Kung Fu San Soo Masters Dave Hopkins & George Kosty #1

[mlsknfasldknfjg]

@sophiaspapi2003 Sorry bud but its still murder. there is no avoiding that. It may have felt or been right or necessary or instinctual, natural or legal, but that killing is murder. Also, most of this discussion seems a little more militaristic than seems wise.

[straightfromthephone]

Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt Rafael Salomao was undefeated, claiming to have won more than 300 fights, when Kyle Olsen went up against him-and ultimately unseeded him to become the first-ever kung-fu san soo world champion recorded in mixed martial arts.

[dogfightvj]

what's the name of the song??

[SanSuMartialArts]

bravo



[thankgod4sk8ting]

r they really punchinjg eachother?

[BoppaTroll]

San Soo VS MMA = stupid question.

San Soo was designed for war to mame, kill, destroy.

Not for competitions to knockout or tapout...

MMA fighters are gladiators in their own respect, but they're also trained to fight to a certain point and give up, all the while following very strict rules.

San Soo targets everything MMA avoids. The only rules are if you have to fight, you have to win. Don't hold back and never give in.

It's pretty simple. I love them both, but i realize they're different.

[streeteffective]

MMA & San Soo. Apples & Oranges. Training with gloves, matts, and rules is not good when facing weapons, bare knuckles and concrete. Training in San Soo with the habits of no rules and no gloves is not good when preparing for MMA...If you want to fight one on one in a ring go do MMA. If you want to stomp attackers in an alley do San Soo. Some aspects will be transfer for both. But you fight how you train. Pick what you like or need... and have fun...

[fearthemunky]

There are some serious problems with San Soo that would be exploited by other disciplines and moves that are impractical against a resisting opponent. A few examples are the lack of full contact sparring (modified speed with people pulling punches and reacting to being hit like dancers or stuntmen is not nearly the same), lack of footwork resulting in strikes that are effectively arm punches, and a lack of ground fighting and grappling skills.

[fearthemunky]

I’m not trying to put down San Soo, but this is just the way it is. This TMA vs. MMA question was settled years ago so I don’t know why people still try to argue it. And I don’t understand why people think that an mma fighter suddenly would be a fish out of water in the street, and couldn’t fight dirty themselves. Watch the video of Roger Huerta destroying a Texas Longhorn linebacker who outweighed him by 80 lbs in seconds in a street fight.

[fearthemunky]

To anyone who is interested in San Soo I would encourage that decision…but it would be advisable to cross train in some kind of grappling as well to get a good well rounded combo. It seems even Dave Hopkins knows this. The reason I posted this is I wanted to refute this guy who was saying that trained pro fighters won’t street fight because they would get killed by San Soo fighters. That’s just ludicrous! It would be like flag football players claiming they can destroy NFL teams- no joke.

[fearthemunky]

I have no doubt that the top 10 amateurs that train at Quest could drive down to Riverside and take on Hopkins’ best 10 students, and it wouldn’t even be fair. The kung fu guys wouldn’t be able to mount any offense, and if they stood there trying to windmill block punches and counter they would get battered. Nothing against kung fu or Hopkins, and I know he has a successful gym, but I’ve seen them both up close and personal, enough to know.

[coolman56503]

@fearthemunky I am a second generation student of kung fu san soo. This means that i learned from a master that learned directly from jimmy woo. I know it works because i have broken arms and legs in fights with people that actually were trying to kill me. Yes i have even been stabbed before among other scars. You have no idea what you are talking about. Someone that knows san soo in its purest form (as a 1st through 3rd gen. student) has been trained how to kill people since his first lesson.

[coolman56503]

@coolman56503 A more accurate example would be to put a special forces soldier(san soo warrior) against an average city cop like nypd (mma competitor) in a fight to the death at a war zone. Its fine if you want to learn a sport like karate, jiujitsu, mma. But dont even think about comparing it to san soo, because yes if you had a mma fighter go and fight with a 1st-3rd gen. student to the death(which is all that counts), the mma fighter would be killed faster than most people would believe.

[fearthemunky]

I want to weigh in on the discussion here. San Soo was my first love starting back in ’93 and I dabbled in it off and on over the course of 10 years. I trained at the studios of Ted Sias, Jack Sera, and Kurt Bellman. I have nothing but nice things to say about them, and over the years I’ve known or trained with many San Soo guys who could kick some serious ass in a street fight. It’s important to also understand the difference between fighting and self defense when comparing.

[fearthemunky]

More recently I’ve also trained submission wrestling, Muay Thai, and MMA at Team Quest Temecula, Dan Henderson’s gym. So I have a lot of perspective to work from, and I used to hear those claims that San Soo (other TMA arts often claim this as well) is too deadly for the cage, that Master Woo frowned on tournament fighting, and that many San Soo moves would be illegal in a tournament fight (which has some truth to it).

[fearthemunky]

I used to want San Soo guys to go to the UFC and prove they were the best, but now I know that is not the case. In fact there have been a few San Soo guys who competed professionally, with predictable results  Vitor Belfort’s pro debut was against a 6’8” 300 lb San Soo fighter (John Hess) and Vitor brutally KO’d him in 12 seconds. There's a YT video of a San Soo guy challenging an MMA fighter to a no-rules fight, and he ended up getting put on his back and got his arm keylocked and snapped.

[shadowchazer87]

I trained with Dave back in Rialto for nearly 4 years. Best training I've done in my life in law enforcement now and it's helped me in many situations throughout my career so far. Thanks Dave

[jackingoldsby]

I'm not getting into the too deadly for the ring argument.... it's just the assumption is that the guy you fight doesn't know you have martial arts training. It's really designed for quick street fights... against a well conditioned pro MMA/ athlete who knows you have training it won't work particularly well.

BTW, I know both Dave & George. Dave has a lot of BJJ experience as well & trained with Gene LeBell.

[drrabbihjohnson]

Go to Deathshead Kung Fu for the real deal of San Soo.......

[Ninjabarbour]

Wow would like to see how far one of these dudes would make it in MMA, they pry wouldn't last until the first bell, I mean seriously... It's real pretty and all but not very practical, that dude would get clinched and destroyed... Watch the first UFC's when style battled style, Kung fu didn't fare too well, as I remember Royce put one of them on the ground and they had no clue about ground fighting...and it didn't last long before kung Fu dude was done

[straightfromthephone]

@Ninjabarbour

You should do your homework. They also have some cross training in brazilian Jiu Jitzu with the Machado's some of the best in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

Fact MMA is just a sport. San Soo isn't for the ring or the drunks at the bars. It is for when your life is on the line. These are just moves to teach your body the alphabet. They are practiced until they are muscle memory. There are thousands of moves, but some look much nicer in demonstrations.

[straightfromthephone]

@Ninjabarbour

Also look up Kyle Olson. The first Kung Fu San Soo MMA world Champion.  He beat an undefeated MMA fighter that had over 300 wins and is a brazilian Jiu Jitsu Black Belt. Olsen is a 3rd degree black belt in san soo.

[cdx16]

MMA = WATERED DOWN MUAY THAI AND WATERED DOWN JAPANESE JIU JITSU ALSO KNOWN AS BRAZILIAN JIU JITSU

Sorry but thats the truth. If you don't believe me, go visit a traditional japanese jiu jitsu dojo or a traditional muay thai studio.

[eurofreak100]

cool

[scabjelly]

The reason why they tell cage fighters NOT to fight outside the ring is because of people like san soo fighters...that will murder you.

[YoungCrs]

@scabjelly what people fail to realize is that, cage fighters fight with rules, but even then they are fast precise ATHLETES (people who can go the distance and take damage while still dealing it)...what do you think will they are capable of, when fighting without rules?

when it comes to kung fu guya, most of the time the questions being asked are, do they have any experience with full contact fighting? can they handle the ground game? can they really pull off those techniques under pressure?

[sophiaspapi2003]

@scabjelly respectfully, you and I know that it's not murder if you are defending your own life or a loved ones life:)

[scabjelly]

This is the same system that is taught to the NAVY SeALs, the basic 45 is good enough for one of the better fighting forces but not good enough for "REAL fighters". ...

[scabjelly]

For example, in the dynamic of a sudden violence encounter the very real possibility of having a knife added to the equation exists. In such a situation, there will be no referee to disqualify anyone. I have never seen BJJ guys train for knives, or any weapon for that matter.

[scabjelly]

I would like to point out that "cage" fighting or MMA style has never been "REAL" as defined by taking place in a controlled environment with referees and judges and rules. Within such a format, the true dynamic of a fight is lost. Most importantly, in a REAL fight, one is not given the option to tap out...

[lococavasa]

@ss5dojo You ufc guy's just love to bash all traditional styles which might i add without them the new mma would not be here today. Are you really so naive that you think nothing except what's geared for the sport ring can work? Lamo HAHA really? LOL Sure there good but really test the shit b 4 you say it can't work funny. A bjj practioner can take a man down in 1 move you can also break bones inc in1 move no there are rules in the ufc. They are there to protect you.

[naja281]

@ss5dojo there are no competitions bcuz most techniques are illegal in competition. the move worked for me in a very real fight after i caught arm its a simple grab and duck under like in wrestling, there are moves to counter it then there are moves to counter those and so on, san soo teaches situations after situations I have never fought a girl so I wouldnt know about it working on my girlfriend you must know from experience...ufc fighters all train "moves" in one art or the other..look closer

[rover548]

i have had the pleasure of meeting both these masters and cant wait to train with them again

[uhohsketyohz]

San Soo is awesome. I'm a green belt and love practicing San Soo. I have had almost all of these moves done to me and I know some of them. My SiFu knows both Master Dave Hopkins and Master George Kosty. I hope to eventually get to meet them.

[newdude32]

@uhohsketyohz what belt are you now? you left the comment i am replying too about 8 months ago. Also i just started san soo, im a white belt lmao but it is a very fun and indeed deadly martial art.

[Shriner66]

I love San Soo!

[rockforlife09]

I have been studying San Soo for about 4 and a half years, my master is Ken Hensley, its awesome! I just got my brown belt.

[Japandriftingstrong]

i studied san soo for two years and looking back it was very effective

[KyleMac92109]

These guys are top notch, their ability to react, redirect, and improvise is very impressive when you feel their technique in person....

[naja281]

Move at :46 to :51 is no joke, actually works. Much respect to these masters. It's one thing to watch and not be impressed and it's another to actually practice the art and understand what they are demonstrating. Holding back just enough not to fuck each other up.

[ynoksu]

not impressed

[zappasaurus]

@ynoksu Ah ... yeah. You are ass-kicking waiting to happen

[BJJHomos]

@ynoksu Cool, I see from your profile that you're 24 years old. Wow, you have been alive less time than Dave & George have been doing martial arts. Maybe you should direct us to some of your videos that will "impress" us....?

[cdx16]

that was beautiful.

[TVYee1]

I love watching Dave and George work out, they have great execution!

[yangdog25]

yeah george kosty's my master mad respect to master dave hopkins also