Jimmy Page/ Joe Bonamassa/ Billy Gibbons String Trick AKA "topwrapping"

[mundellmatthewray]

Page used light gauge

[Hoopermazing]

Never heard of him... he must be a metal or fusion guitarist.

[RisingSon011]

{Page and Billy are two of the best in the world . Monsters of rock . But if you dismiss Joe Bo , you need to get a clue . The man is as good as it gets in the blues rock guitar world .

[emanhacker]

@alanpetsche actually joe plays with alot of emotion and feeling so dont even go there dude

[BluesBrogio]

Would you recommend sanding the top of the stopbar in order to create slots in which the strings would lay?

[TheGospelGuitarist]

@BluesBrogio You can buy Stop Bars with them already molded into it. To save money you could file grooves but make sure you get them smooth.

[ElevenBravo]

Answer to "WHY STRING THIS WAY?":

Stringing this way allows to you crank down your tailpiece (NOT the bridge) so that it in direct contact with the top of the guitar. The reason for stringing this way is so that the strings are at not such a sharp angle to the bridge saddles. The claim is that if the tailpiece is in contact with the top of the guitar, then the string vibration will resonate more readily into the guitar body. Acoustically, this makes perfect sense.

[prsfrank]

Actually Duane Allman was one the first one's to top wrap and closely followed by Billy Gibbons in the late 60's I am not sure when Page started but we wasnt playing a les paul until 1970

[surgeyX]

Okay, so what does this accomplish other than scratching a 100$ stopbar tail?

I've always wondered why people did this -- what are the facts behind that it "improved playability" ? I don't see how it would make any difference other than scratching your stopbar...

[maxgibson42]

I used to do this and it wreck my tail piece, works great until strings cut into the tail piece and start breaking strings . tail piece for good on are 100. bucks easy. just saying

[lastdaysguitar]

Interesting trick - I'll have to try it next time I change strings.

[nikgottheblues]

Oh, don't forget about Pete Townsend doing this on his SG's.

[shinevarghesedaniel]

Guys!I didn't understand the concept that the video is trying to convey :( What does the video mean??

[bowslap]

@shinevarghesedaniel It was displaying the topwrap method of stringing a tune-o-matic/stoptail setup mostly found on Gibson electrics. Supposedly top-wrapping the strings creates less tension on the strings as they pass over the saddles, making for a "looser" feel to the strings and increased sustain. I think it's a snake-oil mth, but that's just my opinion.

[prsfrank]

Actually everyone stole this from Duane Allman

[bchant19]

to do this mod is it just as simple as you thread the string through the other side or wrong side on a standard tail pice when re stringing thick gauge strings or do u have to by a sepical top wrap tail piece to do it

[HeliVis]

I'm not interested in "who they know", "who their dad was". Maybe that impresses other however most people can see a hypejob when they spot it. I'm glad you like him, but to me he's a relative unknown to the rest of the world of music. Most of the occomplishments he or his fans mention, and you just did it yourself, involve someone elses success and how close he got to them. You don't see most other people promote themselves this way unless something is a little "unpro".

[HeliVis]

Just google it. He bills himself as "King of the Blue" and even speaks about it in an interview. If you can't find it I'll find it for you. That was what set this whole thing off. He's always talking about "who" he's played with in every single media piece. Why doens't he just stand on his own 2 feet after all these years? Not an artilcle goes by locally here that doesn't bring it up it just sounds desperate.

[HeliVis]

No sour grapes and never met him. I just find it odd that his local fans always seem to have to embaellish his accomplishments. Examples are playing with Clapton. Great! However that was years ago now yet we hear it in every article along with all these other arguments like :"well he's rich" as if that means anything.

Bottom line, he's ok but not a standout or he'd have a much larger following and you'd see him on tv and on the radio. That's all. He's ok but not "all that" going by exposure.

[hairmonster12]

i heard of this from a Guitar World interview with Zakk Wylde

[ghk58]

i employ this trick on my les paul lol it makes a huge difference in sustain

[mulemusic]

Thanks for the heads up on this.. Anything to be able to use heavier gauge strings and not break a finger!! I am an old guy, but I find Joe Bonamassa to be a very exciting player.. He has a great work ethic and as far as I am concerned, he has the right to brag all he wants!! Seems like a good kid and I wish him all the success in the world!!

[mulemusic]

@mulemusic AMEN TO YOUR COMMENTS! Talent and work = success and anyone putting him down has serious ego problems!! Going to see him live in March!!

[pinkfloydlib]

sorry guys someone can tell me the title of this song?

[JHLittleWing]

Who is hating on Joe. He's waaaay better than Jimmy Page though Jimmy is great. I used to think Stevie Ray was the best blues player but Joe slaughter him too. It's pretty obvious. They all play with a lot of feel though Stevie kills in that department, but Joe just has way more ideas up his sleeve.

[dokokai]

@JHLittleWing Just remember that Joe wouldn't be doing what he's doing without Page, Stevie & Hendrix. They took Albert King & other greats & brought it past what anyone else was doing. And Page was not only a genius guitarist but also a genius musician, songwriter, recording engineer, producer & arranger. Nothing he's done has been match yet... not by a Bonamassa or any other player. Joe is no doubt a great player but has yet to match the greatness of Page & I doubt anyone ever will.

[Zhaggysfaction]

I learned this from Zakk Wylde. He uses 10-60 string, which is like a heavy 7-string set up without the "D" string and put the rest in a 6 string guitar. So the ligth strings are normal but the heavy strings are very heavy, I tune it to D, though. I don't know if I really need to do that but it's just kind of a tribute to Zakk Wylde. It certainly makes me think I can play like him:)

[JoeBonamassaOfficial]

hey guys, thanks so much for your support. Please go to the Official Joe Bonamassa YouTube Channel and subscribe!

[mulemusic]

@JoeBonamassaOfficial TALENT AND HARD WORK = SUCCESS!! Way to go Joe! I am your Dad's age and I am extremely excited with the direction your music is going! Keep being who you are, and let the folks with the insecurities slam everyone instead of embracing your music !!

[ahamay79]

Duane Allman did the same thing. Look closely at Duane Allman pics and you'll see the top wrap. I've been doing it for years. It really improves the tone. Remember to screw the tail piece lugs all the way down.

[blackmetalcreed]

I did this but every bend i did the guitar got out of tune :( what should I do?

[shtdaprdtr]

what song am dis?

[HeliVis]

Page was doing this decades befor JB exactly how is this the "JB string trick"? Anything to keep associating his name with real musicians instead of mediocre types I guess. That's why he bills himself as "King of all Blues" these days?

[weirdotis]

@HeliVis I titled it JB because I first learned of it from him. Also, have you ever seen him live? That will change your opinions of him real quick.

[HeliVis]

@weirdotis Yeah he is from my area before he moved on. The guy and his friends have quite an attitude problem with him going around calling himself the "King of the blues" just because he played with Clapton who BTW is very approachable and jams with just about anyone at all these blues festivals. Joe's playing falls way short in my opinion, especially his vocals. An EJ wanabee with a fatter head. Also he uses samples OVER his audio during solos lipsync style. Whats up with that?

[Sweeper5]

@HeliVis Dude, I'm sorry but you're sounding like you have a sour grapes attitude toward Mr. Bonamassa. Since he is from your area, are you somehow jealous of what he has achieved? Do you consider yourself a superior musician to Joe? Not trying to sound rude, but you seriously are coming across like that to everyone reading your posts. Joe Bonamassa is indisputably a remarkably good musician by any standard. Good enough for Glenn Hughes even! So, who are you playing with these days?

[HeliVis]

@Sweeper5 BTW I do not play anything professionally and don't care to. That's irrelivant and a poor debate tactic. You aren't a doctor but you sure can tell me if you met a quack. The players I personaly know are much more technically proficient at Joe and play a range of music from noeclassiical through rock and blues. All are better. Joe is ok at his blues thing but he's not even mentioned in rollling stone's list of top 100 guitarists. RS is a decent measure to most people except haters.

[Sweeper5]

@HeliVis I didn't mean that as a debate tactic, I said it to make a point. Legends such as Glenn Hughes, Jason Bonham and Derek Sherinian (who of course played with Petrucci in DT); well, if these guys chose Joe as their sole guitarist; and you're kind of diss'ing him, it only seems right that you should have some kind of credentials to back that up. And to clarify, I'm not a die-hard Joe B.fanatic, I'm really not. I am however, a decent guitarist and I've seen Joe play. And he's damn good.

[HeliVis]

@Sweeper5 Legends or past their prime? What exactly has Bonham been doing with his father's fame huh?

[Sweeper5]

@HeliVis Wow dude, you just hate the whole band don't ya? Bonham's father's fame does give him a career boost, no doubt about that. Still, he is a very good drummer played with Foreigner, has done work with the likes of Paul Rogers, Slash, Page, UFO. Hughes...do you also not like his vocals? Do you also think Derek Sherinian is a has-been? Wow man. What musicians do you like? You have to tell me, because there must be something remarkable out there that I'm unaware of.

[Sweeper5]

@HeliVis And as far as Joe playing with Clapton, that don't impress me. I don't think that Clapton is all that on the guitar. I'm quite familiar with the works of Malmsteen, Bellas, Stump, Petrucci, Romeo, Cooley, etc. I'm also into shred, neo-classical, so I see where you're coming from. Joe is not a player in the shred neo-classical style, so if that's all you're into I can understand why you aren't into his musical styles. But no matter how you slice it, Joe Bonamassa is a helluva player.

[guitarjjte]

@HeliVis I think when you base your opinion of guitarists being in the top 100 of Rolling Stone's list that tells us everything. That list is terrible. Putting Kurt Cobain at 12th and not even including Django Reinhardt or Chet Atkins in the list at all is beyond a joke - and that's just to two examples of how bad that list is. I think it's safe to say that Joe's playing far exceeds the technical ability of Kurt Cobain (who has his place in music), so choose a better source for your opinions.

[slydeshow11]

@guitarjjte yeah gotta say kurt wasnt THAT great at guitar, he was just good at creating music. He is no guitar legend though.

[paddytaggart]

@weirdotis HERE,HERE....well said... an i aint never heard him bill himself as 'King of The Blues'.

[mulemusic]

@paddytaggart Anymore, he IS this generation's KING OF THE BLUES!! GOOD FOR HIM!!! He plays his butt off and never NEVER NEVER gets boring!!

[HeliVis]

@weirdotis Ya I have seen him live Joe is alright but to be honest he isn't 1/10th as good as what he and a lot of his fans seem to think he is. He may be nice but his presentation in media is totally a namedropping famemongering approach. Nobody cares he played with clapton but he brings it up in every artical like a coat tail surfer. Theres plenty of kids on youtube who could play with clapton hes not exactly hard to jam with if you are in those circles but Joe's bragging sours me to him.

[vladd001]

@weirdotis go to eric sardinas concert

[ACDCBESTBANDEVER1]

@weirdotis

jb is my idol he is amazing and i can't wait to see him live in cardiff!!!!:)

[MrWarensemble]

@weirdotis That sooooo fucking true my friend.When you see him live you just becomes a bonafan forever.Hes just amazing both in studio and live

[BorghJohan]

@HeliVis Give Joe a chance! He and Derek Trucks are in my opinion the best guitarists of the younger generation.

[ritcheyrocker]

@HeliVis Joe Bonamassa is real music, better than any other dumbasses with the name JB. he's tryin to bring blues back and its workin.

[HeliVis]

@ritcheyrocker I agree it's music as far as what some people are listening to these days but hes never really struck me or a lot of other people in the industry as superstar material. That would be fine except for the strange politics. He's ok. But thousands of kids out here on youtube do better and get more attention. So anyways I'm done messing up this fellows youtube showing stringwrapping I didn't intend to get the rabid hordes all abuzz. Enjoy the "King of the Blues"!

[Fathertimeless]

@HeliVis Asshole just cant think of another term that suits you. lol

[omfg51]

@HeliVis obviously youve never seen him live. i dont know about king, but he is a living legend

[tbcass]

@HeliVis Actually Bonamassa is IMO a better guitar player than Page who IMO has always been overrated. and yes, being only a few months younger than Page I'm old enough to have been around during the Zep years.

[CoreyTB1]

@HeliVis Joe Bonamassa can run circles around Jimmy Page.

[Guitarulez]

@CoreyTB1 I really hope this isn't a serious comment. As it is the most musically inept comment I have ever seen in my life. Aside from the 2 having completely different playing styles, have you ever even heard of Eric Johnson? because I'm betting you haven't if you like Joe Bonamassa so much. As Joe's soloing is literally Johnson's exact licks. Maybe not on the albums so much, but live it is identical. I agree they are both very good players no doubt, but to compare them, makes no sense at all

[alanpetsche]

@CoreyTB1 Maybe he can run circles, I'll bet he's a real fast runner!!! But he can't play a guitar lick that has a micron of emotion in it.

[ACDCBESTBANDEVER1]

@HeliVis

you are a fucking dick i bet your shit at guitar i don't even know if you play guitar but fuck you don't diss joe he even said him self he got the idea from jimmy page so get a life and stop going around puting stupid coments on people's videos

[Mdaman13]

@HeliVis Bold words from a guy that favourites Dave Days....

[11harrison11]

continued @ Shyuum: if you read my 1st comment, give it a try. If that doesn't work, try FILING (with a small saddle file, you can get them to match each gauge of your strings from a place like stewmac.com ). You can probably find a vid on here to help guide you through the process. It's not complicated, I hope this helps.

[Shyuum]

@11harrison11

Ok, Thank you very much for your kind words!

[Barracuda007]

zakk wylde does this as well

[bluesclaudio056]

What are the pros and cons of this trick?

[philly6669]

it lessens the break angle and the only damage you'll do is possibly scratching your bridge's finish

[foamyjesus]

How does it work? And does can it damage your bridge?

[philly6669]

zakk wylde does the same thing i have a tone tail stopbar on my 88 lp custom its awesome has grooves smoothed into bar for even string flow= less snag hard break angle

[GUITAPHIL]

do this trick works on .9-42?

[weirdotis]

Yes, any gauge strings will work.

[Shyuum]

@weirdotis

A quick question

When I bend with my topwrapped .10 gauge strings, the 3 high strings come out of my saddles

What should I do?

[weirdotis]

@Shyuum Crank the tailpiece all the way down, that's a common problem if you don't have the tailpiece down all the way.

[Shyuum]

@weirdotis

Hi , It's me once again!

I already did that.. but I still have the problem

I also cranked the stopbar all the way down..

What should I do?

Sorry If I bother, cheers!

[11harrison11]

@Shyuum when weirdotis said to crank the tailpiece down he meant the "stopbar", ( the stopbar IS the tailpiece) when you say you " ALSO cranked the stopbar all the way down", it seems you mean that you cranked the bridge down AND the stopbar tailpiece , if that is the case, you defeated the purpose of doing what he told you. You need to take the bridge back up to where it was and leave the stopbar all the way down. Without looking at it, it's hard to diagnose the problem.

[matthewrotherham]

@Shyuum i would use a very very sharp knife or a razor blade and whittle the cavities on the 3 saddles til they sit slightly lower.

[freiture]

@weirdotis false, strings ARE GOING TO be sloppy and noisy (buzzy)

[69Bloodsucker]

@GUITAPHIL Page using 08-09-11-24-32-42 set ;) All the time...

[freiture]

@GUITAPHIL no, I did it, u'll lose all the sustain and strings will do that annoying buzz noise

[itsamystery94]

need to find the backround song. someone post a link to it or something

[weirdotis]

It's called Trinity, on Santana's record " All that I am".

[shivkm]

What song is in the background..... sounds beautiful!

[sikuler]

jimmy page didnt use 11s he used 9-42s

[RobDFrizzle]

didnt he use 8s?

[weirdotis]

yes he did for the majority of Zep, now he uses 9s- I THINK. My point is that I use 11s and they don't feel like 11s.

[RobDFrizzle]

I use 2's

[ferlottes]

Maybe 08-38 sometimes !

[treatb09]

i about did this to my les paul but decided not to for fear of wear looks, but how and why do this instead of just raising the tailpiece up.

[weirdotis]

If you do the wraparound and crank the tailpiece down, you get a lot more sustain and it makes the notes more articulate. If you raise the tailpiece up, you will get string buzzing on the saddles. So yes, they both will do the same thing, but the wraparound gives you better tone and eliminates string buzz on the saddles.

[treatb09]

well thanks for the advice i'll try this next time i change strings and see what happens

[mike1jimmypage]

Does it matter what tail piece you use to do this??

[weirdotis]

Hmm... I'd say any regular stoptail tailpiece will do.

[GibsonLesPaul1319]

according to zakk wylde it also seems to reduce the string breakage at the saddle , because the angle of the string to the tailpiece is less in the video

[p58lp]

the music sounds like robert randolph. anyways, i'm gonna have to try this on my LP.

[weirdotis]

Yeah, it's Robert Randolph with Kirk Hammet and Santana :)

[yobhsiFehT]

:o Did you combine tracks, or did they actually play together for something?? That'd be amazing:D

[weirdotis]

Yeah, all on one song. It's on "All That I Am" by Santana. The song is called Trilogy or something like that.

[9jed9]

That's a great idea. Thanks for sharing.

[scarfacedan09]

But Jimmy Page uses 8s doesnt he?

[weirdotis]

He currently uses 9's, he used 8's back in the zep days. I set this guitar up with 11s... you can use it with all gages of strings

[nzoneaffe]

why and how does it change the sound??

[weirdotis]

After I cranked down the tailpiece, I noticed the notes had more clarity and were louder when played acoustically. I also think it adds some treble and mids to the sound

[benjammin420420]

i think i notice longer sustain too. also having the decreased string tension changed the tonal characteristics slightly, in a way i prefer.

[ledzep116]

If you watch the show fron the Royal Albert Hall from the dvd,you will see that Page wrapped his strings aroung the tailpiece.Watch the bow solo.Later,however,he strung up normally.

[benjammin420420]

he had 2 les pauls, i believe one was set up specifically for the bow

[TapeMeasureandhair]

no it wasn't

[benjammin420420]

yes, i stand corrected. I found a good website about his gear since i posted that

[GeoJ]

I've seen this referred to as "Texas Stringing" ... Billy Gibbons has been doing it for decades.

It changes the string tension because the strings don't have as sharp of angle between the tailpiece and the bridge.

Works well, and makes the guitar a bit more "airy"

It also helps to cut down the possibility of bridge collapse, especially with the older style ABR bridges.

[firstgearlead]

Lenny Kravitz does this too, well, his guitar tech Alex Alverez does, that's where i picked up this trick, it DOES work, but i dont recall slim Jim page doing this, and i didn't notice joe (not to say he DOESN'T, but i never saw it before) yepp gibson custom recommends it as well.

[weirdotis]

I didn't know that about Lenny; that guy makes some seriously good music. Honestly I've never seen a picture of Jimmy page with it, but Ive seen Joe live and he has it on all his guitars. Next up is cranking the tailpiece down on the next string change.

[firstgearlead]

yeah actually that's where i picked up the trick, from lenny.his tech said "it gives it more of the wood's tone if you crank the tailpiece down and enhances the bottom end"

actually at first when i saw it i'm like pffft w/e. and then he said "some of you guys are gonna say ' Pfft whatever' but honestly its a small trick that'll take your tone a long way"

so i was convinced.

[weirdotis]

I can see how that would happen because of the vibrations being transferred to the body, etc. Pretty cool trick

[firstgearlead]

yeah, it really does make it sound clearer(more especially in my neck pickup (a lot more defined tone))

[beatlefan66]

This is what Page did:

Took the 6th (E),5th (A) and 4th (D) strings from the set then use the 2nd (B) for G, then use the 1st (High E) for the 2nd (B) and a banjo octave for the 1st string. Back in the day they didn't really have different gauge sets most strings sets where around 10 gauge, so Page did all that to make a lighter set.

[budubum]

but you run the risk of warping the neck caused of the uneveness of the strings npot pulling the correct tension

[weirdotis]

with 8-9s yes, but with 11s, not so much.

[beatlefan66]

Thats what he did man, read it in an interview with him.

[budubum]

im curious. where is this interview?

[weirdotis]

ultimate guitar has a archived file on his rig.

[beatlefan66]

Its in a book and if my memory serves me correct its called "Led Zeppelin : The Story of a Band and Their Music, 1968-1980". I haven't read it, but I looked through it while in a book store and came across that part, I was so interested I entered it into the notepad on my cell phone.

[LIGHTMAN004]

I'm a huge Jimmy Page fan and have never heared of him doing this. I heard Joe Bonamassa say Pagy did it. So I looked through loads of Jimmy Page pictures on the my computer and in my books, and couldn't find any picture of Jimmy's les pauls with the strings wraped over like that. Jimmy used light strings. His top E was very thin. An 8 I believe.

[roliver5150]

Quick question: What's the tune playing during this video? Thanks.

[weirdotis]

Yeah man, its called Trinity be Santana. It's also got Kirk Hammet and Robert Randolph in it. Thanks for watching.

[weirdotis]

oops... Trinity BY Santana hehe