What Palestine needs is an armed revolution it needs to drive all Israeli soldiers and "settlers" out of its territory!I hope the Palestinian people rise up to take their nation back! One day Palestine will be free again!!!
@mouradnrd dude before you espouse your conspiracies learn English and don't be so rude and vulgar. Israeli soldiers do not intentionally kill innocent civilians. I know this, I also know that if we shoot innocents we would go to jail. Don't believe the Arab propaganda.
@kithp wtf are you talking about explain how these ppl are dying and becoming wounded, what of the testimonies from the few decent politicians, hospital workers, human rights activists civilians former israeli soldiers...are they all just making this up? ...your fooling yourself man...
@RustyRocktopus People die in war. Especially when one side is fighting from areas with loads of civilians! Sad but true. Even people like Goldstone admitted they were wrong because sure at first glamce it would appear that Israelis must be really awful, until they bother to fully look into the whole story. but my friend don't be foolish, open your mind to what is really happening.
@kithp thats the thing man, i am looking into it, anyone can see whats happening here is horrible...war crimes are being commited with no regulations...white phosphorus, the death of civillians, palestine, and even US and UK human rights activists are dying...the floatilla incident, US liberty, illegal settlements, theyve water and land blockade without legal war, just one look at a map of terriroty over the last 40 yrs or so tells all...the wall is illegal...Zionism is anti-semetic...
@RustyRocktopus listen naming all these things does not prove anything, u can believe what u want, but the truth is that yes civilians die in war. Thats why both sides need to make peace. But Israel is not intentionally killing civilians and your foolish for believing that. The wall has saved countless lives, Walls can be taken down lives can not be returned. I'm open to discussing any of the above issues you mentioned to see whose at fault, but only if u have an open mind. not an agenda.
@kithp of course listing incedents helps prove a point, its the only way to prove a point...and im not saying ALL IDF soldiers are killing civilians intentionallty but there have been numerous account of alot doing so...and im not at all saying one side deserves that land over another, thats not my place, but what i am saying is that Israel IS in control and have no interest in peace, and that much is evident to me...if you'd like to discuss an issue start with the Use of white phosophorus...
@RustyRocktopus listing incedents means nothing, discussing them and proving what actually hapened means a great deal. There will always be rotten apples in any army, but as a rule IDF soldiers DO NOT intentionally kill innocents. If they do wrong they get tried in court. I know many IDF soldiers. These are young boys who would rather be in the beach or ball game. Israel has a HUGE interest in peace, R U crazy??? Talk to some more Israelis! Israel is ready to talk, Pal's make preconditions.
OK white phosphorus: The IDF’s use of smoke projectiles during the Gaza war were intended to disorient and neutralize Hamas’s anti-tank squads deployed in urban areas, by obscuring their field of view. Smoke screening, including smoke obscurants containing white phosphorous, is widely used in militaries worldwide and is not considered to be indiscriminate weapon.
@kithp ...and i am doing my best to keep an open mind, ive been doing nothing recently but looking into the whats going on over there, and over and over it points to Israel with the exception of a few incidents...my only agenda is human rights and peace...
@RustyRocktopus I must question where you get your information from, I will give you the benifit of the doubt, even though I have seen clearly numerous others who claim to be for human rights clearly taking sides and not being interested in what the other side has to say. I'm happy to discuss this with you incident by incident and I hope you will really consider all possibilities and not be swayed by emotions or propoganda.
@kithp well i do my best to not be swayed by propaganda i try to get as much info from as many places as possible but im sorry i will be swayed by emotion as this is why i argue this topic in the first place, i belive whats being done is wrong and that is based on my own logic and my own emotions...and i belive that Netanyahu has no real interest in peace with the palestinians other than the israeli people in control of As much of israel as possible...they see it more or less as a game o risk
its not just a case of "more palestinian deaths" (most from hamas). 1st its a matter of approach, when i was a child there it was during a time that palestinians were grabbing children from their mothers in the street&stabbing them. meanwhile a commander i knew went to court bcoz he shot a palestinian that threw a molotov cocktail at him&turned to run, the bullet entered thru the guy's back so the commander was charged for shooting an unarmed person trying to escape- IDF protocol in practice
the problem is that one could not testify this story. All this palestinians could work for hamas by will or by force. How could this medic knew that it was the special forces who attacked him?
@Bellvista2 the reason is becuase this isnt the only one...fine, if we were to assume they did make all this up, there are many many more accounts of actions such as these...the bodies dont lie, the demolished buildings and hospitals dont lie...maps dont lie...and your fooling yourself if you think this is all being perpetuated and falsified by palestinian people...
Arabs first lie to the world and themselves and after begin to believe to their lie. This is a road to nowhere. And it will not help them. Live your illusions...
Qur'an 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe in Allah or the Last Day, who do not forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, or acknowledge the Religion of Truth (Islam), (even if they are) People of the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jizyah tribute tax in submission, feeling themselves subdued and brought low." [Another translation says:] "pay the tax in acknowledgment of our superiority and their state of subjection."
the torture everyone who has the balls to stand against them. hmmm moses,, religious meaning, the burning bush has spoken. new president watch american gangstar, and welcome to america
the fool the soldiers to fight a war,, spreading their empire.
I guarantee my relatives did not fight WWII for the purpose of replacing one bunch of abusive egomaniacs waving Swastikas around with another bunch of equally abusive egomaniacs waving a Star of David!!!
The situation of Arabs in Judea, Samaria and Gaza is far better than the image that media present, & their gross domestic product and, life expectancy are among the highest in the Arab world, the Asian Times reported.
Calling their situation hopeless but not serious, the newspapers columnist Spengler wrote on Tuesday that the gross domestic product in Judea, Samaria & Gaza is $3,380 per person, higher than in Egypt, Jordan & Syria....
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Fucking liars, complete liars, that singin thing that the boy was telling? Does anyone believe that shit? I went into this fucking war, I know the IDF, and trust me, we don't roll like that, we just don't. LIARS! LIARS! LIARS!
"If the whole or part of the population of an occupied territory" ( = PALESTINIANS) "is inadequately supplied, the Occupying Power" (=ISRAEL) "shall agree to relief schemes on behalf of the said population, and shall facilitate them by all the means at its disposal.(...)"
When it's not Help that Rots outside of Gaza, it's a state of siege strangling any hope, and it's the situation that Israel's gvt seems to let rot ... on purpose.
this is bullshit.....the real truth is that hamas uses the civilins as human shields and thats why women and children are dying...and hamas launches rockets in order to kill inocent people...i feel bad for the women and children but its all hamas fault we all want peace israelies and palestinians nobody wants a war except hamas that haits us just because we are israelies
jews are cowards that like to kill and maim defenseless starving Palestinians.Israel is the most powerful military in the Middle East has nuclear missiles,jets,tanks,drones,etc. and gets billions of $ every year from the US tax payers.America should cut off all $ and weapons to the terrorist state of Israel !
The War On Gaza Wasn't A War On Gaza. It Was A war against Muslims Blood,muslim dignety,muslim prouds,muslim religion places. Israel is the crime of the Univers now. Anticriest fucked thier heads.
About sides, the fact that everybody has the Right to "defend" himself or his people from attacks, Palestinians are living under occupation and control of an enemy: Israel. To prevent undue use of force in front of an evident right of resistance, there are international Laws. Israel may play victim, but is the clear agressor, and use daily incredible force to crash palestinians, ethnic cleanse the place and occupy 100% of Palestine (West Bank + Gaza are the last 20%, occupied to more than 50%)
Have u actually see an Israel news? because this is exactly whats happening here. Listen, They know the consequences of kidnapping a soldier and shooting rockets into Israel. I'm not saying that we are perfectly right but I'm that u need to find more sources. Have u ever heard of human shield? we'll Hamas are very are very good with it. The only reason that so many civilians dies in Gaza is because the are so stupid...they actually help the Hamas and takes all the risks.
They have a right to fight back, simple as that. I know you belive Israel is "defending" themself. I know you truly belive that all Palistinians is worth less, and personally you and people like you dont differentiate between terrorists and civilians. That is because you´r propaganda works, and because the word terrorist is perverted and being labeled on anyone who is fighting back. People that are helping Palistinian children and bringing AID to Palistine is now being labeled TERRORIST.
The ISRAELI side? We see the Israeli side EVERY DAY on CNN, MSNBC, ABC, BBC, SKY and FOX. What we are watching now is the side that the other networks not dare show us... but to be fair to the "Israeli side" I'll quote DAVID BEN-GURION the first Prime Minister of Israel when he said "We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population. The plain and simple fact is that ZIONISM = RACISM
blah blah blah blah blah blah blah hey heres a thought for you and you gaza living terroist buddy SSSSSSTTTTTTTTTTTTTTOOOOOOOOOOOPPPPPPPP firing rockets in to israel and killing women and children dumb shits fucking dumb ass god how hard is this for you to understand numb nuts stop killing israel women and children and they will leave gaza alone
Just as the SAS did (and got caught!) in Basra. My god how brainwashed must the good, honest, decent Israeli's be for allowing this shit....constantly. Ignorance is not, nor ever has been, an excuse.
Good guess, you start to catch up, but you still need to learn. Mossad was funding Hamas in it's beginnings, since they wanted to have a radicalized Islamic opponent on the Palestinian side they can sell off to the world as a terrorist organization to justify their warlike measures against the indigenous population. A secular peaceful opposition was the anathema they feared much more than a handful of dead soldiers and civilians, since they had no countermeasures against such form of resistance
I think if Mossad were the ones firing rockets, they would have explosives in them. There is no proof for what you said. To say that would be to say there is no resistance in Gaza that fires any rockets.
@trollfinger Those who fire those rockets aren't any resistance only agents provocateurs. Neither do IDF have any evidence who is behind those rockets. People in Gaza, who have their lives destroyed by IDF never get to see any proof of being guilty, no trial, no evidence and no chance to argue.
To apply the Likud Charter, voted by Israeli, and which is the Party in Power, Charter which says it want 100% , all the land, it is simply as clear as talking about "Vital Space" (remember the word ?)
Ethnic cleansing began more than 60 years ago, is being done every day (every home, field, destroyed, every Palestinian killed or harmed is a point of the plan) and this will happen, again and again if International Community let Israel follow the political programm they chose.
no your an antisemite because less than 3k palestinian civilians have been killed in a war with israel in which hamas hides behind women and children IN THE LAST 10 YEARS. And you have the nerve to call them nazis, the jordanians killed 20k pals in 11 days during black september, how many died in the recent sri lankan war?, 5.5 million killed in the congo since 98, 500k in darfur since 2003, and the israelis are nazis to you?? thats why your antisemitic
Congressional members with dual American / Israeli Citizenships are TRAITORS, they need to be lined up against a wall and SHOT..!!
Israel / Zionist Jews are the Blood Sucking Parasites of the World. They are nothing more then Leeches feeding on Humanity and sucking the life out of Mankind.
The sooner this World is rid of them the better we all will be.
As occupied people under enemy control they should be protected by the international community, as laws exist for this kind of case. And human law which is not applied is violation of humanity.
The fact that war is a shame in itself, that so much money is used to kill, that children are dying troughout the world, everything, the misery, catastrophes are important points too but ...when you defend humanism and remain upright there is no need to open more fires so your fumes won't be seen.
there is no occupation in gaza, their gov chooses to attack israel, then hides in mosques, hospitals and schools and fire rockets from these places,
israel can attack any of these places according to intl
its not like they are just occupied people who israel kills for fun, they attack israel and you people just think israel should around and do nothing,
but look, hamas stopped firing rockets at israel after cast lead,
its sad but its the only way they would stop shooting rockets
UNICEF and the FAO released alarming reports about the situation of the children, and of the women, pregnant who need special care too. Of course, rob, you won't see them miscarry their baby,die too young
For your information, Civilians under enemy control (Gen Con IV) should be able to work (they're deprieved of this right 52) and in front of this violation other articles state that if all should be protected, children and pregnant women should receive special attention (16) and rations (55)
this is bullshit, google lauren booth, she went to gaza and then went on numerous television channels calling gaza a concentration camp, she was then photographed at a fully stocked supermarket, with a nicer computer at the checkout counter then my supermarket in america, she was buying enough food to last her a week, she was then also photographed at a feast, later that day as well
the pals smuggled lions through the tunnels for their zoo, they have enough food, look her up
I don't understand your answer. She went there to put some light on the blokade of Gaza last summer. And ?
I mean, do you imply that my sources, UNICEF, FAO from this year are less accurate than your old tunes ?
But I smile seing that you're conscious that these tunnels are much needed to eat.
What you would know, if your read wrmea or other sources than Jerusalem Post is that these tunnels imposed by the siege are like the icing of the cake : they finish to kill the local economy...
no it goes to you that everyone has their own agenda, she likened gaza to a concentration camp and then was photographed at a feast, and in a fully stocked supermarket the same day, they didnt have those things in auschwitz, at the same time she lies she triviliazes things like the holocaust and darfur
About Starvation, I answered you just one page ago.
Do you want me to copy-paste my answer about the incidious and silent ravages of malnutrition ?
Even "European Jews for a Just Peace" signed an appeal in 2006 ! before all this, asking people to open their eyes "Against the oppression and starvation of Palestinian people".
For Auschwitz to tell you the truth, I don't like either the image. But with Varsaw ghetto, yes. Surely. And it's horrible enough.
malnutrition? now we are talking malnutrition, millions starve to death in africa every yr and we are talking about malnutrition???
what do you want israel to do you tell me, you think they like occupying these lands, they tried to give gaza to egypt for free in 81, egypt declined, they left a few yrs ago, now they shoot rockets,
if they left gaza and wb tommorow with not occupation, they would never stop till they destroyed israel, what would you have israel do, tell me id love to know
Gaza malnutrition: "The UN Childrens Fund (UNICEF) said in January that 10.3 percent of children under five are stunted (low height for age), a steadily increasing trend over recent years."
"the significant increase" is concerning.
"65 percent of children aged 9-12 months, and 35 percent of pregnant women are anaemic."
irinnews(dot)org/
search for : Gaza malnutrition
PS : Iron is good for blood cells, oxygenation of cells are essential for the brain, the nervous system, etc...
Malawi is facing its worst food crisis in 50 years. The hunger and malnutrition inflicting some 20 million Africans is the result of severe droughts that dried crops and floods that destroyed much of what survived in countries already wrought with economic instability.
thats in 1 african country, yet the pals get more aid while they can have peace with israel in one second, why?
hahaha how many bombs? 3k civilians killed in 10 yrs of war in which hamas admits to using human shields, nato killed 2500 civilians in kosovo in a few days
plus they attack israel, israel attacks back
500k murdered in darfur in 5 years, and yet they get less aid, how do you explain that, you think the pals have it worst haha
5.5 million died in the congo, you think they deserve less because the pals are dumb enough to shoot rockets at israeli civilians?
22 March 2007 (IRIN) - One-third of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip are food insecure, according to a report by the United Nations World Food Programme (WFP) and Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO).
About 34 percent of Palestinians cannot afford a balanced meal and another 12 percent are at risk of reaching this state, (..) Most affected is the Gaza Strip, where 51 percent of the population suffers from food insecurity."
And that was before Gaza was totally strangled, bombed
and so aid that could go to africans who are starving to death and actually dying should go to the pals who are malnutrioned and only because they tried to destroy israel 4 or 5 times and rejected peace numerous times and try to kill israeli civilians all day every day?
yea you make a lot of sense, your not biased at all hahaha do you listen to yourself
not only that the palestinian leaders steal the money and the food and sell it the pals, haha but you like that dont u? more $ to kill jews
china has killed 1.2 million tibetans, why doesnt anybody try to stop that or give them aid, no we sit here and the world hears about 3k arabs killed in 10 yrs in a war in which hamas hides behind civilians and where peace can be made if they simply accept israel, why?
It's not because you want to compare this situation with Darfur,Tibet and China or else, which are typical separatism's causes that you may dilute the simple fact which is Palestinians are people who live under the occupation and control of an enemy force, and are even, illegally colonised, their soil is changing hands.
Israel is not AT HOME, like France in Corsica, or Spain with Basque, even if it builts homes in West Bank, steals land there or in Gaza for its wall, or gas in gazan's sea.
its because the plight of the pals compare in no way to the plight of other people who are way more innocent than the pals.
Theres people that deserve more help, more aid, more attention, but no one cares about them, only about the pals
the point is the pals are in this situation because of poor leadership and greed, they want it all
israel doesnt want to occupy, they have no choice, if they were to leave they would be screwed, think of it like america in afghanistan, they cant leave
Since res 242,nov 197 it's very clear that Israel is something, on one side, and palestinian territories something else
A recent survey established clearly that israelis like Palestinians are more or less 70% in tune on one main thing : there must be 2 States.
And so One State is clearly occupying an other state-to-be, and placing its colonies in purpose so another State will be hard to make... (Machiavellic)
Rob, I thank you for all your Questions. I copied them in a word doc. It's brilliant. It resumes exactly all the biased ideas around this problem. You're a gem. Thanks. I will try to do a sort of QA with them.
answer the question what do you expect the israelis to do :
Stop the occupation, dismantle the settlements that are cutting the life of Palestinians.
When I think of the noise for one junkie ... some made... I expect Israel to treat correctly Palestinian people. Not as an abusive warden of prison but as it should be done.
Let immediately people in need of care go outside from Gaza without interrogating them like criminals
yes and if israel did all of this today, would the palestinians stop their terror attacks? NO
The israelis need to occupy these lands because just as they left gaza, the arabs will just turn it into other terrorist territory and use it to attack israel from.
if they open the borders they will just bring weapons and rockets so why woul israel do this
you dont see reality, you expect israel to hut itself to make life comfortable for the pals??
65% jobless people, or more (I'm not sure because I heard much more, I have to verify) it's people who have no income to buy anything.
And I wonder if your grocery store still stands up
don't say bullshit to what I relay as information. I've got an ethic.
And if Palestinians receive more aid you should but on balance the quantity of bombs they receive, and the thefts they have to see made from their soil (water) or sea (gas) without counting the price of a field taken with no compensation.
yes their economy is shattered, but the arab world has the worst unemployment rates in the world.
you also discount their own actions, when israel left gaza they built greenhouses for the pals to be able to grow agriculture, they destroyed these greenhouses
arafat stole a billion dollars from the pals thru taxes, hamas steals aid then sells it, and even taxes the tunnels
umm 3k pals killed in 10 yrs vs 500k killed in darfur in 6 yrs, and you still justify how the pals get more aid, so sad
you say the world is deaf, i beg to differ, the pals get more aid than any other people in the world, while there are people around the world who need this aid more, especially in africa
500k people have been murdered in darfur by arabs in 6 yrs in a holocaust
but we only here about the poor pals who less than 3k civilians have been killed in A WAR in which hamas hides behind women and children IN TEN YEARS
5.5 million have died in the congo since 98, we dont even hear or care about that, why
Yes I say this because the noise made when a Palestinian simply snooze is so great, the difference, the silence, when he dies, or hurts, makes me ... disgusted.
Yes I say world is deaf, because I'm fed up too with people who always talk about this or that and can't remain concentrated on one problem for fallacious reasons.
You should read Romain Gary "white dog" he said in it a beautiful thing : Because of the misery some people think they don't need to help a blindman at a roadcrossing
its mind boggling, you people lie and blow everything out of proportion thats the point, you also blame it all on israel, you dont blame hamas for firing rockets at civilians, you dont blame them for hiding behind women and children
the point is this is a war, pals are not just victims they played a role in this whole play,
while we have millions around the world being slaughtered we hear about the poor palestinians who die trying to kill jews
Like lot of people, I didn't wait for you tube to exist and this strange way to speak in 500 characters to wonder about Middle East.
So don't "you people" me when I only try to answer to strange one-sided short cuts in trying to present the other side.
There is always 2 sides of every story. To ignore this is to be biased.
Concerning Palestinian civilians : There is absolutely NO Discussion possible : It's Scandalous what we see for decades now. It's a shame. It's sad beyond words.
haha you only present one side, we all know the pals arent in great shape, but its their fault, they refused a state in 30's, 48, from 48-67 they could have made a state, in 2000
they want to destroy israel, what the hell do you want israel to do? just let them suicide bomb? let them fire rockets? let them kidnap their soldiers? let them bring in weapons and rockets? no country would allow this
they are in this situation because of greed and poor leadership, nothing more
I'm so furious that if I was a dragon everybody but children would sweat great drops
But there is one thing that seems important to me, I think that if WE clearly show that WE will never ever again permit anything that puts these kids in danger : Occupation, siege, humiliation, theft...that we see the global reality, geopolitical and all, for all, but we refuse Impunity for ALL, and collective punishement too, it would be a beginning.
you seem to only blame israel, pals have made poor choices, how many jews would have died if the arabs won any of the wars? all of them, every single last would would have been murdered
hamas puts these kids in danger by using them as human shields and firing from schools
israel has tried to make peace many times, the arabs have refused
your problem is that you dont see reality, you fail to realize that the pals want no israel, they want it all, your too bias to see that
watch the pallywood documentary you can clearly see they stage scenes, thus its called pally wood
i hate people who call what israel does a genocide or a war crime, when its a war and less than 3k civilians died in a war, when 500k civilians slaughtered in darfur and no one care, thats what i hate
if the pals cant go on living like this they could have accepted the 2 state solution in the past 61 years, they havent, they do no want peace, they want to destroy israel
So excuse me but to make me click on a link that says "pallywood" represents for me a shame, something as dirty, as clicking on a nazi or a right-wing extremist's link.
Sorry, but I wasn't educated like this.I have a great tolerance and my kids taught me patience... But I have none for racists and people who trash other human beings. NONE !
I'm fed up with your theories BECAUSE as WE speak sitting on our big asses little kids are suffering from lack of vital support to their growth.
Wow. If Israel stopped destroying billions and billions worth building, economy ... Money could be served not as fast adhesive tape put on a gigantic wound !
How can anybody repay an olive tree whose roots was there hundreds years ago and was chopped ?
HOW can anybody repare a child killed ? reconstruct really the mind and body of anybody ?
YOU tell me !
You say :
"while the world pours money into gaza ..."
I ask : Who is pouring bombs like bloody rain on Gaza ?
if israel was pouring bombs like you say they are there would be a hell of a lot more dead, its simple
plus you make it seem as if they do it for fun, they are protecting themselves, you expect them to sit around and do nothing while they get attacked with rockets?
if russia was in israels place they would have wiped out gaza by now, the israelis have always showed restraint
there are different ideas of a 2 state solution, the sticking point is the right of return, the arabs idea is that a few million arabs would be allowed into israel, of course this would be suicide for israel, and again would be a great security concern, you pick and choose what to look at, you have to look at the big picture.
at camp david israel offered 50 billion in compensation to the refugees, even though more jews were kicked out of arab countries than arabs out of israel
Yes, Rob, and it's cool from Israel to open borders to these refugees while kicking out Palestinians born there, or breaking, killing them.
Of course a better result could be obtained if instead of using its money to pave olive trees fields with canister gaz, and sometimes killing one unarmed person with this unconventionally used arm, Israel would use its brilliant mind and money to help Africa. Yes please, it would be cool.
open their borders? so they can come kill people, its a security risk my friend, its crazier than telling america to open its borders to the mexicans, itll destroy the country and cause thousands of deaths.
umm you mean how they built greenhouses for the pals before they evacuated gaza?? with their own money??
and then the gazans destroyed them the first day the israelis left, they do not want peace, they want all of israel
If you think offering peanuts is offering Peace, maybe the problem is the definition of "Peace".
Robbing soil, destroying fields, houses, all to create settlements, wall, etc... and emprisonning and killing people in that same logic and for the same purpose... that's not "peace", some think
Rob say
arabs never accepted,
I think : Everybody should close its mouth but Palestinians who are digesting the fumes and death Israel make them pay.
Barak offered to form a Palestinian State initially on 73% of the West Bank (that is 27% less than the Green Line borders) and 100% of the Gaza Strip. In 10 to 25 years the West Bank area would expand to 90-91% (94% excluding greater Jerusalem).[1][2][3] As a result, "Israel would have withdrawn from 63 settlements."[4] The West Bank would be separated by a road from Jerusalem to the Dead Sea, with free passage for Palestinians
Rob say: u say u want 2 state solution so does israel, pals dont
I don't say anything. I read a lot and try to resume great lines. I can, of course, copy paste, it's easier :
"According to the poll, 74% of the Palestinians and 78% of the Israelis are willing to accept the basic solution of two states for two people. On the other hand, 66% of the Israelis and 59% of the Palestinians object to one bi-national state."
I'm fed up with Holy - wood choppers' and their iniquitous propaganda.
Clinton blamed Arafat after the failure of the talks, stating, "I regret that in 2000 Arafat missed the opportunity to bring that nation into being and pray for the day when the dreams of the Palestinian people for a state and a better life will be realized in a just and lasting peace." [4] The failure to come to an agreement was widely attributed to Yasser Arafat, as he walked away from the table without making a concrete counter-offer
1 If I had been Clinton, I would have wanted, of course, that Palestinians, like darling little puppets played exactly to the tune that would have left me in history as the Man who made that come true ...
The failure, like everything, like the people who died under phosphorus bombs, like the child or elder man, woman, dying TODAY because of the siege, are Palestinians fault too, if you listen to some ! It's so easier to let the other carry all the burden, huh ?
ahahahaha he did walk away, wtf are you talking about this is a documented fact, even the price of saudi arabia said he couldnt believe arafat rejected the deal and said he should have accepted , even his own aides at the negotiations couldnt believe he rejected it.
the fact is they were offered 94% of the land, and they probably could have gotten more if he had made a counter offer
and again no one would have died if he had accepted or even counter offered, its that simple
Nobody walked away, they concluded the discussion with this special sour note about Jerusalem, then Sharon, Ministry of Lodgement, or general of Settlements deployment put his hand, then people really thought, shit, who are they kidding at the end ?
FOR MEMOIRS Palestinians situation was not "cool" at all, and if it's easy while playing Monopoly with other people's soil to wait, Palestinians, in 2000, had waited 52 years, and since the first great handshake (sept 1993) 7 YEARS !
arafat walked away, its a documented fact, he didnt give a counter offer
they had to wait 52 years?? hahaha there was no occupation from 1948-67, they could have made a state anytime then, why didnt they because they wanted to destroy israel rather than have their own country
Could you please stop with your "hahaha there was no occupation from 1948-67"
Of course there was an occupation.
There is in fact 3 level of Occupation.
1. A minority being given more than the half
2. the occupation of the difference between 55% (hard enough) and 78% (very much more difficult to accept)
3. Since the Ok, we lost so much, ok Israel exist, we need to have a future for our kids, let's talk, 1993 and all ... Israel is simply occupying strategical places, and enough is enough.
I talk about the surface, global of the land we refer too, basically when we talk about the Palestine which was cut into strange pieces to make 2 States + International Status for Jerusalem in 1947.
Of course, maybe according to Likud Charter or some old book, you see another sort of place. But I tend to stick to United Nations definition, because the problem is complex enough without taking your definition, or others definition.
And it should please you, as in that Israel's borders are clear.
3. the map after 48-49 represents in fact the 2nd level of taking space, which with time got worse
haha you mean after the arabs started a war to wipe out the jews? whatd you expect, the israelis not to take any land? you dont think rationally,
hey you just started a war to kill all of us and take all of this land, but here we just won, take back all of the land we took in this war you started, lets be friends hahah, the world doesnt work like that
4. To resume : in 1946 Un saw that, even after the immigration since 1870 and else, there was 30% of Jews, possessing 6%.
The plan of partition of 1947 imagined an jewish State on 55% of the land which was meant to have the 498'000 Jews + 497'000 Arabs (I don't know about beduins ;o)
The arab state kept, of course, its 10'000 jews and 725'000 arabs
The 2 States were made each, of 3 parts
The 7th was Jerusalem
The City of Jaffa was meant to be "an arab enclave" in the jewish state
5. Since 1948-49, the war, killings and flood (Deir Yassin...and like prof Israel Shahak showed it in 1973, 385 palestinian villages disappeared) Israel is on 78% of the land.
So in resume :
1946 : 100% a mixed region
1947 : 55% for a jewish State - 45% for an Arab State (Special status for Jerusalem)
1948-49 : 78% Israel - 22% Palestinian territories
1967 : other wars occupation of new portions of Land.
again you ignore the fact that they got all of jordan which was originally part of palestine, its like if i had a candy bar, i cut off 70% and eat it and then i cut the remaining piece in half and say here im giving you half of this candy bar.
And again, things were they way they were after 48, because of the arabs greed,
ANSWER THIS QUESTION, WHAT WOULD HAVE HAPPENED IF THE ARABS WON IN 1948?
and the pals had all of gaza, wb, and jerusalem, why did they not make a country from 48-67?
6. Even if Arafat, and others, Hamas too recognize Israel ... BUT like some would say : recognize what sort of Israel ?! That's the terrible problem with a sort of blob that changes its borders every day, you see ?
2009 : The 22% that remains are occupied to something like 50%.
So now Palestinians are living on more or less 10% of crumbles of "cantons"
This is the situation
It's a living - dying proof - of an ethnic cleansing, and the situation of Jerusalem is particular since Jesus
arafat recognized israel and he was made an offer he should have accepted, jordan and egypt recognized israel and they now have peace, hamas has never recognized israel you are mistaken.
the pa recognizes israels right to exist but not as a jewish state meaning they want israel to let in 4.6 million pals into israel as part of any peace deal, that is suicide, you know it
ethnic cleansing? more jews were kicked out of arab countries than arabs left israel, thats a fact, thats ethnic cleansing
Israel has proved that if you play the game to the rules or not, the prize and price to pay is the same.
So to recognize or not Israel ...pff, tell me the difference for the people who are dying TODAY as we speak, due to the lack of consideration of their situation.
But still,don't play with words, the "recognize or not point" is about the way to resist or attack. Hamas is not meant to destroy Israel, like you try to imply, but as a resistanc and if not hamas, another group will be created.
The Hamas charter (or covenant), issued in 1988, calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic state in Palestine, in place of Israel and the Palestinian Territories,[52] and the obliteration or nullification of Israel.[53] Specifically, the quotation section that precedes the charter's introduction provides the following quote, attributed to Imam Hassan al-Banna: "Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."[54]
For your information, Palestinian people are living under the control of an enemy whose charter states they don't exist, never existed, and have to disappear.
For your information, this enemy, which controls and occupy their soil is not only saying harsh words on some paper, but is ACTUALLY killing, hurting, palestinians, blokading 1 million and and a half people, shooting on farmers, fishermen, stealing their water and gas ressources, destroying their lives, their cultures (social and fields)
Rob : your panic to this... omigod ... idea :"not as a jewish state" !!
makes me smile. A little bit. I know only one thing, if Jews could "survive" during thousands of years, they will manage. I don't believe in purity of thoughts, religions, or ethnies.
To be alive every society needs differences. Uniformity is death. It's like a slimy pond with the same fishes turning in round circles
To be alive, you need to be open to the things around you.
A. Rob, look at the maps. There is nothing "natural" in this place. The settlers in middle of Palestinians soil, the wall, the killings, wounding of ppl. The point is to make life of Pal's so unbearable that they will leave ... or die.
But they're a sort of flower you can't eradicate. Even under the harshest conditions they remain in place.
All the "philosophy" behind Likud, zionist and extremist in power is to cleanse the place. Make a sort of green without flowers.
dont twist my words, you said they are ethnically cleansing, i cited the casualties to show you your wrong, its simple, if you were right there would be many more deaths, its that simple
As you know, if you ever heard about Red Cross and some ideals, like Human Rights and else, to install one's own people on another people's soil, a soil you are controlling, is a violation of the Geneva's Conventions IV. Article 49 if you are interested. Because it represent a "de facto" ethnic cleansing.
Their life is incredible. It's not f' hospital rooms they need, but a life outside, near the sea, or in middle of a nature without fumes of gaz canister. It's a terrible injustice.
umm the mandate had a right to do with the land whatever they wanted, they owned almost all of the land and the land had been under invaders occupation since the romans kicked out the jews, the fair thing was the partition the arabs didnt accept.
again you exaggerate, and yes they could live in peace, if they stop shooting rockets into israel, how simple is that? compare the west bank to gaza
The poorest life in the world? haha they get more aid than anyone in the world they are far from the
dont fire rockets from your house or your kids school and it will remain safe, its simple, you expect the israelis to just do nothing?? is that what your saying??
i speak of the aid only because you exaggerate the situation and you place no blame on the arabs, this is your problem, you give no facts, no stats, just your dramatic exaggerations, nothing more
Rob's Q :You expect the israelis to just do nothing?? is that what your saying??
Yes, exactly. I expect them to do what was asked in Oslo, was hoped when they shook hands in 1993 : to stop the settlements, stop the Occupation, totally illegal occupation of West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem has not change hands, palestinians must not be chased out of this City, holy for a lot of people.
So yes, to stop doing things that are wrong, and provokes and triggers the logical reaction of the other.
What Palestine needs is an armed revolution it needs to drive all Israeli soldiers and "settlers" out of its territory!I hope the Palestinian people rise up to take their nation back! One day Palestine will be free again!!!
m3talcorps3 1 week ago
rohieh was shouting Allaho Akbar the little boy said in arabic so why is she shouting allho akbar
freelebenon 1 month ago
hiba najar had a mustach i think paliwood is taking its toll
freelebenon 1 month ago
Israeli soldiers do not intentionally kill innocent civilians. Don't believe the Arab propaganda.
kithp 10 months ago
@kithp yes they do you fucking lie what about the zionist media brainwashing people watch david duke videos all us media is fucking jewish
mouradnrd 9 months ago
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@mouradnrd dude before you espouse your conspiracies learn English and don't be so rude and vulgar. Israeli soldiers do not intentionally kill innocent civilians. I know this, I also know that if we shoot innocents we would go to jail. Don't believe the Arab propaganda.
kithp 9 months ago
@kithp wtf are you talking about explain how these ppl are dying and becoming wounded, what of the testimonies from the few decent politicians, hospital workers, human rights activists civilians former israeli soldiers...are they all just making this up? ...your fooling yourself man...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
@RustyRocktopus People die in war. Especially when one side is fighting from areas with loads of civilians! Sad but true. Even people like Goldstone admitted they were wrong because sure at first glamce it would appear that Israelis must be really awful, until they bother to fully look into the whole story. but my friend don't be foolish, open your mind to what is really happening.
kithp 8 months ago
@kithp thats the thing man, i am looking into it, anyone can see whats happening here is horrible...war crimes are being commited with no regulations...white phosphorus, the death of civillians, palestine, and even US and UK human rights activists are dying...the floatilla incident, US liberty, illegal settlements, theyve water and land blockade without legal war, just one look at a map of terriroty over the last 40 yrs or so tells all...the wall is illegal...Zionism is anti-semetic...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
@RustyRocktopus listen naming all these things does not prove anything, u can believe what u want, but the truth is that yes civilians die in war. Thats why both sides need to make peace. But Israel is not intentionally killing civilians and your foolish for believing that. The wall has saved countless lives, Walls can be taken down lives can not be returned. I'm open to discussing any of the above issues you mentioned to see whose at fault, but only if u have an open mind. not an agenda.
kithp 8 months ago
@kithp of course listing incedents helps prove a point, its the only way to prove a point...and im not saying ALL IDF soldiers are killing civilians intentionallty but there have been numerous account of alot doing so...and im not at all saying one side deserves that land over another, thats not my place, but what i am saying is that Israel IS in control and have no interest in peace, and that much is evident to me...if you'd like to discuss an issue start with the Use of white phosophorus...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
@RustyRocktopus listing incedents means nothing, discussing them and proving what actually hapened means a great deal. There will always be rotten apples in any army, but as a rule IDF soldiers DO NOT intentionally kill innocents. If they do wrong they get tried in court. I know many IDF soldiers. These are young boys who would rather be in the beach or ball game. Israel has a HUGE interest in peace, R U crazy??? Talk to some more Israelis! Israel is ready to talk, Pal's make preconditions.
kithp 8 months ago
OK white phosphorus: The IDF’s use of smoke projectiles during the Gaza war were intended to disorient and neutralize Hamas’s anti-tank squads deployed in urban areas, by obscuring their field of view. Smoke screening, including smoke obscurants containing white phosphorous, is widely used in militaries worldwide and is not considered to be indiscriminate weapon.
kithp 8 months ago
@kithp ...and i am doing my best to keep an open mind, ive been doing nothing recently but looking into the whats going on over there, and over and over it points to Israel with the exception of a few incidents...my only agenda is human rights and peace...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
@RustyRocktopus I must question where you get your information from, I will give you the benifit of the doubt, even though I have seen clearly numerous others who claim to be for human rights clearly taking sides and not being interested in what the other side has to say. I'm happy to discuss this with you incident by incident and I hope you will really consider all possibilities and not be swayed by emotions or propoganda.
kithp 8 months ago
@kithp well i do my best to not be swayed by propaganda i try to get as much info from as many places as possible but im sorry i will be swayed by emotion as this is why i argue this topic in the first place, i belive whats being done is wrong and that is based on my own logic and my own emotions...and i belive that Netanyahu has no real interest in peace with the palestinians other than the israeli people in control of As much of israel as possible...they see it more or less as a game o risk
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
@RustyRocktopus I will reply to you directly, much easier.
kithp 8 months ago
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its not just a case of "more palestinian deaths" (most from hamas). 1st its a matter of approach, when i was a child there it was during a time that palestinians were grabbing children from their mothers in the street&stabbing them. meanwhile a commander i knew went to court bcoz he shot a palestinian that threw a molotov cocktail at him&turned to run, the bullet entered thru the guy's back so the commander was charged for shooting an unarmed person trying to escape- IDF protocol in practice
oc00011 1 year ago
test
Bellvista2 1 year ago
the problem is that one could not testify this story. All this palestinians could work for hamas by will or by force. How could this medic knew that it was the special forces who attacked him?
Bellvista2 1 year ago
@Bellvista2 because israeli soldiers have opened up and confessed to war crimes
iraqiblaze 1 year ago
the problem is that one could not testify this story. All this palestinians could work for hamas by will or by force
Bellvista2 1 year ago
@Bellvista2 the reason is becuase this isnt the only one...fine, if we were to assume they did make all this up, there are many many more accounts of actions such as these...the bodies dont lie, the demolished buildings and hospitals dont lie...maps dont lie...and your fooling yourself if you think this is all being perpetuated and falsified by palestinian people...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
Arabs first lie to the world and themselves and after begin to believe to their lie. This is a road to nowhere. And it will not help them. Live your illusions...
hamud77 1 year ago
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@hamud77 racism gets you nowhere...
RustyRocktopus 8 months ago
watch?v=ZprVPKi-W6s
kiko2k 1 year ago
Support World Justice!!
Search on FACEBOOK For;
I CONDEMN THE RECENT ATTACKS BY ISRAEL ON HUMANITARIAN SHIPS
And Join The Group!!
ruq387 1 year ago
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Watch on youtube:
Professor Tony Martin: The Jewish Onslaught pt 1 of 4
About the Jewish Role in the African Slave Trade.
Realiteit01 2 years ago
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copy this text to youtube search:
Goldstone Gaza Report: Col. Richard Kemp Testifies at U.N. Emergency Session
is it all lies?
1johny21 2 years ago
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copy this text to youtube search:
Goldstone Gaza Report: Col. Richard Kemp Testifies at U.N. Emergency Session
are all lies?
1johny21 2 years ago
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islam hate:
Qur'an 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe in Allah or the Last Day, who do not forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, or acknowledge the Religion of Truth (Islam), (even if they are) People of the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jizyah tribute tax in submission, feeling themselves subdued and brought low." [Another translation says:] "pay the tax in acknowledgment of our superiority and their state of subjection."
aviel132 2 years ago
bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!! bullshit !!!!
israel did more to protect civilian lives in GAZA more than any other country EVER !!!
all you see here is only propoganda !!! israel soldier were killed by friendly fire, as much as civilians.. mistakeds happens in war.
patrolus 2 years ago
@patrolus
Ruthless murder happens in war just as much as mistakes. If you can't accept that fact either, then you are extremely naive.
trollfinger 1 year ago
Allah Akbar
Allah means God
Akbar means Greater
xxcoolxx2333 2 years ago
bARBARIC AND INHUMANE.
UmmahTube 2 years ago
the torture everyone who has the balls to stand against them. hmmm moses,, religious meaning, the burning bush has spoken. new president watch american gangstar, and welcome to america
the fool the soldiers to fight a war,, spreading their empire.
eagletalons2007 2 years ago
I guarantee my relatives did not fight WWII for the purpose of replacing one bunch of abusive egomaniacs waving Swastikas around with another bunch of equally abusive egomaniacs waving a Star of David!!!
TARASTWO2 2 years ago
omg, killing white flag woman and children, i feel sick right now.
tubejokez 2 years ago
White flag means zylch in hamas zone...Hamas signatures mean only playing for time...That's why only stick works, no carrot..
amadrys77 2 years ago
Not to be insesitive but does anyone know the name of the song that begins at 1:54
TheBlackEagle20 2 years ago
LOL very funny thank you :)
coucouyoo 2 years ago
Evil is evil. You can call yourself anything you want, if you kill defenseless people you are a piece of human shit.
Ottojr68 2 years ago 3
ottojr68-
- PASS IT ON
Palestinians & 911
'Attacks celebrated in West Bank' The Times, UK
'Palestinians Celebrate Attacks with Gunfire' by Joseph Logan(Reuters)
'AP protests threats to freelance cameraman who filmed Palestinian rally'(The Associated Press)
'Foreign journalists 'deeply concerned' by PA harassment' (AP)
'Palestinian Authority has muzzled coverage of Palestinian celebrations' (MIDDLE EAST NEWSLINE)
'Israel to AP: Release film of Palestinian celebrations' (The Associated Press)
lacarneceria613 2 years ago
No! Palestinians celebrating 9/11?? Are there really such insensitive people in this world? Could such an atrocity ever be justified?
After finding this out I think everything I saw in this video is nothing in comparison to this HORRENDOUS NEWS!!
MootShaheed 2 years ago
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otto-
PA Arabs Better off than Most of Arab World
The situation of Arabs in Judea, Samaria and Gaza is far better than the image that media present, & their gross domestic product and, life expectancy are among the highest in the Arab world, the Asian Times reported.
Calling their situation hopeless but not serious, the newspapers columnist Spengler wrote on Tuesday that the gross domestic product in Judea, Samaria & Gaza is $3,380 per person, higher than in Egypt, Jordan & Syria....
lacarneceria613 2 years ago
...human shit in Gaza is the whole stink...
amadrys77 2 years ago
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There is no Palestine!
All Arabs should get out of the land of Israel!
Go back to the 65 Muslim countries!
Then there will be peace.
zionistshim 2 years ago 2
There is an occupying Force and Occupied people, and the occupying Force is getting every day bigger, a heavier burden, and more violent.
You hear nothing in your media ? Boycott them ! If you don't read them, less ads. No ads, no money. No money, no media, no false voice.
This last week, Israeli Occupying Forces arrested 28 Palestinians ! Including 10 children in West Bank !
When it's not IOF, it's settlers that harm them.
pchrgaza(dot)org
btselem (dot) org
freegaza(dot)org
bixby2000 2 years ago
If this a lie than i wish to god the evil becommes over you israiel and us bitches
capriz25 2 years ago
They are fucking liars ! Damn, I hate those bitches !!!!!
ZZ009966 2 years ago
The armies and leaders of both sides are full of shit. They're both butchers and terrorists. Fuck them all!
YouFailYouLose 2 years ago
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Fucking liars, complete liars, that singin thing that the boy was telling? Does anyone believe that shit? I went into this fucking war, I know the IDF, and trust me, we don't roll like that, we just don't. LIARS! LIARS! LIARS!
rodrigoklepacz 2 years ago
Which end of the IDF's barrel do you know?
mik1984 2 years ago
Article 59 Geneva Conventions
"If the whole or part of the population of an occupied territory" ( = PALESTINIANS) "is inadequately supplied, the Occupying Power" (=ISRAEL) "shall agree to relief schemes on behalf of the said population, and shall facilitate them by all the means at its disposal.(...)"
When it's not Help that Rots outside of Gaza, it's a state of siege strangling any hope, and it's the situation that Israel's gvt seems to let rot ... on purpose.
We see this EVERY time.
bixby2000 2 years ago 2
And every time, weeks, monthes, years pass
Until a new explosion of despair
And who pays the price, every time ?
PALESTINIANS !
And you come with the same old tune ?
It's been 6 monthes, half a year, do you realize that people are trying to reshape their life. Which is difficult enough with loved ones missing.
What is this f' situation ?
Why are the borders closed ?
Even prisonners are entitled to basical goods !
Do you think that something good may come out from this injustice ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
this is bullshit.....the real truth is that hamas uses the civilins as human shields and thats why women and children are dying...and hamas launches rockets in order to kill inocent people...i feel bad for the women and children but its all hamas fault we all want peace israelies and palestinians nobody wants a war except hamas that haits us just because we are israelies
israel960 2 years ago
jews are cowards that like to kill and maim defenseless starving Palestinians.Israel is the most powerful military in the Middle East has nuclear missiles,jets,tanks,drones,etc. and gets billions of $ every year from the US tax payers.America should cut off all $ and weapons to the terrorist state of Israel !
theseventhprotocol 2 years ago 2
The War On Gaza Wasn't A War On Gaza. It Was A war against Muslims Blood,muslim dignety,muslim prouds,muslim religion places. Israel is the crime of the Univers now. Anticriest fucked thier heads.
MrDeadheart 2 years ago
About sides, the fact that everybody has the Right to "defend" himself or his people from attacks, Palestinians are living under occupation and control of an enemy: Israel. To prevent undue use of force in front of an evident right of resistance, there are international Laws. Israel may play victim, but is the clear agressor, and use daily incredible force to crash palestinians, ethnic cleanse the place and occupy 100% of Palestine (West Bank + Gaza are the last 20%, occupied to more than 50%)
bixby2000 2 years ago
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My only regret is that they are not destroying the buildings FAST enough. We need new golf courses with ocean views!
SellTheBenefits 2 years ago
Have u actually see an Israel news? because this is exactly whats happening here. Listen, They know the consequences of kidnapping a soldier and shooting rockets into Israel. I'm not saying that we are perfectly right but I'm that u need to find more sources. Have u ever heard of human shield? we'll Hamas are very are very good with it. The only reason that so many civilians dies in Gaza is because the are so stupid...they actually help the Hamas and takes all the risks.
Itamarsivan 2 years ago
Sides ? Palestinians are people who, very much legally try to resist to a very much illegal occupation.
Since Arafat's olive branch in front of UN who really tried to understand the horrendous conditions Palestinians are subject to by Israel ?
Palestinians tried every thing ! Olive branch ? Their olive trees are burned.
Rocket falling 95% nowhere ? Phosphorus bombs ? Pacific march ? Gas canister shoot close range, like a little bomb in the ribs.
Whatever they try they are killed the same.
bixby2000 2 years ago
They have a right to fight back, simple as that. I know you belive Israel is "defending" themself. I know you truly belive that all Palistinians is worth less, and personally you and people like you dont differentiate between terrorists and civilians. That is because you´r propaganda works, and because the word terrorist is perverted and being labeled on anyone who is fighting back. People that are helping Palistinian children and bringing AID to Palistine is now being labeled TERRORIST.
chippis78 2 years ago
this only shows the other side? what about Israel's side?
Itamarsivan 2 years ago
The ISRAELI side? We see the Israeli side EVERY DAY on CNN, MSNBC, ABC, BBC, SKY and FOX. What we are watching now is the side that the other networks not dare show us... but to be fair to the "Israeli side" I'll quote DAVID BEN-GURION the first Prime Minister of Israel when he said "We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population. The plain and simple fact is that ZIONISM = RACISM
occulist 2 years ago 11
blah blah blah blah blah blah blah hey heres a thought for you and you gaza living terroist buddy SSSSSSTTTTTTTTTTTTTTOOOOOOOOOOOPPPPPPPP firing rockets in to israel and killing women and children dumb shits fucking dumb ass god how hard is this for you to understand numb nuts stop killing israel women and children and they will leave gaza alone
eric1112 2 years ago
eric1112
You need to grow up.
haaswww 2 years ago 2
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wileydredd 2 years ago
Mossad is dressing up and firing those rockets, so that they have a pretext to mow down entire neighborhoods with bulldozers.
mik1984 2 years ago 3
Just as the SAS did (and got caught!) in Basra. My god how brainwashed must the good, honest, decent Israeli's be for allowing this shit....constantly. Ignorance is not, nor ever has been, an excuse.
CoBurN82 2 years ago 10
...a good one, this . Well, hamas must be a Jewish plot to kill babies...
amadrys77 2 years ago
Good guess, you start to catch up, but you still need to learn. Mossad was funding Hamas in it's beginnings, since they wanted to have a radicalized Islamic opponent on the Palestinian side they can sell off to the world as a terrorist organization to justify their warlike measures against the indigenous population. A secular peaceful opposition was the anathema they feared much more than a handful of dead soldiers and civilians, since they had no countermeasures against such form of resistance
mik1984 2 years ago
@mik1984
I think if Mossad were the ones firing rockets, they would have explosives in them. There is no proof for what you said. To say that would be to say there is no resistance in Gaza that fires any rockets.
trollfinger 1 year ago
@trollfinger Those who fire those rockets aren't any resistance only agents provocateurs. Neither do IDF have any evidence who is behind those rockets. People in Gaza, who have their lives destroyed by IDF never get to see any proof of being guilty, no trial, no evidence and no chance to argue.
mik1984 1 year ago
To apply the Likud Charter, voted by Israeli, and which is the Party in Power, Charter which says it want 100% , all the land, it is simply as clear as talking about "Vital Space" (remember the word ?)
Ethnic cleansing began more than 60 years ago, is being done every day (every home, field, destroyed, every Palestinian killed or harmed is a point of the plan) and this will happen, again and again if International Community let Israel follow the political programm they chose.
bixby2000 2 years ago
fuck em let em take all the pakis out
nirv911 2 years ago
The Israelis is doing ´to Palestinian´s what the Nazis were doing to them. They call you a antisemite if you criticize them in any way!
Beatnikful 2 years ago
no your an antisemite because less than 3k palestinian civilians have been killed in a war with israel in which hamas hides behind women and children IN THE LAST 10 YEARS. And you have the nerve to call them nazis, the jordanians killed 20k pals in 11 days during black september, how many died in the recent sri lankan war?, 5.5 million killed in the congo since 98, 500k in darfur since 2003, and the israelis are nazis to you?? thats why your antisemitic
robsage1 2 years ago
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We the American people are NOT Israels BITCH
F**K Israel
Israel is NO Friend to America..!!
Congressional members with dual American / Israeli Citizenships are TRAITORS, they need to be lined up against a wall and SHOT..!!
Israel / Zionist Jews are the Blood Sucking Parasites of the World. They are nothing more then Leeches feeding on Humanity and sucking the life out of Mankind.
The sooner this World is rid of them the better we all will be.
"Die You Scum Bastards, Die"
MeteoritesPlus 2 years ago
How come this report doesn't go out to Ashdod and report on Israelis getting hit by rockets? This is called, "PallyWood"...
missingtimeprod 2 years ago
And your comment is typical
HOLY-Wood destroyers
bixby2000 2 years ago
As occupied people under enemy control they should be protected by the international community, as laws exist for this kind of case. And human law which is not applied is violation of humanity.
The fact that war is a shame in itself, that so much money is used to kill, that children are dying troughout the world, everything, the misery, catastrophes are important points too but ...when you defend humanism and remain upright there is no need to open more fires so your fumes won't be seen.
bixby2000 2 years ago
there is no occupation in gaza, their gov chooses to attack israel, then hides in mosques, hospitals and schools and fire rockets from these places,
israel can attack any of these places according to intl
its not like they are just occupied people who israel kills for fun, they attack israel and you people just think israel should around and do nothing,
but look, hamas stopped firing rockets at israel after cast lead,
its sad but its the only way they would stop shooting rockets
robsage1 2 years ago
UNICEF and the FAO released alarming reports about the situation of the children, and of the women, pregnant who need special care too. Of course, rob, you won't see them miscarry their baby,die too young
For your information, Civilians under enemy control (Gen Con IV) should be able to work (they're deprieved of this right 52) and in front of this violation other articles state that if all should be protected, children and pregnant women should receive special attention (16) and rations (55)
bixby2000 2 years ago
this is bullshit, google lauren booth, she went to gaza and then went on numerous television channels calling gaza a concentration camp, she was then photographed at a fully stocked supermarket, with a nicer computer at the checkout counter then my supermarket in america, she was buying enough food to last her a week, she was then also photographed at a feast, later that day as well
the pals smuggled lions through the tunnels for their zoo, they have enough food, look her up
robsage1 2 years ago
I don't understand your answer. She went there to put some light on the blokade of Gaza last summer. And ?
I mean, do you imply that my sources, UNICEF, FAO from this year are less accurate than your old tunes ?
But I smile seing that you're conscious that these tunnels are much needed to eat.
What you would know, if your read wrmea or other sources than Jerusalem Post is that these tunnels imposed by the siege are like the icing of the cake : they finish to kill the local economy...
bixby2000 2 years ago
no it goes to you that everyone has their own agenda, she likened gaza to a concentration camp and then was photographed at a feast, and in a fully stocked supermarket the same day, they didnt have those things in auschwitz, at the same time she lies she triviliazes things like the holocaust and darfur
How many pals have died of starvation again?
robsage1 2 years ago
About Starvation, I answered you just one page ago.
Do you want me to copy-paste my answer about the incidious and silent ravages of malnutrition ?
Even "European Jews for a Just Peace" signed an appeal in 2006 ! before all this, asking people to open their eyes "Against the oppression and starvation of Palestinian people".
For Auschwitz to tell you the truth, I don't like either the image. But with Varsaw ghetto, yes. Surely. And it's horrible enough.
Comparison is not reason. I know
bixby2000 2 years ago
malnutrition? now we are talking malnutrition, millions starve to death in africa every yr and we are talking about malnutrition???
what do you want israel to do you tell me, you think they like occupying these lands, they tried to give gaza to egypt for free in 81, egypt declined, they left a few yrs ago, now they shoot rockets,
if they left gaza and wb tommorow with not occupation, they would never stop till they destroyed israel, what would you have israel do, tell me id love to know
robsage1 2 years ago
Gaza malnutrition: "The UN Childrens Fund (UNICEF) said in January that 10.3 percent of children under five are stunted (low height for age), a steadily increasing trend over recent years."
"the significant increase" is concerning.
"65 percent of children aged 9-12 months, and 35 percent of pregnant women are anaemic."
irinnews(dot)org/
search for : Gaza malnutrition
PS : Iron is good for blood cells, oxygenation of cells are essential for the brain, the nervous system, etc...
bixby2000 2 years ago
Malawi is facing its worst food crisis in 50 years. The hunger and malnutrition inflicting some 20 million Africans is the result of severe droughts that dried crops and floods that destroyed much of what survived in countries already wrought with economic instability.
thats in 1 african country, yet the pals get more aid while they can have peace with israel in one second, why?
robsage1 2 years ago
Because if aid's proportionnal to bombs received, destructions made, Palestinians receive nothing
bixby2000 2 years ago
hahaha how many bombs? 3k civilians killed in 10 yrs of war in which hamas admits to using human shields, nato killed 2500 civilians in kosovo in a few days
plus they attack israel, israel attacks back
500k murdered in darfur in 5 years, and yet they get less aid, how do you explain that, you think the pals have it worst haha
5.5 million died in the congo, you think they deserve less because the pals are dumb enough to shoot rockets at israeli civilians?
you claim your not biased but you are
robsage1 2 years ago
22 March 2007 (IRIN) - One-third of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip are food insecure, according to a report by the United Nations World Food Programme (WFP) and Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO).
About 34 percent of Palestinians cannot afford a balanced meal and another 12 percent are at risk of reaching this state, (..) Most affected is the Gaza Strip, where 51 percent of the population suffers from food insecurity."
And that was before Gaza was totally strangled, bombed
bixby2000 2 years ago
yet how many have died of starvation, zero
and whos fault is it they are in this situation? their own
could they have their own state? maybe not with netanyahu in power now, but could they have had it for the last 61 yrs before? yes
would the pals kill every last jew in israel if they could? yup
an you sit here and talk about malnutition
robsage1 2 years ago
Are you really so ignorant ?
A body is an extraordinary machine. You need water and food to make it work. You can remain years in coma with only water and a bit sugar and salt.
Of course you'll die before your time
And if you are a child you won't grow harmoniously
And if you are pregnant your baby will have problems spina bifida or other problems
bixby2000 2 years ago
and so aid that could go to africans who are starving to death and actually dying should go to the pals who are malnutrioned and only because they tried to destroy israel 4 or 5 times and rejected peace numerous times and try to kill israeli civilians all day every day?
yea you make a lot of sense, your not biased at all hahaha do you listen to yourself
not only that the palestinian leaders steal the money and the food and sell it the pals, haha but you like that dont u? more $ to kill jews
robsage1 2 years ago
china has killed 1.2 million tibetans, why doesnt anybody try to stop that or give them aid, no we sit here and the world hears about 3k arabs killed in 10 yrs in a war in which hamas hides behind civilians and where peace can be made if they simply accept israel, why?
maybe you can tell me why
robsage1 2 years ago
Tibetans ? Sorry about Tibetans, but at least Tibetans are being talked about.
When it's about my brothers, the silence is total.
But it's another story.
Another cause for anger.
bixby2000 2 years ago
It's not because you want to compare this situation with Darfur,Tibet and China or else, which are typical separatism's causes that you may dilute the simple fact which is Palestinians are people who live under the occupation and control of an enemy force, and are even, illegally colonised, their soil is changing hands.
Israel is not AT HOME, like France in Corsica, or Spain with Basque, even if it builts homes in West Bank, steals land there or in Gaza for its wall, or gas in gazan's sea.
bixby2000 2 years ago
its because the plight of the pals compare in no way to the plight of other people who are way more innocent than the pals.
Theres people that deserve more help, more aid, more attention, but no one cares about them, only about the pals
the point is the pals are in this situation because of poor leadership and greed, they want it all
israel doesnt want to occupy, they have no choice, if they were to leave they would be screwed, think of it like america in afghanistan, they cant leave
robsage1 2 years ago
Since res 242,nov 197 it's very clear that Israel is something, on one side, and palestinian territories something else
A recent survey established clearly that israelis like Palestinians are more or less 70% in tune on one main thing : there must be 2 States.
And so One State is clearly occupying an other state-to-be, and placing its colonies in purpose so another State will be hard to make... (Machiavellic)
bixby2000 2 years ago
the fact is the pals could have had their state numerous times, they didnt take it, and you blame israel for this situation?
hamas refuses the two state solution, the pals cant even negotiate with israel, they are fighting among themselves
the fact is today israel has no peace partner, because no one can guarantee peace
maybe you should read the hamas charter
robsage1 2 years ago
Rob, I thank you for all your Questions. I copied them in a word doc. It's brilliant. It resumes exactly all the biased ideas around this problem. You're a gem. Thanks. I will try to do a sort of QA with them.
bixby2000 2 years ago
your very welcome, we all care for the pals, but they are in this position because of themselves
maybe you should read about camp david and the hamas charter
robsage1 2 years ago
Don't be so arrogant
If Israel hadn't be created people wouldn't have subsaharan conditions.
This logic is terrible, isn't it ?
So try not to play with stupid IF and consider the actual situation, what can be changed, logically, and what should remain.
Life is like a canot, you have to row both sides if you want to go Right
But maybe like your way to say always the same things you prefer to turn in rounds
bixby2000 2 years ago
i have no clue what you just said, this doesnt even make sense
answer the question what do you expect the israelis to do
robsage1 2 years ago
answer the question what do you expect the israelis to do :
Stop the occupation, dismantle the settlements that are cutting the life of Palestinians.
When I think of the noise for one junkie ... some made... I expect Israel to treat correctly Palestinian people. Not as an abusive warden of prison but as it should be done.
Let immediately people in need of care go outside from Gaza without interrogating them like criminals
Let immediately things in, medics and else
Be human
bixby2000 2 years ago
yes and if israel did all of this today, would the palestinians stop their terror attacks? NO
The israelis need to occupy these lands because just as they left gaza, the arabs will just turn it into other terrorist territory and use it to attack israel from.
if they open the borders they will just bring weapons and rockets so why woul israel do this
you dont see reality, you expect israel to hut itself to make life comfortable for the pals??
i asked what u would do if you were ISRAEL?
robsage1 2 years ago
i have no clue what you just said, this doesnt even make sense
What about ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
65% jobless people, or more (I'm not sure because I heard much more, I have to verify) it's people who have no income to buy anything.
And I wonder if your grocery store still stands up
don't say bullshit to what I relay as information. I've got an ethic.
And if Palestinians receive more aid you should but on balance the quantity of bombs they receive, and the thefts they have to see made from their soil (water) or sea (gas) without counting the price of a field taken with no compensation.
bixby2000 2 years ago
yes their economy is shattered, but the arab world has the worst unemployment rates in the world.
you also discount their own actions, when israel left gaza they built greenhouses for the pals to be able to grow agriculture, they destroyed these greenhouses
arafat stole a billion dollars from the pals thru taxes, hamas steals aid then sells it, and even taxes the tunnels
umm 3k pals killed in 10 yrs vs 500k killed in darfur in 6 yrs, and you still justify how the pals get more aid, so sad
robsage1 2 years ago
you say the world is deaf, i beg to differ, the pals get more aid than any other people in the world, while there are people around the world who need this aid more, especially in africa
500k people have been murdered in darfur by arabs in 6 yrs in a holocaust
but we only here about the poor pals who less than 3k civilians have been killed in A WAR in which hamas hides behind women and children IN TEN YEARS
5.5 million have died in the congo since 98, we dont even hear or care about that, why
robsage1 2 years ago
Yes I say this because the noise made when a Palestinian simply snooze is so great, the difference, the silence, when he dies, or hurts, makes me ... disgusted.
Yes I say world is deaf, because I'm fed up too with people who always talk about this or that and can't remain concentrated on one problem for fallacious reasons.
You should read Romain Gary "white dog" he said in it a beautiful thing : Because of the misery some people think they don't need to help a blindman at a roadcrossing
bixby2000 2 years ago
its mind boggling, you people lie and blow everything out of proportion thats the point, you also blame it all on israel, you dont blame hamas for firing rockets at civilians, you dont blame them for hiding behind women and children
the point is this is a war, pals are not just victims they played a role in this whole play,
while we have millions around the world being slaughtered we hear about the poor palestinians who die trying to kill jews
robsage1 2 years ago
Like lot of people, I didn't wait for you tube to exist and this strange way to speak in 500 characters to wonder about Middle East.
So don't "you people" me when I only try to answer to strange one-sided short cuts in trying to present the other side.
There is always 2 sides of every story. To ignore this is to be biased.
Concerning Palestinian civilians : There is absolutely NO Discussion possible : It's Scandalous what we see for decades now. It's a shame. It's sad beyond words.
bixby2000 2 years ago
haha you only present one side, we all know the pals arent in great shape, but its their fault, they refused a state in 30's, 48, from 48-67 they could have made a state, in 2000
they want to destroy israel, what the hell do you want israel to do? just let them suicide bomb? let them fire rockets? let them kidnap their soldiers? let them bring in weapons and rockets? no country would allow this
they are in this situation because of greed and poor leadership, nothing more
robsage1 2 years ago
I blame everybody in the region, globally seen.
I'm so furious that if I was a dragon everybody but children would sweat great drops
But there is one thing that seems important to me, I think that if WE clearly show that WE will never ever again permit anything that puts these kids in danger : Occupation, siege, humiliation, theft...that we see the global reality, geopolitical and all, for all, but we refuse Impunity for ALL, and collective punishement too, it would be a beginning.
bixby2000 2 years ago
you seem to only blame israel, pals have made poor choices, how many jews would have died if the arabs won any of the wars? all of them, every single last would would have been murdered
hamas puts these kids in danger by using them as human shields and firing from schools
israel has tried to make peace many times, the arabs have refused
your problem is that you dont see reality, you fail to realize that the pals want no israel, they want it all, your too bias to see that
robsage1 2 years ago
watch this video, its just a small piece of the puzzle, but it gives you a sense that the pals are only a victims of themselves
watch?v=cn4r7ZjG9Nc
lemme know what you think
robsage1 2 years ago
Rob : I despize from the bottom of my heart people who use the word "Pallywood"
For me these people (link)have exactly the same mind that those who said Negro, or in french youpin to Jews, or other words meant as insults.
Now... for the content ? It doesnt talk about the only question and subject that need to be looked at : Palestinians can't go on living like this
And even if Israel rejected the appeal made by UN Monday, The only solution and all the discussions should be about that. So...
bixby2000 2 years ago
watch the pallywood documentary you can clearly see they stage scenes, thus its called pally wood
i hate people who call what israel does a genocide or a war crime, when its a war and less than 3k civilians died in a war, when 500k civilians slaughtered in darfur and no one care, thats what i hate
if the pals cant go on living like this they could have accepted the 2 state solution in the past 61 years, they havent, they do no want peace, they want to destroy israel
robsage1 2 years ago
So excuse me but to make me click on a link that says "pallywood" represents for me a shame, something as dirty, as clicking on a nazi or a right-wing extremist's link.
Sorry, but I wasn't educated like this.I have a great tolerance and my kids taught me patience... But I have none for racists and people who trash other human beings. NONE !
I'm fed up with your theories BECAUSE as WE speak sitting on our big asses little kids are suffering from lack of vital support to their growth.
bixby2000 2 years ago
while the world pours money into gaza that goes into the pockets of hamas, and supports a terror organization
there are people dying in africa, they didnt choose to be in this position the pals did, they tried to destroy the jews how many times?
the people in africa deserve more aid, more attention and more money than the pals, they are 100 times worse off, you know this
israel has offered peace, arabs never accepted, u say u want 2 state solution so does israel, pals dont
robsage1 2 years ago
Money into Gaza ?
Wow. If Israel stopped destroying billions and billions worth building, economy ... Money could be served not as fast adhesive tape put on a gigantic wound !
How can anybody repay an olive tree whose roots was there hundreds years ago and was chopped ?
HOW can anybody repare a child killed ? reconstruct really the mind and body of anybody ?
YOU tell me !
You say :
"while the world pours money into gaza ..."
I ask : Who is pouring bombs like bloody rain on Gaza ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
if israel was pouring bombs like you say they are there would be a hell of a lot more dead, its simple
plus you make it seem as if they do it for fun, they are protecting themselves, you expect them to sit around and do nothing while they get attacked with rockets?
if russia was in israels place they would have wiped out gaza by now, the israelis have always showed restraint
robsage1 2 years ago
there are different ideas of a 2 state solution, the sticking point is the right of return, the arabs idea is that a few million arabs would be allowed into israel, of course this would be suicide for israel, and again would be a great security concern, you pick and choose what to look at, you have to look at the big picture.
at camp david israel offered 50 billion in compensation to the refugees, even though more jews were kicked out of arab countries than arabs out of israel
robsage1 2 years ago
You say :
There are people dying in africa,
Yes, Rob, and it's cool from Israel to open borders to these refugees while kicking out Palestinians born there, or breaking, killing them.
Of course a better result could be obtained if instead of using its money to pave olive trees fields with canister gaz, and sometimes killing one unarmed person with this unconventionally used arm, Israel would use its brilliant mind and money to help Africa. Yes please, it would be cool.
bixby2000 2 years ago
open their borders? so they can come kill people, its a security risk my friend, its crazier than telling america to open its borders to the mexicans, itll destroy the country and cause thousands of deaths.
umm you mean how they built greenhouses for the pals before they evacuated gaza?? with their own money??
and then the gazans destroyed them the first day the israelis left, they do not want peace, they want all of israel
robsage1 2 years ago
Rob say:
israel has offered peace,
If you think offering peanuts is offering Peace, maybe the problem is the definition of "Peace".
Robbing soil, destroying fields, houses, all to create settlements, wall, etc... and emprisonning and killing people in that same logic and for the same purpose... that's not "peace", some think
Rob say
arabs never accepted,
I think : Everybody should close its mouth but Palestinians who are digesting the fumes and death Israel make them pay.
bixby2000 2 years ago
Barak offered to form a Palestinian State initially on 73% of the West Bank (that is 27% less than the Green Line borders) and 100% of the Gaza Strip. In 10 to 25 years the West Bank area would expand to 90-91% (94% excluding greater Jerusalem).[1][2][3] As a result, "Israel would have withdrawn from 63 settlements."[4] The West Bank would be separated by a road from Jerusalem to the Dead Sea, with free passage for Palestinians
robsage1 2 years ago
Rob say: u say u want 2 state solution so does israel, pals dont
I don't say anything. I read a lot and try to resume great lines. I can, of course, copy paste, it's easier :
"According to the poll, 74% of the Palestinians and 78% of the Israelis are willing to accept the basic solution of two states for two people. On the other hand, 66% of the Israelis and 59% of the Palestinians object to one bi-national state."
I'm fed up with Holy - wood choppers' and their iniquitous propaganda.
bixby2000 2 years ago
Clinton blamed Arafat after the failure of the talks, stating, "I regret that in 2000 Arafat missed the opportunity to bring that nation into being and pray for the day when the dreams of the Palestinian people for a state and a better life will be realized in a just and lasting peace." [4] The failure to come to an agreement was widely attributed to Yasser Arafat, as he walked away from the table without making a concrete counter-offer
robsage1 2 years ago
1 If I had been Clinton, I would have wanted, of course, that Palestinians, like darling little puppets played exactly to the tune that would have left me in history as the Man who made that come true ...
The failure, like everything, like the people who died under phosphorus bombs, like the child or elder man, woman, dying TODAY because of the siege, are Palestinians fault too, if you listen to some ! It's so easier to let the other carry all the burden, huh ?
No, Arafat didn't walk away ...
bixby2000 2 years ago
ahahahaha he did walk away, wtf are you talking about this is a documented fact, even the price of saudi arabia said he couldnt believe arafat rejected the deal and said he should have accepted , even his own aides at the negotiations couldnt believe he rejected it.
the fact is they were offered 94% of the land, and they probably could have gotten more if he had made a counter offer
and again no one would have died if he had accepted or even counter offered, its that simple
robsage1 2 years ago
Nobody walked away, they concluded the discussion with this special sour note about Jerusalem, then Sharon, Ministry of Lodgement, or general of Settlements deployment put his hand, then people really thought, shit, who are they kidding at the end ?
FOR MEMOIRS Palestinians situation was not "cool" at all, and if it's easy while playing Monopoly with other people's soil to wait, Palestinians, in 2000, had waited 52 years, and since the first great handshake (sept 1993) 7 YEARS !
bixby2000 2 years ago
arafat walked away, its a documented fact, he didnt give a counter offer
they had to wait 52 years?? hahaha there was no occupation from 1948-67, they could have made a state anytime then, why didnt they because they wanted to destroy israel rather than have their own country
robsage1 2 years ago
Could you please stop with your "hahaha there was no occupation from 1948-67"
Of course there was an occupation.
There is in fact 3 level of Occupation.
1. A minority being given more than the half
2. the occupation of the difference between 55% (hard enough) and 78% (very much more difficult to accept)
3. Since the Ok, we lost so much, ok Israel exist, we need to have a future for our kids, let's talk, 1993 and all ... Israel is simply occupying strategical places, and enough is enough.
bixby2000 2 years ago
1. A minority being given more than the half
in the 30's there was a plan to give the jews a tiny enclave on the coast in israel, a fraction of what they ended up with, the arabs still said no
the arabs got all of jordan
the land wasnt owned by arabs it was owned by the mandate
2. the occupation of the difference between 55% (hard enough) and 78% (very much more difficult to accept)
and again this is the arabs fault, they started the wars, you cant start a war and then whine when u lose
robsage1 2 years ago
Q. this is the arabs fault, they started the wars, you cant start a war and then whine when u lose
A Every conflict has more than one side, of course.
You can't say arabs began as the partition was imposed on them and they tried to resist this imperialistic Diktat.
In what did they begin ?
Q in the 30's there was a plan to give the jews a tiny enclave
A That was before or after Uganda which nearly became Holy ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
i dont understand
robsage1 2 years ago
2 "a just and lasting peace" Pffff !
In Oslo, OLP had accepted to say Ok, Israel exist, Ok for Peace, Ok we forget something bigger, we take 22% of the 100% that were Palestine in 1947.
Like you know 1947, Jews that possessed only 6% were given 55%. And it was not something that pleased people there.
Where do these 22% come from ? From 1967, UN resolution, (242) stating another State should be made on these Occupied Territories.
WHAT could Arafat OFFER more ?
Israel wants all Palestine
bixby2000 2 years ago
again your wrong, jordan was part of palestine, and the all of it was given to arabs in 1947, the remaining part 55 to jews, thats 15% of palestine
and you say jews only owned 6% of the land, but guess what, the mandate owned about 85% of the land, the arabs didnt own much more than the jews.
what is this 22%?
if israel wanted all of palestine, why did they offer gaza to egypt for free in 1981?
why did they offer 94% of wb and all of gaza to arafat, you make zero sense
robsage1 2 years ago
I talk about the surface, global of the land we refer too, basically when we talk about the Palestine which was cut into strange pieces to make 2 States + International Status for Jerusalem in 1947.
Of course, maybe according to Likud Charter or some old book, you see another sort of place. But I tend to stick to United Nations definition, because the problem is complex enough without taking your definition, or others definition.
And it should please you, as in that Israel's borders are clear.
bixby2000 2 years ago
have u seen the map of 1948 partition??? the arab country would be one whole country while the israeli one would be 3 cantons
moreover jerusalem was to be in the center of the arab country and the jews would have had to travel miles into palestine to get their
what r u arguing with me about this is all fact?
robsage1 2 years ago
Q :have u seen the map of 1948 partition??? the arab country would be one whole country while the israeli one would be 3 cantons
A : 1. The 1947 map was a proof that the people who imagined this were mad, idiotic, stupid
2. But, at least the provinces (arab's side was made of "pieces" too) were linked,
3. the map after 48-49 represents in fact the 2nd level of taking space, which with time got worse
bixby2000 2 years ago
3. the map after 48-49 represents in fact the 2nd level of taking space, which with time got worse
haha you mean after the arabs started a war to wipe out the jews? whatd you expect, the israelis not to take any land? you dont think rationally,
hey you just started a war to kill all of us and take all of this land, but here we just won, take back all of the land we took in this war you started, lets be friends hahah, the world doesnt work like that
robsage1 2 years ago
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bixby2000 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
4. To resume : in 1946 Un saw that, even after the immigration since 1870 and else, there was 30% of Jews, possessing 6%.
The plan of partition of 1947 imagined an jewish State on 55% of the land which was meant to have the 498'000 Jews + 497'000 Arabs (I don't know about beduins ;o)
The arab state kept, of course, its 10'000 jews and 725'000 arabs
The 2 States were made each, of 3 parts
The 7th was Jerusalem
The City of Jaffa was meant to be "an arab enclave" in the jewish state
bixby2000 2 years ago
5. Since 1948-49, the war, killings and flood (Deir Yassin...and like prof Israel Shahak showed it in 1973, 385 palestinian villages disappeared) Israel is on 78% of the land.
So in resume :
1946 : 100% a mixed region
1947 : 55% for a jewish State - 45% for an Arab State (Special status for Jerusalem)
1948-49 : 78% Israel - 22% Palestinian territories
1967 : other wars occupation of new portions of Land.
But Res 242 1967 : No to other occupation.
bixby2000 2 years ago
again you ignore the fact that they got all of jordan which was originally part of palestine, its like if i had a candy bar, i cut off 70% and eat it and then i cut the remaining piece in half and say here im giving you half of this candy bar.
And again, things were they way they were after 48, because of the arabs greed,
ANSWER THIS QUESTION, WHAT WOULD HAVE HAPPENED IF THE ARABS WON IN 1948?
and the pals had all of gaza, wb, and jerusalem, why did they not make a country from 48-67?
robsage1 2 years ago
6. Even if Arafat, and others, Hamas too recognize Israel ... BUT like some would say : recognize what sort of Israel ?! That's the terrible problem with a sort of blob that changes its borders every day, you see ?
2009 : The 22% that remains are occupied to something like 50%.
So now Palestinians are living on more or less 10% of crumbles of "cantons"
This is the situation
It's a living - dying proof - of an ethnic cleansing, and the situation of Jerusalem is particular since Jesus
bixby2000 2 years ago
arafat recognized israel and he was made an offer he should have accepted, jordan and egypt recognized israel and they now have peace, hamas has never recognized israel you are mistaken.
the pa recognizes israels right to exist but not as a jewish state meaning they want israel to let in 4.6 million pals into israel as part of any peace deal, that is suicide, you know it
ethnic cleansing? more jews were kicked out of arab countries than arabs left israel, thats a fact, thats ethnic cleansing
robsage1 2 years ago
Israel has proved that if you play the game to the rules or not, the prize and price to pay is the same.
So to recognize or not Israel ...pff, tell me the difference for the people who are dying TODAY as we speak, due to the lack of consideration of their situation.
But still,don't play with words, the "recognize or not point" is about the way to resist or attack. Hamas is not meant to destroy Israel, like you try to imply, but as a resistanc and if not hamas, another group will be created.
bixby2000 2 years ago
The Hamas charter (or covenant), issued in 1988, calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic state in Palestine, in place of Israel and the Palestinian Territories,[52] and the obliteration or nullification of Israel.[53] Specifically, the quotation section that precedes the charter's introduction provides the following quote, attributed to Imam Hassan al-Banna: "Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."[54]
robsage1 2 years ago
For your information, Palestinian people are living under the control of an enemy whose charter states they don't exist, never existed, and have to disappear.
For your information, this enemy, which controls and occupy their soil is not only saying harsh words on some paper, but is ACTUALLY killing, hurting, palestinians, blokading 1 million and and a half people, shooting on farmers, fishermen, stealing their water and gas ressources, destroying their lives, their cultures (social and fields)
bixby2000 2 years ago
Rob : your panic to this... omigod ... idea :"not as a jewish state" !!
makes me smile. A little bit. I know only one thing, if Jews could "survive" during thousands of years, they will manage. I don't believe in purity of thoughts, religions, or ethnies.
To be alive every society needs differences. Uniformity is death. It's like a slimy pond with the same fishes turning in round circles
To be alive, you need to be open to the things around you.
bixby2000 2 years ago
i dont understand your english here
robsage1 2 years ago
Q :ethnic cleansing?
A. Rob, look at the maps. There is nothing "natural" in this place. The settlers in middle of Palestinians soil, the wall, the killings, wounding of ppl. The point is to make life of Pal's so unbearable that they will leave ... or die.
But they're a sort of flower you can't eradicate. Even under the harshest conditions they remain in place.
All the "philosophy" behind Likud, zionist and extremist in power is to cleanse the place. Make a sort of green without flowers.
bixby2000 2 years ago
ethic cleansing? 3k civlians killed in 10 years
averages to less than 1 person killed a day, israel is slow at this ethnic cleansing no??
they make their life unbearable? this is why they allow gazans to get more aid than anyone in the world?
10's of thousands of them treated in israeli hospitals, they built greenhouses for them in gaza before they left, again your just imagining things
robsage1 2 years ago
3k civlians killed...
What's this f' way to say things ??
less than 1 person killed a day
Are you mad ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
dont twist my words, you said they are ethnically cleansing, i cited the casualties to show you your wrong, its simple, if you were right there would be many more deaths, its that simple
robsage1 2 years ago
As you know, if you ever heard about Red Cross and some ideals, like Human Rights and else, to install one's own people on another people's soil, a soil you are controlling, is a violation of the Geneva's Conventions IV. Article 49 if you are interested. Because it represent a "de facto" ethnic cleansing.
Their life is incredible. It's not f' hospital rooms they need, but a life outside, near the sea, or in middle of a nature without fumes of gaz canister. It's a terrible injustice.
bixby2000 2 years ago
umm the mandate had a right to do with the land whatever they wanted, they owned almost all of the land and the land had been under invaders occupation since the romans kicked out the jews, the fair thing was the partition the arabs didnt accept.
again you exaggerate, and yes they could live in peace, if they stop shooting rockets into israel, how simple is that? compare the west bank to gaza
robsage1 2 years ago
DON'T YOU THINK ANY OF THEM would prefer not to receive the stupid icing (help) on the heavy cake, impossible to digest (Bombs, killings, wounds...).
The poorest life in the world, the most total misery, anything would be bliss in comparison to this awful insecurity !
Imagine ! Every day, hell can break loose, your child, or other loved ones can die, like this ... PUf !
Or your house can be demolished, or your fields burn ...
and like a jealous kid you speak about the help they receive ?
bixby2000 2 years ago
The poorest life in the world? haha they get more aid than anyone in the world they are far from the
dont fire rockets from your house or your kids school and it will remain safe, its simple, you expect the israelis to just do nothing?? is that what your saying??
i speak of the aid only because you exaggerate the situation and you place no blame on the arabs, this is your problem, you give no facts, no stats, just your dramatic exaggerations, nothing more
robsage1 2 years ago
Rob's Q :You expect the israelis to just do nothing?? is that what your saying??
Yes, exactly. I expect them to do what was asked in Oslo, was hoped when they shook hands in 1993 : to stop the settlements, stop the Occupation, totally illegal occupation of West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem has not change hands, palestinians must not be chased out of this City, holy for a lot of people.
So yes, to stop doing things that are wrong, and provokes and triggers the logical reaction of the other.
bixby2000 2 years ago
dumb ass
eric1112 2 years ago