Re: Why racism can be good, individualism can be retarded, and government needs to gtfo

[Knapper411]

I think, its time to move out of your parent's house and grow up.

By the way, nice fohawk..

[unitylovefamily]

Headhunters

[Buergs323]

You argue two things: lynchings and private business owners refusing service.

The only title Libertarians disagree with was the govt mandate to serve to minorities.

The only reason lynchings deceased was because hanging a black man from a tree and riddling him with bullets was suddenly against the law. Plain and simple. But lynchings never stopped because a racist white owner had to serve a black man a cheeseburger. There is no evidence to suggest such a claim.

The end.

[Buergs323]

Cont....

Why would it be a crime? Because of the CIVIL RIGHTS ACT! It forced public institutions i.e. police to punish those who committed violent crimes against blacks. For the first time, It became law that if you waved a shotgun at a black man and threatened to kill him you'd go to jail!!

99% of the titles in the civil rights act prevented governments from condoning racist behaviors. Allowing such an acceptance of violence against blacks or anyone for that matter would be anti-freedom. ....

[Buergs323]

You mix up government racism vs private racism.

Gov't racism and private racism both occurred in the south. But there was a distinct difference between the two. Private racism was lynchings, beatings, verbal and sexual harassment, etc. The reason these things continued was because of govt racism! State governments didn't punish those who lynched blacks or poured ketchup on blacks! If that were done today...it would be a flat out crime

Gov't racism was about failing to punish those who lynched

[Buergs323]

African culture believes in traditions that differ from American Culture.

But does the fact that you prefer American culture over African culture make African culture irrational?

The problem with your assessment is that you are arrogant enough to believe your values trump other peoples values. Freedom isn't about imposing the majority's values onto society through the state but instead about protecting the largest minority on the planet -- the individual.

[MrOmniblast]

Lol yeah, I was taught that "Black is beauty and red is corruption" (Red meaning people of lighter skin tones such as yourself). I have found this teaching to be false. The people who hold these ideas, are basing this claim on nothing at all.

[siggyboss]

The decrease in lynchings of blacks in the South is a consequence of the federal state providing security, and not necessarily integration. Southern states provided no security for blacks, and continued to do so after the US Civil War. The issue has less to do with race, than the state tries monopolize security and anyone it does not protect is vulnerable to being attacked.

[ElGeecho]

It does not presuppose that ANY particular value system is rational. Rather, it presupposes that adhering to your preferences is rational.

Somehow I knew you two would just end up talking past each other.

[TehClockwork]

According to Tocqueville and other historians, the American North was horribly racist and did have discriminatory preferences before the Civil War, during the Civil War, and after. The government, to my knowledge, never stepped in and forced intergration on anyone. Nevertheless, discrimination came to an end. So your assertion that nothing will happen or that the situation could only get worse if the government steps in, is not true.

[TehClockwork]

@TehClockwork

*if the government DOESN'T step in... Sorry.

[TehClockwork]

You are correct that the race situation is a lot better in the South after the Civil Rights Acts. However, I would not be so hasty to say the current state of affairs is a direct result of the civil rights acts. It seems all too more probable that culture played a heavier hand in this change. Or, to me at least, it seems more intuitive that the internal culture of the South, rather than government imposition, lead to diminished racism.

[theradioschizo]

I don't understand how you talk of irrationality but make baseless assertions like "things have gotten better" since then. You say you don't see as many lynchings but never provide any lynching statistics to support this. It's also funny because I can pretty much guarantee you weren't around before the Civil Rights act to compare how race crimes statistics have changed over the years after it was implemented. Stop making baseless assertions and claims of objective values. They don't exist.

[Sinisterene]

You could at least get a better microphone :(

[fringeelements]

Objective values! Caveman.

"racism is bad, therefore there must be some internally consistent argument against chosen separatism!"

Sorry, there isn't. Your teachers and parents are fools and your core values need to be discarded if you want to understand the world. Otherwise it's all going to be a mishmash-blur of institutional history and pre-economic political theory.

[LudditeRomantic]

@fringeelements

Don't mind Mr. WhiteNationalist SecularTalk, I can translate his racist talk for you: "Seig Heil!"

[ChristianScherwin]

@LudditeRomantic Don't mind Mr. CutsHimself SecularTalk, I can translate his emo talk for you: "Please, love me!"

[LudditeRomantic]

@ChristianScherwin

I see you watched the video in which I reveal my overly sexy body; this is most unfortunate. It fills me full of horror to know that a racist fucktard such as yourself would masturbate to viewing my profoundly aesthetically appealing body. I would rather you pay a visit to your fellow racist friend, Mr. White Nationalist and "know" him....he's calling your name now.

[IHeardYouLikeFitness]

Can someone please block this troll?

[LudditeRomantic]

@IHeardYouLikeFitness

Me or Mr. ChristianScherwin?

[ChristianScherwin]

@LudditeRomantic I find it ironic that you would end up bashing homosexuality in defense of anti-racism. I don't know if you're taking the piss or if you're simply that stupid, but in any case it's pointless and detrimental to rational debate. Good job.

[LudditeRomantic]

@ChristianScherwin

Good God, when did I 'bash' homosexuality? I've got no problem with homosexuals, I do have a problem with dumb racists such as yourself; dude, you are a fucking racist and you lament the loss of rational debate; you're laughable :)

Race, as applied to humans, is a social construct, you need to look at the description bar of my video "Rejecting Spawkkkism," demonstrating this point.

[ChristianScherwin]

@LudditeRomantic This is the second time you call me a racist, and may I ask: on what grounds? You have no idea what preferences I hold simply because I defend others' right to hold theirs, including your right to be a homophobe even if it contradicts your ideas of racism. I'm sure fringeelements would do the same, would that make him a homophobe? hah... Not that it matters. Even if I was a racist your assertion about my credibility wouldn't hold water simply because it begs the question.

[ChristianScherwin]

@LudditeRomantic Regarding your quote from Alan R. Templeton, Ph.D., professor of biology in Arts & Sciences at Washington University in St. Louis (argument from authority much? lol) I don't see how his standards of differing betweens races are relevant to the interests and goals of "racists." Categorizing genetic groups is simply means to an end. Now the ends of a biologist is doubtfully the same as the ends of whomever you call racists. Don't like the word "race?" Call it heritageism.

[LudditeRomantic]

@ChristianScherwin

I copy and pasted that into the description bar, what was I supposed to do, actually go out of my way to delete gentleman's credentials? And since when is mentioning one's educational credentials necessarily appealing to authority? Come now, you can do better than fling these lazy accusations about. There is simply no such thing as 'race' when applied to human beings, the genetic differences simply are not there.

[LudditeRomantic]

@ChristianScherwin

It's not that I "don't like the word race," rather, it is a fantasy word for stupid, shallow fucking morons who do not have the psychological maturity to coexist with those who have the audacity to manifest themselves as physically different. Heritageism? Christ man, call it whatever the fuck you want, I call it an immature defense mechanism for maladapted psychopaths.

[ChristianScherwin]

@LudditeRomantic Now I can't comment on whether or not racism is objectively stupid since it, like many other things, is completely subjective. Generally you seem to have a hard time accepting that your ends aren't universal. In any case, I would personally agree with you and I don't befriend "racists." Isn't it funny though, that I don't propose chasing them down and locking them up? I simply don't associate with them. It seems that you're the one who needs the maturity to coexist with racists.

[theracemixer]

@fringeelements

go die faggot

[lookit87]

@fringeelements Understanding the world has little to do with discarding your values. Values systems can be a subterfuge to realizing the way the world works but not always.

[ChristianScherwin]

Talking about assumptions, when you talk about the next problem, you assume two things: that blacks and whites "getting along" is a good thing, and that it was caused by the civil rights act. Now I don't think I have to talk a lot about crimes conducted by blacks (especially in heavily populated areas) or the fact that racism now comes from both sides (and unlike you, I don't think it has improved). Claiming that the civil rights act was responsible it both stupid and unscientific (comparison?).

[ChristianScherwin]

Are you seriously claiming that value systems can be inherently irrational, and if so, to what end? Other values? Values are inherently SUBJECTIVE and are the ends to which our acts may be either rational or irrational, and that is what spawk was talking about when he said that acting against your own values is irrational. No, he was not assuming that a value system is either rational or irrational, because it is neither. All logical conclusions stem from premises.

[return135]

eating vegetables is also good for you, but do you want the state FORCING you to eat vegetables?

[ChristianScherwin]

Are you seriously claiming that value systems can be inherently irrational, and if so, to what end? Other values? Values are inherently SUBJECTIVE and are the ends to which our acts may be either rational or irrational, and that is what spawk was talking about when he said that acting against your own values is irrational. No, he was not assuming that a value system is either rational or irrational, because it is neither. All logical conclusions stem from premises.

[Sivels]

The topdown segregation was also a preference imposed on the majority, for many white people they would have no reason to hate black people but it was somthing forced down their throat fro the top down, by that I mean, it was infested in the legislature and the laws, racism that is.

[IndividualAutonomy]

Something being logical or rational in my mind requires a goal. If the goal is to associate with white or make money is a white racist conscience neighborhood than it is rational. If natives enjoy their way of life and wish to preserve it then they are being rational to resist. However, all will have to deal with the consequences.

[IndividualAutonomy]

It is true there is more interracial interaction  and marriage I would guess because of the lack of state laws banning interracial marriage and segregation. There is also less social pressure against it but however people still largely do voluntary segregate based on race and class.

[IndividualAutonomy]

*in a white

[BasseLundh]

Well, I guess you'll grow up some day to, SecularTalk.