@some1rational wow i just read my old comment and i am actually ashamed of it haha (not to make any johns but in all fairness i wrote that before i knew shit about melee or the people who played it professionally)
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
If were Fox here I'd have thrown the controller down and left halfway through this. Nobody wants to play against somebody who uses such dirty tactics.
this is quite opposite from what we see today. m2k being the idiot who goes to the edge and gets gimped by something sexy.... nowaways its m2k doing the gimps to idiots who go near the edge.
oh yea. one more thing. im not being unrealistic. with many things there is a theoretical perspective and a practical perspective. in theory my point was that unknown players can still have valid insights/comments/criticisms. in a practical sense im sure m2k could win 9/10 matches (or better) with any player who had never been to a national tourney. people need to calm down and stop seeing people's posts as threatening or insulting. just relax.
its not unrealistic to think there are players in existence better than m2k and pc and KDJ etc. who are not ranking players because they cant go to big tourneys. im not sayin im better than any of them but ive been playin melee competitively since like 2004 and ive never been to a national tourney because of school and shit.
Actually Russia's pretty good at this game. He never said he had no tourney experience, just that he hasn't been to a nationally recognized one. And he isn't saying it's possible to become excellent on one's own; he's saying it's possible (though IMO rare) to become excellent and not be talked about.
C. all i was actually saying is that people youv'e never heard of might possibly have a valid opinion about something smash related.
my original post was in response to this comment: "lol the internet, everyone is a critic but no one here is raking in the dough with their 1337 insight."
he seemed to imply that if these people knew what they were talking about they would be making money at tournaments. you dig what im sayin now?
yea i am. crazy who the hell are you? lol anyway why is everyone taking what i said as an insult. M2k is the best example of what i was saying. He wasnt even on the power rankings for the longest time and then suddenly gained recognition after a few tourneys. hes exactly the kinda player i was talking about. not to mention i meant no offense to anyone.
Ok I see your point. The thing is Mew2King practiced really hard against good players, even though he rose out of obscurity. I've known him since 2004. The people who are responding to you think you're saying a player can become excellent on his own. Players can be excellent without being heard of, but it's almost inevitable that a good player will start being talked about. I'm Johnny by the way.
moozles: "Sheik can't kill fox when fox isn't off the stage" Incorrect. the match you're referring to is a horrible example of how to play a campy fox. camping with fox never guarantees victory. there's a reason why your comment was struck down 3 times and the first one calling you out has +7 lol. nice try.
watch like any 2007-present fox/falco vs shiek vid. Most shiek kills are pretty much f-air/b-air edgeguards. Shiek can't do normal dash attack to f-tilt comboes unless fox has around 60%. Below that, all shiek can do is just u-throw/d-throw tech chase until they're near the edge, then b-throw to edgeguard.
sheik can camp back of course, and her camping game is quite good. all she needs is 30% and one combo ends the stock. she also throws in fairs / dash attacks / grabs if you ever mess up, and if you do mess up your camping you're basically dead anyway. it's easier to get in sheik's face because she has no response to that, interspersing camping when optimal.
then what about marth? he only wins from edgegaurding as well right? its just the fact that its harder to get an combo to uair against fast fallers cause simply their precentages need to be higher, when a fair is sufficient when its that high. sheiks against marths or something need uairs almost as much as fairs, simply cause marths die upwards easier and the combos are more easily set up. this vid is a class of its own, u cant compare the way kdj played to sheiks in general.
Wait, what about Marth? Marth vs spacies or marth vs sheik? I actually don't know much marth vs sheik, I usually try to stay away from taht match up >_>
Yea true, but fox needs to be in like the 50-60% range. Ken took so much damage from many missed techs. If he didn't miss them, he prolly woudl be able to survive better
50-60 range is really early for a death, though nearly all people and characters try to kill as early as they can right? so whatever the person can do, does, its not the character that lacks on stage like sheik.
Funny this is sheik cold have easily made it back when he first died by transforming into zelda, and maybe even after the shine spike (transform, drift left until just under the edge, teleport up) at least one of these would have been edgehogged or punished in some way, but oh well. i just like it when people dont' give up. btw- RAPE BY KDJ!!!!!!!!
I play as zelda,Both of those times KDJ would not have gotten onto the ledge, and he would've had transform disadvantage on his next stock.
The first one he had great DI, however, m2k is fox, zelda's recovery at that percentage is just too slow, easily killed no matter how he tries to recover. It's better to just stay sheik. After the shinespike, transform would've put him too far under the stage, edgehog is death. Transforming back into sheik causes you to lose invincibility frames.
yeah it wouldn't have been smart, but i still think he could have made it back on the stage the first time. don't know why i posted that comment really, i was probably wasted.
i cant believe you guys think d-throw off the ledge would've worked. that just shows your own levels of ineptness, these guys would never miss a meteorcancel
naw it mightve worked. when was the last time you saw someone meteor dthrow? it was probably the last thing on kdj's mind and he mightve lost a stock from it. not to mention that sheik's meteor cancel sucks (m2k probably couldve edgehogged)
so? surprise works on everyone. they might be experienced and technical, but there is a .16-.25 second reaction time, and that is only when you are looking for something and you see it. when you are looking for something and see something else, it takes much longer to react. they arent gods.
It MIGHT have worked. Or KDJ might've meteor cancelled immediately and grabbed the edge before m2k had a chance to edgeguard. Fthrow guarranteed M2k a chance at edgeguarding, which he isn't bad at, btw. Odds of KDJ getting surprised: not good. Odds of edgeguard KO: much better.
Ive played with KDJ, and the reaction time like that is nothing. Remember, these people are practically frame perfect - and there are 60 frames a second. They are plenty fast enough to become aware of the downthrow, so just be quiet. There is no way DJ would have died from that. HE PRACTICALY BREAKS OUT OF GUARDS FASTER.
even if it he did meteor cancel, he is now below the stage in his upb. if he isnt, he is dj up to the stage. either way its a very nice ledge guard opportunity.
Wow I hope you realize that dthrow on the ledge is extremely predictable and easy to escape from. If you just hold toward the stage when you get dthrown you don't even get meteored.
maybe, im just saying surprise is never a bad option. he could have even fucking predicted the tech or missed tech and fsmashed inwards. either way the fthrow backfired.
no. i never said it would have been better. i just said it wouldnt be bad. in fact, when watching the video it never crossed my mind. i would never have predicted it. i would have teched it and DIed onto the stage still. easy tech chase with fsmash or usmash.
it would have been bad. he had a much higher chance to edgeguard with the fthrow than the dthrow, therefore he would have been doing something which wouldn't have given him as much chance to win in that situation, therefore it would have been bad. even if you don't expect the dthrow, it's quite long, and once it starts you know immediately what to do. the dthrow wouldn't have helped him at all.
actually dthrow could be very good. kdj has 2 options to avoid it. tech or meteor cancel. i havent seen the clip in the while but i know from experience you cant tech the dthrow if youre far enough out. if that was the case then sheik is left with a metoer cancel, in which case sheik would easily die (she can basically only go straight up and get edgehogged).
but the dthrow is so easy to see. i have slow reactions and i can still react to it after it's started. sheik can jump then immediately fair or nair, so an not to really have a problem. he could also wait a bit before jumping, to throw off m2k
it would have been bad. he had a much higher chance to edgeguard with the fthrow than the dthrow, therefore he would have been doing something which wouldn't have given him as much chance to win in that situation, therefore it would have been bad. even if you don't expect the dthrow, it's quite long, and once it starts you know immediately what to do. the dthrow wouldn't have helped him at all.
ive seen kdj miss easy techs and its not as easy as you say to meteor cancel it, especailly when youre not ready for it. the move lasts longer than you think, and if you try to meteor cancel early you are dead. and if youve ever had it done to you, the acceleration is very high, so being more than 3 frames slow would make his jump not be high enough. not to mention most people meteor cancel with just upb, which is bad for sheik. in any case this game isnt a game of unbeatable combos, its about
To me there are cheap=stronger/more abused moves in the game. Don't tell me a shine spike from 0% isn't cheap or gimpy in any way. That's what makes some characters better than others. I'm not saying that using them(overpowered moves) is a guaranteed win though.
What kind of an idiot gets himself shinespiked from 0%?
Sounds to me like that person needs to spend less time complaining about cheaps moves and figure out how to get better with his own character or else use a different one.
It is just as possible to shine spike someone from 0% as any %. The shine sends back each character a certain distance no matter how much damage they have. Therefore, according to any random video of a Fox shine spiking somebody, there are a lot of so called "idiots" who get shine spiked from 0%.
Well it's my definition of cheap and as I said before it doesn't really matter at percentage with the shine. Either way they travel the same distance.
i know they travel the same distance...i do it all the time to people. its just that i personally dont think its cheap, cuz, i mean if u edgeguard someone when they were messing around the ledge with 0%, and they die, i believe that to be sort of the same, thats skill, not cheap.
I'm not saying that there's no skill involved but I mean a one frame move that is consistent in its power is a little cheap. What I believe to be cheap anyways.
Your use of logical insults astounds me. I also don't get shine raped...The most common people I play against play as Yoshi, Ness, and Doc. Believe it or not.
Great, so stop bawwing about something everyone else has learned to cope with.
At the very least you could just take up Fox, if he's SOOO ridiculously cheap (even as fair game to anybody wishing to man him) you might as well jump on board with the other winners :>
Why is it that everyone feels the need to put down the opinions of other people? I never said Fox was cheap... but the space animals were overpowered in the first place. Also where do you think Fox would be on the tier list without the shine? Same goes for Falco.
So you admit that Fox/Falco are NOT cheap (or you refuse to rehash) and further state that the shine is not ONLY not cheap, but necessary for their competitive play at all.
I never said any of those. You just keep trying to put words in my mouth. I asked where do YOU think they would be without the shine. Also in my opinion there are characters that are more overpowered/have more potential than others...That's why there's a tier list and the game is not completely balanced. The only way for there to be non cheap/overpowered moves is to only have one character in the game.
Anyone can be fox. Anyone can use his shine at their leisure. Even IF, and even assuming he's "cheap" or in some way better than every other character as a result of having it in his arsenal, nothing is stopping anyone from "counterpicking" fox with fox. He is as available to the "abuser" as to the crying child, and regardless of your stance regarding this it is NOT going to change.
All that is true. However, that limits people to just Fox... I'm not talking about the concept of one player against another but rather the character Fox against another character. Furthermore, I was never complaining about Fox in the first place. Rather I was just stating my opinion that the characters aren't completely balanced and some are more overpowered than others. (Or at least have more potential)
The old days when M2K didn't rage quit when he started getting raped...
nahor88 4 months ago
@nahor88 The era collectively known as the pre-brawl era.
phantom20874 4 months ago
amazing play by KDJ
fLcGambit 6 months ago
kdj knows how to handle fox's up b way too good
AguyNamedHorse 9 months ago
god dammit kdj is soo good
ResidentWaffle 11 months ago
Type PRIZE before youtube and hit enter
GAMECITYLEGEND 1 year ago
0:34 it's a dair?
Noggilein 1 year ago
@Noggilein no its a fair
crystalnite 9 months ago
jaja que asco de pelea
grandfatherpaul 1 year ago
that woulda been funny if m2k missed the back air at 0:52, and KDJ got ANOTHER sweet ass edgeguard slap off the stage
thecrossover1382 1 year ago
nobody should ever complain about gay tactics... its johning.
...but its ESPECIALLY stupid when foxes complain about gay sheiks.
PlayerPandu 1 year ago
this video should be called "the textbook"
junkimchi 1 year ago 6
KDJ is my hero
iScr3am666 1 year ago
@some1rational wow i just read my old comment and i am actually ashamed of it haha (not to make any johns but in all fairness i wrote that before i knew shit about melee or the people who played it professionally)
Yoububehahaha 1 year ago
melee > brawl
DesN00b 1 year ago 11
such aggressive edgeguarding
likemy 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
If were Fox here I'd have thrown the controller down and left halfway through this. Nobody wants to play against somebody who uses such dirty tactics.
ericfuchs123 2 years ago
@ericfuchs123 its not dirty tactics, its being the most agressive and arguably best sheik ever
thaqiwagee 2 years ago 16
LOL good one ericfuck
hoopspr226 1 year ago 4
ROFL THIS GUY!
jungshin87 1 year ago
after this day in history. M2k has been develpping his "gimping" skill in accordance to this rapage
homorapian 2 years ago 8
he also started using shiek but didnt show it till later
Dooky916 1 year ago
Wow! KDJ is so good at edgeguarding! Great match!
ForestTemple05 2 years ago 3
Holy shit, KDJ's edge guarding is l33t!
Disperfection 2 years ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
What a faggoty way to play?
This is "pro"?
More like scrubby noob tactics.
peanutbutterfork 2 years ago
obvious brawl head
"scrubby" lol
Shintroy 2 years ago 16
Lol, yes. How dare they do what it takes to win a tournament. Curse them.
TOYD3 2 years ago 44
This has been flagged as spam show
get a life dude
sasori16 2 years ago
Comment removed
peanutbutterfork 2 years ago
1:40 mindfucked
HaZeEurope91 2 years ago 2
Freestyle rap'd by Korean DJ.
PLHarky 2 years ago
M2K only mains high tier characters.
ZidaneTribal93 2 years ago
Most pros only main high tier characters. >_>
RadiatingxEyes 2 years ago 9
this is quite opposite from what we see today. m2k being the idiot who goes to the edge and gets gimped by something sexy.... nowaways its m2k doing the gimps to idiots who go near the edge.
crimson35124 2 years ago 4
why does the fox keep trying to play edge games when it's at an obvious disadvantage? firefox is so easy to block
usurper70 2 years ago 4
this very well might be why M2K thinks sheik is the best character in the game lol.
TheQuaz 2 years ago 16
amzing read by kdj on that last kill to follow him all the way down there
legendariesarecheap 2 years ago
It's amazing how the characters moved back in the days to today.
exactlythatsthepoint 2 years ago 3
this is still the greatest shiek set ever
lovingmonkay 2 years ago 6
LOL i still <3 this match
Hamsterlord106 2 years ago
Edgeguard rape fantasies.
Ghettoflame1 2 years ago
0:34 - transexual rape.
Ghettoflame1 2 years ago 5
fox got his ass wooped!
Utubemember165247 2 years ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
m2k is only good when he is playing with faggy ass meta knight
Yoububehahaha 2 years ago
@Yoububehahaha yoububehahaha is only good when he comments on videos with which he has no understanding
some1rational 1 year ago
mew2king wasn't lying when he said he was bad at fighting shiek with fox. damn.
jammyrocket 2 years ago
Nah he wasn't lying, he was johning.
BlueFoxXT 2 years ago 38
..0_0. kdj (L)
thaqiwagee 3 years ago
lmfao. I love the last kill.
TehFair 3 years ago 9
This has been flagged as spam show
NO ONE RATE
this bad boy has got the special number of ratings (69), so whoever fucks it up and makes 70 ratings is a BITCH in my eyes...
Zialox 3 years ago
nested replies FTW
RRRRussia 3 years ago
oh yea. one more thing. im not being unrealistic. with many things there is a theoretical perspective and a practical perspective. in theory my point was that unknown players can still have valid insights/comments/criticisms. in a practical sense im sure m2k could win 9/10 matches (or better) with any player who had never been to a national tourney. people need to calm down and stop seeing people's posts as threatening or insulting. just relax.
RRRRussia 3 years ago
m2k would win 10/10.
Darkatma 3 years ago 2
i guess 10/10 would fall into the "or better" category.
RRRRussia 3 years ago 4
hes right, 10/10 easy. 3-4 stock each time. been there done that. m2k was my first pro i played with, back in 06. easy rape.
Sveet 3 years ago
owned
lmaoskitz 3 years ago
I've seen a ton of DJ's vids and he never ceases to amaze me. That f-air edge guard against fox is insane.
Flandy121 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
m2k u marth is strong but u fox is gay^^
cross25011990 3 years ago
lol the internet, everyone is a critic but no one here is raking in the dough with their 1337 insight.
IndigoR 3 years ago
its not unrealistic to think there are players in existence better than m2k and pc and KDJ etc. who are not ranking players because they cant go to big tourneys. im not sayin im better than any of them but ive been playin melee competitively since like 2004 and ive never been to a national tourney because of school and shit.
RRRRussia 3 years ago
nope.
you're worse than 90% of the tournament players just because you haven't had tourney experience.
Darkatma 3 years ago 6
Actually Russia's pretty good at this game. He never said he had no tourney experience, just that he hasn't been to a nationally recognized one. And he isn't saying it's possible to become excellent on one's own; he's saying it's possible (though IMO rare) to become excellent and not be talked about.
Slashtap3 3 years ago
A. hey johnny.
B. i believe i am ranked 4th in La.
C. all i was actually saying is that people youv'e never heard of might possibly have a valid opinion about something smash related.
my original post was in response to this comment: "lol the internet, everyone is a critic but no one here is raking in the dough with their 1337 insight."
he seemed to imply that if these people knew what they were talking about they would be making money at tournaments. you dig what im sayin now?
RRRRussia 3 years ago
tournament experience matters
reference sorakeyblademaster and FLT
HydroKirby 3 years ago
Hey RRRRussia are you Tim K? If so, you of all people should know that you can't get near Jason or Daniel's level without travelling a ton.
Slashtap3 3 years ago
yea i am. crazy who the hell are you? lol anyway why is everyone taking what i said as an insult. M2k is the best example of what i was saying. He wasnt even on the power rankings for the longest time and then suddenly gained recognition after a few tourneys. hes exactly the kinda player i was talking about. not to mention i meant no offense to anyone.
RRRRussia 3 years ago
Ok I see your point. The thing is Mew2King practiced really hard against good players, even though he rose out of obscurity. I've known him since 2004. The people who are responding to you think you're saying a player can become excellent on his own. Players can be excellent without being heard of, but it's almost inevitable that a good player will start being talked about. I'm Johnny by the way.
Slashtap3 3 years ago
why is m2k firefoxing? Of course your going to get edgeguarded easy.
SilverShadow02 3 years ago
After watching this match, it's hard to think of FD as anything more than a pair of ledges!
BillyRVaughan 3 years ago 4
this is art
OneBadAssBeanieBaby 3 years ago
the greatest smash match ever.
bpxterry 3 years ago
i dont dont know if anyone noticed but dosent melee seem way more faster than brawl
look at the video and tell me what you think
thanks:)
dynex1432 3 years ago 2
no brawl is much fast and more technical
jk
FAWK BRAWL
goatseman5000 3 years ago 7
oooh how i wish my sheik was this good... so beautiful
transmorgraphier 3 years ago
what for a strong fight from krdj^^
cross25011990 3 years ago
that boy dj is sick makin us sheiks look good
good shit dj gimpin m2k's fox n all favorited
nicaboy68 3 years ago
this video is so very sexy
neji1515 3 years ago
ridiculous edge guarding on stock 2 of m2k and stock 3 by KDJ. If only he was coming to fast.
Capncrunchssbm 3 years ago
m2k should've just camped at the middle of the stage. Sheik can't kill fox when fox isn't off the stage
moozles 3 years ago
Not as easy as it sounds.
GodheadsLamentX 3 years ago 9
moozles, try camping kdj's sheik. just try it.
oceanwaves83 3 years ago 2
watch?v=LNvtLmuhwIw&feature=related
moozles 3 years ago
moozles: "Sheik can't kill fox when fox isn't off the stage" Incorrect. the match you're referring to is a horrible example of how to play a campy fox. camping with fox never guarantees victory. there's a reason why your comment was struck down 3 times and the first one calling you out has +7 lol. nice try.
oceanwaves83 3 years ago
watch like any 2007-present fox/falco vs shiek vid. Most shiek kills are pretty much f-air/b-air edgeguards. Shiek can't do normal dash attack to f-tilt comboes unless fox has around 60%. Below that, all shiek can do is just u-throw/d-throw tech chase until they're near the edge, then b-throw to edgeguard.
moozles 3 years ago
i've seen more than enough. the initial comment you made was stupid, which is why i contested it. i'm not going to argue over youtube.
oceanwaves83 3 years ago
just tell me why. it won't be arguing, just informing
moozles 3 years ago
sheik can camp back of course, and her camping game is quite good. all she needs is 30% and one combo ends the stock. she also throws in fairs / dash attacks / grabs if you ever mess up, and if you do mess up your camping you're basically dead anyway. it's easier to get in sheik's face because she has no response to that, interspersing camping when optimal.
Vyse0wnz 3 years ago
mm i c. I thoguth it was more 50% than 30, but w/e.
moozles 3 years ago
err watch last stock
moozles 3 years ago
then what about marth? he only wins from edgegaurding as well right? its just the fact that its harder to get an combo to uair against fast fallers cause simply their precentages need to be higher, when a fair is sufficient when its that high. sheiks against marths or something need uairs almost as much as fairs, simply cause marths die upwards easier and the combos are more easily set up. this vid is a class of its own, u cant compare the way kdj played to sheiks in general.
T651 3 years ago
Wait, what about Marth? Marth vs spacies or marth vs sheik? I actually don't know much marth vs sheik, I usually try to stay away from taht match up >_>
moozles 3 years ago
sheik vs spacies and sheik vs marth
T651 3 years ago
not to mention that sheik can kill fox on the stage, refer to watch?v=jha3dvPs8Yc&feature= related
T651 3 years ago
Yea true, but fox needs to be in like the 50-60% range. Ken took so much damage from many missed techs. If he didn't miss them, he prolly woudl be able to survive better
moozles 3 years ago
50-60 range is really early for a death, though nearly all people and characters try to kill as early as they can right? so whatever the person can do, does, its not the character that lacks on stage like sheik.
T651 3 years ago
sheik can do her gay downthrow techchase
crimson35124 2 years ago
almost all the KOs from this match are gimps lol. but KDJ's gimpy KOs are just too good.
byakuya32 3 years ago 2
God Damn...
kouryuuXfighter 3 years ago 4
dj is sick
teknofuzion87 3 years ago 2
Have I mentioned before that this is the best match I have ever seen? KDJ is sublime.
BillyRVaughan 3 years ago 7
Cool match.
OnYourMarkItsumo 3 years ago
there are 2 smash videos that i keep returning to because they are educational and rape.
this is one. the other one is pound 3 m2k vs pc fox v fox.
jungshin87 3 years ago
This match is always 2 much rape for me to handle everytime I watch it.
NETyser 3 years ago
dude that was good shit
pezai 3 years ago
Incredible match.
EniesLobby 3 years ago
i love you kdj, good stuff
neji1515 3 years ago 2
OMFG RAPEAGE
Justerbuster89 3 years ago 3
Best match ever
moozles 3 years ago 2
Wow KDJ is niiiice
kn0wy0urenemy 3 years ago
Funny this is sheik cold have easily made it back when he first died by transforming into zelda, and maybe even after the shine spike (transform, drift left until just under the edge, teleport up) at least one of these would have been edgehogged or punished in some way, but oh well. i just like it when people dont' give up. btw- RAPE BY KDJ!!!!!!!!
oceanwaves83 3 years ago
nope
I play as zelda,Both of those times KDJ would not have gotten onto the ledge, and he would've had transform disadvantage on his next stock.
The first one he had great DI, however, m2k is fox, zelda's recovery at that percentage is just too slow, easily killed no matter how he tries to recover. It's better to just stay sheik. After the shinespike, transform would've put him too far under the stage, edgehog is death. Transforming back into sheik causes you to lose invincibility frames.
Darkatma 3 years ago
yeah it wouldn't have been smart, but i still think he could have made it back on the stage the first time. don't know why i posted that comment really, i was probably wasted.
oceanwaves83 3 years ago
no johns.
NETyser 3 years ago
Damm KDJ is too good...2 bad he retired.. :(
kingz29 3 years ago 3
raped
Justerbuster89 4 years ago
KoreanDJ: Mew2king, lets see who's better of the edge
M2k: kk
crimson35124 4 years ago 3
That strange to see that m2k
kelvin989 4 years ago
that was owned
om9999 4 years ago
That was short.
DocSmash 4 years ago
loool at how low he comes
aaronhthomas 4 years ago
o_O
Jimmymcjimthejim 4 years ago
Who did KDJ lose to to have to do two sets?
capefeather 4 years ago
It was M2K who lost.
RadicallyDreaming 4 years ago
nice match and here is a joke
OMFG KDJ
GCLU 4 years ago 2
KDJ is god at edgeguarding.......jesus
andrewh817 4 years ago
i cant believe you guys think d-throw off the ledge would've worked. that just shows your own levels of ineptness, these guys would never miss a meteorcancel
jngshin 4 years ago
I've never seen so many flashy kills in a match before. Too bad KDJ's V-Akiha isn't as good.
Impact009 4 years ago
would like to see drephen vs koreanDJ in a sheikditto match
blackjo007 4 years ago
whos the best sheik in usa
blackjo007 4 years ago
You are looking at him. KoreanDJ is too good.
veedee1307 4 years ago 2
even if he dthrowed, KDJ coulda teched it.
ffgamer22 4 years ago
at 1:35 M2K should have thrown down
KDJ's edeguard is too good
blackjo007 4 years ago
Uh...KDJ would've canceled the spike. He's a professional.
Yayuhzz 4 years ago
All he would have had to do is meteor cancel... Heck, even I can meteor cancel, so pros like KDJ would have had no trouble.
At least with the Fthrow M2K had a better chance to edgeguard. (even though it didn't work...)
Protoguy1 4 years ago
naw it mightve worked. when was the last time you saw someone meteor dthrow? it was probably the last thing on kdj's mind and he mightve lost a stock from it. not to mention that sheik's meteor cancel sucks (m2k probably couldve edgehogged)
Sveet 4 years ago
kdj has such awesome reaction skill that it wouldn't have mattered. He would have meteor cancelled it and gotten back on the stage.
Remember, these are pros.
Buourn 4 years ago
so? surprise works on everyone. they might be experienced and technical, but there is a .16-.25 second reaction time, and that is only when you are looking for something and you see it. when you are looking for something and see something else, it takes much longer to react. they arent gods.
Sveet 4 years ago
It MIGHT have worked. Or KDJ might've meteor cancelled immediately and grabbed the edge before m2k had a chance to edgeguard. Fthrow guarranteed M2k a chance at edgeguarding, which he isn't bad at, btw. Odds of KDJ getting surprised: not good. Odds of edgeguard KO: much better.
cowboyardee 4 years ago
either or has a good chance of working.
Sveet 4 years ago
Ive played with KDJ, and the reaction time like that is nothing. Remember, these people are practically frame perfect - and there are 60 frames a second. They are plenty fast enough to become aware of the downthrow, so just be quiet. There is no way DJ would have died from that. HE PRACTICALY BREAKS OUT OF GUARDS FASTER.
Buourn 4 years ago
even if it he did meteor cancel, he is now below the stage in his upb. if he isnt, he is dj up to the stage. either way its a very nice ledge guard opportunity.
Sveet 4 years ago
you know that you can meteor cancel with a jump, right?
Buourn 4 years ago
yea, and if you read my post, i mention that. btw dj = double jump.
Sveet 4 years ago
Wow I hope you realize that dthrow on the ledge is extremely predictable and easy to escape from. If you just hold toward the stage when you get dthrown you don't even get meteored.
Fthrow was the better choice and always will be.
shoeboxdan 4 years ago
maybe, im just saying surprise is never a bad option. he could have even fucking predicted the tech or missed tech and fsmashed inwards. either way the fthrow backfired.
Sveet 4 years ago
Maybe..
But this is all in hindsight, if he had dthrown and it backfired, you would've said: "Why didn't M2K fthrow instead? That would've been better"
Darkatma 4 years ago
no. i never said it would have been better. i just said it wouldnt be bad. in fact, when watching the video it never crossed my mind. i would never have predicted it. i would have teched it and DIed onto the stage still. easy tech chase with fsmash or usmash.
Sveet 4 years ago
it would have been bad. he had a much higher chance to edgeguard with the fthrow than the dthrow, therefore he would have been doing something which wouldn't have given him as much chance to win in that situation, therefore it would have been bad. even if you don't expect the dthrow, it's quite long, and once it starts you know immediately what to do. the dthrow wouldn't have helped him at all.
thedifinitive 3 years ago
actually dthrow could be very good. kdj has 2 options to avoid it. tech or meteor cancel. i havent seen the clip in the while but i know from experience you cant tech the dthrow if youre far enough out. if that was the case then sheik is left with a metoer cancel, in which case sheik would easily die (she can basically only go straight up and get edgehogged).
Sveet 3 years ago
but the dthrow is so easy to see. i have slow reactions and i can still react to it after it's started. sheik can jump then immediately fair or nair, so an not to really have a problem. he could also wait a bit before jumping, to throw off m2k
thedifinitive 3 years ago
it would have been bad. he had a much higher chance to edgeguard with the fthrow than the dthrow, therefore he would have been doing something which wouldn't have given him as much chance to win in that situation, therefore it would have been bad. even if you don't expect the dthrow, it's quite long, and once it starts you know immediately what to do. the dthrow wouldn't have helped him at all.
thedifinitive 3 years ago
ive seen kdj miss easy techs and its not as easy as you say to meteor cancel it, especailly when youre not ready for it. the move lasts longer than you think, and if you try to meteor cancel early you are dead. and if youve ever had it done to you, the acceleration is very high, so being more than 3 frames slow would make his jump not be high enough. not to mention most people meteor cancel with just upb, which is bad for sheik. in any case this game isnt a game of unbeatable combos, its about
Sveet 3 years ago
pressuring and predicting. a meteor is really great pressure. everyone and their brother fthrows and everyone knows how to exploit an fthrow.
Sveet 3 years ago
KDJ's edgeguard is so cheap...I wish I could edgeguard like that. =/
Axl29 4 years ago
Nothing that you can do in Smash Bros is cheap. End of story.
aids514 4 years ago
To me there are cheap=stronger/more abused moves in the game. Don't tell me a shine spike from 0% isn't cheap or gimpy in any way. That's what makes some characters better than others. I'm not saying that using them(overpowered moves) is a guaranteed win though.
Axl29 4 years ago
What kind of an idiot gets himself shinespiked from 0%?
Sounds to me like that person needs to spend less time complaining about cheaps moves and figure out how to get better with his own character or else use a different one.
aids514 4 years ago
It is just as possible to shine spike someone from 0% as any %. The shine sends back each character a certain distance no matter how much damage they have. Therefore, according to any random video of a Fox shine spiking somebody, there are a lot of so called "idiots" who get shine spiked from 0%.
Axl29 4 years ago
even if it is possible, that doesnt make it cheap lol. i mean if u manage to shine spike someone at 0% gratz to u lol.
WisdomX001 4 years ago
Well it's my definition of cheap and as I said before it doesn't really matter at percentage with the shine. Either way they travel the same distance.
Axl29 4 years ago
i know they travel the same distance...i do it all the time to people. its just that i personally dont think its cheap, cuz, i mean if u edgeguard someone when they were messing around the ledge with 0%, and they die, i believe that to be sort of the same, thats skill, not cheap.
WisdomX001 4 years ago
I'm not saying that there's no skill involved but I mean a one frame move that is consistent in its power is a little cheap. What I believe to be cheap anyways.
Axl29 4 years ago
someone gets shineraped often
stop crying butthurt faggot
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
Your use of logical insults astounds me. I also don't get shine raped...The most common people I play against play as Yoshi, Ness, and Doc. Believe it or not.
Axl29 4 years ago
Great, so stop bawwing about something everyone else has learned to cope with.
At the very least you could just take up Fox, if he's SOOO ridiculously cheap (even as fair game to anybody wishing to man him) you might as well jump on board with the other winners :>
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
Why is it that everyone feels the need to put down the opinions of other people? I never said Fox was cheap... but the space animals were overpowered in the first place. Also where do you think Fox would be on the tier list without the shine? Same goes for Falco.
Axl29 4 years ago
So you admit that Fox/Falco are NOT cheap (or you refuse to rehash) and further state that the shine is not ONLY not cheap, but necessary for their competitive play at all.
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
I never said any of those. You just keep trying to put words in my mouth. I asked where do YOU think they would be without the shine. Also in my opinion there are characters that are more overpowered/have more potential than others...That's why there's a tier list and the game is not completely balanced. The only way for there to be non cheap/overpowered moves is to only have one character in the game.
Axl29 4 years ago
shut the fat fuck up faggot
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
^^Translation: I'm going to call you homosexual because I have no logical evidence to say.
Axl29 4 years ago
It's not so much me having none as you choosing to ignore it, so, yeah, kill yourself etc
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
I don't see much evidence in your posts...at all.
Axl29 4 years ago
soz faggot
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
^^Gee look that's some solid evidence you have there. Please clarify the great and plentiful evidence you have given which I have overlooked.
Axl29 4 years ago
Anyone can be fox. Anyone can use his shine at their leisure. Even IF, and even assuming he's "cheap" or in some way better than every other character as a result of having it in his arsenal, nothing is stopping anyone from "counterpicking" fox with fox. He is as available to the "abuser" as to the crying child, and regardless of your stance regarding this it is NOT going to change.
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
All that is true. However, that limits people to just Fox... I'm not talking about the concept of one player against another but rather the character Fox against another character. Furthermore, I was never complaining about Fox in the first place. Rather I was just stating my opinion that the characters aren't completely balanced and some are more overpowered than others. (Or at least have more potential)
Axl29 4 years ago
Good to have cleared that up..
:/
gangreneriddencorpse 4 years ago
KDJ is ma fave...one of the best Sheik around
krisangel910 4 years ago
at 1:35 M2K should have thrown down
CloudsoI 4 years ago