Powering up a broken CFL

[Arembjorn]

What is this, the pro-mercury convention????

[mewhor]

Let's face it. . .our children's children will be born with three eyes--on both their heads.

[Lachlant1984]

@mewhor Fluorescent lights have been around for many years, so why is it that people get so damned worried about them only now, they're fat better for the environment than standard incandescent bulbs because the draw far less current and are far more efficient. All the fear mongering has to stop.

[BenHutchinson1]

Should let it keep running till the filaments burn out.

[T3Asp00n]

theres dangerous mercury levels werevr that bulb broke them r bad 4 uuuu!1!

[jecwhiz]

@T3Asp00n actually.....they deplete when they reach room temputure...and there is not much inside...but a bunch of CFL all together adds up when thrown away (and newer ones don't last as long meaning faster increased amount of mercury being thrown away....but one lamp or a few is not something to really HYPE about...but again....newer stuff are junk...so more of them are thrown away..so more mercury is thrown away faster nowdays than before....In fact less mercury = shorter life...

[stickedU]

@T3Asp00n CFL bulbs have the same amount of mercury that you would find on the tip of a pen.

[rhblakeman]

All those freaking out that CFLs are terrible and toxic and shouldnt be used had also better get rid of the regular FL bulbs in your house that have been around since designed in the 40's, your laptop and LCD TV (what did you think lit up the display - LEDs? - well on a few they do). The only real hazard with these is misuse by using dimmers on non-dimmable CFLs and getting shitty Chinese quality bulbs that are defective and start fire. The freakout needs to end, so does the BS rumors.

[Nivicoman]

@rhblakeman Yeah I've seen the motherfuckers burn or at least melt and produce a horrible burnt odor. The ballasts are supposed to shutdown under overcurrent/overtemp conditions. Matter of fact the other day a dual 30 watt fixture at work burned up one socket and blew the shit out of the cathode on that end. What a raunchy smell. And maybe you've seen the 8 foot Instant Start tubes swirl and flash toward end of life when the cathode emissive coating is depleted and the lead in wires vaporize.

[rhblakeman]

@Nivicoman Yep that's because the low quality parts and labor from China all to make them cheap as possible and be able to sell them cheap. It's not just the CFLs doing this, it's computers and tvs and toasters and coffee pots and other things we have shoved in our face made in China. Even our 4 and 8 ft tubes are being made there, put an older one side by side with a new one and you'll see the difference.

[rhblakeman]

@DecemberReign2012 Radiation? WTF there's no uranium or radium in them, it's mercury and a tiny droplet of it at that. When the tube breaks the mercury is let loose. Long FL tubes in ceiling fixtures have had the same in them for decades, CFLs are a miniature version of the same with an electronic ballast in the base rather than a magnetic like the old brick ballasts were. You must believe the old tale that a microwave is actually nuking your food rather than using microwave band radio waves.

[Nivicoman]

Experience shows that 3-6 volts lights the ends of a fluorescent tube an orange glow and sometimes the mercury ionizes and produces the regular white light but just at the ends. I'm surprised these light so brightly and burned out right away.

[jestavonation]

TAZER

[PhuqueU]

The white power when you broke it? ...toxic mercury too breath.

Look it up.

[Nivicoman]

@PhuqueU actually the white powder is a phosphorous compound that gives visible light when hit by the UV light of the mecury.

[rhblakeman]

@Nivicoman It's a phospor, not phosphorous. The electrical stimulation of the mercury going from the usual metal we all know in thermometers to a gas or vapor creates UV light we can't see. The UV reacts with the phosphors (mixtures of red, green and blue phosphors) and emits visible light. The light color, or temp, in Kelvin is determined by the ratio of the R G and B phosphors. To prevent filament burnout there's also argon in the tube, similar to incandescent bulbs.

[Nivicoman]

@rhblakeman I stand corrected. I have always known the two were different but put down phosphorous. I also realize that many "Neon" signs are actually Cold Cathode Fluorescent if they are for a color other than re/orange. The biggest difference is in the cathodes being metal shells that are unheated but depend on high voltage to strike the arc then a lower running voltage that is current limited. Actually come to think of it LCD backlights are smaller versions of Cold Cathode Fluorescent.

[rhblakeman]

@Nivicoman Yeap and they still have a tiny droplet of mercury. I had a feeling you meant phosphor not phosphorous but a lot of people think do the similar being the same, like thinking chips are made of silicone like bathtub caulk when it's silicon the element. It's actually pretty amazing the things humans have created but it's terrible to think how some misuse those technologies, how some slap them together halfass to make a buck and yet how many people believe the crap they hear on the web.

[Nivicoman]

@rhblakeman I wonder where the name silicone the oily stuff came from vs silicon the most abundant element besides carbon.

[rhblakeman]

@Nivicoman Looked it up and silicone is a compound of elements including silicon:

"Silicones are polymers that include silicon together with carbon, hydrogen, oxygen, and sometimes other chemical elements. Some common forms include silicone oil, silicone grease, silicone rubber, and silicone resin."

Of course people call the dark grey slippery compressed powder in pencils "lead" but it hasnt been the element lead since the discovery of graphite in the middle 1500's

[ballores]

dors that mean we will all be mad as hatters mercury poisoning but our carbon footprint will be minimal i for one was looking forward to increased temperatures and erratic weather makes life more interesting umbrella or sunhat or both

[mrjustin5]

CFL's contain MERCURY - That is what makes them GLOW! Its in GAS form and when the CFL is broken, it goes into the air and onto whatever surface it broke upon.

It is recommended that you follow HAZMAT (Hazardous Materials) procedures to clean this up.

NEVER stay in the room when a CFL breaks - ventilate the area! Open windows! LEAVE! etc. etc. for at least 15 minutes!

These are among the BARE MINIMUM you can do to NOT expose yourself to the most TOXIC METAL ON EARTH besides Uranium!

[rhblakeman]

@mrjustin5 Nope, it goes in as a small drop of the liquid/solid like a thermometer has. The filament heats the mercury into a vapor which creates UV light, the UV reacts with the phospors to create visible light. When the bulb is off the mercury goes back to the droplet (which looks like a liquid but is actually a solid form of mercury). Did you freak when people broke the standard flourescent bulbs at school, work, your kitchen or bath? I bet not yet they are the SAME thing as a CFL in makeup.

[jecwhiz]

@mrjustin5 Mercury isn't really as toxic as people make it out......you got mercury inside you if you got vaccine shot! ;-) Yes Sir!

Also I would be more afraid of the 1940s fluorescent being broken as they had even more toxic stuff than mercury which was the Zinc Beryllium!

The gas is Argon (sometimes Xeon is added in certain brands or types) and mercury vapors as it warms up....The phosphor is excited by the UV of the vapor. Without the phosphor...it would appear dimmer greenish blue color

[kenneykole]

@jecwhiz

NO, it still highly toxic.

[jecwhiz]

@kenneykole

It's really unknown in effect...but it's not as toxic as people hype about those days....it's a little excuse for marketing reasons and for the greenies....who STILL promote spirals which are mercury filled....not good for environment though...

[rexmcnish]

@jecwhiz

Incorrect. Mercury shrivels up neurons that are in the vicinity of it. It is highly toxic and is basically a neuro toxin. Look up 'Brain Neuron Degeneration via Mercury' here on youtube. Disturbing stuff.

[kenneykole]

@jecwhiz

And they are fire hazards.

[jecwhiz]

@kenneykole Yes they are fire hazards....never leave them on unattended....you are totally right about that.....although the older magnetic ballast ones from the 80s and early 90s were not fire hazards...they were much safer since they weren't using HIGH voltage (high in electrical terms, not as in 240 volt).....the magnetic ballast gave out 60 hz output while the electronic was MUCH higher eliminating the flicker and used higher voltage...

[stickedU]

@mrjustin5 they have the same amount of mercury that would fill the tip of a pen, settle down.

[laurdy]

i had a lamp with one of these bulbs in it then one night it randomly just went out and a few seconds later..... BANG!!!

big blue flash and the breaker tripped

[jecwhiz]

Yeah, there also were known cases for them to catch fire during death or even in operation!

[jecwhiz]

Thanks for your concern, I am aware, but mercury was already depleted, it broke during the move when we were moving, so all is good....And my health is in tiptop shape actually, went to doctor after this anyway.

Although this is a concern to even using CFL over incandescent as children could bump into table lamps and break them then actually get exposed to mercury as mercury is vaporizing away as those CFL breaks....mercury is dangerous when it's vaporized.

[rhblakeman]

@jecwhiz Mercury is a hazard in powder form (mercuric oxide), solid form (whats in thermometers and both FL and CFL lamps) and as a vapor (when the bulb is on) but you have to be exposed for long periods to have a health risk. The Mad Hatter of Alice in Wonderland, like other hat makers of yesteryear, went crazy from continued mercury exposure as they used it in the making of hats. Fear of the unknown is a bigger risk than this little experiment. You did have a high voltage hazard though.

[DiachiLaser]

You should power up the filaments in a non-broken CFL from a 12-20V DC supply ! nice and bright , I've done it up to 32V , but the filaments die after two clicks ( you need to give them short pulses. )

Check my video of powering the filaments that are still in the mercury/argon atmosphere inside the tubes.

[jecwhiz]

I have used a computer transformer on tubular lamps and had them lit under 12 volts ...in fact that's how rapid start ballasts works, using low voltage to power up the ends..

[jecwhiz]

Actually I wasn't around when it broke it broke during moving I believe I have done more things than above so far I'm healthy in fact I know someone who had mercury all over her body 30 years ago & she's fine!

But agreed we need to worry about mercury mostly on CFL since they are used all over the place

Imagine a child in a child room was playing around himself & knocked over a spiral breaking it & he starts picking it up? That's why we should continue incandescent or energy saving halogen

[worryphree]

Well, by breaking that bulb, or being around where it got broke, you've contaminated yourself with mercury. I've got mercury amalgam fillings in my teeth, and it has caused me no end of problems, not to mention vaccinations as a child and in the military. Get yourself some zeolite, and get detoxified. Good luck.

[TranCendenZ]

worryphree: You don't sound so "worry free". According to Consumer Reports, American Health, Prevention, and other health newsletters, amalgam is safe. You need to stop worrying, and you need to stop getting others to worry.

[cheetawolf]

its not a POP, more of a fizzzzzzz...

either way,

FRIED

[jecwhiz]

To see one of the articles with CFL fires, google "Whitehorse house fire" and you will find that a light bulb was responsible for this fire, and it was a CFL. There were other reports of them catching fire but was caught before it did any serious damage, unfortunately on the google keyword I just posted, didn't survive.

[bfeely]

That's what the fire chief thought at first, BUT they later concluded it was not the fault of the CFL.

[scof94]

ohh yes IKEA!!!

[rootbrian]

Those aren't cathodes, those are 2 tungsten filaments!!

They're probably 10-40 watts each, adding the ballast using 10-30 MORE Watts just to START and POWER the bulb.

[jecwhiz]

yep those do......so seriously CFL should not be made and used....in fact CFL uses 4 times more electricty TO MAKE in factory than incandesent due to more parts, more stuff, things to add such as mercury, plastics, circuit boards. Those are fire hazards too.

[vmelkon]

Those long fluo tubes also have mercury and they have been going to dump for many decades.

The real solution is to recycle, no matter what you use. Nobody recycles incandescent bulb!

[jecwhiz]

correct, they are basically the same, but the spirals and modern small compact fluorescent lights are more dangerous due to not being correctly used, and that too many reports of fires blamed by those because of bad design and flaws. They actually don't last long like the ones from the 80s-90s which were heavier but better quality, I even liked how they flash when turned on. Truly lasted 7 years. Today's have too many flaws and caused fires (do a search on it)

[flamesforfun]

Ur both morons. Even if it takes 4 times more electricity to make them, the bulbs last 7-9 years longer than a typical lightbulb while emitting 4 times the amount of light for significantly less electricity. This saves electricity which means less coal burned which means less mercury (from the coal) being put into the air. CFLs are win win win. Even if every single CFL wasn't recycled and thrown into the landfill, it would be only .1 percent of total mercury emissions. ZING!

[vmelkon]

It depends on your power plants. In my area, it's all hydro power (no mercury issue) and winter is long (won't have much effect on electric bill). I'm happy with incandescent but I would like to recycle them.

[flamesforfun]

A compact fluorescent pays for itself over time, emits much more light while using much much less watts. Lasts 9 years too. So pay the extra 2 dollars or so and you won't have to change the bulb for almost a decade. So it saves electricity and it saves money. Even if you have hydro, that's no reason not to use electricity more efficiently. And think of the energy used to make all those incandescents that you have to throw out? Where do you live that has hydro? Just curious

[vmelkon]

Quebec. I have 2 bulbs. One of them burned up in 2 years and the other, it has been 4 years and keeps going. They estimated on the box 5 years.

I use 60 watt bulbs, rated for 1500 hours for most of the rooms. I also use a laptop now so perhaps it uses half the power compared to my desktop :)

[rootbrian]

CFL's use MORE watts (ballast) than incans.

[doodnik]

When a CFL bulb shatters on the floor in your home, 4mg of powdered mercury is released into your HOME in one second. That is quite different in regards to the health of those residing in that home, than 4mg released into the atmosphere over time. I have also heard that manufacturing of CFL bulbs causes a great deal more pollution than incandescents. Using CFLs is a personal descision to save money, not help the environment, and one that should not be taken lightly if you have small children.

[flamesforfun]

I'm not sure why you came to that conclusion. The biggest polluter and emitter of mercury are coal power plants. This is why fish have mercury in them because the water becomes tainted from burning coal. CFL's use vastly less amounts of energy which means much less coal has to be burned per lightbulb which is much less pollution. Regardless of CFL's supposedly causing more pollution to make, they last years longer than normal bulbs.

[madman195]

do you really know anything about coal power plants. the water that goes into any creek or river has to have about 2-4 times less pollutants then town water you drink. well here it does anyway.

[jecwhiz]

Actually there;s more factory flaws lately...Why? 3 words "Made in China" they care more about quantity than quality, so I've had some experience of them not last as long as incandescent, and I have also heard reports of them going up into smoke and catch fires. You can do intense research about CFL fires. Also it actually uses up more coal to MAKE CFL than to make incandescent due to more complex design and more parts and materials as plastic, silicon board, more soldiering job. Wait till HEI!

[flamesforfun]

And I broke a CFL before. I just cleaned it up like any normal bulb. But to be sure, I called the manufacturer of the bulb and the poison control center. Both of them said it was fine and to just clean it up like I would any other normal bulb. They said the amount of mercury in a CFL is so tiny that even IF we came into DIRECT contact with it, it would most likely NOT be harmful. The manufacturer said the phosphorous coating inside the bulb was probably MORE harmful than the mercury itself.

[vmelkon]

CFL don't contain powdered mercury. The powder is a phosphorescent substance. The mercury is in the form of a vapor. If you break it, leave doors and windows open.

[LookItsRiceCake]

Its hilarious to think breaking these bulbs is "the big issue". I think I've only broke two incandescent bulbs, and never broke a CFL.

Even if I break 10 CFL bulbs, I doubt I'll grab it and go sucking on the thing to get all the mercury.

I think you'd be damn lucky to be exposed to anything more comparatively dangerous than sharp glass.

But, as always, point out the tiniest of possible dangers.

[jecwhiz]

I am not paranoid careful person usually, but mercury from CFL is not the biggest danger of those to be honest, but it is poisonous, but the bigger danger is the UV rays that come out of them, I recently had read an article of a woman who started to get sick from me and it has been a more recent research on that. So far reading it the best recommendation for those is to not use them too close like a table lamp and be near it lit too long! But bigger danger, google "CFL Fires" or similar keywords

[jecwhiz]

Correct!

[jecwhiz]

as vmelkon said, mercury isn't powdered, it's that "grey or silver dot you see through the tube" also they TURN into vapor when it breaks or cracks or is heated (they vaporize when you turn them on making mercury stream inside) (ever wonder why they turn on dim in colder environment like in a garage?)

[jecwhiz]

But you are not basing on real facts on the lifetime, those that were made in the 1980s and early 1990s are true, they did last 9 times longer, but today's spirals? Nope! They are now complete junk! You only listen to written facts, not experience of using em. Most people don't track them down while I actually write down the installation date on em!

[doodnik]

I live in Santa Barbara and we have one of the best recycling programs in the country. For the saftey of my trash-handling professionals, I collect my spent lightbulbs in a cardboard shoebox until it is snugly full, gently tape the lid close and clearly mark "LIGHTBULBS" on the outside. I then either hand-deliver the box to the recycling center or place it adjacent to my recycling bin for the pros to pick up.

[LookItsRiceCake]

jecwhiz has a point since tons of the bulbs out there are generic bulbs made by some anonymous company, rebranded under Rona, Noma, enerSave, and other cheap store brands.

They're cheaper, and almost always go on sale, so people buy them. (They're lightbulbs, who cares, right?).

Good bulbs are rock solid. I have a few good ones but I use cheapies around the house and haven't yet had a problem, but its a pain in the ass when my Noma brands take nearly 2 seconds before they light up at all.

[jecwhiz]

Right ricecake, and some companies that we've known of for a long time sometimes sources stuff and brands them instead of making them themselves.

"Just light bulbs" for some people yes, but ive known some people do not like the dull quality of the lighting from those CFL, they aren't as crisp....also sometimes the colors in the room is affected by some lights, the CRI of CFL are lower than incandescent, while some dont pay attention or care, but others do.

[eFlux]

i meant mercury!

[jayguy173]

don those have murcury

[beemoovee]

Cool stuff!! Have you ever tried using an incandescent bulb instead of a preheat fluorescent ballast??

Nice vintage pull chain socket, by the way.

[jecwhiz]

That was actually not preheat, it was a programmed start I believe....but similar

And thanks you noticed! It's a GE Socket patented May 17, 1910.....