You changed my morality, 9 months ago today. I have never looked back to religion since and i owe you a great debt, more than i can ever hope to repay. Thank you.
@VeritasTruthEmet: God's moral standards? No thanks! Look at how God rewards child sacrifice for Jephthah, how he arranges the killing of Job's beloved children just because Job trusted God, how God commands his people to rip little girls from the bloody arms of their murdered mothers and take them home to share with YHVH's priests, how he approves of public rape to punish people. Look at the command to practice ritualized cannibalism! What a wonderful pattern for morality!
@wowpapa Laws set by a government elected by the majority of the population make acts criminal and punishable... You know this already, and it ought to be the primary reason why you pay heed to the laws of your country - not that you think there is a divine being watching you who will judge you in an afterlife.
It is the primary reason. But just because others think their is no god doesn't change my perspective because just as their is no evidence to say their is a god, there is none to disprove him. Evolution is true, but that doesn't change my perspective.
@wowpapa I have no quarrel with you or anybody else believing in things, i just wanted to point out that laws are contingent on the population as a majority agreeing that they are sound to judge by. And that is regardless of there being a god or not, or several gods for that matter, heck even if there were a pantheon of gods, aliens and mythical creatures the laws of our nations would still be contingent on the wish of the population for regulation and order :)
I agree with this VID 100%, but I have to ask "With what would us humans replace the sense of community many of these religions promote?" Without religion we would more than likely to fall back on patriotism or racism.
These are still dividing doctrines.
As far as I know humanism has not promoted any sense of community.
What belief system could actually heal the world? That is the question I have been asking myself.
Well if 'community' can be measured by crime rate then go look at Sweden.A largely socialist secular society with low crime rates.There is no belief system to heal the world but getting rid of religion would remove the major source of conflict.
the easy way would be to gather 30k+ people that agree with you, then kill off the rest and repopulate the world with people who generally agree on everything, that'd be the nice and lazy way though.
religion is already used to endorse patriotism and racism, so it can't get worse without it.
I'm not sure how critical you are of the usage of humanism, if lenient, I know several communities based on it (though they still pay taxes to the larger community)
We are all divided by separate communities regardless of religion or nationality, race, etc.. But with the Internet or Youtube platform we seem to be closer together with no barriers.
Humanism promotes one planet, one home, but you must bury your mental baggage to be composted.
Belief system? How about a verifying system instead? So we can get on with it, and spend more time on exploring for the little time that we have here.
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i dont know if i a gree with this video i can see were you are coming from. but if you observe the soshal structure of the religious and the non religious threw out history and in present day or Evin political structure the religious mane tan society with hire growth as for the non religious thay do not which is seen in history and present day....the word escaped me but right wing / left wing
The Bible was written exclusively by men, and when the female perspective is left out, you can bet the message will be one-sided, and screwed up. You always need the male AND the female perspective to get a good sense of the message. I tired to read the Bible on my spiritual quest, and it just didn't work out. It made me really angry. Chauvinism incarnate. God is smarter than people give credit for. Intention is very important.
I know, from personal experience, that some things in the Bible are true. But I don't think all of it is true. Everytime I read it, I become enraged about something. I have no specifics for you. I've tried to read the Book, but it doesn't work out for me. I follow just what Jesus said, and consider the rest. It's the best I can do.
Ok, not criticizing, just clarifying. So you are not a fundamentalist, but you hold your beliefs to be true as you understand them. Your reason for your beliefs are your life experiences. It would be very wrong of anyone to tell you they are not true. That said, it is equally wrong to dismiss another's beliefs based on that person's life experiences. The belief in God, or a god, or several gods, or none at all is a personal conclusion. tbc...
I cannot speak for all athiests, but for myself I'm tired of others trying to convert or "save" me. I'm not trying to discount your beliefs Belle. I do have one more question, why do most (not all) Christians feel such a compelling desire to force their beliefs onto others?
I am an independent Christian, bound by no laws of any church or dogma. I hold my beliefs to be true because of my experiences, nothing else. On my spiritual quest, I was looking for truth, not God, not Jesus. All I found was Jesus. The Man is real. I'm not capable of creating a man who walks into my room, and touches me physically on my head. I'm not. I've also glimpsed behind the veils. The kingdom of God is within, so are the veils. I can't shut up about what I experienced, because it's true.
I think I've given offense when it was not intended. I'm not saying you should "shut up", I respect your beliefs and your right to have and express them. I'm asking why do you, as a Christian, think that some Christians (though not necessarily you) feel the need to convert others? I really am trying to gain an understanding of that.
I'm not offended at all. Talking to you is a breeze. You should see what I go through. Most Christians try to convert people because they are supposed to. It's probably in the Bible somewhere. I'm not trying to convert anyone to anything. I swear I'm not. I've experienced things so out-of-the-ordinary. I've been healed of pain, rescued, and when told by my doctor, I needed surgery for a crushed disk, healed of it after months when I prayed to Him. I'm 58 years old, no liar, and perfectly lucid.
Peace to you Belle. Either way, believer or non-believer, in the end we all find out the truth. I'm actually ok with the idea of ceasing to exist when I die, but the idea of a heaven is quite tempting too. I can't say that I believe because I won't lie, not even to a god that I don't believe exists. My lack of belief does not invalidate your belief in any way. I'm very glad you have found what you were looking for, I've stopped looking, but I'm not sad either. Peace. :)
I know your lack of belief does not invalidate my experiences. I think you're wondering what I'm doing on this channel talking about my stuff. I'm subscribed to many athiest channels, because athiests are very intelligent, and I like to hear what they say, and watch their videos. I understand why people are becoming athiests. I do! If I hadn't had my experiences, I would be right there with you. But, I know there is something else going on here. None of this is real. An experience for growth.
lsd or a dream is what happend to you lol...jesus it was not,dont be silly..you know that deep down your telling lies or you really wanted somthing like that to happen to you and you have convinced yourself that it really happend,i think that deep down everyone really knows that religion and praying is bull shit,but not every body wants to stand up and say.."this is crap i dont believe in any of this"..because they will be disowned by family and friends,in a lot of cases anyway.
Accusing ME of LIEING? Are you out-of-your-mind? You wait, until someone you love is suffering, or dieing. You'll be on your bony knees asking for a miracle, intervention. Convinced myself? How droll. How short-sighted you are. I'm old enough to know what's happened to me. You obviously are not old enough, nor have you done any work, to realize that there is much more going on here than you could ever dream. You just a child, with no experience. Evolve please.
Though I don't doubt your sincerity belle, I have to say if you were living in iran or saudi arabia or another none christian country and you had the same physical experiences with your body (having whatever illness you had and getting better) you would NOT of been thinking it was jesus. Also I really can't tell the different between your case and a mental patient. I mean whats the differents between your believe and with someone thats got paranoia
Why do you insist that there is only one reality, this one? Your scientists have found "vibration," at the core of the atom, nothing solid. There is great strength in a Name. There was no paranoia involved at all. I don't drink, smke dope, and have delusions. Never. There "is" someone out there. I worked my ass off, searching for truth. What have you done? Probably nothing, and you have nothing but this crumby reality. I pity you, because you're wrong. Be happy, fool.
I wasn't talking about different realities...but I guess I am now. Why do YOU think there is more than one reality. To think there is more than one you'd have evidence for it. E.g saying "there is another room", you can prove it by showing pictures of the other room or even take the person there. But how can you say somethi like more than one reality without prove. Just because this reality might be "crumbly" at least I KNOW it's here. btw the vibrations you talked about are just how atoms work
At the core of the atom is vibration, meaning the core of everything "is not solid." Hello!Spiritual things have to be proven to the self. Every individual has to do this themselves. I can't show you what I saw, found. I can only tell you about it. What I can do, is tell you how I got to the point, where I could see, feel, know. I worked so hard seeking truth.
1. The Tibetan Five.
2. Breathing rhythms.
3. Meditation.
Now go work. Your breathing rhythms are directly related to your reality
For an outsider there is not one difference between what you said you saw (jesus), compared to someone who thought they were abducted by aliens..both claim something happened and both have no way for an outside to confirm what actually happened. So even if you tell someone this story they have NO reason to believe it. Anyway, so your saying if you do the work you'll see something...if you look long enough, and ook hard enough, at the sky you'll eventally see 'something'
No. What I'm saying is if you do the techniques, they will change you, or put into action, something you could do all along. Knowing ourselves is required. Our sense of reality is directly connected to our breathing rhythms. True. We do have chakras in our spirit bodies, and the kundalini is real. I raised mine to my heart chakra. The Tibetan Five simple yoga postures help in bringing the power of the kundalini up the spine. Opens you up to the spirit world. Don't believe? Good. Bye.
Belle19700: Your physical postures affect what exactly? It lifts your physical well being, which your have translated as being tied to the spirit world.
How does that argument follow logically?
You feel better exercising? It has been proven that exercise causes one to feel better, but these exercises effect your physical world and has nothing to do with a spiritual world.
There is no immediate logic in this. When you do yoga, it enhances your sensitivity. If you don't believe this, I suggest you call 1-800-India. When I do the Tibetan Five, meditate, and do breathing rhythms, stuff happens much more quickly. There is a spirit world, and the portal is in your own third eye, which can see both in and out. I don't ask anyone to believe me. Just try it, when you get sick of this world, and try to find truth.
You made me laugh so hard with that pathetic line about "when you get sick of this world" lmao!! You`re basically telling people to be pessimistic and to go looking for an escape they don`t need, and that`s retarded. Truth can`t be found by trying to escape reality.
If you want to understand what the "third eye" actually means, you should read Joseph Campbell`s Transformations of Myth Through Time, he knew all about it, and it`s not a portal to cop-out land.
Belle19700: I do Tai Chi and experience the same thing, but I realize the good feelings are caused by physical movements, and not some hockus pockus belief in a spiritual plain.
No. Will you please understand, that I would not lie, or try to mislead anyone. Do the Tibetan Five, some breathing rhythms, and meditation, and see what happens. These things open you up, and, I think, bring you closer to the spirit world.
When I meditate, and do my techniques, I see inside my head. There is a third eye. There is something that maybe you should face. Maybe you're not as mature spiritually, and some of us, because what I'm telling you is true.
Belle19700: I do not doubt that you believe what you say. I do not doubt that this experience for you seems very real. It is after all a mental experience, which is what all our real experiences are.
It is easy for me to see how some people could get the two confused.
That after all is what a psychosis is:
The inability to differentiate reality from the purely mental experiences.
Real is real to you, even if it is only in your mind.
If it works, and helps you stay off of meds, good.
Real is being healed of a crushed disk in my back, right after the doctor told me I needed back surgery. I prayed for healing, and I was healed. That's psychosis? I don't think so.
You're just not spiritually mature enough to grasp the concept, that this reality, is not the only reality. Ask a scientist if there is only one dimension. They'll tell you, there are many dimensions.
The mind and body working together can cause some amazing results, at times. And at others nothing. Many times prayer is added to the equation, which only confuses matters. If one believes ones body can heal itself, from a cut or broken bone without the help of some spiritual being, then back pain should not be any different.
Healing does at times seem to be miraculous, but I believe it is the natural process of the body. Sometimes it works better than at other times.
Because your antagonist doesn't believe your line of bullshit you imply that he may not believe in 'honesty,' 'love,' or 'anything at all?' Wow, what a terrible thing to do to a fellow human being. A spiritually mature person, such as yourself, would admit to this right? Use your third eye and see why you responded in this manner. Then cut away that thing that made you this way. When you're done: I welcome to the realm of ambiguity, fellow atheist.
@elbowbiter1 Line of bullshit? Listen to me, you stupid, little punk: Anyone who rejects something, for absolutely no reason, other than they are in their 20's, and think they know it all, is as much of an ass, as you are.
I am more spirtually mature than you are, and I know this is true.
Come back and talk to me, when you grow up.
U wanna fight? Get ready, because my fights last about 3 months, on the average. How much hate, and disdain R U capable of? Tons, I fugure.Let's go!
Dear Belle, Forgive my insensitive diction. Allow me to better explain. You don't believe in Thor, if people would preach Thor to you, you'd think they were full of it, and vice versa; hense, your brand of bullshit (and it's all bullshit, I am full of it too so it isn't being used as a pejorative, please understand). I didn't mean to get you so defensive and I apologise. Please re read my last post and pretend that I am a good ol' casual friend from back in the day. ;)
Its an interesting thing, reality/truth (practical) and Reality/Truth (the absolute version). In short, scientists define/clarify reality through hypothesis, experimentation, prediction, and finally theory. Ex: the atom, then particles, then quarks, and now strings. For you point on vibrations, on a practical scale, i.e. larger than a particle, everything acts as a solid. Your idea is the perversion of science with some philosophical idea that lets you keep your reality or one alive.
Science can not define Reality. Philosophers basically say humans can never actually know Reality because everything is based on human experience. However, religious people claim that they know Reality/Truth with now background or basis, no way to support it, and now way for it to be Truly communicated to others because every religious person like you has their own version. Does a Reality of 1 count for anything? Its seems arrogant to me.
There are those who would deny a child medical treatment in favor of prayer.. and I
I'm sorry, that's not acceptable to me.
Yes, prayer makes you feel better, but ultimately it doesn't alter the outcome in any way. That doesn't mean that prayer is wrong or even useless.. unless.. it's wrong or useless.
Praying for someone you don't like to get cancer, or prayer that replaces an operation to remove a burst appendix.
I have said, that through my techniques, I may have tapped into a way, some power that the mind has, to heal the body. But what I tell here is just a little bit of what has happened to me. I am not capable of creating a person who touched me physically. No.
People want proof. The only proof anyone will believe is their own proof. This is why I say, do the techniques, and find your own proof. Nobody wants to work. There IS someone out there. I've experienced Him. I saw His sandals and robe.
There is hidden knowledge in this world. I've experienced and experimented with some of it. Extraordinary things have happened to me, actually some before my spiritual quest. I can feel the difference in the atmosphere when I get near water. Very dramatic change. We are a part of this world, not separate. We have feelings, emotions, and they "do" matter, and are powerful. Gateways actually. Some are sensitive, some are not, some refuse to seek. Good book: The Magic of Believing. Peace.
I'm going to do you all a big favor, and get lost. I'm not going to comment on vistimlesscriminal's relgious videos anymore. I just don't belong here, and I know this now. I think it's for the best.
No need for that Belle, Why are you taking it as a personal affront, it is just discourse is it not? We may not agree on things granted, but there is no need to get upset and walk away from the conversation. Like you striving to get us [atheists] to see things from your vantage point, we are also striving likewise to do the same for you. If you find offence in a open space like this, merely shrug it off and ignore the comment.
Islam would have to be the warped sandshoe of human morality. The anointed treasurers of God's latest thoughts calmly (or violently) tell us all how we must behave. Murder apostates, murder jews, murder non-believers, murder adulterers... then get rewarded.
Since cognitive biologist have pretty much proven that our morality comes from our instinctive empathy and to a large dregree also from the envoirment, I have never thought if the "morality argument" as being very valid.
But good job at making some enviorment related arguments.
Are you sure that Christians believe that athiests are immoral? I don't. I have found the athiests I listen to are usually pretty smart. They think. I don't agree with everything they believe, because I can't. But at the core, I find most athiests are people who are tired of bullshit, and are rebelling against it. That takes character, most of the time. The athiests I listen to are mostly truth seekers, brave, and sweet underneath all the noise they sometimes project. Don't others see this?
I wish most people saw it as you do. Though I will say that atheism is not so much a rebellion against religious authority, more that it's a position on a single idea, or rather question. We've rejected the god hypothesis. That's all. We often share beliefs, but that is due to a common set of criteria for belief in something.
Okay, I have to step in right here. I "do" see athiests rebelling against religion big-time. They don't seem to be content to sit quietly at all. What I hear them saying is "religion is so hainous, that it has literally destroyed belief in God for them," and they want to destroy religion. I'm sure there are many quiet athiests also. That's only logical.
"Okay, I have to step in right here. I "do" see athiests rebelling against religion big-time."
It's not rebellion if the group you're talking about never had any authority over you. Think of Scientology. Do you rebel against them if you think they are a dangerous cult and should be stopped? Perhaps what we need is to define rebellion better. Rebellion to me is something you do against people in authority over you. Your parents, your boss, your government.
If you're not rebelling against religion, and a belief in God, then what are you doing right now? What do you call it? I call it fighting against religion and a belief in God. If it isn't, and I am wrong, just say so again, and I'll shut up. But I have to call it as I see it. I don't see a quiet athiest here. I see someone bucking the system, and rightfully so. Why pretend it is anything else?
It's the word rebellion that I don't agree on the use of. Fighting, yes. Arguing, yes. Defending against, yes. But not rebelling. The word rebelling suggests that I was once with them, but now have turned against them.
If I disagree with a certain groups ideology, and reject their thesis, I'm not rebelling against them, I'm just not agreeing with them. If I fight to stop their tenants from ruling law, I'm fighting them but not rebelling against them.
No. I'm fighting a rival ideology. That's not the same as rebellion. As I said before. It's only rebellion if I was once part of it and broke away. At least that is how I define rebellion in this context.
The definition could certainly be stretched to call atheists rebels, but that would be like calling non-astrologers rebels against astrology. We don't think of people who don't accept the stork-baby 'theory' as rebels, do we? ^^
It's just semantics I suppose. If you want to use the word rebel, you of course can. It's just not the word I would choose. One can't rebel against a god one does not believe in.
I don't see you rebelling against God. I see you rebelling against a "belief" in God.
Okay, I'll come clean. I am a person who has experienced miraculous events in a spiritual form. I'm about the most down-to-earth, literal, logical person around. I'm almost totally left-brained. But, I cannot deny what has happened to me. There is a spiritual world, and someone who answers to the Name of Jesus. Forgive me, but it's so hard to shut up when I've seen the next world. There is another world.
Okay cool, here's the disconnect in a nut shell then. I'm not rebelling against a belief in god, I just don't have a belief in god.
The reason atheist are very vocal at the moment is because of the pressure in politics to give religion special concessions and legislation. It's fair to say we are, at times, angry. Angry that absurd laws are passed based on myths and that people are trying their best to bring science into disrepute because they lack a fundamental understanding of it.
"Forgive me, but it's so hard to shut up when I've seen the next world. There is another world."
Well, I hope you're right. I of course do not belief there is another world, but I cannot say one does not exist. Many people misunderstand atheism on that point. It's not about saying, 'There is no such thing', though I'm sure some atheists say this, but it just a rejection of an assertion until there is reasonable evidence to support that assertion.
I want for you to be right. I like the idea of a spiritual world. I just cannot accept it until there is good reason to. I could just have faith and believe. That's what many people do. But I really care about whether my beliefs are correct, so I must be very skeptical of assertions of things for which there is no real evidence. Beyond personal experience.
I believe that you experienced the things you say you did. It's not that I think you're lying. It's just that, as per the purple dragon analogy, those experiences are your and can do me no good if you can't can't produce the 'purple dragon', and every effort on my part to reveal said dragon is thwarted.
P.S
Victimlesscrime, I'm really really really sorry for spamming the crap out of your comments section. *blushes*
You're right. My experiences do you no good at all. But, if there is one chance in hell that I am telling you the truth, why wouldn't you want to know how that happened to me? Are you looking for truth, or are you determined to stamp out any thought of a spiritual world? If I hear anology, theology, one more time, I shall scream. That crap is man-made bullshit. Have your own experiences. You can. It's right under your nose. I don't need faith. I know because I have experienced it. Hello!
You're presuming that I haven't tried. I was very spiritual in my teens and 20s, but I found nothing. Sure, one could say 'just keep on truckin', but one can only entertain such things for so long. I looked, and looked long and hard and found nothing. I will never say there is nothing there, but nothing was revealed to me, or discovered by me. You can tell me the story of your experience if you wish, but it's just an anecdote to me.
Yeh, but what did you do, read some stuff? For some reason, on my spiritual quest, I got tired real quick of reading about other's experiences. I wanted my own. Nobody is a better person than I am, nobody, and if they had experiences, so could I. So I searched how to do that. I searched and I found. I do believe though that things happen when people are ready. I was 40.
I will not lower myself here. What I will do is give you the method. Try it. IT might work, and blow you little world apart.
I actually read very little. I did a lot of meditation. I spoke with a lot of like minded people and we swapped stories of our experiences, as well as different meditation methods.
I never prayed. It was never religious. My Aunt was a large source of information for me. She's a 'psychic' healer. Or at least claims to be. I took a lot of stock in what she told me in those days, but I realised that she's really just very flakey.
1. The Tibetan Five-Google it-or buy the little book. They are the easiest yoga postures around. Chakras are real, and the kundalini is real. Yoga opens something up.
2. Breathing rhythms-Breathe twice, not on the 3rd breath, or 4 times, not on the 5th breath. Whatever. I use this to become stone-like during meditation.
3. Meditation-I hate meditation, but no matter how bad one is at it, it still works.
Thanks, I really appreciate it, but I've been there and done that. I'm not going to waste anymore time chasing dragons. If the dragon catches me, well maybe we'll have something. :)
You haven't been anywhere, and haven't done anything, because if you had, you wouldn't be saying what you're saying. Or, things happen when people are ready for it, and you're not ready. That's perfectly fine. It's too bad that people like you don't listen to people who were ready, and experienced.
Here's an easy exercise: Announce out loud, when alone, "that you never lie." You have attained that particualar virtue. Let me know what happens. ha ha
"You haven't been anywhere, and haven't done anything"
See, here's the problem right here. This is exactly what every religion, faith and spiritual sect says. "Oh, you would know the thruth if you only did what I said you should do. If you did, you'd know. Well I'm sorry but you can't all be right can you.
It seems you can't even accept the fact that you might be wrong. I can. I fully acknowledge that there may indeed be a spirit world. But until such time as there is real, and I mean REAL evidence for it, I cannot accept your hypothesis.
So here's the rub Belle. What makes you any different from any mullah, priest or rabbi in saying these things? I've tried to play nice and not indulge in any atheist stereo-types, but you guys just wont have it will you? 'Believe what I say or you're just wrong' Is that what you're telling me? 'If you did as I do, you'd be enlightened too' Well sorry bud, but you're not particularly enlightened, nor have you demonstrated a single thing that couldn't be uttered by stoner on some bad acid.
As we kind of discussed before, and I did say this. It's in the comments. When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. You're not ready yet, and that's fine. Everyone is on the path, at different places. I'm not preaching a religion here. I'm just telling the truth about what's happened to me. That's all. What's enlightenment to you? How do enlightened people act? You tell us how enlightened people act. I don't think I'm enlightened. I just know what's in the next world for me.
Belle, if Jesus tell you things and he wants another believer ask him what my name is and I will believe , I am not making fun, I just want you to see.
I was raised in the Catholic Church from birth, then ran because of the people.
I am now at 56, an independent Christian because of what I've experienced. Jesus Christ is a real being, so real, that it will blow you away. Has He communicated with me? Yes. In a nutshell, He has healed me of a crushed disk in my back, a peridonatl abscess, and rescued me from a panic attack. He walked in, and I saw his sandals, robe. Then the message, "That's how you felt when you were little." I was fine then.
I can accept that seeing Jesus could be a delusion. But no way, because I am not capable of conjuring up a being that actually touched the top of my head, with physical hands. He touched my head. I felt it physically. The techniques that I do, allow me to have one foot in the physical, and one foot in the spiritual. When you are like this, you see what is going on in the spiritual world. It doesn't just happen, you see it happening. See?
I already explained to you a couple of things that happened to me. If you don't believe me, that's fine, but you asked. Do I sound like a preacher to you? No. I'm not cut out for it. I'm just telling the truth from my experiences. So let's leave it at that.
Also before I leave, there are things in the Bible that are true. I was granted a meditation that allowed me a glimpse behind the veils. I saw. The Kingdom of God "is" within. I'll be darned. Believe not, but never stop searching for truth.
As I already said, I've explained to you what has happened to me. I don't have any kind of direct communication with Jesus Christ as far as what you are asking. You obviously did not read what I wrote. Goodbye
Out of curiosity Belle, these "experiences" that you say you have had, how do you decipher them from merely having a rather active or vivid imagination? By feelings? By discussions / confirmations of those other believers around you? A mixture of all of that or is the something else?
There are no other believers around me. I am totally independent. As far as imagination goes, if that's all it takes to heal you, and rescue you, then imagination is good! But no, I know myself, and when something else is going on. I don't mention things if there wasn't a result, okay.
Belle, as for your healings that u have had, you'd be amazed to know what the body can do to repair itself. Positive thinking goes a long way into aiding this process. As I am sure you know, stress and negative thinking can run u down, weaken your immune system and cause u to get all forms of illnesses, yet the opposite can have the reverse effect.
Might it not be the case that u have merely had and extreme positive effect which has caused your bodies repair system to kick in?
I guess I should remember that people who haven't heard the whole story, wouldn't have a clue as to my age, how much work I did on this, and my critical-thinking-abilities. I've only gone over these things a billion or so times, making sure I haven't missed anything, making sure I've been gut-honest. I'm an adult, and these things happened to me. And by the way, I haven't had a positive in about 30 years, so "no" it didn't happen from positive thinking. Positive thinking cures crushed disks?
Yes, you have to forgive my ignorance in respects to your story. So Belle, "crushed disc" by this do you mean degenerative disc disease, whereby the water in the disc is desiccated/dried out and the disc flattens? Or are you speaking of a herniated disk? Did you have a X-ray, MRI or CT scan of the said damaged area before and/or after this healing experience? I am curious as to your actual medical diagnosis before and after this experience you say you had.
I think using the word "cure" is somewhat misleading here, you may indeed have the disk/s? in a better state now but how are you judging that? By the mere absence of pain ... or a total physical change in the disk/s themselves?
Yes, positive thinking & a good spine stabilization exercise program can help take the load off the disc's and spread it more onto the muscles & ligaments which r essentially immortal.
"Any" form of healing starts with the mind beginning to feel more positive first.
I was accidently watching a TV evangelist program that night. The remote didn't work, and I would have to crawl to change the channel. I ended up praying with some men for healing of my back. The doc was talking surgery because I wasn't getting better. I ask for healing that night, and the next morning, after months of crawling, I felt good. I could sort of hobble around. I got better every day. In 2 weeks, I was normal. I knew when I awoke that something was different. I could feel it.
Dear, there was nothing positive about my attitude, okay. I was pissed big-time. I was crippled. I couldn't sit or walk, only lay and crawl. This went on for months. I did not get better until the morning after I prayed for healing, and that is it in a nutshell. I was under a doctor's care for the entire time. He said surgery. Jesus said, "I don't think so." Never underestimate the power of prayer. It works much of the time.
The "positive thinking" I speak of seems [in your case] to begin with the focusing upon a religious vantage point. So, not quite 30 years hmmm?
Question, you say were healed of a periodontal abscess too? Did you go to the dentist after this, if so what was the diagnosis there? Were you on any anti-biotic treatments at the time of the abscess?
Have you ever had a peridontal abscess? Believe me on this one, there is no mistake. It is the gum, not the tooth, and it fills your body with pain and nausea. The gum is very swollen. I had, had one before. I knew exactly what was happening. It was at least 105 that day. I was just getting over the flu. Then my gum began to swell on top of everything else. I was thumbing through Life magazine, "Who is God." I came to the part about Jesus, and said, "This is too much." "I can't stand it."
Everything blurred, and my gum was the center of the universe. It throbbed exactly 3 times, I saw Jesus on the cross, and boom, all the pain, nausea, flu symptoms, and sickness from the heat vanished instantly. I went from inevitable bursting into tears, throwing up, to wanting to go for a brisk walk in the heat. I was completely better. I felt fantastic, and I wasn't praying. I was complaining. I thought I saw the crusifixion in the magazine, but it's not there. It was a vision.
I still use meditation, but I've since learned what is really going on with it. I've had some very interesting experiences whilst meditating, but nothing my mind could not have produced on it's own. One 'could' interpret such experiences as spiritual, but I really see no evidence that they were not just creations of my mind. Our brains have a wonderful capacity for illusion and hallucination.
I'm sorry if you have little, shall I say, faith in the achievements of humankind, but these words have real meaning, and confer conceptual understanding.
Sorry, just ignore that one. It's based of a misreading of your last post. I re-read it, and it wasn't saying at all what I thought it was. That's a good sign that I'm really tired and should probably get some sleep. If I don't, I really will be seeing god. lol
Text, the reason why I want a marriage is that even with a Will and a power of Atty, it can still all be shot down by a religious relative. Hospitals can still turn one away from vistiation or makiking large medical decissons,,,its sad, but We need that peice of paper.
Indeed. And you have every right to it. Even here in secular Australia, gay and lesbian couples have the same problems. Lack of fair access to adoption, fertility technologies, marriage. Our last Prime Minister made sure of that, and our current Prime Minister is just as conservative. So it doesn't look like it changing anytime soon. For a while there in the late 80s and 90s, I thought the world had moved past all this crap. It's seems I was very much mistaken.
Belle, I was raised by a Scientist in Cocoa Beach Fl who worked for NASA,,I was born in to an atheist family,I feel the same about religion and I am certainily not rebelling.I have never been religious and never believd in a god, so how can I be rebelling?
I think what Belle is referring to is the more vocal atheists that seem to be around at the moment. One could ask, why jump up and down so much for something you don't believe in? It's a fair question, but one just has to see what's been done in the name of religion to understanding the current atheist furor.
I hear you dude. And I agree completely. It would be nice if people kept their religion on a personal level. I don't mind religious debates and argument. It's not like I want to ban religion, I just don't want it corroding and poisoning to well of human progress. When someone says we should ban medical certain research because they insist that blastocysts have souls, and our leaders agree and legislate, it's time to ask what's in that kool-aid.
Text, My sistuation is very widespread. I am a Firefighter, served in the AF and My Partner is a Pilot for Delta and also served , together we have one adopted Daughter and for yrs we could not get married becuase some foolish silly belief system that wants to infringe on my personal life. Kool-aide is over-flowing.
I can't for the life of me understand what politicians are thinking when they legislate in such ways. Who people marry is their own business. Love is love I say.
It's also cherry picking the bible. They love to quote Leviticus 18:22, but forget all about Numbers 15:32-36.
"But I have to call it as I see it. I don't see a quiet athiest here."
Belle, think about what you are saying.
I could state that I am one of those "quiet atheists", but now that I have posted here in opposition to your statement, you could say, "But you're not quiet, you're arguing here."
So, would you EVER see a "quiet atheist"?
How can you possibly count all those "quiet atheists" in order to provide you with a more representative cross-section for your "census" ?
It is Theists that rebelling against there Atheistic/Agnostic nature, if you would like to get technical about it.
I was born an Atheist/Agnostic with a thirst & hunger for knowledge & the to explore the wonders of the universe I was born into. Christians performed a ritual of baptism on me & proclaimed me Christian, without me be informed...in other words forced to sign/agree to a contract without knowing the contents of the contract or knowing how to sign or...
..even having any notion at all of what signing or agreeing is. Because I had an innate trust with my mother from the time I was in her womb and later with my father. I came to accept this rebellious condition on my free will, and eventually through persistent reminding by those preaching about hell fire, guilt, & repentance, then I started calling my self Christian out of fear, but only because if I believe in Jesus he will love me, then spare me.
Belle19700 When I started thinking, I stopped being afraid, then explored again...then I started doubting about religion & theism...and started loving life, loving my existence, loving and respecting the symbiotic relationship with living life, loving the universe for what it is and all it's unanswered mysteries yet...thus became a born again Theist/Agnostic.
Question, do you recommend people to sign blank checks or sign contracts without knowing or reading what they are committing to?
I value honor and virtue, but not in the biblical sense, but in the sense amongst equals in humanity.
You think it's easy to walk away from years of indoctrination, and commitment. It's not so easy. It takes some serious self questioning & discovering.
I do not break contracts that easy. When you sign a will you must be of sound body & mind, & a witness or 2 to be uncontested. Is a baby of sound body and mind? Legally no, so the baptism can be contested then. The logic works.
I totally undersand how much work it took to walk away. That's what I went through on my spiritual quest. I was looking for truth, not anything else, God, or whatever. I am almost totally left-brained. LOGICAL. No scripture, or any of that stuff. All I found was Jesus everytime I got into trouble. Being open-minded, I found is easier said than done. I also was granted a glimpse behind the veils. The kingdom of God "is" within. I saw. Trinity is real.
They baptise to protect your soul from birth. You know that. I know it's something that many of us have no control over, but I throughout my life, and have been kind of glad I was baptised at birth. It doesn't mean you have to stay in a religion though. You just walk away if that's what you want. Find your own way. I totally believe in that.
You know how that sounds to me now...like voodoo magic.
Yes I truly believe in that to, that we all need the space and time to find our own way, besides who in the hell do we think we are to try to impose our views on others, with persistent solicitations and impositions. Try living an Atheistic/Agnostic life in a Theistic world.
I know baptism sounds like vodoo magic. I know. But, there is spirit world, and any protection we can get, should be a good thing? Ever lived with a ghost? I have, and my ex-husband, and girlfriend will attest to that ghost. There "is" a world that we cannot see with our eyes. Everything is conscious, trees, animals, and especially the grasses. I do not like preachers either, that's why I am "independent." in my statements, and beliefs. I only tell what I experience.
so being cleansed in water by clergy is protection from "spirits"? that doesnt sound like protection atall. a man in robes dripping water on your brow and spouting verses?
I don't know what the implications are. I do know that words are important. I do know that water has a different atmosphere around it. Water is supposed to be sacred. I'm not sure, but I can feel that it is different when I get around large bodies of water. I should have stated that before. You know what? What can it hurt? Why not?
Large or smaller bodies of water "do" have a different atmosphere than when you're not around them. I can feel it. Is "no evidence supporting it," the new catch phrase for idiots who have the sensitivity of rocks? I do not belong here, and I'm not replying anymore. I now know the meaning of the phrase, "Do not cast pearls before swine." Thank you for teaching me this lesson.
i believe it's called having a brain and not accepting every piece of subjective nonsence presented by others. but hey, if you want to believe water is more than 2hydrogen atoms bonded to a single oxygen atom, you can. "a body of water" the world is over 70% water, so is your body. Your sensitivity levels must be that of GOD, teach me o' wise one, in the ways of science. feed me data with no evidence and i shall repent!
I can't present any evidence because my evidence is my own personal experience. All I say is never stop seeking truth, never. Do it every day for at least 1/2 hour, be it reading, meditating, yoga, whatever suits "you." And always announce out loud that you are seeking the truth. Is that so terrible? There "is" help out there.
Belle, I know of a former Female and Male monk and one former nun and all of them sought God intensily,,and later realised "nothing, Even Motehr tereses at the end of her life in letters claimed there "was no god"
In the forest 3 years on quest, and seeking always after. Core of "what works" is ""SELF-HONESTY, sincerity, and drive"" I've never met a humble, nun in my life! Nuns and monks will not use the "SCATTERED" knowledge available. I was cautious, but flew with the wind. I was given a meditation that allowed me to see behind the veils. The kingdom of God is within, my sweet. Chop wood, carry water is always there. It's the in-between time, the testing time. Nothing means the time is not yet,thats all
Belle, it seems alot of flowery talk, I am a Firefighter and served inthe AF so I am a direct man,yet my Partner is a Quaker and My Daughter is fully blind and I am a gay man so all together I am not with out sensitivity,,but so far your not presenting any thing.
What is it that you want from me that I am not giving you? The method? See, I very quickly wanted my own experiences. I got tired real quick of reading about other's opinions, and experiences. So I found my own method, and occasionally tell a small smattering of what I have experienced. That's all. Sensitivity if the path to intuition, and intuition is the path to physicism. You're on the path alright. At the core of the atom is vibration. Nothing solid.
Belle, nothing really you have set your self aprt with a wll, of " I dont need to give proof" so I guess thats that,,,I think your delussional,,but hey its just my silly fact checking and science background,,,
Belle, if you scroll back down through my comments, I asked you a few questions in respect to your healing experiences. I'd like us to stay on that topic if it is not too much of a problem. I would like to know what medicines/treatments your physician prescribed/gave you once you had been diagnosed with the said problems?
I would also like to know what was the time frame between stopping any given treatments and these experiences you say you had. [I'm assuming here you saw a physician, yes?]
I don't know about other doctors, but my physician only gave me anti-imflammatories, which I didn't take because they did nothing. He said I had a herniated disk, I think. But what I remember is he said it was a crushed disk. I could only crawl and lay for months, and being as he said I wasn't getting any better after months, he felt surgery was needed. About a week or so later, the beginning of my 2-week healing started, the morning after I prayed to Jesus for healing.
i suppose jesus loves you more than the millions of children he slays with cancer and AIDS, herniated disk? that's not an overly problematic injury. With enough rest it could go away within weeks. evidence evidence evidence! the fools vocabulary.
I've said many times that maybe I am tapping into a power that allows healing. But, again, I am not capable of creating a man who touches my head, and I felt it physically. People come to this earth for a reason. Let them experience their experience. It's really hard to let go, and not try to control the world. We can't anyway. I don't give evidence. I give you the method to find your own evidence, and you laugh. If you don't try, you'll get nothing. If nothing is good, then be happy. Peace.
If healing through God is possible, it won't be happening a lot until people learn how to do it. How can they do it if they don't know how? In past comments, I have given the basics of my methods. The world is full of stories of other's experiences. Have your own experiences instead. I'm not talking bullshit. You're talking bullshit. You refuse to work, earn, seek, search. This isn't about reasoning. It's about "try it," before you say it's bullshit. Goodbye.
"try it" so if we imagine we are getting better we will? everything is about REASON, without reason we are gullible to shit like that. how on earth does praising an imaginery god kill of microscopic bacterium or fix muscles. please, use reason in your life. adults falling victim to this religious nonsence is making me lose my ever decreasing faith in our species future.
Imagine we're getting better? I never said that at all. This has nothing to do with imagination. I am a person who thinks "anything" is possible. Anything. When you or someone else gets sick, scared, ask for help. How much does that cost? You're friends can't hear you. What the hell. Also, in these comments somewhere is my method. Look for it. This isn't shit. My method works for me like crazy. It takes work though. My feeling is you aren't ready, and that's okay. Every person on their own path.
i'm not looking through your comments to find this magic pseudo-logical explainations. when i'm sick i go to the doctors, recieve medicine and i'm cured. To make these claims you need genuine evidence. Not subjective, objective. something others can study and test. god never seems to heal any major disease or ailments.
"My feeling is you aren't ready"
so you're going to evangelise me then?
please, hold your mythic abilities to youself, im open to all ideas, but yours are irrational 'n crazy
When did I say don't go to the doctor? I pray for healing when I can't go to the doctor, or the doctors can't do anything.
Again, you have to find your own evidence, because that is the only evidence you'll accept, and that's good. It's smart. That's what I did! I proved to myself that there is something else happening here, so much more than we see with our 2 eyes. I am not irrational or crazy. Go find your own truth in whatever way you want. That's as it should be. Peace.
Since when is truth rational? Truth is always subjective, always. Everyone has their own idea of the truth, and nowhere on this planet will you find 2 people with exactly the same idea of truth, ever, always a little different.
the truth might not always be rational. but truth itself is not subjective. so if you believe the sky to be silver...therefore it is? no, you are mistaken.
You changed my morality, 9 months ago today. I have never looked back to religion since and i owe you a great debt, more than i can ever hope to repay. Thank you.
VeritasTruthEmet 1 year ago
lizazoon 1 year ago
If there is no god, what would make rape or murder a crime? It would be social darwinism which is evil and wrong.
wowpapa 1 year ago
@wowpapa Laws set by a government elected by the majority of the population make acts criminal and punishable... You know this already, and it ought to be the primary reason why you pay heed to the laws of your country - not that you think there is a divine being watching you who will judge you in an afterlife.
GronTheMighty 1 year ago
@GronTheMighty
It is the primary reason. But just because others think their is no god doesn't change my perspective because just as their is no evidence to say their is a god, there is none to disprove him. Evolution is true, but that doesn't change my perspective.
wowpapa 1 year ago
@wowpapa I have no quarrel with you or anybody else believing in things, i just wanted to point out that laws are contingent on the population as a majority agreeing that they are sound to judge by. And that is regardless of there being a god or not, or several gods for that matter, heck even if there were a pantheon of gods, aliens and mythical creatures the laws of our nations would still be contingent on the wish of the population for regulation and order :)
GronTheMighty 1 year ago
Comment removed
lizazoon 1 year ago
@lizazoon
I have and discovered that religion brings no peace and promotes genocide.
wowpapa 1 year ago
Comment removed
iversonmatthew 2 years ago
I agree with this VID 100%, but I have to ask "With what would us humans replace the sense of community many of these religions promote?" Without religion we would more than likely to fall back on patriotism or racism.
These are still dividing doctrines.
As far as I know humanism has not promoted any sense of community.
What belief system could actually heal the world? That is the question I have been asking myself.
gjsterp 2 years ago
Well if 'community' can be measured by crime rate then go look at Sweden.A largely socialist secular society with low crime rates.There is no belief system to heal the world but getting rid of religion would remove the major source of conflict.
Rockster969 2 years ago 4
the easy way would be to gather 30k+ people that agree with you, then kill off the rest and repopulate the world with people who generally agree on everything, that'd be the nice and lazy way though.
religion is already used to endorse patriotism and racism, so it can't get worse without it.
I'm not sure how critical you are of the usage of humanism, if lenient, I know several communities based on it (though they still pay taxes to the larger community)
Sutskoen 2 years ago
gjsterp
Direct Democracy on a community level!
We are all divided by separate communities regardless of religion or nationality, race, etc.. But with the Internet or Youtube platform we seem to be closer together with no barriers.
Humanism promotes one planet, one home, but you must bury your mental baggage to be composted.
Belief system? How about a verifying system instead? So we can get on with it, and spend more time on exploring for the little time that we have here.
Aegialeus 2 years ago 2
It is what is meant by "Let's get real."
Too many people have either their heads in the clouds or up their asses.
People In the clouds thinking they can make a utopia for everyone or that God will do it for them, or those who just don't give a lick.
We all need to have reasonable expectations.
I just hope my grandchildren get to enjoy one half of the good times that I did, and if they have more, so much the better. PEACE
gjsterp 2 years ago
The answer is sports.
MagicofAramis 2 years ago
I love the idea that if you follow a false god it's better than following no god. It's so revealing.
AbbeyNormal 2 years ago
I like the excuse some people use that is is better to worship a God, and find that there is none, then to NOT worship and find out there is one.
So, while you are alive waste your time in worship and you play the fool for a nonexistent being.
I am still trying to figure out why I am wasting my time trying to convince these people of their error.
Maybe I should find something more useful to do.
gjsterp 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
i dont know if i a gree with this video i can see were you are coming from. but if you observe the soshal structure of the religious and the non religious threw out history and in present day or Evin political structure the religious mane tan society with hire growth as for the non religious thay do not which is seen in history and present day....the word escaped me but right wing / left wing
saxonhaste 3 years ago
abolish racism
cpk9999 3 years ago
Another great video full of clear minded thinking.
kaduisaui 3 years ago 14
interesting stuff.
theselfishshellfish 3 years ago
Fantastic argument, incredibly well put. Keep up the god (oops I mean good!) work.
God bless atheism!!
Bantu1875 3 years ago
The Bible was written exclusively by men, and when the female perspective is left out, you can bet the message will be one-sided, and screwed up. You always need the male AND the female perspective to get a good sense of the message. I tired to read the Bible on my spiritual quest, and it just didn't work out. It made me really angry. Chauvinism incarnate. God is smarter than people give credit for. Intention is very important.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, so, just to clarify... you don't believe the Bible is "the Word of God"?
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago
I know, from personal experience, that some things in the Bible are true. But I don't think all of it is true. Everytime I read it, I become enraged about something. I have no specifics for you. I've tried to read the Book, but it doesn't work out for me. I follow just what Jesus said, and consider the rest. It's the best I can do.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Ok, not criticizing, just clarifying. So you are not a fundamentalist, but you hold your beliefs to be true as you understand them. Your reason for your beliefs are your life experiences. It would be very wrong of anyone to tell you they are not true. That said, it is equally wrong to dismiss another's beliefs based on that person's life experiences. The belief in God, or a god, or several gods, or none at all is a personal conclusion. tbc...
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago
I cannot speak for all athiests, but for myself I'm tired of others trying to convert or "save" me. I'm not trying to discount your beliefs Belle. I do have one more question, why do most (not all) Christians feel such a compelling desire to force their beliefs onto others?
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago 2
I am an independent Christian, bound by no laws of any church or dogma. I hold my beliefs to be true because of my experiences, nothing else. On my spiritual quest, I was looking for truth, not God, not Jesus. All I found was Jesus. The Man is real. I'm not capable of creating a man who walks into my room, and touches me physically on my head. I'm not. I've also glimpsed behind the veils. The kingdom of God is within, so are the veils. I can't shut up about what I experienced, because it's true.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I think I've given offense when it was not intended. I'm not saying you should "shut up", I respect your beliefs and your right to have and express them. I'm asking why do you, as a Christian, think that some Christians (though not necessarily you) feel the need to convert others? I really am trying to gain an understanding of that.
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago
I'm not offended at all. Talking to you is a breeze. You should see what I go through. Most Christians try to convert people because they are supposed to. It's probably in the Bible somewhere. I'm not trying to convert anyone to anything. I swear I'm not. I've experienced things so out-of-the-ordinary. I've been healed of pain, rescued, and when told by my doctor, I needed surgery for a crushed disk, healed of it after months when I prayed to Him. I'm 58 years old, no liar, and perfectly lucid.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Peace to you Belle. Either way, believer or non-believer, in the end we all find out the truth. I'm actually ok with the idea of ceasing to exist when I die, but the idea of a heaven is quite tempting too. I can't say that I believe because I won't lie, not even to a god that I don't believe exists. My lack of belief does not invalidate your belief in any way. I'm very glad you have found what you were looking for, I've stopped looking, but I'm not sad either. Peace. :)
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago
and thanks for the reply.
XCarnwennanX 3 years ago
I know your lack of belief does not invalidate my experiences. I think you're wondering what I'm doing on this channel talking about my stuff. I'm subscribed to many athiest channels, because athiests are very intelligent, and I like to hear what they say, and watch their videos. I understand why people are becoming athiests. I do! If I hadn't had my experiences, I would be right there with you. But, I know there is something else going on here. None of this is real. An experience for growth.
Belle19700 3 years ago 3
lsd or a dream is what happend to you lol...jesus it was not,dont be silly..you know that deep down your telling lies or you really wanted somthing like that to happen to you and you have convinced yourself that it really happend,i think that deep down everyone really knows that religion and praying is bull shit,but not every body wants to stand up and say.."this is crap i dont believe in any of this"..because they will be disowned by family and friends,in a lot of cases anyway.
theselfishshellfish 3 years ago 2
Accusing ME of LIEING? Are you out-of-your-mind? You wait, until someone you love is suffering, or dieing. You'll be on your bony knees asking for a miracle, intervention. Convinced myself? How droll. How short-sighted you are. I'm old enough to know what's happened to me. You obviously are not old enough, nor have you done any work, to realize that there is much more going on here than you could ever dream. You just a child, with no experience. Evolve please.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Though I don't doubt your sincerity belle, I have to say if you were living in iran or saudi arabia or another none christian country and you had the same physical experiences with your body (having whatever illness you had and getting better) you would NOT of been thinking it was jesus. Also I really can't tell the different between your case and a mental patient. I mean whats the differents between your believe and with someone thats got paranoia
ezjisalive 3 years ago
Why do you insist that there is only one reality, this one? Your scientists have found "vibration," at the core of the atom, nothing solid. There is great strength in a Name. There was no paranoia involved at all. I don't drink, smke dope, and have delusions. Never. There "is" someone out there. I worked my ass off, searching for truth. What have you done? Probably nothing, and you have nothing but this crumby reality. I pity you, because you're wrong. Be happy, fool.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I wasn't talking about different realities...but I guess I am now. Why do YOU think there is more than one reality. To think there is more than one you'd have evidence for it. E.g saying "there is another room", you can prove it by showing pictures of the other room or even take the person there. But how can you say somethi like more than one reality without prove. Just because this reality might be "crumbly" at least I KNOW it's here. btw the vibrations you talked about are just how atoms work
ezjisalive 3 years ago
At the core of the atom is vibration, meaning the core of everything "is not solid." Hello!Spiritual things have to be proven to the self. Every individual has to do this themselves. I can't show you what I saw, found. I can only tell you about it. What I can do, is tell you how I got to the point, where I could see, feel, know. I worked so hard seeking truth.
1. The Tibetan Five.
2. Breathing rhythms.
3. Meditation.
Now go work. Your breathing rhythms are directly related to your reality
Belle19700 3 years ago
For an outsider there is not one difference between what you said you saw (jesus), compared to someone who thought they were abducted by aliens..both claim something happened and both have no way for an outside to confirm what actually happened. So even if you tell someone this story they have NO reason to believe it. Anyway, so your saying if you do the work you'll see something...if you look long enough, and ook hard enough, at the sky you'll eventally see 'something'
ezjisalive 3 years ago 5
No. What I'm saying is if you do the techniques, they will change you, or put into action, something you could do all along. Knowing ourselves is required. Our sense of reality is directly connected to our breathing rhythms. True. We do have chakras in our spirit bodies, and the kundalini is real. I raised mine to my heart chakra. The Tibetan Five simple yoga postures help in bringing the power of the kundalini up the spine. Opens you up to the spirit world. Don't believe? Good. Bye.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Hahaha I'm not sure if that last comment was suppost to be a joke or what, but whatever..bye bye now.
ezjisalive 3 years ago
Belle19700: Your physical postures affect what exactly? It lifts your physical well being, which your have translated as being tied to the spirit world.
How does that argument follow logically?
You feel better exercising? It has been proven that exercise causes one to feel better, but these exercises effect your physical world and has nothing to do with a spiritual world.
gjsterp 2 years ago
There is no immediate logic in this. When you do yoga, it enhances your sensitivity. If you don't believe this, I suggest you call 1-800-India. When I do the Tibetan Five, meditate, and do breathing rhythms, stuff happens much more quickly. There is a spirit world, and the portal is in your own third eye, which can see both in and out. I don't ask anyone to believe me. Just try it, when you get sick of this world, and try to find truth.
Belle19700 2 years ago
You made me laugh so hard with that pathetic line about "when you get sick of this world" lmao!! You`re basically telling people to be pessimistic and to go looking for an escape they don`t need, and that`s retarded. Truth can`t be found by trying to escape reality.
If you want to understand what the "third eye" actually means, you should read Joseph Campbell`s Transformations of Myth Through Time, he knew all about it, and it`s not a portal to cop-out land.
shrikechan 2 years ago
Belle19700: I do Tai Chi and experience the same thing, but I realize the good feelings are caused by physical movements, and not some hockus pockus belief in a spiritual plain.
Third Eye my ASS!
gjsterp 2 years ago
No. Will you please understand, that I would not lie, or try to mislead anyone. Do the Tibetan Five, some breathing rhythms, and meditation, and see what happens. These things open you up, and, I think, bring you closer to the spirit world.
When I meditate, and do my techniques, I see inside my head. There is a third eye. There is something that maybe you should face. Maybe you're not as mature spiritually, and some of us, because what I'm telling you is true.
Belle19700 2 years ago
Belle19700: I do not doubt that you believe what you say. I do not doubt that this experience for you seems very real. It is after all a mental experience, which is what all our real experiences are.
It is easy for me to see how some people could get the two confused.
That after all is what a psychosis is:
The inability to differentiate reality from the purely mental experiences.
Real is real to you, even if it is only in your mind.
If it works, and helps you stay off of meds, good.
gjsterp 2 years ago
You are the confused, uninformed one.
Real is being healed of a crushed disk in my back, right after the doctor told me I needed back surgery. I prayed for healing, and I was healed. That's psychosis? I don't think so.
You're just not spiritually mature enough to grasp the concept, that this reality, is not the only reality. Ask a scientist if there is only one dimension. They'll tell you, there are many dimensions.
Grow up.
Belle19700 2 years ago
The mind and body working together can cause some amazing results, at times. And at others nothing. Many times prayer is added to the equation, which only confuses matters. If one believes ones body can heal itself, from a cut or broken bone without the help of some spiritual being, then back pain should not be any different.
Healing does at times seem to be miraculous, but I believe it is the natural process of the body. Sometimes it works better than at other times.
Prayer can add hope. +++
gjsterp 2 years ago
Belle19700: I am not confused. I admit to being ignorant of many things, but my grasp of reality and to assess fact from fantasy is pretty good.
Hopefully it will get better.
Scientists claim other dimensions?
You dare to suggest that scientists are "right" when you obviously must deny so much of what they say?
Agree with them when it suits your fancy?
That's confusion.
I don't agree with scientists belief there are other dimensions.
It is a moot point if these can not be observed.
A unicorn!
gjsterp 2 years ago
What "do" you believe in? Love? Honesty? Giving? Anything?
Go do the Tibetan Five, meditation, and breathing. Then come back and talk to me. Until then, you don't know what you're talking about.
Belle19700 2 years ago
Dear Belle,
Because your antagonist doesn't believe your line of bullshit you imply that he may not believe in 'honesty,' 'love,' or 'anything at all?' Wow, what a terrible thing to do to a fellow human being. A spiritually mature person, such as yourself, would admit to this right? Use your third eye and see why you responded in this manner. Then cut away that thing that made you this way. When you're done: I welcome to the realm of ambiguity, fellow atheist.
Peace,
Biter.
elbowbiter1 2 years ago
@elbowbiter1 Line of bullshit? Listen to me, you stupid, little punk: Anyone who rejects something, for absolutely no reason, other than they are in their 20's, and think they know it all, is as much of an ass, as you are.
I am more spirtually mature than you are, and I know this is true.
Come back and talk to me, when you grow up.
U wanna fight? Get ready, because my fights last about 3 months, on the average. How much hate, and disdain R U capable of? Tons, I fugure.Let's go!
Belle19700 2 years ago
Dear Belle, Forgive my insensitive diction. Allow me to better explain. You don't believe in Thor, if people would preach Thor to you, you'd think they were full of it, and vice versa; hense, your brand of bullshit (and it's all bullshit, I am full of it too so it isn't being used as a pejorative, please understand). I didn't mean to get you so defensive and I apologise. Please re read my last post and pretend that I am a good ol' casual friend from back in the day. ;)
Peace,
Biter.
elbowbiter1 2 years ago
Logic doesn`t enter into it, I think she may even be deliberatly trying to abandon it.
shrikechan 2 years ago
Its an interesting thing, reality/truth (practical) and Reality/Truth (the absolute version). In short, scientists define/clarify reality through hypothesis, experimentation, prediction, and finally theory. Ex: the atom, then particles, then quarks, and now strings. For you point on vibrations, on a practical scale, i.e. larger than a particle, everything acts as a solid. Your idea is the perversion of science with some philosophical idea that lets you keep your reality or one alive.
exodortch 3 years ago 2
To continue:
Science can not define Reality. Philosophers basically say humans can never actually know Reality because everything is based on human experience. However, religious people claim that they know Reality/Truth with now background or basis, no way to support it, and now way for it to be Truly communicated to others because every religious person like you has their own version. Does a Reality of 1 count for anything? Its seems arrogant to me.
exodortch 3 years ago 2
"You wait, until someone you love is suffering, or dieing."
That's happened to me. Continue...
"You'll be on your bony knees asking for a miracle, intervention. "
I didn't. I don't have a belief in a God or Gods, and so I saw the fruitless endeavour for what it was. Projection is NOT evidence.
"I'm old enough to know what's happened to me."
As am I.
"You just a child, with no experience."
Stop insulting people who disagree with you.
FSAthe1st 3 years ago 15
@FSAthe1st
There are those who would deny a child medical treatment in favor of prayer.. and I
I'm sorry, that's not acceptable to me.
Yes, prayer makes you feel better, but ultimately it doesn't alter the outcome in any way. That doesn't mean that prayer is wrong or even useless.. unless.. it's wrong or useless.
Praying for someone you don't like to get cancer, or prayer that replaces an operation to remove a burst appendix.
Prayer is not an indication of morality.
PaleHearse 1 year ago
One of the most "moral" people I know is an atheist, while some of the most immoral and hypocritical people I have known have been religious.
mzjazz37 3 years ago
I have said, that through my techniques, I may have tapped into a way, some power that the mind has, to heal the body. But what I tell here is just a little bit of what has happened to me. I am not capable of creating a person who touched me physically. No.
People want proof. The only proof anyone will believe is their own proof. This is why I say, do the techniques, and find your own proof. Nobody wants to work. There IS someone out there. I've experienced Him. I saw His sandals and robe.
Belle19700 3 years ago
There is hidden knowledge in this world. I've experienced and experimented with some of it. Extraordinary things have happened to me, actually some before my spiritual quest. I can feel the difference in the atmosphere when I get near water. Very dramatic change. We are a part of this world, not separate. We have feelings, emotions, and they "do" matter, and are powerful. Gateways actually. Some are sensitive, some are not, some refuse to seek. Good book: The Magic of Believing. Peace.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Simply beautiful!!!
Aegialeus 3 years ago
BRILLIANT!
freedom0f5peech 3 years ago
I'm going to do you all a big favor, and get lost. I'm not going to comment on vistimlesscriminal's relgious videos anymore. I just don't belong here, and I know this now. I think it's for the best.
Belle19700 3 years ago
No need for that Belle, Why are you taking it as a personal affront, it is just discourse is it not? We may not agree on things granted, but there is no need to get upset and walk away from the conversation. Like you striving to get us [atheists] to see things from your vantage point, we are also striving likewise to do the same for you. If you find offence in a open space like this, merely shrug it off and ignore the comment.
PacalB 3 years ago
Islam would have to be the warped sandshoe of human morality. The anointed treasurers of God's latest thoughts calmly (or violently) tell us all how we must behave. Murder apostates, murder jews, murder non-believers, murder adulterers... then get rewarded.
mjdoyza 3 years ago
Sense and sensibility. Great stuff!
IceneBoudicca 3 years ago
It is true you can't see GOD.
Just imagine if you can ???
without seeing we destroyed half of our commonsense,
Just imagine what will be left, if we see one.
RGpbuh 3 years ago
It is true that you cannot see the flying spaghetti monster.
Just imagine if you can???
Without seeing, you just destroyed half of your common sense.
Imagine what will be left if you see one.
RoadRunnerLaser 3 years ago
If you are concerned with Islam and the Islamization of your country this video has a message for YOU.
watch?v=8789NMWZ9EI
It is a step by step outline on Europe's Islamization.
cafeafuh 3 years ago
Since cognitive biologist have pretty much proven that our morality comes from our instinctive empathy and to a large dregree also from the envoirment, I have never thought if the "morality argument" as being very valid.
But good job at making some enviorment related arguments.
qanazir 3 years ago
5 stars.........again!
stuffisgd 3 years ago
Superb. Not suprisingly, victimlesscriminal is succeeding in the set task in these videos.
slipcurve 3 years ago
Are you sure that Christians believe that athiests are immoral? I don't. I have found the athiests I listen to are usually pretty smart. They think. I don't agree with everything they believe, because I can't. But at the core, I find most athiests are people who are tired of bullshit, and are rebelling against it. That takes character, most of the time. The athiests I listen to are mostly truth seekers, brave, and sweet underneath all the noise they sometimes project. Don't others see this?
Belle19700 3 years ago
I wish most people saw it as you do. Though I will say that atheism is not so much a rebellion against religious authority, more that it's a position on a single idea, or rather question. We've rejected the god hypothesis. That's all. We often share beliefs, but that is due to a common set of criteria for belief in something.
Textra1 3 years ago
Okay, I have to step in right here. I "do" see athiests rebelling against religion big-time. They don't seem to be content to sit quietly at all. What I hear them saying is "religion is so hainous, that it has literally destroyed belief in God for them," and they want to destroy religion. I'm sure there are many quiet athiests also. That's only logical.
Belle19700 3 years ago
"Okay, I have to step in right here. I "do" see athiests rebelling against religion big-time."
It's not rebellion if the group you're talking about never had any authority over you. Think of Scientology. Do you rebel against them if you think they are a dangerous cult and should be stopped? Perhaps what we need is to define rebellion better. Rebellion to me is something you do against people in authority over you. Your parents, your boss, your government.
Textra1 3 years ago
If you're not rebelling against religion, and a belief in God, then what are you doing right now? What do you call it? I call it fighting against religion and a belief in God. If it isn't, and I am wrong, just say so again, and I'll shut up. But I have to call it as I see it. I don't see a quiet athiest here. I see someone bucking the system, and rightfully so. Why pretend it is anything else?
Belle19700 3 years ago
It's the word rebellion that I don't agree on the use of. Fighting, yes. Arguing, yes. Defending against, yes. But not rebelling. The word rebelling suggests that I was once with them, but now have turned against them.
If I disagree with a certain groups ideology, and reject their thesis, I'm not rebelling against them, I'm just not agreeing with them. If I fight to stop their tenants from ruling law, I'm fighting them but not rebelling against them.
Textra1 3 years ago
"I see someone bucking the system"
No. I'm fighting a rival ideology. That's not the same as rebellion. As I said before. It's only rebellion if I was once part of it and broke away. At least that is how I define rebellion in this context.
The definition could certainly be stretched to call atheists rebels, but that would be like calling non-astrologers rebels against astrology. We don't think of people who don't accept the stork-baby 'theory' as rebels, do we? ^^
Textra1 3 years ago
It's just semantics I suppose. If you want to use the word rebel, you of course can. It's just not the word I would choose. One can't rebel against a god one does not believe in.
:)
Textra1 3 years ago
I don't see you rebelling against God. I see you rebelling against a "belief" in God.
Okay, I'll come clean. I am a person who has experienced miraculous events in a spiritual form. I'm about the most down-to-earth, literal, logical person around. I'm almost totally left-brained. But, I cannot deny what has happened to me. There is a spiritual world, and someone who answers to the Name of Jesus. Forgive me, but it's so hard to shut up when I've seen the next world. There is another world.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Okay cool, here's the disconnect in a nut shell then. I'm not rebelling against a belief in god, I just don't have a belief in god.
The reason atheist are very vocal at the moment is because of the pressure in politics to give religion special concessions and legislation. It's fair to say we are, at times, angry. Angry that absurd laws are passed based on myths and that people are trying their best to bring science into disrepute because they lack a fundamental understanding of it.
Textra1 3 years ago
"Forgive me, but it's so hard to shut up when I've seen the next world. There is another world."
Well, I hope you're right. I of course do not belief there is another world, but I cannot say one does not exist. Many people misunderstand atheism on that point. It's not about saying, 'There is no such thing', though I'm sure some atheists say this, but it just a rejection of an assertion until there is reasonable evidence to support that assertion.
Textra1 3 years ago
I want for you to be right. I like the idea of a spiritual world. I just cannot accept it until there is good reason to. I could just have faith and believe. That's what many people do. But I really care about whether my beliefs are correct, so I must be very skeptical of assertions of things for which there is no real evidence. Beyond personal experience.
Textra1 3 years ago
I believe that you experienced the things you say you did. It's not that I think you're lying. It's just that, as per the purple dragon analogy, those experiences are your and can do me no good if you can't can't produce the 'purple dragon', and every effort on my part to reveal said dragon is thwarted.
P.S
Victimlesscrime, I'm really really really sorry for spamming the crap out of your comments section. *blushes*
Brevity and I aren't on the best of terms. :D
Textra1 3 years ago
You're right. My experiences do you no good at all. But, if there is one chance in hell that I am telling you the truth, why wouldn't you want to know how that happened to me? Are you looking for truth, or are you determined to stamp out any thought of a spiritual world? If I hear anology, theology, one more time, I shall scream. That crap is man-made bullshit. Have your own experiences. You can. It's right under your nose. I don't need faith. I know because I have experienced it. Hello!
Belle19700 3 years ago
You're presuming that I haven't tried. I was very spiritual in my teens and 20s, but I found nothing. Sure, one could say 'just keep on truckin', but one can only entertain such things for so long. I looked, and looked long and hard and found nothing. I will never say there is nothing there, but nothing was revealed to me, or discovered by me. You can tell me the story of your experience if you wish, but it's just an anecdote to me.
Textra1 3 years ago
Yeh, but what did you do, read some stuff? For some reason, on my spiritual quest, I got tired real quick of reading about other's experiences. I wanted my own. Nobody is a better person than I am, nobody, and if they had experiences, so could I. So I searched how to do that. I searched and I found. I do believe though that things happen when people are ready. I was 40.
I will not lower myself here. What I will do is give you the method. Try it. IT might work, and blow you little world apart.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I actually read very little. I did a lot of meditation. I spoke with a lot of like minded people and we swapped stories of our experiences, as well as different meditation methods.
I never prayed. It was never religious. My Aunt was a large source of information for me. She's a 'psychic' healer. Or at least claims to be. I took a lot of stock in what she told me in those days, but I realised that she's really just very flakey.
Textra1 3 years ago
1. The Tibetan Five-Google it-or buy the little book. They are the easiest yoga postures around. Chakras are real, and the kundalini is real. Yoga opens something up.
2. Breathing rhythms-Breathe twice, not on the 3rd breath, or 4 times, not on the 5th breath. Whatever. I use this to become stone-like during meditation.
3. Meditation-I hate meditation, but no matter how bad one is at it, it still works.
Sensitivity, path to intuition.
Intuition, path to psychicism.
Do some work!
Belle19700 3 years ago
Thanks, I really appreciate it, but I've been there and done that. I'm not going to waste anymore time chasing dragons. If the dragon catches me, well maybe we'll have something. :)
Textra1 3 years ago
You haven't been anywhere, and haven't done anything, because if you had, you wouldn't be saying what you're saying. Or, things happen when people are ready for it, and you're not ready. That's perfectly fine. It's too bad that people like you don't listen to people who were ready, and experienced.
Here's an easy exercise: Announce out loud, when alone, "that you never lie." You have attained that particualar virtue. Let me know what happens. ha ha
Belle19700 3 years ago
"You haven't been anywhere, and haven't done anything"
See, here's the problem right here. This is exactly what every religion, faith and spiritual sect says. "Oh, you would know the thruth if you only did what I said you should do. If you did, you'd know. Well I'm sorry but you can't all be right can you.
Textra1 3 years ago
It seems you can't even accept the fact that you might be wrong. I can. I fully acknowledge that there may indeed be a spirit world. But until such time as there is real, and I mean REAL evidence for it, I cannot accept your hypothesis.
Textra1 3 years ago
So here's the rub Belle. What makes you any different from any mullah, priest or rabbi in saying these things? I've tried to play nice and not indulge in any atheist stereo-types, but you guys just wont have it will you? 'Believe what I say or you're just wrong' Is that what you're telling me? 'If you did as I do, you'd be enlightened too' Well sorry bud, but you're not particularly enlightened, nor have you demonstrated a single thing that couldn't be uttered by stoner on some bad acid.
Textra1 3 years ago
As we kind of discussed before, and I did say this. It's in the comments. When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. You're not ready yet, and that's fine. Everyone is on the path, at different places. I'm not preaching a religion here. I'm just telling the truth about what's happened to me. That's all. What's enlightenment to you? How do enlightened people act? You tell us how enlightened people act. I don't think I'm enlightened. I just know what's in the next world for me.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, if Jesus tell you things and he wants another believer ask him what my name is and I will believe , I am not making fun, I just want you to see.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
If you want to start lecturing about how many fairies will fit on the head of a pin, you're welcome to, but do so on your own.
Textra1 3 years ago
Belle are you a believer and what faith are you if any religion and id so do you communicate with your god?
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I was raised in the Catholic Church from birth, then ran because of the people.
I am now at 56, an independent Christian because of what I've experienced. Jesus Christ is a real being, so real, that it will blow you away. Has He communicated with me? Yes. In a nutshell, He has healed me of a crushed disk in my back, a peridonatl abscess, and rescued me from a panic attack. He walked in, and I saw his sandals, robe. Then the message, "That's how you felt when you were little." I was fine then.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I can accept that seeing Jesus could be a delusion. But no way, because I am not capable of conjuring up a being that actually touched the top of my head, with physical hands. He touched my head. I felt it physically. The techniques that I do, allow me to have one foot in the physical, and one foot in the spiritual. When you are like this, you see what is going on in the spiritual world. It doesn't just happen, you see it happening. See?
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, so jesus would tell you things?
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I already explained to you a couple of things that happened to me. If you don't believe me, that's fine, but you asked. Do I sound like a preacher to you? No. I'm not cut out for it. I'm just telling the truth from my experiences. So let's leave it at that.
Also before I leave, there are things in the Bible that are true. I was granted a meditation that allowed me a glimpse behind the veils. I saw. The Kingdom of God "is" within. I'll be darned. Believe not, but never stop searching for truth.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle is all I am asking is for you to ask Jesus what is my name,,its really simple.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
As I already said, I've explained to you what has happened to me. I don't have any kind of direct communication with Jesus Christ as far as what you are asking. You obviously did not read what I wrote. Goodbye
Belle19700 3 years ago
Out of curiosity Belle, these "experiences" that you say you have had, how do you decipher them from merely having a rather active or vivid imagination? By feelings? By discussions / confirmations of those other believers around you? A mixture of all of that or is the something else?
PacalB 3 years ago
A wild imagination does not:
Heal you of a crushed disk in your back.
Heal you instantly of a peridontal abscess.
Completely stop a panic attack on a dime.
Create someone who touches you physically.
There are no other believers around me. I am totally independent. As far as imagination goes, if that's all it takes to heal you, and rescue you, then imagination is good! But no, I know myself, and when something else is going on. I don't mention things if there wasn't a result, okay.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, as for your healings that u have had, you'd be amazed to know what the body can do to repair itself. Positive thinking goes a long way into aiding this process. As I am sure you know, stress and negative thinking can run u down, weaken your immune system and cause u to get all forms of illnesses, yet the opposite can have the reverse effect.
Might it not be the case that u have merely had and extreme positive effect which has caused your bodies repair system to kick in?
PacalB 3 years ago
I guess I should remember that people who haven't heard the whole story, wouldn't have a clue as to my age, how much work I did on this, and my critical-thinking-abilities. I've only gone over these things a billion or so times, making sure I haven't missed anything, making sure I've been gut-honest. I'm an adult, and these things happened to me. And by the way, I haven't had a positive in about 30 years, so "no" it didn't happen from positive thinking. Positive thinking cures crushed disks?
Belle19700 3 years ago
Yes, you have to forgive my ignorance in respects to your story. So Belle, "crushed disc" by this do you mean degenerative disc disease, whereby the water in the disc is desiccated/dried out and the disc flattens? Or are you speaking of a herniated disk? Did you have a X-ray, MRI or CT scan of the said damaged area before and/or after this healing experience? I am curious as to your actual medical diagnosis before and after this experience you say you had.
PacalB 3 years ago
I think using the word "cure" is somewhat misleading here, you may indeed have the disk/s? in a better state now but how are you judging that? By the mere absence of pain ... or a total physical change in the disk/s themselves?
Yes, positive thinking & a good spine stabilization exercise program can help take the load off the disc's and spread it more onto the muscles & ligaments which r essentially immortal.
"Any" form of healing starts with the mind beginning to feel more positive first.
PacalB 3 years ago
I was accidently watching a TV evangelist program that night. The remote didn't work, and I would have to crawl to change the channel. I ended up praying with some men for healing of my back. The doc was talking surgery because I wasn't getting better. I ask for healing that night, and the next morning, after months of crawling, I felt good. I could sort of hobble around. I got better every day. In 2 weeks, I was normal. I knew when I awoke that something was different. I could feel it.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Dear, there was nothing positive about my attitude, okay. I was pissed big-time. I was crippled. I couldn't sit or walk, only lay and crawl. This went on for months. I did not get better until the morning after I prayed for healing, and that is it in a nutshell. I was under a doctor's care for the entire time. He said surgery. Jesus said, "I don't think so." Never underestimate the power of prayer. It works much of the time.
Belle19700 3 years ago
The "positive thinking" I speak of seems [in your case] to begin with the focusing upon a religious vantage point. So, not quite 30 years hmmm?
Question, you say were healed of a periodontal abscess too? Did you go to the dentist after this, if so what was the diagnosis there? Were you on any anti-biotic treatments at the time of the abscess?
PacalB 3 years ago
Have you ever had a peridontal abscess? Believe me on this one, there is no mistake. It is the gum, not the tooth, and it fills your body with pain and nausea. The gum is very swollen. I had, had one before. I knew exactly what was happening. It was at least 105 that day. I was just getting over the flu. Then my gum began to swell on top of everything else. I was thumbing through Life magazine, "Who is God." I came to the part about Jesus, and said, "This is too much." "I can't stand it."
Belle19700 3 years ago
Everything blurred, and my gum was the center of the universe. It throbbed exactly 3 times, I saw Jesus on the cross, and boom, all the pain, nausea, flu symptoms, and sickness from the heat vanished instantly. I went from inevitable bursting into tears, throwing up, to wanting to go for a brisk walk in the heat. I was completely better. I felt fantastic, and I wasn't praying. I was complaining. I thought I saw the crusifixion in the magazine, but it's not there. It was a vision.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I still use meditation, but I've since learned what is really going on with it. I've had some very interesting experiences whilst meditating, but nothing my mind could not have produced on it's own. One 'could' interpret such experiences as spiritual, but I really see no evidence that they were not just creations of my mind. Our brains have a wonderful capacity for illusion and hallucination.
Textra1 3 years ago
I'm sorry if you have little, shall I say, faith in the achievements of humankind, but these words have real meaning, and confer conceptual understanding.
Textra1 3 years ago
I don't know what you're talking about.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Sorry, just ignore that one. It's based of a misreading of your last post. I re-read it, and it wasn't saying at all what I thought it was. That's a good sign that I'm really tired and should probably get some sleep. If I don't, I really will be seeing god. lol
Textra1 3 years ago
Text, the reason why I want a marriage is that even with a Will and a power of Atty, it can still all be shot down by a religious relative. Hospitals can still turn one away from vistiation or makiking large medical decissons,,,its sad, but We need that peice of paper.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
Indeed. And you have every right to it. Even here in secular Australia, gay and lesbian couples have the same problems. Lack of fair access to adoption, fertility technologies, marriage. Our last Prime Minister made sure of that, and our current Prime Minister is just as conservative. So it doesn't look like it changing anytime soon. For a while there in the late 80s and 90s, I thought the world had moved past all this crap. It's seems I was very much mistaken.
Textra1 3 years ago
Belle, Really?,,,you see this as a rebellion?
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
Belle, I was raised by a Scientist in Cocoa Beach Fl who worked for NASA,,I was born in to an atheist family,I feel the same about religion and I am certainily not rebelling.I have never been religious and never believd in a god, so how can I be rebelling?
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I think what Belle is referring to is the more vocal atheists that seem to be around at the moment. One could ask, why jump up and down so much for something you don't believe in? It's a fair question, but one just has to see what's been done in the name of religion to understanding the current atheist furor.
Textra1 3 years ago
Textra, The reason I am a bit upset at the moment is because of how The Hyper Religious have persoanlly affected my life, and it must stop.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I hear you dude. And I agree completely. It would be nice if people kept their religion on a personal level. I don't mind religious debates and argument. It's not like I want to ban religion, I just don't want it corroding and poisoning to well of human progress. When someone says we should ban medical certain research because they insist that blastocysts have souls, and our leaders agree and legislate, it's time to ask what's in that kool-aid.
Textra1 3 years ago
Text, My sistuation is very widespread. I am a Firefighter, served in the AF and My Partner is a Pilot for Delta and also served , together we have one adopted Daughter and for yrs we could not get married becuase some foolish silly belief system that wants to infringe on my personal life. Kool-aide is over-flowing.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I can't for the life of me understand what politicians are thinking when they legislate in such ways. Who people marry is their own business. Love is love I say.
It's also cherry picking the bible. They love to quote Leviticus 18:22, but forget all about Numbers 15:32-36.
Textra1 3 years ago
"But I have to call it as I see it. I don't see a quiet athiest here."
Belle, think about what you are saying.
I could state that I am one of those "quiet atheists", but now that I have posted here in opposition to your statement, you could say, "But you're not quiet, you're arguing here."
So, would you EVER see a "quiet atheist"?
How can you possibly count all those "quiet atheists" in order to provide you with a more representative cross-section for your "census" ?
RoadRunnerLaser 3 years ago
Belle19700
It is Theists that rebelling against there Atheistic/Agnostic nature, if you would like to get technical about it.
I was born an Atheist/Agnostic with a thirst & hunger for knowledge & the to explore the wonders of the universe I was born into. Christians performed a ritual of baptism on me & proclaimed me Christian, without me be informed...in other words forced to sign/agree to a contract without knowing the contents of the contract or knowing how to sign or...
1/C
Aegialeus 3 years ago
Belle19700
..even having any notion at all of what signing or agreeing is. Because I had an innate trust with my mother from the time I was in her womb and later with my father. I came to accept this rebellious condition on my free will, and eventually through persistent reminding by those preaching about hell fire, guilt, & repentance, then I started calling my self Christian out of fear, but only because if I believe in Jesus he will love me, then spare me.
2/C
Aegialeus 3 years ago
Belle19700 When I started thinking, I stopped being afraid, then explored again...then I started doubting about religion & theism...and started loving life, loving my existence, loving and respecting the symbiotic relationship with living life, loving the universe for what it is and all it's unanswered mysteries yet...thus became a born again Theist/Agnostic.
Question, do you recommend people to sign blank checks or sign contracts without knowing or reading what they are committing to?
3/C
Aegialeus 3 years ago
It's pretty easy to break a contract, you know. You just walk away. I did from Catholicism.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle19700
I value honor and virtue, but not in the biblical sense, but in the sense amongst equals in humanity.
You think it's easy to walk away from years of indoctrination, and commitment. It's not so easy. It takes some serious self questioning & discovering.
I do not break contracts that easy. When you sign a will you must be of sound body & mind, & a witness or 2 to be uncontested. Is a baby of sound body and mind? Legally no, so the baptism can be contested then. The logic works.
Aegialeus 3 years ago
I totally undersand how much work it took to walk away. That's what I went through on my spiritual quest. I was looking for truth, not anything else, God, or whatever. I am almost totally left-brained. LOGICAL. No scripture, or any of that stuff. All I found was Jesus everytime I got into trouble. Being open-minded, I found is easier said than done. I also was granted a glimpse behind the veils. The kingdom of God "is" within. I saw. Trinity is real.
Belle19700 3 years ago
They baptise to protect your soul from birth. You know that. I know it's something that many of us have no control over, but I throughout my life, and have been kind of glad I was baptised at birth. It doesn't mean you have to stay in a religion though. You just walk away if that's what you want. Find your own way. I totally believe in that.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle19700
"to protect your soul"
You know how that sounds to me now...like voodoo magic.
Yes I truly believe in that to, that we all need the space and time to find our own way, besides who in the hell do we think we are to try to impose our views on others, with persistent solicitations and impositions. Try living an Atheistic/Agnostic life in a Theistic world.
Aegialeus 3 years ago
I know baptism sounds like vodoo magic. I know. But, there is spirit world, and any protection we can get, should be a good thing? Ever lived with a ghost? I have, and my ex-husband, and girlfriend will attest to that ghost. There "is" a world that we cannot see with our eyes. Everything is conscious, trees, animals, and especially the grasses. I do not like preachers either, that's why I am "independent." in my statements, and beliefs. I only tell what I experience.
Belle19700 3 years ago
so being cleansed in water by clergy is protection from "spirits"? that doesnt sound like protection atall. a man in robes dripping water on your brow and spouting verses?
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
I don't know what the implications are. I do know that words are important. I do know that water has a different atmosphere around it. Water is supposed to be sacred. I'm not sure, but I can feel that it is different when I get around large bodies of water. I should have stated that before. You know what? What can it hurt? Why not?
Belle19700 3 years ago
"i do know that water has a different atmosphere around it"
what are you comparing water too?
"why not"
I'd rather not take part in an aquatic ceremony laced with myths with no evidence supporting them. that's why not.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
Large or smaller bodies of water "do" have a different atmosphere than when you're not around them. I can feel it. Is "no evidence supporting it," the new catch phrase for idiots who have the sensitivity of rocks? I do not belong here, and I'm not replying anymore. I now know the meaning of the phrase, "Do not cast pearls before swine." Thank you for teaching me this lesson.
Belle19700 3 years ago
"new catch phrase for idiots"
i believe it's called having a brain and not accepting every piece of subjective nonsence presented by others. but hey, if you want to believe water is more than 2hydrogen atoms bonded to a single oxygen atom, you can. "a body of water" the world is over 70% water, so is your body. Your sensitivity levels must be that of GOD, teach me o' wise one, in the ways of science. feed me data with no evidence and i shall repent!
or not.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
Belle you talk and talk and talk , yet, you never , ever presernt ant evidience.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
I can't present any evidence because my evidence is my own personal experience. All I say is never stop seeking truth, never. Do it every day for at least 1/2 hour, be it reading, meditating, yoga, whatever suits "you." And always announce out loud that you are seeking the truth. Is that so terrible? There "is" help out there.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, I know of a former Female and Male monk and one former nun and all of them sought God intensily,,and later realised "nothing, Even Motehr tereses at the end of her life in letters claimed there "was no god"
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
In the forest 3 years on quest, and seeking always after. Core of "what works" is ""SELF-HONESTY, sincerity, and drive"" I've never met a humble, nun in my life! Nuns and monks will not use the "SCATTERED" knowledge available. I was cautious, but flew with the wind. I was given a meditation that allowed me to see behind the veils. The kingdom of God is within, my sweet. Chop wood, carry water is always there. It's the in-between time, the testing time. Nothing means the time is not yet,thats all
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, it seems alot of flowery talk, I am a Firefighter and served inthe AF so I am a direct man,yet my Partner is a Quaker and My Daughter is fully blind and I am a gay man so all together I am not with out sensitivity,,but so far your not presenting any thing.
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
What is it that you want from me that I am not giving you? The method? See, I very quickly wanted my own experiences. I got tired real quick of reading about other's opinions, and experiences. So I found my own method, and occasionally tell a small smattering of what I have experienced. That's all. Sensitivity if the path to intuition, and intuition is the path to physicism. You're on the path alright. At the core of the atom is vibration. Nothing solid.
Belle19700 3 years ago
Belle, nothing really you have set your self aprt with a wll, of " I dont need to give proof" so I guess thats that,,,I think your delussional,,but hey its just my silly fact checking and science background,,,
Clemburke1111 3 years ago
Belle, if you scroll back down through my comments, I asked you a few questions in respect to your healing experiences. I'd like us to stay on that topic if it is not too much of a problem. I would like to know what medicines/treatments your physician prescribed/gave you once you had been diagnosed with the said problems?
I would also like to know what was the time frame between stopping any given treatments and these experiences you say you had. [I'm assuming here you saw a physician, yes?]
PacalB 3 years ago
I don't know about other doctors, but my physician only gave me anti-imflammatories, which I didn't take because they did nothing. He said I had a herniated disk, I think. But what I remember is he said it was a crushed disk. I could only crawl and lay for months, and being as he said I wasn't getting any better after months, he felt surgery was needed. About a week or so later, the beginning of my 2-week healing started, the morning after I prayed to Jesus for healing.
Belle19700 3 years ago
i suppose jesus loves you more than the millions of children he slays with cancer and AIDS, herniated disk? that's not an overly problematic injury. With enough rest it could go away within weeks. evidence evidence evidence! the fools vocabulary.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
I've said many times that maybe I am tapping into a power that allows healing. But, again, I am not capable of creating a man who touches my head, and I felt it physically. People come to this earth for a reason. Let them experience their experience. It's really hard to let go, and not try to control the world. We can't anyway. I don't give evidence. I give you the method to find your own evidence, and you laugh. If you don't try, you'll get nothing. If nothing is good, then be happy. Peace.
Belle19700 3 years ago
if healing through god actually worked, we wouldnt need hospitals or medicine.
again, you provide nothing but circle reasoning and no merit for your words.
in other words, you're talking bullshit.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
If healing through God is possible, it won't be happening a lot until people learn how to do it. How can they do it if they don't know how? In past comments, I have given the basics of my methods. The world is full of stories of other's experiences. Have your own experiences instead. I'm not talking bullshit. You're talking bullshit. You refuse to work, earn, seek, search. This isn't about reasoning. It's about "try it," before you say it's bullshit. Goodbye.
Belle19700 3 years ago
"try it" so if we imagine we are getting better we will? everything is about REASON, without reason we are gullible to shit like that. how on earth does praising an imaginery god kill of microscopic bacterium or fix muscles. please, use reason in your life. adults falling victim to this religious nonsence is making me lose my ever decreasing faith in our species future.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
Imagine we're getting better? I never said that at all. This has nothing to do with imagination. I am a person who thinks "anything" is possible. Anything. When you or someone else gets sick, scared, ask for help. How much does that cost? You're friends can't hear you. What the hell. Also, in these comments somewhere is my method. Look for it. This isn't shit. My method works for me like crazy. It takes work though. My feeling is you aren't ready, and that's okay. Every person on their own path.
Belle19700 3 years ago
i'm not looking through your comments to find this magic pseudo-logical explainations. when i'm sick i go to the doctors, recieve medicine and i'm cured. To make these claims you need genuine evidence. Not subjective, objective. something others can study and test. god never seems to heal any major disease or ailments.
"My feeling is you aren't ready"
so you're going to evangelise me then?
please, hold your mythic abilities to youself, im open to all ideas, but yours are irrational 'n crazy
lifeisgummo 3 years ago 2
When did I say don't go to the doctor? I pray for healing when I can't go to the doctor, or the doctors can't do anything.
Again, you have to find your own evidence, because that is the only evidence you'll accept, and that's good. It's smart. That's what I did! I proved to myself that there is something else happening here, so much more than we see with our 2 eyes. I am not irrational or crazy. Go find your own truth in whatever way you want. That's as it should be. Peace.
Belle19700 3 years ago
truth is not subjective.
again, you show your irrationality.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago 2
Since when is truth rational? Truth is always subjective, always. Everyone has their own idea of the truth, and nowhere on this planet will you find 2 people with exactly the same idea of truth, ever, always a little different.
Belle19700 3 years ago
the truth might not always be rational. but truth itself is not subjective. so if you believe the sky to be silver...therefore it is? no, you are mistaken.
lifeisgummo 3 years ago
Personally, I think we both have to concede that there are "facts (objective) and perception (subjective). Facts verses perception.
Scientific proof is objective. It's simply true. (depending on the century)
Personal truth (subjective) is truth to them whether it's true or not.
If it's subjective truth, can we call it truth, or should it just be called perception?
Actually personal truth means personal perception though. I like thinking about stuff like this.
Belle19700 3 years ago