If pro lifers are pro life as far as their babies are concerned thats OK.They have no rights to impose their view on others who are not.Its like pro choicers imposing abortion on them.They're trying to control the rights of another individual.If abortion is murder masturbation is genocide If everything that ever lived is dead and everything alive is gonna die,where does the sacred part come in?If youre against adoption,that means you turn a blind eye to child abuse, neglect and child murder.
This is a tough tough topic... I don't believe in invisible men in the sky, but i believe it's a tough call... tough... women are not cattle, but a human embrio is a human embrio... tough...
I've never particularly liked the titles "pro-choice" and "pro-life". How many "pro-choicers" out there would gladly tell you what car you can drive, food you can eat, and money you can use? How many "pro-lifers" support the death penalty, and are completely ambivalent to kids dying in other countries? Besides, they're not mutually exclusive. Being pro-choice doesn't make you anti-life and being pro-life doesn't make you anti-choice. What matters is freedom and responsibility.
We'll have dead women before women practicing safe sex and/or abstinence when not desiring pregnancy? Then I'm sure the dead women will be more than adequate deterrence from having nonchalant behavior toward the creation of life as soon as those dead women become common knowledge.
@ItsAboutWhatUDo Well, I'm not the one who're protesting for something that requires hard work for someone else. If someone wants to abort a child, that person have the fucking right to do it.
IMHO, If the mother's life is in danger she should be free to decide whether to have an abortion.
If the mother was raped then there should be assistance programs that would include providing free morning after pills (emergency contraception) within 24 hours after the rape occured (before fertilization).
If it's being done out of convenience (unexpected pregnancy, no condom was used or accidentally broke, etc) then abortion should not be allowed.
well I'm glad that it's not your decision to make because your philosophy is deeply flawed. Life is not black and white like you're making it out to be.
People who want the state to ban abortion are statists. It's that simple. They value the 'life' of an unborn, fully dependent being more than that of a living, independent and self-determining being.
its the choice of the persons that created the seed of life. The fetus doesn't know anything at all, the brain is not developed at all, it doesn't even have genitals. Let the woman do what they want, if they don't want a child you would obviously use contraception. Simple.
@Madfoot713 why wouldn't it start at conception? Do you realize how miraculous and complex the folding of DNA is? Those first cells contain the pattern that is life. Biologically, those cells are alive and contain something very unique - a developing person.
@ItIsNot1984 They're biologically alive, but philosophically they're not a person. A two-celled organism that can't think or feel pain isn't a person.
@Madfoot713 I look at it very differently. To me, we are not physical beings. Every cell in you body will be replaced by new cells within a month's time. So, within a month nothing that physically comprises you body will remain, yet you'll still be alive and still be the same person. Biologically, yes embryos are alive but so is that persistent pattern that makes them individuals.
@ItIsNot1984 This is a stunning thing, but embryos don't have a brain or a nervous system so I don't see how they're morally different from sperm or an egg. -_-;
If you say one form of abortion is a murder (let alone a term as powerful as genocide), you shouldn't include a racial label on top of that such as 'black abortion' because that implies that you are:
a- only value unborn, black children (because of their skin color?).
b- discriminate against any child which will supposedly not be born black (I'm guessing in visible skin tone, only known after birth).
c- are using the race card to promote a religious and/or partisan political agenda.
Very much aware, my comment was in regards to the topic which this video was focused upon (if Adam Kokesh's past videos are anything to base an opinion off of, accusing him of any of my three listed criteria would be an impossible endeavor).
I don't understand the Libertarian pro-life position. If the right to self ownership and self-governance is the basis for all (or most) rights, shouldn't the fetus' right to life end at violation of the mother's body? Even if we hold an embryo to be a human being with full rights, we would never grant a similarly dependent human outside the womb access to another person's bloodstream and body just because they need it to live. What distinction am I missing?
What these people fail to realize is the unsafe lengths some will go if abortion becomes illegal. There would be dead women from unsafe and unclean abortion procedures and overdoses on abortifacient drugs. I'm also assuming none of these people understand what most contraceptives do to fertilized eggs but are taking them. It's just stupid.
@npeffer ... First, most mothers would disagree with you on the whole violation thing. The dependence arguement is null and void since children are dependant for multiple years, not just in the womb. Should we then be able to kill a 2 year old because we feel burdened by them?
@npeffer ... First, most mothers would disagree with you on the whole violation thing. The dependence arguement is null and void since children are dependant for multiple years, not just in the womb. Should we then be able to kill a 2 year old because we feel burdened by them?
@npeffer I'll explain it. Libertarians have a strong sense of responsibility for their own actions. With a few exceptions, abortion is the act of selfishly dodging the biggest responsibility of all. It is offensive to someone like myself that believes strongly in personal responsibility.
i am a pro choice atheist if you want to debate this fact with me feel free to email me at tmoneywars@hotmail.com but i didnt have enought space to explain it here
@smokeystarr One's actions have consequences. It's obvious that I am not free to murder my neighbor out of some twisted sense of liberty. Liberty stops where you harm another. The debate is about whether a fetus is "another". Some say no, because of their selfishness, I say yes. Most agree that murder of a pregnant woman should be punished doubly. In *that* circumstance, the fetus counts because of intention. Hypocrisy. It's selfishness: what about the fetus's intent to live?
@GtheMVP I agree with you. Ideally, medical decisions should be made by the patient & physician. And where appropriate, the patient's family should be included. The government---Federal and State---should stay out of it.Unfortunately in its current form, healthcare is a government sponsored enterprise:Govt pays for all or part of individual healthcare & demands it has a say in personal medical decisions.That's why Ron Paul's healthcare policy makes sense & why statists hate it.
@GtheMVP "I find it funny how many anti stattists want the feds to forcefully prevent the murder of unborn children". Fixed that for you. Giving someone the choice to take the life of another is not liberty.
It's not just black babies being aborted.Abortion knows no race.We have to stop abortion because it is murder.By singling out black people in this video does the fight against abortion a disservice.
I think abortion is horrible!!!! But please don't give the god damn government more power over you. Let the individual decide what to do, not the fucking government. Do you people realize what you are doing?
No matter how you try to justify, abortion is murder. Just think about it. Imagine if you were aborted or if you loved one never existed because they were aborted. Wake up people. Stop being do naive and selfish. A woman's right to choose starts with lifestyle and when rap is involved you ask. How about understanding that that child is not at fault and should not take on the punishment for the acts of others. Those women have an opportunity to give life a chance. Adoption?
My issue is I fail to see how someone thinks that they can tell anyone else what to do with their body. I a totally Pro Choice.An evil choice? If a woman is raped and doesn't want to raise a rapists child should she not be able to choose wether or not she wants to raise it?
@tacoswamper If that woman I spoke of earlier doesnt want to bear the child of a rapist, are you implying that she should and then give that child up for adoption? That sounds alot like she is given less choice. It sounds like the arguement of either bear this child and give it up or bear it and take the "Blessing" of being raped, possibly given an STD, and raise a child with potential affor mentioned STD.Which would most likely turn into a terminal illness in early life. I don't buy that crap.
Its funny cause Ron Paul has voted No against every Goverment Bill having to do with Abortion and funding for Abortion but the media won't tell you that
this guy cam say the president is black like me,if any white person said the presdident is white like me,it would ba an outrage.i hate double standars dont you.k im going to watch wet (white entertainment tel-lie-vision) now
The hypocrisy is people who want the State and Federal government to stay out of the abortion business yet cry for the government to help them raise their kids!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!
@Malie420 I know it's been awhile I'm working on a huge project and hope to be ready in a few weeks. I'm actually looking for a few test users for input, so Email me if you want to be apart of it. playpianoking at gmail
THE MORALITY OF THIS COUNTRY HAS CHANGED. THE ONLY REASON PEOPLE ARE PRO-CHOICE IS PART OF THE FEMINIST MOVEMENT. MAN I WISH MEN HAD AN OPT OUT MEASURE LIKE WOMEN. THEY GET 100% SAY IN WHETHER TO KEEP THE BABY OR NOT YET MEN ARE JUST AS FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR TAKING CARE OF THE CHILDREN AS WOMEN ARE. I'M I LITTLE MORE INDIFFERENT IN THE CASE OF RAPE AND INCEST AND I MIGHT EVEN LET 6WEEKS PREGNANT SLIDE. BUT IF YOU LAY YOUR BED YOU MUST FIX IT.
@16coonedan Why am I atheist or pro-life? I assume you mean pro-life since the atheism arguments are abundant. Anyway, I'm pro-life because the loss of life is a tragedy. There's a 6 month waiting list for parents to adopt even the most unwanted children (disabled blacks). With very few exceptions, this means that aborting an unborn child is completely unnecessary. It is a selfish act on behalf of the parents of the child to take it's life rather than give it away to a loving family.
@ItIsNot1984 so if a woman gets raped they have to ruin there lifes, go through horrible pains that remind her of getting raped, and give up this child that she has become attatched to while thaere are children in group homes and foster care praying to get adopted, or if the baby inside the woman pregnant gets some sort of infection meaning if you didnt abort it the mother and child would both die.
@16coonedan Yeah the fetus is alive, meaning viable, at conception. life begins at conception, since there's only one outcome of pregnancy. Many people believe that the baby is alive at conception.Others believe it is when the heart beats for the first time (6 weeks after conception). Still others believe that the baby is not alive until quickening (16-20 weeks), and some don't believe the baby is alive until it is full-term (37 weeks) or even born. I think it's wrong, but it's up to states :P.
@16coonedan dude abortion is wrong plain and simple no matter what the circumstances. the woman has the right to choose but men should always highly recommend keeping the baby no matter what. I dont get why u have to go through all of that explanation.
@ItsAboutWhatUDo I'm sorry i just don't understand why people are pro life. it's wrong to tell people how to live thier life. We are a great country because people have freedom. I personally don't think abortion is right but it's none of my or anyone's buisness so I recommend everyone should just stay out of it. It's up to the woman. nuff said
@16coonedan Once a baby is conceived it should have rights as well and im sure the baby would choose to live. If the woman is about to die then of course u abort the baby but anything other than that is murder basicly, ur killing a child if u agree to abortion.
@ItsAboutWhatUDo It's not murder. It's cancelling a pregnancy. Why make a mother and child go throw hardships of life. In most cases the child would probably live a sad life. But I beleive in woman haveing the freedom to choose. sometimes woman are stuck in very very tough situations where they need that option.
@16coonedan dude cancelling a pregnancy just because u dont have money to support the baby doesnt make it right. the mother and child going through hardships doesnt have anything to do with abortion being wrong or not. I dont understand why people cant understand that even 1 month into a pregnancy there is a still a life there! ur explanation is shit dude so just because u have a shitty life u should just kill ur self is basicly what ur saying.
@ItsAboutWhatUDo I just think its wrong for judgemental conservative assholes like I asume your a man so if you are who r u to tell a woman what they can and can't do it has nothing to do with you. Second we don't know exactly when a human life begins so as long as there are doupts you can't say its murder so in reality nothing you are saying makes sence. Who is anyone to get in a woman's face while they are making one of the hardest decisions of there life.
@16coonedan whatever man i already said the woman has a right to make the decision but if she aborts the baby it was the wrong decision. millions of children dont get a chance at life because of abortions that is the only fact that matters. mammals r developing when the mother is pregnant even in the first month and an abortion is cutting off that development.
@16coonedan "It's not murder. It's cancelling a pregnancy. Why make a mother and child go throw hardships of life." Sound's like you're not giving them the "choice". ;)
Uhm, yeah it completely matters. A basic understand of the development of a fetus is what makes MOST abortions humane to perform as well as safe. People like you are scary because you just regurgitate what you hear without any research or thought put into your opinion. You most likely hold a dualist philosophical view which helps cloud your already murky viewpoint as well. Learn some shit before you act like an asshole, ok?
@WildKatWays It doesnt matter dude. U dont need to know everything about a fetus to know that abortion is wrong. It is the womans choice tho ultimately.
True you don't need to know everything, however a BASIC understanding of reproduction will uncover that by the time most abortions occur a fetus won't have even developed a CNS. But if we were to get in deeper I could very well explain to you why you're an idiot.
If you don't like abortions, don't get one. End of story.
@WildKatWays how am i an idiot then? ur the one that sent me a comment talking shit when it was none of ur beezwax so whatever. i said one month into life there is a baby there but u act like im completely clueless. so i guess when ur pregnant one month in doesnt count. And u call me scary, funny.
Hahaha So it's none of my "beeswax" but you're a male (assuming from your youtube profile) getting into an issue you will probably never have to deal with. Hahaha that's just one example of how you're an idiot. You also say the development doesn't matter when you abort, which it completely does. It's a matter of human embryology that makes majority of induced abortions safe, painless, and ethical. You are clueless.
@WildKatWays from the very start the baby is developing so it really shouldnt matter if it is one month in or nine months. ur saying that sometimes abortions r fine and sometimes they arent, how can i be the clueless one here? ur just trying to argue for no reason and it is a waste of my thoughts abortion is wrong end of story goodbye clown.
But in the scheme of things yes it does matter. You're not going to sit here and try and guilt trip women into thinking that they're bad people for not wanting a child and getting an abortion. A little opposition and you crumble like a bitch. If you understood the development, you'd understand why it's a humane procedure and how regular contraception (besides condoms) does the same thing as a surgical procedure. Im arguing cause you're dumb and refuse to use science.
@16coonedan Like I said there are few exceptions. It is sad that people are forced to choose in those situations. However, in the instance of rape, a woman that values life strongly enough to go through with it has a special place in my book. The world would be a far better place if we all aspired to that level.
I was watching CBN Newswatch yesterday and they covered this. I smiled when as they showed footage they several times showed a huge sign which said "Life, Liberty, Ron Paul" Only ones too. Made me so proud.
No thumbs up or down its there choice to believe in what ever they want to believe no matter what you believe is right!
I'm a Ron Paul supporter, if you should ever be lucky enough to come in contact with one of us in person be sure to absorb what comes out of there mouths. For you'll never meet any1 with so MUCH KNOWLEDGE & OPEN MINDEDNESS IN SUCH A YOUNG BODY... My opinion on this is: glad U have an opinion & so many followers, I'll just be sure to avoid that state
Read about the dark side of Margaret Sanger and her views on eugenics. She founded Planned Parenthood, to further eugenics to eliminate the weak, feeble, undesirables. Last year this administration erected a statue to immortalize her. Is eugenics still going on in America? I will leave you to decide. Read about John Holdren, Obama's science czar and his views on eugenics. Educate yourselves.
According to what? Are you seriously implying that a zygote that has no organs is just as much a human as you or I, and do you expect your position to be taken seriously?
"It's a life!"
Cancer, meat, and germs are as well. I don't see you calling for a ban on chemotherapy, eating meat or using soap. Certainly there's a point of viability where the baby would indeed feel pain if aborted, and maybe a ban there is acceptable.
@IJUSTLOVETURTLES when a seed is germinated it becomes a living thing. after a seed is germinated, the only thing you can do to it is, "kill it". otherwise it's not going to be any living thing because it was not germinated... eggs that are layed from chickens which have not been fertilized (germinated) inside the chicken will not ever be life... they will rot as eggs...
@IJUSTLOVETURTLES it's not about the pain, it's about the life itself. it's total disregard for life to knowingly kill a germinated seed. in fact, to knowingly kill a germinated seed is just pure evil...
@jbkibs The point I'm making is that very few people have regard for life in all contexts, so the argument is inconsistent for almost all pro-lifers to make.
This guy, and all who agree with him, should work a day where I work, at a drug rehabilitation center where most of our clients have over 3 children, some as many as 11, all of whom are undereducated, underprivileged, malnurished and on welfare. Abortion is killing a life but sometimes its a mercy killing.
@hospitalcorpsmanstep I would check out the documentary Maafa 21. You can watch the full thing on youtube. Basically describes the racial agenda behind abortion (eugenics, genocidal goals of the likes of Margaret Sanger, disproportionate abortion of African Americans etc)
The preacher even said it himself, it's a choice he finds evil. Though just like anything else you drive underground with laws it will still happen just in a less safe way. I know a young girl who had an abortion just by having someone jump on her belly in a semi-rough manner. So sure it's a horrible thing and possibly immoral but if your willing to force your views on others through law it will only make the reality of the situation a lot worse. Leave funding choices to each states if anything.
Obama has no remorse for Black Genocide, whether through abortion or the murder of Black Libyans, in his immoral war against the Sovereign Nation of Libya!! Obama is an "Elitist" now and has no regard for Human life, regardless of skin color!!
I think 3 months is a good place to draw the line. It's plenty of time for the woman to decide whether or not a baby is feasible for her and at 3 months, doctors cannot distinguish a human fetus from a pig one.
Pro-Choice? More like Anti-Responsibility. These people would rather murder another human being than accept responsibility for their actions. Funny how these people are all for a woman running away from responsibility and yet if you ask them if they would be okay with the man leaving the woman for the same reasons suddenly they do a hypocritical complete 180. if you believe in a womans "right" to run away from responsibility you must also believe in a mans right as well. Equality.
Most disgusting to me are the doctors who go to school for years to learn how to kill babies. What sick person when given the choice to preserve life or end it chooses to end life.
@willkev25 What kind of person imposes Good Samaritan laws on half the population? Or polices what others do with their own bodies? Or assumea the universal guilt of those who seek abortion in particular circumstances? Or restricts the free action of another because of emotional distress? Or values a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being?
@CleanTownUSA Once again, an unborn baby is NOT your body. How is not allowing death clinics to legally operate imposing "good samaritan" laws? People just plain and simply don't value any life but their own. It's the sad truth!
52 million huh? I for one am glad these people aren't clogging up the roads and competing for jobs, too many fucking people anyway. Take a ride in an airplane, houses everywhere, no wild places left in America.
So sick of these fuckers wasting their time on the rights of eggs and sperm. If they really cared about human beings they'd be sorting out the problems of people with lives. Much easier to champion the cause of a theoretical person.
And making abortion illegal doesn't stop it. It just goes underground and kills more women., But then these fuckers don't care about women dying.
Should sperm have rights, too? Should ovaries have rights? Or is it the moment of conception that endows the fetus, the zygote, with rights and sanctification?
@ThisPoisonTree Significant, morally relevant life with a future-like-ours begins at conception, because it is only upon fertilization that a future-like-ours can be realized. But that is only one side of the equation. No one has a right to another's body. We shouldn't value a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being. It is immoral to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of women to their bodily autonomy and self-determination.
@CleanTownUSA I would argue if no one has the right to another person's body is not the argument. You do not have the right to murder your baby. What about the unborn childs body? You seem to have no problem with violating it.
@willkev25 You also have "no problem" with letting people in distant lands die of starvation. After all, you could sell some of your possession and feed a whole village for a month. But no one has the right to your property, or the labor of your hands, or the autonomy of your body. No one can force you to give up your autonomy, not even for a whole village. So yes, it is the right argument.
@CleanTownUSA An unborn child is NOT property, therefore your argument is irrelevent. Also, how would you know what I do or don't do with my money/property. It is you who says I don't care about those in distant lands, not I.
@willkev25 You are correct. An unborn child is not your property. Neither are starving children who have already been born. Neither of them have a right to your body.
You are right, I don't know what you do with your property or your body. It is none of my business. That is my point. I don't have the right to command you to do anything for another human being you haven't already aggressed against. That includes starving children across the ocean, and a fetus in our body.
@CleanTownUSA It is not a question of what you have to do for someone, it is what you are allowed to do TO another human. You shouldn't kill other humans, therefore you also shouldn't kill unborn humans.
@jrgenkratz You are not allowed to usurp another persons body. You are not allowed to force labor. You are not allowed to enslave another. You are not allowed to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of others. You shouldn't curtail the self-determination of others. You shouldn't coerce others into actions that are preferable to you. You shouldn't value a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being.
There is a difference between justified killing and murder.
@CleanTownUSA So killing someone solely because they would be burdensome to you is justified. "You are not allowed to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of others" Like the life of an unborn child for example.
@cbuma I advise you to click the "view all comments" button and search through my posts. I've answered that question already, and have most likely reposted the reply several times. I'm going to bed now!
@CleanTownUSA No one's trying to steal your body or tell you what to do with it. We're telling you that you can't kill your baby! A mother is supposed to defend their child, not defend themselves from real responsibility by killing their baby. It's amazing that this needs to be explained to people!
@ThisPoisonTree I don't think anyone argues that they should. But no matter what your stance is, you have to draw the line somewhere. Even the pro-choicers. Cause nothing really happens with the baby upon birth. It is still exactly the same thing, it only moved. And there is no easy line to be drawn anywhere, no matter what criteria you use. And all criteria for when to get your rights are completely arbitrary. That is what pro-choicers and pro-lifers both need to understand.
@jrgenkratz No, it is not exactly the same thing. Pull the fetus out too early and there is not a chance for survival on it's own. If the baby could survive on it's own with the help of others, then that is different. Are we not rationalizing the criteria for personhood and rights right now? I don't want absolute morality. I'd rather have reason and rational discussion and the fact that morality and rights may be challenged. Respecting the dignity of others with their choices.
@ThisPoisonTree I agree with you. We need a rational discussion on the ethics of killing fetuses and embryos. That is exactly what I am asking for. I do not think it should be illegal to take a morning after pill, but where to draw the line is extremely difficult. Which is why I have problems with the pro-choicers overly simplistic argumentation. Argument like "it's just a ball of cells", like any human isn't just a ball of cells. Or completely ignoring the children altogether.
@jrgenkratz What about completely ignoring the human host altogether? Woman are considered as secondary (if they are considered at all) in these debates. The actual experiences of women are not perceived as morally relevant to the debate, unless these women can are "innocent" by because of rape or incest. Women’s role are often reduced to a ‘fetal containers’; individual women disappear or are perceived simply as mechanical life-support systems.
@ThisPoisonTree A good place to start is to stop your heart and see what happens. If your heart did stop for the rest of your life, wouldn't you die? So then, the child inside the womb has a beating heart, it's heart stops and... it dies! Therefore it was alive due to it's beating heart.
@thildebrand Significant, morally relevant life with a future-like-ours begins even earlier than the beating hear. It begins at conception, because upon fertilization a future-like-ours can be realized. But that is only one side of the equation. No one has a right to another's body. We shouldn't police what women do with their bodies, because they have inviolable, inalienable rights of bodily autonomy and self-determination.
@thildebrand How logical. Of course, though I think your question is rhetorical. BUT, could the fetus survive if it was pulled out at the moment of conception? During certain points of gestation? It is fully dependent on the mother, and thank (add adage here) that the choice can be made, because it may be for the best interests of both of them.
@ThisPoisonTree Yes, logical. That's actually why I think life begins when there is a discernable heart beat. I stray away from saying it starts at conception, but if I were to use logic to understand conception it would be "a ball of cells does a function" But an Embryo is a ball of cells, within a womb of a human woman, that is doing it's funtion toward the end result of a human being. Therefore, it is, in that sense, a completely different situation than any other cells
@thildebrand Oh and also my initial question wasn't rhetorical, but factual. All animals are "alive" because they have a heart beat, correct (speak of humanoid animals). Now, the "fully dependent" idea is interesting, but if you take a new born, leave it on the table and give it no help, it will die as well. So then, can you judge life by our dependence on another? No, of course not. A retarded 30 year old would die without his mother, but he IS alive, right?
Amen, Pastor Luke Robinson, best pro-life speech EVER!!!!! Defund Klan Parenthood!
bluepuppyboy 18 hours ago
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If pro lifers are pro life as far as their babies are concerned thats OK.They have no rights to impose their view on others who are not.Its like pro choicers imposing abortion on them.They're trying to control the rights of another individual.If abortion is murder masturbation is genocide If everything that ever lived is dead and everything alive is gonna die,where does the sacred part come in?If youre against adoption,that means you turn a blind eye to child abuse, neglect and child murder.
afrikanballa 3 weeks ago
hahahahahhahahahahaaahah
shirin2556 3 weeks ago
ABORTION IS WHITE GENOCIDE!
NPDkampf 1 month ago 2
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afrikanballa 3 weeks ago
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NPDkampf 1 month ago
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ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
This is a tough tough topic... I don't believe in invisible men in the sky, but i believe it's a tough call... tough... women are not cattle, but a human embrio is a human embrio... tough...
andresrianofski 1 month ago
I've never particularly liked the titles "pro-choice" and "pro-life". How many "pro-choicers" out there would gladly tell you what car you can drive, food you can eat, and money you can use? How many "pro-lifers" support the death penalty, and are completely ambivalent to kids dying in other countries? Besides, they're not mutually exclusive. Being pro-choice doesn't make you anti-life and being pro-life doesn't make you anti-choice. What matters is freedom and responsibility.
AndrewOverthrow 1 month ago
I don't like abortion, but there is nothing my power to force a woman to not get one. Only persuasion.
kmelfina 1 month ago in playlist More videos from AdamKokesh
We'll have dead women before women practicing safe sex and/or abstinence when not desiring pregnancy? Then I'm sure the dead women will be more than adequate deterrence from having nonchalant behavior toward the creation of life as soon as those dead women become common knowledge.
heymisterderp 1 month ago
So many dislikes u people r ignorant.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
If you are against abortion then I suggest you take care of the child instead of talking a lot of shit. Most of you pussies talk more than you act.
Watchdawg 1 month ago
@Watchdawg well u just talked
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo Well, I'm not the one who're protesting for something that requires hard work for someone else. If someone wants to abort a child, that person have the fucking right to do it.
Watchdawg 1 month ago
@Watchdawg i never said they didnt
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
IMHO, If the mother's life is in danger she should be free to decide whether to have an abortion.
If the mother was raped then there should be assistance programs that would include providing free morning after pills (emergency contraception) within 24 hours after the rape occured (before fertilization).
If it's being done out of convenience (unexpected pregnancy, no condom was used or accidentally broke, etc) then abortion should not be allowed.
87webdev 1 month ago
@87webdev
well I'm glad that it's not your decision to make because your philosophy is deeply flawed. Life is not black and white like you're making it out to be.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
People who want the state to ban abortion are statists. It's that simple. They value the 'life' of an unborn, fully dependent being more than that of a living, independent and self-determining being.
sheepOG 1 month ago
@sheepOG agree
broncofan92slay 1 month ago in playlist More videos from AdamKokesh
its the choice of the persons that created the seed of life. The fetus doesn't know anything at all, the brain is not developed at all, it doesn't even have genitals. Let the woman do what they want, if they don't want a child you would obviously use contraception. Simple.
Goatsteeet 1 month ago
I don't necessarily believe life starts at BIRTH but I don't think life starts at CONCEPTION. That's just insane.
-not pro-choice nor pro-life-
Madfoot713 1 month ago
@Madfoot713 why wouldn't it start at conception? Do you realize how miraculous and complex the folding of DNA is? Those first cells contain the pattern that is life. Biologically, those cells are alive and contain something very unique - a developing person.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
@ItIsNot1984 They're biologically alive, but philosophically they're not a person. A two-celled organism that can't think or feel pain isn't a person.
Madfoot713 1 month ago
@Madfoot713 I look at it very differently. To me, we are not physical beings. Every cell in you body will be replaced by new cells within a month's time. So, within a month nothing that physically comprises you body will remain, yet you'll still be alive and still be the same person. Biologically, yes embryos are alive but so is that persistent pattern that makes them individuals.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
@ItIsNot1984 This is a stunning thing, but embryos don't have a brain or a nervous system so I don't see how they're morally different from sperm or an egg. -_-;
Madfoot713 1 month ago
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baydood510 1 month ago
If you say one form of abortion is a murder (let alone a term as powerful as genocide), you shouldn't include a racial label on top of that such as 'black abortion' because that implies that you are:
a- only value unborn, black children (because of their skin color?).
b- discriminate against any child which will supposedly not be born black (I'm guessing in visible skin tone, only known after birth).
c- are using the race card to promote a religious and/or partisan political agenda.
Dragodemon000 1 month ago
@Dragodemon000 That is not what Adam thinks that was Pastor Luke's message.
masterbrice 1 month ago
@masterbrice
Very much aware, my comment was in regards to the topic which this video was focused upon (if Adam Kokesh's past videos are anything to base an opinion off of, accusing him of any of my three listed criteria would be an impossible endeavor).
Dragodemon000 1 month ago
ANY abortion is genocide
th86stone 1 month ago
I don't understand the Libertarian pro-life position. If the right to self ownership and self-governance is the basis for all (or most) rights, shouldn't the fetus' right to life end at violation of the mother's body? Even if we hold an embryo to be a human being with full rights, we would never grant a similarly dependent human outside the womb access to another person's bloodstream and body just because they need it to live. What distinction am I missing?
npeffer 1 month ago 2
@npeffer
I don't understand it either....
What these people fail to realize is the unsafe lengths some will go if abortion becomes illegal. There would be dead women from unsafe and unclean abortion procedures and overdoses on abortifacient drugs. I'm also assuming none of these people understand what most contraceptives do to fertilized eggs but are taking them. It's just stupid.
WildKatWays 1 month ago 2
@npeffer ... First, most mothers would disagree with you on the whole violation thing. The dependence arguement is null and void since children are dependant for multiple years, not just in the womb. Should we then be able to kill a 2 year old because we feel burdened by them?
Gethsemaneful 1 month ago
@Gethsemaneful
There is a difference between a conscious 2 year old and a fetus without the neurological pathways to form thoughts.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays What about a fetus with a developing nervous system?
Madfoot713 1 month ago
@Madfoot713
It depends on the stage at the time of abortion.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays yes I would think so.
Madfoot713 1 month ago
@Madfoot713
So I guess I really don't get where you were trying to go by responding to me...
WildKatWays 1 month ago
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@npeffer ... First, most mothers would disagree with you on the whole violation thing. The dependence arguement is null and void since children are dependant for multiple years, not just in the womb. Should we then be able to kill a 2 year old because we feel burdened by them?
Gethsemaneful 1 month ago
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ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
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@npeffer I'll explain it. Libertarians have a strong sense of responsibility for their own actions. With a few exceptions, abortion is the act of selfishly dodging the biggest responsibility of all. It is offensive to someone like myself that believes strongly in personal responsibility.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
Calling Obama black is disrespectful to his mother (thank you KRS1).
jwalidea 1 month ago
Why doesn't everyone just worry about their own reproductive decisions?
WildKatWays 1 month ago
You know what they say, once you have a black baby, you're a single mother.
Cibermonster 1 month ago
You don't know if you like it until you try it. By the sound of this fruit it seems like the best option in all cases.
Cibermonster 1 month ago
i am a pro choice atheist if you want to debate this fact with me feel free to email me at tmoneywars@hotmail.com but i didnt have enought space to explain it here
crazyfordhat 1 month ago
I think we are all pro-life. Youre either pro-choice or anti-choice. Dont villanize liberty.
smokeystarr 1 month ago
@smokeystarr One's actions have consequences. It's obvious that I am not free to murder my neighbor out of some twisted sense of liberty. Liberty stops where you harm another. The debate is about whether a fetus is "another". Some say no, because of their selfishness, I say yes. Most agree that murder of a pregnant woman should be punished doubly. In *that* circumstance, the fetus counts because of intention. Hypocrisy. It's selfishness: what about the fetus's intent to live?
ssdwellah 1 month ago
This should be a state issue IMO. I find it funny how many anti stattists want the feds to forcefull prvent choice.
If a woman is raped, no one but her should have the choice.
GtheMVP 1 month ago
@GtheMVP I agree with you. Ideally, medical decisions should be made by the patient & physician. And where appropriate, the patient's family should be included. The government---Federal and State---should stay out of it.Unfortunately in its current form, healthcare is a government sponsored enterprise:Govt pays for all or part of individual healthcare & demands it has a say in personal medical decisions.That's why Ron Paul's healthcare policy makes sense & why statists hate it.
whatthedormousesaid 1 month ago
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@GtheMVP "I find it funny how many anti stattists want the feds to forcefully prevent the murder of unborn children". Fixed that for you. Giving someone the choice to take the life of another is not liberty.
cbuma 1 month ago
It's not just black babies being aborted.Abortion knows no race.We have to stop abortion because it is murder.By singling out black people in this video does the fight against abortion a disservice.
jerryb19531953 1 month ago
I wish I would have been aborted, then I wouldn't have to see all these idiots begging the government to rule them like the slaves they are.
twn5858 1 month ago
We don't need 'change', I agree "We need to change.".
wisefulone 1 month ago
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I am a pro-choice atheist.
I think abortion is horrible!!!! But please don't give the god damn government more power over you. Let the individual decide what to do, not the fucking government. Do you people realize what you are doing?
twn5858 1 month ago
Maafa 21 - An amazing documentary on Planned Parenthood and its origins
uwmbigb 1 month ago
I could have been aborted because doctors said I had muscular dystrophy. If you support abortion, you would have killed me.
Craigvr 1 month ago
No matter how you try to justify, abortion is murder. Just think about it. Imagine if you were aborted or if you loved one never existed because they were aborted. Wake up people. Stop being do naive and selfish. A woman's right to choose starts with lifestyle and when rap is involved you ask. How about understanding that that child is not at fault and should not take on the punishment for the acts of others. Those women have an opportunity to give life a chance. Adoption?
wallaceju 1 month ago
A little less stupid people that procreate like rabbits sounds like a good idea for all races.
SloterMFmeyer 1 month ago
Personhood? This is a part of the corporate agenda.
SloterMFmeyer 1 month ago
My issue is I fail to see how someone thinks that they can tell anyone else what to do with their body. I a totally Pro Choice.An evil choice? If a woman is raped and doesn't want to raise a rapists child should she not be able to choose wether or not she wants to raise it?
jnmaxwell117 1 month ago
@jnmaxwell117 Your argument is invalid because adoption is an option.
tacoswamper 1 month ago
@tacoswamper So she should slave away for nine months because you say so?
What is with all these "libertarians" who like to use force?
sheepOG 1 month ago
@tacoswamper If that woman I spoke of earlier doesnt want to bear the child of a rapist, are you implying that she should and then give that child up for adoption? That sounds alot like she is given less choice. It sounds like the arguement of either bear this child and give it up or bear it and take the "Blessing" of being raped, possibly given an STD, and raise a child with potential affor mentioned STD.Which would most likely turn into a terminal illness in early life. I don't buy that crap.
jnmaxwell117 1 month ago
Teach your kids how to use rubbers!!!!!! No shame...no shame!!!!
IrishLincoln 1 month ago 4
Its funny cause Ron Paul has voted No against every Goverment Bill having to do with Abortion and funding for Abortion but the media won't tell you that
RJD185 1 month ago
this guy cam say the president is black like me,if any white person said the presdident is white like me,it would ba an outrage.i hate double standars dont you.k im going to watch wet (white entertainment tel-lie-vision) now
18wheeler76 1 month ago
Ron Paul 2012
dubk71 1 month ago 25
@dubk71 Ditto :D
RJD185 1 month ago
The hypocrisy is people who want the State and Federal government to stay out of the abortion business yet cry for the government to help them raise their kids!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!
You can't have it both ways.
acidhead43 1 month ago 3
You will receive supernatural favor and blessings for standing up for the innocent babies who cant stand up for themselves.
bluechipmor 1 month ago
Adam, thank you for posting this video
bluechipmor 1 month ago
@Malie420 I know it's been awhile I'm working on a huge project and hope to be ready in a few weeks. I'm actually looking for a few test users for input, so Email me if you want to be apart of it. playpianoking at gmail
gotitans999 1 month ago
Ron Paul 2012!
shwalgren 1 month ago
Amen! Hey Adam, this is a really powerful speech you've captured, and I appreciate you filming and sharing it. Thanks!
FatimaTruthseeker 1 month ago
THE MORALITY OF THIS COUNTRY HAS CHANGED. THE ONLY REASON PEOPLE ARE PRO-CHOICE IS PART OF THE FEMINIST MOVEMENT. MAN I WISH MEN HAD AN OPT OUT MEASURE LIKE WOMEN. THEY GET 100% SAY IN WHETHER TO KEEP THE BABY OR NOT YET MEN ARE JUST AS FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR TAKING CARE OF THE CHILDREN AS WOMEN ARE. I'M I LITTLE MORE INDIFFERENT IN THE CASE OF RAPE AND INCEST AND I MIGHT EVEN LET 6WEEKS PREGNANT SLIDE. BUT IF YOU LAY YOUR BED YOU MUST FIX IT.
colossalko 1 month ago 3
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black abortion is welfare relief
rtardbox 1 month ago
I am a pro-life atheist.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago 29
@ItIsNot1984 I can have a completely non-religious pro-life argument based on the constitution. We need more of you, it's the only way.
wrighjac 1 month ago
@wrighjac Too many atheists are pro-choice just because they think some religious nuts are trying to impose their beliefs on them.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
@ItIsNot1984 why?
16coonedan 1 month ago
@16coonedan Why am I atheist or pro-life? I assume you mean pro-life since the atheism arguments are abundant. Anyway, I'm pro-life because the loss of life is a tragedy. There's a 6 month waiting list for parents to adopt even the most unwanted children (disabled blacks). With very few exceptions, this means that aborting an unborn child is completely unnecessary. It is a selfish act on behalf of the parents of the child to take it's life rather than give it away to a loving family.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
@ItIsNot1984 so if a woman gets raped they have to ruin there lifes, go through horrible pains that remind her of getting raped, and give up this child that she has become attatched to while thaere are children in group homes and foster care praying to get adopted, or if the baby inside the woman pregnant gets some sort of infection meaning if you didnt abort it the mother and child would both die.
16coonedan 1 month ago
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@16coonedan Yeah the fetus is alive, meaning viable, at conception. life begins at conception, since there's only one outcome of pregnancy. Many people believe that the baby is alive at conception.Others believe it is when the heart beats for the first time (6 weeks after conception). Still others believe that the baby is not alive until quickening (16-20 weeks), and some don't believe the baby is alive until it is full-term (37 weeks) or even born. I think it's wrong, but it's up to states :P.
baydood510 1 month ago
@16coonedan dude abortion is wrong plain and simple no matter what the circumstances. the woman has the right to choose but men should always highly recommend keeping the baby no matter what. I dont get why u have to go through all of that explanation.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo I'm sorry i just don't understand why people are pro life. it's wrong to tell people how to live thier life. We are a great country because people have freedom. I personally don't think abortion is right but it's none of my or anyone's buisness so I recommend everyone should just stay out of it. It's up to the woman. nuff said
16coonedan 1 month ago
@16coonedan Once a baby is conceived it should have rights as well and im sure the baby would choose to live. If the woman is about to die then of course u abort the baby but anything other than that is murder basicly, ur killing a child if u agree to abortion.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo It's not murder. It's cancelling a pregnancy. Why make a mother and child go throw hardships of life. In most cases the child would probably live a sad life. But I beleive in woman haveing the freedom to choose. sometimes woman are stuck in very very tough situations where they need that option.
16coonedan 1 month ago
@16coonedan dude cancelling a pregnancy just because u dont have money to support the baby doesnt make it right. the mother and child going through hardships doesnt have anything to do with abortion being wrong or not. I dont understand why people cant understand that even 1 month into a pregnancy there is a still a life there! ur explanation is shit dude so just because u have a shitty life u should just kill ur self is basicly what ur saying.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo I just think its wrong for judgemental conservative assholes like I asume your a man so if you are who r u to tell a woman what they can and can't do it has nothing to do with you. Second we don't know exactly when a human life begins so as long as there are doupts you can't say its murder so in reality nothing you are saying makes sence. Who is anyone to get in a woman's face while they are making one of the hardest decisions of there life.
16coonedan 1 month ago
@16coonedan whatever man i already said the woman has a right to make the decision but if she aborts the baby it was the wrong decision. millions of children dont get a chance at life because of abortions that is the only fact that matters. mammals r developing when the mother is pregnant even in the first month and an abortion is cutting off that development.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
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@16coonedan "It's not murder. It's cancelling a pregnancy. Why make a mother and child go throw hardships of life." Sound's like you're not giving them the "choice". ;)
PrivateVideoArchive 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo
You need some biology lessons badly. You don't understand anything about the development of a fetus, and that's scary.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays does it really matter? atleast im not trying to defend abortion, the people defending abortion r the scary ones.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo
Uhm, yeah it completely matters. A basic understand of the development of a fetus is what makes MOST abortions humane to perform as well as safe. People like you are scary because you just regurgitate what you hear without any research or thought put into your opinion. You most likely hold a dualist philosophical view which helps cloud your already murky viewpoint as well. Learn some shit before you act like an asshole, ok?
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays It doesnt matter dude. U dont need to know everything about a fetus to know that abortion is wrong. It is the womans choice tho ultimately.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo
True you don't need to know everything, however a BASIC understanding of reproduction will uncover that by the time most abortions occur a fetus won't have even developed a CNS. But if we were to get in deeper I could very well explain to you why you're an idiot.
If you don't like abortions, don't get one. End of story.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays how am i an idiot then? ur the one that sent me a comment talking shit when it was none of ur beezwax so whatever. i said one month into life there is a baby there but u act like im completely clueless. so i guess when ur pregnant one month in doesnt count. And u call me scary, funny.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo
Hahaha So it's none of my "beeswax" but you're a male (assuming from your youtube profile) getting into an issue you will probably never have to deal with. Hahaha that's just one example of how you're an idiot. You also say the development doesn't matter when you abort, which it completely does. It's a matter of human embryology that makes majority of induced abortions safe, painless, and ethical. You are clueless.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@WildKatWays from the very start the baby is developing so it really shouldnt matter if it is one month in or nine months. ur saying that sometimes abortions r fine and sometimes they arent, how can i be the clueless one here? ur just trying to argue for no reason and it is a waste of my thoughts abortion is wrong end of story goodbye clown.
ItsAboutWhatUDo 1 month ago
@ItsAboutWhatUDo
But in the scheme of things yes it does matter. You're not going to sit here and try and guilt trip women into thinking that they're bad people for not wanting a child and getting an abortion. A little opposition and you crumble like a bitch. If you understood the development, you'd understand why it's a humane procedure and how regular contraception (besides condoms) does the same thing as a surgical procedure. Im arguing cause you're dumb and refuse to use science.
WildKatWays 1 month ago
@16coonedan Like I said there are few exceptions. It is sad that people are forced to choose in those situations. However, in the instance of rape, a woman that values life strongly enough to go through with it has a special place in my book. The world would be a far better place if we all aspired to that level.
ItIsNot1984 1 month ago
@ItIsNot1984 It would be even more sad if people didn't have the option to even chose.
16coonedan 1 month ago
I was watching CBN Newswatch yesterday and they covered this. I smiled when as they showed footage they several times showed a huge sign which said "Life, Liberty, Ron Paul" Only ones too. Made me so proud.
Gethsemaneful 1 month ago
Sorry Adam Kokesh for using your page to talk to piano boy, we miss you here in the 505
Malie420 1 month ago
No thumbs up or down its there choice to believe in what ever they want to believe no matter what you believe is right!
I'm a Ron Paul supporter, if you should ever be lucky enough to come in contact with one of us in person be sure to absorb what comes out of there mouths. For you'll never meet any1 with so MUCH KNOWLEDGE & OPEN MINDEDNESS IN SUCH A YOUNG BODY... My opinion on this is: glad U have an opinion & so many followers, I'll just be sure to avoid that state
mrsentry08 1 month ago
had to thumbs down. All I heard was yelling.
gotitans999 1 month ago
@gotitans999
Better then not shit for months, make a fucking tutorial already. I WANT TO BE A MEMBER BUT YOU HAVE NO NEW SHIT
Malie420 1 month ago
Read about the dark side of Margaret Sanger and her views on eugenics. She founded Planned Parenthood, to further eugenics to eliminate the weak, feeble, undesirables. Last year this administration erected a statue to immortalize her. Is eugenics still going on in America? I will leave you to decide. Read about John Holdren, Obama's science czar and his views on eugenics. Educate yourselves.
Mojo3192 1 month ago
Just my pro-choice opinion, but this is stupid.
"IT'S A PERSON"
According to what? Are you seriously implying that a zygote that has no organs is just as much a human as you or I, and do you expect your position to be taken seriously?
"It's a life!"
Cancer, meat, and germs are as well. I don't see you calling for a ban on chemotherapy, eating meat or using soap. Certainly there's a point of viability where the baby would indeed feel pain if aborted, and maybe a ban there is acceptable.
IJUSTLOVETURTLES 1 month ago
@IJUSTLOVETURTLES when a seed is germinated it becomes a living thing. after a seed is germinated, the only thing you can do to it is, "kill it". otherwise it's not going to be any living thing because it was not germinated... eggs that are layed from chickens which have not been fertilized (germinated) inside the chicken will not ever be life... they will rot as eggs...
jbkibs 1 month ago
@IJUSTLOVETURTLES it's not about the pain, it's about the life itself. it's total disregard for life to knowingly kill a germinated seed. in fact, to knowingly kill a germinated seed is just pure evil...
jbkibs 1 month ago
@jbkibs The point I'm making is that very few people have regard for life in all contexts, so the argument is inconsistent for almost all pro-lifers to make.
IJUSTLOVETURTLES 1 month ago
can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em
twags32689 1 month ago
C'mon really, Kokesh — really?
Tsicar 1 month ago
This guy, and all who agree with him, should work a day where I work, at a drug rehabilitation center where most of our clients have over 3 children, some as many as 11, all of whom are undereducated, underprivileged, malnurished and on welfare. Abortion is killing a life but sometimes its a mercy killing.
Fatman0and0LittleBoy 1 month ago
if black abortion is genocide, what is white abortion?
hospitalcorpsmanstep 1 month ago
@hospitalcorpsmanstep I would check out the documentary Maafa 21. You can watch the full thing on youtube. Basically describes the racial agenda behind abortion (eugenics, genocidal goals of the likes of Margaret Sanger, disproportionate abortion of African Americans etc)
TechMeched 1 month ago
@hospitalcorpsmanstep Reverse affirmative action?
willkev25 1 month ago
I was there! Awesome Adam
TechMeched 1 month ago
So is this guy for Obama?
Merktime2889 1 month ago
Lol
ydms14 1 month ago
The preacher even said it himself, it's a choice he finds evil. Though just like anything else you drive underground with laws it will still happen just in a less safe way. I know a young girl who had an abortion just by having someone jump on her belly in a semi-rough manner. So sure it's a horrible thing and possibly immoral but if your willing to force your views on others through law it will only make the reality of the situation a lot worse. Leave funding choices to each states if anything.
Batta0909 1 month ago
@Batta0909 States traditionally have control over murder, rape etc. Bring abortion to the states. Abortion is the murder of an individual.
TechMeched 1 month ago
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willkev25 1 month ago
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willkev25 1 month ago
@Flyingzebra9 Not killing your baby is not a religious topic!
willkev25 1 month ago
Obama has no remorse for Black Genocide, whether through abortion or the murder of Black Libyans, in his immoral war against the Sovereign Nation of Libya!! Obama is an "Elitist" now and has no regard for Human life, regardless of skin color!!
watertonrivers 1 month ago
I think 3 months is a good place to draw the line. It's plenty of time for the woman to decide whether or not a baby is feasible for her and at 3 months, doctors cannot distinguish a human fetus from a pig one.
utarian7 1 month ago
Pro-Choice? More like Anti-Responsibility. These people would rather murder another human being than accept responsibility for their actions. Funny how these people are all for a woman running away from responsibility and yet if you ask them if they would be okay with the man leaving the woman for the same reasons suddenly they do a hypocritical complete 180. if you believe in a womans "right" to run away from responsibility you must also believe in a mans right as well. Equality.
cbuma 1 month ago
Most disgusting to me are the doctors who go to school for years to learn how to kill babies. What sick person when given the choice to preserve life or end it chooses to end life.
willkev25 1 month ago
@willkev25 What kind of person imposes Good Samaritan laws on half the population? Or polices what others do with their own bodies? Or assumea the universal guilt of those who seek abortion in particular circumstances? Or restricts the free action of another because of emotional distress? Or values a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being?
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
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willkev25 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA Once again, an unborn baby is NOT your body. How is not allowing death clinics to legally operate imposing "good samaritan" laws? People just plain and simply don't value any life but their own. It's the sad truth!
willkev25 1 month ago
52 million huh? I for one am glad these people aren't clogging up the roads and competing for jobs, too many fucking people anyway. Take a ride in an airplane, houses everywhere, no wild places left in America.
demonorse 1 month ago
@demonorse Your name speaks for itself!
willkev25 1 month ago
So sick of these fuckers wasting their time on the rights of eggs and sperm. If they really cared about human beings they'd be sorting out the problems of people with lives. Much easier to champion the cause of a theoretical person.
And making abortion illegal doesn't stop it. It just goes underground and kills more women., But then these fuckers don't care about women dying.
geffel 1 month ago
I hate preachers..
CanNotType 1 month ago
Everytime I get a blowjob and a woman swallows my sperm on accident, I'm going to charge her with voluntary murder.
ThisPoisonTree 1 month ago
Should sperm have rights, too? Should ovaries have rights? Or is it the moment of conception that endows the fetus, the zygote, with rights and sanctification?
ThisPoisonTree 1 month ago
@ThisPoisonTree Significant, morally relevant life with a future-like-ours begins at conception, because it is only upon fertilization that a future-like-ours can be realized. But that is only one side of the equation. No one has a right to another's body. We shouldn't value a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being. It is immoral to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of women to their bodily autonomy and self-determination.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA And I gave the grounds for you to think otherwise where? I agree.
ThisPoisonTree 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA I would argue if no one has the right to another person's body is not the argument. You do not have the right to murder your baby. What about the unborn childs body? You seem to have no problem with violating it.
willkev25 1 month ago
@willkev25 You also have "no problem" with letting people in distant lands die of starvation. After all, you could sell some of your possession and feed a whole village for a month. But no one has the right to your property, or the labor of your hands, or the autonomy of your body. No one can force you to give up your autonomy, not even for a whole village. So yes, it is the right argument.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA An unborn child is NOT property, therefore your argument is irrelevent. Also, how would you know what I do or don't do with my money/property. It is you who says I don't care about those in distant lands, not I.
willkev25 1 month ago
@willkev25 You are correct. An unborn child is not your property. Neither are starving children who have already been born. Neither of them have a right to your body.
You are right, I don't know what you do with your property or your body. It is none of my business. That is my point. I don't have the right to command you to do anything for another human being you haven't already aggressed against. That includes starving children across the ocean, and a fetus in our body.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA It is not a question of what you have to do for someone, it is what you are allowed to do TO another human. You shouldn't kill other humans, therefore you also shouldn't kill unborn humans.
jrgenkratz 1 month ago
@jrgenkratz You are not allowed to usurp another persons body. You are not allowed to force labor. You are not allowed to enslave another. You are not allowed to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of others. You shouldn't curtail the self-determination of others. You shouldn't coerce others into actions that are preferable to you. You shouldn't value a dependent being over a self-determining, autonomous being.
There is a difference between justified killing and murder.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA So killing someone solely because they would be burdensome to you is justified. "You are not allowed to infringe upon the inviolable, inalienable rights of others" Like the life of an unborn child for example.
cbuma 1 month ago
@cbuma I advise you to click the "view all comments" button and search through my posts. I've answered that question already, and have most likely reposted the reply several times. I'm going to bed now!
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@cbuma Amen
moontooth 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA No one's trying to steal your body or tell you what to do with it. We're telling you that you can't kill your baby! A mother is supposed to defend their child, not defend themselves from real responsibility by killing their baby. It's amazing that this needs to be explained to people!
willkev25 1 month ago
@CleanTownUSA If you agree that the baby is not your property, then it would in fact be murder to kill it. No?
willkev25 1 month ago
@ThisPoisonTree I don't think anyone argues that they should. But no matter what your stance is, you have to draw the line somewhere. Even the pro-choicers. Cause nothing really happens with the baby upon birth. It is still exactly the same thing, it only moved. And there is no easy line to be drawn anywhere, no matter what criteria you use. And all criteria for when to get your rights are completely arbitrary. That is what pro-choicers and pro-lifers both need to understand.
jrgenkratz 1 month ago
@jrgenkratz No, it is not exactly the same thing. Pull the fetus out too early and there is not a chance for survival on it's own. If the baby could survive on it's own with the help of others, then that is different. Are we not rationalizing the criteria for personhood and rights right now? I don't want absolute morality. I'd rather have reason and rational discussion and the fact that morality and rights may be challenged. Respecting the dignity of others with their choices.
ThisPoisonTree 1 month ago
@ThisPoisonTree I agree with you. We need a rational discussion on the ethics of killing fetuses and embryos. That is exactly what I am asking for. I do not think it should be illegal to take a morning after pill, but where to draw the line is extremely difficult. Which is why I have problems with the pro-choicers overly simplistic argumentation. Argument like "it's just a ball of cells", like any human isn't just a ball of cells. Or completely ignoring the children altogether.
jrgenkratz 1 month ago
@jrgenkratz What about completely ignoring the human host altogether? Woman are considered as secondary (if they are considered at all) in these debates. The actual experiences of women are not perceived as morally relevant to the debate, unless these women can are "innocent" by because of rape or incest. Women’s role are often reduced to a ‘fetal containers’; individual women disappear or are perceived simply as mechanical life-support systems.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@ThisPoisonTree A good place to start is to stop your heart and see what happens. If your heart did stop for the rest of your life, wouldn't you die? So then, the child inside the womb has a beating heart, it's heart stops and... it dies! Therefore it was alive due to it's beating heart.
thildebrand 1 month ago
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@thildebrand Significant, morally relevant life with a future-like-ours begins even earlier than the beating hear. It begins at conception, because upon fertilization a future-like-ours can be realized. But that is only one side of the equation. No one has a right to another's body. We shouldn't police what women do with their bodies, because they have inviolable, inalienable rights of bodily autonomy and self-determination.
CleanTownUSA 1 month ago
@thildebrand How logical. Of course, though I think your question is rhetorical. BUT, could the fetus survive if it was pulled out at the moment of conception? During certain points of gestation? It is fully dependent on the mother, and thank (add adage here) that the choice can be made, because it may be for the best interests of both of them.
ThisPoisonTree 1 month ago
@ThisPoisonTree Yes, logical. That's actually why I think life begins when there is a discernable heart beat. I stray away from saying it starts at conception, but if I were to use logic to understand conception it would be "a ball of cells does a function" But an Embryo is a ball of cells, within a womb of a human woman, that is doing it's funtion toward the end result of a human being. Therefore, it is, in that sense, a completely different situation than any other cells
thildebrand 1 month ago
@thildebrand Oh and also my initial question wasn't rhetorical, but factual. All animals are "alive" because they have a heart beat, correct (speak of humanoid animals). Now, the "fully dependent" idea is interesting, but if you take a new born, leave it on the table and give it no help, it will die as well. So then, can you judge life by our dependence on another? No, of course not. A retarded 30 year old would die without his mother, but he IS alive, right?
thildebrand 1 month ago