Tien Shan Pai - Tai Chi Two Person Set

[Mikhahbendavid]

Tony and Willy look quite a bit alike. i suppose i should have known this, as Willy had stopped training with his Shifu then, right?

T'aishizu Wang looks great in this video.

[Mikhahbendavid]

Notice the commentator speaks of the 64th generation!!! Sorry Willy.

[richhewton]

Please name more than 10 of the 64 generations

[Mikhahbendavid]

Name 10 generations before Dong, Hai-Chuan.

Name 10 generations before Jiang Fa.

Name the HUGE gap in Xingyi after General Yueh Fei.

MOST systems do not have complete records of everyone in their lineage. This is not the least bit unusual to those of us who know history.

[Tianshanwarrior]

general Yueh Fei? man I bet you still believe in Santa Claus!

[Mikhahbendavid]

You do realize that General Yueh Fei was well documented by Chinese historians within 60 years of his death right? i'm in school to be a Religious Studies Professor. i really would hate to embarrass you with my knowledge of history (if you want to continue down this road).

[Tianshanwarrior]

I dont dispute that Yueh Fei was a historical figure, which as you said has been very well documented. However, I do dispute the belief that he originated the many styles he is credit of creating. Even though he did practice spear fighting, archery and perhaps some sort of boxing (as mentioned by military figures like Qi Jiguang, who used it as an introduction to weapons fighting), the stories mentioning Yueh Fei as the creator of Xing Yi Quan are not that old.

[Mikhahbendavid]

Unfortunately for you, you spoke of belief in the figure HIMSELF as akin to belief in Santa Claus! Anyone can see this above. Now you are simply backpedaling.

[Tianshanwarrior]

If you have serious sources that you use to support what you say, PLEASE do share, I am always willing to learn!

[Mikhahbendavid]

Please name Wily Lin's T'aiji lineage......... Does this mean that it is not actually from Yang, Lu-Ch'an simply because he does not know it?

[Tianshanwarrior]

Master Lin mentioned the same story in his book, BUT he he is the only as far as I know that went to CHina searching for the temple. As for your endorsement of the 64th generation let me ask you, if Tien Shan Pai has long been popular in Xinjiang, Gansu and other western provinces how come nobody has ever heard of this in those provinces?

[Mikhahbendavid]

There are many lineages that are not popular nor even public throughout their history. Many have only come to light in the Modern Era. Have you ever found documentation of Baguazhang before Dong, Hai-Ch'uan? No one ever heard of it before him, even though he was the first to claim that it was taught to him and that he was not the developer thereof. Your argument is spurious.

[Ryooken]

Well since I was a student of one of Willy Lin's students Dennis Brown of Washington, DC, I can tell you that Tien Shen Pai exists. In fact, Willy Lin's teacher was Wong Jie Jin from Taiwan. The Tai Chi form practiced was found in the Chen village. It was an older form. Now the temple of the western provinces I am not sure about but temples in China have been torn down and never rebuilt.

[Tianshanwarrior]

Master Lin talked not only with masters Wang family in China, but also the Xinjiang Province Wu Shu Association and nobody heard of this so popular style. Moreover if master Wang was at the First Professor/Research Class of Central Guoshu Academy, master Wangs name is nowhere to be found. I have researched in a few sources that discuss the activities of the Academy and have never heard of TSP or master Wang.

[Mikhahbendavid]

Your first point was defeated so now you change to another argument without acknowledging your defeat on the first.

[Tianshanwarrior]

OK granted that I used the wrong words to point out that the lineages attributed to YF are weak, you won. About DHC it has been researched that he is most likely the creator of BGZ, there is a master thesis by Prof. Kang Gewu that talks about this. Your only argument is that if no body heard of it that is therefore enough to support it, talking about spurious. As I said if you have sources to support this please share them or better write a paper so people can learn about this.

[Mikhahbendavid]

There are alternate lineages from his teacher still around today. This coupled with the fact that he openly claimed to NOT be the creator of it gives the benefit of the doubt to him and the parallel lineage that corroborates his claims. People don't always make everything to develop public; ESPECIALLY in the case of Martial Arts. Furthermore, when something DOES become public it DOES NOT mean that it was just innovated.

[folmosan]

muy bueno es una pena la calidad del video pero de todas formas felicidades

[CottonBoxer]

bravo,bravo not seen much. very nice performance. met tony & willy lin when they had the schoool in baltimore on howard street. a friend of mine Donald Manning joined the school i just watch. hadn't made up my mind yet though was thinking of the taji,bagua,& hsing i that was taught by them! brings back a friendly sparring match with big donald . had to use a jumping descending punch to beat him.

[vquach13]

hey can you send me this video?

[Tianshanwarrior]

cool

[Dragonkarma]

This is the actual tai chi two person set. grandmaster Wang with his disciple Tony Lin, brother of Willy Lin. Gm Wang only demonstrated with his top disciples- Willy Lin, C.C. Liu, & Tony Lin.