Natural Dog Training, What Natural Means in Terms of Energy and Training

[PrometheansFire]

"I" don't have a theory, I am pointing out that your funny ideas are not consistent with the scientific observations of animal behavior or our understanding of cognition, learning theory, ethology, physics, chemistry, biology.

[sebjohns]

This is pretty ridiculous. How can you not have a theory and challenge someone else's? If you didn't have a theory, you wouldn't have anything to dispute. How would you even know what was false? This is just mindless attacking. People need to be more open to new ideas and for some reason, that seems to be very difficult to do in the dog-world.

[PrometheansFire]

What is ridiculous is to believe a guy with no scientific training and want to throw out the work of every biologist, psychologist, and even physicists without questioning his data.

These ideas fly in the face of our current understanding of nature.

[quantumcanine]

You do have a theory and you can't defend it.

[quantumcanine]

Your argument is that cats manifest the same degree of noise phobias as dogs. That is a shaky foundation for your theory.

[PrometheansFire]

You are once again trying to derail the issue with useless observations. "I" don't have a theory, I am pointing out that your funny ideas are not consistent with the scientific observations of animal behavior or our understanding of cognition, learning theory, ethology, physics, chemistry, biology.

[quantumcanine]

So you are willing to rest your argument on the supposition that cats manifest in equal measure as dogs, the syndrome of becoming inconsolably distraught, prone to flinging themselves off of high rise patios, hours and sometime days before an approaching thunderstorm? Also, your scientific background has certainly equipped you to a high level of discourse.

[PrometheansFire]

You are the one making false assertions in the vain hope of propping up your ideas. I am merely pointing out that the arguments you present are patently false.

[quantumcanine]

Why are you afraid to venture a theory for why so many domestic dogs but not domestic cats, to limit the scope of the inquiry for your benefit, are afraid of thunderstorms? You don't seem to have anything to say.

[PrometheansFire]

Another lie. Cats are also afraid of storms and end up hiding in closets.

[quantumcanine]

If gene-driven theory of behavior is correct, it should be impossible for any police dog to bypass breeding opportunity, not to mention that all police dogs bred for the work bypass mating opportunity. Only dogs are capable of becoming bereft days before a thunderstorm whereas no animal, no matter how frightened by nearby strikes, generalizes this fear to the "time" horizon. I do have answers to these paradoxes. Meanwhile you see sun rise and fall, conclude geocentric, and have no questions.

[PrometheansFire]

Your persistence to think it's all of nothing, is part of the reason you are so confused. These absurd illogical arguments fail to make any point. It is also a lie about the thunderstorm. Do you have any documented, statistcally valid evidence to back up you claim.... NO YOU DON'T.

[quantumcanine]

Because the science on dogs doesn't add up. Why do only domestic dogs, not cats, not lions, not wolves, not horses, become hysterically upset by the approach of thunderstorms, even though all these animals are afraid of the crack of nearby thunder? This should be easy if dogs are all figured out.

Describe quantitatively why a well-bred police dog would rather do bite work then breed with a female dog in full estrus.

[PrometheansFire]

You haven't brought up any point that doesn't add up, merely questions to which you don't have an answer to.

Dogs do not become hysterically, some dogs dog. Just as some horses, some sheep, and in you will find most mammals have a fearful response to a sudden loud noise.

Once again you've wrongly assumed that what you perceive as incompleteness translates into incorrectness.

Your use of absolutes is also false. Some police dogs may bypass mating for bitework, some may not.

[PrometheansFire]

You are using energy as a metaphor. The way it is used in science can be described quantitatively. In fact, the meaning of 'energy' is not even consistent throughout the videos. You can observe the actions or you can use various diagnostics tools to observe the dog's brain.

Ethologists and pyschologists can already adequately explain the dog's actions - to a degree.

Why is it that non-scientists always think they can do science better?

[quantumcanine]

I am using the term as science uses it, as an "action potential." This allows me to explain behavior and investigate inside the dog's mind as an energy circuit while behaviorists and biologists are constrained to describing behavior in terms of human reason and thoughts. An energy approach is scientific, the latter approach is anthropomorphic.

[PrometheansFire]

Dude "energy" means nothing. What's with all the metaphysics? Trainers that base their methods on actual science (i.e NATURE) can describe their methods using concrete, descriptive language.