Show me a style or school where NONE of their practitioners ever got defeated. No such style or school exists. Get your heads out of your asses Mr. Livingroom martial arts experts.
Its the skill of the practitioner not the style, jackwads. Notice none of the actual MA school/style channels go to another style's channel and make shit comments. There's a reason for that. Respect and humility. The rest are just shit talkers who hold no rank nor recognition in the MA community. Your opinion is worth shit.
why does everybody boob about what style is more deadly and what style is more sport? Its all in the mind set of the martial artist. If you train to fight by rules You will more then likely die in a REAL fight....If you train with no rules you may walk out of that dark ally.....PERIOD
@Ilanactingreel No. I didn't say that kajukenbo schools that practice sparring are effective. Schools that practice sparring should be better than those that don't.. However, kajukenbo does not give you a strong foundation for a full contact match let alone a real street fight. Kajukenbo assumes that people will stay static while you launch your attacks... that is BS! In addition, they don't teach proper sparring techniques against resisting opponents. It is a very weak system.
I'm not big mouth thats 1 difference I always back up what I say because i have the guts to do it, I'm more then willing to meet you face to face. Fancy dances are for ballerinas not martial artists! If you were a martial artist you would know that. Nah hes not fat he'll beat ya ass from one side of the country to the other by he does one technique youll be dead
@dokokai ....what u dont know where your club is located at? Regarding club hopper...are you an idiot? Dont you know Kyokushin is made up of other styles of Karate? Anta nanimo wakarai na....
I'm seeing alot of Kenpo in this as a well as some muay thai. Case in point: The elbow shield. It seems very effective, but mind you . This is a drill. In a reallife situation, you'd probably be using only part of it. The drill is to give you an idea and option on what to do. Some of you need ot relaxon what works or do not works. It depends on the individual/practioner. Its best to always have an open mind.
Do not judge all Kaju by a few videos, everybody/branch trains differently. One key for my group is to try and make pre arranged motions work while sparring, you learn in a hurry what works and what dosnt,. my teacher always said dont take the motions literal, just work the concept, and let your soul control the fight.Kaju motto "Unity of Mind, Body, and Spirit"
@kajukine That is a way to acknowledge that kaju techniques don't work in real life... Everyone knows this, yet they keep practicing useless techniques and katas just to follow a tradition.
Well reading this I see it turned into a Kaju vs Kyoku. Both arts are great arts with hard tough guys, and not so tough guys.. just the nature of the beast I have been Kaju for 43 years and have trained with a few Kyoku guys, I loved working them, and they loved working me, we spar with no equip other than a mouth piece and cup optional, stupid, but makes you block better. TBC
@CrowdPleeza It is not more popular because people have other options that are way more effective. Kajukenbo practitioners have an extremely hard time transferring their techniques from the bubble of their dojos to the brutal reality of the streets.... that explains why it never took off as a mainstream martial art.
@CrowdPleeza Actually Bruce trained with some of the SF bay area kaju guys BEFORE he created JKD..hmm Im not saying he wasnt already thinking that way, but, Im sure it at least confirmed what he was already working on...
I have a black in both Kajukenbo and Kyokushin but have to say Kyokushin is made for sport where Kajukenbo is made for street. kaju is very brutal compared to kyokushin but I have to admit this video is weak. . I would not use these moves myself. All branches of Kajukenbo dont have the exact tecniques. Kaju was made for the street but over the years and was tested in the streets to prove its effectiveness and from over the years fom Hawaii to the mainland it changed a lot.
@mitsuo39 With too many of the younger Kyokushin instructors teaching now, Kyokushin is focusing too much on tournament training. I have said that in the past & agree, but it was not made for sport fighting. It was modified for sport fighting. The techniques are much more brutal than you will ever see on youtube with tourney videos. With the old school Kyokushin instructors (myself & those who taught me) we still train for street & ignore the tournament modifications. Don't get confused~
@dokokai What you learned most likely came from Hawaii as most arts from Asia came to Hawaii then to mainland if you study history. I also studied Shotokan and Matsubayashi Shoren ryu karate along with Aikido, Kodokan judo and Tae kwon do. Also work shops with Wally Jay small circle jiujitsu and Wing chun do. Every art has something special to offer so rather than to be closed minded I studied many arts and it was not about what I got good at, it was about what made me better as a whole.
@mitsuo39 Kyokushin did not come from Hawaii. I learned from Shigeru Oyama directly in New York who was trained in Japan by Mas Oyama (Kyokushin founder who was trained in Shotokan, Goju & Judo & blended these arts together while eliminating what didn't work with full contact fighting). As history shows, Japanese martials mostly came from Okinawa which in turn mainly came from Chinese arts. If you know any martial arts history at all, you would know this information.
@NikolaisoPaladino Yes I was. As I already stated in my previous comments, I was trained directly by Shoshu Shigeru Oyama who is the founder & retired head of World Oyama Karate, an off shoot of Kyokushin, which he founded in 1982 after breaking away from Mas Oyama (Shigeru's Instructor & founder of Kyokushin). Shigeru taught the old school way that he learned from Mas Oyama & was key in bringing Kyokushin to the U.S along with Kaicho Tadashi Nakamura.
@dokokai Kyokushin creates a strong mind and usually even in point competition a Kyokushin may not hold back their punches. I took out of it the ability to take a lot of pain and use it where I have no fear so would not need to think about what to do instead it would be strictly a reaction without thought. You probably would agree even a 7th dan instructor that gets hit hard in the face for the first time will loose confidence in a fight if had never been in a fight or ever hit before.
@dokokai In a street fight many people can take pain and would keep attacking you even if you broke their fingers due to adrenaline. So the focus on the Karate to end a fight with that deadly one or two blows just isnt realistic. Kajukenbo is overkill and better to have over kill than to see that that one or two finishing strikes was not enough. Karate focuses on all your strength on the finishing kill that if it is not enough it is hard to come back fast with another strike.
@dokokai Dont get me wrong. Reason again I studied many arts is they all have something good to offer and it is about what I can incorporate. To study a few arts and even to be great at them does not make one so well rounded. It is not about what arts are better but what makes us as a whole a better person. To think of oneself as a master is to know everything. Better to always think of oneself as a student and be able to learn and absorb. Is the cup half full or half empty? Hehe =)
@mitsuo39 Clearly you have no knowledge of Kyokushin at all. Yes, Karate generally focuses on the one blow philosophy, but Kyokushin does not train that way in either giving or receiving strikes. We practice a multiple strike approach but the Kajukenbo techniques demonstrated here are a lot of wasted, overly rehearsed movements even though I realize it's mostly a demo to get people interested in the art.
@dokokai I trained for over 30 years. Do you know Bobby Lowe? I know history to what Mas Oyamas background is. I have original tape of Fighting Black Kings if you know what that is. I have to admit this video on Kajukenbo is very weak having strikes that probably wont work well. Do you know Kajukenbo has 4 branches? Kajukenbo original hard style, Won hop Kuen do, Kajukenbo chuan fa, Kajukenbo tai chi. I studied original hard style under C.Emperado. Clearly ur ignorant so care not reply anymore.
@mitsuo39 Bobby Lowe was a Kung Fu practioner in Hawaii who trained occasionally with Mas Oyama to become skilled enough in Kyokushin to be a branch chief so Oyama could spread Kyokushin easier around the world. He is not a true Kyokushin practitioner in the same way that Shigeru Oyama, Tadashi Nakamura, Ashihara, Kurosaki & many other instructors. Oyama did the same thing with a number of instructors from other styles. Training & grading them enough to become branch chiefs & spread Kyokushin.
@mitsuo39 That is the true history behind Bobby Lowe. If you are not aware of that, you are either confused or completely misinformed. I have trained with all four of the American team members in the Fighting Black Kings movie which is known as "The Strongest Karate" in the Japanese version. I've also trained with the members of the 2nd World Tournament American team which included Sensei Eddie Frazier who I know well & trained under for a long time. The number of Kaju branches is irrelevant~
@mitsuo39 ~to this conversation. Lots of people have seen Fighting Black Kings so just because you cite the movie doesn't give you any insight to what's really going on. You sure did "study" a lot of arts which is more likely due to you not learning any of them well enough. You seem more like a Dojo hopper who tried this for a little while, then tried that & another but couldn't stay focused on anything long enough. Where did you train Kyokushin & with who?Where/who did you get your Shodan from?
I sometimes wonder what people expect to see in a self defense demo? Blood and Bone??an actual fight or ko in a bout is the only acceptable vid? Looks like a decent technique to me,and done with a reasonable amount of intensity and accuracy too,considering some,.Kyoku' doesnt do something like this? What when y'all practice your defense you bust each others chops,arms knees and face?Yeah right.I find hard and full contact necessary too but come on these critiques are just looking for fault.
@danbau08 The critique is not that there is no blood or broken bones but with the unnecessarily high quantity of strikes shown in one defense example & the unrealistic expectation that each strike will be delivered perfectly & that the attacker will stand there cooperatively while the strikes are delivered. The point is that attackers aren't always instantly incapacitated with the 1st or 2nd strike & get this...they may even fight back & not wait to get hit even though they may be getting hit.
@dokokai Well first off when practicing a self defense tech, to practice only one or two strikes is less than realistic because exactly as you say they are not often incapacitated by one or two,and get this.. they will fight back,and won't stand there cooperatively.Of course in practicing a technique, one must have s o m e cooperation in order to practice perfect strikes etc.These ones show at least some realistic distancing, precision, and intensity. You contradict yourself in your reply.
@danbau08 There is no contradiction in what I say. There is no cooperation with Kyokuyshin fighting, even with the self defense techniques. That is the whole point & the thing that separates Kyokushin from most other martial arts including what is seen here. Beginners do go slower & pay more attention to technique til it is becomes more reaction than thought. & advanced practitioners don't go all the way to full damage intent with techniques, but the attacking partner is not cooperative.
@dokokai I don't quite know if this whole thread is a kyoku,vs kaju thing but they do exactly the same thing, and from what ive seen a lot of there demos were far worse.I dont practice either one.This whole thing lately with criticising every self defense tech is,just like I say,fault finding.If one doesn't have some cooperation you can't practice period.One might as well just spar,full contact no less,maybe without protective gear too as its not quite realistic enough with it.Come on, nonsense
@danbau08 I'm not trying to make it into a Kyoku v. Kaju but merely point out that rehearsed strikes as shown here will not come off without a hitch & the attacker will not wait to be hit like this in reality. If you don't practice either, your are not making informed comments since Kyokushin does train full contact with no protective equipment. The goal of training in a free fighting,full contact way as we do is to get to a level of reaction & condtioning. Kyokushin does not practice for~
@danbau08 ~using predetermined moves. We have techniques that we train over & over but the goal is to be reactive to the situation. Free fighting trains the body & mind to read the timing of your attacker & react but what comes out as a defense is never a planned movement. Krav Maga is the closest representation of what Kyokushin does with the street training.
@dokokai okay, then we are in agreement. thats why i prefer the live energy drills. that encompass resistance factors as well as timing and broken rhythm. so, in essence we are on the same page. most times when you blast someone in the face or body they immediatly recoil if you connect. i dont want to toot my own horn by saying i never miss but, i do like to walk through the door before i go in the house. thank you for the conversation. i actually learned something.
its an art not a SPORT .... for fighting on the streets .... a trained Kyokushin person wouldnt even attack(or rob) me .....so why should i train like that??i would really think about the diffrents from fightingsport and fightingart........in english it seems like martial arts is the word for everything.....but there are 2 sides in the martial arts world........and i can not put sport comments on a video what has nothing to do with sport......
Sorry but did nott interest me much...Very good for speed training but you shouldn't anticipate the move to go exactly as you plan.In other words, this would be great defense to go against someone who is untrained in anything. If the other guy knows something, it would be a very different match.
I understand that Kajukenbo was founded in Hawaii, But we are not Maori ! If you can respect Hawaiian Culture in it's entirety then you should do more research before taking another cultures Ta'iki and trying to pass it off as Hawaiian. Apologies to my distant cousins in Aotearoa, some cultures still do not understand the significance of Polynesians, but yet they can always take without respect or care.
I've seen kajukenbo that was very rough street fighting type of training (the way it was suppose to be) and the "slap fest" that a lot of kenpo school does - so whatever style you choose - make sure it is somewhat realistic.
@ryandrumkid Don't get confused. Kajukenbo is mainly and almost exclusively a striking art. It uses some elements of judo/jiujitsu but ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY for transitions between strikes. Kajukenbo guys will never be able to grapple against a wrestler, judoka or BJJ practitioner because they lack the technical depth required.
@nerdswers No, you are the one thati s confused. because you automatically assumed that "grapple" meant ground grappling since you jumped to compare it to ground grappling arts. You are a prime example of an mma fan that watches one fight and think he has a black belt in all arts that he can make his bias assumptions about. Quit your bias, you have proven that you lack the knowledge to comment correctly.
@Yourmomishre I think I explained the differences between the "grappling" in kajukenbo and the grappling specialists do. You are fighting a loosing battle trying to defend kajukenbo which is primarily a demonstration tool against static opponents.
@nerdswers No, you said there was no GRAPPLING in Kajukenbo, which was wrong. Then you use a sport that restricts face punching, and creates a small window of what is "legal" hits to explain how they can take punishment, yet forget to add how many parts of the body are illegal to hit. When you make a good point I will believe you, so far i see assumptions.
@Yourmomishre I repeat... there's NO GRAPPLING in kajukenbo, except for certain techniques that are used as TRANSITIONS in the striking process. That's the truth. If u think differently, u got to explain your semantics.
Kyokushin pracitioners DO learn techniques that target the face and other soft tissue targets.They don't use it in sparring but they practice those techniques. Kaju guys DON'T use soft tissue strikes in competition either. In fact,they RARELY spar.
@nerdswers Look up GRAPPLING definition properly. Grappling is siezing manipulating your opponents to offset balannce and so on. You can dart your eyes a few inches to the right to see for yourself the grappling techniques of the art. As for kyokushin, they learn KATA and traditional striking to the face and areas, which is the same for kenpo/kajuken, i guess kyokushin gets a free pass to u. And you said they dont use it in sparring, so how exactly are they an example for withstanding punishment
@Yourmomishre Dude, u aren't reading what I typed.I said that kaju uses elements of judo/jiu jitsu as TRANSITIONS (between strikes) ONLY. If u want to call twisting a wrist or pulling someone's arm, to shift his balance, grappling then go ahead with your definitions. If u use grappling in that broad sense, then dancers are grapplers too!
Kyokushin teaches TECHNIQUES that target soft tissue but more importantly they spar FULL CONTACT against resisting opponents.. not just static ukes like kaju
@papalegua6 I have nothing against grapplers... they do PLENTY of sparring against resisting opponents. Kajukenbo only does mirror dancing with a compliant partner.
@NikolaisoPaladino Wooowww!! I'm really scared now... a kajukenbo faggot asked me out on a date. If we agreed to meet up, I bet anything that you won't show up.
@NikolaisoPaladino The last guy who invited me to a fight turned out to be a karate wannabe who happened to be confined to a wheelchair. Judging by the shit you talk, you are probably a 12 year old or a retard... you'd never show up because only wannabe martial artists launch threats from the comfort of your PC chair.
@nerdswers well the difference between me and the guy who is the wanna be is that im not a wanna be, im 20 years old i train martial arts 6 days a week ive been taught by the best of the best, talk is cheap, let me know when and where
@NikolaisoPaladino Dude, big mouths like u would never show up.Like I said, the last guy who invited me to a fight was a sick boy on a wheelchair who almost cried when I uncovered that fact in YouTube. For all I care, u Rjust like that...
If you practice kajukenbo, you are better off doing your fancy dances (the ones you call pinians) in the comfort of your mcdojo rather than trying to use all of that nonsense your fat instructor tells you in a real fight. Tell me your instructor isn't fat!
i have trained and competed in muay thai since im 14 (I am now 29) I have been doing bjj competitvely for 9 years. Both are sport style mma fighting styles that everyone loves. I think they are great. But honestly you are vastly underestimating the skillsets and benefits of other arts. It is pure ignorance to assume mma training is better than kakukenbo or any other style (EXCEPT TAEKWONDO WHICH IS BALLS) :)
@Ilanactingreel Have you heard me say that mma is better than kajukenbo? I practiced kajukenbo before so I'm speaking from first hand experiences... The problem with kajukenbo is the way they train. For a MA to be effective you need to make sure your techniques work against resisting opponents. In kajukenbo, just like kenpo, the excessive use of static ukes make the training unrealistic and highly ineffective. This is why kajukenbo has never been a mainstream MA.
@nerdswers No there are many kajukendo schools that do live sparring. Some are starting to shine in the kickboxing world, and no they do not ban head punches and clinches. And kyokushin does NOT allow hit soft tissue areas kyokushin mostly based on their knuckle sport. Any techniques that are done at eyes, groins, throats, are practiced from their katas. Kyokushin self defense barely exists nowadays. And grappling as defined, is seizing your opponent in combat, which kaju does. you make no sense
I agree with dokokai on conditioning, if you don't gain a tolerance for being punched and hit, you probably shouldn't be fighting, because every sport takes conditioning, and martial arts is one of those that takes conditioning everywhere.
Kajukenbo has a lot of different stances, and generally people will shift their stance as they're fighting. And in many of the techniques that we do involve kicks to the groin, knee, or pretty much anywhere, except generally above the chest. But part of Kajukenbo is being able to react to anything, so when that guy walks up and randomly throws a punch, he is just going by instinct, and it was a hard position to use a kick in.
Dummy drills are necessary to instill a sense of fluidity in the practicioner. Kajukenbo as well as kenpo is based on principles not techniques. That´s why both are strong arts. What´s missing in those techniques is the multizone simultanous strikes of the lower body and stances, he should really had checked the attacker´s stance with his own stance, and should delivered a hard looping kick at the end of the drill.
That's all great, but look at the Kingi's today...all they do is some lame point sparring and forms competition. This is the typical story of the McDojos in the USA.
By the way, attacking each other with no equipment helps you build your warrior character, but it doesn't necessarily help you much with ur technique.
Kajukenbo is now passing to the history books as a once effective system that has become part of the McDojo franchise...Kenpo is another flavor of the same shitty system.
Training without equipment is great if you like going to the ER and paying medical bills. One should always train with protective gear. There is nothing McDojo about not wanting to wear a cast for 6 weeks.
You got to read what I wrote again... I did not say you have a McDojo if you train with equipment.
I responded to someone who said that kaju guys used to train without equipment... to that I said, that it helps you learn how to take a hit and continue pressing forward with your offensive. This is very true.
You can't get conditioned if you are sitting out of training all the time because you are injured all the time. Protective gear is common sense. anyone who says otherwise is not looking out for your best interests.
I am a 3rd Dan in Kyokushin Karate with over 27yrs experience training. The last 18yrs I've been teaching it as well. We teach our students from white belt by gradually introducing them to full contact so they are slowly building up a tolerance & gaining conditioning. Yes injuries occur but they also occur when protective equipment is used. That is the nature of anything with contact. Look at football...& they wear a lot more equipment. More injuries happen in that sport than almost any other.
No, Kyokushin does not have a form of iron body training. The reason we can absorb/receive the hard hits is from gradually conditioning the students body from white belt when they first start training. Over time the pain receptors are de-sensitized to the hard contact & the signal isn't received by the brain in the same way as people who do not condition their body. Some hits do hurt if they are hard enough no matter how much conditioning is done, but that's where the will & spirit that's been ~
~ developed over time takes over & helps get through the pain...or you go down because it's too painful. The goal, of course, is always to NOT get hit but the whole idea of Kyokushin full contact is if you do get hit you can take a lot more punishment than most & also to find out what techniques really work using full power. This type of training eliminates the fear of getting hit & are able to act freely without worry. We then just have to really protect face, throat & groin.
I have received injuries over the years & they have never sidelined me for very long...not more than a few days.Some of my Sempai & Kohai (seniors & juniors) who have sustained broken arms (about the worst injuries that occured during training) continued to train after a few days. The human body is much more resilient than you give it credit for. The human mind, spirit & will to train & not quit is even greater. Using equipment inhibits the true spirit from fully developing.
Ehh, just find a good school. In the US oh yeah... Mc Dojos around every corner, Taekwondo "Masters", that bought their way to the top, same with their students. I had a Kenpo teacher that was legit, I could tel lfrom the start that he was good, because he never said he was, he always said he had alot of stuff to still learn, that your never good enough. Karate is spilt in two, BS point sparring, and legit Karate. Shotokan is good, Kyokushin, Daido Juku. Kajukenbo had good schools too =)
Kajukenbo is great, but those techniques in particular are lacking stance power, it looks like relying just in arms force, when you should hit with marriage of gravity, angle of incidence and momentum, it looks like a primitive (but effective) kind of kenpo.
well the kenpo in Kaju is primitve, if you can say that about an art thats only 50-60 years old. the kenpo they incorporate is the original form used in early 1900's Okinawa and Post WWII Hawaii. most kenpo has evolved since then and includes more of the principles you named. glad to see you know your stuff.
Sadly,all of the alleged scientific revolution triggered by Ed Parker resulted in a form of new age dancing they call american kenpo.Most of the kenpo practitioners nowadays are more concerned about the beauty of their techniques, when executed against a "sitting duck", rather than worrying about making sure the techniques are effective against resisting opponents.
Too bad for martial arts that kenpo degraded to this level,but it's great for beer belly holders who now have a style to practice
You never worked with someone who is a true American Kenpo Practitioner. We are known for having heavy hands...meaning sometimes you really get hit training if you don't make the block. Just like any other art some bad practitioners make all look bad.
If that is the case, there are very few true american kenpo practitioners because I've trained at many schools in the USA and Venezueal and all of them are pretty much a carbon copy of the other.
Very hard to find a heavy-handed kenpoist who actually had any technique. All of them are simple brawlers with no technique
your more than welcome to come and train with us, or if you ever get a chance to train with Frank Trejo or Huk Planas they are our mentors now. Our technique is to always have a check while imparting as much damage as possible. We do use dummy attacks...most martial arts do, however we try to "dummy" realisticly. The techniques we use are just a springboard to ignite your own imagination on what can and should be done on any given attack. Mr. Parker said that repeatedly.
As soon as you use a dummy as the primary way to train,you start losing sight of reality.When using a dummy,the only thing you can do is train your very1st counter move.Everything else is wishful thinking.Real opponents will have powerful motivations to fight back (saving their lives,pride,money, etc).Those motivations WILL give opponents strength to power out of a technique,take your shot or counter strike.I've seen people on the street take a groin shot and continue fighting without hesitation
Again training is just that training...there is no true way to train in a self-defense system without using dummys (someone acting as the agressor). If you think MMA is a truer way then you kid yourself MMA is a great sport but it's just a sport. Now you can go to a bar and start a fight to see if you can handle yourself but then its not self-defense is it. Your right some people can take shots but Mr.Parker said were training and knowlege end conditioning and persiverance take over.
I think MMA is nowhere close to a real street fight.However,I think kenpo is way more removed from a real street fight scenario than MMA.Yes,you can argue that you use groin shots,throat strikes and other soft tissue strikes that aren't allowed in MMA.However,the truth of the matter is that kenpo training isn't realistic because it isn't done against a resisting uke.When the uke cooperates to the extreme as in kenpo training you are conditioning yourself to fail when the opponent fights back.
Again I have to say you haven't trained with a real kenpoist. You may have trained with several but not anyone who teaches Ed Parker Kenpo. For one we don't use uke, and our attacker is a resistant participant to the extent that nothing comes easy. When I say we train heavy handed, thats the reason...you can't feel the power if the attacker is to compliant. Yes he knows whats coming but thats why they call it training and not fighting. I promise you someone puts me me on my back he loses eyes.
For some reason,all kenpoists say the same thing..."you haven't trained in my school" or "you haven't trained our version of kenpo".Come on,if people have so much trouble finding an "authentic kenpoist" then there's something wrong with the system.
I must say that BJJ has done something good in this regard.You can go to almost any BJJ school and their bb are always very well developed technicians.With kenpo,this isn't the case...as a matter of fact,most kenpo schools in the USA are McDojos.
BTW, if you don't know any ground fighting and you start attacking your opponent eyes and other soft tissue, he will do exactly the same with the difference that he will have the best position to launch his attacks from. It is a losing proposition unless you can take him out with your first attempt.
Finally, I wanted to ask you... Are there any videos on YouTube from real kenpoists? It seems that real kenpoists are as elusive as the Abominable Snowman.
Yes anything by Frank Trejo is good. Anything by Martin Wheeler is good. Huk Planas is good. On the Mat is pretty good, but probably a little to technical for you to follow. And if I have to go for someone's eyes you can believe the first attempt will be all I need. I also find it very hard to believe you've trained in a lot of kenpo schools. Rick Fowler is another that's good.
I've been around the kenpo world long enough to recognize these names. Unfortunately,there's nothing that differentiates them from other instructors...All their techniques are based on hypercompliant ukes,which is very nice for demo purposes,but unrealistic
Funny you mentioned Josh Ryers (On the Mat) because this is exactly what kenpo needs..."more mat time" with a resisting opponent training under duress. If it works under those conditions,the chances of it working on the street are higher.
have ever trained with them. One thing we can agree on is Josh's abilitys. But his main instructor had a big influance on my training also Huk Planas. Gil Hibben was my instructor and Huk would come down and smooth our rough edges. My shoulder still pops from some of these lessons. And I am one of your fat instructors but my friend I've earned the right.
I'm glad you take pride in being hurt by your kenpo instructor -- most likely as you were sitting idle waiting for him to demonstrate his techniques on you.
You did not have to clarify you were fat... After all, it is very hard to get a good cardio workout while sitting idle while you wait to get hit by, your even fatter, instructor.
I was reading your comments and, i don't know what's your background, how long you've been in the martial family and what you do for a living, but the point is, you are right! I agree with your opinions as they go much further than the kenpo style alone. You have a good insight on the subject and i recommend you push your study even more, Some people might not like what you say, but hey truth hurts! Too many McDojos & self proclaim masters of the universe out there! Maybe a book...? OSU!
I've been practicing martial arts for 25 years and I've been seriously hurt numerous times on the job here in Venezuela.IMO,styles are only a small piece of the puzzle to survive in the streets.I'm a firm believer that nothing fancy works on the street.Adrenaline,fear,rage and other physiological factors will strip you of a lot of tools in the field
Your will to survive,self awareness about your own limitations,good physical conditioning and thinking like a criminal are all key to survive.
No No if you were hurt you were hurt by waiting on your fat instructor. I've tryed to have a intellegent discussion with you but I see thats not possible. Yes at 44 I have put on weight, due to a car wreck that had me laid up for over a year. Yes I do take pride in the fact that Huk Planas taught me roughly, and no I was not a compliant attacker...never have been never will be. I've been more than upfront with my background and you do circle talk so this will be my last post wasted on you.
You can't have an intelligent discussion because you're too emotionally attached to your "kenpo"
Sorry if we can't agree that kenpo works. However,I'll admit you can make some nice demonstrations with it if your uke stays still long enough
In 25 years of MA experience,I've never ever seen a realistic fight in which o1 of the 2 participants have used a single kenpo technique successfully.That's all I'm still looking for...It could be a YouTube video or anything that shows that kenpo works.
If I go to the eyes you can bet it will only take one attempt. As for good kenpoist there are several, Frank Trejo, Martin Wheeler, Jeff Speakmen, Larry Tatum (however I do have some differences with Mr. Tatum) Huk Planas. On the Mat series is very good also but probable a little over your head. I'm interested to know what art do you think is a true fighting art? Keep in mind MMA is a sport. Even then some of the best have studied Kenpo. Chuck Liddel and Frank Mir just of the top of my head.
I don't blame you for believing that all the fancy hand waiving and theoretical embellishments that are served with your kenpo portions at your McDojo are going to help you in the street
No matter how hard you train and how many point sparring tournaments you've participated in,the 1st thing you lose in a street fight is your fine motor control. Without it,I'd be interested to see you trying to strike such a small target as your opponent's eyes without having trained extensively under duress.
Remember, one thing is to train against a compliant uke and quite another thing is to fight for your life against an attacker that is as afraid as you are but has the element of surprise on his side as well as a strong motivation to survive (be it the need for drugs or money to feed his family or whatever the case may be).
Please don't believe everything your (most likely fat) kenpo instructors tell you unless you can see his scars from real confrontations.
regarding your questions about what style is true fighting art... I would say, the one you train under realistic scenarios, with opponents that are trying their best to survive and counter your attacks and one that fits you (not your instructor)
By the way, I'm sure Chuck and Frank also practiced baseball long time ago and that has nothing to do with their success in the cage..just like their kenpo.
You keep insisting that my style doesn't work in the streets. I need to let you know a little about my background. I've been training in Ed Parkers Kenpo since the early 80's. I have also trained in Escrima, Akido, and Silat. I have had jobs as a doorman (bouncer) a bodygaurd and verious types of jobs were I have had the need to use my knowledge in the arts. Kenpo the way Mr.Parker taught it has saved my face on several occations and my life on one. Being aware of a name doesn't mean you have
I'm very sorry to hear you have wasted so much time of your life with kenpo... On the bright side, you have gotten the benefit of the "placebo effect" and now you credit your prior "street successes" on kenpo.
Keep on putting on weight and one day you too will be a 10th degree black belt!
I've been training in Kyokushin for over 27 years and teaching it for the last 18 of those 27. One thing you can be sure of is, the human body can withstand a lot of punishment before a confrontation ends. If any of you have tried to fight full contact as Kyokushin does you would know it's not always so easy to take an opponent out or down or knock them out. I have to give you credit "nerdswers" for recognizing a bit of that.
Kyokushin is a great example. They hit each other with everything they got and the fight doesn't end with the first blow.
Kenpo has grown in the safety of their "dojo bubble". They don't venture to try their techniques against resisting opponents but even then, they claim their techniques are effective. Their ignorance and blind trust in the system can get them in big trouble in a street confrontation.
@nerdswers In Kyokushin, there is no grappling, eye gouges, or hit to vital areas (which is what kajukenbo/kenpo focuses on) or face punches allowed in both sparring, or training besides their kata. So you really cant use kyokushin as an exact measurement. You can take a lot of punches/kicks to your mid-section, is a better 'comment', when it comes to using Kyokushin as an example, since this is what they do. I took both IKO1 kyokushin, and World Oyama, and quit both, i have years of kickboxing
@Yourmomishre Well,the fact that kyokushin does not use eye gouges or groin shots in sparring doesn't mean they can use that in a real fight.In fact, u can argue that they can be a lot more effective than kajukenbo practitioners in the use of soft tissue strikes because they're used to fight against a resisting opponent (kajukenbo practitioners just fight static ukes).
Kajukenbo DOES NOT have grappling...that is a misconception and a recent addition to kajukenbo, kenpo and everything else.
@nerdswers I never said that Kyokushin cant use eye gouges in a real fight. I bringing to question where you are saying that people can "withstand damage" easy using kyokushin as an example, but kyokushin doesnt "withstand" damage from vital strikes, nor do they withstand face on fist punching, or pain from grapple locks. And I dont know what kajukenbo u r referring 2 that doesnt grapple, but its a collection of styles, including judo/jujitsu, which is where the ju in the name refers to.
@nerdswers The legal targets in kyokushin r limited. I have seen people from kyokushin enter kickboxing and have to relearn from day one because they cant defend and get ko from face punching. Thats why the majority of kyokushin fighters in both mma and k-1, take up boxing/muay thia. If we are arguing about taking the most punishment in the midsection and legs, then yes, kyokushin wins hands down. But considering that most idiots on the street "head-hunt" i wouldnt talk any further about it.
Yes that can be very true, how ever it is situational, And it depends on where the hits land. A hammer strike coming down on the collar bone for example vs a kick to the chest, The human collar bone cannot take as much pressure as the human chest.
Full contact in a spar with kyokushin practitioners is alot easyer to know how to take the blows and keep them from doing major damage.
Warfare, and the streets, are much more random. No disrespect intended.
An axe kick to the collar bone can cause a break in Kyokushin & K-1 tournament fights though it doesn't always happen. So don't feel confident a hammerfist strike will. One thing most people overlook is that Kyokushin trains for the street, but what most people only see is tournament clips where techniques are modified or eliminated for competitor safety. Don't mistake what you see on YouTube clips as the be all end all of Kyokushin.
Yeah, tournaments in Kyokushin are just like, whos spirit is stronger. Who can keep moving forward longer even though it hurts. But in real life one punch the the face bare knuckle by Kyokushin you will be quite done, or at least not looking for more from that person anytime soon. Does Kyokushin train by Kata as well??? I dont know, I never saw it before, but im Shotokan as far as my Karate goes.
Yes Kyokushin trains with Kata. A lot of the same ones from both Shotokan & Goju (Taikyoku 1-3, Pinan 1-5, Yantsu, Tsuki no Kata, Kanku, Sushiho, Sanchin, Gekisai Dai and Sho, Tensho, Saiha, Seienchin, Seipai. Garyu (which was created by Oyama while developing Kyokushin in the early days). The biggest focus of Kyokushin though are the Kihon (basics) & the full contact bare knuckle (no equipment) Kumite.
Thats cool, alot of Karate is very basic anyway, thats why it works very nicely. Unless you go to like some point sparring lame school... I like Karate, but I like to learn all styles of every country. I like to mix stuff I learn with my Karate. One thing im trying to stop, comming from Shotokan, I put EVERYTHING into each attack, that is bad, and VS people that are good defenders, it makes you tired and leaves you open alot... =O But theres no punch like Karate punch =D
@dokokai Yeah buddy, Kyokushin is great, but is not the same thing to be kicked in the groin, or gougged in the eyes than receive mawashis to the body or the legs. There´s a reason why Kyokushin´s Irikumi as full contact as it is, doesn´t allow fists to the face or skull . Osu
@chimibert We train for street self defense using punching to the head but since we don't use protective equipment we don't make contact. What you see here on youtube is almost always tournaments & training for them. It is a modified version of what we actually do. People make the mistake in assuming Kyokushin does not train for the face. The older Dojos & Instructors (myself included) DO train for street self defense. No one can condition the groin so we train to avoid getting hit there~
@dokokai I am reading your response right now, and in essence I agree a hundred percent with you. Besides, is really hard to actually reach for the groin, eyes or neck, those are well protected both technically and instinctively by any person you may encounter with.
@chimibert ~The purpose of full contact fighting & conditioning the body for it is that IF you miss a block, you will not be afraid to be hit or completely freeze up & shut down when you get hit. It is not to strictly absorb as much punishment as possible although we can withstand a lot more than most people due to conditioning. With the fear of getting hit eliminated, we are free to focus on protecting the face/head & groin.Don't get hung up on what you see from only watching Kyokushin tourneys
@dokokai Brother, I am a long time practicioner of both goju and American kenpo. The first was an inspiration for Shihan Oyama, in the sense that we practice Irikumi go and Hojo Hundo, wich are a full contact practices. Kenpo Karate is also very tough, and I am agree with you in every respect. But self defense main targets are parts that you just can´t train to be tough, as the groin, the neck and the eyes. All of them will shut any attacker out regerdless of size.
Yeah... The human body can withstand Kyokushin TOURNAMENT strikes, like punches to the chest and body, and kicks to the legs. But martial arts like Kajukenbo and Lua are not meant for tournaments, they're meant for getting people off you. The combo at the end of this video is not gonna get someone off you, it's just a demo, but look at Lua. Strikes to the groin,neck, eyes.Grappling locks,finger breaks and even biting the other persons throat and ears is part of it.THAT will get someone off you
@GuamKomudo You fail to realize that is exactly what Kyokushin was created to do. Street defense to get someone off you. Kyokushin is only modified for tournaments originally as a way to spread the art when it was only about a decade or so old. Nowadays too many Kyokushin Dojos focus on too much tournament training only & the street defense aspect is being lost by younger instructors. But in the older Dojos we still train the old way & ignore much or all of the tournament training.
So what are you saying? That the human body can withstand all your strikes and they don't work??? =P
Kyokushin is a very good martial art, and you probably know that the average human is not as prepared to take a beating the like the kyokushin body is... I would say that a solid Kyokushin Karate punch to the body on a normal person would give you enough time to get away from the person... Kajukenbo is part Karate as wel las boxing and other fighting arts combined, but it's 100% street
@GuamKomudo So when exactly did you miss the part where I said Kyokushin is for street defense and only the newer Dojo's have become misguided in focusing on the tournament training?
@GuamKomudo Also I did not say the body can withstand ALL the strikes. I said that the human body is more resilient than this Kajukenbo video demonstrates. Attackers aren't going to be so co-operative & wait to be hit as this video implies they will.
It's just a demo video to make people interested... I could say the same about Kyokushin breaking ice... You can smash through 9 blocks of ice, yet no one sits there with their head down waiting for you to chop their head. It's just a demo thing, not the most effective Kajukenbo, just for show to make others think it's cool and try it.
@MrByaeger As I have already said & explained to several others here, Kyokushin modifies the techniques so that tournaments can be possible. Real Kyokushin Dojos (as I have trained in & teach) concern themselves with street techniques & ignore the tournament methods. The purpose body condtioning is to eliminate the fear of getting hit (which is the problem most people have) & also if a strike to the body comes through, it's not as incapacitating. But most street fights are face/head punches.
@MrByaeger No apology necessary but I do appreciate the thought, thanks. I can understand people(your students as well as many others) not wanting to put themselves through the type of training Kyokushin requires. It's not for everyone & I have seen many people start & quit at all levels in my now 29yrs of training & teaching. The dropout rate has always been about 90% for Kyokushin but for those who stick with it,there is a higher level of skill & confidence they reach than most anywhere else.~
Are these videos available in the USA??
tamashii14 3 months ago
Show me a style or school where NONE of their practitioners ever got defeated. No such style or school exists. Get your heads out of your asses Mr. Livingroom martial arts experts.
fallen808 3 months ago 4
Its the skill of the practitioner not the style, jackwads. Notice none of the actual MA school/style channels go to another style's channel and make shit comments. There's a reason for that. Respect and humility. The rest are just shit talkers who hold no rank nor recognition in the MA community. Your opinion is worth shit.
fallen808 3 months ago
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fallen808 3 months ago
tooooooooo much wasted movement..eye neck nuts.......train for those areas or keep doing the same old shit like you see here
ilendboy 3 months ago
why does everybody boob about what style is more deadly and what style is more sport? Its all in the mind set of the martial artist. If you train to fight by rules You will more then likely die in a REAL fight....If you train with no rules you may walk out of that dark ally.....PERIOD
ilendboy 3 months ago
@Ilanactingreel No. I didn't say that kajukenbo schools that practice sparring are effective. Schools that practice sparring should be better than those that don't.. However, kajukenbo does not give you a strong foundation for a full contact match let alone a real street fight. Kajukenbo assumes that people will stay static while you launch your attacks... that is BS! In addition, they don't teach proper sparring techniques against resisting opponents. It is a very weak system.
nerdswers 5 months ago
I'm not big mouth thats 1 difference I always back up what I say because i have the guts to do it, I'm more then willing to meet you face to face. Fancy dances are for ballerinas not martial artists! If you were a martial artist you would know that. Nah hes not fat he'll beat ya ass from one side of the country to the other by he does one technique youll be dead
NikolaisoPaladino 5 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino LOL! He should send kids like you to school...you should learn to spell first and then change your mcdojo for a real MA academy.
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers you should take your own advice, what style do you study ?
NikolaisoPaladino 4 months ago
Respect! it has a nice flow
NYWAORCANZ 6 months ago
1:30 One adaptation- don't hit his back, hit his neck. When he falls, have a little stompy stompy fun.
Ebuverthebicepcurler 7 months ago
Thats cool! I gotta learn that!
kev3145 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Lol, Kyokushin guys vs Kajukembo dudes? Us Kyokushinkai would kill you guys in a fight. My Sensei, Maki Hisao, killed 3 Yakuza with his hands.
Muraku666 8 months ago
@dokokai ....what u dont know where your club is located at? Regarding club hopper...are you an idiot? Dont you know Kyokushin is made up of other styles of Karate? Anta nanimo wakarai na....
mitsuo39 9 months ago
I'm seeing alot of Kenpo in this as a well as some muay thai. Case in point: The elbow shield. It seems very effective, but mind you . This is a drill. In a reallife situation, you'd probably be using only part of it. The drill is to give you an idea and option on what to do. Some of you need ot relaxon what works or do not works. It depends on the individual/practioner. Its best to always have an open mind.
Bladestar7 9 months ago
Do not judge all Kaju by a few videos, everybody/branch trains differently. One key for my group is to try and make pre arranged motions work while sparring, you learn in a hurry what works and what dosnt,. my teacher always said dont take the motions literal, just work the concept, and let your soul control the fight.Kaju motto "Unity of Mind, Body, and Spirit"
kajukine 10 months ago
@kajukine That is a way to acknowledge that kaju techniques don't work in real life... Everyone knows this, yet they keep practicing useless techniques and katas just to follow a tradition.
nerdswers 9 months ago
Well reading this I see it turned into a Kaju vs Kyoku. Both arts are great arts with hard tough guys, and not so tough guys.. just the nature of the beast I have been Kaju for 43 years and have trained with a few Kyoku guys, I loved working them, and they loved working me, we spar with no equip other than a mouth piece and cup optional, stupid, but makes you block better. TBC
kajukine 10 months ago
@kajukine Kajukenbo, Kenpo and TKD are among the less useful martial arts in the world.
nerdswers 9 months ago
I'am surprised that Kajukenbo isn't more popular. It was one of the first cross training systems before Bruce Lee's JKD.
CrowdPleeza 10 months ago
@CrowdPleeza It is not more popular because people have other options that are way more effective. Kajukenbo practitioners have an extremely hard time transferring their techniques from the bubble of their dojos to the brutal reality of the streets.... that explains why it never took off as a mainstream martial art.
nerdswers 9 months ago
@CrowdPleeza Actually Bruce trained with some of the SF bay area kaju guys BEFORE he created JKD..hmm Im not saying he wasnt already thinking that way, but, Im sure it at least confirmed what he was already working on...
kajukine 8 months ago
@kajukine Bruce probably did. He was alwyaslooking outside his art. And remeber , Kajukenbo was started before Bruce Lee thought up JKD.
Bladestar7 6 months ago
I have a black in both Kajukenbo and Kyokushin but have to say Kyokushin is made for sport where Kajukenbo is made for street. kaju is very brutal compared to kyokushin but I have to admit this video is weak. . I would not use these moves myself. All branches of Kajukenbo dont have the exact tecniques. Kaju was made for the street but over the years and was tested in the streets to prove its effectiveness and from over the years fom Hawaii to the mainland it changed a lot.
mitsuo39 11 months ago 2
@mitsuo39 With too many of the younger Kyokushin instructors teaching now, Kyokushin is focusing too much on tournament training. I have said that in the past & agree, but it was not made for sport fighting. It was modified for sport fighting. The techniques are much more brutal than you will ever see on youtube with tourney videos. With the old school Kyokushin instructors (myself & those who taught me) we still train for street & ignore the tournament modifications. Don't get confused~
dokokai 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 ~between the two. Also, you may have trained in a more tournament focused Kyokushin Dojo.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai What you learned most likely came from Hawaii as most arts from Asia came to Hawaii then to mainland if you study history. I also studied Shotokan and Matsubayashi Shoren ryu karate along with Aikido, Kodokan judo and Tae kwon do. Also work shops with Wally Jay small circle jiujitsu and Wing chun do. Every art has something special to offer so rather than to be closed minded I studied many arts and it was not about what I got good at, it was about what made me better as a whole.
mitsuo39 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 Kyokushin did not come from Hawaii. I learned from Shigeru Oyama directly in New York who was trained in Japan by Mas Oyama (Kyokushin founder who was trained in Shotokan, Goju & Judo & blended these arts together while eliminating what didn't work with full contact fighting). As history shows, Japanese martials mostly came from Okinawa which in turn mainly came from Chinese arts. If you know any martial arts history at all, you would know this information.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai were you taught the old school way ?
NikolaisoPaladino 5 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino Yes I was. As I already stated in my previous comments, I was trained directly by Shoshu Shigeru Oyama who is the founder & retired head of World Oyama Karate, an off shoot of Kyokushin, which he founded in 1982 after breaking away from Mas Oyama (Shigeru's Instructor & founder of Kyokushin). Shigeru taught the old school way that he learned from Mas Oyama & was key in bringing Kyokushin to the U.S along with Kaicho Tadashi Nakamura.
dokokai 4 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino Yes, absolutely I was taught the old way. That is the only way Shigeru Oyama taught!!
dokokai 3 months ago
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mitsuo39 10 months ago
@dokokai Kyokushin creates a strong mind and usually even in point competition a Kyokushin may not hold back their punches. I took out of it the ability to take a lot of pain and use it where I have no fear so would not need to think about what to do instead it would be strictly a reaction without thought. You probably would agree even a 7th dan instructor that gets hit hard in the face for the first time will loose confidence in a fight if had never been in a fight or ever hit before.
mitsuo39 10 months ago
@dokokai In a street fight many people can take pain and would keep attacking you even if you broke their fingers due to adrenaline. So the focus on the Karate to end a fight with that deadly one or two blows just isnt realistic. Kajukenbo is overkill and better to have over kill than to see that that one or two finishing strikes was not enough. Karate focuses on all your strength on the finishing kill that if it is not enough it is hard to come back fast with another strike.
mitsuo39 10 months ago
@dokokai Dont get me wrong. Reason again I studied many arts is they all have something good to offer and it is about what I can incorporate. To study a few arts and even to be great at them does not make one so well rounded. It is not about what arts are better but what makes us as a whole a better person. To think of oneself as a master is to know everything. Better to always think of oneself as a student and be able to learn and absorb. Is the cup half full or half empty? Hehe =)
mitsuo39 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 Clearly you have no knowledge of Kyokushin at all. Yes, Karate generally focuses on the one blow philosophy, but Kyokushin does not train that way in either giving or receiving strikes. We practice a multiple strike approach but the Kajukenbo techniques demonstrated here are a lot of wasted, overly rehearsed movements even though I realize it's mostly a demo to get people interested in the art.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai I trained for over 30 years. Do you know Bobby Lowe? I know history to what Mas Oyamas background is. I have original tape of Fighting Black Kings if you know what that is. I have to admit this video on Kajukenbo is very weak having strikes that probably wont work well. Do you know Kajukenbo has 4 branches? Kajukenbo original hard style, Won hop Kuen do, Kajukenbo chuan fa, Kajukenbo tai chi. I studied original hard style under C.Emperado. Clearly ur ignorant so care not reply anymore.
mitsuo39 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 Bobby Lowe was a Kung Fu practioner in Hawaii who trained occasionally with Mas Oyama to become skilled enough in Kyokushin to be a branch chief so Oyama could spread Kyokushin easier around the world. He is not a true Kyokushin practitioner in the same way that Shigeru Oyama, Tadashi Nakamura, Ashihara, Kurosaki & many other instructors. Oyama did the same thing with a number of instructors from other styles. Training & grading them enough to become branch chiefs & spread Kyokushin.
dokokai 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 That is the true history behind Bobby Lowe. If you are not aware of that, you are either confused or completely misinformed. I have trained with all four of the American team members in the Fighting Black Kings movie which is known as "The Strongest Karate" in the Japanese version. I've also trained with the members of the 2nd World Tournament American team which included Sensei Eddie Frazier who I know well & trained under for a long time. The number of Kaju branches is irrelevant~
dokokai 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 ~to this conversation. Lots of people have seen Fighting Black Kings so just because you cite the movie doesn't give you any insight to what's really going on. You sure did "study" a lot of arts which is more likely due to you not learning any of them well enough. You seem more like a Dojo hopper who tried this for a little while, then tried that & another but couldn't stay focused on anything long enough. Where did you train Kyokushin & with who?Where/who did you get your Shodan from?
dokokai 10 months ago
@mitsuo39 Did you even read any of my posts before replying? It sure doesn't seem like you did.
dokokai 10 months ago
I sometimes wonder what people expect to see in a self defense demo? Blood and Bone??an actual fight or ko in a bout is the only acceptable vid? Looks like a decent technique to me,and done with a reasonable amount of intensity and accuracy too,considering some,.Kyoku' doesnt do something like this? What when y'all practice your defense you bust each others chops,arms knees and face?Yeah right.I find hard and full contact necessary too but come on these critiques are just looking for fault.
danbau08 11 months ago
@danbau08 The critique is not that there is no blood or broken bones but with the unnecessarily high quantity of strikes shown in one defense example & the unrealistic expectation that each strike will be delivered perfectly & that the attacker will stand there cooperatively while the strikes are delivered. The point is that attackers aren't always instantly incapacitated with the 1st or 2nd strike & get this...they may even fight back & not wait to get hit even though they may be getting hit.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai Well first off when practicing a self defense tech, to practice only one or two strikes is less than realistic because exactly as you say they are not often incapacitated by one or two,and get this.. they will fight back,and won't stand there cooperatively.Of course in practicing a technique, one must have s o m e cooperation in order to practice perfect strikes etc.These ones show at least some realistic distancing, precision, and intensity. You contradict yourself in your reply.
danbau08 10 months ago
@danbau08 There is no contradiction in what I say. There is no cooperation with Kyokuyshin fighting, even with the self defense techniques. That is the whole point & the thing that separates Kyokushin from most other martial arts including what is seen here. Beginners do go slower & pay more attention to technique til it is becomes more reaction than thought. & advanced practitioners don't go all the way to full damage intent with techniques, but the attacking partner is not cooperative.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai I don't quite know if this whole thread is a kyoku,vs kaju thing but they do exactly the same thing, and from what ive seen a lot of there demos were far worse.I dont practice either one.This whole thing lately with criticising every self defense tech is,just like I say,fault finding.If one doesn't have some cooperation you can't practice period.One might as well just spar,full contact no less,maybe without protective gear too as its not quite realistic enough with it.Come on, nonsense
danbau08 10 months ago
@danbau08 I'm not trying to make it into a Kyoku v. Kaju but merely point out that rehearsed strikes as shown here will not come off without a hitch & the attacker will not wait to be hit like this in reality. If you don't practice either, your are not making informed comments since Kyokushin does train full contact with no protective equipment. The goal of training in a free fighting,full contact way as we do is to get to a level of reaction & condtioning. Kyokushin does not practice for~
dokokai 10 months ago
@danbau08 ~using predetermined moves. We have techniques that we train over & over but the goal is to be reactive to the situation. Free fighting trains the body & mind to read the timing of your attacker & react but what comes out as a defense is never a planned movement. Krav Maga is the closest representation of what Kyokushin does with the street training.
dokokai 10 months ago
@dokokai okay, then we are in agreement. thats why i prefer the live energy drills. that encompass resistance factors as well as timing and broken rhythm. so, in essence we are on the same page. most times when you blast someone in the face or body they immediatly recoil if you connect. i dont want to toot my own horn by saying i never miss but, i do like to walk through the door before i go in the house. thank you for the conversation. i actually learned something.
opticannon 10 months ago
looks like kempo
bummercal 1 year ago
its an art not a SPORT .... for fighting on the streets .... a trained Kyokushin person wouldnt even attack(or rob) me .....so why should i train like that??i would really think about the diffrents from fightingsport and fightingart........in english it seems like martial arts is the word for everything.....but there are 2 sides in the martial arts world........and i can not put sport comments on a video what has nothing to do with sport......
edlinjeremy1 1 year ago
OSU
mitchx69 1 year ago
Cool Martial Art!
FunnyJapanesePranks 1 year ago
im getting promoted to purple advaced. :P ANANKU AN KHIONS 1-10
MegaKillerpoo 1 year ago
i know it's demonstrational but it looks like this stuff will get u hurt, people usually aren't that compliant when you're beating on them
garyfox89 1 year ago
i know it's demonstrational but it looks like this stuff will get u hurt
garyfox89 1 year ago
Sorry but did nott interest me much...Very good for speed training but you shouldn't anticipate the move to go exactly as you plan.In other words, this would be great defense to go against someone who is untrained in anything. If the other guy knows something, it would be a very different match.
MrDeathCab1 1 year ago
Xmm dont know if its just me but this looks a lot like Wing Tsung
Kabamaru2000 1 year ago
they waist so much time.
hawaiianselfdefeyaho 1 year ago
I understand that Kajukenbo was founded in Hawaii, But we are not Maori ! If you can respect Hawaiian Culture in it's entirety then you should do more research before taking another cultures Ta'iki and trying to pass it off as Hawaiian. Apologies to my distant cousins in Aotearoa, some cultures still do not understand the significance of Polynesians, but yet they can always take without respect or care.
NaKaneKoa 1 year ago
I've seen kajukenbo that was very rough street fighting type of training (the way it was suppose to be) and the "slap fest" that a lot of kenpo school does - so whatever style you choose - make sure it is somewhat realistic.
gomergilligan 1 year ago
Combine this with Judo and you've got a real fighting machine on your hands :)
ComputerIlliterit 1 year ago
@ComputerIlliterit Judo actually is part of the Kajukenbo fighting system. it also includes karate, jujistsu, kenpo, and chinese boxing (kung fu)
ryandrumkid 1 year ago 2
@ryandrumkid Don't get confused. Kajukenbo is mainly and almost exclusively a striking art. It uses some elements of judo/jiujitsu but ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY for transitions between strikes. Kajukenbo guys will never be able to grapple against a wrestler, judoka or BJJ practitioner because they lack the technical depth required.
nerdswers 9 months ago
@nerdswers No, you are the one thati s confused. because you automatically assumed that "grapple" meant ground grappling since you jumped to compare it to ground grappling arts. You are a prime example of an mma fan that watches one fight and think he has a black belt in all arts that he can make his bias assumptions about. Quit your bias, you have proven that you lack the knowledge to comment correctly.
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
@Yourmomishre I think I explained the differences between the "grappling" in kajukenbo and the grappling specialists do. You are fighting a loosing battle trying to defend kajukenbo which is primarily a demonstration tool against static opponents.
nerdswers 9 months ago
@nerdswers No, you said there was no GRAPPLING in Kajukenbo, which was wrong. Then you use a sport that restricts face punching, and creates a small window of what is "legal" hits to explain how they can take punishment, yet forget to add how many parts of the body are illegal to hit. When you make a good point I will believe you, so far i see assumptions.
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
@Yourmomishre I repeat... there's NO GRAPPLING in kajukenbo, except for certain techniques that are used as TRANSITIONS in the striking process. That's the truth. If u think differently, u got to explain your semantics.
Kyokushin pracitioners DO learn techniques that target the face and other soft tissue targets.They don't use it in sparring but they practice those techniques. Kaju guys DON'T use soft tissue strikes in competition either. In fact,they RARELY spar.
nerdswers 9 months ago
@nerdswers Look up GRAPPLING definition properly. Grappling is siezing manipulating your opponents to offset balannce and so on. You can dart your eyes a few inches to the right to see for yourself the grappling techniques of the art. As for kyokushin, they learn KATA and traditional striking to the face and areas, which is the same for kenpo/kajuken, i guess kyokushin gets a free pass to u. And you said they dont use it in sparring, so how exactly are they an example for withstanding punishment
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
@Yourmomishre Dude, u aren't reading what I typed.I said that kaju uses elements of judo/jiu jitsu as TRANSITIONS (between strikes) ONLY. If u want to call twisting a wrist or pulling someone's arm, to shift his balance, grappling then go ahead with your definitions. If u use grappling in that broad sense, then dancers are grapplers too!
Kyokushin teaches TECHNIQUES that target soft tissue but more importantly they spar FULL CONTACT against resisting opponents.. not just static ukes like kaju
nerdswers 9 months ago
@nerdswers DANCERS ARE GRAPPLERS IF THEY DANCE IN PAIRS....
papalegua6 6 months ago
@papalegua6 I have nothing against grapplers... they do PLENTY of sparring against resisting opponents. Kajukenbo only does mirror dancing with a compliant partner.
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers I have an idea if you think Kajukenbo is just mirror dancing, lets meet up and I'll show you what kajukenbo really is
NikolaisoPaladino 5 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino Wooowww!! I'm really scared now... a kajukenbo faggot asked me out on a date. If we agreed to meet up, I bet anything that you won't show up.
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers name the time and place, when i do show up i bet you'll run away
NikolaisoPaladino 5 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino The last guy who invited me to a fight turned out to be a karate wannabe who happened to be confined to a wheelchair. Judging by the shit you talk, you are probably a 12 year old or a retard... you'd never show up because only wannabe martial artists launch threats from the comfort of your PC chair.
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers well the difference between me and the guy who is the wanna be is that im not a wanna be, im 20 years old i train martial arts 6 days a week ive been taught by the best of the best, talk is cheap, let me know when and where
NikolaisoPaladino 5 months ago
@NikolaisoPaladino Dude, big mouths like u would never show up.Like I said, the last guy who invited me to a fight was a sick boy on a wheelchair who almost cried when I uncovered that fact in YouTube. For all I care, u Rjust like that...
If you practice kajukenbo, you are better off doing your fancy dances (the ones you call pinians) in the comfort of your mcdojo rather than trying to use all of that nonsense your fat instructor tells you in a real fight. Tell me your instructor isn't fat!
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers
i have trained and competed in muay thai since im 14 (I am now 29) I have been doing bjj competitvely for 9 years. Both are sport style mma fighting styles that everyone loves. I think they are great. But honestly you are vastly underestimating the skillsets and benefits of other arts. It is pure ignorance to assume mma training is better than kakukenbo or any other style (EXCEPT TAEKWONDO WHICH IS BALLS) :)
Ilanactingreel 5 months ago
@Ilanactingreel Have you heard me say that mma is better than kajukenbo? I practiced kajukenbo before so I'm speaking from first hand experiences... The problem with kajukenbo is the way they train. For a MA to be effective you need to make sure your techniques work against resisting opponents. In kajukenbo, just like kenpo, the excessive use of static ukes make the training unrealistic and highly ineffective. This is why kajukenbo has never been a mainstream MA.
nerdswers 5 months ago
@nerdswers
are you saying that kajukenbo schools that practice sparring are effective than?
Ilanactingreel 5 months ago
@nerdswers No there are many kajukendo schools that do live sparring. Some are starting to shine in the kickboxing world, and no they do not ban head punches and clinches. And kyokushin does NOT allow hit soft tissue areas kyokushin mostly based on their knuckle sport. Any techniques that are done at eyes, groins, throats, are practiced from their katas. Kyokushin self defense barely exists nowadays. And grappling as defined, is seizing your opponent in combat, which kaju does. you make no sense
Yourmomishre 4 months ago
I agree with dokokai on conditioning, if you don't gain a tolerance for being punched and hit, you probably shouldn't be fighting, because every sport takes conditioning, and martial arts is one of those that takes conditioning everywhere.
monkeymaster81 1 year ago
Kajukenbo has a lot of different stances, and generally people will shift their stance as they're fighting. And in many of the techniques that we do involve kicks to the groin, knee, or pretty much anywhere, except generally above the chest. But part of Kajukenbo is being able to react to anything, so when that guy walks up and randomly throws a punch, he is just going by instinct, and it was a hard position to use a kick in.
monkeymaster81 1 year ago
el man grita como si le pegara con fuerza
EIROS15 1 year ago
scooping kick, my bad.
chimibert 2 years ago
Dummy drills are necessary to instill a sense of fluidity in the practicioner. Kajukenbo as well as kenpo is based on principles not techniques. That´s why both are strong arts. What´s missing in those techniques is the multizone simultanous strikes of the lower body and stances, he should really had checked the attacker´s stance with his own stance, and should delivered a hard looping kick at the end of the drill.
chimibert 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
kajukenbo is for gays!
prabhumast 2 years ago
"nerdswers"
Agreed
This is some McDojo stuff -_-
Mocktezuma111 2 years ago
That's all great, but look at the Kingi's today...all they do is some lame point sparring and forms competition. This is the typical story of the McDojos in the USA.
By the way, attacking each other with no equipment helps you build your warrior character, but it doesn't necessarily help you much with ur technique.
Kajukenbo is now passing to the history books as a once effective system that has become part of the McDojo franchise...Kenpo is another flavor of the same shitty system.
nerdswers 2 years ago
Training without equipment is great if you like going to the ER and paying medical bills. One should always train with protective gear. There is nothing McDojo about not wanting to wear a cast for 6 weeks.
mmtxaz 2 years ago
You got to read what I wrote again... I did not say you have a McDojo if you train with equipment.
I responded to someone who said that kaju guys used to train without equipment... to that I said, that it helps you learn how to take a hit and continue pressing forward with your offensive. This is very true.
nerdswers 2 years ago
The first time you get hit or hit something yourself without protective equipment...you will be going to the ER because you won't be conditioned.
dokokai 2 years ago
You can't get conditioned if you are sitting out of training all the time because you are injured all the time. Protective gear is common sense. anyone who says otherwise is not looking out for your best interests.
mmtxaz 2 years ago
I am a 3rd Dan in Kyokushin Karate with over 27yrs experience training. The last 18yrs I've been teaching it as well. We teach our students from white belt by gradually introducing them to full contact so they are slowly building up a tolerance & gaining conditioning. Yes injuries occur but they also occur when protective equipment is used. That is the nature of anything with contact. Look at football...& they wear a lot more equipment. More injuries happen in that sport than almost any other.
dokokai 2 years ago
Kyokushin has a form if iron body right? Thats how they can take such hard hits with out seeming to feel it?
Mider999 1 year ago
No, Kyokushin does not have a form of iron body training. The reason we can absorb/receive the hard hits is from gradually conditioning the students body from white belt when they first start training. Over time the pain receptors are de-sensitized to the hard contact & the signal isn't received by the brain in the same way as people who do not condition their body. Some hits do hurt if they are hard enough no matter how much conditioning is done, but that's where the will & spirit that's been ~
dokokai 1 year ago
~ developed over time takes over & helps get through the pain...or you go down because it's too painful. The goal, of course, is always to NOT get hit but the whole idea of Kyokushin full contact is if you do get hit you can take a lot more punishment than most & also to find out what techniques really work using full power. This type of training eliminates the fear of getting hit & are able to act freely without worry. We then just have to really protect face, throat & groin.
dokokai 1 year ago
I have received injuries over the years & they have never sidelined me for very long...not more than a few days.Some of my Sempai & Kohai (seniors & juniors) who have sustained broken arms (about the worst injuries that occured during training) continued to train after a few days. The human body is much more resilient than you give it credit for. The human mind, spirit & will to train & not quit is even greater. Using equipment inhibits the true spirit from fully developing.
dokokai 2 years ago
Ehh, just find a good school. In the US oh yeah... Mc Dojos around every corner, Taekwondo "Masters", that bought their way to the top, same with their students. I had a Kenpo teacher that was legit, I could tel lfrom the start that he was good, because he never said he was, he always said he had alot of stuff to still learn, that your never good enough. Karate is spilt in two, BS point sparring, and legit Karate. Shotokan is good, Kyokushin, Daido Juku. Kajukenbo had good schools too =)
GuamKomudo 2 years ago
The background graffiti is a nice touch. Where you film this video?
BTC141 2 years ago
Why are we talking about kenpo in the comments section of a kajukenbo video?
Kajukenbo has been street tested since the first day it was developed. The whole theory behind it is to take what works best, and discard the rest.
publikenemy187 2 years ago
Actually that's JKD your talking about, but kajukenbo was created by 3 black belts of different arts to help the locals to defend themselves.
stenokhoria 2 years ago
It was actually created by 5, not three. And it actually was street tested to improve the method.
JKD might have the same philosophy and beginnings too, I wouldn't know.
publikenemy187 2 years ago
muy bueno felicitaciones :D
kenpoista007 2 years ago
awsome :D
Bjerkeseth 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
i know smif n wesson the school of bang bang u!
jiner666 2 years ago
i want to lern kajukenbo
cali4jose 2 years ago
Why did they continuously show that last clip as though it were so impressive?
dokokai 2 years ago
Nice Vids!
UnionCityTopTeam 2 years ago
very smooth, very nice
docdice 2 years ago
Peace brother
chimibert 2 years ago
Kajukenbo is great, but those techniques in particular are lacking stance power, it looks like relying just in arms force, when you should hit with marriage of gravity, angle of incidence and momentum, it looks like a primitive (but effective) kind of kenpo.
chimibert 2 years ago
well the kenpo in Kaju is primitve, if you can say that about an art thats only 50-60 years old. the kenpo they incorporate is the original form used in early 1900's Okinawa and Post WWII Hawaii. most kenpo has evolved since then and includes more of the principles you named. glad to see you know your stuff.
violentbuddha 2 years ago
Sadly,all of the alleged scientific revolution triggered by Ed Parker resulted in a form of new age dancing they call american kenpo.Most of the kenpo practitioners nowadays are more concerned about the beauty of their techniques, when executed against a "sitting duck", rather than worrying about making sure the techniques are effective against resisting opponents.
Too bad for martial arts that kenpo degraded to this level,but it's great for beer belly holders who now have a style to practice
nerdswers 2 years ago
You never worked with someone who is a true American Kenpo Practitioner. We are known for having heavy hands...meaning sometimes you really get hit training if you don't make the block. Just like any other art some bad practitioners make all look bad.
docdice 2 years ago
If that is the case, there are very few true american kenpo practitioners because I've trained at many schools in the USA and Venezueal and all of them are pretty much a carbon copy of the other.
Very hard to find a heavy-handed kenpoist who actually had any technique. All of them are simple brawlers with no technique
nerdswers 2 years ago
your more than welcome to come and train with us, or if you ever get a chance to train with Frank Trejo or Huk Planas they are our mentors now. Our technique is to always have a check while imparting as much damage as possible. We do use dummy attacks...most martial arts do, however we try to "dummy" realisticly. The techniques we use are just a springboard to ignite your own imagination on what can and should be done on any given attack. Mr. Parker said that repeatedly.
docdice 2 years ago
As soon as you use a dummy as the primary way to train,you start losing sight of reality.When using a dummy,the only thing you can do is train your very1st counter move.Everything else is wishful thinking.Real opponents will have powerful motivations to fight back (saving their lives,pride,money, etc).Those motivations WILL give opponents strength to power out of a technique,take your shot or counter strike.I've seen people on the street take a groin shot and continue fighting without hesitation
nerdswers 2 years ago 2
Again training is just that training...there is no true way to train in a self-defense system without using dummys (someone acting as the agressor). If you think MMA is a truer way then you kid yourself MMA is a great sport but it's just a sport. Now you can go to a bar and start a fight to see if you can handle yourself but then its not self-defense is it. Your right some people can take shots but Mr.Parker said were training and knowlege end conditioning and persiverance take over.
docdice 2 years ago
I think MMA is nowhere close to a real street fight.However,I think kenpo is way more removed from a real street fight scenario than MMA.Yes,you can argue that you use groin shots,throat strikes and other soft tissue strikes that aren't allowed in MMA.However,the truth of the matter is that kenpo training isn't realistic because it isn't done against a resisting uke.When the uke cooperates to the extreme as in kenpo training you are conditioning yourself to fail when the opponent fights back.
nerdswers 2 years ago
Again I have to say you haven't trained with a real kenpoist. You may have trained with several but not anyone who teaches Ed Parker Kenpo. For one we don't use uke, and our attacker is a resistant participant to the extent that nothing comes easy. When I say we train heavy handed, thats the reason...you can't feel the power if the attacker is to compliant. Yes he knows whats coming but thats why they call it training and not fighting. I promise you someone puts me me on my back he loses eyes.
docdice 2 years ago
For some reason,all kenpoists say the same thing..."you haven't trained in my school" or "you haven't trained our version of kenpo".Come on,if people have so much trouble finding an "authentic kenpoist" then there's something wrong with the system.
I must say that BJJ has done something good in this regard.You can go to almost any BJJ school and their bb are always very well developed technicians.With kenpo,this isn't the case...as a matter of fact,most kenpo schools in the USA are McDojos.
nerdswers 2 years ago
BTW, if you don't know any ground fighting and you start attacking your opponent eyes and other soft tissue, he will do exactly the same with the difference that he will have the best position to launch his attacks from. It is a losing proposition unless you can take him out with your first attempt.
Finally, I wanted to ask you... Are there any videos on YouTube from real kenpoists? It seems that real kenpoists are as elusive as the Abominable Snowman.
nerdswers 2 years ago
Yes anything by Frank Trejo is good. Anything by Martin Wheeler is good. Huk Planas is good. On the Mat is pretty good, but probably a little to technical for you to follow. And if I have to go for someone's eyes you can believe the first attempt will be all I need. I also find it very hard to believe you've trained in a lot of kenpo schools. Rick Fowler is another that's good.
docdice 2 years ago
I've been around the kenpo world long enough to recognize these names. Unfortunately,there's nothing that differentiates them from other instructors...All their techniques are based on hypercompliant ukes,which is very nice for demo purposes,but unrealistic
Funny you mentioned Josh Ryers (On the Mat) because this is exactly what kenpo needs..."more mat time" with a resisting opponent training under duress. If it works under those conditions,the chances of it working on the street are higher.
nerdswers 2 years ago
have ever trained with them. One thing we can agree on is Josh's abilitys. But his main instructor had a big influance on my training also Huk Planas. Gil Hibben was my instructor and Huk would come down and smooth our rough edges. My shoulder still pops from some of these lessons. And I am one of your fat instructors but my friend I've earned the right.
docdice 2 years ago
I'm glad you take pride in being hurt by your kenpo instructor -- most likely as you were sitting idle waiting for him to demonstrate his techniques on you.
You did not have to clarify you were fat... After all, it is very hard to get a good cardio workout while sitting idle while you wait to get hit by, your even fatter, instructor.
nerdswers 2 years ago
I was reading your comments and, i don't know what's your background, how long you've been in the martial family and what you do for a living, but the point is, you are right! I agree with your opinions as they go much further than the kenpo style alone. You have a good insight on the subject and i recommend you push your study even more, Some people might not like what you say, but hey truth hurts! Too many McDojos & self proclaim masters of the universe out there! Maybe a book...? OSU!
Zayan911 2 years ago
Talking to nerdswers...
Zayan911 2 years ago
I've been practicing martial arts for 25 years and I've been seriously hurt numerous times on the job here in Venezuela.IMO,styles are only a small piece of the puzzle to survive in the streets.I'm a firm believer that nothing fancy works on the street.Adrenaline,fear,rage and other physiological factors will strip you of a lot of tools in the field
Your will to survive,self awareness about your own limitations,good physical conditioning and thinking like a criminal are all key to survive.
nerdswers 2 years ago
No No if you were hurt you were hurt by waiting on your fat instructor. I've tryed to have a intellegent discussion with you but I see thats not possible. Yes at 44 I have put on weight, due to a car wreck that had me laid up for over a year. Yes I do take pride in the fact that Huk Planas taught me roughly, and no I was not a compliant attacker...never have been never will be. I've been more than upfront with my background and you do circle talk so this will be my last post wasted on you.
docdice 2 years ago
You can't have an intelligent discussion because you're too emotionally attached to your "kenpo"
Sorry if we can't agree that kenpo works. However,I'll admit you can make some nice demonstrations with it if your uke stays still long enough
In 25 years of MA experience,I've never ever seen a realistic fight in which o1 of the 2 participants have used a single kenpo technique successfully.That's all I'm still looking for...It could be a YouTube video or anything that shows that kenpo works.
nerdswers 2 years ago
If I go to the eyes you can bet it will only take one attempt. As for good kenpoist there are several, Frank Trejo, Martin Wheeler, Jeff Speakmen, Larry Tatum (however I do have some differences with Mr. Tatum) Huk Planas. On the Mat series is very good also but probable a little over your head. I'm interested to know what art do you think is a true fighting art? Keep in mind MMA is a sport. Even then some of the best have studied Kenpo. Chuck Liddel and Frank Mir just of the top of my head.
docdice 2 years ago
I don't blame you for believing that all the fancy hand waiving and theoretical embellishments that are served with your kenpo portions at your McDojo are going to help you in the street
No matter how hard you train and how many point sparring tournaments you've participated in,the 1st thing you lose in a street fight is your fine motor control. Without it,I'd be interested to see you trying to strike such a small target as your opponent's eyes without having trained extensively under duress.
nerdswers 2 years ago
Remember, one thing is to train against a compliant uke and quite another thing is to fight for your life against an attacker that is as afraid as you are but has the element of surprise on his side as well as a strong motivation to survive (be it the need for drugs or money to feed his family or whatever the case may be).
Please don't believe everything your (most likely fat) kenpo instructors tell you unless you can see his scars from real confrontations.
nerdswers 2 years ago
regarding your questions about what style is true fighting art... I would say, the one you train under realistic scenarios, with opponents that are trying their best to survive and counter your attacks and one that fits you (not your instructor)
By the way, I'm sure Chuck and Frank also practiced baseball long time ago and that has nothing to do with their success in the cage..just like their kenpo.
nerdswers 2 years ago
You keep insisting that my style doesn't work in the streets. I need to let you know a little about my background. I've been training in Ed Parkers Kenpo since the early 80's. I have also trained in Escrima, Akido, and Silat. I have had jobs as a doorman (bouncer) a bodygaurd and verious types of jobs were I have had the need to use my knowledge in the arts. Kenpo the way Mr.Parker taught it has saved my face on several occations and my life on one. Being aware of a name doesn't mean you have
docdice 2 years ago
I'm very sorry to hear you have wasted so much time of your life with kenpo... On the bright side, you have gotten the benefit of the "placebo effect" and now you credit your prior "street successes" on kenpo.
Keep on putting on weight and one day you too will be a 10th degree black belt!
nerdswers 2 years ago
I've been training in Kyokushin for over 27 years and teaching it for the last 18 of those 27. One thing you can be sure of is, the human body can withstand a lot of punishment before a confrontation ends. If any of you have tried to fight full contact as Kyokushin does you would know it's not always so easy to take an opponent out or down or knock them out. I have to give you credit "nerdswers" for recognizing a bit of that.
dokokai 2 years ago 9
Kyokushin is a great example. They hit each other with everything they got and the fight doesn't end with the first blow.
Kenpo has grown in the safety of their "dojo bubble". They don't venture to try their techniques against resisting opponents but even then, they claim their techniques are effective. Their ignorance and blind trust in the system can get them in big trouble in a street confrontation.
nerdswers 2 years ago
been to alot of kempo schools have you? the techniques are just an idea, a starting point. not meant to be taken literally from start to finish.
kempobrad 2 years ago
@nerdswers In Kyokushin, there is no grappling, eye gouges, or hit to vital areas (which is what kajukenbo/kenpo focuses on) or face punches allowed in both sparring, or training besides their kata. So you really cant use kyokushin as an exact measurement. You can take a lot of punches/kicks to your mid-section, is a better 'comment', when it comes to using Kyokushin as an example, since this is what they do. I took both IKO1 kyokushin, and World Oyama, and quit both, i have years of kickboxing
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
@Yourmomishre Well,the fact that kyokushin does not use eye gouges or groin shots in sparring doesn't mean they can use that in a real fight.In fact, u can argue that they can be a lot more effective than kajukenbo practitioners in the use of soft tissue strikes because they're used to fight against a resisting opponent (kajukenbo practitioners just fight static ukes).
Kajukenbo DOES NOT have grappling...that is a misconception and a recent addition to kajukenbo, kenpo and everything else.
nerdswers 9 months ago
@nerdswers I never said that Kyokushin cant use eye gouges in a real fight. I bringing to question where you are saying that people can "withstand damage" easy using kyokushin as an example, but kyokushin doesnt "withstand" damage from vital strikes, nor do they withstand face on fist punching, or pain from grapple locks. And I dont know what kajukenbo u r referring 2 that doesnt grapple, but its a collection of styles, including judo/jujitsu, which is where the ju in the name refers to.
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
@nerdswers The legal targets in kyokushin r limited. I have seen people from kyokushin enter kickboxing and have to relearn from day one because they cant defend and get ko from face punching. Thats why the majority of kyokushin fighters in both mma and k-1, take up boxing/muay thia. If we are arguing about taking the most punishment in the midsection and legs, then yes, kyokushin wins hands down. But considering that most idiots on the street "head-hunt" i wouldnt talk any further about it.
Yourmomishre 9 months ago
Yes that can be very true, how ever it is situational, And it depends on where the hits land. A hammer strike coming down on the collar bone for example vs a kick to the chest, The human collar bone cannot take as much pressure as the human chest.
Full contact in a spar with kyokushin practitioners is alot easyer to know how to take the blows and keep them from doing major damage.
Warfare, and the streets, are much more random. No disrespect intended.
HowlsFury 2 years ago
An axe kick to the collar bone can cause a break in Kyokushin & K-1 tournament fights though it doesn't always happen. So don't feel confident a hammerfist strike will. One thing most people overlook is that Kyokushin trains for the street, but what most people only see is tournament clips where techniques are modified or eliminated for competitor safety. Don't mistake what you see on YouTube clips as the be all end all of Kyokushin.
dokokai 2 years ago
Yeah, tournaments in Kyokushin are just like, whos spirit is stronger. Who can keep moving forward longer even though it hurts. But in real life one punch the the face bare knuckle by Kyokushin you will be quite done, or at least not looking for more from that person anytime soon. Does Kyokushin train by Kata as well??? I dont know, I never saw it before, but im Shotokan as far as my Karate goes.
GuamKomudo 2 years ago
Yes Kyokushin trains with Kata. A lot of the same ones from both Shotokan & Goju (Taikyoku 1-3, Pinan 1-5, Yantsu, Tsuki no Kata, Kanku, Sushiho, Sanchin, Gekisai Dai and Sho, Tensho, Saiha, Seienchin, Seipai. Garyu (which was created by Oyama while developing Kyokushin in the early days). The biggest focus of Kyokushin though are the Kihon (basics) & the full contact bare knuckle (no equipment) Kumite.
dokokai 2 years ago
Thats cool, alot of Karate is very basic anyway, thats why it works very nicely. Unless you go to like some point sparring lame school... I like Karate, but I like to learn all styles of every country. I like to mix stuff I learn with my Karate. One thing im trying to stop, comming from Shotokan, I put EVERYTHING into each attack, that is bad, and VS people that are good defenders, it makes you tired and leaves you open alot... =O But theres no punch like Karate punch =D
GuamKomudo 2 years ago
@dokokai
i gotta say, i've been watching Fight Quest, on Discovery channel with Jimmy and Dough. really, beautiful sport!
today I've been out here in Holland for eventually Kajukenbo schools.. without any luck:(
probably Holland doesn't know the sport:( such an pity!
friendly greet,
killaruna34 1 year ago
@dokokai Yeah buddy, Kyokushin is great, but is not the same thing to be kicked in the groin, or gougged in the eyes than receive mawashis to the body or the legs. There´s a reason why Kyokushin´s Irikumi as full contact as it is, doesn´t allow fists to the face or skull . Osu
chimibert 1 year ago
@chimibert We train for street self defense using punching to the head but since we don't use protective equipment we don't make contact. What you see here on youtube is almost always tournaments & training for them. It is a modified version of what we actually do. People make the mistake in assuming Kyokushin does not train for the face. The older Dojos & Instructors (myself included) DO train for street self defense. No one can condition the groin so we train to avoid getting hit there~
dokokai 1 year ago
@dokokai I am reading your response right now, and in essence I agree a hundred percent with you. Besides, is really hard to actually reach for the groin, eyes or neck, those are well protected both technically and instinctively by any person you may encounter with.
chimibert 1 year ago
@chimibert ~The purpose of full contact fighting & conditioning the body for it is that IF you miss a block, you will not be afraid to be hit or completely freeze up & shut down when you get hit. It is not to strictly absorb as much punishment as possible although we can withstand a lot more than most people due to conditioning. With the fear of getting hit eliminated, we are free to focus on protecting the face/head & groin.Don't get hung up on what you see from only watching Kyokushin tourneys
dokokai 1 year ago
@dokokai Brother, I am a long time practicioner of both goju and American kenpo. The first was an inspiration for Shihan Oyama, in the sense that we practice Irikumi go and Hojo Hundo, wich are a full contact practices. Kenpo Karate is also very tough, and I am agree with you in every respect. But self defense main targets are parts that you just can´t train to be tough, as the groin, the neck and the eyes. All of them will shut any attacker out regerdless of size.
chimibert 1 year ago
Yeah... The human body can withstand Kyokushin TOURNAMENT strikes, like punches to the chest and body, and kicks to the legs. But martial arts like Kajukenbo and Lua are not meant for tournaments, they're meant for getting people off you. The combo at the end of this video is not gonna get someone off you, it's just a demo, but look at Lua. Strikes to the groin,neck, eyes.Grappling locks,finger breaks and even biting the other persons throat and ears is part of it.THAT will get someone off you
GuamKomudo 1 year ago
@GuamKomudo You fail to realize that is exactly what Kyokushin was created to do. Street defense to get someone off you. Kyokushin is only modified for tournaments originally as a way to spread the art when it was only about a decade or so old. Nowadays too many Kyokushin Dojos focus on too much tournament training only & the street defense aspect is being lost by younger instructors. But in the older Dojos we still train the old way & ignore much or all of the tournament training.
dokokai 1 year ago
So what are you saying? That the human body can withstand all your strikes and they don't work??? =P
Kyokushin is a very good martial art, and you probably know that the average human is not as prepared to take a beating the like the kyokushin body is... I would say that a solid Kyokushin Karate punch to the body on a normal person would give you enough time to get away from the person... Kajukenbo is part Karate as wel las boxing and other fighting arts combined, but it's 100% street
GuamKomudo 1 year ago
@GuamKomudo So when exactly did you miss the part where I said Kyokushin is for street defense and only the newer Dojo's have become misguided in focusing on the tournament training?
dokokai 1 year ago
@GuamKomudo Also I did not say the body can withstand ALL the strikes. I said that the human body is more resilient than this Kajukenbo video demonstrates. Attackers aren't going to be so co-operative & wait to be hit as this video implies they will.
dokokai 1 year ago
It's just a demo video to make people interested... I could say the same about Kyokushin breaking ice... You can smash through 9 blocks of ice, yet no one sits there with their head down waiting for you to chop their head. It's just a demo thing, not the most effective Kajukenbo, just for show to make others think it's cool and try it.
GuamKomudo 1 year ago
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MrByaeger 11 months ago 4
@MrByaeger Thank you for clarifying that to them, many just don't understand the diference..
KuriSakamoto 11 months ago
@MrByaeger As I have already said & explained to several others here, Kyokushin modifies the techniques so that tournaments can be possible. Real Kyokushin Dojos (as I have trained in & teach) concern themselves with street techniques & ignore the tournament methods. The purpose body condtioning is to eliminate the fear of getting hit (which is the problem most people have) & also if a strike to the body comes through, it's not as incapacitating. But most street fights are face/head punches.
dokokai 10 months ago
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MrByaeger 10 months ago
@MrByaeger No apology necessary but I do appreciate the thought, thanks. I can understand people(your students as well as many others) not wanting to put themselves through the type of training Kyokushin requires. It's not for everyone & I have seen many people start & quit at all levels in my now 29yrs of training & teaching. The dropout rate has always been about 90% for Kyokushin but for those who stick with it,there is a higher level of skill & confidence they reach than most anywhere else.~
dokokai 10 months ago