As this Movie rightfully points out - Christians stopped using your argument.. many Centuries ago - because it was so radically inneffective in convincing anyone. Iron Age peasants weren't impressed by your argument, so I think to afford it any degree of respect would be to undermine the Human Brain..
I stopped believing this video when it claimed at least one of the previous "saviors" was "also" born on December 25. First, no prophecy demands that Christ have been born on December 25; the Roman calendar didn't even exist when the Messianic prophecies were made. Second, any pastor will admit we have no actual idea what day Jesus was born on; Christians first celebrated on the solstice (NOT the 25th, mind you) out of convenience. Price is, at best, not examining what he's rejecting.
I've been to various Churches, usually different Sects. I've never once met a Pastor who would admit that.
Also, Christian Councils set up the 25th of December as the Date - because it coincided with the Pagan Festival (Winter Solstice) which was appropriated by the Christian Councils - they thought it would be easier to convert if they stuck to the pre-existing date that people were used to. ''Out of convenience'' - what's your source for that?
@BelfastAtheist "I've never once met a Pastor who would admit that." I'm sorry to hear that's been your experience. Mine has been the exact opposite: various churches of different denominations; none that WOULDN'T admit to it. Maybe it's a Belfast thing?
Regardless, you can read more about why we know it wasn't December by going to revneal.org/Writings/jesusbirth.htm
@TonDogWayner You may see other films similar to it and have even the same actors all this does not make a new and latest film false. Also if you here of an original film and then discover that there were older films similar to it does not make it false. You see what I'm saying is this in he beginning the Jesus story was spoken of and taught but the story over the many years got taken changed a bit or even the story was kept closely the same in other words it was copied
@TonDogWayner As I have said before on Videos of this sort and on statements like the one you have made. Its not proof that Jesus is false. Obviously if there is a Satan then for Christians it makes sense that he planed the similarities to deceive but for none believers obviously that's not an acceptable answer. I'l put it this way when a film is due out you here about it here stuff about it then you watch the real film. Of course that does not make the film false because you have heard about it
He says that Christians say that Satan planed the Jesus similarities in advance in a way as if its impossible Well if there is a Satan then it surely would make sense for beleivers but not for none believers. So its pointless making such a statement and especially the way he said it. To prove or disprove something would require some evidence where both sides cant argue with such facts.
it would seem logical to any observer that christianty has merely evolved from past religions. making it to appear as it is, just absolute bollocks. people in distress, or insecure or perhaps indoctronated will keep the myth alive unfortunately.
i love how he says "in advance." as if to say, how could people really believe that god would fuck with people that much as to allow the devil to make the christ story seem borrowed so more people reject jesus christ?
i love how he says "in advance." as if to say, how could people really believe that god would fuck with people that much as to allow the devil to make the christ story seem borrowed so more people reject jesus christ?
jesus is a holy prophet who send by god to deliver the message OF gOD ;TO WORSHIP only the creator the only God but the bible was corrupted by many and each one see JESUSas he wantand they use the miracles which was proof that he was a messenger to proof that he was aGODas was for other religion and so THE ALMIGHTY GOD send another messenger to correct all this dillusion with another book ;the word of GOD the name is QURAN read it and all your question will be answered
legalbeagle26, don't you think that the similarites between the various Christs and Jesus are too striking, and that the Justin Martyr explanation gives the whole thing away? You're using sophistry to deny the truth.
The argument is "Cum Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc" With this therefore because of this. You assume that two stories correlate simply because they appear to have relation. This is a logical fallacy. Two stories may appear to be similar but that doesn't necessarily mean one came from the other. I urge you to think critically about such things
You clearly have an opinion, jordan. You fail to express it in a form that we can relate to as thinking beings and conduct a sensible debate based upon your intellectuality and your clever reasoning.
ok im not christian and im not atheist but, how can you believe in a contradicting book that was written by people over 50-70 years after Jesus "died"? Plus the Church is constantly changing the Bible so if its true form existed, its long lost by now. if we had the original, we might have been able to make alot more sense out of all this.
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This video is total horse shit. "Resurrection Narratives," by Mettinger (a non-Christian) refutes these type of claims, as does "The Gospel and the Greeks," by Nash. The "copy-cat" theory was refuted by scholars in the early 20th century
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The guy who said those words was a bullshitting mud race liar. Are you that blind? Watch it again brainwashed fool. Hes bullshitting. Niggers & spics are professional liars.
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what you just told me, you shall say it to him aswell, so that even if he is not aware that he is a "bullshitting mud race liar" you would have the opporunity then to tell him as you have said it to me, so he will know aswell
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Speak not Satan. What have you against the Roman Catholic church? Yeshu Yeshu did say that those that are not against us are with us. Their are two signs Love and Unity. Nobody invetned the church it was called to be by Hakadosh Baruch Hu Himself. The church is the bride of Christ and as it is the church is divided as a whole, yet a day will come when the Truth comes back and all shall be clear, face to face. Come Yeshu Yeshu and settle matters right.
FIRST FLAW IN THIS VIDEO you're all so raving about - Yeshua (Jesus Christ) wasn't born on December 25th! That was an invention of the Roman Catholic Church, which is Christian in name only! It was designed to lure pagans into Christianity through compromise. That's why orthodox Christians no longer celebrate "Christ-mas"
First flaw, LOL, come on rex, let's give you he existed, ok? then which Jesus are you presuming existed, the one that spoke Aramaic while alive, or Greek after death?
So now we should believe that the December 25th thing was made up but the rest of the story is really true. Why does the nativity story copy all the symbology of other Sun gods born on December 25th?
Actually the December 25th thing is the Winter Solstice falls about then. It was the egalitarian Feast of Saturnalia in the early Roman Empire, later it became the High Holy Day of both Sol Invictus and Mithras. The Christian feast of the Annunciation on January 5th was a real flop in the popularity stakes by comparrison, so like so much else, Christianity was swallowed up by the larger corporations who kept the Christ label for marketing purposes.
"Yeshua (Jesus Christ) wasn't born on December 25th!"
Ha! You're correct! So one must wonder why the church chose 25 Dec to celebrate the centrepiece's birthday. One must also wonder what the centerpiece's birthday really was?
He was after all born a biological bastard child. And was also prophecied to be "Bigger than Elvis, and about to be born!"
Everyone say this coming, it was widely expected. Did noone honestly write down the baby's b-day?
I know that Jesus Son of God is a fiction - copied from so many pagans religion. It is easier to sell the concept to Pagans at the time of Roman/Byzantyne empire...it is all about "Marketing" the newborn religion. Till now, Christians are happily celebrating Pagans Holidays - Christmas, Easter, Halloween. Poor suckers.
As I remember, it was said in the movie that like Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, and the god named Horus were allaged to have been born of virgins. But, that is near impossible since both Buddha and Krishna's mothers were married. As for Horus, in the story, his mother, Isis, is the lover of Osiris. Whether you are Christian or not, these errors should seriously call into question Mr. Flemming's credibility. I have posted similar stuff on other videos related to this movie.
Does anyon really know that they would bet their eyes or their loved ones lives that the truth is in any theology? That is why belief is belief and knowing absolutely is knowing.
24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.
And about these interviews, I wonder just how many people were interviewed and how many plenty of good answers and responses were cut out and only the foolish ones put it? Everyone's got an agenda so I guess it makes sense to not put in any information that would weaken you're case... but still...
This is a major misconception. The births MAY have been done without the act of sex in the stories, but the mothers were certainly not virgins. Osiris was dismembered and then put back together for a new existence in the realm of the dead cause he was not actually alive in the normal sense of the word.
You can still be a Christian and not believe in the "myth" of Christ(death, resurrection, virgin birth, divinity) The Gnostics don't believe he is divine and neither do Deist(Our founding fathers) and some Quakers.
and none of the previous religions held enough water to stick around. What was it that made this one last for 2000 years? Many of the things you listed in the other messiahs that compared to Jesus were mostly things that were in prophecy. If someone is trying to prove someone as a messiah wouldn't it make sense for them to say that they fufilled the prophecies? They had to to even give their claim any validity!
What happened to the cult of Osiris? The death of the messiah was prophecied in Psalms. To say that Osiris was the messiah they would HAVE to say that he rose from the grave, even if he didn't you catch my drift? I know I know how do we know we aren't doing the same thing for Jesus well if hundreds of men who saw Jesus were thrown to lions because they wouldn't deny Jesus as Christ it sounds a lot more unlikely that they would die so willingly for something they just kinda "made up"
Funny thing is you assume the pagans really gave a shit about what Psalms said. The jews were seen as basically a tribal cult up until the late 1st centuary
Well could it not be possible that God would implant an idea of a God dying for his people long before his arrival? If all these religions share so many similarities then could it not be true that these ideas are given by God himself before his arrival? If pagans didn't give a crap about the "Jewish cult" then why would their religions hold similarities?
And perhaps you guys aren't aware of just how many prophecies the messiah had to fufill to BE the messiah. go to Yahoo and search "Odds of Jesus fulfilling prophecies" and you will see that the odds of any man fufilling 8 of the prophecies is 10^17. To fufill all 48 it was 10^157 power. Odds are in Jesus' favor.
and then what are the odds of those said followers Dying by lions for their made up stories when all they had to do to save their life was to admit that they were just stories. It seems MORE farfetched that they would die for a fairy tale then what they really saw isn't it? :)
The followers who died as martyrs did not make up the stories. They believed in them wholeheartedly. Also, there were persecutions of other cults and their followers died for believing in what you consider false gods. That argument used by apologists is so easy to prove wrong it is amazing it's repeated so many times.
So all the Disciples made up the stories? Give me a brake! They were there, so they would not be follwing a story they heard, but one that they lived! It puts the arguement on a whole different and more powerful level? Maybe these cultists died for something they heard, but this sir, is not just dying for faith alone but by what they saw and experienced.
Who says we know what the disciples believed. We have none of their writings or if they all even existed. You assume the disciples all tell the story in Mark. This is the story after at least 40 years of accumulating legendary elements. Most of the events in the gospels are not mentioned by Paul. The initial followers of Jesus very well could have believed Jesus ascended to heaven because of dreams or visions and be sincerely convinced that was the case.
CHRISTIANITY; The Belife that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree....yeah, makes perfect sence.
CHRISTIANITY; The Belief that God sent down his Spirit in a Jewish Man's body who was par t of a trinity (God is not just the father, only in Jewish culture. God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) who can save your soul that will live forever if you (symbolicly) partake in his sacrifice then we no longer have to face an eternity apart from him and what is good.
Focus more on the symbolism then literal flesh eating and snakes and trees.
all established religion is bollocks. grade a bollocks.
god (in all established religions)is a dictator...he sees everything u do, he knows everthing u do and if u dont do as he says...U GO TO HELL! the main point of religion: suffer now and go to heaven. repression. nature made us, nature is everywere sees all and knows /feels what we do. we r part of nature.
>>thomaski87god is just a symbol for nature blatently, basically just fucking live life and enjoy it<<
Nice idea. The problem arises when some decide to do extreme evil and good people suffer. So how the fuck can good people "enjoy life and live it?"(without teaching some moral conscience?)
what and u think reading those people a book and lieing to them about it will stop them...lol cos evidently it does not. those people say to others they r teaching them morals, and how to be good, and religion proves a very usefull toll to get them to beleive...
thomaski87--Your reply is very choppy---I just gave the "reason" for spreading moral laws..of course not every one obeys moral or "civil" laws either. A person without guilt over evil is an animal.
lol so its not reasoning to think that because religion is a system of control and the basis for most wars, that it is morally incorrect? pfft. as u admit, its biggest downfall is its all written and told by man, probably with good intentions, but they get lost as man is a flawed
to u real reasoning is that because i cannot prove to u there is a no magical man in the clouds who is good, and horned creature in the earths core who is evil, its fact they exist. nice one.
its only mysterious to us because we cannot understand everything yet, like when any religion was formed, what couldnt be understood was attributed to god. now we know, well rational people know, its not the work of a magical man, its the work of nature, evolution is fact!
i dont like the word god, but yes to me, the universe is kind of god, but id rather just call it the universe...
so r saying most wars dont involve religion? cos if u r ur lieing. i know u could argue that man will have wars regardless, as atheists prove, but atheism can become almost a religionm itself. religion is what is used to hide behind and to suck what otherwise would be normal people into wars. take away religion and u take away the excuses for war and their means of recruiting.
In the final conclusion does it seem clear that much unpunished evil can be accomplished in this life as long as one is not caught in this life; therefore evil people have no need to worry during or after this life is over?
What is our soul being saved from? Answer: The anger of the same god towards us for a sin one of our ancestors commited. God himself unfairly damned us and now we are supposed to thank him for forgiving us? Also, saving us by dying in a cross only makes sense to primitive minds who thing god must be apeaced with blood. If he's going to forgive us for whatever imagined transgression we are guilty of then just forgive us. No need for a bloody death. XFxflow's description sounds right to me.
rm991 you are very unchurched. We are not damned for what Adam did, but for what we did. Adam did play a huge part with the fact that we couldn't sin if it wasn't for Adam, but have you guy's ever lied? Acted selfishly? Used others for you're own gain? Knew what was the right thing to do but didn't do it? You're own actions bought you you're own judgement. Did God want you to sin? No. Did he ever intend for us to know about sin? No. This is why he must interfere with forgiveness...
So what sin did a few months old baby commit to deserve being born with a genetic defect that kills him/her after months of excruciating pain? Also, what horrible sin have people committed to deserve the horrible pain of cancer? Because they lied? So I guess you think it is their own fault and they deserve what they got right?
... Ever since the beginning all sin was paid for with sacrafice because that was the punishment. Now, we no longer need to make sacrifices for our forgiveness because a sacrifice of infinite purity can pay for infinite sins. Infinite bleach kills infinite disease.
What you rm991, as well as many many others are under is pride. "We didn't do anything wrong" sort of thing. It's probably best way to try to push this sort of thing away because if we don't acknowledge wrong, it does not exist right? The fact that the word purpose even exists is strange isn't it? Why would we create the word light if the universe didn't have any and was only darkness? Same with words like moral and purpose. But you'll just ignore these words and pretend they don't exist.
It is understandable that your god requires blood as the solution for everything. All the men women and children killed by his command and Christians dare to plea innocent to the mass murder of Pagans and Muslims by their "brothers in christ". Now Christians beg for tolerance of their cult while back-stabbing the ones who disrupt their "righteous agenda". See you in hell.
I don't think most people who suffer from diseases so painful not even the worst human sadist would have dreamed of deserve what they got. I guess you do. They must have sinned some how in your eyes to deserve it.
I read your complaint and factually definitely we have tons of evil along with the good in human history. This being the case and the concept that nothing cannot be made into something, reasons that something indeed started all there is. We can only search for the answers WHY this origin has also sustained evil rather than leave it out of creation/evolution and still allow free will.
yea, i read the book CHRISTIANITY BEFORE CHRIST. great book, if that doesnt show that religion is man made than i dont know what does. How can these gods, from the same part of the world, have the same life story as Jesus, almost identical ! The kicker- these saviour gods came about hundreds of years before Jesus was invented.
I agreet that fundementalist Christianity is bad. However, it seems to me that this movie is a bit intelluctually dishonest. December 25 was not designated as Christmas until the third century. Also, the theory that Jesus is a copy of other figures is based on major misrepresentations. For example, Buddha and Krishna's mothers were not virgins since both were married.
The only proof that Jesus existed is in a ancient manuscript that became the bible. I am yet to find archaelogical and historical evidence of an empty tomb of Jesus.
Knowing who Dionysus was has nothing to do with believing that Jesus rose. This arguement is: "If Christianity can't prove to be first on every element of its doctrine then it isn't true." Hogwash. Yes, other religions *claim* that someone rose from the dead; but in the case of Christianity we see specific evidence that it is fact through eyewitness testimony. The cults deal in "long, long ago in a far off place"; Christianity supplies date, time, and witnesses.
No. Nobody has risen from the grave unless they WEREN'T DEAD. Didn't happen. Not to Adonis, not to Hercules, not to Dionysus, not to Jesus. Period. Ever. Didn't happen. Not once.
Ridiculous, has anybody else risen again from the grave? NOPE, even the Roman's who were Jesus' enemies tried to cover up the fact He had risen from the grave. Every other Jesus like figure is still in the grave man. That is what sets Jesus apart from the rest. By the way, most of His disciples died defending His resurrection and the truths of the gospel. If this was all a lie don't you think they would have just given up and gone home?
You make it sound like a conspiracy. It's not a secret that the Apostels fused Chistianity with the various near east mystery cults that already existed
" I saw it in the news a couple times" What news station does he watch? Lol. Why can't ppl just admit if they don't know about something?
thex13thxchild 2 months ago
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Evolution is an absolute disgrace to science.
Objects never order anything, mutations never order anything and natural selection will only select what has already been ordered.
Evolution is so irrational that it should be removed from all classrooms.
watch?v=HoKVVYJ8KJM
JungleJargon 4 months ago in playlist Teaching Evolution
@luvpusha
To each their own. I was just pointing out that it's not the best argument.
Good day to you. :)
BelfastAtheist 5 months ago
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@luvpusha
To each their own. I was just pointing out that it's not the best argument.
Good day to you. :)
BelfastAtheist 5 months ago
@luvpusha
To each their own. I was just pointing out that it's not the best argument.
Good day to you. :)
BelfastAtheist 5 months ago
@luvpusha
As this Movie rightfully points out - Christians stopped using your argument.. many Centuries ago - because it was so radically inneffective in convincing anyone. Iron Age peasants weren't impressed by your argument, so I think to afford it any degree of respect would be to undermine the Human Brain..
BelfastAtheist 5 months ago
I stopped believing this video when it claimed at least one of the previous "saviors" was "also" born on December 25. First, no prophecy demands that Christ have been born on December 25; the Roman calendar didn't even exist when the Messianic prophecies were made. Second, any pastor will admit we have no actual idea what day Jesus was born on; Christians first celebrated on the solstice (NOT the 25th, mind you) out of convenience. Price is, at best, not examining what he's rejecting.
ShireNomad 6 months ago
@ShireNomad
''Any pastor will admit''
I've been to various Churches, usually different Sects. I've never once met a Pastor who would admit that.
Also, Christian Councils set up the 25th of December as the Date - because it coincided with the Pagan Festival (Winter Solstice) which was appropriated by the Christian Councils - they thought it would be easier to convert if they stuck to the pre-existing date that people were used to. ''Out of convenience'' - what's your source for that?
BelfastAtheist 5 months ago
@BelfastAtheist "I've never once met a Pastor who would admit that." I'm sorry to hear that's been your experience. Mine has been the exact opposite: various churches of different denominations; none that WOULDN'T admit to it. Maybe it's a Belfast thing?
Regardless, you can read more about why we know it wasn't December by going to revneal.org/Writings/jesusbirth.htm
ShireNomad 4 months ago
@TonDogWayner You may see other films similar to it and have even the same actors all this does not make a new and latest film false. Also if you here of an original film and then discover that there were older films similar to it does not make it false. You see what I'm saying is this in he beginning the Jesus story was spoken of and taught but the story over the many years got taken changed a bit or even the story was kept closely the same in other words it was copied
ZeusHelios 8 months ago
@TonDogWayner As I have said before on Videos of this sort and on statements like the one you have made. Its not proof that Jesus is false. Obviously if there is a Satan then for Christians it makes sense that he planed the similarities to deceive but for none believers obviously that's not an acceptable answer. I'l put it this way when a film is due out you here about it here stuff about it then you watch the real film. Of course that does not make the film false because you have heard about it
ZeusHelios 8 months ago
He says that Christians say that Satan planed the Jesus similarities in advance in a way as if its impossible Well if there is a Satan then it surely would make sense for beleivers but not for none believers. So its pointless making such a statement and especially the way he said it. To prove or disprove something would require some evidence where both sides cant argue with such facts.
ZeusHelios 8 months ago
good video forthose who can see
comebigarestayathome 9 months ago
The guy with the beard is from the Jesus Seminar. I wouldn't take anything that particular institution says seriously
FuroraCeltica 11 months ago
Luke 21:8 "Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am he,' and, 'The time is near.' Do not follow them.
temo 1 year ago
The old delayed second coming, hello it's 2011...
elvismilk 1 year ago
@temo Trying to prove God exists by using the Bible, is like trying to prove Superman exists by using a comic book.
SirBraxton1989 11 months ago
@SirBraxton1989 k
temo 9 months ago
it would seem logical to any observer that christianty has merely evolved from past religions. making it to appear as it is, just absolute bollocks. people in distress, or insecure or perhaps indoctronated will keep the myth alive unfortunately.
kram83au 1 year ago
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i love how he says "in advance." as if to say, how could people really believe that god would fuck with people that much as to allow the devil to make the christ story seem borrowed so more people reject jesus christ?
Carlinism 1 year ago
i love how he says "in advance." as if to say, how could people really believe that god would fuck with people that much as to allow the devil to make the christ story seem borrowed so more people reject jesus christ?
Carlinism 1 year ago
jesus is a holy prophet who send by god to deliver the message OF gOD ;TO WORSHIP only the creator the only God but the bible was corrupted by many and each one see JESUSas he wantand they use the miracles which was proof that he was a messenger to proof that he was aGODas was for other religion and so THE ALMIGHTY GOD send another messenger to correct all this dillusion with another book ;the word of GOD the name is QURAN read it and all your question will be answered
TheTutrue 1 year ago
everybody look out for "gabriel's revelation",another proof that christianity is just a rip-off of other religions before christ
geiuy 1 year ago
legalbeagle26, don't you think that the similarites between the various Christs and Jesus are too striking, and that the Justin Martyr explanation gives the whole thing away? You're using sophistry to deny the truth.
nomoremyths1 1 year ago
The argument is "Cum Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc" With this therefore because of this. You assume that two stories correlate simply because they appear to have relation. This is a logical fallacy. Two stories may appear to be similar but that doesn't necessarily mean one came from the other. I urge you to think critically about such things
legalbeagle26 1 year ago
We are walking into a very dark night.
It must be dark, very dark...to appreiciate
the light.
Demama777 2 years ago
LOL ! Most religions prophecy predict the end of the world and then consistently work together to ensure that these prophecies come true.
MyFartsRock 2 years ago 2
Anyone know the name of the song?
Kevinsufacation 2 years ago
Is there anything dimmer than a Christian?
ClumsyRoot 2 years ago 2
A muslim (maybe)?
lucidatheist 1 year ago
@lucidatheist
Point taken.
ClumsyRoot 1 year ago
We will never know the truth...none of you
TokenChokin 3 years ago
@TokenChokin The truth is Jesus Christ is son of God and is Lord and Savior.
tylerh5k 2 years ago
That's a statement, not particularly "truth"..
shoulderkolibri 2 years ago
I can agree with that to a certain extent.
tylerh5k 2 years ago
Osiris is the Christ, Horus is the son of God and the Christ, as Horus and Osiris are one and the same. The Lord is Osiris and Horus is the saviour.
martynblackburn1977 1 year ago
@tylerh5k dont ever pull your face out of the sand, as embarressment is sure to follow your ignorance.
kram83au 1 year ago
@kram83au okay
tylerh5k 1 year ago
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@kram83au okay
tylerh5k 1 year ago
10 out 10 christian theologians admit that jesus is " LORD OF HEAVEN " or BAAL SHAMEM.
It is written in art and music and scholarly theological books.
Baal Shamem means "LORD OF HEAVEN "and it is the ancient name of Zeus
eretzsus 3 years ago
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that movie is the stupidest shit ive ever seen.. it has a bunch of retarded atheists who think they know what theyre talking about
jordandavis7 3 years ago
lol.
A very defensive person, you are.
Truth is very hard to swallow for many.
wrestler50000 3 years ago 3
Ha ha ha. Good response. I love how they just attack when feeling like they've been backed into a corner.
JBlueMast 2 years ago
@JBlueMast -- why don't you try and attack me with your thoughts and theories and see what I got, then we'll see who gets backed into a cornor.
tylerh5k 2 years ago
Did it take you 7 months to come up with that? Seriously...I don't even remember this conversation. Have a good one.
JBlueMast 2 years ago
so u believe the bs in the bible? wow...
MiPedoteTUMBA 3 years ago 11
Wow.Airtight arguement there.Flawless and penetrating logic.Robert M. Price,you stand completely refuted.
jeffphansen77 3 years ago
You clearly have an opinion, jordan. You fail to express it in a form that we can relate to as thinking beings and conduct a sensible debate based upon your intellectuality and your clever reasoning.
Do try again?
draagon66 3 years ago
ok im not christian and im not atheist but, how can you believe in a contradicting book that was written by people over 50-70 years after Jesus "died"? Plus the Church is constantly changing the Bible so if its true form existed, its long lost by now. if we had the original, we might have been able to make alot more sense out of all this.
puddinisgood 2 years ago 3
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This video is total horse shit. "Resurrection Narratives," by Mettinger (a non-Christian) refutes these type of claims, as does "The Gospel and the Greeks," by Nash. The "copy-cat" theory was refuted by scholars in the early 20th century
GreekOrthodoxy 3 years ago
What is the name of that song playing in the video? I like it!
BlackHit 3 years ago 3
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The Biblical record is always infallible.
Disregard the satanic counterfeits out of Babel and Egypt.
I understand Robert was a Christianette.
Now he needs to get saved and become a Christian.
:-)
trac4yt 3 years ago
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The guy who said those words was a bullshitting mud race liar. Are you that blind? Watch it again brainwashed fool. Hes bullshitting. Niggers & spics are professional liars.
shwantz2 3 years ago
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what you just told me, you shall say it to him aswell, so that even if he is not aware that he is a "bullshitting mud race liar" you would have the opporunity then to tell him as you have said it to me, so he will know aswell
Elijah4Love 3 years ago
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"It's all about Jesus" blessed is he who said those words.
Elijah4Love 3 years ago
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Speak not Satan. What have you against the Roman Catholic church? Yeshu Yeshu did say that those that are not against us are with us. Their are two signs Love and Unity. Nobody invetned the church it was called to be by Hakadosh Baruch Hu Himself. The church is the bride of Christ and as it is the church is divided as a whole, yet a day will come when the Truth comes back and all shall be clear, face to face. Come Yeshu Yeshu and settle matters right.
Elijah4Love 3 years ago
"It's been on the news a couple of times." LOL! Typically ignorant Christian.
ClumsyRoot 3 years ago
FIRST FLAW IN THIS VIDEO you're all so raving about - Yeshua (Jesus Christ) wasn't born on December 25th! That was an invention of the Roman Catholic Church, which is Christian in name only! It was designed to lure pagans into Christianity through compromise. That's why orthodox Christians no longer celebrate "Christ-mas"
gman40soon 4 years ago
First flaw in your post
You presume Jesus ever existed.
rexthebarker 4 years ago 15
First flaw, LOL, come on rex, let's give you he existed, ok? then which Jesus are you presuming existed, the one that spoke Aramaic while alive, or Greek after death?
elvismilk 1 year ago
"That was an invention of the Roman Catholic Church"
Much like the rest of your putrid human sacrifice, and death cult was an invention.
MikkalaTube 4 years ago 3
So now we should believe that the December 25th thing was made up but the rest of the story is really true. Why does the nativity story copy all the symbology of other Sun gods born on December 25th?
drflynn73 4 years ago 3
Actually the December 25th thing is the Winter Solstice falls about then. It was the egalitarian Feast of Saturnalia in the early Roman Empire, later it became the High Holy Day of both Sol Invictus and Mithras. The Christian feast of the Annunciation on January 5th was a real flop in the popularity stakes by comparrison, so like so much else, Christianity was swallowed up by the larger corporations who kept the Christ label for marketing purposes.
formless777 4 years ago
"Yeshua (Jesus Christ) wasn't born on December 25th!"
Ha! You're correct! So one must wonder why the church chose 25 Dec to celebrate the centrepiece's birthday. One must also wonder what the centerpiece's birthday really was?
He was after all born a biological bastard child. And was also prophecied to be "Bigger than Elvis, and about to be born!"
Everyone say this coming, it was widely expected. Did noone honestly write down the baby's b-day?
MikkalaTube 4 years ago
Actually i went to space once
and i found out we are th most advance civilization.
We are the only life here.
there are exactly 12x99to the power of 9999999999999999999999999999999999
planets in the universe.
There are exactly 4x12to the power of 7894444584 universes
olfkin 4 years ago
I know that Jesus Son of God is a fiction - copied from so many pagans religion. It is easier to sell the concept to Pagans at the time of Roman/Byzantyne empire...it is all about "Marketing" the newborn religion. Till now, Christians are happily celebrating Pagans Holidays - Christmas, Easter, Halloween. Poor suckers.
alphamain 4 years ago 3
As I remember, it was said in the movie that like Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, and the god named Horus were allaged to have been born of virgins. But, that is near impossible since both Buddha and Krishna's mothers were married. As for Horus, in the story, his mother, Isis, is the lover of Osiris. Whether you are Christian or not, these errors should seriously call into question Mr. Flemming's credibility. I have posted similar stuff on other videos related to this movie.
metaldude82 4 years ago
You're talking about fables. Virgin, or not, still fables. Get over it.
sillychrist 4 years ago
Without that drab story in the bible dominating our existence we become something wonderful.
mistaspot1 4 years ago
The righteous are in daily glory while the unrighteous are daily called to repentance.
Their life caught up in misery; they look like you and look like me; yet they can't see what you and I can see.--MB's
"For I came not for the righteous but for the sinner." JC
EGMAG 4 years ago
I believe you mean,"self righteous".
sillychrist 4 years ago
Whatever is righteous is knowing right from wrong/ good from evil/ sin from no sin. All of it is the same for society co-existence in peace!
EGMAG 4 years ago
Does anyon really know that they would bet their eyes or their loved ones lives that the truth is in any theology? That is why belief is belief and knowing absolutely is knowing.
EGMAG 4 years ago
the bible says drugs r bad right? but it says alcohol is ok...wtf??? bullshit
thomaski87 4 years ago
hahahaa stupid religions
XFxflow250 4 years ago
24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.
- Jesus (Matthew 24)
plajsnip06 4 years ago
And about these interviews, I wonder just how many people were interviewed and how many plenty of good answers and responses were cut out and only the foolish ones put it? Everyone's got an agenda so I guess it makes sense to not put in any information that would weaken you're case... but still...
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
and about Mary being married and a vergin, nobody said she was a vergin after Jesus, just before.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
Right, and all those other "saviors" were supposedly born of virgins as well.
Aquarianbrass 4 years ago
This is a major misconception. The births MAY have been done without the act of sex in the stories, but the mothers were certainly not virgins. Osiris was dismembered and then put back together for a new existence in the realm of the dead cause he was not actually alive in the normal sense of the word.
metaldude82 4 years ago
Mary was not married when she concieved Jesus.
metaldude82 4 years ago
You can still be a Christian and not believe in the "myth" of Christ(death, resurrection, virgin birth, divinity) The Gnostics don't believe he is divine and neither do Deist(Our founding fathers) and some Quakers.
Aquarianbrass 4 years ago
and none of the previous religions held enough water to stick around. What was it that made this one last for 2000 years? Many of the things you listed in the other messiahs that compared to Jesus were mostly things that were in prophecy. If someone is trying to prove someone as a messiah wouldn't it make sense for them to say that they fufilled the prophecies? They had to to even give their claim any validity!
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
The cult of Osiris lasted for nearly 3000 years.
What do you say to that. Oh, and he died and was resurrected as well.
Aquarianbrass 4 years ago
What happened to the cult of Osiris? The death of the messiah was prophecied in Psalms. To say that Osiris was the messiah they would HAVE to say that he rose from the grave, even if he didn't you catch my drift? I know I know how do we know we aren't doing the same thing for Jesus well if hundreds of men who saw Jesus were thrown to lions because they wouldn't deny Jesus as Christ it sounds a lot more unlikely that they would die so willingly for something they just kinda "made up"
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
Well, if Christianity is true and all other religions false then it seems that men die for "made up stuff" all time.
Did you know that among those who were martyred were Gnostics who thought of Jesus as a symbol not a real man.
Aquarianbrass 4 years ago
Funny thing is you assume the pagans really gave a shit about what Psalms said. The jews were seen as basically a tribal cult up until the late 1st centuary
ozatheist 4 years ago
Well could it not be possible that God would implant an idea of a God dying for his people long before his arrival? If all these religions share so many similarities then could it not be true that these ideas are given by God himself before his arrival? If pagans didn't give a crap about the "Jewish cult" then why would their religions hold similarities?
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
And perhaps you guys aren't aware of just how many prophecies the messiah had to fufill to BE the messiah. go to Yahoo and search "Odds of Jesus fulfilling prophecies" and you will see that the odds of any man fufilling 8 of the prophecies is 10^17. To fufill all 48 it was 10^157 power. Odds are in Jesus' favor.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
But the odds of followers making stories up to make him fulfill prophecy are very high
rm991 4 years ago
and then what are the odds of those said followers Dying by lions for their made up stories when all they had to do to save their life was to admit that they were just stories. It seems MORE farfetched that they would die for a fairy tale then what they really saw isn't it? :)
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
The followers who died as martyrs did not make up the stories. They believed in them wholeheartedly. Also, there were persecutions of other cults and their followers died for believing in what you consider false gods. That argument used by apologists is so easy to prove wrong it is amazing it's repeated so many times.
rm991 4 years ago
So all the Disciples made up the stories? Give me a brake! They were there, so they would not be follwing a story they heard, but one that they lived! It puts the arguement on a whole different and more powerful level? Maybe these cultists died for something they heard, but this sir, is not just dying for faith alone but by what they saw and experienced.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
Who says we know what the disciples believed. We have none of their writings or if they all even existed. You assume the disciples all tell the story in Mark. This is the story after at least 40 years of accumulating legendary elements. Most of the events in the gospels are not mentioned by Paul. The initial followers of Jesus very well could have believed Jesus ascended to heaven because of dreams or visions and be sincerely convinced that was the case.
rm991 4 years ago
CHRISTIANITY; The Belife that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree....yeah, makes perfect sence.
XFxflow250 4 years ago
CHRISTIANITY; The Belief that God sent down his Spirit in a Jewish Man's body who was par t of a trinity (God is not just the father, only in Jewish culture. God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) who can save your soul that will live forever if you (symbolicly) partake in his sacrifice then we no longer have to face an eternity apart from him and what is good.
Focus more on the symbolism then literal flesh eating and snakes and trees.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
sure mate, when they prove it, I still wont do it, cause christianity is for fags
XFxflow250 4 years ago
XFxflow250, you seem a bit bitter towards christianity. What did we do to you? :)
Read "Mere Christianity" by C.S. Lewis if you want a rational and reasonable debate for an existance of a God but until then don't be bitter :)
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
Christianity is a lie
XFxflow250 4 years ago
And xFxflow250you have provided no evidence to make this claim so it's really only opinion right now ;)
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
ITS EVOLUTION, not revolution
Man EVOLVED
XFxflow250 4 years ago
all established religion is bollocks. grade a bollocks.
god (in all established religions)is a dictator...he sees everything u do, he knows everthing u do and if u dont do as he says...U GO TO HELL! the main point of religion: suffer now and go to heaven. repression. nature made us, nature is everywere sees all and knows /feels what we do. we r part of nature.
thomaski87 4 years ago
god is just a symbol for nature blatently, basically just fucking live life and enjoy it
thomaski87 4 years ago
Fxflow 250, didnt mean to attack u at end if any confusion, sry, just went off on one. with u, i concur
thomaski87 4 years ago
>>thomaski87god is just a symbol for nature blatently, basically just fucking live life and enjoy it<<
Nice idea. The problem arises when some decide to do extreme evil and good people suffer. So how the fuck can good people "enjoy life and live it?"(without teaching some moral conscience?)
EGMAG 4 years ago
what and u think reading those people a book and lieing to them about it will stop them...lol cos evidently it does not. those people say to others they r teaching them morals, and how to be good, and religion proves a very usefull toll to get them to beleive...
thomaski87 4 years ago
usefull tool to get them to believe
thomaski87 4 years ago
thomaski87--Your reply is very choppy---I just gave the "reason" for spreading moral laws..of course not every one obeys moral or "civil" laws either. A person without guilt over evil is an animal.
EGMAG 4 years ago
but spreading moral laws does not mean spreading lies and repression.
thomaski87 4 years ago
>>thomaski87 but spreading moral laws does not mean spreading lies and repression.<<
That is because the foundations of most moral theologies are blatantly twisted in actions to meet the needs of individual gratification.
EGMAG 4 years ago
hence my reasoning that established religion is bollocks...
thomaski87 4 years ago
>>thomaski87 hence my reasoning that established religion is bollocks...<<
No! Not reasoning at all. This "reasoned" conclusion is your "belief"; until proven otherwise.
EGMAG 4 years ago
lol so its not reasoning to think that because religion is a system of control and the basis for most wars, that it is morally incorrect? pfft. as u admit, its biggest downfall is its all written and told by man, probably with good intentions, but they get lost as man is a flawed
to u real reasoning is that because i cannot prove to u there is a no magical man in the clouds who is good, and horned creature in the earths core who is evil, its fact they exist. nice one.
thomaski87 4 years ago
basically like al religious freaks u ignore facts and spout bs about faith trust and mysterious forces. u have been lied to!
thomaski87 4 years ago
The universe is a complete mysterious force---is it god to you?
EGMAG 4 years ago
its only mysterious to us because we cannot understand everything yet, like when any religion was formed, what couldnt be understood was attributed to god. now we know, well rational people know, its not the work of a magical man, its the work of nature, evolution is fact!
i dont like the word god, but yes to me, the universe is kind of god, but id rather just call it the universe...
thomaski87 4 years ago
Your waisting time. Wars are mostly contrived by evil and not by good.
EGMAG 4 years ago
so r saying most wars dont involve religion? cos if u r ur lieing. i know u could argue that man will have wars regardless, as atheists prove, but atheism can become almost a religionm itself. religion is what is used to hide behind and to suck what otherwise would be normal people into wars. take away religion and u take away the excuses for war and their means of recruiting.
thomaski87 4 years ago
just out of curiosity, what is the religious explanation for dinosaurs and other planets? did god get it wrong?
also what are other religions? gods message went wrong? but ur one is correct? hmmmm bollocks
o yeh, he is such a kind god "do as i say or burn in hell for all eternity!" hmmmm lovely and godlike, dictatoer like. not even being sarcastic.
thomaski87 4 years ago
In the final conclusion does it seem clear that much unpunished evil can be accomplished in this life as long as one is not caught in this life; therefore evil people have no need to worry during or after this life is over?
EGMAG 4 years ago
no it doesnt
thomaski87 4 years ago
thomaski87no it doesnt<<
Why not? Please elucidate.
EGMAG 4 years ago
What is our soul being saved from? Answer: The anger of the same god towards us for a sin one of our ancestors commited. God himself unfairly damned us and now we are supposed to thank him for forgiving us? Also, saving us by dying in a cross only makes sense to primitive minds who thing god must be apeaced with blood. If he's going to forgive us for whatever imagined transgression we are guilty of then just forgive us. No need for a bloody death. XFxflow's description sounds right to me.
rm991 4 years ago
rm991 you are very unchurched. We are not damned for what Adam did, but for what we did. Adam did play a huge part with the fact that we couldn't sin if it wasn't for Adam, but have you guy's ever lied? Acted selfishly? Used others for you're own gain? Knew what was the right thing to do but didn't do it? You're own actions bought you you're own judgement. Did God want you to sin? No. Did he ever intend for us to know about sin? No. This is why he must interfere with forgiveness...
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
So what sin did a few months old baby commit to deserve being born with a genetic defect that kills him/her after months of excruciating pain? Also, what horrible sin have people committed to deserve the horrible pain of cancer? Because they lied? So I guess you think it is their own fault and they deserve what they got right?
rm991 4 years ago
... Ever since the beginning all sin was paid for with sacrafice because that was the punishment. Now, we no longer need to make sacrifices for our forgiveness because a sacrifice of infinite purity can pay for infinite sins. Infinite bleach kills infinite disease.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
What you rm991, as well as many many others are under is pride. "We didn't do anything wrong" sort of thing. It's probably best way to try to push this sort of thing away because if we don't acknowledge wrong, it does not exist right? The fact that the word purpose even exists is strange isn't it? Why would we create the word light if the universe didn't have any and was only darkness? Same with words like moral and purpose. But you'll just ignore these words and pretend they don't exist.
LifeReborn7 4 years ago
It is understandable that your god requires blood as the solution for everything. All the men women and children killed by his command and Christians dare to plea innocent to the mass murder of Pagans and Muslims by their "brothers in christ". Now Christians beg for tolerance of their cult while back-stabbing the ones who disrupt their "righteous agenda". See you in hell.
DarkHollow6 4 years ago
I don't think most people who suffer from diseases so painful not even the worst human sadist would have dreamed of deserve what they got. I guess you do. They must have sinned some how in your eyes to deserve it.
rm991 4 years ago
>>rm991 The anger ... god <<<
I read your complaint and factually definitely we have tons of evil along with the good in human history. This being the case and the concept that nothing cannot be made into something, reasons that something indeed started all there is. We can only search for the answers WHY this origin has also sustained evil rather than leave it out of creation/evolution and still allow free will.
EGMAG 4 years ago
1.- I'm not talking about created human evil. I'm talking about natural evils like diseases, or tsunamis, earthquakes to name a few,
2.- How do you know that first there was nothing and then there was something. Maybe something has always existed.
rm991 4 years ago
yea, i read the book CHRISTIANITY BEFORE CHRIST. great book, if that doesnt show that religion is man made than i dont know what does. How can these gods, from the same part of the world, have the same life story as Jesus, almost identical ! The kicker- these saviour gods came about hundreds of years before Jesus was invented.
flubno 4 years ago
I agreet that fundementalist Christianity is bad. However, it seems to me that this movie is a bit intelluctually dishonest. December 25 was not designated as Christmas until the third century. Also, the theory that Jesus is a copy of other figures is based on major misrepresentations. For example, Buddha and Krishna's mothers were not virgins since both were married.
metaldude82 4 years ago
The so-called Virgin Mary was married too.
Aquarianbrass 4 years ago
The only proof that Jesus existed is in a ancient manuscript that became the bible. I am yet to find archaelogical and historical evidence of an empty tomb of Jesus.
connerjd 4 years ago
Knowing who Dionysus was has nothing to do with believing that Jesus rose. This arguement is: "If Christianity can't prove to be first on every element of its doctrine then it isn't true." Hogwash. Yes, other religions *claim* that someone rose from the dead; but in the case of Christianity we see specific evidence that it is fact through eyewitness testimony. The cults deal in "long, long ago in a far off place"; Christianity supplies date, time, and witnesses.
searchjedi 4 years ago
You should check out a video called "Syncretism" on the ridi0t channel. He explains it rather well.
w0lfkilla 4 years ago
Soldieroflight777:
No. Nobody has risen from the grave unless they WEREN'T DEAD. Didn't happen. Not to Adonis, not to Hercules, not to Dionysus, not to Jesus. Period. Ever. Didn't happen. Not once.
Luchiadh 4 years ago
Ridiculous, has anybody else risen again from the grave? NOPE, even the Roman's who were Jesus' enemies tried to cover up the fact He had risen from the grave. Every other Jesus like figure is still in the grave man. That is what sets Jesus apart from the rest. By the way, most of His disciples died defending His resurrection and the truths of the gospel. If this was all a lie don't you think they would have just given up and gone home?
Soldieroflight777 4 years ago
lol, i see him like everyday, that's my girlfriends dad! heh, he's pretty awesome too. I've seen that movie twice as well.
Necr0FoxxeN 5 years ago
You make it sound like a conspiracy. It's not a secret that the Apostels fused Chistianity with the various near east mystery cults that already existed
shrinky428 5 years ago
oh yeah, and you forgot to mention Zoroaster
shrinky428 5 years ago