Well done Ms Lucas !! Well spoken !! Tories and Lib Dems unmasked !! GREEN PARTY is only way !! I hope by 2015 there are 20 Green MPs !!! More MPs like you !!!
@moodini99 - how exactly has she failed to use logic or rationale? Sure, you can write what you want on here and no-one's stopping you, but you won't win many people over without backing up your statements with examples.
@moodini99 - care to elaborate? So far they're the only party that hasn't gone against their pre-election manifesto (and that includes Labour). Caroline is doing an excellent job as leader and as an MP, and I expect they'll do much better next time around.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Idiotic trouble makers like this women don't deserve reason, because she is incapable of using logic or rationale. I can leave whichever comments I see fit.
@moodini99 She isn't causing trouble without reason. Trouble should be caused where nessecery or anything that the government wants would be able to get through, and they do not always act in the best interests of the public. Saying that people like this do not deserve reason is like saying people like this do not deserve to be reasoned with, therefore you expect them to just listen to you without reason. Do you really think people should be sheep?
The system isn't unfair, nor is it unequal. think of all the post-graduates that earn between £15,000 and £20,999, now they won't have the pay back any loans. It is much better for them. With all these new, worthless degrees, like media, social science etc, there are plenty of post-grads that don't earn £21,000 - these changes are better for them. And that is reason.
Also, many people don't understand the gravity of the current economy. Education is one of may sectors being cut!
@moodini99 Education is a right and shouldn't be affected by economic situation, but because capitalism relies so heavily on monetary values, it appears that even human rights are distorted in order to keep money flowing..
Anyway, someone from a family with savings of £50,000 will not have to pay a dime (themselves - their family is paying for them - unless their family make them pay), so to the student personally, the education will be free. Not the same story for someone from a poor fam.
A right? fuck that. Everyone gets plenty of free education. From 5 until 18. There is nobody who will be stopped from going to Uni. In fact, Uni is now more acessible. Post-grads earning between 15 and 21 grand can now go to uni without fear of being lumbered with debt they can't pay back. The poorest benefit. There is no such thing as 'rights'!
So what if a family has £50,000 savings. that is their money. It has nothing to do with a bunch of greedy teenagers. Everyone can afford to go to Uni!
@moodini99 If the family has £50,000 they will most likely help out with their offsprings educational fee's. Those families with a lot of money will take the burden of debt off of their offspring. £21,000 is not a golden limit which suddenly equates to a perfect life. What about the people just over £21,000? Why should they have to pay towards their education when someone just under £21,000 doesn't? They shouldn't, which is why all education should be free to avoid all of this inequality.
So what if some family has £50,000. Millions of families have far less than the poorest British families. I don't see poor students dividing all their money between the starving. It's childishly greedy. People survive on a hell of a lot less than £21,000 a year, and they have far greater loans to pay back. I certainly do. You are so greedy, it's mad.
What else do you want, a free car? A free swimming pool?
University is not free, and there is nothing that you, or anyone else, can do about it!
@moodini99 I do not want any material goods for free. They should be worked for. Education is not a material good. If someone has the ability, they should be able to do it and earn according to their ability, regardless of how much money they have.
It's when money that has not been worked for by the beneficery is used i.e. family paying students debts for them, that there is a problem.
Education costs money, just like material goods. It doesn't matter if you want a free degree or not, it will cost you, or anyone who earns in excess of £21,000. You say that 'if someone has the ability, they should be able to do it'. That is ridiculous, because, with these modern degrees, everyone, bar those with learning difficulties, has the ability. This money you speak of has been worked for, and these families can do with it what they like, including giving it to their children Just greed!
@moodini99 I have no problem with a family helping their child. Is it not greedy that someone at any one point in time has money which they do not need, whether it has been worked for or not? If someone has worked very hard in their life and has made a positive contribution to society, then yes they should be allowed to survive and have a good quality of life etc. But when they start to accumulate money which they do not need for them to survive, e.g. enough to buy a mansion, it becomes greedy.
@moodini99 Also, inheritance helps keep the money in the family. This means someone could live off of their parents saving and have a comfortable life without hacing to work at all. That's not very fair and is rather arrogant, thinking that they can live without contributing to society.
If uni was like used to be, there would be no need for these changes. The amount of people going to uni has increased massively, as have the variety of degrees that have no significant benefit on society or the economy. A degree's worth can be rationally quantified.
There is nothing wrong with someone living off of their family's money. The family can do what they like with their money. Those without rich families are incredibly fortunate in the grand scheme of things. It is selfish to compain.
@moodini99 I suppose it's fair if you think that because a family worked hard, their child should reap the benefits of it despite perhaps themselves not working at all. I still think it's be lazy to live off of your family and give nothing back to society, much the same as it is lazy for those who are capable of working, and could find employment if they tried, to live off of the state.
Living from your parents wealth may not be very enriching or character building, but it is in a whole different league to people refusing to work so that they can sponge from hard working tax-payers. These people really are scum. It is the same reason why I feel the same about some students. Many students only do these pointless degress (humanities, Media etc) because they don't want to get a job and be an adult. Effectively, these people are the same as the dole-scum that refuse to contribute!
@moodini99 I understand what you're saying. It's not just media and such degree's that are costing lots of money. It's the useful ones too. I don't have a problem with any student, whatever they are going to take, protesting, because it will help change things not only for themselves but for everyone, including those degree's which are actually useful. I agree with you that people should have jobs which are useful and enable people to contribute to society.
But it won't help change anything. It will just cost money. Public damage and police hours are very costly. If the protests escalate, the police will start using more barbaric measures, and they are well within their rights to do so. The protesting is all in aid of returning to the old system, which is much worse.
Like I said before, these changes aren't ruthless. Many people live well on far less than £21,000, and have bigger loans too. It's perfectly managable. There is no need for these caps
@moodini99 'No one can do everything, but everyone can do something'. In this system that we are in atm, many things are unfair and wrong. The very existance of children living in poverty in a "developed country" is evidence of this. It's clever what the current system does. It hides the wrongs in plain sight.
This does go off of the topic of tuition fee's, but perhaps these protests will start the begining of realisation. It may be unlikely that things will change, but not impossible.
There are virtually no children living in poverty in the U.K. Not real poverty. Like I say, people are so greedy that they think they are living in poverty, just because they compare themself with the rich. They should compare their lives with people in other countries, who live in actual poverty. Then they may have a bit of gratitude.
The only things that these protests are highlghting is that there a lot of greedy teens. Wasting tax money on daft degrees that could be used to reduced poverty.
@moodini99 Well, there's a certain quality of life that all should have (providing they contribute to society), but it isn't fair that children from poor families do not have the same oppertunities as those from the rich. You can say all you like that they do, but they don't. As long as there is competition between schools, there will always be that gap. The better schools/unis cost more money, indirectly. E.g. houses are more expensive near better schools, once again favouring the rich.
@moodini99 I agree that the poverty certainly isnt on as big of a scale as in other countries, and not as severe. Poverty is still poverty none-the-less.
Statistics show that those from poorer familes do not get such skilled jobs when they are older. Those are statistics presented by the government.
I don't think that those statistics are necessarily an indication of inequality. It's just that those from poorer backgrounds don't seem interested in education. It isn't that they don't have the oppertunity. I remember well from school that those from poor families - well, most of them - didn't care for education.
I don't know why it is, but, in general, people from families don't try hard enough to reach higher education. They attend the same schools, the same sylabus etc.
@moodini99 The why is a big debate. Some say it's because the parents don't pay enough interest in their childs education, some say this then makes the child careless so they do bad. Others say the poor living conditions i.e. damp flats and noisey neighbours affect concentration at home for homework (being just one of the problems ontop of many others). Some think that because the stresses of poorer families (poor housing, crime in area) education is not seen as a priority.
@moodini99 Something which supports the higher stresses argument is divorce rates are the highest in working class families, which could be a consequence of these higher stresses. I'm not entirely sure of the reasons either tbh, but I don't think it's right to just look at the what, (the "what", being: 'poor people don't care about their education', and ignore the possible reasons. If reasons are identified, children may care about their education. However capitalism relies on a working class...
@moodini99 Now whether that working class is in the same country is not nessecery now (global communication is now much easier). On a global scale, the UK, USA etc, could be seen as the higher class, and the countries where we get imports from, the working class - cheap labour.
I voted for libdems one the one basis that free education.. not for me, i've paid and i'm doing mine now, but for my little sister who is 10 and wants to be a vet
It was the tories' rich friends who caused the recession. They should pay for it, not the poor. But, of course, they don't want to do that. It'll mean they have one less pleasure barge to eat swan on. :\
Well done Ms Lucas !! Well spoken !! Tories and Lib Dems unmasked !! GREEN PARTY is only way !! I hope by 2015 there are 20 Green MPs !!! More MPs like you !!!
davisgreen2020 1 year ago
Note that all Young Greens (people under 30 and students) can join up for FREE for a limited time on the green party website!
rustam92 1 year ago
@moodini99 - how exactly has she failed to use logic or rationale? Sure, you can write what you want on here and no-one's stopping you, but you won't win many people over without backing up your statements with examples.
wysedragonfly 1 year ago 2
This would have been all the more excellent had there been a spoffle available.
Emmanovi 1 year ago
@moodini99 I don't follow. Support for the Green Party is rising and will rise further after the betrayal of the Liberal Democrats.
mikish23 1 year ago
@moodini99 - care to elaborate? So far they're the only party that hasn't gone against their pre-election manifesto (and that includes Labour). Caroline is doing an excellent job as leader and as an MP, and I expect they'll do much better next time around.
wysedragonfly 1 year ago 11
This comment has received too many negative votes show
This women is a moron, The green party are a joke. What a daft, ignorant bitch.
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 Sorry, how is she ignorant?
hmmmmm1988 1 year ago
@moodini99 Don't be so dogmatic. If you are going to comment, at least try and give valid reasoning.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Idiotic trouble makers like this women don't deserve reason, because she is incapable of using logic or rationale. I can leave whichever comments I see fit.
moodini99 1 year ago
I can only see one idiotic troublemaker on this page, @moodini99 - and that's you!
leoninelives 1 year ago 5
If you don't like the comments, don't read them. The green party waste everyone's time. They are a nuisance. This is clearly above your head.
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 She isn't causing trouble without reason. Trouble should be caused where nessecery or anything that the government wants would be able to get through, and they do not always act in the best interests of the public. Saying that people like this do not deserve reason is like saying people like this do not deserve to be reasoned with, therefore you expect them to just listen to you without reason. Do you really think people should be sheep?
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
The system isn't unfair, nor is it unequal. think of all the post-graduates that earn between £15,000 and £20,999, now they won't have the pay back any loans. It is much better for them. With all these new, worthless degrees, like media, social science etc, there are plenty of post-grads that don't earn £21,000 - these changes are better for them. And that is reason.
Also, many people don't understand the gravity of the current economy. Education is one of may sectors being cut!
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 Education is a right and shouldn't be affected by economic situation, but because capitalism relies so heavily on monetary values, it appears that even human rights are distorted in order to keep money flowing..
Anyway, someone from a family with savings of £50,000 will not have to pay a dime (themselves - their family is paying for them - unless their family make them pay), so to the student personally, the education will be free. Not the same story for someone from a poor fam.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
A right? fuck that. Everyone gets plenty of free education. From 5 until 18. There is nobody who will be stopped from going to Uni. In fact, Uni is now more acessible. Post-grads earning between 15 and 21 grand can now go to uni without fear of being lumbered with debt they can't pay back. The poorest benefit. There is no such thing as 'rights'!
So what if a family has £50,000 savings. that is their money. It has nothing to do with a bunch of greedy teenagers. Everyone can afford to go to Uni!
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 If the family has £50,000 they will most likely help out with their offsprings educational fee's. Those families with a lot of money will take the burden of debt off of their offspring. £21,000 is not a golden limit which suddenly equates to a perfect life. What about the people just over £21,000? Why should they have to pay towards their education when someone just under £21,000 doesn't? They shouldn't, which is why all education should be free to avoid all of this inequality.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
So what if some family has £50,000. Millions of families have far less than the poorest British families. I don't see poor students dividing all their money between the starving. It's childishly greedy. People survive on a hell of a lot less than £21,000 a year, and they have far greater loans to pay back. I certainly do. You are so greedy, it's mad.
What else do you want, a free car? A free swimming pool?
University is not free, and there is nothing that you, or anyone else, can do about it!
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 I do not want any material goods for free. They should be worked for. Education is not a material good. If someone has the ability, they should be able to do it and earn according to their ability, regardless of how much money they have.
It's when money that has not been worked for by the beneficery is used i.e. family paying students debts for them, that there is a problem.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
Education costs money, just like material goods. It doesn't matter if you want a free degree or not, it will cost you, or anyone who earns in excess of £21,000. You say that 'if someone has the ability, they should be able to do it'. That is ridiculous, because, with these modern degrees, everyone, bar those with learning difficulties, has the ability. This money you speak of has been worked for, and these families can do with it what they like, including giving it to their children Just greed!
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 I have no problem with a family helping their child. Is it not greedy that someone at any one point in time has money which they do not need, whether it has been worked for or not? If someone has worked very hard in their life and has made a positive contribution to society, then yes they should be allowed to survive and have a good quality of life etc. But when they start to accumulate money which they do not need for them to survive, e.g. enough to buy a mansion, it becomes greedy.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
@moodini99 Also, inheritance helps keep the money in the family. This means someone could live off of their parents saving and have a comfortable life without hacing to work at all. That's not very fair and is rather arrogant, thinking that they can live without contributing to society.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
If uni was like used to be, there would be no need for these changes. The amount of people going to uni has increased massively, as have the variety of degrees that have no significant benefit on society or the economy. A degree's worth can be rationally quantified.
There is nothing wrong with someone living off of their family's money. The family can do what they like with their money. Those without rich families are incredibly fortunate in the grand scheme of things. It is selfish to compain.
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 I suppose it's fair if you think that because a family worked hard, their child should reap the benefits of it despite perhaps themselves not working at all. I still think it's be lazy to live off of your family and give nothing back to society, much the same as it is lazy for those who are capable of working, and could find employment if they tried, to live off of the state.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
Living from your parents wealth may not be very enriching or character building, but it is in a whole different league to people refusing to work so that they can sponge from hard working tax-payers. These people really are scum. It is the same reason why I feel the same about some students. Many students only do these pointless degress (humanities, Media etc) because they don't want to get a job and be an adult. Effectively, these people are the same as the dole-scum that refuse to contribute!
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 I understand what you're saying. It's not just media and such degree's that are costing lots of money. It's the useful ones too. I don't have a problem with any student, whatever they are going to take, protesting, because it will help change things not only for themselves but for everyone, including those degree's which are actually useful. I agree with you that people should have jobs which are useful and enable people to contribute to society.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
But it won't help change anything. It will just cost money. Public damage and police hours are very costly. If the protests escalate, the police will start using more barbaric measures, and they are well within their rights to do so. The protesting is all in aid of returning to the old system, which is much worse.
Like I said before, these changes aren't ruthless. Many people live well on far less than £21,000, and have bigger loans too. It's perfectly managable. There is no need for these caps
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 'No one can do everything, but everyone can do something'. In this system that we are in atm, many things are unfair and wrong. The very existance of children living in poverty in a "developed country" is evidence of this. It's clever what the current system does. It hides the wrongs in plain sight.
This does go off of the topic of tuition fee's, but perhaps these protests will start the begining of realisation. It may be unlikely that things will change, but not impossible.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
There are virtually no children living in poverty in the U.K. Not real poverty. Like I say, people are so greedy that they think they are living in poverty, just because they compare themself with the rich. They should compare their lives with people in other countries, who live in actual poverty. Then they may have a bit of gratitude.
The only things that these protests are highlghting is that there a lot of greedy teens. Wasting tax money on daft degrees that could be used to reduced poverty.
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 Well, there's a certain quality of life that all should have (providing they contribute to society), but it isn't fair that children from poor families do not have the same oppertunities as those from the rich. You can say all you like that they do, but they don't. As long as there is competition between schools, there will always be that gap. The better schools/unis cost more money, indirectly. E.g. houses are more expensive near better schools, once again favouring the rich.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
@moodini99 I agree that the poverty certainly isnt on as big of a scale as in other countries, and not as severe. Poverty is still poverty none-the-less.
Statistics show that those from poorer familes do not get such skilled jobs when they are older. Those are statistics presented by the government.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
I don't think that those statistics are necessarily an indication of inequality. It's just that those from poorer backgrounds don't seem interested in education. It isn't that they don't have the oppertunity. I remember well from school that those from poor families - well, most of them - didn't care for education.
I don't know why it is, but, in general, people from families don't try hard enough to reach higher education. They attend the same schools, the same sylabus etc.
moodini99 1 year ago
@moodini99 The why is a big debate. Some say it's because the parents don't pay enough interest in their childs education, some say this then makes the child careless so they do bad. Others say the poor living conditions i.e. damp flats and noisey neighbours affect concentration at home for homework (being just one of the problems ontop of many others). Some think that because the stresses of poorer families (poor housing, crime in area) education is not seen as a priority.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
@moodini99 Something which supports the higher stresses argument is divorce rates are the highest in working class families, which could be a consequence of these higher stresses. I'm not entirely sure of the reasons either tbh, but I don't think it's right to just look at the what, (the "what", being: 'poor people don't care about their education', and ignore the possible reasons. If reasons are identified, children may care about their education. However capitalism relies on a working class...
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
@moodini99 Now whether that working class is in the same country is not nessecery now (global communication is now much easier). On a global scale, the UK, USA etc, could be seen as the higher class, and the countries where we get imports from, the working class - cheap labour.
DeanoProductionsTM 1 year ago
Point for point she is absolutely bang on the mark.
smartverity 1 year ago 3
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I voted for libdems one the one basis that free education.. not for me, i've paid and i'm doing mine now, but for my little sister who is 10 and wants to be a vet
now
i should of gone green
himaro101 1 year ago 5
Comment removed
himaro101 1 year ago
I <3 Caroline. I want to move to Brighton so that she can be my local MP!
Adreamofhoney 1 year ago 3
you should have the right to smash the place up as well. (sarcasm)
kidlewis 1 year ago
@kidlewis
cynicism
divinacomedias 1 year ago
@divinacomedias so who were they? anarchists? anti capitalists?
kidlewis 1 year ago
@kidlewis who were who? (Go Caroline!)
allalexia 1 year ago
@allalexia the protesters smashing up london, pissing on Churchills statue and swinging from the Cenotaph.
kidlewis 1 year ago
@kidlewis
The same fraction of troublemakers as in the police or any other large group...
divinacomedias 1 year ago
@kidlewis Anarchists im guessing. They're good at getting on the telly.
Caroline explicitly supports non-violent protests though
allalexia 1 year ago 2
@allalexia she never said that she does support the violence etc, she supports the message.
drunkalfuzzyness 1 year ago
@drunkalfuzzyness That's what I said. She supports the non-violent protests.
allalexia 1 year ago
@allalexia yeah, sorry, just backing you up there ;]
drunkalfuzzyness 1 year ago
Yes, YES Caroline! You are so right about all of that!! IM voting GREEN PARTY when the time comes!! I hope the rest of the youth will!
Keep up the amazing work Lucas!!
drunkalfuzzyness 1 year ago 13
It was the tories' rich friends who caused the recession. They should pay for it, not the poor. But, of course, they don't want to do that. It'll mean they have one less pleasure barge to eat swan on. :\
David Thatcher, education snatcher.
JoelCornah 1 year ago 2
@JoelCornah You don't think the Federal Reserve had any part to play?
Totter7 1 year ago
@Totter7 You don't think the conservatives have rich friends in the federal reserve?
JoelCornah 1 year ago
@JoelCornah Well, which conservatives?
Totter7 1 year ago