He is an idiotic arse that is out of touch with the reality every day folk & has no idea what's going on in the real world. yesterdays Blaming the celeb culture as driving the Riots of last summer; like Davy Cam Boy he is an Aristo that lives in the past; he should shut the f up because this this country did not vote for this shower of crap.
And what happens now that the Tories are actually in power? Sure Start funding is not protected in the budgets and so local councils are beginning to take the axe to their Sure Start programmes. IDS spews all the usual bull one hears from his kind.
This man is a fool of the highest order, even his own party got rid of him as leader, heres an idea cut all overseas aid to Pakistan, you know the country whos helping the Taliban kill our troops, next stop waisting money on wars that our not our concern, next stop civil servents waisting billions threw incompetence, then we will have money for jobs and to help people who need a hand up, btw there would be more housing if you politicians never flooded the country with immigrants! Vote Ukip
Toynbee's bogus arguments are all thinly disguised attacks on the principle of marriage, she spits her bile because she enjoys family break-up and social breakdown, like everyone in TrashLabour.
Ian Duncan Smith is possibly the only conservative in the cabinet. His welfare reforms are fantastic and Labour would be mad if they refused to support them. He is absolutley right on the issue of marriage; government should not dictate who stays together and who doesn't, but it can at least promote commitment rather than penalising it in the tax system.
It is a statistical fact that husbands and wives enjoy a healthier relationship, stay together longer and raise happier children than cohabitating couples. Divorce is difficult and expensive, so marriage creates an incentive for people who would otherwise seperate to think more deeply about the cosequences of their actions and to consider an alternative. This has prevented countless families from destruction. A society of this nature is cohesive. It is most certainly the state's business.
Thats right go back to the 50s when women stayed with husbands despite unhappiness. Anyway you are wrong. IDS is a thicko who has no academic qualifications and is a creationist. Why should I listen to a twat like him misquoting sociological facts. You appear to be taken in by his dullard musings.
Indeed the children of married couples who argue are rather unhappy - that too is a fact this Victorian pillock forgets
@grizzle100 Please resist the temptation to misrepresent your opponents. As a libertarian, I do not suggest that couples should be forced to stay together. However, I would encourage them to do so. There is a world of difference between these two approaches.
IDS is a highly intelligent man. His academic achievements are entirely unconnected to his political career; Winston Churchill failed all of his exams apart from English and became the greatest Prime Minister in this nation's history.
Encouragement to stay together is another word for forcing.
Churchill was a great war leader, a useless peace time one. Churchill was not in charge of a dept that required academic aptitude. IDS is entirely misrepresenting the data in order to force is Tory Taliban ideology down our throats.
I suspect the dimwit is too stupid to know it though.
His type of middle class pompous catholic morally bettermas attitude is entirely inappropriate for a liberal democracy
Incentives do not amount to regulations. If these policies are implemented, spouses will remain free to obtain a divorce if they so desire. Your refusal to accept this fact makes it abudantly clear that you do not understand the proposals that are being made.
Churchill lead this country through a period of hardship and ensured that victory was possible. This alone is worthy of respect.
You are still unable to explain why the Work and Pensions Secretary is a "dimwit." Why is this?
Firstly Churchill was undeniably intelligent, and having academic qualifications is also not necessarily a sign of intelligence. But pretending you do, as IDS did, is undeniably a stupid thing to do. IDS's failure to understand the causality in the figures on marriage which he often quotes illustrate a decided lack of brain power.
IDS argument that the UK is broken due to lack of marriage is Tory Taliban claptrap. We are one the world's most stable countrries.
@grizzle100 You criticise the government for its alleged deceit. However, you are unable to provide evidence to support your claims and make unfounded statements that are based on preconceptions.
A reduction in the number of legitimate children, coupled with an increase in divorce, is hardly a sign of stability. For this and other reasons, it is consensus that society is broken.
Your family is no concern of mine; sentiment should not inhibit argument.
Marriage is a stable institution that provides the appropriate conditions for parenting and childhood. It ensure that the foundations of society remain firm, so a community that lacks it is divided.
The statement "IDS is a highly intelligent man" makes it perfectly obvious that I oppose your position. Your final remark does not concern politics and is therefore irrelevant.
Typical ideologue,j ust like the Marxists. How strange that so many neo cons like yourself were once Marxists ( I am not saying you were).
You are also wrong about marriage. Caring parents who separate amicably have far happier children that warring marriages that stay together for the children. Indeed there is some evidence that step family children are better able to deal that most difficult of all issues for a human being- someone else.
@grizzle100 As I have previously stated, my guiding principle is libertarianism. Contrary to your implications, this is compatible with family values.
It is more expensive for single people to live, as recognised in the pension system, that is why two people in a relationship who don't live together get more than a couple.
I am afraid calls for moral rearmament as outlined by you are not libertarian except according to the definitions outlined by nationalists- hardly liberal democractic. The social progress made since the was would be undone by such a policy advocated by the bald twit lion
Almost certainly , indeed my most liberal friends think I'm liberal.
No marriage, no baptism, nothing except a solstice ivy ceremony on Haytor twenty years ago, and even then I don't buy Paganism - though it is at least liberal ( usually)
Who gave the governemnt the right to regulate facilitate or do anything as far as marriage of a couple is concerned? Tomorrow they will start giving money to couples who don't fight. This is ridiculous.
I'm a Labour Party member, but Iain Duncan Smith usually comes across well. That's not to say I agree with him however - I certainly don't on this issue, and Poly raises good points about this strange scheme.
he is an honerable man, who has honestly undergone a real eye opening expereience and wants to make things better for ordinary people. its just a shame he didn't have it before he was tory leader.
What this feminist attack dog, Toynbe is doing is classic projection. She is projecting onto I.D.S what the feminists have been doing for forty years. THEY interferred in family life by setting up a system that was designed to make marriges fail. They used divorce and tax laws to do it. Now she is accusing IDS of doing what her pals are doing. This is how feminists work. They reverse the guilt. IDS should have asked HER, why are you against marriage and why do you hate the idea of supporting it?
I ahev never heard such dump comments in my life ""what makes you think that the government can reach into peoples lives and change the way they behave" says Polly...er......The law Polly???.....
She truely is one of the thickest women in Britian
@AlienPsyTing err, are you too thick to pick up the context she meant it in? No government can pass a law saying 'you will get married and never divorce' unless you live in a dictatorship.
He is an idiotic arse that is out of touch with the reality every day folk & has no idea what's going on in the real world. yesterdays Blaming the celeb culture as driving the Riots of last summer; like Davy Cam Boy he is an Aristo that lives in the past; he should shut the f up because this this country did not vote for this shower of crap.
boogiegroover1 2 months ago
And what happens now that the Tories are actually in power? Sure Start funding is not protected in the budgets and so local councils are beginning to take the axe to their Sure Start programmes. IDS spews all the usual bull one hears from his kind.
bodnotbod 3 months ago
This man is a fool of the highest order, even his own party got rid of him as leader, heres an idea cut all overseas aid to Pakistan, you know the country whos helping the Taliban kill our troops, next stop waisting money on wars that our not our concern, next stop civil servents waisting billions threw incompetence, then we will have money for jobs and to help people who need a hand up, btw there would be more housing if you politicians never flooded the country with immigrants! Vote Ukip
1965CAPTKIRK 4 months ago
F&?k off boldy
computer00fulify 4 months ago
We dont need welfare reform in this country, we needs secure jobs, we need to come away from being market/prifit lead.
We need in Britain a well funded welfare State and low rented council housing.
imonthebox 7 months ago
God that womens bloody awful....Ian on the other hand is speaking sense! :)
Whitedove89 1 year ago
@Whitedove89
What and IDS is a twat of the highest order
grizzle100 1 year ago
@Whitedove89
IDS is like the bald twit lion
grizzle100 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Chat with sexy women ** rockmycity.info **
feeshaniciyani 1 year ago
Toynbee's bogus arguments are all thinly disguised attacks on the principle of marriage, she spits her bile because she enjoys family break-up and social breakdown, like everyone in TrashLabour.
TheZanipolo 1 year ago
@TheZanipolo
Typical Tory wants to intervene in what people do in the bedroom.
What a prat lecturing people from his idiotic moral high ground, got no figures just religious garbage
grizzle100 1 year ago
@TheZanipolo
No we just don't want to live in a Franco-esque state with religious bigots, which IDS is, lecturing us on morality
I suggest you ook at the politics of Franco and Pinochet and see how close they are to IDS's
grizzle100 11 months ago
from wikipedia
about Natinalist Spain
''Divorce was forbidden, and also contraceptives and abortion.'
. It was also isolationist and authoritarian and autere
All distinct tendencies within th coalition. No wonder Thatcher loved Pinochet, Franco's little brother
grizzle100 11 months ago
Ian Duncan Smith is possibly the only conservative in the cabinet. His welfare reforms are fantastic and Labour would be mad if they refused to support them. He is absolutley right on the issue of marriage; government should not dictate who stays together and who doesn't, but it can at least promote commitment rather than penalising it in the tax system.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago 2
@MrYoungIndependence
fucking garbage, the idea the govt promotes commitment in marriage is laughably stupid
grizzle100 1 year ago
@grizzle100 How is it acceptable for couples who seperate to be rewarded, when those who stay together are punished? That's my point.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
It is absolutley irrrelevant what people do . If you stay together or separate it is nobody's business but their own.
How exactly is separation rewarded anyway and what business is it of a religious nutter like IDS
grizzle100 1 year ago
It is a statistical fact that husbands and wives enjoy a healthier relationship, stay together longer and raise happier children than cohabitating couples. Divorce is difficult and expensive, so marriage creates an incentive for people who would otherwise seperate to think more deeply about the cosequences of their actions and to consider an alternative. This has prevented countless families from destruction. A society of this nature is cohesive. It is most certainly the state's business.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Thats right go back to the 50s when women stayed with husbands despite unhappiness. Anyway you are wrong. IDS is a thicko who has no academic qualifications and is a creationist. Why should I listen to a twat like him misquoting sociological facts. You appear to be taken in by his dullard musings.
Indeed the children of married couples who argue are rather unhappy - that too is a fact this Victorian pillock forgets
grizzle100 1 year ago
@grizzle100 Please resist the temptation to misrepresent your opponents. As a libertarian, I do not suggest that couples should be forced to stay together. However, I would encourage them to do so. There is a world of difference between these two approaches.
IDS is a highly intelligent man. His academic achievements are entirely unconnected to his political career; Winston Churchill failed all of his exams apart from English and became the greatest Prime Minister in this nation's history.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Encouragement to stay together is another word for forcing.
Churchill was a great war leader, a useless peace time one. Churchill was not in charge of a dept that required academic aptitude. IDS is entirely misrepresenting the data in order to force is Tory Taliban ideology down our throats.
I suspect the dimwit is too stupid to know it though.
His type of middle class pompous catholic morally bettermas attitude is entirely inappropriate for a liberal democracy
grizzle100 1 year ago
Incentives do not amount to regulations. If these policies are implemented, spouses will remain free to obtain a divorce if they so desire. Your refusal to accept this fact makes it abudantly clear that you do not understand the proposals that are being made.
Churchill lead this country through a period of hardship and ensured that victory was possible. This alone is worthy of respect.
You are still unable to explain why the Work and Pensions Secretary is a "dimwit." Why is this?
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Firstly Churchill was undeniably intelligent, and having academic qualifications is also not necessarily a sign of intelligence. But pretending you do, as IDS did, is undeniably a stupid thing to do. IDS's failure to understand the causality in the figures on marriage which he often quotes illustrate a decided lack of brain power.
IDS argument that the UK is broken due to lack of marriage is Tory Taliban claptrap. We are one the world's most stable countrries.
grizzle100 1 year ago
@grizzle100 You criticise the government for its alleged deceit. However, you are unable to provide evidence to support your claims and make unfounded statements that are based on preconceptions.
A reduction in the number of legitimate children, coupled with an increase in divorce, is hardly a sign of stability. For this and other reasons, it is consensus that society is broken.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Thats my son and daughter you are talking about you bigot.
Illlegitimacy and divorce is hardly a sign of a broken society. That is called being a liberal democracy, something you clearly don't believe in.
We aren't talking Somalia here. Your definition of broken is frankly idiotic.
You have clearly accepted the fact IDS is stupid since you haven't disputed it, he is also a creationist which is inherently stupid
grizzle100 1 year ago
Your family is no concern of mine; sentiment should not inhibit argument.
Marriage is a stable institution that provides the appropriate conditions for parenting and childhood. It ensure that the foundations of society remain firm, so a community that lacks it is divided.
The statement "IDS is a highly intelligent man" makes it perfectly obvious that I oppose your position. Your final remark does not concern politics and is therefore irrelevant.
MrYoungIndependence 1 year ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Typical ideologue,j ust like the Marxists. How strange that so many neo cons like yourself were once Marxists ( I am not saying you were).
You are also wrong about marriage. Caring parents who separate amicably have far happier children that warring marriages that stay together for the children. Indeed there is some evidence that step family children are better able to deal that most difficult of all issues for a human being- someone else.
grizzle100 11 months ago
@grizzle100 I am neither a neoconservative nor a Marxist.
MrYoungIndependence 11 months ago
You certainly aren't a Marxist.
However I would gainsay that you are pretty close to neo con thinking on moral issues, Palin- esque.
grizzle100 11 months ago
@grizzle100 As I have previously stated, my guiding principle is libertarianism. Contrary to your implications, this is compatible with family values.
MrYoungIndependence 11 months ago
It is more expensive for single people to live, as recognised in the pension system, that is why two people in a relationship who don't live together get more than a couple.
I am afraid calls for moral rearmament as outlined by you are not libertarian except according to the definitions outlined by nationalists- hardly liberal democractic. The social progress made since the was would be undone by such a policy advocated by the bald twit lion
grizzle100 11 months ago
@grizzle100 If cohabitation is more difficult than marriage then the latter is preferable. You have defeated your own argument.
MrYoungIndependence 11 months ago
@MrYoungIndependence
People who are in a relationship don't always live together, except in Walton mountain where you live.
I am not sure where cohabitation comes into it.
I you cohabit under pension or benefits you are treated as if you were married Duh..
grizzle100 11 months ago
@grizzle100 I can see that we will get absolutely nowhere with this debate.
MrYoungIndependence 11 months ago
@MrYoungIndependence
Almost certainly , indeed my most liberal friends think I'm liberal.
No marriage, no baptism, nothing except a solstice ivy ceremony on Haytor twenty years ago, and even then I don't buy Paganism - though it is at least liberal ( usually)
grizzle100 11 months ago
@MrYoungIndependence Britains welfare plans are crazy and ungenerous.
Invesigator 3 months ago
Who gave the governemnt the right to regulate facilitate or do anything as far as marriage of a couple is concerned? Tomorrow they will start giving money to couples who don't fight. This is ridiculous.
dynomyght 1 year ago
Comment removed
zanyzoo6767 1 year ago
Toynbee is an arse
ladmolav 1 year ago 5
He converted her to him! lol
redmattuk 1 year ago
I'm a Labour Party member, but Iain Duncan Smith usually comes across well. That's not to say I agree with him however - I certainly don't on this issue, and Poly raises good points about this strange scheme.
phiellaep 1 year ago
he is an honerable man, who has honestly undergone a real eye opening expereience and wants to make things better for ordinary people. its just a shame he didn't have it before he was tory leader.
jinkedful 1 year ago
@jinkedful
no hes not he is a thick liar
grizzle100 1 year ago
Nazi Gas Chamber Guard.
GenericEmotions 1 year ago
HEEEE'S TURNING UP THE VOLUUUME
purpleferret 1 year ago
Giving a tax incentive to couples that marry would mean they would be less inclined to part when children come along.
jrnjames1 1 year ago
What this feminist attack dog, Toynbe is doing is classic projection. She is projecting onto I.D.S what the feminists have been doing for forty years. THEY interferred in family life by setting up a system that was designed to make marriges fail. They used divorce and tax laws to do it. Now she is accusing IDS of doing what her pals are doing. This is how feminists work. They reverse the guilt. IDS should have asked HER, why are you against marriage and why do you hate the idea of supporting it?
DumblyBrilliant 2 years ago
She is a fricking retard.
Must say, I really do 'buy' IDS's commitment to this cause.
OneBigRetard 2 years ago
@OneBigRetard
Your right there , any way who reads the fuckin Guardian utter shite!
theblackmafia71 1 year ago
@theblackmafia71 THE FUCKING SUN IS ABOVE YOUR LEVEL YA WANKER : )
Che870 1 year ago
@theblackmafia71 TRYING TO MAKE FRIENDS I SEE HOW SWEET : ) : ) : )
Che870 1 year ago
I ahev never heard such dump comments in my life ""what makes you think that the government can reach into peoples lives and change the way they behave" says Polly...er......The law Polly???.....
She truely is one of the thickest women in Britian
AlienPsyTing 2 years ago
@AlienPsyTing err, are you too thick to pick up the context she meant it in? No government can pass a law saying 'you will get married and never divorce' unless you live in a dictatorship.
zephyruk 1 year ago