Pagan and Wicca vs. Christian Youtube Drama Wars

[SeramiNefera]

I agree w/allowing people to keep their own beliefs. But if they talk about Wicca/Pagan religions & are spreading disinformation it's hard for me to stay silent. My path honors truth; seeks to uphold the truth as we see it. If we do not know the truth, then we admit we don't know it. For instance, I can't say which gods are real or not; but I could say Wiccans aren't Satanists. I can say that the modern druids don't sacrifice people (some say Ancient Irish ones didn't sacrifice people either).

[SeramiNefera]

@SeramiNefera (2nd) Anyway, thank you for posting this. It surprises me sometimes to see insults being thrown about other religions. I think the world would be a happier place if we did not fight over whose god is the best or the most loving. To me to stay silent when others lie about your religion is dangerous. Not enough people are willing to really educate themselves on their own religion (let alone other religions).

Blessed Be.

[Digikitty21]

I don't think its drama to have defended our religious rights.

[TheFugitive2]

Myself, I battle trolls & haters who have nothing better to do than stalk and harass Wiccans; especially when they make epic hypocrites of themselves! I'm here to put those twerps...OUT OF BUSINESS

[Darkfeather21]

As far as I'm concerned, any Wiccan/Pagan who gets into a big cyber war, on YouTube of all places, is not a Wiccan/Pagan, but a Fluffy Bunny.

[VaraliRose]

TOTTALLY ON THE WICCAN TEAM!

[chrislostangel]

i only stand up when people dis wicca seeing as i was raised as a witch and find it hard to watch people who say they dont judge...judging my brothers and sisters we are diffrent yes however we are not satanists and so its an insalt to us wiccans and pagans

[bornbythesea]

@nathanjhuff pan plays his flute to lead unwary creatures to things definitely not good. Pan was only made to seem good by the likes of Disney(who was a satanist) in the character of Peter Pan. But all the "make-believe" magic in his movies is a subtle invitation for children to begin the dangerous and deadly occult dabble. Thanks. ellenwhiteestate. organization. Fear God and give Him glory, for the hour of His judgment is come: and worship Him who made heaven, and the earth, and the sea. Rev 14

[kelticgod088]

Great video. In the new testemant jesus said he had come not for peace but to bring the sword. he said he had come to turn families agianst each other. check out my videos for further details.

[HappyGoat75]

great pirate get up!

[HappyGoat75]

@HappyGoat75 fear and intolerance+ignorance=war

[HappyGoat75]

@HappyGoat75 intolerance/fear+ignorance=war­..I think there are as many 'bad' Wiccans as there are 'bad' Christians.

[TheInGODalone]

Wicca isof the deil and not the same as religion Wicca is a cult not religion Get it right. GO warned about cults and atheiests and satansts they are not good

[bornbythesea]

@TheInGODalone dear one, when making a comment, recheck for spelling errors. It makes it easier for us to read and gives one more credibility. Thank you. ellenwhiteestate. organization.

[steverock100]

hey pansgrove. not tryin to be an ass. but u should reword the name of this vid. cause i miss understood the name at first. cause i thought u meant that pagans and wiccans where dumb. like ii said not tryin to be an ass. just a helpfull tip is all.

[pansgrove]

Done. Thank you.

[witchesnews]

oops. i replied to myself. that reply was to u sry.

[witchesnews]

ur welcome. and thank u. cause im not wiccan but satanist. but i consider wiccans and all other pagans my brothers and sisters. blessed be. and ave satan.

[SangoNMiroku4eva]

@witchesnews That is very interesting because a true wiccan/pagan does not believe in satan or hell. It says so in the code of american witches.

[bornbythesea]

@SangoNMiroku4eva I almost married a witch and she knew full well that Satan existed even though she claimed she did not worship him. I was a Christian and she complained that every time I came in the house her familiar would take off. I was sleeping next to her one night and I had a dream that her familiar was on the other side of her furious that I was there. I felt the attack and called out to my Lord and it left. These familiars are evil. Don't think otherwise, dear ones.

[houtaru90]

@bornbythesea now thats just weird.......... sounds like the lady was wacko....... i am a wiccan in a family of strong christians. I have never felt any animosity towards them because of our differences. and I doubt if I had a "familiar" it would either. Wicca is a peaceful religion. What that women was into was something else.

[KuraienzeruHiruyay1]

Thats pretty much where I stand with this drama. :3

[KuraienzeruHiruyay1]

'the devil'. to me there are things that might be more than what was written down in those pages. Have u ever thought of the good witches fighting the bad? Good dragons fighting the bad? even evil and good fairies at war?o.o; They seem to have met their match. Such as angels and demons. If i was asked, I wouldnt really pick a side.^^; just saying.

[KuraienzeruHiruyay1]

the very beginning and say God, or Gaia didnt exist. But fighting over whos right or wrong won't change the fact of what u believe to be right or wrong. If people don't want to convert thats their business. For me its what I have been told by God and what I've seen. Im not sure about you guys...but I've actually seen elemental deities from all over the world. In the bible they mention Satan having a pet dragon, and also mentions the existence of witches. Its said that its known as a sin or

[KuraienzeruHiruyay1]

I was raised into a christain life. Though it wasnt how I was raised, but what I experienced while growing up. I believe in God. N i also believe in the mythical realms of wizards/witch craft/ fairies, etc. Only because I have met Jesus, and seen the most unimaginable. Although for most people, u cant be half christian and half wiccan. Now that I think about it, i've seen so many things. Im not sure if there is a religion to it. :T tru some things can be solved by science, but science cnt go to

[julienicole100]

i am pagan but belive in all paths to gods and/or goddesses

[AstroMen2911]

Christianity and Islam are bullies who insist that they are the one and true faith. And they use thier faith to excludes others.

[bornbythesea]

@AstroMen2911 true Christians will not bully. Although anyone can be an idiot once in a while. Thanks. ellenwhiteestate. organization.

[munku121]

Christianity is not a bully. We are trying to alert people to the truth that is this: we are sinners. Christ died for us so that we can be forgiven and enter into Heaven. That is the truth. True Christians try to help people and NOT exclude them. The Lord Jesus loves you. Please come back to Him. God bless.

[followthewicked666]

the fight exsist b/c one religion says that one religion is wrong...it all start from there...btw...no one was equivalent to zeus..and ur right..wiccan rede says.."ye harm none do as ye will"...that means not physically...emotionally..ment­ally...magickly..

[ShahMashya]

Why don't you build a temple for the moongod, moongoddess and fertility goddess triad whatever? Then maybe those hypocrite christians and others will accept you better. Chants, prayers, rituals are all good if being from original pagan historical sources but what about the original animal sacrifices? What about the ancient believe in the kingdom of death? What about the heaven for fallen warriors? What about those egyptian etc resurrection myths? In western paganism there wasn't reincarnation.

[TwilightSpeaker]

I love both religions, but the fighting is really pathetic and stupid. Christians use the " you are going to hell!" excuse if you're anything but christian and Wiccans use "we don't go around critising you" exuse. -.-

[youngwizard666]

Im talking about the crazy ass christians attacking others with christianity so what im saying is that maybe its time that they get a dose of their oun medicine im the black magician this witch doesnt turn the other cheek i will attack the ones who come agaist me curses will be handed out but anyway all im saying is  that its time for all magical people to stand up for magic witches dont need jesus or christian ways all we need is magic my kind of witches only see power evil isnt real

[youngwizard666]

fuck jesus its all about mindpower jesus is a myth satan is a myth myself is all i need the mind is the only creator hell sin mary jesus is bullshit its time for everybody to stand up to the crazy christians they are agaist everybody so now lets attack back

[saul812]

What are you talking about

[epiksonik]

I'm amused that that was your point in making the video. Speak courteously yes, if you must, but my first response was never answered. I'm concluding that was because there were certain words that "hurt." The breaking down into self defense mechanisms is discourteous, especially when we're adults and should be able to 'actually' be comfortable with our positions. Science and reason?

[epiksonik]

how was I in anyway not courteous?

[texanwitchie]

I love the way you think and explain things. I think along the very same lines, so I'm a little dissapointed to see people acting that way with the drama.

[epiksonik]

christianity has the bravado of centuries long power...its adherents display boorish superiority which only enhances their egregious ignorance...

the wiccans...are pathetic yet pitiable.

I dont mean to offend anyone, its just that I was raised with different standards. When is reason and science so bad that we submit to this drudgery?

[Espinozaize]

How do wiccans stand on pre-Christian history? I mean the ancient Greeks and Romans endorsed slavery and exclusion of women from democracy. In India there were Sakri where the widow of a man must be burned along with him. The Aztecs sacrifised humans in the 1000s. Egyptians, Alexander the great and the Romans build empires. Vikings pilliged and raped. So slavery, misonogy, imperialism and war were as much a part of paganism as christianity. Do you think the wold were better under pagan rule?

[Dionysusheathen]

Those same things were still going on post-christianity..... infact the church was against the anulment of slavery and the rights of women. And you confusing Vikings Egyptians and Romans were races they were not Pagans. The fact is over the last 2000 years world views have changed we're just waiting for the church to catch up!

[princessannikki]

Vikings, Egyptians, Romans were NOT Races, they were Cultures - and Religion was part of their Culture.

[Espinozaize]

Yes this is true- I was asking Pansgrove a question regarding the wiccan view on pagan history. Are you a wiccan? If so maybe you could give me an answer? My name is ESPINOZAIZE and my question are currently seven comments dowm on this video. Best regards.

[Dionysusheathen]

Of course they were a Race of people..The fact they had a culture means they were a race!

[zydilak]

Look. No offence but that is just not true. The debate on race is still going on. Some geneologists belive there are races as the genetic differences are to small. Others that there exsist between 4-5 races(None of these better than the others. Just slightly adapted to different environments. Especially the condition of sunlight). Culture is a set of beliefs, pratices and societal organisation. Thus one culture exsist in Denmark another in Germany. But there is no German and Dansish ´Race´.

[Dionysusheathen]

They are simply debating because of PC gone mad. A genetic difference no matter how small is still a difference, just like the differences in snakes are small they are still placed in classifications. We just pussy foot around things because of issues that may arise form the "classifiction" of humans.

[zydilak]

Maybe some geneologists would find that a little simplistic: But I hope you now see that wikings, romans and ancient greeks are properly classified as Cultures not as races. I myself belive that races do exsist but obviously not that each cultureconstitute a race. Communist/Confutzian China is one culture Democratic/Zen Japan another. Whereas they are one race. Best regards

[princessannikki]

ok, so blondes are a different race to red heads, and tall people are a different race to short people, i mean thats how small the difference is.

[Dionysusheathen]

clearly there are bigger differences between Egyptians and Vikings then hair colour. Like zydilak said it was simplistic, the fact is there are distinguisable differences just like you can tell if a person is chinese, Pakistani, or greek, just by looking at them means that there are obvious differences other than colour of hair.

[Espinozaize]

Look my comment was not an attack. Im agnostic not christian, I was just wondering how wiccans stand on these points. So I am not defending the church. Therfore I would like to point out that your argument Basicly is: Pagans based their economy on slavery and their culture on misonogy. The church is evil for preserving this. But that goes right to my point: Were pagans and christians not equaly chauvanistic? And further more Vikings, romans and (the ancient) Egyptians are NOT races.

[Espinozaize]

Vikings were a scandinavian culture and people whose religion were the norse mythology of Odin, Ygdrasil and Asgard. So they were most surtenly pagans. And the same is true of both the Roman and Egyptian culture where polytheism was the norm, Well known Gods from these pantheons are: Jupiter And Mars or Isis and Horus. So I would like to ask you again: Do you belive the pagan was morally superior to christians? Or that humans commit the same evils regardless of religion? I belive the latter

[Dionysusheathen]

The word Pagan as you are using it is a CHRISTIAN concept, Vikings Romans and Egyptians would not have concidered them selfs as such! You are grouping different religions and different cultures under one "umbrella term". Vikings, Romans and Egyptians are a race of people, try looking in a dictionary for the term RACE!!

[zydilak]

Well I am doing so because that is the very concept of the Wiccan religion. The basic structure is an extreme religious eccletisism. Where you pick and chuse freely from the belov mentioned pantheons. Some even use Christian figures and symbols. All of which is fine by me. It just seemed to me that many Wiccans or Neo-pagans where demonising christianity. So I just wished to point out that pagen(or non-christian if you prefer)cultures were equally cruel and chauvanistic. Best regards

[toroga1]

lol u tell her!

[wolf44mag]

Just wanted to point out that there were some pre-christian societies that regarded women as equal in most respects to men and aforded them the same rights. (celts) . I would also like to add that much of pre-christian history was tainted and changed to fit the agenda of the church of rome after its rise to power, and many of the works of roman historians descibing the people of northern europe and the brittish Isle contained little fact and much speculation. Just some food for thought

[Espinozaize]

OK. But you agree that basicly pagan societies: Greeks, Romans, Wikings, Marcedonians, Mayans and African culture in general based their culture on slavery? Aztects sacrificed humans by the 1000s like Japanise developed Harakiri. Ritual suicide as a fundamental part of their culture. I just belive that this Neo-Paganism is self aggrandisement without regard to historical facts. Pagans was just as imperialisitic and cruel as christians. If this is not realised you are living a lie

[wolf44mag]

With all due respect, by your own logic these "evils" of anchient pagan society were no different then those attrocities commited by christianity, therefor we can assume that these barbaric practices transcend religieon and are infact the results of primitive minds and not necessarily the product of any specific faith or lack there of. Your aguement refutes its self. Again, I mean no disrespect or insult.

[Espinozaize]

None taken. What you say was my point exactly: Christianity and paganism were from a moral perspective eqully bad(or good). Best regards

[wolf44mag]

Again you are missing my point friend. You are not making the distinction between faith and culture, two very seperate subjects.

[Espinozaize]

I cant see we disagee. I mean in general Religion is regarded as a part of the culture of a nation. Like Christianity is a basic part of the Danish culture that I live in. Or Confutzianism is a major part of Chinise culture(Despite the official Communism). Or Hinduism in democratic India. I am not christian but agnostic. I just viewed some of these wiccan vidoes. And I thought the critic of Christianity was a little selfrighteous. So I just wanted to point out that Pagans made the same mistakes

[Espinozaize]

I dont know if you are Wiccan. But like you said earlier: I mean no offence: Just Discussing. Best reagards dude

[wolf44mag]

No friend Im not wiccan, I follow the path of my celtic ancestors. And I never take offence to civilized discussion.

Now after reading your last reply I can see that we do infact agree on the subject, and I want to thankyou for taking the time to help me see that.

Live well my friend.

[princessannikki]

Wicca owes a lot to Christianity, at least, the esoteric side of Christianity.

[chrisbass48]

Aye, indeed !

"We all come from the Godd-ess, tra la la rumpety tump" !!!!

[Dionysusheathen]

lol what???

wicca owes a lot to the secret side of christianity??? Please enlighten me?

[princessannikki]

have a look at freemasonry and rosicrucianism, oh and golden dawn, these are the three main components of Wicca.

[Dionysusheathen]

Wicca is a new religion. It has no religious antecedents.

It is not traditional. It is not part of the western esoteric tradition. Your talking about initiations and rituals use magical techniques derived from the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, Freemasonry.

[princessannikki]

Yes, Wicca is based on Golden Dawn & Freemasonry - this is Western Occultism - this is the Tradition Wicca belongs to. Traditional Wiccans adhere to concepts of Western Occultism.

[multifacetedmage]

Christians litterally published a book on methods of torture to be used in order to find out if someone was a witch.

[multifacetedmage]

okay side by side:

Christianity versus Wicca

------------------------------­-----

Christians killed people for not believing what they believefor over 2000yrs;Christians have accused people of doing things that they did not do just in order to have them condemned and, then steal the other people's land. Catholic priest have gone to prison for ass-raping little catholic kids in their churches.

People have claimed to hear the voice of god tell them to murder their families and then done so.

[munku121]

For you information: the early Christians, like Paul, Peter, John, Matthew, etc., were not violent. They preached the truth without torturing people. Christiantiy did not start out violent. Islam, however, was violent from its very beginnings. Adultery; rape; murder; these things are bad, and people ARE doing these things, look at the news. We Christians are trying to help people stop this and turn to the Lord for salvation. God bless.

[Wadjitstar]

You're right, it should not exist, but it does 'cuz people are looking to be RIGHT about their own views & that is rediculous. In spirituality there is no such thing as RIGHT or WRONG. In religion however, there IS RIGHT or WRONG & that's where the lines blur & the fights (or bickering) begins. Folks want a guarantee that they RIGHT in their beliefs, & they miss the point of spirituality all together. It's a vicious circle that turns in on itself. Sad, but true.

[PragmaticHeathen]

It wasn't over Christian verses pagan or Christian verses Wiccan. This was a few people, self included, who didn't ike being called biggoted and being told we didn't belong in the pagan community because we disagreed with some one.

As to Christian Wicca, if some one wants to practice an oddball religion, it's not my business to them what to believe.

[thedarkmoonmidnight]

cute kitties ^_^, thanks for this hope more people see this