Freedomain Radio: Practical Politics

[fullfist]

.

Political power comes in severral ways, birth right, violent takeover, by sheer charisma and leadership (very hard these days, media is loyal to whoever pays the bills), by having a rich benefactor to fund the campaign to whom you owe big time.

Thus we can conclude that we live in a plutocracy , rule of the rich.

[DigitalSkyline]

Sounds all well in good in theory until the day you get pulled over, served a ticket and forced to comply by paying or losing your license to drive, then you get pulled over and put in jail.

[IterProLibertasV]

35:21. And what a journey it is

[ReasonDictates]

Currently I'm in the frustrated/ desperate/ angry portion of my experience with Libertarianism. I'm having a hard time being convinced to step away from politics altogether. I feel that changing peoples' minds about the way things are is an important task. Debate is necessary in my opinion. It offers a way to spread the message of liberty to more people. I don't think the message will ever spread if I reserve myself to waiting for people to come to me and ask me how they can be free

Suggestions?

[FactualSolutions]

What is real Freedom about?

Zeitgeist Movement, of course

- Watch Zeitgeist Addendum online - free -

:)

FS

[pointatthemoon]

Fifty bucks an hour! You are talking about people a lot more white collar then me or anyone I know. This is off wiki but here in America for women (I am a woman) the average (2007) is ~33,000-35,000 a year. That's around 16 bucks an hour. I'm a poor person and make around half that. I know you think highly of your audience but does virtue correlate in your mind so strongly with being incredibly well paid?

[djleoluck]

So what is the solution? I already am pretty disinterested in politics. I thought Ron Paul was great, 2-3 years ago. Now, it all seems pointless. But rather than just save time and money by ignoring politics, I want to know, how will my own personal freedom increase if I stop voting? Something just doesn't seem to equate. I will still be taxed and my government will still invade other countries, whether I vote or not. The solution seems to be, to get out of America and live elsewhere.

[grumpone]

@djleoluck All countries are the same, some worse than others. By not voting you do not give sanctiosn to the system. You will have to apy taxes anywhere or you'll be put in jail, everywhere. Being offshore and incorporated does help + changing your domicile. Of course you have to have time and money for that. Have as little or none of your assets in your personal name - play poor and you won't be suffering so much. If more people do it, the system will collapse sooner.

[LibertyJedi]

Yes I now see his solution, invest the money so you become a fatter cow to be milked even more by his strategy, later by the statists. Let's face it these people won't go away till we deal with them. His solution is to immobilize you and he has no solution, be a slave the rest of your life is suppose to be great because u are cornered by the fact of the issue that we don't want to do violence. I would have liked to have seen his argument during the revolution.... we can all be good slaves....

[grumpone]

@LibertyJedi Go ahead then, do violence oh wise one. Good luck with that. See how well that revolution turned out - being taxed and controlled more by your own in less than 30 years after that revolution (how many people died for that!) than the English monarchy ever would.

[LibertyJedi]

@grumpone no u do the violence u must be braver than me. I'm making a point of what it leads to, not sure if that is over your head. I have no idea what the mob rule will do and if they do or don't do violence is not bad or good as violence is not bad but rather the initialization of it is. If stealing continues not sure what people will do in self defense of econ. aggression, nor am I the wise one like Stef or you to know. I am sure u are so wise u know. In Freeedom,

[LibertyJedi]

@grumpone "oh wise one" evidence of the typically ass backwards retards found on FDR or is that a violation of free speech that only FDR can decode as the real truth? Not sure why my other response did not post, perhaps to truthful? Watch people that take away free speech, (anyway possible) that is a true sign of a limited mind like found here. Interesting u can judge the revolution in hind-site with all your knowledge, u must be smart like Stef.

[truevoice08]

Well, Ron Paul is still the greatest popularizer of libertarian ideas. Far more effective than this youtube channel has been. But I totally agree with you though. At least for now, I prefer to work with the best we have and maintain my support for Ron Paul.

[grumpone]

@truevoice08 I agree he is. The results of "waking people up" are debatable to say the least. How many take action? It is good to have some martyr - they change things in the long run - but I mean in the long run. I am sure Paul knows this and knows he will never get elected president.

[gijoeski1]

I'm been lucky enough to have been given a link to this video from a friend, and it's a barrel of laughs. You talk about cost of political activity and the man hours.

I'm curious, how much time do you invest in promoting the anarchist view? and, at the same time.... what's the cost involved in that?

It's not nothing!

[Springtime916]

political action isn't completely worthless Stefan. About a year and a half ago i was a neoconservative... where my veiws were somewhere close to Lee Doren's. Ron Paul's Campaign introduced me to libertarianism, and then finally i stumbled upon intellectually founded anarchy.

[grumpone]

@Springtime916 He means voting, not educating others through a national platform.

[libertarianjury]

critique of practical politics = "You HAVE to get other people to agree with you". WRONG. This is a common error of thinking. All the politician does is tell demographics what they want to hear, and act sincere. a la Reagan. When a demographic gets powerful enough, it wins election from the single issue voters who are conflicted on all issues, but agree with that one single issue. Most are conflicted, so this is how it actually works. I could go deeper, if there were no text limit here...

[grumpone]

@libertarianjury You know what, you are completely correct - The ones ruling you now sure didn't get people to agree with them, they just control the media and they make the "public opinion". The problem is that if you want to win, you have to hide your values and positions and scam the electorate.The problem is that after you are elected and show your true face your backers eliminate you, peacefully or violently.

[libertarianjury]

I really need to go through this whole video with you, and just point out your errors in thinking. There are sooooo many. Too many to name here. Internet/AI actually might be counted more towards libertarians, since information favors the intelligent, and the intelligent benefit more from it. The producers benefit more than the looters. Moreover, the state kills itself over time. Weak action from libertarians / abolitionists means liberty will be enacted in a stupider way - like civil war

[libertarianjury]

Clueless. Don't measure your strategies next to clueless standards. = "Paulestinian = clueless" your political action side was not given the "best side" it was given the clueless dilettante side. The straw man. I really need to educate you and the other libertarians. You are totally "all or nothing". Or "all" or "typical lbertarian stupidity" (= "nothing") LOL. You are a genius in many areas, but are clueless as to what effective and meaningful "politics" is. Politics is one more tool

[libertarianjury]

There are no data for our side, because libertarians are not trying. They don't really want freedom. I do. I've seen it be effective. Libertarians and anarchists don't want to be bothered to learn how to be effective in politics. I can prove this nine ways to sunday, should anyone ever care... Libertarians = total apathy, but smarter than joe sixpack.

[libertarianjury]

Your screen, "Politics v. Anarchy the core criticism" has it all wrong. You make gradations into "either/or" for the sake of argument, when they are gradations. This is intuitively hard for all-or-nothing type personalities to understand. Your limited definition about what "the" anarchist approach to politics is, is unnecessarily narrow. I qualify as an anarchist by some definitions, and not as others. The problem lies in your definition of 'voluntaryism' to your definition of 'state'.

[RuddODragonFear]

Stef:

Not "asymptotically". Exponentially. Asymptote means approaching a particular value but never reachin git. Look at the graphs, they not only approach tons of increasing values, they actually break all expectations of growth.

[virindi1]

Anarchist philosophy is simple as this: reject all unjustifiable authority.

[luckyday24]

Another good video. Just subscribed. 5*s

[Conza88]

Got a question.. what if you actually take power though? i.e do what you would usually do, have your normal job etc, live your life as free as possible, try to be a shining example.. but you don't - lobby for change from people that don't care - but run for office.. You join one of the main parties, network etc.. do what you love, and if that involves educating others - and speaking honestly about the problems,like Ron Paul - and if you won.. can't you reduce that state etc?Then its worthwhile?

[stefbot]

Well but people have been trying that approach for a few hundred years, it just doesn't work -- you might want to check out my free book Everyday Anarchy available on my website... :)

[Conza88]

What if you don't think they've been genuine in their attempts? i.e I don't think Reagan was ever genuine in actions.. but say, Ron Paul would be.. The founding fathers did it, why can't another individual of stature come along and do the same? :s

[stefbot]

What makes you think that the Founding Fathers were successful in their goal of creating a self limiting government? :)

[Conza88]

LoL. Fair point.. they set up a framework that made it harder.. But how do you limit the fact that power attracts the corruptible? How do you get the pure minds to run for office? And educate the public.. Arrghhh lol.

[stefbot]

Haha have a listen to my book 'Everyday Anarchy', it's free on my web site... :)

[libertarianjury]

So, if I'm living freedom, and I come home from the firing range one day, and the ATF has jacked my pregnant wife against the wall, murdered my unborn child, shot my teenage son, and is fully prepared to kill me or imprison me, FDRA will stop them? A person who has Jeff Cooper's skills would respond in kind.  That is the logical extension of FDRA, and why it's so valuable: It gives you the time to become a Jeff Cooper. But don't criticize politics: it CAN (partly chance) give you the same.

[stefbot]

Well you can keep pursuing the same "solutions" that have not worked for 200+ years then.

[libertarianjury]

I have an organized plan for action revolving around jury rights. The only problem with the plan is that it requires people who are approximately equally as educated as myself, and equally as willing to be arrested as myself. (And $.) ...It is a totally effective plan. I have to fund it myself, because I've never encountered anyone with the vision to understand how it will work. But the time is growing ripe for change. Noone can deny the FDRA approach is a powerful low-cost tactic.

[libertarianjury]

FDRA is effective, and does not rule out other political action. Most people are far from "Constitutional Conventions" where their high level of information might matter. But numerous human lives are saved by jury trials. No accurate $value can be put on those lives. If you fail to take political action, those lives will die. History is full of instances of ABLE people taking political action, or giving money to people who are more effective (and sometimes less effective) than they are.

[libertarianjury]

Moreover, not all political actions are equal. Moreover, FDRA is just another "low cost" (high information) political action. Also, with more information, political strategies become vastly more effective. You are in a position to create real change, but don't, possibly because your intelligence quotient is greater than your bravery quotient. To not vote for the least of several evils is simply to waste a very "low-cost" opportunity.  The players will play without you, until you become one.

[libertarianjury]

Your arguments fail to adequately value

1) entire economies and markets

2) individual human lives

the limited nature of political expenditure, given self-control.

Politics is never a half measure, unless you shoot the soldiers who have been sent out to kill you, and also shoot the man who gave them the order. That's also "playing politics", and also taking the FDRA approach. It's easy to sit on a jury, and it's also easy to get seated on the constitutional convention that creates juries.

[Shandalaybgood]

i found the "some key differences" table helpful.

[Shandalaybgood]

lord almity! lots of math and graphs!

[GonetoSleep21]

I find you extremely entertaining to listen to. Maybe it's the voice, maybe the charisma, what ever it is, you have it.

[adorianvlad]

I started watching your anarchism and ethics videos, so far I've been watching over 50 % of your philosophy videos and the past 20+ of your videos, Stef, and I really enjoy watching them, they are fun to watch, indeed.

They require a bit more effort in comparison with this last video of yours, for the obvious reasons of the suplemental visual presentation, here.

You've improved the efficiency of teaching methods with each video, I've figured and myself make videos using Camtasia studio and

[adorianvlad]

(continuation) I'm still learning how to improve my videos, now at least I now how to increase the speed of creating + downloading an error free video, with 100% download success both to my computer and youtube.

[aaron0883]

Great video.

[steelejk]

Dude, I like you videos but what the hell... Most people are born to follow. There is no way you could convince the majority of your viewpoint no matter how much it would work. Yeah, if the entire population were made up of FDRA thinkers it would work but that simple is never going to happen. People are sheep, they want to be led. You don't have to think as much. BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH.

[GonetoSleep21]

Quiet follower.

[davidngo4415]

i think this is the equivalent of a slave telling a fellow slave, "well, you and i want to be free and we could be, if we wanted to, but everyone else wants to be a slave. so we can't do this revolution alone. sorry. tough luck huh?"

[steelejk]

What I said is not like your slave analogy. It's more like theoretical versus practical. Theoretically this might work but when applied to the current mentality of homosapiens it falls flat. The fact that I'm told to be quiet and called a follower proves my point. Are you going to ridicule 99.9% of the population when they have opposing ideas? Are they going to listen to you? Fuck no. Convince me without fuzzy math. Convince me that humans aren't hardwired to be tribal, shit-chucking followers.

[xelenty]

Stef dude.. The emotional stress is taking longer than 5 weeks...

[PaulMcKeever]

I saw nothing in this video to suggest that achieving "personal freedom" will be any more effective in achieving political freedom than are other approaches.

To say that FDRA is a "multi-generational approach" is to say that FDRA cannot achieve the freedom of ones own generation.

I wish you well, but it does appear that you are ultimately saying: political freedom is not attainable, so give up seeking it and settle for "personal freedom". That's not "practical politics". It's therapy.

[stefbot]

Well as I mentioned a few times in the video, I could provide the positive case in 35 mins, since it would be far too time-consuming. This was just to point out that political activism is the polar opposite of "practical," and in terms of actually achieving freedom, FDRA is entirely practical and successful. :)

[PaulMcKeever]

"FDRA is entirely practical and successful."

Well, that's a bold claim. My point is that your video is 35 minutes long, and chock full of statistics showing other methods failing. Where are the stats showing FDRA succeeding? Why aren't they in the video?

[PaulMcKeever]

"FDRA is entirely practical and successful."

Well, that's a bold claim. My point is that your video is 35 minutes long, and chock full of statistics showing other methods failing.  Where are the stats showing FDRA succeeding? Why aren't they in the video?

[davidngo4415]

like PaulMcKeever, I would like to learn more about how FDRA will eventually free us from the state. I'm probably wrong but, the theory as i understand it is that if everyone agrees to UPB/RTR/etc. and brings that in their life, no one will see the need for a state anymore, and we can live a happy rational life. Should we just rely on the "argument" and hope it works out for generations in the future? It's helping in my life already, but is there a better way to see that we're gaining headway

[NeonKnight88]

I do research on the candidates, but I am voting none of the above in november.

[gnu11111]

I saw someone showing the exact same graphs for proving that free market doesn't work :-)

Large debts and high inflation is the result of _bad_ politics, not politics in general.

[cocaineduck]

Bad politics is unavoidable when politics is in use, in the same way as bad soccer is unavoidable for as long as the game of soccer is played.

[gnu11111]

empirically large groups of people fail to work within any system. anarchy failed as well, simply because large groups of people tend to f'up in general. all we know is how to organize in tribes of 30 to 100 people - there's no concept at all for anything bigger.

PS: maybe you never watched Real, Inter, ManU or Juventus.

[cocaineduck]

I completely agree, that is why this philosophy isnt revolutionary, its over the long haul.

However, with that very argument i would rather se us f*uck up without hierarchy than someone high in the hierarchy doing it. Most noteworthy at the moment Irak..

I have seen them, but you cant really use that as an argument agains "Bad soccer is more common than good soccer when soccer as a whole is played" since they are the elite teams. How about the other hundreds of thousands of teams around? :P

[TehBANN3D]

Woah, who gets $50 an hour? DO WANT.

[Ralajer]

Very good practical arguments to supplement the many fine moral arguments against the state and other institutions that cause people to loss their freedom. To address an earlier comment it freedom from the unchosen and unwanted burdens that others thrust upon us. That not to say freedom responsibility but rather freedom arbitrary whims.

[adorianvlad]

Stef, please accept my heartliest congratulations!! This is what I call professional! I've been watching several hundreds of videos on the Internet, including Nobel Laureates' Presentations, debates about countless scientific/religion/political/­social topics, and if this vodcast is not "Numero Uno", is in my all time Top 5! The clarity of ideeas, the sound quality, the brilliant visual presentation, the passionate speech, the intelligent arguments, the steadiness pace of talk, all 5*****STARS.

[stefbot]

Thanks man, you done made me blush! :)

[adorianvlad]

Your most welcome!

[Ape65]

1) Maybe the guy enjoys politics. If he were serious about freedom from government, he'd devote his time and energy figuring out how to cheat on his taxes and get away with it.

2) "freedom" is meaningless unless you specify freedom from what? At first you seem to be talking about freedom from taxes and state authority. However I presume you pay your taxes and are a law-abiding citizen, so the FDR way gives you freedom from what exactly?

[stefbot]

You might find the presentation instructive, i.e. corrupt relationships and wasting your life...

[lizonya7]

Love the talk on the "cost" of political involvement.

However, with all this, I'm starting to wonder if concept of "freedom" itself is just another illusion.

[RussellsParadox]

1.) Freedom is the absence of illusion.

2.) Freedom is an illusion.

Therefore...

3.) The absence of illusion is an illusion, and all perceptions must be illusions, including the perception that freedom is an illusion.

aaaand kaBOOM! Your proposal self-detonates.

[Adipatus]

Dude, I agree that the Bush Republicans have made a huge power and money grab through the War on Terrorism.

Do you have any ideas why they have refused the opportunity to exploit Global Warming into grabbing even more power and money?

[lizonya7]

Didn't you watch the video. I think he's interested in talking about Bush or the Republicans.

[D4Shawn]

Global Warming is the corollary to the war in Iraq. Both are design to indefinitely expand state power (perhaps even on a global scale). It's the same agenda, just with a different name and a different approach. People must believe that the right and left are opposites (which is why the right doesn't support Global Warming, and why the left doesn't support the war). This gives people the illusion of choice (where in fact there is none).

[jiveturkey86]

@D4Shawn Global warming is a scientific fact made out of to be a political issue, it is a real threat and we know this through science. It is sad that people believe that it is some kind of conspiracy to establish government control.

[FistsoFuckinFreedom]

They're waiting for the Democrats to do that.

[Adipatus]

First !!!!!