Unitarian Universalist National Marketing Campaign NOT!

[bensteinke]

Let it go, Robin. UUism is a shallow, elitist, pompous, and flighty collective of people without a clear and well-founded sense of direction and purpose. They flaunt their advanced college degrees (from Harvard/Yale/Stanford/Berkeley­, of course) and their majors in English and Women's Studies and love to stick their noses in the air and look down upon those who couldn't afford college. Theirs is little more than a social club for bored liberals.  Let them go, Robin, and seek CHRIST.

[RobinEdgar]

Ben,

You're a genius! U*Us are always trying to formulate a short concise description of *The* Tiny Declining Fringe Religion aka Unitarian*Universalism to share with people who ask what U*Uism is. They call this brief concise description an "elevator speech" because one is supposed to be able to share it with someone within the short time that one might be together with them in an ascending, or in the case of U*Uism. . . descending, elevator. You have provided a wonderful "elevator speech"!

[MismeretMonk]

@bensteinke thanks. Your comment reminded me how completely done I am with Christianity.

[baggagequeen]

STALKER is a 7 letter word!

[RobinEdgar]

So it is baggagequeen.

PROTESTER is a 9 letter word.

My peaceful public protest would have ended years ago if Montreal Unitarian U*Us and the UUA had responded to my serious complaints about the anti-religious intolerance and bigotry of Rev. Ray Drennan, Frank Greene, and other "fundamentalist atheist" Humanist U*U bigots with justice, equity and compassion. In fact my protest only began after they had ignored my letters of grievance and had expelled me from the "church" for distributing them

[tlh215]

Robin...a non-theistic/humanist UU told my Pagan boyfriend Joseph that Joe was carrying around useless "baggage" in the form of theistic belief. Joe did deliver a catty but intelligent response and left him to his irritation. Point is, no one is perfect, whether UU or humanist or Christian or Pagan. Why not just give Drennan enough rope to hang himself (similar to the way Joe handled the humanist) if he's the jerk you've indicated he is, and leave it at that? His butt will get bit, right?

[tlh215]

I mean, think on it a moment...Drennan, no matter what job he wound up holding, has as much right as anyone to make an ass of himself, yes? So let him have his moment of being an ass and don't give him more power than he deserves, make sense? Has he moved on with his life from the "cult" incident you describe? If he has, then it is he who has you in his power, not the other way around. Think about it...

[tlh215]

I'm trying to find a website with something to read about what Creation Day is all about anyway...help?

[daledeloy]

I guess I'm missing the whole "Cult is a four letter word" Ok yeah.... and your point?

[RobinEdgar]

The point of my -

"CULT" IS A FOUR LETTER WORD

picket sign slogan is that using the four letter word "cult" to describe a person's or group's religious activities is about the most insulting, defamatory, and damaging label that one can use these days. The only justifiable use of this derogatory aka pejorative label is when the group in question actually is a genuine cult. "Cult" is the 20th and 21st centuries equivalent of the word "witch". That label casts fear and suspicion upon the labelee.

[daledeloy]

But why would you do that to someone? To treat a complete stranger with such harshness. Its no wonder we won't have world peace because people like you find satisfaction in people's pain and suffering.

[RobinEdgar]

Please see my CULT IS A FOUR LETTER WORD video Dale. It was Rev. Ray Drennan of the Unitarian Church of Montreal who treated *me*, someone who was close to being a complete stranger to him because he made virtually no effort to get to know me, with such harshness. I am peacefully protesting against the fact that he and other leaders of the Unitarian Church of Montreal falsely and maliciously labeled an inter-religious celebration of Creation that I had quite successfully organized as a "cult".

[ChrisSuperstar]

Quit stalking the UU's.  You claim you're not crazy, but you sure act like it. Personally, I think you're a lunatic and I hope the law keep you away from the poor people.

[poiliopizzuy]

Creation day is retarded...If people want to forward the obviously false view of the Christian right about the origins of the world , then they should go to a conservative Baptist church. It does nothing for religion to forward literal interpretations of texts. I went to the creation day website and they are complaining about the fact that Christian creationism is not taught in school. Well in the USA that type of thing is illegal.

[RobinEdgar]

Actually poiliopizzuy it looks like some Christians decided to start a different Creation Day celebration. The Creation Day that Rev. Ray Drennan, and other intolerant and abusive fundamentalist atheist "Humanist" U*Us, falsely and maliciously labeled as a "cult" was an inter-religious event that brought together people from diverse religious groups and belief systems, including atheists. . . to share their beliefs about the origins of the world and promote care for the Earth and its creatures.

[poiliopizzuy]

Sorry..that sucks. It sound very un UU to me.

I apologize for my hasty assumption.

[RobinEdgar]

Well, if you mean that falsely and maliciously labeling an inter-religious event as a "cult" is very unUU, I fully agree. That is why I filed a formal complaint against Rev. Ray Drennan with the Board of the Unitarian Church of Montreal and forwarded a copy of it to UUA President John Buehrens. Unfortunately the UUA's well named Ministerial Fellowship Committee decided that Rev. Ray Drennan's anti-religious intolerance and bigotry was "within the appropriate guidelines of ministerial leadership"

[RobinEdgar]

I hereby accept your apology for your hasty assumption. I have a policy of generally accepting apologies that are volunteered unilaterally without me needing to ask for one even if the offence is quite serious. Quite regrettably neither Rev. Ray Drennan nor the Unitarian Church of Montreal, nor the UUA's Ministerial Fellowship Committee ever offered me such an apology. In fact I am still waiting for acceptable apologies from the aforementioned parties and some other U*Us who owe me apologies.

[baristamullet]

Maybe you should just forgive. Stop waiting for an apology. If one comes, great. If not, so be it. Eh?

[RobinEdgar]

Unfortunately, Rev. Ray Drennan and other intolerant and abusive U*Us repeatedly rejected the high degree of forgiveness that they would have received following an apology that clearly acknowledged the wrongfulness and harmfulness of their insulting and defamatory smearing of me and my religious beliefs and practices. U*Us have repeatedly punished me for exposing and denouncing their injustices and abuses so now I insist that they provide some genuine justice and accountability in this matter.

[RobinEdgar]

For the record, Rev. Diane Rollert, the new minister of the Unitarian Church of Montreal, is currently seeking a restraining order against me in a manner that perverts justice and further defames me. Rev. Rollert has made highly misleading and outright false statements to the police and she has also told falsehoods and a few provable outright lies in her sworn testimony against me in criminal court. Can U*Us say perjury? Hypocritical U*U attempts to silence me can only prolong this war of words.

[greenfrogct]

Robin -

Each UU church is self governing. Your issue is with Rev. Drennan and the Board of the Montreal church. The UUA has no jurisdiction over the affairs of a church with a minister in final fellowship except for serious breaches of ministerial ethics -- which your complaint does not rise to. In fact, The UUA has no jurisdiction over the affairs of any UU church in Canada and has not since the CUC officially seperated from the UUA on 7/1/02.

N'amaste

[RobinEdgar]

Some of my issues are with Rev. Drennan the so-called Unitarian Church of Montreal, but others are with the UUA and those U*Us who condone the anti-religious intolerance and bigotry and other U*U injustices, abuses and hypocrisy that I am protesting against. The UUA has jurisdiction over the affairs of U*U ministers to use your words. Do you really believe that falsely and maliciously labeling me as "psychotic" and Creation Day as "your cult" are not serious breaches of ministerial ethics?

[RobinEdgar]

It would appear that greenfrogct is at a loss for words. . .

[MikeSarno]

A minister calling someone "psychotic" is simply wrong, there's no other way to state it. However, you must see that this is extremely low on a scale of breaches of ministerial ethics. I hope you can make peace with the Montreal congregation, or that you find another religious home. Stop by the UU Church of Athens and Sheshequin if you're ever in our neck of the woods. Peace.

[RobinEdgar]

Unfortunately Mike, Montreal Unitarians and the UUA have behaved in a way that indicates that they believe that it is perfectly acceptable for a U*U minister, U*U church presidents, and other U*Us to label me "psychotic" or otherwise insane and my religious activies as a "cult". This is all very well documented. I can make peace with Montreal U*Us and the UUA etc. as soon as they do what is necessary to make peace with me. So far they have obstinately refused to do so. . .

[MikeSarno]

"So far they have obstinately refused to do so. . ."

Then I suppose my advice to you is: wish them well in a different part of the world. If they've brought you to this point, then you should feel justified in moving on with your life and your spiritual journey. Again, feel free to stop by some time to visit a 200-year old Universalist congregation. Peace.

[gingerbreadmun]

If you click on view all comments then it goes in order with the replies underneath - makes much more sense

[RobinEdgar]

It looks like my commenting on them in reverse order put them back in correct order.

[gingerbreadmun]

Ok all my posts were part of one big email so its best that they are read from the first to the last. sorry!

[gingerbreadmun]

Sorry I ranted a little too much there but as you know unitarians tend to have strong views and find it hard to keep them in! I am sorry that this happened to you and I hope you find somewhere, where you can feel comfortable in your beliefs and it makes me so sad that the Rev. has made this impossible for you in the one place I thought was meant for everyone

[RobinEdgar]

No need to apologize for you "rant" gingerbreadmun. Of course Rev. Ray Drennan and other "like-minded" intolerant fundamentalist atheist "Humanist" U*Us have strong views and find it hard to keep them in too! ;-) It should be noted that it was not just Rev. Ray Drennan who made it impossible for me to be in the one place you thought was meant for everyone. As you noted, he was backed up by many other "Unitarians". . .

[greenfrogct]

I deplore the use of the word "cult". The majority of UUs I know would agree. On your "World Day of Conscience" website you speak of "A Better Future for Humanity". Perhaps we would all be better served by devoting our attentions to those things we hold in common, and apply the balm of love and forgiveness to old wounds rather than use them to hurt those who share so much in common, even if it is expressed in different words.

[RobinEdgar]

U*Us have abjectly failed to state that they deplore the intolerant and abusive labeling of Creation Day as a "cult" by Rev. Ray Drennan and other anti-religious U*Us. U*Us would be well served by devoting their attention to the injustices, abuses and hypocrisy that I am protesting against in order to bring the balm of healing to the U*U World. U*Us have repeatedly proven themselves to be unloving and unforgiving. The utterly conscienceless behaviour of U*Us inspired World Day of Conscience. . .

[greenfrogct]

I am sorry for your pain. I hope you can find some peace.

[RobinEdgar]

I am by no means the only victim of injustices and abuses perpetrated and/or perpetuated by Unitarian*Universalists aka U*Us. When we actually receive some genuine justice, genuine equity, and genuine compassion from the individual U*Us (including U*U clergy. . .), U*U "churches", and indeed the UUA's very aptly named Ministerial Fellowship Committee and its office of Congregational Services, there may be some genuine peace for us and for U*Us more generally.

[gingerbreadmun]

But we have people like all religions who take it differently, ie. Islam is supposed to be a very nonviolent religion but some people read the texts in their own way and take to acts that hurt people - which never ends well, its not the religions fault but the organisation behind it should stick to the main principles.

[gingerbreadmun]

I tell people that in my faith we baiscally preach tolerance, and I know in my church your experience would be welcomed by my minister and my most even if they were sceptical but it frustrates me so much that people can - as I put it - act so un-unitarian!

[RobinEdgar]

I agree that Rev. Ray Drennan's insulting and defamatory anti-religious attack on me was quite "un-Unitarian". Quite regrettably however neither the Board and congregation of the Unitarian Church of Montreal, nor the UUA and its Ministerial Fellowship committee, agree with that assessment. Maybe the next time I am in the UK I will visit your Unitarian Church and see how British Unitarians do respond to my claims about the symbolic "Eye of God" that is manifested during total solar eclipses.

[gingerbreadmun]

I also went to a young adult conference and especially in that age range - traditional views can be looked down upon but it was made clear that this was not what the organisation felt, ie I am a straight, monogamist who is reasonable conservative in my actions - and felt slightly out of place. This was by a certain group mind - not the organisers or many of the elder members.

[RobinEdgar]

I presume that you mean the British Unitarian organization here.

[gingerbreadmun]

Actually it was an american and canadian combined conference that I went to - I haven't yet been to a young adult conference in the UK yet - they aren't very big because the culture is very different overhere and we do not have anywhere near the amount of people. I think it depends on who you are dealing with because not all the UUA organisers would have agreed with your treatment but unfortunatley it turned out the way it did.

[gingerbreadmun]

I was sat in my second service at an Australian church they were discussing intelligent design - as a true unitarian I think that I don't belive in intelligent design but it is a viable belief to have and shouldn't be dismissed. The man behind me however stood up and proceeded to tell the congregation that believers were pretty much stupid for believing in it and the 'lies' should not be taught. He was asked to be more tolerant or he wasn't welcome back to the services.

[RobinEdgar]

The man behind you could have been a U*U minister. . . You are right on the money in suggesting that it is "awful" that such anti-religious intolerance and bigotry on the part of a Unitarian*Universalist minister was, and still is. . . backed up by both the Unitarian Church of Montreal and the UUA's very aptly named Ministerial Fellowship Committee.

[gingerbreadmun]

I am shocked at what happened that is ridiculous for a UU minister to say! I am a british unitarian and have recently got involved with the american UUs and the canadian unitarians and even a few australian churches - I was travelling, I think there are a lot of people like that in the communities like there are in all religions but for the UUA to back him up is awful!

[RobinEdgar]

Thank you so much for putting your two cents worth, or perhaps I should say your common sense worth, in here gingerbreadmun. It was indeed ridiculous, to say nothing of intolerant, hostile and abusive, for Rev. Ray Drennan to contemptuously dismiss my revelatory religious experience as "your psychotic experience" and falsely and maliciously attack Creation Day as "your cult".