After much experience with Alcoholics Anonymous, I can honestly say that AA is a religious cult that takes advantage of nulnerable drunks for the purpose of religious indoctrination.
All of that nonsense about choosing "a God of your own understanding" is just designed to get you to hang around long enough to be indoctrinated.
The AA God is a micro-managing diety that punishes alcoholics who refuse to surrender their lives and wills to Alcoholics Anonymous.
I love it. This kind of philosophy made my complicated multi religious childhood into a reliable new God, and that has kept me sober so far for 18 months. As a result, I feel faith and don't control ppl as much and feel happier, and I don't have to worry about dui's and getting fired bc of drugs and alcohol. So is it worth the philosophy of my concept? Absolutely. I am grateful.
AA has a 3% sucess rate they will say AA dose not keep stats , AA dose but wont make them public .. AA will say it has helped millions will know would they know this if they dont keep stats ,, AA was put togeter in 1932 and has done nothing to change or upgrade , refuseing all the many advancments in recovery . Total relgion based . thay say your higer power can be anything try to tell them you are you higher power , It is all lie writen by a wall street con man to make money Bill willson..
A lot of us came to that conclusion, IT, and the pro-AA videos on youtube often get that across more clearly than the critical ones! Check out the films of founder Bill W droning on about his supposed spiritual entightemnment. They were the clincher for me.
Some of these comments are demonic in nature....AA is a good thing...It saves lives....
Millions to date!
GOD can mean "Good Orderly Direction"...absolutely isnt even close to being a religion....People that knock goodness are people that are very unhappy with their own lives....Id doesnt have to be that way...There is a solution....Any 12 step program can help you....God Bless !!
Demonic because they disagree with you? Nice position, how do you expect to ever learn anything if you claim to have all the answers already?
Millions? Membership seems to never make it past the 2M mark. I wonder why that is? I mean they have produced more than 30 million big books. Look up the triennial survey and you will see why.
I have my own understanding of God and I personally don't care to access the God of my understanding through AA. But for those who do, I'm glad they have found something that works for them. There are also those who are staunch atheists and to tell them that they can have their own conception of God when they believe in no God, is ridiculous. If someone can't relate to a God program, then why not suggest that they find a secular alternative?
The answer to your question is that AA asks you to have a "higher power" - not a god. A HP can be nature, a mountain, a special place or whater you prefer. My friend uses her dead grandmother as her HP. The idea is to get outside of YOURSELF. Jetplane002 put it well. It is a path AWAY from self-centered ego, and TOWARD a new attitude of modesty, humility and gratitude. A spiritual (not god) path.
Though he [Bill Wilson] could not accept all the tenets of the [1] Oxford Groups, he was convinced of the need for [2] moral inventory, [3] confession of personality defects, [4] restitution to those harmed, [5] helpfulness to others and the necessity to [6] belief in and [1] dependence upon God."
His belief was clearly "the grave nature of alcoholism" he learned from Silkworth. Part of "dependence" in the teaching of Frank Buchman is step 11 guidance and meditation.
Read step 11 (BB pg 86/87) and replace God w/ ego. This was a useful HP (higher power) for Wilson at Mayflower Hotel. After six month practice "walking in a bar" was not in his to do list / guidance for that day. Then he didn't follow his fist instinct and thought the situation over
Pride is what will destroy a man with drink even unto death. When I drank I was my own God. I didn't need any other God. Alcohol was my God. Before alcohol could completely destory me I found A.A. and found that I wasn't God and Alcohol wasn't my God. A.A. isn't even my God but A.A. has shown me a way to a God of my understanding and kept me sober for 9 years now from being a 5th a day drunk.
Just refuse to say the prayer or accept the doctrine of "higher power"& watch the "group" become more & more aggresive towards you, concerned not with your addiction, but with your beliefs regarding a "supreme being". AA is a cult in which Bill W. intended to trick as many people into as he could.
Jack Norris, and Nell Wing all said that Bill had let them know how badly he felt about his unfaithfulness to Lois. That he nevertheless was seemingly unable to control himself filled him with despair and self-loathing at times and left him feeling unworthy to lead AA.
Thanks for this video. We never know who we may help. AA is so diverse anyone can be in it! With a desire to be sober of course. We need time to find sobriety, AA helped me do this. As there are 6 or 7 billion people on the planet, its good to know all 6 to 7 billion have an understanding of God, all different and all right! Good conscience and truth, as Ghandi suggests are our conscious contact with God? Works for me. Spiritual is always now with least denials and filters, thank God for that!
Slogan 6862 nick-names: "the numb", "second numb" or "the get numb". Term "big numb" not in use for many 12+12h. Some expert old-timers expect an revival though, other doubt though.
Slogan 6862 history: Short form of slogan 3828** (you) better recover before recovery, the "fucu".
**notes on notes
sn3818 short form without you, sn 3818(a) long form with you
To mind mind there's something inherently dubious and disingenous about intruding discussions of this issue of spiritual beliefs into what purports to be a method of recovery from an illness.
So what these people are doing is talking to an aspect of their subconscious and asking it to rule their lives. Sounds safe! Nothing irrational or repressed exists in the psyche! It's made out of magic and pixie dust from Ohio.
Really though this reminds me of a Scientology commercial.
I was in aa for many years and left.I am still sober even though I was told I would drink if I left aa.I believe aa is a cult and teaches people not to trust their inner guidance
There is plenty in this aa ideology to offend the religious and non-religious in equal measure. No Christian could honestly say a teaching that you can make anything you like God is compatible with their faith. No atheist or agnostic can honestly believe in the necessity of prayer. This is a superstitious and idolatrous pseudo-religion masquerading as treatment for a supposed illness.
Perhaps some confabulations with folks that are not deluded. Or better yet folks that just quit their bad habit sans meetings, religion, or recovery cults.
I'm an atheist and freethinker. I also attend A.A. meetings. It says that "the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking." I've been sober for almost 17 years. My so-called "higher power" is reason and rational thinking. There are many "powers" higher than me. The sun, the moon, doctors, lawyers,...even the group of "drunks." g.o.d. Good orderly directions. I don't have to believe like another.
Yes, there are many higher powers, but the point of the 12 steps is to find one that will you can believe will alleviate your alcoholism. I doubt that you actually believe that the sun can perform this function.
You are not actually following the program. Many steppers offer up substitute higher powers for the one described in the Big Book, but when asked to describe how they work in practice, they can't. For example, did you humbly ask reason and rationality to restore you to sanity?
This higher power may be of one's own understanding, but said higher power must be (according to AA literature) singular, desirous, omnipotent, benevolent and in communion with the stepper. He is also male and called "God". You approach him in a certain way (humbly) and communicate with him in a certain way (through prayer and meditation). The God of AA is much more specific than AA members would lead you to believe.
This is a fairytale take of the REAL authoritarian, fundamentalist "spirituality" of AA.
Jrunri 1 year ago
THE 12 STEP-RELIGION, IS THE RELIGION FOR THE NEW WORLD ORDER !
IGOROZKARSKY 1 year ago
After much experience with Alcoholics Anonymous, I can honestly say that AA is a religious cult that takes advantage of nulnerable drunks for the purpose of religious indoctrination.
All of that nonsense about choosing "a God of your own understanding" is just designed to get you to hang around long enough to be indoctrinated.
The AA God is a micro-managing diety that punishes alcoholics who refuse to surrender their lives and wills to Alcoholics Anonymous.
exposeaa 1 year ago
Jez says stand up on ur knees?
andreasheinz 2 years ago
whatever
next time they kill Songe Bob
andreasheinz 2 years ago
I love it. This kind of philosophy made my complicated multi religious childhood into a reliable new God, and that has kept me sober so far for 18 months. As a result, I feel faith and don't control ppl as much and feel happier, and I don't have to worry about dui's and getting fired bc of drugs and alcohol. So is it worth the philosophy of my concept? Absolutely. I am grateful.
melonskyutube 2 years ago
AA has a 3% sucess rate they will say AA dose not keep stats , AA dose but wont make them public .. AA will say it has helped millions will know would they know this if they dont keep stats ,, AA was put togeter in 1932 and has done nothing to change or upgrade , refuseing all the many advancments in recovery . Total relgion based . thay say your higer power can be anything try to tell them you are you higher power , It is all lie writen by a wall street con man to make money Bill willson..
rexxed33 2 years ago
It a cult peole aew wakeing up AA wont be around long there lies are bring themselfs down .. Stay away from AA CULT
rexxed33 2 years ago
This all sounds like a cult to me.
IrreverentTetrapod 2 years ago
A lot of us came to that conclusion, IT, and the pro-AA videos on youtube often get that across more clearly than the critical ones! Check out the films of founder Bill W droning on about his supposed spiritual entightemnment. They were the clincher for me.
MrTobytwirl 1 year ago
Some of these comments are demonic in nature....AA is a good thing...It saves lives....
Millions to date!
GOD can mean "Good Orderly Direction"...absolutely isnt even close to being a religion....People that knock goodness are people that are very unhappy with their own lives....Id doesnt have to be that way...There is a solution....Any 12 step program can help you....God Bless !!
zzprimeguy 2 years ago
Demonic because they disagree with you? Nice position, how do you expect to ever learn anything if you claim to have all the answers already?
Millions? Membership seems to never make it past the 2M mark. I wonder why that is? I mean they have produced more than 30 million big books. Look up the triennial survey and you will see why.
isegoria1 2 years ago
I have my own understanding of God and I personally don't care to access the God of my understanding through AA. But for those who do, I'm glad they have found something that works for them. There are also those who are staunch atheists and to tell them that they can have their own conception of God when they believe in no God, is ridiculous. If someone can't relate to a God program, then why not suggest that they find a secular alternative?
prschuster 2 years ago
This is only a preview. The documentary in its entirety does reference secular alternatives.
joshtreevideo 2 years ago
The answer to your question is that AA asks you to have a "higher power" - not a god. A HP can be nature, a mountain, a special place or whater you prefer. My friend uses her dead grandmother as her HP. The idea is to get outside of YOURSELF. Jetplane002 put it well. It is a path AWAY from self-centered ego, and TOWARD a new attitude of modesty, humility and gratitude. A spiritual (not god) path.
quickcap 2 years ago
Comment removed
MrTobytwirl 1 year ago
@quickcap
I LOVE MY SELF-CENTERED EGO DEARLY, IT IS
MY HIGHER POWER, GOD, AS I UNDERSTAND GOD.
IGOROZKARSKY 1 year ago
Foreword of second eddition
Though he [Bill Wilson] could not accept all the tenets of the [1] Oxford Groups, he was convinced of the need for [2] moral inventory, [3] confession of personality defects, [4] restitution to those harmed, [5] helpfulness to others and the necessity to [6] belief in and [1] dependence upon God."
His belief was clearly "the grave nature of alcoholism" he learned from Silkworth. Part of "dependence" in the teaching of Frank Buchman is step 11 guidance and meditation.
andreasheinz 2 years ago
Read step 11 (BB pg 86/87) and replace God w/ ego. This was a useful HP (higher power) for Wilson at Mayflower Hotel. After six month practice "walking in a bar" was not in his to do list / guidance for that day. Then he didn't follow his fist instinct and thought the situation over
andreasheinz 2 years ago
Pride is what will destroy a man with drink even unto death. When I drank I was my own God. I didn't need any other God. Alcohol was my God. Before alcohol could completely destory me I found A.A. and found that I wasn't God and Alcohol wasn't my God. A.A. isn't even my God but A.A. has shown me a way to a God of my understanding and kept me sober for 9 years now from being a 5th a day drunk.
jetplane002 2 years ago
Now this guy really gets it! Thank you for your sharing, jetplane002.
joshtreevideo 2 years ago
Too true
marcusfeloni 2 years ago
Good Job!
tumescent345 3 years ago
Just refuse to say the prayer or accept the doctrine of "higher power"& watch the "group" become more & more aggresive towards you, concerned not with your addiction, but with your beliefs regarding a "supreme being". AA is a cult in which Bill W. intended to trick as many people into as he could.
Yoganao 3 years ago
I couldn't agree with you more!
You can see right here how creepily they are describing it as their own new age religion right here.
Question: is AA religion's insult to people with drinking problems or is AA the troubled's insult to religion?
AzzholesAnonymous 2 years ago
Bill W. hated alcoholics & his 12 step cult are definite punishment, whose rules were for everyone but himself, Bill Wilson was a punk.
lighwave 3 years ago
want to know what a cult looks like?
go 12 steps!
you know when you have to dance around the fact that you are not a religion, you probably are a religion!
SimonPeter168 3 years ago
Jack Norris, and Nell Wing all said that Bill had let them know how badly he felt about his unfaithfulness to Lois. That he nevertheless was seemingly unable to control himself filled him with despair and self-loathing at times and left him feeling unworthy to lead AA.
fucummings 3 years ago
God is a myth
isegoria1 3 years ago
You know, I still hope you decide to represent the other side - the one based in reality, science and reason.
No cults or higher powers needed or wanted.
911SGY 3 years ago
Thanks for this video. We never know who we may help. AA is so diverse anyone can be in it! With a desire to be sober of course. We need time to find sobriety, AA helped me do this. As there are 6 or 7 billion people on the planet, its good to know all 6 to 7 billion have an understanding of God, all different and all right! Good conscience and truth, as Ghandi suggests are our conscious contact with God? Works for me. Spiritual is always now with least denials and filters, thank God for that!
doninlondon 3 years ago
A group of lowlife pickled brained drunks is not god, and they have no understanding of anything.
hedges2 3 years ago
"group of drunks", my share to the topic:
"recover before recovery" (sn6862*)
*notes
Slogan number 6862
Slogan 6862 nick-names: "the numb", "second numb" or "the get numb". Term "big numb" not in use for many 12+12h. Some expert old-timers expect an revival though, other doubt though.
Slogan 6862 history: Short form of slogan 3828** (you) better recover before recovery, the "fucu".
**notes on notes
sn3818 short form without you, sn 3818(a) long form with you
andreasheinz 3 years ago
Than why is "God" and "him" all over it?
How
The Oxford Group was a cult and so is AA today
Why can't the language in the AA literature be changed over time? Answer, Absolutism, it's a cult!
Jrunri 3 years ago
Group Of Drunks = GOD that can be your higher power a God of YOUR understanding
elkydosser 3 years ago
To mind mind there's something inherently dubious and disingenous about intruding discussions of this issue of spiritual beliefs into what purports to be a method of recovery from an illness.
tobytwirrll 3 years ago
This video seems to have been cut off before the part about the facts are introduced-proven success rate and the such. I am sure it is an over site.
MrAmmo 3 years ago
So what these people are doing is talking to an aspect of their subconscious and asking it to rule their lives. Sounds safe! Nothing irrational or repressed exists in the psyche! It's made out of magic and pixie dust from Ohio.
Really though this reminds me of a Scientology commercial.
ramdillian 3 years ago
I was in aa for many years and left.I am still sober even though I was told I would drink if I left aa.I believe aa is a cult and teaches people not to trust their inner guidance
sherwoode7 3 years ago
si lol
BeantownJim 3 years ago
There is plenty in this aa ideology to offend the religious and non-religious in equal measure. No Christian could honestly say a teaching that you can make anything you like God is compatible with their faith. No atheist or agnostic can honestly believe in the necessity of prayer. This is a superstitious and idolatrous pseudo-religion masquerading as treatment for a supposed illness.
tobytwirrll 3 years ago
Perhaps some confabulations with folks that are not deluded. Or better yet folks that just quit their bad habit sans meetings, religion, or recovery cults.
911SGY 4 years ago
I'm an atheist and freethinker. I also attend A.A. meetings. It says that "the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking." I've been sober for almost 17 years. My so-called "higher power" is reason and rational thinking. There are many "powers" higher than me. The sun, the moon, doctors, lawyers,...even the group of "drunks." g.o.d. Good orderly directions. I don't have to believe like another.
phoenixbrew 4 years ago
Yes, there are many higher powers, but the point of the 12 steps is to find one that will you can believe will alleviate your alcoholism. I doubt that you actually believe that the sun can perform this function.
You are not actually following the program. Many steppers offer up substitute higher powers for the one described in the Big Book, but when asked to describe how they work in practice, they can't. For example, did you humbly ask reason and rationality to restore you to sanity?
telethon123 4 years ago
This higher power may be of one's own understanding, but said higher power must be (according to AA literature) singular, desirous, omnipotent, benevolent and in communion with the stepper. He is also male and called "God". You approach him in a certain way (humbly) and communicate with him in a certain way (through prayer and meditation). The God of AA is much more specific than AA members would lead you to believe.
telethon123 4 years ago
It's great how the members come from so many different backgrounds of faith (or lack thereof). Looking forward to the full-length film. nwb
Yaravis 4 years ago