Can Islam be reformed? Robert Spencer, Zuhdi Jasser, Walid Shoebat

[afgdude100]

people get the wrong idea about jihad, it's when you fight in the path of god and when other people try to attack mulims jihad is a hily war where we defend ourselfs.

[ktchong]

@afgdude100 Look for this video on YouTube: "Three Stages of Jihad".

[ScreeminMeeme]

I thank God for ABAsat.com for the wealth of truthful information about Islam. Thank you.

[Bnglore2010]

I am an athiest. I think if I fallow any religion & if there is a god..then I expect that god to be GOD..not a peodophile..like Mohamad..he should be genuine..not raping a 6yr old girl..while mohamad is 56yr..y he could not find some 50yr old lady..instead of 6yr old child. People who believe in this religion r totally retarded r dumb r brainless...I don't know whichone they r please tell me if u want ur 6yr old daughter to get married to an oldman of 56yr? If u disagree then FUCK that religion.

[aboodred1]

@Bnglore2010 it seems like you're an Ex Christian!!!

[MrAztec1970]

muslims = nazis

[spook79]

Bottom line for me is that perhaps there could be a perfect and good God out there but he is certainly not fully described and contained in the bible or the quran or any other book out there.

[Itugen88]

Christians are peaceful when they follow Christ. Muslims are violent when they follow Muhammad. Islam cannot be reformed, it can only be wiped out as a religion and ideology.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 hahahah fool. stop day dreaming kid and go read up on the crusades.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE No, I think you better had read up on the Crusades and the cause of them, rather than judging them on popular opinion of people who don't read history.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 Then I will go ahead and give you the same advice. Islam is not a religion were pray only on Sunday. Its a way of life. Go read up on Islam before following the majority of ignorant fools who make up most of our country,

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE You're right only in one sense - the true followers of Islam keep it as their way of life. Unfortunately for everyone else, that means death and oppression. Christianity is not a religion where we pray only on Sunday, or five times a day as prescribed in meaningless repetitions... It is taking up a personal cross to follow Christ, and it's for everyday, at all times. Neither is it a works-based religion, like Islam. I have assurance of salvation - do you?

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 hehehehe you tell me Jesus is God and I am telling you he is a Noble Prophet. Lay back and think about it. Did you know that when Muslims conquered countries they were prohibited from killing women and children? or fighting those with no weapons or harming the elderly? did you know it was also prohibited in Islam to kill the livestock or even cut down a tree? Islam comes from the Arabic word "Salam" which means peace. Go figure.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE No, Islam refers to "submission". "Salaam", related to Hebrew "Shalom" means "peace". But I'm not surprised you're saying this - every Muslim I've come across uses taqiyya tactics. Further, Jesus did not declare himself to be a "noble prophet" - he declared himself the Son of God. And if you honestly think the Bible is corrupted, then prove it. The Bible is one of the most reliable pieces of ancient scripture in the world, if not THE most. The Qur'an is not.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 Actually the term Muslim refers to "submission to God" i.e. you live your life only to please and worship your Lord as the Noble Prophets that came before us. We as Muslims believe in the Gospel and the Torah just not the ones put into practice again. The Bible humiliates the Prophets such as Lot and Noah or even David and Solomon and elevates the status of Jesus (peace and blessings be upon him). Read the Quran and the Bible and compare the stories of the prophets.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE It does not humiliate them, tell me where it says this. And yes, I have read the Qur'an and compared. Also, "submission" also refers to the submission of non-Muslims to the Muslims, in dhimmitude. If you believed the Gospel you would not be Muslim, plain and simple.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE "Muslim" means "one who submits". al-Silm being the root word. al-Salaam means "peace". If they meant the same thing they'd be the same word and wouldn't have different meanings. Surely you know Arabic, since you can only worship in it? I can worship in any language I please because God understands more than one language.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 dude we can worship in any language to but when you read the Quran in prayer it must be done in Arabic only you can't read translations. If you don't know any Quran then just ask God about what you feel in your heart for God understands all languages. Doesn't necessarily have to be in Arabic when you want to talk go God. "one who submits" to what? God! bro all I am asking is if you don't want to be a Muslim then leave us alone and stay quiet. Is this what Jesus would do? mock others?

[fiocchiman]

@CONV3RSE Jesus would throw you out of the temple JUST LIKE HE DID CORRUPT PRIESTS.

You people are bringing your garbage into our land and homes and then have the audacity to ask why we are angry about it!

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Ah, "BUT" - you cannot read it in your own language or pray your five daily prayers in it. That is silly - why would God show favoritism over one language? The writers of the Bible wrote in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, and the Bible is the most widely translated book in the world. No, I will not 'leave you alone' and stay quiet, because that's what dhimmis do. Jesus did not put up with lies and hypocrisy, and neither will I.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 Let me ask you something. Is that what Jesus would do? go around mocking others and what they believe in? trust me buddy you have no clue what you are talking about. Live what you preach fool.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE I do not mock. I speak the truth and I'm asking you to be honest. Out of one corner of your mouth you ask me what Jesus would do, out of the other you call me a "fool". You do not know what Jesus would do because you do not know Jesus - you call him "Isa" and a mere prophet. Jesus said, "I am the Way and the Truth and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through me." -John 14:6. I will pray for you, because you are a lost sheep looking for your Good Shepherd.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Also you have not refuted anything I have said thus far. If I recall correctly, it was you who first jumped up at the chance to tell me I am a "fool", but again, you have no facts.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 A fool is someone who talks more than they listen. God gave you 2 ears and 1 mouth for a reason. You should also recall the fact that you were the one to post your hateful comment. Once again is that what Jesus would do? You guys keep talking about Jesus this Jesus that when you fail to live the way he did or act upon what you preach. Love ones neighbor as much as you love yourself?...shame

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE No, a fool is one who disregards wisdom and facts. Is my comment hateful, or is it truthful? Again, Jesus did not stop from condemning the vile acts of the Pharisees and others, but rightly he recognized that humans are all sinful - that means you, and that also means me! I am not perfect, I cannot be sinless like Christ, but can follow him in love for others, and REDUCE my sin. I don't hate you; if I hated you I would not be talking to you or praying for you.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Because we cannot cure ourselves of our sin, Christ's sacrifice negates our sins when we believe in him and declare him our Savior. Christians strive to follow Christ's example, in loving others and "dying to sin". Of course, in this life we cannot completely banish our sinful nature, and some people are better at it than others. Only when we are absolved of our sins and in the presence of God when we die can we be free of sin altogether. God cannot abide sin.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 I didn't ask Christ to die for my "sin" nor do I recall committing the "sin" in the first place. God is capable of making Adam pay for his own sin. In which country does one pay for another persons crime? The Bible tells us of people who were also destroyed such as the people of Noah, and Lot. What did their prophets preach and why were they destroyed? simple because they refused to worship one God and repent for their sins. Not accept Jesus as their savior.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 1.I am numbering my posts in order that they might be easier to read, because this could get lengthy. To start off, think about this: if a murderer who killed many people suddenly decides, while he is in prison, that he wants to give away all his belongings to the poor, does it amend him of his crimes? No, he is still a murderer, and his good works have not changed this – the sin is still there. Works, then, cannot correct sinful behavior. And God cannot abide sin in His presence.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 2. Now to some history. Recall Abraham and his descendents, the Hebrews, sacrificed to atone for their sins. God had approved sacrifices for sins, but the sacrifices had to be specifically prepared and only certain things could be sacrificed: unblemished, non-deformed rams or lambs (for example) could be sacrificed, but pigs and camels could not be (Deuteronomy 14:7-8). Blood had to be drained out (and not used for anything), and sacrifices were often burned.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 3. Sacrifices were worthless if God did not approve of them. Animals like lambs were used because they were deemed sinless – indeed, they weren’t people! This is why any ORDINARY human cannot die for another’s sins, instead, that would be murder and an abomination in God’s eyes. In the Laws, when someone like a murderer was killed for his crimes, it was only as an earthly justice – that person was not “cured” of his sin, and he remained a dead sinner!

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 4.This is why sacrificial acts and punishment of death are DIFFERENT. This also explains why any ordinary person cannot sacrifice himself for their sins, because they are sinful, and are not unblemished! They would be “unclean” sacrifices! We must also remember that God knows ALL of our sins, and our sins will not outweigh our good works – otherwise what was the use of sacrificing?

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 5. And, it’s quite clear in the Old Testament that the Laws of Moses and making animal sacrifices were NOT a permanent covenant – another Covenant, namely the Messiah, would be provided, for all people at all times. Now we come to Jesus. He was born as foretold be the previous prophets, and just as God had said he would, born of a virgin and completely sinless, God in the flesh.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 6. THIS is why Jesus was the proper sacrifice – only one who was pure, sinless, and God Himself could atone for humanity’s sins in full. But we must accept his sacrifice to be amended for them. Jesus willingly went to the cross to die for our sins, he was not “murdered” because he was willing. God had already accepted this as a sacrifice through His love and mercy. Christ was the perfect “Lamb of God, which takes away the sin of the World” (John 1:29).

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 7. Also, in a symbolic way, Christ was sacrificed on the very day in which Passover lambs were being killed and prepared! Abraham had gone to Mount Moriah to sacrifice his son, Isaac, but God did not approve of this sacrifice, instead a ram was provided. So Abraham called that place, “YHWH-Jireh”, or “God Will Provide”. This is the same place where Christ was sacrificed, in Jerusalem. God had provided!

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE 8. Christ’s resurrection was the final victory over sin, over spiritual and physical death! You didn’t ask for Christ to die for you, in God’s mercy and forgiveness it was GIVEN to you!

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 well God can have it back because I don't want it. I didn't ask to be saved in the first place.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 I just read all your posts that you have numbered. Think about it man, is God not able to forgive our sins without any sacrifices made? God is above following any law and God does not need reason to act. God simply does as He wishes. Abraham wanted to sacrifice his son Ishmael because God ordered Him to as a test (because he was his beloved son) and then when Abraham and his son did as God ordered he then sent down the lamb (which is now a holiday we muslims practice called Eid).

[spook79]

@CONV3RSE I think that God forgiving sin without an atonement, is God supporting sin. If sin is such a big deal to God how is just saying "oops sorry God, lets still be good friends" dealing with sin? If holiness is the only thing that puts God above everybody, his holiness should be super obvious and provable! But its not: because of the way people murder gays, either intellectual murder or even physical murder which happened in Iran not long ago because of Islam.

[CONV3RSE]

@spook79 what on earth are you talking about? you have issues so please refrain from talking to me.

[spook79]

@CONV3RSE How is it that you don't understand what I am talking about? You just said God can simply forgive sins because he is God. Well if thats the case then I can forgive sins because I am me. What makes God different from me that he has the authority to forgive sins and I don't? Miraculous powers? Don't demons use miracles too? And seriously dude why are you on a comment forum if all you are gonna do is tell people to shut up? Can't you handle some criticism and questions?

[spook79]

@CONV3RSE Perhaps you would say something like "God is holy therefore he can forgive sin." But if God is holy, the reality should also be considered that because God is holy, he cannot tolerate or forgive sin without tarnishing his character of being holy. Why is it hard for muslims to accept the concept of God becoming a human atonement for sinful people? Why does this even make muslims angry at all? I would speculate it is an unhealthy fear of the unknown, but I still don't know for sure.

[elwap0]

@CONV3RSE

Yes God could make Adam could pay for his sin.But what is the price for sin?God says it can only be paid by death of an Innocent. But God loves Adam and paid for Adams Mine and Your sin himself .We do not have to accept this gift.

Then all who sin will pay..........our choice.

[CONV3RSE]

@elwap0 Well then thats not fair, it was not me who committed this sin in the first place so how can a burden be taken off of me if there was no burden to begin with? Does Jesus dying for your sin help you live a better life? do your meals taste better? are you living a stress free life? because if God wanted to really help us then I would rather be making a 6 figure salary than have someone die for my sin. Btw if Jesus was God then how do you explain Jesus eating and drinking food? What is God?

[elwap0]

@CONV3RSE  again your choice

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Fairness? The “fair” thing to God would be to simply allow us to burn in Hell for our sins, and never be reconciled, because it’s what we all deserve. But God has several attributes, like love, and a desire to have us commune with Him forever, as a Creator and His children. It was love, mercy, and forgiveness that brought God to us to save us from our sins – didn’t Jesus forgive his tormenters on the cross? “Forgive them, Father, for they know not what they do”?

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Also, when God came down to us as a human being, He necessarily “limited” himself. Jesus performed great miracles that only God could have done, like raising the dead, healing the blind, deaf, mute, and sick, walking on water, changing water into wine, multiplying the fish and bread beside the sea of Galilee, raising himself from the dead, and so on. As a human, God did human things, like eating and drinking. . God was able to die in FLESH on the cross, but not SPIRITUALLY.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE . And only He could have raised himself from the dead. And yes, Christ’s sacrifice DO make my life better because I know I have been forgiven for my sins, and I can reside with God in eternal life. Heaven with God is being in eternal communion with Him as spiritual beings – Islam’s heaven gives its followers earthly pleasures. Ask yourself which sounds more like a false doctrine! Did your Allah create you just to engage in sexual acts on Earth AND in your Paradise?

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 Fool. Continue to live your life thinking you have been forgiven for a sin that you did not commit. You live a life fool of lies. Had you known any better you would have known that "Allah" is the arabic term used for God. The Bible has many editions and contradictions in it. Many sects each claiming they are on the true path. Hate to break it to you but Jesus doesn't know you. Don't argue with me about someone that lived nearly 2000 years ago.

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE If that's the way you are going to be, then you aren't worth talking to. Names are largely irrelevant if your deity doesn't match the same characteristics as ours, therefore they are not the same god. Name the contradictions of the Bible, then, if you have any! I know Jesus far more than you know your "Allah" and his "prophet", who died 1400 years ago and surprise, has not risen from the dead. Live your life of sin if you so prefer it! I am done here.

[CONV3RSE]

@Itugen88 Well I guess this is were we part ways because I suppose you Christians believe something along the lines of "Jesus coming to save you all today (probably in a couple of hours) because supposedly "its the end of the world" which to me is more bs lies that you guys feed yourselves to help you live your daily life. Good luck in this life and there hereafter buddy because trust me your gonna need it!

[Itugen88]

@CONV3RSE Also, maybe you just skip over the pages of suras declaring death and conquest - Sura 9:15 – “Fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them, and see them, belittle them and lie and wait for them in every strategy of war.” Sura 4:24 –“All married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hands possess." From these two suras alone we knkow this 1) it does not say to kill only men, 2) women who are captured can be forced into marriage or slavery.