Added: 3 years ago
From: RTM1000
Views: 172,957
Sort by time | Sort by thread (beta)

Link to this comment:

Share to:
see all

All Comments (139)

Sign In or Sign Up now to post a comment!
  • A Mireille du Lycée Technique de Douai...superbe danseuse et excellent souvenir de concert, bisous

  • SHE WAS THE STAR with that Unique voice of hers... I been ROBBED!!!!

  • WTF ...WHERE'S JODY WATLEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • @noinwe Carolyn? OH, that's my step mother... And I'd appreciate if you'd take your negative comments elsewhere. Because last time I checked, you paid for a ticket to their show, just to criticize. But, thanks for putting money in my mother's pocket ;)

  • Carolyn is a great singer, but Jodi, compared with Howard was the real Shalamar sound. Although Carolyn deserves to be at the top, theres just no replacement for Jodi.

  • @1teedie I agree with you "There's no replacement for Jody (correct spelling)." Even after a nation wide talent search when Watley departed the group, there still wasn't an efficient replacement found in De'lisa Davis. But as far as Carolyn being a great singer? How would you know? After all, no ones never heard her on a CD!

  • jody should be back

  • Watch and listen closely you will notice the host, Jeffrey and Howard trying to pass the new Shalamar girl Carol Griffey daughter of the owner off as original female member Jody Watley. When she says "Oh look there's Jermaine" it's like she was there back in the day after Jeff says 'they're reunited'. Wouldn't it have been like "Oh, I remember going to my daddy's office and meeting the group, can't believe I'm in it now" or something to that effect? Shady business tactics and misleading

  • @nuthinbutclassics I caught that too!

  • not quite the right mix.  ...where Jody at?

  • and then Timomatic took the moon walk to a new level

  • awww yeaahh

  • @mrcovering......I couldn't have said it any better.........

    A HOT DAMN MESS!!!

  • booooooooo....I miss Jody.

    =(

  • I love Howard but his voice here seems to be strained some. I miss Jody. I think she was the best with the group. They were once the greatest!

  • @lukeloveslauraalways Howard's voice may be strained due to age.

  • ok I adore the jody Watley Shalamar but I must say the Jeff Daniels mike pass to the Jody imposter at 2:17-2:18 was really hot. I like this guy.

  • IT DOESN'T SEEM THE SAME WITHOUT JODY WITH, IT'S LIKE A WHOLE DIFFERENT GROUP

  • Comment removed

  • @MrCovering shady business and bad karma is what killed Griffey! God don't like ugly, and ain't to fond of pretty...... Just take a look at that drag queen that took De'lissa Davis' place! Oh...... sorry, my sorces just advised me that that's a real woman in the group. Mmm....questionable!

  • Ow I love this. <3

  • Listening to this you can tell they have mixed old Shalamar backing vocals in this to make it have the Watley era "sound" to help this incarnation along. Whatever works I guess. Did this lineup ever release an album after this talent contest?

  • that dude taught michael jackson how to moonwalk.

  • @tech4156 Apparently so did Cooley Jaxson (youtube him) and so did Geron Casper Candidate apparently. Seems those dancers of The Electric Boogaloo's taught Daniels and Michael Jackson. Of course MJ was already a legend artist, tremendous singer, writer, entertainer and so forth from a young age.

  • THIS IS NICE....

  • HEY ITV WHAT A GREAT SHOW  THIS WAS HIT ME BABY GREAT FORMAT AND ATMOSPHERE PLEASE BRING THIS BACK ON TO OUR SCREENS!!

  • I dont know wot the hells up Jody, she never wants to do a shalamar reunion, ok so jody and howard had a big fallout,but let by gones be by gones lifes too short, Come on jody take your head out ya ass!!

  • @kev222kev Why on earth does she need to do something she don't care to do and head up her ass, huh??? Let the woman keep doing her thing thats what we want (Jody fans). Jeffry was abusive to her and Griffey who owns the group tried to bring her dow check unfiltered show here. Like she said she got off the plantation the others had to go back. Good for her she moved on to sucess. You need to get your head out your own ass. She let by gones be by gones when she got out of there, she still fierce

  • Not the same without JODY

  • The lady singing is the daughter of SOLAR record label owner Dick Griffey and his wife Carrie Lucas, herself a SOLAR recording artist.

  • @hughesjr Solar hasn't been a record company in DECADES.....Oh, I get it! A fallen star. You're right! She' a star, al'ite! But, loved her mom!

  • they sounded better with jody watley

  • @noinwe Oh, by the way..... did you ever find that information on the Griffey's school for girls in Africa that I mentioned to you on UNFILTERED I Googled, but nothing never appeared... I guess I'd have better chance myself in locating Griffey's missing checks from Africa, than YOU finding his higher learning training ststem for girls on Google's social media service.

  • @1973cleopatrajones You need some psychiatric help. Actually I know who Carolyn is, she's Dick's Daughter, so I guess that cancels out the theory that they hated Dick so much. I can see Jeffery & Howard now, (Jeffery) man Dick stole all of our money, (Howard),hey why don't we get his daughter & do a Shalamar reunion tour, (Jeffery), yeah that 'll show em. I can hear it now. Get A life, please. Also Carolyn is a much better singer than Jody.

  • @noinwe the public's voice have tallied the votes by record sales and you're entitled to your opinion and it's good to think highly of yourself...Oops, I mean, 'your friend,' but when did a recording career become garnered by vocal talent? She does a good job doing KARAOKE and I've witnessed good amateur singers tuning to prerecorded songs from years before, but we, the public need to hear her sing original material, until that time, everything you're saying is pure hearsay !

  • @noinwe you're attempt of placing Jody in the 'no talent/singing file is so futile of you. I've known for years just because a singer can carry out a vocal gymnastic does not qualify them to be a better singer. For instance Cher, Grace Jones, the Beatles, Diana Ross, Madonna, Janet Jackson and Jody may have not package their presentation with vocial acrobats, but they all had the one lil' thing Carolyn lacks. The X-factor. And, that's what makes (or, breaks one who lacks quality) a star

  • @noinwe what's all this exchange of chatter dialouge of 'Howard said this!,' and 'Jeffrey saying that!' This reunion has lasted longer than Cher's farewell tour, and the group ain't even kicked it off yet. Ok, they got Dick's daughter to complete the trio, SO WHAT! Release a CD, already. Damn, God created the world, an entire universe and man just to top off a plan of existence, and it's taken 27 years for this group to start on a CD? 3 more years and they'll all be dead, so work fast fellows!

  • @noinwe PSYCHIATRIC HELP? The only help need be advised, or requested on this page is for Shalamar to hurry and rush a release. Stop using tracks w/Jody's vocals, Carolyn find her own ninch and style. There's your help! Did the group ever bounce back from their public loss to Shaking Stevens on 'Hit me baby one more time?' Maybe Carolyn should've yoddled a lil' louder. And, speaking of Carolyn, are you two still Googling information on Dick's (missing) school for girls in the motherland?

  • @noinwe 'Carolyn is a much better singer than Jody'? Really to who? Jody added to the sound and style. Does Carolyn have hits other than trying to pretend she is Jody? Watching these clips it's obvious they're trying to fake No integrity and desperation imo. As a longtime fan of Shalamar, the Solar label Jody since Soul Train days, HH. Folks need to get their own "shine" the old fashioned way, Earn it. All groups with revolving members make distinction of old and new, not be try to be imposter

  • @nuthinbutclassics Carolyn is a much better singer than Jody Whatley. Jody at best was an average singer, with great songs. If Carolyn was the original singer in Shalamar & Jody came after her, people would be saying the same thing about Jody. Carolyn is not trying to be Jody, that is an extremely ignorant statement. She is just trying to make the song authentic. Carolyn's voice is a little heavier than Jody's, she sounds very good. Just stop hating & get a life.

  • @noinwe I have a life and its very full. Youtube has Your reaction? and Reply, America has free speech. I was simply taking advantage and offering my personal opinions and observations after watching this video as a fan of the old Shalamar, Jody Watley, Howard,Jeffrey, Jermaine and how this was played on on this show in this video. My comments had nothing with who sang this song the best or hating. I heard some soul stirring singing in church this morning. Good singers are a dime a dozen.

  • @noinwe Maybe this unknown Carolyn (not mentioned by name in THIS vid or displayed in the archive) who in your opinion is a better singer than an established artist like Jody will release some new music with Shalamar like Delisa Davis did. I'm a fan of good music and real entertainers so I will look forward to see what this sistah can do on her own,like Jody did in and out of Shalamar some just have the full package. I will buy the album if they put one out. The last had Sidney, Micki and DD

  • @noinwe If I may add one last thing, Carolyn sounds average to me nothing distinct, heavier voice than Jody yes even moreso than Howard. This Carolyn sistah has a real deep alto almost baritone nothing special and no real charisma and I disagree no one would be checking for her if she was the original. Many of us loved Jody and Jeffrey from Soul Train days they always stood out. You'd have to know and have seen Shalamar from the old days they sang, danced and had a memorable presence.

  • @noinwe can your ignorance be anymore bliss! @nuthinbutclassics comment was not about who was the better singer, it was about Carolyn Griffey and Shalamar portraying a 10 year sham that she's Jody Watley, when in truth, she's no more than a second rate seat filler. It's very obvious, I noticed when the show aired and during the interview clips Carolyn stated with glee, "Oh there's Jermaine" as if she had a connection with the singer, when in truth, she NEVER knew Jermaine!

  • @noinwe so, since you want to build a case on singing, let's spit yammer and while the instructor is tutoring the student will receive! How did you judge Carolyn being a better singer? your statement "Jody at best was an average singer, with great songs" the way I see it, Carolyn's a below average singer, with no hits! I think authenticity would work better on this version of Shalamar with their own songs but until then, in the GREAT words of Jermaine Stewart "EVERYBODY WANTS JODY!

  • @noinwe I really wish certain group of people would remain silent instead of speaking to remove my doubts about them! There have been original singers in a group, left the nucleus and the public have falling for the new comer (never in Carolyn's case) example: Diana Ross and Jean Terrell of the Supremes. Diana was fabulous in what she brought, but there were other FANS who liked Jean better. But then again, Terrell never misled the public into passing herself off as Diana Ross, either!

  • @noinwe in closing, just because Carolyn's voice is MUCH heavier than Jody's is a far cry from making her a better singer, or a singer! An audible sound is not always a good sound, it's just a sound. It was Jody's voice that gave the group & Solar it's SOUND, don't believe it, check out Leon's wannabe 2nd coming of Shalamar, DYNASTY, with that, i bring this topic to a period. I'll say, deeper sound! Maybe someone should check her knickers see if she wears Victoria secrets or Fruit of the looms!

  • @noinwe girl, where you at? Still on that mission searching for the missing girl school in Ghana. Hmm... Can't find nothing that don't exist! I just checked out Shalamar's show at the 02 bar lounge and you're right, Carolyn's voice is low. So low that the trio's once beloved harmonies now sounds like three bull moose's stuck in mud. Mmm, with Carolyn in the group, Jeffrey has to sing Jody's note. And for the record, the brim hat's not working for her. She needs a larger size... As in, SOMBRERO!

  • @1973cleopatrajones When did Jeffrey learn to sing?

  • @BeautyinChaos1 he hasn't!

  • @noinwe being such the close Griffey family friend you say you are, you're the only one who knows their sound since the public hasn't heard them sing for almost 30 years. The public knew Shalamar's sound because Leon created their sound around Jody and her unique tone (pre-Howard). Being loud does not a better singer make. With Carolyn's LOUD flat, tones and Howard's cracking voice is a sad remnants of what once was a good thing gone bad. This is definitely not the group the public remembers

  • @noinwe if Whitney Houston, who was once considered the most widely acclaimed singer in the business had been Jody's replacement, the outcome of the group would have been the same. Once nectar's drawn from a flower, bees will defect from the vine, once nucleus is divided from the atom, there's no nuclei and that's the result of Shalamar, the group lost it's significant mark and tried resuscitating with a 2nd rate look alike, and a tone-death bass singer and the group lack the fullness & harmony.

  • @noinwe your post of 'she' (Caroly) being a better singer would matter a damn if the public knew who 'she' is. Let's take a look at history, 'her' story, unlike yours, never lies! Shalamar sold records when Jody was in the group, she departed to do Jody, and did very well, selling over 25 millions disc, Shalamar had not another hit once Jody hit air waves, so from the PUBLIC'S affirmation, the votes have been tallied who's the better singer. I would advise your friend to take singing lessons!

  • @noinwe not that people are used to hearing Jody's voice that they'er favoring with familiarity w/Shalamar, it was her uniqueness. Her look, tone and style. If a singer before her (which there was) had worked better, the group woul've remain top of their game, but once 'Take that to the bank' was released w/her tone setting the sound, the group broke bank. You claim Carolyn's better, then shouldn't there be a hit somewhere....at least a single. Scared of a little competition? Bring it Bitches!

  • @noinwe Don (Cornelius), being the great visionary that he is, knew exactly what he was doing when he HAND PICKED Jody to be in shalamar knowing her presence would elevate the group to the level of success with her Ross-like quality, style and class (which Shalamar now lacks). Maybe the new Shalamar should revisit some of those old rehersal tapes that's on BETA, and being the nostalgic that they are, I'm sure one member still holds dearly to their VCR-BETAMAC!

  • @noinwe Well...well...well! We finally meet again ;-) I'd wondered where you had tucked your tail and ran off too! Bet'cha you never thought in a million years we'd bump heads, again, but guess what. I'm baccccccccccccckkkkkkk! And, unlike you, I won't be high-tailing it back to Dodge no time soon. So, I think I'll pull up a chair and rest a while. And, while I'm here, make yourself useful. Bring me a cocktail! It's the least you could do after your disappearing act from UNFILTERED!

  • @GMANKOOL23 It seems as if the masses agree with you, also. It's been 27 years ago since there last hit, or album, and Jody hasn't been off the charts since 1987.

  • I'm sorry, but this isn't O.G. Shalamar. Home girl is a nice singer but Shalamar will never be electric like it once was without Jody, Jeffrey & Howard together. I don't give a rat's poot what or how they split up, it's just not the same. It's like watching Earth, Wind & Fire without Maurice White...

  • To be honest, I believe I saw Damita Jo Freeman do the moonwalk on an episode of Soul Train with Rufus Thomas a few years before the Shalamar years. She was later on the Private Benjamin series in the 80's.

  • Both Jodi & Howard got really resentful because in Europe and Asia, Jeffrey was the most popular of the three. He wasn't one of the "lead" vocalists, but had flare (fashion wise) and was (is) a great dancer.

  • @MB3Productions I think you have your facts skewed and should watch Ms Watley's Unfiltered on her jwatley1 youtube channel she breaks down the deterioration of the group in her own words. She wished them all well even though the same could not be said of them to her it seems and went on to her own solo success, resentful? In terms of "Flair", Watley, wins then and NOW. Are you serious?

  • @stilettogroove Do you honestly believe that if Ms. Watley was indeed resentful, that she would share that in an interview? "Oh, yes, I'm quite resentful. I thought I deserved the spotlight for myself". I don't think so. But she is/was indeed talented and I'm a fan. I just know that both she and Howard, being the "lead singers" didn't understand why Jeffrey had so much attention and was actually the favorite in many countries (not the U.S.). Are YOU serious? :-)

  • @MB3Productions Say what? And she would be resentful because why? Hello she had her own hits and accolades Daneils quit the group first because he thought he would be the most successful, we know how that turned out don't we, lol YES I am serious. Watley quit and wished them all well despite their wishing her the opposite go listen to her own words on her channel unfiltered and if not anyone who watched unsung can see how shady those dudes were from dick griffery , daniels and the hewett guy

  • @MB3Productions i encourage anyone reading this nonsense to watch the full watley unflitered on her channel jwatley1 learn about griffery's greed the egos of daniels and hewett smh as a watley fan i'm so glad she left and did her own thing (adding she still does) while the others either ride the nostaliga wave or MJ's coattails. RIP King of POP

  • Tony, you gave me lots of nights to remember and I never forgot. My wish is to find you again some day, to know if you are well. Do you think of me sometimes, listening to Shalamar? Heidi

  • Who is Dick Griffey?

  • @MrSexxxy20 Dick Griffey was the founder of Solar Records who signed Shalamar to their his label. He died two months ago after heart surgery and he did Jody and Jefferey wrong

  • I love this group there music was fab why did they have to split up what a shame

  • @billclements70 it was for the best especially for Ms Watley

  • this group was going to be huge and i mean huge and egos got in the way.

  • Where the fuck is JODY?????

  • Howard can still sing. I love his voice!

  • I remember Jodi Watley saying she would NEVER perform as Shalamar again. Thats sad, they made such great music together and as w/ most groups when they get new members, its not the same...chemistry be all off...anywho...Jeffrey still got them soul train moves, lol...go Jeffrey!

  • what kinda show is this?

  • from what i understand this female is dick griffey's daughter and he is not someone that i would admire just a no good snake in the grass

  • jody whatley owns her sorry!

  • She's no Jody Watley or Delisa Davis, but Carolyn Griffey is a great singer. But it's too bad that Shalamar reunion didn't last

  • Jody need t bring her ass back. ya'll subscribe to my channel.

  • Ain't that the truth?

  • Industry insiders have said that even after all these years that Howard, Jeffrey and Dick continue to be envious and disrespectful of a solo Jody and that they have never tried to truly remedy the past with her in order to have a positive reunion! It has also been rumored that Dick threatened her physically and verbally, years ago at a industry event as well! After hearing all of this and watching Unsung, it appears that they are indeed still bitter and from a fan's view its a musical shame!

  • Jody might take Dick Griffey and Howard Hewett seriously about a Shalamar reunion if they gave her the respect she deserves starting with paying her for the work she did in Shalamar. She makes more money now as an independent artist especially since she owns her own label and can control her own music from a business and creative standpoint - she owns the rights to her own music and can create freely. Why return to Shalamar where they still don't give her the props she deserves?

  • @stanleyballard amen to that! Jody, keep doin you and don't worry about the ones the kept you down for so long! I love you truly and keep you head up sista!

  • @dpartystarter1 Which industry insiders? Tell us your sources

  • @dpartystarter1 Very serious stuff ... the golden goose has been killed.

    x

  • @GeneralTrousers Who is the Golden Goose?????..Who is x?...Look up Jody's revealing Unfiltered series on this site!

  • @dpartystarter1 some Gooses are known to have laid some rotten eggs! Hahaha!

  • ditto sexybrownsatindiva and osmiley99!

    jody won't come back check out her myspace page :(

  • Great hook. Love that old Stax-synth sound. This female singer is very good.

  • Never be the same without Jody's voice. That girls voice is too shaky and empty.. Jody's pitch was more feverish and Jody does not pronounce the letter R when she sings.

    When the new girl came out the audience froze and did not like her or her wig. sorry..

  • @sexybrownsatindiva - Who is this girl? This is not Jody Whatley?

  • Wow, Howard can't hit or hold the high notes anymore so he has to talk though those passages and rearrange his vocals.

  • @kimbaptise Yeah I caught that. He has kinda lost that aspect of his voice :-( Maybe a little coaching will help

  • @kimbaptise yeah I noticed that too !! Howard just does'nt have that voice anymore.

  • Damn! Howard is fine. And now he's COCK DIESEL. Talk about eye candy!

  • This song is kind of hot. I know it's an old 80s song from Shalamar but I'm starting to look up their songs because I heard Jeffrey Daniels taught Micheal Jackson dance moves.

  • ye he did i check it out on the internet to. michael took moves from james brown alittle from jeffreys poping and moonwalking. but michael master it ALL and took it to another level......

  • I love this group. Jody can come back, but this woman looks like her. I believe she is the record owners daughter.

  • aint da same without jody, but they still got it. Jeffrey is a Awesome dancer, when he debuted his dance in 82 he brought a dance style Uk people never saw. I am definitely inspired by Jeffrey

  • I like how he did da mj moon walk & then passed da mic to jody watley

  • Its not the MJ moonwalk... He was the one who did it before micheal.... Though MJ Perfected It

  • @tarunkzzz NO ITS THE BILLY OCEAN MOONWALK!!!!

  • @tarunkzzz Sorry Micheal did not perfect the moon walk..this dude is a s loose as a goose ....he's the man and the group is awesome..

  • @Kanescollectibles if Michael didn't perfecte the MOONWALK, then who did? Certainlt you don't believe Jeffrey did? Maybe, you should speak with the gentleman who TAUGHT Michale, and Jeffrey, Cooley Jackson! He, and the public thinks differently. But, it's a free country to think what you think. At least I now know what you and a wooden bobble head have in common!

  • @tarunkzzz MJ didnt prefect it.... he just redid it and made it more popular because its now tied to him.... it still a shame that Shalamar or Soul Train still doesnt get the much create for creating the original move....

  • @tarunkzzz exactly the moonwalk was a dance kids were doing on the street in the 80s Michael Jackson and Jeffrey Daniels just perfected it and make it look smoother.

  • @amillionwaysTv Jeffrey Daniels was the main and long-time choreographer of Michael Jackson. Actually he taught him moonwalk and some other things. Most notably, choreography in Bad and Smooth Criminal videos

  • @wasntme1967 Main choreographer? You might want to double check your info. Michael Peters (Thriller, Beat It), Vincent Paterson (Smooth Criminal, Blood on The Dance Floor), Travis Payne (Dangerous Emmy Nomination), Jeffrey Hornaday (Captain EO)..Michael had many teacher dating back to Soul Train (Cooley Jaxson, Geron "Casper" Candidate) the list goes on and Mr. Jackson King of Pop always credited those he really worked with.

  • @nuthinbutclassics @wasntme ......And, let's not forget one of the original 'Lockers,' Shabado

  • this is such a great song and howards still sexy even if he got some beef on him. more sexiness to love

  • They sounded great...Howard is the bomb...Jeffrey sounded great....the new girl sounded good...I know we all want to see Jody..but she probably won't ever do this..

  • when was this?

  • Hopefully, a lot of you got to watch "UnSung" which came on tonight on TV One. Jody says that she will probably never participate in a Shalamar reunion.

    I guess from all the stuff that happened, she said if we knew what she knew, we wouldn't want to participate in a reunion either.

  • Im glad we got to here everyone side of the story.

  • There were rumors of Jeffrey pushing her out of a moving van and stuff like that.

  • No that was Jeffrey pushing Stephanie Mills out of a moving vehicle..he dated her also...the rumor was Howard and Jody had a relationshipa and it caused his first divorce. They got into a physical altercation on the set of the video "Dead Giveaway"

  • @littletink03 I worked at Solar from the Gearld Brown days through the time went Jeffrey walked away at the group's height of fame, and with all that was going on within the group, she's right, neither would you, but if you'd like to know more, I invite you to Jody Watley's UNFILTERED... you'll discover all you need to know!

  • Who won if it wasn't shalamar? Jeff Daniels, still looking as hot & sexy as ever!

  • Where's Jody????!!!!!!

  • This was good but it would have been better with Jody Watley but the new girl held her own.

  • No JODY ! Where is she? Carolyn can sing, you go girl

  • @ewingkha you can go to any local Baptist, C.O.G.I.C. (church of God in Christ) Methodist, or non-denomination church and you'll find some of the greatest singers you'll ever here, but without the X-factor, which most SINGERS lack, a star can't ever be created, and you're left with just ONE of many singer! Catch that!

  • Hell nah that ain't Jody or Delisa Davis(the one that replaced Jody) back in '84. This is SUPERWHACKED. Jody is also a vital part of Shalamar. I cannot understand why Howard,Jeffrey and Jody put aside their differences and make a comeback album and tour. It would definately sell out. Fo sho.

  • definitely NOT Jody Watley! But I can't blame her for declining this. This show is cheezy and definitely creates an aura of "has been"

  • that ain't Jody!

  • still luv me some shalamar!

  • ok I see Howard, Jeff and who's the lady, Jody's replacement? I thought it was a reunion performance.

  • Thats not Jody Watley?

  • Carolyn Griffey (long time friend and fan of the original band, and daughter of Shalamar founder Dick Griffey). - wikipedea... and it wasnt really a reunion performance, it was for an "american idol like" contest show with old music acts... viewers voted for their fav to win hence the tel# @ 3:27. i was disappointed that shalamar didnt win

  • what happen to "Jody Watley"???.

  • @DarkShoryuken well, America seemed to had got it right!

  • @Juillet14 Delisa Davis was Jody's replacement. Carolyn Griffey was Delisa's replacement, and not the greatess, i must add!

  • shalamar, you guys rock(^-^), carolyn, you are excellent, you fit in perfectly and i'm so glad to hear that male and female harmony that makes your music so magical, and much love to hh and jd, ya'll keep doin yo thang

Loading...
0 / 00Unsaved Playlist Return to active list
    1. Your queue is empty. Add videos to your queue using this button:
      or sign in to load a different list.
    Loading...Loading...Saving...
    • Clear all videos from this list
    • Learn more