I like tl notes because if they're putting them in, that means the references/jokes should be translated correctly like when shows borrow an English phrase from some book.
I respect Otaking's work on this video though I get a heavy and strong impression that he's something of a close minded purist who doesn't like new anime even though there's been some absolute masterworks and thinks old dubs by streamline e.t..c were actually good even though old anime dubs back in the day were god awful and they're actually superior now than back in small little world
The sad thing is, while you guys that live in America or UK or any country that got legit anime distribution and cheap delivery cost can enjoy well subbed anime, most of the world don't get that privilage.
1) Steep exchange rate and different disposable income: for some of us, $20-$40 for a copy of 4 episodes DVD is very expensive.
2) Delivery cost: $20 for a DVD + $20 delivery? screw that.
3) Slow net connection: We have to pay for some people with good net to download and burn them to DVD.
@GigawingsVideo That's not true, the part where you said those DVDs are well subbed anime. There are a lot of DVDs with a bad work made in em, starting for translation, bad synch and bad video quality. At least that's frequent with old animes. Other cases are DVDs with dubtitles (using Eng-dub dialogues as subtitles), they don't match with the original version. A good example of bad DVDs could be "Blood +", the fansub version is better in TL. I'd prefer to spend in J-DVDs than those with subs.
@NemaN101 That's another problem with trusting a company sub and dub it, some of them are in for the money, and it shows with their quality.
The worst part? spending so much money and waiting for 2 weeks to a month for a DVD to arrive (shipping from US to Asia is damn long, especially with sea line) and when we finally put it in the DVD player and find out that the sub and dub quality are bad, that is just disheartening to us.
@GigawingsVideo Luckily for those in Spain, Italy, France, or Arabic speaking companies, they still got more anime aired and dubbed overall back then, like Mazinger, Grendizer, and Knights of the Zodiac.
@MisterHeroman Yeah, that's why Knights of the Zodiac and robot series are popular. I still love Zodiac Knights and even going to get the new PS3 game.
What's your fucking problem nerds? You seriously have nothing else to complain about? Are you virgins seriously that bored? Anime today is shit anyways so who cares about how it's subbed. What's the point of crying little girls over shit nobody cares about. If you don't like the way they fansub it - Then dont watch it. Keep your fat ugly otaku piece of shit mouths shut and go watch some more Raw K-ON. I wanted a document about fansubbing - I got some menchild crying about their butthurt. Thanks.
Anyone can fansub in half an hour to one hour? What a joke! By that reasing, translating, timing, sub setting, encoding, and editing a 25 minute episode can be done by a single person with only five to ten minutes for each task!
Overall good guidelines, though I'm uneasy about the idea of totally changing the meaning of a metaphor or reference in order to shoehorn it into making sense to foreign audiences. We should instead seek better understanding of Japanese culture by explaining these ideas; the so-called translation notes should refer to these hard-to-understand moments either before or after an episode, as opposed to overwhelming viewers with information In-medias-res.
Without fansubbers I wonder how merchandise sales would be... Anyways, is it ironic that I had a tuff time reading the subtitles. And why, please tell me, must I have my subtitles translated into English for idiots just because some person does not know a few japanese terms. So you have stop and look it up, is using one's brain so hard to do today?
@RoMayDrako Do you know what a translation is? It is changing one language into another for the purpose of understanding. Leaving words untranslated in a Japanese to English translation DEFEATS the purpose of the translation. If you are so in love with Japanese, then just watch raws. I swear it's weaboo's like you that ruin it for people that want real translations.
@BuranLyoko I'm confused. A brief history of fansubbing as a way to introduce the concept through surveying historical and modern forms of it sounds like a documentary to me.
It's not a truly encompassing work (considering it's just one guy doing this), but it still brings to the overall discussion (in this case about fansubbing) a wide array of points. That's what documentaries do, isn't it?
The first part of the video series is much like a documentary, however the rest of the series is someone's soap box about modern day fansubers and how OtaKing77077 thinks they are arrogant and failures at translation.
OtaKing77077 makes some good points, but is unwilling to consider that fan subs are NOT professional translators.
OtaKing77077 also is unable to understand people (like myself) prefer certain words like baka not to be translated.
@BuranLyoko Why shouldn't baka be translated? There are many words in the English language that has the same meaning as the Japanese word baka. They'res stupid, dumb, idiot, fool, etc.
The audience for illegal fansubs are NOT your ordinary people they know what certain words and phrases mean.
Sometimes English translation disrupts the flow of reading subtitles when the phrase is common knowledge to the viewer. Also phrases like baka and honorifics give a fansub a certain charm.
Additionally a phrase like "Itadaki-masu" sounds better than "thanks for the food".
@BuranLyoko So what you're saying is that certain words can't be translated because they don't sound "cool". That's a load of crap. Also, the only reason "nakama" is all that special in Japan is because the Japanese view friendship more differently than Americans. To them, friendship is sacred. And if a bunch of white boys think says "Itadaki-masu" while they're speaking English, they need to be shot.
@BuranLyoko True enough, I found certain points not worth squat like writing names on tombstones sideways isn't how one does it in real life, as though fansubbers sought to replace the japanese writing instead of say, paralleling written text with its translation. His biggest point however, is the arbitrary translation patterns for leaving "key words" like baka in japanese. It is definitely inclusive as he said and does liken itself to how "weaboo" speak irl. Which is simply annoying imho.
@BuranLyoko Then watch raw Japanese. Baka has MANY MANY valid translations. The only reason you don't want it translated is because you are a fanboy weaboo. You probably go to anime cons using baka and such in English speaking conversations.
I'm sorry but this isn't a documentary but more of a throw around opinion. I'm a funsubber and I've researched if this is hurting the industry BUT actually it's helping the industry because when people watch the subbed show they usually buy the manga and figurines..etc. this trash is all opinions and I LAUGH AT YOUR USELESS OPINION. my fucking translator quit on me because of you thanks a lot
@ReachingWithin A documentary doesn't have to be neutral. In fact, most documentaries are quite opinionated when aimed at a particular problem in regards to people or actions of a company.
The purpose of this is to set an argument based on the concerns of the maker, and backing up whatever claims and assertions made with well thought or factual statements. Notice how I didn't say that EVERYTHING had to be "factual" in regards to appeasing anyone who watched a particular documentary...
@KingRangerLive nope sorry I am an editor....and my translator quitting is a bad thing I do this for fans....it's called FANsubbing not PRO subbing so we do shit our own way...whether we put in TL notes or have karaoke is our business just turn the subtitles off for that time if your that butthurt
@KingRangerLive who said I'm not subbing anymore? I'm happily subbing and I'm happily good at it......and weaboo subbers.....thye do the best job cause we're not getting paid this is fun for us
@uiliands And where exactly do those "non-intrusive plain .srt subtitles" come from, for shows that don't have official releases? Oh that's right, from the "obsolete" fansubbers.
And I know I've seen some releases where the lack of formatting in .srt makes it FAR more intrusive than typical fansub typesetting, particularly when there's a lot of onscreen text, insert songs, or overlapping dialogue.
If fAnsubbers really considered their subs "untouchable," they'd still be hardsubbing everything. "Everyone can collaborate"? Most fAnsub watchers don't know: Japanese, how to time/typeset, or the finer details of English spelling/grammar. Also, fAnsub-scene encodes are better than Japanese P2P scene raws. And most viewers don't want to read through subtitle scripts for episodes they haven't seen, and they prefer the formatting fansubs provide over plain .srt or DVD/BD imagesubs.
What kind of subbing software are out there? I want to make a personal subbing so I don't have to deal with name changes in both english dubs and other fansubs.
The problem with fansubbers is that they either don't know Japanese very well, or they know Japanese a little TOO well, and they see fit to remind people of that fact all through the flick.
I can't agree more with OtaKing's message here. Fansubs, in my opinion, are doing more to hurt the industry than help it. They have their uses, like bringing us some unlicensed classics. But I also think most groups are pretty poor quality. I don't need flashy text. It takes away from the show. And yes I do like my shows to actually be translated, and not some weird English-Japanese mishmash.
And for the record, I put my money where my mouth is. I buy legit anime and lots of it.
Why people bitch about free shit... Its up to you to DL them or not. If you don't like the FS than simply don't watch! Im grateful that they actually have the time to translate these. Bitching about what others do on their free time makes the watchers look like assholes. If you hate FS, GROW BALlS and MONEY AND BUY THE DAMN DVD!!
So what if there is a misplaced word here or a untranslated word there. If it weren't for them you wouldn't be able to 80% of the anime you see today.
By the way, I agree with almost every single point made in this doc, especially regarding how cliquey fansubbing has gotten these days (something which also kind of bleeds into another, unrelated to fansubbing, gripe that I have with modern anime fandom, but thats neither here nor there). Im old enough to remember late 80s anime fandom, and the better fansubs are just one of several things that I miss terribly from that era. Excellent job OtaKing.
Could anyone please name the anime played in the lower half of the screen (to the right of Macross 7) at about 1:53? I KNOW I know it from somewhere, I just cant think of the damn title for the life of me, and its driving me nuts. And yes, Im sure Ill feel very dumb as soon as someone says it. Thanks in advance.
@DrunkSamurai : How? Tell me, how? Otaking has detailed explanations, tons of good examples, and quotes from professional subtitlers. What do you have except your n00bish arrogance?
@HYAAALP I gave my explanations before and I'm far too lazy to rewatch the videos to do it more detailed. The sign one he said was terrible though. There is nothing wrong with translating the kanji on signs.Translation notes are definitely the best way to do things too.
@DrunkSamurai There's nothing wrong with translation notes and translating kanji on signs. However, going overboard with translation notes is pretty poor (e.g. nakama isn't really a special and has an English equivalent of comrade), and why not simply put the notes on the area where the subtitles are located? Those are what he is trying to get at.
@PantherCaruso Friend is a better translation for Nakama. It's only One Piece subs that do that anyway. You also can't go overboard when translating a sign.
Also are you fucking kidding me? If the fansubbers did that then the dialogue subs would merge with the translator notes
@DrunkSamurai That depends really - nakama implies more of an "ally" than a friend. You can go overboard with translation notes (e.g. all according to keikkaku), which implies the unprofessionalism of subbers.
And no, that only happens when the sign appears with a dialog, in which you can simply place it in a different line. At least it will be visible to the lines you are reading. It's not that hard to understand.
I'll say thsi again: I don't mind fansubs but boy they are gwetting ridiculous and yeah I even have a friend of sorts in sixth form who loves fansubs so much he eschews dvd's and claims fansubs make things prettier and do it so much better.
Not really. It depends on the company. Geneon dubs were terrible with horrible voice acting. So a lot of fansubbers would continue them. Plus most people want streaming in other countries than just the U.S. and Canada.
Mainly stuff that is already licensed (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece, etc.).
Also, many different groups releasing the same title. Is it really necessary for 3-5 groups subbing one particular title (e.g., all of the above mentioned). Is this type of rivalry really necessary?
Anime is not dying at all. I mean people like you are complete idiots. You blame fansubs when you completely forget about the recession. Recession = less money = less money to buy anything.
No argument here. Fansubs now look like a bad Engrish translation done be a retarded ten year old with crayons, but that's just a small indicator of a larger problem. Anime is now just a generic rehash of tired themes and characters. Even original music has been replaced by lame J Pop to promote a band.
And then you have the little twats who never buy, just download fansubs.
Yeah I get you when it come people who download and never buy. However with the rehash I don't agree for so long now people have been telling story and just putting their spin on things. There is nothing new under the sun its just a matter of finding what youre in to really.
I don't mind, and even expect some similarity in shows of the same genre. Example:
Gundam, Macross and Patlabor are 3 older mecha shows but each has a distinctive style in story in presentation.
What I'm referring to, for example is a show such as Steel Angel Kurumi. Which, except for changing the names and the occasional small detail is almost an exact rip off of an older show: Saber Marionette.
Yeah I get you when it come people who download and never buy. However with the rehash I don't agree for so long now people have been telling story and just putting their spin on thing. There is nothing new under the sun its just a matter of finding what youre in to really.
So true, even inmy high school days there were tons of anime I "could only dream of" watching. Young 'uns these days have it so easy. :P
But while today's subs can be incredibly weird and literal, I do appreciate some fans' effort to explain cultural references and words. I've learned a lot from them. But I guess I'm one of the more obsessively curious ones.
He complains over fansubs this days and dont even mention that many profesional releases in the days wher totaly altered "to fit the western publicum". Even recuted ...
Mind two exampels:
Robotech/Macross
Star Sherifs/Sei Juushi Bismarck
You should not be prude to be a member of the industry that did this things this to anime .
no you don`t understand waht i mean. They did not only translate this animes.
They used only the Animation. The Industrie Altered the Storyboard and even recuted the Series ... with duplicated scenes ... leting some scenes out and all taht shit. To get in Anime that would fith "Western Publicum" ...
It was cruelsome. Try to get a copy of Robotech and Macross and compare them. Or worser. Satr Shreifs and Sei Juushi Bismarck the last one is one of the worste ever.
Another problem with fansubs I have are how they add more profanity in that wasn't there( kinda like how manga entertainment used to do dub their anime) I think its misleading, and detracts from the experience because I know they aren't shouting F-bombs all the time in shounen anime, and it makes serious scenes seem more comical. Good documentry I agree with you even though I'm more of a dub watcher myself, and even some dubs are starting to use honorifics. *sigh*
Just wanted to make a second comment about these videos. The reason that you probably won't get a real "history of fansubbing" is that people nowadays are looking at litigation big time. No one will come forward to talk about the "old days", so much of this history is being lost (as is much anime fan history). I've been roaming the net for a long time and so much of everything I remember simply isn't there. Good thing I remember it (well, most of it anyway). But no "tell all" book from me...
Not much of a documentary. It starts off seeming like one but most of it is just the author ranting about a cherry picked selection of fansubs he doesn't like.
Not always in my experience. I've seen some pretty stupid mistakes in fansubs. Not conjugating verbs correctly, those stupid translation notes to explain a metaphor that probably has an English equivalent.
To put this into perspective, I once watched a fansubbed anime where they said: "It seems baby calf meat is very popular among the rich these days." But above it was a translator's note saying: "They mean a cow, not a human baby." THEN WRITE THE WORD 'VEAL'!
Why do you think high school and collage students who take evening classes in japanese better than people who have atained degrees or even doctorates in translation? I never got that logic.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
because the professional subbers are paid to dumb down the translation to make it accessible to as many people as possible. The fan subbers, despite having poorer Japanese, try and keep cultural references and jokes that would otherwise be lost. Of course any one can be a fan subber so any generalisation about fan subbers is just that, a generalisation.
DVD subbers will not put in an obscure reference to some kind of breakfast dumpling or a direct translation of a colloquial greeting, instead they will put a western equivalent such as "corn flakes" or "hey man". This is because DVD distributors want to appeal to a broader market than just japanophiles but in doing so, some meaning is inevitably lost in translation. Fan subbers may not have the best linguistic ability but the have less commercial pressures to "dumb down"
damn character count! anyway maybe it was a little bit wrong to put "bad translation" but the quality of the translation decreases because of commercial pressure not because of unskilled translators. For the record I watch both DVD subs and fansubs cos they both have there pros and cons
It's not dumbed down! Seriously, ever heard of the idea that... when you explain a joke, it just isn't funny? Fan-subbers have a hard time with stuff like that because the joke is sometimes completely inaccessible for a non-Japanese audience. The proof of the pudding is when you look around different fan-sub groups. Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei (and its other series) is on the list of 'dropped projects' for a LOT of them.
Good translators should find a way to render said joke in English, which is often possible (not to mention, it's really cool when you come up with something clever. As for pop culture references and such... well, if it parodies another series, of course you're not meant to get the joke if you haven't seen that series. American shows do this all the time too - I doubt you've got every joke South Park has ever made, either. The joke went over the head of many Japanese, too.
An idiotic statement. Filling the screen with a paragraph explaining an in-joke for the stupid gaijin in the audience is the ultimate representation of dumbing down. Hey, a "real otaku" would understand the joke without an essay, right?
That is like looking up the definition of a joke in a dictionary. By then it isn't funny anymore. A good translator should translate everything fully into English instead of leaving things untranslated. The only exception would be names and locations, which is perfectly understandable.
I'm not arguing for whole essays on the screen, I'm merely stating that fansubbers are creating subs for people like themselves, fans. Whereas DVD publishers are creating subs to be as populist as possible but in the process missing out lots of the subtleties.
Overly literal translations miss out on a lot of subtleties as well. Otaking mentions that explaining a visual gag makes it lose its comedic value. Similarly, putting a note on screen to explain a metaphor, colloquialism or old saying makes it lose its emotional impact.
Recession my ass. Idiots who own a 50 in TV, an Ipod and a 360 saying they can't afford a dvd.
I get tired of hearing complaints about a $20 dvd when VHS used to cost $50.
It's not about price, it's about principle. If an episode were 50c legal download people would still get the fansub for free just because they can. And I've heard a lot of hate for US releasing companies from these goofs.
So if you're trying to use the recession as an excuse, you're shit out of luck.
Nah. I'm, really not. I'm just more intelligent than you to not just blame fansubs. Also let's see here. If a person who downloaded something would have never bought it in the first place means it is not a lost sale. It would only be a lost sale if the person planned on buying it but decided just to pirate it.
You're not intelligent at all. Downloading has been going on before a recession so you struck out on that one. Now you're switching to the "I wouldn't have bought it anyway" excuse.
Just because something isn't tangible doesn't mean it has no value, and you are taking it without consent of the owner simply because the opportunity is there.
@wartarot Piracy got worse because of the recession. Less money means less buying. No it's called copyright infringement. Only morons such as yourself who do not know the difference call it stealing.
Copyright infringement is illegal it is no different than stealing you dumbass. It involves taking and modifying someone's work or intellectual property without permission.
And give up this recession excuse. A lot of these freeloaders have the money to buy the toys I mentioned earlier so, don't give me this bullshit that some kid with a computer is being forced to choose between anime and eating.
Actually is is. Just look at the the definition by law. Copyright Infringement is not considered stealing. I said the recession made it worse. That is why there is less buying going on.
3 days before you reply and this is the best you can come up with?
The recession made you do it.
That's right folks, hard economic times FORCED Samurai Lad to march over to his comp and look for torrents of Naruto. He can't live without his fix of Japanese cartoons.
Seriously, shut up trying to blame anyone or anything but yourself for a decision you make on your own.
I said the recession made it worse. Not that that's the only reason. Of course you're too damn retarded to understand that. I'm a pirate and I never deny it. However, if I never intended on purchasing something then it is not a loss sale. It would only be a loss sale if a person who downloads something would have bought it. Also Naruto sucks major ass. If I dropped anything then Shippuden and the manga would be the first things to go.
You need to shut up now. Giving dumbass arguments such as people are downloading anime because of the recession and it's not a loss sale because you wouldn't have bought it anyway.
And fuck Naruto you tard. You couldn't figure out that was an example.
Further you have no business giving an opinion on something which you take without paying for.
People like you are the problem so you have no right to participate in the discussion.
@wartarot The only dumbass is you. People are pirating a lot of stuff because of the recession. Less money = less buying. You don't know shit about this at all. The only way it could be a loss sale is if the person had intended on buying it but decided to pirate it. I'm not a problem since I never would have bought it in the first place. You must be like a 12 year old kid.
Pretty interesting, I'll be looking forward to seeing the other parts of this soon.
But based on the older comments on this video, I'd say that fansubs are inferior to professional subs. I've seen many subs, and they just look attrocious. And yet people eat this up and worship the fansubbers, while the subbers themselves revel in their cloud of elitism or purism. Really, I'd much rather buy a DVD sub than a fansub, I'd even watch the dub instead of the sub if there is one.
I agree. Notes shouldn't be in anime. I can remember how I used to pause the anime in order to read the notes. Now I don't even care anymore and just ignore the notes.
I can understand the subbers want to inform you, but subtitles are meant to translate. I do appreciate it very much if there was an extra text file with explanation in it.
It kinda ruins and distracts it if there's text everywhere. Subtitles are meant for translating, not for adding.
I think that unless you understand Japanese fluently, you can't really say that. Unless you were referring to their personalities, there are overused personalities in most types of storytelling. Ignore DrakkhenTrollku, everyone here is an idiot to him.
Your talking out your ass. I've never stated I value fansubbers in that way. I've only made it clear that I can't stand people like yourself. Why do you feel the need to be a complete douchebag to anybody without the same opinion as your own?
search for "Greg Ayres anime detour fansubbing" on youtube and in 1 or 2 of those videos I argued with an ass named DrunkSamurai. Hell, before I knew he was on youtube, he acted like a child, taking my words and being technical about it on the "What are your views on Piracy" thread on the Myanimelist website!
I like tl notes because if they're putting them in, that means the references/jokes should be translated correctly like when shows borrow an English phrase from some book.
dingumfCallofDuty 1 week ago
Are you Jonathon Clements?
Nicky131Popstar 2 weeks ago
I respect Otaking's work on this video though I get a heavy and strong impression that he's something of a close minded purist who doesn't like new anime even though there's been some absolute masterworks and thinks old dubs by streamline e.t..c were actually good even though old anime dubs back in the day were god awful and they're actually superior now than back in small little world
slyther2 2 months ago
someone get the fansub people working on the new fma brotherhood movie naow for gods sake imma cry if its not done soon!
TheNeozoid 3 months ago
The sad thing is, while you guys that live in America or UK or any country that got legit anime distribution and cheap delivery cost can enjoy well subbed anime, most of the world don't get that privilage.
1) Steep exchange rate and different disposable income: for some of us, $20-$40 for a copy of 4 episodes DVD is very expensive.
2) Delivery cost: $20 for a DVD + $20 delivery? screw that.
3) Slow net connection: We have to pay for some people with good net to download and burn them to DVD.
GigawingsVideo 3 months ago
@GigawingsVideo That's not true, the part where you said those DVDs are well subbed anime. There are a lot of DVDs with a bad work made in em, starting for translation, bad synch and bad video quality. At least that's frequent with old animes. Other cases are DVDs with dubtitles (using Eng-dub dialogues as subtitles), they don't match with the original version. A good example of bad DVDs could be "Blood +", the fansub version is better in TL. I'd prefer to spend in J-DVDs than those with subs.
NemaN101 3 months ago
@NemaN101 That's another problem with trusting a company sub and dub it, some of them are in for the money, and it shows with their quality.
The worst part? spending so much money and waiting for 2 weeks to a month for a DVD to arrive (shipping from US to Asia is damn long, especially with sea line) and when we finally put it in the DVD player and find out that the sub and dub quality are bad, that is just disheartening to us.
GigawingsVideo 3 months ago
@GigawingsVideo Luckily for those in Spain, Italy, France, or Arabic speaking companies, they still got more anime aired and dubbed overall back then, like Mazinger, Grendizer, and Knights of the Zodiac.
MisterHeroman 4 days ago
@MisterHeroman Yeah, that's why Knights of the Zodiac and robot series are popular. I still love Zodiac Knights and even going to get the new PS3 game.
GigawingsVideo 4 days ago
Couldn't agree more with what you say in this. Am telling everyone to watch this. There's no reason to leave honorifics in.
moonkittynet 4 months ago in playlist MUST WATCH
excelente , lo agrago a favoritos
i love is ANIME n_n
arielbas 4 months ago
What's the show at 2:44?
PandaWithARailgun 5 months ago
What's your fucking problem nerds? You seriously have nothing else to complain about? Are you virgins seriously that bored? Anime today is shit anyways so who cares about how it's subbed. What's the point of crying little girls over shit nobody cares about. If you don't like the way they fansub it - Then dont watch it. Keep your fat ugly otaku piece of shit mouths shut and go watch some more Raw K-ON. I wanted a document about fansubbing - I got some menchild crying about their butthurt. Thanks.
datFloyd 6 months ago
@datFloyd Cool shit arguement, pal. Ad hominems, contradicitng yourself, and irony all in one post.
MisterHeroman 5 months ago
@datFloyd I LOVE how the video condemns weaboo-ism and ye
Rawksyousocks 3 months ago
aren't fansubs illegal?
earth1552 6 months ago
Anyone can fansub in half an hour to one hour? What a joke! By that reasing, translating, timing, sub setting, encoding, and editing a 25 minute episode can be done by a single person with only five to ten minutes for each task!
Velocitas014 6 months ago
@Velocitas014
yeah this "documentary" is not credible at all
yaglourt 5 months ago
Dattebayo's gone. R.I.P
vjott 8 months ago
I'm... really sad that I am JUST NOW seeing this.
Your animation is amazing~
DollarTaco 8 months ago
Overall good guidelines, though I'm uneasy about the idea of totally changing the meaning of a metaphor or reference in order to shoehorn it into making sense to foreign audiences. We should instead seek better understanding of Japanese culture by explaining these ideas; the so-called translation notes should refer to these hard-to-understand moments either before or after an episode, as opposed to overwhelming viewers with information In-medias-res.
nerael 9 months ago
Without fansubbers I wonder how merchandise sales would be... Anyways, is it ironic that I had a tuff time reading the subtitles. And why, please tell me, must I have my subtitles translated into English for idiots just because some person does not know a few japanese terms. So you have stop and look it up, is using one's brain so hard to do today?
RoMayDrako 9 months ago
@RoMayDrako Do you know what a translation is? It is changing one language into another for the purpose of understanding. Leaving words untranslated in a Japanese to English translation DEFEATS the purpose of the translation. If you are so in love with Japanese, then just watch raws. I swear it's weaboo's like you that ruin it for people that want real translations.
KingRangerLive 9 months ago 2
@KingRangerLive You can get your "real" translations from a company such as Funimation.
DrunkSamurai 9 months ago
@DrunkSamurai They do a good job from time to time on their uncut subs. Unlike most fan erm weaboosubbers.
KingRangerLive 9 months ago
@KingRangerLive You missed the sarcasm. Fansubs are better.
DrunkSamurai 9 months ago
Anime Fansub Documentary . . other than a brief history of historical and modern fansubbing this is NOT a documentary.
Why don't you change your title to: Anime Fansubs a Failure to Translate?
That title would be more honest and accurate than the current one.
BuranLyoko 10 months ago
@BuranLyoko I'm confused. A brief history of fansubbing as a way to introduce the concept through surveying historical and modern forms of it sounds like a documentary to me.
It's not a truly encompassing work (considering it's just one guy doing this), but it still brings to the overall discussion (in this case about fansubbing) a wide array of points. That's what documentaries do, isn't it?
gh3ttoduCanada 10 months ago
@gh3ttoduCanada
The first part of the video series is much like a documentary, however the rest of the series is someone's soap box about modern day fansubers and how OtaKing77077 thinks they are arrogant and failures at translation.
OtaKing77077 makes some good points, but is unwilling to consider that fan subs are NOT professional translators.
OtaKing77077 also is unable to understand people (like myself) prefer certain words like baka not to be translated.
BuranLyoko 9 months ago
@BuranLyoko Why shouldn't baka be translated? There are many words in the English language that has the same meaning as the Japanese word baka. They'res stupid, dumb, idiot, fool, etc.
anti4kids2000 9 months ago
@anti4kids2000
Why shouldn't baka be translated?
The audience for illegal fansubs are NOT your ordinary people they know what certain words and phrases mean.
Sometimes English translation disrupts the flow of reading subtitles when the phrase is common knowledge to the viewer. Also phrases like baka and honorifics give a fansub a certain charm.
Additionally a phrase like "Itadaki-masu" sounds better than "thanks for the food".
BuranLyoko 9 months ago
@BuranLyoko So what you're saying is that certain words can't be translated because they don't sound "cool". That's a load of crap. Also, the only reason "nakama" is all that special in Japan is because the Japanese view friendship more differently than Americans. To them, friendship is sacred. And if a bunch of white boys think says "Itadaki-masu" while they're speaking English, they need to be shot.
anti4kids2000 9 months ago
@BuranLyoko True enough, I found certain points not worth squat like writing names on tombstones sideways isn't how one does it in real life, as though fansubbers sought to replace the japanese writing instead of say, paralleling written text with its translation. His biggest point however, is the arbitrary translation patterns for leaving "key words" like baka in japanese. It is definitely inclusive as he said and does liken itself to how "weaboo" speak irl. Which is simply annoying imho.
gh3ttoduCanada 9 months ago
@BuranLyoko Then watch raw Japanese. Baka has MANY MANY valid translations. The only reason you don't want it translated is because you are a fanboy weaboo. You probably go to anime cons using baka and such in English speaking conversations.
KingRangerLive 9 months ago
I'm sorry but this isn't a documentary but more of a throw around opinion. I'm a funsubber and I've researched if this is hurting the industry BUT actually it's helping the industry because when people watch the subbed show they usually buy the manga and figurines..etc. this trash is all opinions and I LAUGH AT YOUR USELESS OPINION. my fucking translator quit on me because of you thanks a lot
ReachingWithin 11 months ago
@ReachingWithin A documentary doesn't have to be neutral. In fact, most documentaries are quite opinionated when aimed at a particular problem in regards to people or actions of a company.
The purpose of this is to set an argument based on the concerns of the maker, and backing up whatever claims and assertions made with well thought or factual statements. Notice how I didn't say that EVERYTHING had to be "factual" in regards to appeasing anyone who watched a particular documentary...
gh3ttoduCanada 10 months ago
@ReachingWithin If you are a fansubber, I sure as shit hope you are not an editor or a translator.And good. It's good that your translator quit.
KingRangerLive 9 months ago
@KingRangerLive nope sorry I am an editor....and my translator quitting is a bad thing I do this for fans....it's called FANsubbing not PRO subbing so we do shit our own way...whether we put in TL notes or have karaoke is our business just turn the subtitles off for that time if your that butthurt
ReachingWithin 9 months ago
@ReachingWithin So as long as it's done by fans then completely fucking over what a translation is supposed to be.. Is ok?
I am glad you are not fansubbing. The world needs LESS weaboo subbers like you.
KingRangerLive 9 months ago
@KingRangerLive who said I'm not subbing anymore? I'm happily subbing and I'm happily good at it......and weaboo subbers.....thye do the best job cause we're not getting paid this is fun for us
now stop getting buthurt
ReachingWithin 9 months ago
Agreed with pretty much everything you said in these videos. Excellent job.
GareJei 11 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
違法ダウンロード者は国内・ファンサブ野郎問わず死ね。日本国内でも放送局ネットの関係で週遅れで視聴をするほかない人間がいるのに、DVDすら買わない・CMをカットする外国人がなぜ堂々と大手を振って違法ダウンロードしているんだ？
Fuck you FANSUB-er.
Zheidentified 11 months ago
@Zheidentified そうだなぁ。
今、たくさんの日本のアニメDVDは欧米ですぐに商業的供給源から容易に調達できるが、外人のおたくの大多数は違法ダウンロードする。あいつらは恩知らずのがき共だから。
90年代の古き良き時代には、イギリス人も米国人は日本のアニメを買うことが出来なかった。
今でさえ銀河英雄伝説とか、マクロス7は日本国外の人々の手の届かない。
その当時、Fansubber達の中でお互いの了解があった。アニメは公式契約の下で欧米に発売されと、そのアニメのファンサブの配布をすぐにやめる、って。でも、あの時代のFansubber達はほとんど30歳の熱心なファン。目的はただアニメの素晴らしさを無知な人々に伝えること。現代のFansubberは逆に幼稚で間抜けな野郎ども。目的はアニメについて良い評判を広めるではなく、自己宣伝と勝手な自己満足だ。
現代の社会風潮の反映かもしれない...
OtaKing77077 11 months ago 5
@Zheidentified sup. Streaming for free.
AktiebolagetAB 8 months ago
What's the anime at 2:43?
ShadeolTheFox 11 months ago
That's why I only download raw BD/DVD rips from now on.
And if I need to watch with someone who doesn't understand japanese,
I only need to download non intrusive plain srt subtitles.
I can find almost everything in raw nowadays.
From the number of leechers I see on the torrent files, I'm not alone.
Funsubs are obsolete now.
uiliands 11 months ago
@uiliands And where exactly do those "non-intrusive plain .srt subtitles" come from, for shows that don't have official releases? Oh that's right, from the "obsolete" fansubbers.
And I know I've seen some releases where the lack of formatting in .srt makes it FAR more intrusive than typical fansub typesetting, particularly when there's a lot of onscreen text, insert songs, or overlapping dialogue.
Zalis116 7 months ago
@Zalis116 Funsubbers should only provide plain subtitles to match released raw video files.
I think more people should help. Funsubbers usually think their subtitles must be untouchable and users as passive as possible.
With the subtitles files available, everyone can collaborate with corrections (bad timing, typos, bad translations).
In fact, I edit most of subtitles I have to match my expectations (no lyrics, no weird formating, no intrusive text).
Today most of funsubbers make people lazy...
uiliands 6 months ago 2
If fAnsubbers really considered their subs "untouchable," they'd still be hardsubbing everything. "Everyone can collaborate"? Most fAnsub watchers don't know: Japanese, how to time/typeset, or the finer details of English spelling/grammar. Also, fAnsub-scene encodes are better than Japanese P2P scene raws. And most viewers don't want to read through subtitle scripts for episodes they haven't seen, and they prefer the formatting fansubs provide over plain .srt or DVD/BD imagesubs.
Zalis116 6 months ago
What kind of subbing software are out there? I want to make a personal subbing so I don't have to deal with name changes in both english dubs and other fansubs.
therox94 1 year ago
what anime that morrigan succubus appear 0:36 ?
YamiNogun 1 year ago
@YamiNogun
Judging from the footage, it's from the Vampire Hunter OVA (known as Night Warriors: Darkstalker's Revenge in the U.S.)
RyuuKouOu 3 months ago
I can write subtitles for every anime ever made....... On my cock
GehennaSlumberParty 1 year ago
1990 ?? wtf ? when i think we watch animes in europe since the early 70's.....
zecle 1 year ago
It's a sad true. But in the russian fansub things a lot lot worse...
Zhuravliov 1 year ago
This is an awesome video you got. I also love the intro. I wish I could animate like that.
You're awesome!
TKGB2006 1 year ago
I remember when I was about 5 trying to find anime. Could only seem to get them from second hand stalls lol
wesleysonic 1 year ago
How dare fansubbers make subs for fans in there free time bunch of faggots
sonamyfreak 1 year ago
hi i have tons and tons of anime in my external HD would i get in trouble if i shared these videos with the you tube community?
im kinda new to the whole uploading thing
thanks in advanced!
Random1251 1 year ago
STUDY JAPANESE.
the spanish fansub use to be bad because they sub from english, no one subs from japanese. it's so sad
ESTUDIA JAPONES!
los fansub en español suelen ser malos ya que traducen desde ingles,casi nadie traduce desde japones, es muy triste
napoedge 1 year ago
You wanna talk stupid: leave honorifics in the dub. Yup, I've seen it in both anime and games. It sounds beyond retarded.
DmonHiro 1 year ago
Can I have the permission to download this videos, translate and re-up them in Italian via softsub? Thanks!
OsservatoreDiAnime 1 year ago
you forgot the karaoke
MrZorro0O 1 year ago
WTF is starscream doing there
heronatoin 1 year ago
whats the anime at 1:53 on the right hand side of the screen please it looks really good
trulgn 1 year ago
@trulgn
Combustible Campus Guardress. By the same guy who did BASTARD.
OtaKing77077 1 year ago
@OtaKing77077
Thanks. I've been trying to find out its name for a while. I'm also a fan of Bastard. It's good to know this one is done by the same guy.
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
I do a little amateur TL every now and again, and since I base my methods off what I learned here, I though I'd ask:
When a character refers to themselves in the third person, should that be carried over to the translation, or changed to "I", "Me", etc?
tokiwotomare 1 year ago
@tokiwotomare
I would go with "I" every time as a rule.
Just say it out loud in your head and imagine the sentence being spoken in a (good) dub. If it sounds stupid, something's gone wrong!
OtaKing77077 1 year ago
What is the show from 3:14?
Taoku 1 year ago
@Taoku
Dominion Tank Police. A masterpiece!!
OtaKing77077 1 year ago 4
The problem with fansubbers is that they either don't know Japanese very well, or they know Japanese a little TOO well, and they see fit to remind people of that fact all through the flick.
DonZabu 1 year ago
I can't agree more with OtaKing's message here. Fansubs, in my opinion, are doing more to hurt the industry than help it. They have their uses, like bringing us some unlicensed classics. But I also think most groups are pretty poor quality. I don't need flashy text. It takes away from the show. And yes I do like my shows to actually be translated, and not some weird English-Japanese mishmash.
And for the record, I put my money where my mouth is. I buy legit anime and lots of it.
Soufriere84 1 year ago 18
please who is the name of the last anime?
shinianime 1 year ago
@shinianime
That one is Darkstalkers. This one was released by Viz in the early 2000s.
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
Why people bitch about free shit... Its up to you to DL them or not. If you don't like the FS than simply don't watch! Im grateful that they actually have the time to translate these. Bitching about what others do on their free time makes the watchers look like assholes. If you hate FS, GROW BALlS and MONEY AND BUY THE DAMN DVD!!
So what if there is a misplaced word here or a untranslated word there. If it weren't for them you wouldn't be able to 80% of the anime you see today.
..grow up people
ranivus 1 year ago
I saw this some years ago and came to see it again. I like to see the history of fansubbing and, better or worse, how it's changed.
Kudos to the professionally done documentary.
xjxm 1 year ago
weeeeeeaaaabooooooo !
firefail1 1 year ago
This documentary is great and true. If you think otherwise, you're a weeaboo.
urfhorf 1 year ago
@urfhorf
You obviously don't know what a weeaboo is.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
Someone who is obsessed with Japan and /or Japanese culture, often wanting to be japanese themselves.
I was just using weeaboo as an umbrella term for people that likes anime a bit too much.
urfhorf 1 year ago
@urfhorf Liking some Japanese words left in does not make a person a weeaboo.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
Besides Japanese it´s a languaje that can´t be measure by classic translation rules.
ergmog 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
This is bullshit! It sounds to me like Waa Waa (note: Waa Waa means a little baby crying) XD
It just some bitter translator who had run out of clients because people do it for FREE in their FREE time.
Besides Japanese it´s a languaje that can be measure by classic translation rules.
ergmog 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
you are not proffesional.
maniula12 1 year ago
By the way, I agree with almost every single point made in this doc, especially regarding how cliquey fansubbing has gotten these days (something which also kind of bleeds into another, unrelated to fansubbing, gripe that I have with modern anime fandom, but thats neither here nor there). Im old enough to remember late 80s anime fandom, and the better fansubs are just one of several things that I miss terribly from that era. Excellent job OtaKing.
HellmaskerD 1 year ago 2
Could anyone please name the anime played in the lower half of the screen (to the right of Macross 7) at about 1:53? I KNOW I know it from somewhere, I just cant think of the damn title for the life of me, and its driving me nuts. And yes, Im sure Ill feel very dumb as soon as someone says it. Thanks in advance.
HellmaskerD 1 year ago
I love everything about how you carry this out. The examples and the demonstrations only further prove your points. The new way IS stupid.
(Unrelated: Just wondering, what was the anime at 2:44 ?)
HYAAALP 1 year ago
@HYAAALP I think you mean the new way is 100x better.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai : Shut up, that's not even close to what I said or meant. You were "seeing a dream" if you honestly thought that's what I said.
HYAAALP 1 year ago
@HYAAALP It's called sarcasm. The new way is shitloads better than the old way fansubs did it.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai : How? Tell me, how? Otaking has detailed explanations, tons of good examples, and quotes from professional subtitlers. What do you have except your n00bish arrogance?
AND WHAT THE #$!* IS A NAKAMA?!?
HYAAALP 1 year ago 16
@HYAAALP I gave my explanations before and I'm far too lazy to rewatch the videos to do it more detailed. The sign one he said was terrible though. There is nothing wrong with translating the kanji on signs.Translation notes are definitely the best way to do things too.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai There's nothing wrong with translation notes and translating kanji on signs. However, going overboard with translation notes is pretty poor (e.g. nakama isn't really a special and has an English equivalent of comrade), and why not simply put the notes on the area where the subtitles are located? Those are what he is trying to get at.
PantherCaruso 1 year ago
@PantherCaruso Friend is a better translation for Nakama. It's only One Piece subs that do that anyway. You also can't go overboard when translating a sign.
Also are you fucking kidding me? If the fansubbers did that then the dialogue subs would merge with the translator notes
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai That depends really - nakama implies more of an "ally" than a friend. You can go overboard with translation notes (e.g. all according to keikkaku), which implies the unprofessionalism of subbers.
And no, that only happens when the sign appears with a dialog, in which you can simply place it in a different line. At least it will be visible to the lines you are reading. It's not that hard to understand.
PantherCaruso 1 year ago
@PantherCaruso Forgot to respond. Putting them directly on the sign is much better.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
Nakama is literally "Partner", no friend. Friend is opcional.
XXshirokuroXX 1 year ago
I'll say thsi again: I don't mind fansubs but boy they are gwetting ridiculous and yeah I even have a friend of sorts in sixth form who loves fansubs so much he eschews dvd's and claims fansubs make things prettier and do it so much better.
honestly I now think he's a fucking idiot
slyther2 1 year ago
Your friend is an idiot.
I saw someone post on a forum that anime isn't dying, just that the style is changing.
Well the style is changing and I don't care much for it but that's not the reason.
Anime is dying because a lot of people don't care enough about anime to buy it.
If they can't get it for free they're not interested.
wartarot 1 year ago
@wartarot
these days fansubs are nothign like fansubs of the past.
fansubs of the past and select subs of today (guin Saga, Fist of the north star)
do justice to the industry but most are destroying
and ruining a wonderful genre.
slyther2 1 year ago 2
You're completely wrong. Fansubs are not destroying anything.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
Enlighten me.
The purpose of fansubs is promote something that's not commercially available in hopes of eventually getting licensed.
By subbing what's already licensed and commercially available, that already undermines the efforts of the companies releasing them.
Fansubs are a double-edged sword.
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
Not really. It depends on the company. Geneon dubs were terrible with horrible voice acting. So a lot of fansubbers would continue them. Plus most people want streaming in other countries than just the U.S. and Canada.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@slyther2
I totally agree with you.
The problem is what most subbers are subbing.
Mainly stuff that is already licensed (Naruto, Bleach, One Piece, etc.).
Also, many different groups releasing the same title. Is it really necessary for 3-5 groups subbing one particular title (e.g., all of the above mentioned). Is this type of rivalry really necessary?
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
Anime is not dying at all. I mean people like you are complete idiots. You blame fansubs when you completely forget about the recession. Recession = less money = less money to buy anything.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
are u native japanese? ur japanese is amazing. i wish i could say it like that. :D
lovelylioness12 1 year ago
No argument here. Fansubs now look like a bad Engrish translation done be a retarded ten year old with crayons, but that's just a small indicator of a larger problem. Anime is now just a generic rehash of tired themes and characters. Even original music has been replaced by lame J Pop to promote a band.
And then you have the little twats who never buy, just download fansubs.
Anime has gone to hell in a baby cart.
wartarot 1 year ago
Yeah I get you when it come people who download and never buy. However with the rehash I don't agree for so long now people have been telling story and just putting their spin on things. There is nothing new under the sun its just a matter of finding what youre in to really.
judgment02 1 year ago
I don't mind, and even expect some similarity in shows of the same genre. Example:
Gundam, Macross and Patlabor are 3 older mecha shows but each has a distinctive style in story in presentation.
What I'm referring to, for example is a show such as Steel Angel Kurumi. Which, except for changing the names and the occasional small detail is almost an exact rip off of an older show: Saber Marionette.
wartarot 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Yeah I get you when it come people who download and never buy. However with the rehash I don't agree for so long now people have been telling story and just putting their spin on thing. There is nothing new under the sun its just a matter of finding what youre in to really.
judgment02 1 year ago
Just wondering, what is the name of the series in 1:52 - 2:00 next to Macross 7?
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
Comment removed
RyuuKouOu 1 year ago
I am totally agree with this video
lmk10000 1 year ago
oh shit everything goes downhill from here
satsugekibukouken 2 years ago
I don't think you can really call this a documentary. It's more of a video argument or rant.
BSaito1987 2 years ago
Thank you for cover this subject.
Artist Robert C Allen
Co-President Nc Rowan County Anime Group
MrArtist24 2 years ago
So true, even inmy high school days there were tons of anime I "could only dream of" watching. Young 'uns these days have it so easy. :P
But while today's subs can be incredibly weird and literal, I do appreciate some fans' effort to explain cultural references and words. I've learned a lot from them. But I guess I'm one of the more obsessively curious ones.
Ayyyu 2 years ago
LOL @ 1:20. (Robotech *brr*)
He complains over fansubs this days and dont even mention that many profesional releases in the days wher totaly altered "to fit the western publicum". Even recuted ...
Mind two exampels:
Robotech/Macross
Star Sherifs/Sei Juushi Bismarck
You should not be prude to be a member of the industry that did this things this to anime .
Raistlin2k 2 years ago
Yes, how dare people translate and localize anime into a recognizable facsimile of the English language.
rubino83 2 years ago
@rubino83
no you don`t understand waht i mean. They did not only translate this animes.
They used only the Animation. The Industrie Altered the Storyboard and even recuted the Series ... with duplicated scenes ... leting some scenes out and all taht shit. To get in Anime that would fith "Western Publicum" ...
It was cruelsome. Try to get a copy of Robotech and Macross and compare them. Or worser. Satr Shreifs and Sei Juushi Bismarck the last one is one of the worste ever.
Raistlin2k 2 years ago
Raistlin Majere was the worst character in those games. It so pwned to finally have him Magic Missile the dragon into oblivion.
rubino83 2 years ago
Is not orginaly a game, is a D&D style Fantasy Novel ...
kkthxbye
Raistlin2k 2 years ago
i only have one question.
when did it fall?
looks like its rising to me.
RockerXZERO 2 years ago
ive watched this like 5 times already . omg . i hope you something like this again . it was entertaining.
Kaderderz137 2 years ago
This "documentary" was a good watch. Very amusing and for the most part I agree with it.
failmore 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You are an idiot.
MacDonagh 2 years ago
Another problem with fansubs I have are how they add more profanity in that wasn't there( kinda like how manga entertainment used to do dub their anime) I think its misleading, and detracts from the experience because I know they aren't shouting F-bombs all the time in shounen anime, and it makes serious scenes seem more comical. Good documentry I agree with you even though I'm more of a dub watcher myself, and even some dubs are starting to use honorifics. *sigh*
greenhairedsetokaiba 2 years ago 6
Just wanted to make a second comment about these videos. The reason that you probably won't get a real "history of fansubbing" is that people nowadays are looking at litigation big time. No one will come forward to talk about the "old days", so much of this history is being lost (as is much anime fan history). I've been roaming the net for a long time and so much of everything I remember simply isn't there. Good thing I remember it (well, most of it anyway). But no "tell all" book from me...
dougo13 2 years ago
Not much of a documentary. It starts off seeming like one but most of it is just the author ranting about a cherry picked selection of fansubs he doesn't like.
prsnth1111 2 years ago
wow. I read the description and thought it was going to be about the origin of fansubs... then it talked about sub station alpha. LOL
before then, ppl were using Amigas, genlocks (which had overlay built in - even SSA had to use them though), and JACOSub.
probably still a good documentary, I was just shocked because I suddenly felt very old...
GunterJPN 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Fansubs = good translation, terrible typography
Professional subs = average translation, good typography.
This generalisation is normally true
chazzplaya 2 years ago
Not always in my experience. I've seen some pretty stupid mistakes in fansubs. Not conjugating verbs correctly, those stupid translation notes to explain a metaphor that probably has an English equivalent.
To put this into perspective, I once watched a fansubbed anime where they said: "It seems baby calf meat is very popular among the rich these days." But above it was a translator's note saying: "They mean a cow, not a human baby." THEN WRITE THE WORD 'VEAL'!
DJVinneh 2 years ago 4
Why do you think high school and collage students who take evening classes in japanese better than people who have atained degrees or even doctorates in translation? I never got that logic.
almanacofsleep 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
because the professional subbers are paid to dumb down the translation to make it accessible to as many people as possible. The fan subbers, despite having poorer Japanese, try and keep cultural references and jokes that would otherwise be lost. Of course any one can be a fan subber so any generalisation about fan subbers is just that, a generalisation.
chazzplaya 2 years ago
Thats such an incredibly stupid thing to belive. Using readable english is not dumbing down.
almanacofsleep 2 years ago 9
DVD subbers will not put in an obscure reference to some kind of breakfast dumpling or a direct translation of a colloquial greeting, instead they will put a western equivalent such as "corn flakes" or "hey man". This is because DVD distributors want to appeal to a broader market than just japanophiles but in doing so, some meaning is inevitably lost in translation. Fan subbers may not have the best linguistic ability but the have less commercial pressures to "dumb down"
chazzplaya 2 years ago
damn character count! anyway maybe it was a little bit wrong to put "bad translation" but the quality of the translation decreases because of commercial pressure not because of unskilled translators. For the record I watch both DVD subs and fansubs cos they both have there pros and cons
chazzplaya 2 years ago
It's not dumbed down! Seriously, ever heard of the idea that... when you explain a joke, it just isn't funny? Fan-subbers have a hard time with stuff like that because the joke is sometimes completely inaccessible for a non-Japanese audience. The proof of the pudding is when you look around different fan-sub groups. Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei (and its other series) is on the list of 'dropped projects' for a LOT of them.
DJVinneh 2 years ago 3
missing out a joke because it is deemed not accessible to non Japanese viewers IS dumbing down whether or not it's necessary, good, bad whatever.
chazzplaya 2 years ago
Good translators should find a way to render said joke in English, which is often possible (not to mention, it's really cool when you come up with something clever. As for pop culture references and such... well, if it parodies another series, of course you're not meant to get the joke if you haven't seen that series. American shows do this all the time too - I doubt you've got every joke South Park has ever made, either. The joke went over the head of many Japanese, too.
Pikachu132 2 years ago 9
An idiotic statement. Filling the screen with a paragraph explaining an in-joke for the stupid gaijin in the audience is the ultimate representation of dumbing down. Hey, a "real otaku" would understand the joke without an essay, right?
rubino83 2 years ago
That is like looking up the definition of a joke in a dictionary. By then it isn't funny anymore. A good translator should translate everything fully into English instead of leaving things untranslated. The only exception would be names and locations, which is perfectly understandable.
hyperzeronos 2 years ago
yeah I bet those who watch a movie in Japan don't have little anecdotes to explain every American joke in a live-action movie either.
ShadowAlex 2 years ago 2
And I bet a lot is missed in translation.
chazzplaya 2 years ago
I'm not arguing for whole essays on the screen, I'm merely stating that fansubbers are creating subs for people like themselves, fans. Whereas DVD publishers are creating subs to be as populist as possible but in the process missing out lots of the subtleties.
chazzplaya 2 years ago
Overly literal translations miss out on a lot of subtleties as well. Otaking mentions that explaining a visual gag makes it lose its comedic value. Similarly, putting a note on screen to explain a metaphor, colloquialism or old saying makes it lose its emotional impact.
strizzuth 2 years ago 2
There is no lost of emotional impact at all. Seriously. Is this all you people can come up with?
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
Recession my ass. Idiots who own a 50 in TV, an Ipod and a 360 saying they can't afford a dvd.
I get tired of hearing complaints about a $20 dvd when VHS used to cost $50.
It's not about price, it's about principle. If an episode were 50c legal download people would still get the fansub for free just because they can. And I've heard a lot of hate for US releasing companies from these goofs.
So if you're trying to use the recession as an excuse, you're shit out of luck.
wartarot 1 year ago
Nah. I'm, really not. I'm just more intelligent than you to not just blame fansubs. Also let's see here. If a person who downloaded something would have never bought it in the first place means it is not a lost sale. It would only be a lost sale if the person planned on buying it but decided just to pirate it.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
You're not intelligent at all. Downloading has been going on before a recession so you struck out on that one. Now you're switching to the "I wouldn't have bought it anyway" excuse.
Just because something isn't tangible doesn't mean it has no value, and you are taking it without consent of the owner simply because the opportunity is there.
It's called stealing.
wartarot 1 year ago
@wartarot Piracy got worse because of the recession. Less money means less buying. No it's called copyright infringement. Only morons such as yourself who do not know the difference call it stealing.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
Copyright infringement is illegal it is no different than stealing you dumbass. It involves taking and modifying someone's work or intellectual property without permission.
And give up this recession excuse. A lot of these freeloaders have the money to buy the toys I mentioned earlier so, don't give me this bullshit that some kid with a computer is being forced to choose between anime and eating.
wartarot 1 year ago
Actually is is. Just look at the the definition by law. Copyright Infringement is not considered stealing. I said the recession made it worse. That is why there is less buying going on.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
3 days before you reply and this is the best you can come up with?
The recession made you do it.
That's right folks, hard economic times FORCED Samurai Lad to march over to his comp and look for torrents of Naruto. He can't live without his fix of Japanese cartoons.
Seriously, shut up trying to blame anyone or anything but yourself for a decision you make on your own.
wartarot 1 year ago
I said the recession made it worse. Not that that's the only reason. Of course you're too damn retarded to understand that. I'm a pirate and I never deny it. However, if I never intended on purchasing something then it is not a loss sale. It would only be a loss sale if a person who downloads something would have bought it. Also Naruto sucks major ass. If I dropped anything then Shippuden and the manga would be the first things to go.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
@DrunkSamurai
You need to shut up now. Giving dumbass arguments such as people are downloading anime because of the recession and it's not a loss sale because you wouldn't have bought it anyway.
And fuck Naruto you tard. You couldn't figure out that was an example.
Further you have no business giving an opinion on something which you take without paying for.
People like you are the problem so you have no right to participate in the discussion.
wartarot 1 year ago
@wartarot The only dumbass is you. People are pirating a lot of stuff because of the recession. Less money = less buying. You don't know shit about this at all. The only way it could be a loss sale is if the person had intended on buying it but decided to pirate it. I'm not a problem since I never would have bought it in the first place. You must be like a 12 year old kid.
DrunkSamurai 1 year ago
The logic of the retarded.
DrakkhenToku 1 year ago
Jesus I didn't think this would cause such a shit storm. maybe I shouldn't have been so general to start with.
chazzplaya 2 years ago
Pretty interesting, I'll be looking forward to seeing the other parts of this soon.
But based on the older comments on this video, I'd say that fansubs are inferior to professional subs. I've seen many subs, and they just look attrocious. And yet people eat this up and worship the fansubbers, while the subbers themselves revel in their cloud of elitism or purism. Really, I'd much rather buy a DVD sub than a fansub, I'd even watch the dub instead of the sub if there is one.
Hotstarthefaggot 2 years ago 2
I agree. Notes shouldn't be in anime. I can remember how I used to pause the anime in order to read the notes. Now I don't even care anymore and just ignore the notes.
I can understand the subbers want to inform you, but subtitles are meant to translate. I do appreciate it very much if there was an extra text file with explanation in it.
It kinda ruins and distracts it if there's text everywhere. Subtitles are meant for translating, not for adding.
Respectican 2 years ago
Woops, I said the same thing twice.
Oh well xD
Respectican 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Translator notes are good, and fansubs are far better than any DVD subs.
Maybe not if you're a bro or something and don't like to read. Quality fansubs have better translations than official DVD releases as well.
seanmcc05 2 years ago
wrong answer
chibigatts 2 years ago 2
then why they don't translate words as "sama" "one-chan" "oji-sama" etc.....
chibigatts 2 years ago
nice japanese, sounds exactly like one of the 6 total types of character voices heard in every anime ever made.
niggerinnis 2 years ago
Clueless about anime voices eh?
DrakkhenToku 2 years ago
I think that unless you understand Japanese fluently, you can't really say that. Unless you were referring to their personalities, there are overused personalities in most types of storytelling. Ignore DrakkhenTrollku, everyone here is an idiot to him.
aneurysm2009 2 years ago
Nope, just the people such as yourself who think fansubbers are gods for leaving stuff in the golden language that is japanese.
DrakkhenToku 2 years ago
Your talking out your ass. I've never stated I value fansubbers in that way. I've only made it clear that I can't stand people like yourself. Why do you feel the need to be a complete douchebag to anybody without the same opinion as your own?
aneurysm2009 2 years ago 2
search for "Greg Ayres anime detour fansubbing" on youtube and in 1 or 2 of those videos I argued with an ass named DrunkSamurai. Hell, before I knew he was on youtube, he acted like a child, taking my words and being technical about it on the "What are your views on Piracy" thread on the Myanimelist website!
Trust me dude, I feel your frustration.
Hypeathon 2 years ago