Fort Worden 2006 - Medic!!

[dx9s]

@GryphisOne: I wouldn't be calling MILES2000 cheap or for children! Children in the middle of a combat training exercise? MILES is adult laser tag for combat simulation, not the same as your PB sport. That said, commercial outdoor gear (Adventure Sports, Steradian Tech, etc.) is not cheap either. Lazer Tag (Team Ops) is a lower cost, doesn't skimp on quality w/o costing $1K/tagger. MILES/LT doesn't require mask where PB/simunitions does (you normally don't go into a war zone wearing a mask).

[GryphisOne]

@dx9s, finally someone has a responce that I can respect. While it is true that there are high tech guns out there, the guns used in this video are cheap, $40 or less guns. Used by grown men who have jobs. I don't have a gripe with pro LT players or their gear, I do have issue with men using guns made for KIDS. You'd think they could afford the good stuff by now....

[GregGaub]

Nice try. Clearly you have not played with the gear shown in this video. You assume that because it's a toy, it is crap. It's not. This gear has features beyond some pro gear, range that matches and beats most pro gear, AND is affordable. Let's see, I can outfit an entire team for the price of ONE pro gear load out. Tough choice, I know.

Not.

[GryphisOne]

@GregGaub, as a matter of fact, I have played with those guns. I bought one set of guns, both didn't work right out of the box. I had to go get a second set and one of them broke within a week. The other one has some sort of invincibility glitch where you can unload a few clips of ammo at point blank and it won't take a single shot of damage. You call that quality? You're going to have to do better then that.

[GregGaub]

I don't disagree that they are toys. As such, there is a certain level of manufacturing problems. I never had nearly as many problems as you did. Sucks that you did. But when the gear works, which most of it does just fine, it works GREAT.

Sorry you had a bad experience with it. Maybe if you had played with my club, your opinion would be different.

[GryphisOne]

@GregGaub, It's always possible, but I doubt it considering it looks like you only ever have less then 20 people, most of which look younger then 16. For all I know, you play with a large group of other guys, but I'm just going off of what I see in the video.

[GregGaub]

@GryphisOne: It varies. I've played when there are only 3 people, and I've had so many people wanting to play that we had to cycle them through (24 player limit in hosted/scored games) or play the simpler unscored game with everyone at once. I prefer large groups, which is why I started my club, but no matter how many there are, it's still a lot of fun.

First 10 was too few, now 20 is too few? Why does that number keep increasing?

[dx9s]

Probably because he counted 21 people in the group shot at the end of the video (and that doesn't include the ONE [Greg] holding/taking the picture) = 22 people. And usually those games have people going home early, so I'd expect there where probably a few more people that didn't get a picture taken.

[GryphisOne]

Dude, I don't care if it's 3, 5, 10 or 20. The point I'm trying to make is, paintballers are always going to have more people involved in any given match. Sure, playing with your closest bros is fun, but isn't it MORE fun to have 30 or 40 people?

[GregGaub]

Nice cyclical argument you've got there. So, no matter how many people I have in a game, it's not enough, simply because a paintball game might have more.

More players can often increase the amount of fun, but not always.

In any case, you still haven't presented any compelling arguments against laser tag. You had a bad experience and don't like it, but you have nothing other than emotion to argue against laser tag. As such, no one can ever change your mind, and so I give up on you.

[GryphisOne]

No, thats not what I'm saying. What I am saying is because paintball is more popular, we're always going to have more people for a game which= more fun. I've recently taken polls from my friends, all who have played Lazer Tag, Paintball, Airsoft and Dart Wars. Most have played LT at large indoor arenas. They all pick paintball and airsoft. Also, if that isn't enough for you, I've gotten the opinon of some pro and rec players that I've run into and they ALL say paintball trumps LT every time.

[Sinistrahd]

So in the opinion of your paintball-favoring crowd, paintball is the best? That's such a coincidence... Democrats all think a democrat candidate is the best and republicans all think a republican candidate is the best... This all boils down to opinion. In ours, LT > PB. In yours, PB > LT. Everyone has opinions, if you can't accept that we enjoy LT more than PB, there really is no point in arguing it further. More people does not always = more fun. GASP: I have an opinion different from yours!

[dx9s]

@Gryphis: You are WRONG when you state OPINION as FACT. Sinistrahd is RIGHT when he states OPINION is OPINION, NOT FACT. Sinistrahd is RIGHT, you are WRONG! You are confused and are either 1) ignorant or 2) not old enough to know between OPINION and FACT. Derive OPINIONS from FACTS, it is STILL OPINION! I've had LT games at the same field with PBers and they are NOT this dense... and we all hung out and had fun! (adjacent fields, they playing PB, we playing LT, all getting along fine!)

[GregGaub]

I'll ignore your cyclical "more is better" mantra.

Sorry, dude, but playing INDOOR laser tag is NOT an apples-to-apples comparison. If that is their basis of comparison, then they haven't been able to form a REAL opinion of laser tag as an alternative to painball.

If I put some Adventure Sports taggers, or even a set of LTTO Master Blasters in the hands of all your painballer friends and had them play on the SAME field they play now, they'd have a completely different opinion of the sport.

[GregGaub]

@GryphisOne As for age, well, that's the nice thing about laser tag. There's no age minimum OR maximum. Yes, we often have kids playing, but we have the dads play just as often. I've had airsofters and painballers come play with my club, and they always have fun.

If you only played with busted gear in a game of 3 or less people, then I can totally understand why you think it sucks. It's your loss, really.

[dx9s]

Being cost smart is okay! Hasbro gear is "good stuff". Cost doesn't always equal good. Hasbro targeted kids, but adults can use too! SOME cheap lasertag gear is JUNK (see Laser Challenge). If I was rich, I'd design my own AND buy a crap load of "pro" gear and use Hasbro's. I have a budget and use Team Ops and have fun! BTW, Pro is slang for professional (your job) not expensive. You can get paid for football, or for running (something kids and adults do) and shoes don't cost much.

[GryphisOne]

@dx9s, all I know is, I don't mind paying a little extra for quality. If you have a cheap gun, you may as well just stay at home because you won't be any use to your team if you can't hit anything because your gun is acting up.

[GregGaub]

@GryphisOne. We don't mind paying a little extra, either. Laser Challenge costs half of what Lazer Tag does. It's less than half the quality, though. Unfortunately, there's no "in between" Lazer Tag and the lowest cost pro gear. After Lazer Tag, it jumps to $400 per player, and that's low-end pistol junk I wouldn't bother with. The GOOD stuff is $1000 per player. If you can drop that kind of cash, then bully for you.

Lazer Tag is inexpensive, not cheap.

[dx9s]

You are making my point without knowing it... Hasbro is fair priced (was, now internet scalpers sell them for $300+) and is good quality. I would never use the cheap gear/crappy quality (see Laser Challenge). It can barely go 50 feet before having problems with the sunlight. Tagging with Team Ops tagger at registering hits at 500+ feet is 10 times better! Cheap = low quality + low price. Hasbro is quality at a fair price. If you never used Team Ops gear, it's like saying all drinks are the same!

[GryphisOne]

Lazer tag has known it's day and that day was back in the 90's! Let it die in peace! Go play paintball instead. You'll always get more then 10 players.....

Going to bitch about the cost? To bad! Paintball is an adult sport, unlike lazer tag where you get what you pay for: cheap guns that are made in China. If someone has the nerve to defend lazer tag and the man-childs that play it in this video, I'll gladly stomp your argument flat.

[GregGaub]

@GryphisOne Wow, sounds like that koolaid you drank was pretty bitter.

Have fun with your pea shooters, dude.

[GryphisOne]

@GregGaub, no offence, but you're one to talk about bitter koolaid. You're the 30 something that runs around with kids toys.

[GregGaub]

Err... who's the one seeking out videos to hate on? I'm not bitter. I'm quite happy. That's why I can enjoy a sport that doesn't involve pain and rampant, testosterone induced hazing and cheating.

As for your arguments, since YOU started it, why don't YOU post some REAL reasons that "paintball is an adult sport" and that everyone over 12 that plays laser tag is a "man-child".

Your personal opinions, unfortunately, don't count. I don't expect you to know logic from emotion, though.

[Sinistrahd]

Sorry GryphisOne, your low range soapbubble firing markers don't have anything on LT. I've played since '86, and even then the range was better than PB. During my military service, me and friends in my division had tons of games without needing any external motivation (pain) We get enough of that in the real world and can motivate ourselves, rather than needing a paintball in the backside to push us. Come out and try it instead of beating your soft fuzzy chest about PB being superior.

[GryphisOne]

@Sinistrahd, Thanks to your service in the Navy, there's nothing stopping me from "beating my soft fuzzy chest about paintball being superior." It's still a free country right? I'll point out that over the years, I've played with Lazer tag and dart gun stuff. Both were crap. I actually owned the same guns shown in this video. The only thing that LT has on PB is range. Maybe. As for accuracy, hitting anything is next to imposible. And last time I looked, the US Armed Forces used PB to train guys.

[GregGaub]

Wait... you had LTTO gear and couldn't hit anything? Heh, well, I guess that says something.

Trust me, the gear is accurate to hundreds of feet. Just because you couldn't use it right, doesn't make it crap.

[Sinistrahd]

GryphisOne: PB is only actually used for close quarters training, due to its range limitations and the poor aerodynamic performance of the paintballs. For the long range and tactical stuff, the MILES 2000 has the ability to simulate armor, heavy weapons, explosions, radiation zones, etc... Much of which the LTTO/LTX gear used here can do to some extent with a little creativity. Sure rich adults can afford the pro gear, but look at the economy. (1 of 2)

[Sinistrahd]

I use LTTO/LTX because I could afford to buy enough to outfit 50 players at the price of a couple pro sets, and the LTTO/LTX, if used properly and if you didn't perhaps get a defective set, generally seems to surpass the performance of the pro gear I've tried out (Steradian and BFS) (2 of 2)

[GryphisOne]

@Sinistrahd, I've seen Army Rangers, SWAT units and Air Force Rangers use paintball guns for long range engagements and they worked just fine.

[Sinistrahd]

Really, long range engagements? The range of a Paintball Marker, even one with modified valves and pressure reservoirs, still falls far short of what would be considered long range. By close quarters combat I mean that the combatants can see their targets in good detail, so they're within a few hundred feet of one another. By long range I mean the sort of distances where snipers and heavy gunners are actually effective. Paint Bullets (deadly at close range without armor) are NOT paintballs.

[GryphisOne]

When things get to be at long range, I call that unrealistic. So your lazer pistol can shoot a target at 100yds or more? Thats whats nice about paintball. You don't have a one-size-fits-all gun thats good for any situation. In paintball, you have your guns that are good and fast up front and you have your slower, more powerful guns that can hit at longer range. I like having the choice. More realistic.

[SparkySU1]

PB and LT both have pros and cons. I enjoy both. However, putting someone down for using a gun that is $24 over one that is $300 to get the same tactical fun is just dumb. It is like saying a guy that drinks Coniac is better than a guy who drinks Burbon, is better than the Guy who buys Whiskey is better than guys who buy beer. Can one argue that someone who drinks Coors is not a man because he buys cheap beer. How arrogant can you get?

[GryphisOne]

@SparkySU1, Last time I looked, we wern't talking about alcohol so I'm going to ignore 75% of your comment.

[SparkySU1]

Last time I talked to my son...they were still using Miles, although it sounds like a newer better one than you see in the movies. The squads play paintball, but it is not for training purposes...more for just the fun of it.

[skatrix0]

also u can go to my favorites to find a secret spot at fort worden.

[skatrix0]

that is one of the cooler locations ive seen u at.

[GregGaub]

Well, there are signs. 1) if they're using a TMB or a Phoenix, their dome will flash for every tag. 2) If you AND your target are using LTTO gear, then you'll get a hit confirmation sound some times. 3) Depending on their play style, they'll react to getting tagged, either by looking for you, or hiding.

In the end, the REAL way to know is by the scores at the end. With LTTO gear, you can even check PvP tags.

[crabheart]

lol should paint the starbase orange and green lol

[ZFKM]

Where is Fort Worden.

[Sinistrahd]

It is near Port Townsend on the Olympic Peninsula in Washington State.

[GregGaub]

If you mean the next Fort Worden game, be sure to register. If you mean an ALTC game, then keep an eye on the ALTC home page for the next date (once I set one).

[NeedsMusic2Live]

that llooks so fun but like playing lazer tag in those bunkers would be too much. I freaked out walking in those little tunnels.LOL

I wanna play with u guys sometime looks fun!