@MultiW350i When the heroes of the Luftwaffe destroyed Warsaw in Sept 1939, they started the fashion for city bombing r? While Dresden was being bombed, V2 rockets were still falling indiscriminately on London, rockets still at that time being made in Mittelbau-Dora by slave labourers, 20,000 of whom were hung, shot, beaten or starve to death in the process? Wollt ihr den totalen Krieg? Wollt ihr ihn, wenn nötig, totaler und radikaler, als wir ihn uns heute überhaupt erst vorstellen können?
@eddie What about the over 3 Million German civilians, murdered by you Allied pigs after the war was over?
What about the 1 Million children and women, burnt to ashes alive by your sick mad psychopath killer Churchill?
While Churchill's Allied soldiers were burning little children with a grin on their face, Allied dictator Stalin murdered 39 Million innocents in Allied concentration camps like Vorkuta, Murmansk, Astrakhan, Rostov-on-Don, Sverdlovsk and other Allied death camps.
@eddie123e Your warcriminal pig Arthur Harris has invented bombing civilians in 1920.
Warsaw was many years later, and it was a military city., as the Polish army had retreated to Warsaw.
Hitler asked the Polish army to surrender, they refused, so Warsaw was taken by force. That's war.
The Germans had offered peace to Churchill over 20 times in 1939 and 1940. But this insane massmurderer Churchill wanted to set the whole world on fire.
The people who could have stopped the bombing of Dresden and the needless deaths of hundreds of thousands of Germans and Allies were German generals who knew the war was over but kept on fighting. There was no bombing after the surrender and the surrender should have happened many months earlier. Stalingrad and the invasions at Normandy and Italy made defeat inevitable - the Generals knew it but still refused to give up - that's not bravery - that's stupidity and Dresdeners paid the price.
@eddie123e Yes hitlers generals were hard core criminals. Slaughtering german civilians didnt really effect them. The air campaigns against the german cities didnt really effect the outcome of the war It was a waste of allied soldiers and materiel. They should have concentrated on railways etc. During the Vietnam war the large scale air campains against north vietnamese cities didnt really effect the outcome of the war either. I understand you hate as you lived through the war though
@Siegthor Concentrating on railways is pointless - destroying them with the then bombing aiming technology was impossible and in any event, they are easy to repair if you happen by chance to hit one. ITs people who fight and people who wage wars - its people who make bombs and bombers and that makes them legitimate targets. I hate not one single German - Lothar Goebbels was a personal friend and I lived with a German family for many years. I simply accept the reality that was Germany in WW2
@eddie123e Exacly, concentrating on railway is pointless -.
that is why sick massmurderer Churchill targeted women, children, babies, hospitals and Red-Cross stations.
Churchill started the bombing war on Germany on 11th May 1940, the very same night he became fascist leader of Britain (he was not elected). This sick pervert warcriminal could not wait to kill children.
The Germans could do nothing to stop the Allied war machine. Churchill and Roosevelt wanted the extermination of the German people. Type in Google: MORGENTHAU PLAN.
Germany had made over 20 peace offers to Churchill already in 1939. The war could have stopped within weeks - but the Allies wanted world war.
The only culprits of this terrible war were:
1. Dicator Stalin
2. Warcriminal Roosevelt
3. The sick mad killer Churchill, who is the main culprit of BOTH world wars.
The war was certainly horrible - you got that right and yes, the gas chambers no longer operated because the SS wanted the evidence destroyed bu the killing went on. I lived in the Uk at hat time and the V2 rockets were still falling on the south of England.- rockets that were still being made in Mittelbau-Dora - chekc it out! The people were still dying in Belsen and many other camps - indeed, because of German brutality, they carried on dying for months after the war..
@eddie123e Mittelbau-Dora was starved by the Allies: Allied warcriminals systematically bombed the railway for German food-supply , which caused the Jews to starve. Later on the "innocent" Allies would make up the "lampshade" story, one of countless lies., to blackmail the Germans to pay Trillions.
The "gas-chamber" story on German soil is a lie - nobody was ever gassed on German soil,. ALL Jews starved and died of Typhus.
@eddie123e The only places were children and women on German soil were gassed, were the Dresden cellars, where innocent children were asphyxiated and poisoned by warcriminal Winston Churchill.
Churchill and his Allies killed over 1 Million innocents in Dresden, Tokyo, Hamburg, Nagasaki, Sweenemunde, Hiroshima a.o. Axis cities.
This hideous warcriminal pig should have been tried and hanged at Nuremberg 1946.
Be assured that unlike you, I am neither sick nor illegitimate. I did not learn history from the vomit and the vomiters who infest site likes this. I lived through WW2 and walked among the death pits in Bergen Belsen in June 1945. I have a close connection with the Goebbels family in that Lothar Goebbles, a nephew of Dr J was a personal friend while he was a student at Bonn University. I know yu cant help being a freak but you could at least try to broadcast your stupidity so widely.
Right up to the time of liberation, the herioes of the third reich were still killing innocent people in the death camps. The Dresdeners were not innocent civilians - they were active and willing participants in the war - they supplied men and materials for the front. Dresdeners turned out en masse whenever their beloved Fuehrer visited the city - they couldn't raise their hands high enough or scream 'Sieg Heil' loud enough. War is terrible - which is a very good reason for not starting one.
Poison Gas was still being produced in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden right up to the bombing. Are we not supposed to mention that Dresdens anti-aircraft guns were removed by German generals to protect themselves against the Russians. Are we not supposed to mention that? The truth is not negotiable.
Those who portray Dresden as a war cime carried out by the cowards of the USAAF and RAF might consider that it was the heroes of the Luftwaffe that introduced the tactic of city bombing when these kind heroes used their tactic of 'friendly bombing' destroyed Warsaw in Sept 1939 killing ten times more people than were killed Dresden. You sow the wind. You reap the whirlwind.
@eddie123e the fact that the nazis murdered women children doesnt make the slaughter of german civilians less a crime. Lol it didnt even serve any real military purpose.
@Siegthor Yes. It did serve a very real military purpose. It stopped the gas production in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden - it took pressure of the Red Army - it gave comfort to the Londoners who were still having rockets falling on them and it sent a very clear message to the German generals that in refusing to surrender in a war they knew they could not win, they were causing hundreds of thousands of Allied and civilian deaths. It also comforted the starving millions in the death camps.
@eddie123e True - that's what the warcriminals Churchill and Harris told her crews: To bomb "gas factories".
Today we know, these "gas factories" never existed, and the British pilots did not know they were systematically exterminating German children, babies and mothers with PHOSPHOROUS, turning 250 000 innocents into human torches. Biggest massacre in human history.
Churchill had lied to his own people - just like he lied to the whole world.
@Elberiver11 The biggest massacre in the Human History was the sack of Baghdad in 12th century, with 2 000 000 Arabs killed by Hulagu, a Mongol Chieftain.
Yes, Dresden, it was with its ca. 250 000 deaths one of the quickest and most effective slaughters of civilian population. The Western Allied were the true masters in this.
Interesting that the Nazi sympathisers who portray Dresden was a war crime dont mention the fact that while Dresden was being bombed, V2 rockets were still falling indiscriminately on London, rockets made in Mittelbau-Dora by slave labourers, 20,000 of whom were shot, hung, beaten or starved to death in the process. It is very clear that Dr Goebbels spirit lives on. "Wollt ihr den totalen Kreig? Wollt ihr ihn totaler und radikaler, als wir ihn uns heute überhaupt erst vorstellen können?
What kind propaganda it is ? German Nazi did much more disaster in whole Europe like one air raid RAF pilot over the Dresden.Start from Poland to Russia and from Dunkierq to London. Germany Lufftwafe bombing Warsaw.Moscow,Kiev, Minsk,Stalingrad, and hundred other citys turns all of them to flat, killing hundreds thousends people. Luftwaffe with black cross and swastika on the wings it was flying death over the Europe from 1938-1945
It is too bad Hitler didn't take Russia and all of this could have been avoided and Germany would have been the Empire it deserved to be, and then all of these victims would be cheering their leader like they did during the good times, instead of experiencing this horrible bombing. Germany gambled and this is the result of the loss. The British were no better than the Nazi's after the bombing of Dresden. Sad story and heart breaking.
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
@Elberiver11 SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
NEVER FORGET! Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more
@wavepsychic The same theroy (German WW1) of shooting a man in the stomach not to kill but to mortally wound and use up valuable resource and people to aid him...
@Elberiver11 Roosevelt wanted war in Europe; the American public didn't. However the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor and that gave Roosevelt the justification to wage war on Japan. Germany is allied to Japan and declared war on us which made it okay for us to attack them.
I don't think it was right to have engaged in terror-bombing against the Germans, but the Germans engaged in terror-bombing against the British. Hitler did tell the Luftwaffe to break the British will. That's terror-bombing
@KJLesnick No,you are wrong. Hitler at first forbade the Luftwaffe to bomb back. Britains started bombing German cities, it took almost a year until Germany bombed back.
Hitler had made enough peace offers to Britain, over 20 peace offers, but the British kept bombing. Hitler's deputy HESS even flew to Britain to bring peace.
The peace bringer was arrested, and Britain dragged the USA into war, thus turning it into world war. Official history is fraud - written by the perpetrator.
@KJLesnick Germans did NOT use terror-bombing, but strategic bombing, always in connection with ground troops or as retaliation.
Coventry was centre of the British war machine, Nr. 1 primary military target. London docks were the aim, not the housing areas. But America and Britain even passed a law which said that housing areas were the aim, not military sites.
Allies killed 1 Million children and women in Axis cities. This is called "Democracy". It prolonged the war.
@KJLesnick Germany did NOT declare war on you. Read about the Lend-Lease Act, which put the USA into state of war on Germany on March 11 1941.
Roosevelt ordered to attack German ships in Summer 1941 , this was an official order. America has started countless wars on countries who did less than that, e.g. the fake "Gulf of Tonkin" incident, which was a lie by _US-president Johnson to start war on Japan.
Germans ships did not shoot back, until half a year later in Dec. 1941.
@KJLesnick you americans should stop to insult the germans and accusing them, making them look like criminals.
have a look at who really started both world wars, and ask yourself why we speak English, and not German.
And notice, the same two countries that started war on Germany in 1914/1917 and in 1939/1941, are the same two countries that bomb Iraq, Libya, Pakistan and many other countries today.
@KJLesnick You compare the few broken streets in London to the Hell-fire in Dresden? In Dresden you can walk over 12 squares miles, without seeing a single old house.
I recommend you watch the newsreels of London 1945, completely untouched streets like Picadilldy Circus or Regent Str in Downtown London, untouched houses, people dancing, fun, shops open, buses running. In Dresden, there *were* no streets and no humansover 12 squares miles: A death zone. And you dare compare that?
@Elberiver11 SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
@Elberiver11 I don't think the Treaty/Dictate of Versailles was was right. All it did was lead to another war. It was even realized by some even back in the late 19-teens that it would lead to the Germans wanting to seek revenge.
Despite your assertions as to what the US would do, Germany could not declare war as any nation couldn't declare war if they were occupied after being defeated. Still there's such a thing as being a sore winner just as there is such a thing as being a sore loser.
@KJLesnick No, you are wrong again. It was not about "seeking revenge". If was mainly about freeing millions from alien rule and from alien occupation. You insult those people by calling them "sore losers". Do you insult the graves of the Jews as "sore losers", too? They certainly were losers. So is that something to mock about?
In any case its amazing how little people know about the Versailles dictate. It caused invasions, death and war. Long time before Hitler was even known.
@KJLesnick Exactly, Germany could not start war to free their countymen, because they were occupied, disarmed and depleted.
But still, you are distracting because you seem to hate to face the truth:
What would any nation do, if they were occupied by alien tanks invading? Would they want to throw those alien aggressors of their land? And what if a man came along who would promise to do that, would they cheer him and vote for him?
@KJLesnick The main thing you are trying to distract from: How is a war in Europe America's business anyway? America had no right to change Germany's borders, thus forcing millions under the yoke of Alien tyranny.
I know you dont like the issue. But Americans would start war far sooner than Germany did, if their country was occupied by hostile neighbouring states. The reason why this is inconceivable to you is because America HAS no hostile invading neighbours.
Have you guys ever heard of General Giulio Douhet? General Douhet wrote a book in 1921 called Command of the Air. It advocated using bombers to fly over cities and drop poison gas, explosives, and incendiaries as a means to destroy enemy industry and cause mass murder to terrorize the population to the point that they would either beg their government for surrender or overthrow it with a government willing to do so.
Effectively he wanted to undo all the progress the Geneva Conventions made.
No, Germany started WW2 when it invaded Poland which was an ally of England. Hitler pushed things quite a lot and the British and French let them get away with it. You can only push things far before they snap-back against you. In 1941 the Germans launched massive bombing campaigns on Britain to destroy their war-making capability and crush their morale.
Just as the Luftwaffe was inspired by Giulio Douhet's ideas regarding terror bombing, so was the RAF.
@KJLesnick Poland had occupied German land, holding 2.1 Million Germans captive. This is what started war. Germany did not "declare world war" as you claim.
Its the Allies who try to lay the blame on the Germans. So you are trying that too? lol
We all know that Allied history is fake. I have neither the time, nor the mind to list all the Allied lies and educate brainwashed people. Whoever wants to believe Hollywood-TV show fake history, is welcome to do so.
@Elberiver11 C'mon, you don't actually believe that? Hitler had his men disguise as Polish soldiers and attack Germany in order to paint the Polish as being an enemy as to justify war.
@KJLesnick Its funny you always try to silence about what lead to this war.
History is not a matter of belief, dude, we are not in a church here.
Poland had invaded German land in 1919 and held 2.1 Million Germans captive. French and Czechs did the same. Would the USA tolerate Mexican tanks invading Texas or California and their fellow countrymen to be put under alien rule?
America would never tolerate that for a single day. But its funny you expect the Germans to.
@KJLesnick You probably mean the "Dictate" of Versailles. According to American law or British law its not a treaty. The signature was extorted, which is something like "force to consent".
Most Americans dont know anything about the consequences of Versailles. They think it was a "humilitation" only.
It meant enslavement, terror and alien rule for millions of people, military invasions and occupation for millions of peoplem, starvation, civil war and destruction of families.
@KJLesnick PS I actually refer to the consequences of Versailles, the whole years through the 1920ies and 30ies. Rathern than Versailles itself. Most people dont know anything about that.
If someone invaded the USA or England with tanks and 100 000 soldiers, trying to occupy these countries and force millions under the invader's rule, the USA and England would immediately start war.
But exactly this happened to the Germans in the 1920ies, and nobody did bat an eyelid.
The Germans did not tolerate Alien invaders to have millions of Germans occupied. Its amazing how little you know about history.
What you beliefe to be "Poland" in the interwar period, was not the land of Poles but an artificially created country whose Population was not Poles, but containing millions of non-Poles: 2.1 Million Germans, 6 Mio. Ukrainians and others.
None of these people were asked whether they wanted to live under Polish tyranny. They were forced under alien rule.
@KJLesnick The "disguise" thing you mention has nothing to do with the millions of German civilians, enslaved under alien rule.
Everybody knows today, that the Dictate of Versailles was the reason for WW II. It placed millions of people under alien tyranny, tore families apart and caused desaster.
When you forbid democratic elections for millions of people, it's not democracy.
You should research the situation in Europe between 1919 - 1933. A war does not come out of the blue.
Wurzburg and Pforzheim seemed almost to be continuations of Dresden. They were largely destroyed because the allied forces had run out of large targets of serious importance and were looking for built up areas that they could smash and burn.
Admittedly Wurzburg had some supply depots that were destroyed, whether Pforzheim really did have a decentralized industrial base rigged through the city, no clue but it reeked of a pretext.
Under Eisenhower's orders POW's were starved to death as a deliberate policy even when sufficient food was available. Since the policies going on at the camps were against the Geneva Convention, Eisenhower decided to redesignate the POW's as Disarmed Enemy Forces (DEF); then claimed the Geneva Conventions didn't apply.
This bears an eerie similarity to the way Bush (and now Obama) labeled people Enemy Combatants to avoid following the Geneva Convention in the same fashion.
General Patton actually released his prisoners after VE Day even though the DEF camps were very much in operation. Eisenhower was furious about it and Eisenhower ordered him to stop though it would seem Patton just ignored the order. Admittedly Patton had some fascist leanings which might have been why he did what he did.
I think both Fascism and Communism are the greatest plagues to ever affect the modern world. I don't think it's right to mistreat POW's either.
The USAAF usually bombed by day and generally preferred to hit specific industrial targets, and transportation systems such as railways and ship-yards. Dresden seemed to be more of an exception than the rule.
The RAF generally bombed at night. Targets were either of cultural value (i.e. Nikolaiarche in Hamburg) or stuff that would just burn. Bombs were used to blast the roofs off, and firebombs to set the timber structures ablaze. The goal was to maximize civilian fatalities.
If Dresden was an exception, what was Würzburg then? Pforzheim? Sweenemunde?
In Sweenemunde, the US-warcriminals attacked a city overcrowded with women and children refugees. The survivors of this Allied massmurder reported how they walked over mounds of corpses, torn-off children's heads , arms, legs.
So why is Sweenemunde never mentioned? 20 000 were murdered here by Americans and British, so why does Allied-written history only mention Coventry with some 500 deaths?
Göbbels was a little orphan-boy comapare to British chief-propagandist SEFTON DELMER.
Sefton Delmer invented "black propaganda" and used it for the British 1941 - 1945. "Black Propaganda" works with lies, deception, fraud, falsehood and is the most evil form of Propaganda ever used by a nation.
The aim was to discredit Germany and to blacken and foul her name by any means, including lies. Allied-written history is the continuaton of Delmer's "black propaganda".
A terrible thing to have to live through (or die through). But this should be a lesson to all leaders in the world not to start a war - because you never know how far it will drag you down into hell. Hitler promised the German people a heaven lasting 1,000 years, what they really got was another matter.
@Stoory If the British and their fine French friends had not enslaved millions of Germans under alien rule in Versailles 1919 and brought mass-poverty, civil war, state bankrupcy and alien invasions over Germany in the 1920ies, then there wouldn't even have been any Hitler.
It's funny how the British and Americans still use "helping Poland" as a pretext for their the destruction of Germany, when in truth it was them who created the Polish-German conflict in Versailles 1919.
@Stoory PS: Churchill used the same "'1000 years" metaphors. Nothing special. When leaders try to agitate, they always promise "broad, sunlit uplands" and stuff.
Only difference: Churchill whipped up anti-german hate in England and FEAR, although Germany never had any hostility towards England - and Churchill knew that.
Hitler, however, might be reproached for all sorts of things, but he never whipped up hate against the English.
Bombing Dresden was fully justified by an enemy which had already destroyed dozens of cities - murdered millions in death, slave labourer and concentration camps - an enemy still engaged in making poison gas in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden and still launching V2 rockets against London - rockets still being made in Mittlebau-Dora by slaves, 20,000 of whom were hung, shot, beaten or starved to death - how else were we stop this murdering regime which was refusing to end an unwinnable war?
Is it not astonishing how Goebbels words live on.It was he who invented the term 'revenge weapons' and he was the first to claim 250,000 dead in Dresden. When the Allies bombed Germany, that was 'terror bombing' by RAF cowards and when the Luftwaffe destroyed Warsaw in 1929 killing 240,000 in 1939 that was the heroes of the Luftwaffe. Goebbels would be very proud of some of the freaks who post here.
@eddie123e You little dumb dwarf with your silly Göbbels-nonsense. lol Why dont you make up something new? We have heard it all before.
Let's talk about something new: The British propaganda-expert Sefton Delmer, who worked for the British Political Warfare Executive (PWE) to spread anti-German hate propaganda.
Sefton Delmer was one of Britain's de-facto Propaganda ministers.
@eddie123e Göbbels was a little orphan-boy comapare to British chief-propagandist SEFTON DELMER.
Sefton Delmer invented "black propaganda" and used it for the British 1941 - 1945. "Black Propaganda" works with lies, deception, fraud, falsehood and is the most evil form of Propaganda ever used by a nation.
The aim was to discredit Germany and to blacken and foul her name by any means, including lies.
You, Eddie, carry on the tradition of British "black propaganda".
@Elberiver11 Prior to Dresden, Great Britain had undergone massive bombing raids on all her major cities whether they were a base for munitions or not. Judging Dresden by modern day standards is wrong, it has to be judged by the time in which World War 2 took place, by the standards of the time. London, Coventry, Plymouth, Bristol etc were all beautiful cities and tens of thousands of innocent civilians died due to the German Luftwaffe fire bombs, V1 flying bombs and V2 rockets.
@RedGoblinus LOL and where did the "massive"" bombing come from?
The British bombed Germany, so the Germans bombed you back. Learn history, little dummy. lol
What you call "massive", was a petty little joke compared to the atrocities your warcriminal grandfather unleashed on millions of civilians. How dare you compare London, a city almost untouched by war, to the Dresden Holocaust in which your Grandfather wiped a whole city off the map over 12 square miles?
@damislav Yes, i have learned this nonsense at school, too.
I recommend you take a good encyclopedia or a scientific book, rather than watching your silly Hollywood-.TV shows. Then you will find out thaBritish Empire, USA and France all started war on Germany. Not the other way round.
Why should the winner blame himself? Nobody would ever do that.
@Elberiver11 London was not "a city almost untouched by war" as you claim. During the 'blitz', the city of London was bombed by the Luftwaffe for 76 consecutive nights and more than one million London houses were destroyed or damaged.
@Elberiver11 Go to the central areas of any major British city and you'll find that most of the buildings are post World War 2. That's because the German Luftwaffe bombed the old buildings out during the blitzkrieg of 1940/41. This is especially true of Plymouth in South West England. The only big towns that were spared were Oxford and Blackpool because Adolf Hitler wanted Oxford as the new English capital and Blackpool as a Third Reich pleasure resort had he conquered England.
@Elberiver11 Just defending Nazi Germany is telling that you are some fascist.Second Germans broke Treaty of Versaille,they conquer almost all Europe,they attack Poland and holocaust happen,they attack Soviet Russia,install Croatia as puppet country(100 000 people killed),Operation Himmler was made for attacking Poland. What do you think that Allied soldiers should do.Germans were not surrendering.
@damislav LOL me, defending the Nazis? I dont even talk abvout the Nazis. Its rather you, insulting the German nation and trying to justify Allied warcrimes and Bombing-Holocausts.
What the Allied soldiers should have done? They should have gone home and end the war. Germany had made over 20 peace offers to the Allies.
Read "The Hess-deception" by British historian Martin Allen, Harper-Collins, London /England.
The quote from Don Nielsen (who was then a B-17 aircraft-commander -- I made a mistake earlier about that, sorry) does raise the question as to how many pilots (at least US) were mislead about the nature of their mission.
Interestingly there were many pilots who had horrible nightmares and believed they'd burn in hell for what they did. There's no such thing as hell, but it's nice to know that there were some who felt remorse for what they did...
Dit is zeker niet normaal meer,maar zolang er mensen zijn op deze mooie planeet, ben ik bang dat dit zeker niet de laatste keer zal zijn dat we elkaar afmaken,af en toe denk ik wel is,we verdienen het niet om op deze aarde rond te mogen lopen,we vernietegen toch alles wat hier leeft.
@MrCrunkwear who started the war, who killed millions in death camps & experimented on thousands of children and adults in the most vile and horrific fashion
who began civillian bombing, who was obsessed with world domination and the illimination of all non approved races
How dare you make such a twisted comment. All war is vile, but the difference was the allies sole aim was to end the war not start one unlike the Germans & Japanese
@trackend Governments start wars, not women and children. There is no excuse for carnages like this.
But Britain needs these excuses in order to conceal the Allied war crimes and crimes against the humanity.
As much as we agree that the Nazi goverment was evil and committed crimes, it is not any excuse to make firebombing acceptable. Each crime is unique and to be judged separately regardless some other. The Dresden raid by the RAF and USAAC is a war crime.
How many wars did the U.S. begin after the ww2? How many foreign territories did it invade?
Besides, Britain and the U.S. and their establishments started to prepare Germany and Russia for destruction and war already in 1890s when it appeared that Germany challenged Anglo-Saxon world economically and would have joined its pools of resources with Russia. That lead to the "Entente" and to the plans how to chop powers into pieces in the continent one after another.
@trackend LOL who started the war? You Britishers started the war between Poland and Germany in Versailles 1919, it was you who actually created the conflict. You enslaved over 2.0 Million Germans under Alien rule and you made Polish tanks invade Germany in 1919. The Germans logically took the land back that YOU had stolen.
And what about the Allied death camps? And what about British atrocities? Remember, you Britishers exterminated the Red Indians - first Holocaust in history.
This was one of the most tragic attacks of WW 2 on civilian Populace. There were no Men there only Women and Children and Senirors!! But it was Wart and Hitler attacked Coventry England with V 2 Rockets! This was the revenge!
Yes, yes we're very impressed with your views on total war. The problem is that under that mentality anything is acceptable -- even bayonetting pregnant women (which the Japanese did). Are you saying that the Allies should have bayonetted pregnant women too?
Because that's the direction your argument flows.
Yup, during Dresden, the RAF were sent in to smash and torch a city and kill civilians. That was the entire objective -- kill so many people that it would destroy German morale and cause whoever lived to flee in terror with the aim of blocking roads which the German troops were approaching through to keep them from moving eastward.
Apparently all you have to do is win the war and all the wrongdoing becomes okay.
Next time, though, don't plan for and start the war, don't build gas chambers, don't kill six million Jews, don't stand with Nazis, and don't wage war as your predecessors did against civilians.
@hwhope321 I hope you that you are well aware that every single thing you point out is arguable. Furtheremore, had Weakileaks existed at the time the war took place we might have known a very different version of history. Your comment simply vents an unbearable display of ignorance. I "hwhope" you are aware of that too as you base your stance on simple flimsy conventional and , thank heavens now, easily breakable arguments.
11:20 "NO WAY DID WE GO DOWN AND DO ANY STRAFING", of course not.
You have been highly moral people and never harmed a single child or mother, never set fire onto a whole fucking city, and never threw any children into a fucking FIRESTORM.
TERRORISTS & MURDERERS . You dirty people should all have been tried and hanged for warcrimes and atrocities on innocent civilians.
It's so disgusting to hear all those American and British liars trying to whitewash their Phosporous-Holocaust.
Look at 10:25 "Many Dresdners BELIEVED they had seen strafers".
"There is no evidence in the Allies' records". Well, of course not. Why should they write down how they systematically exterminated people, either by fire or machingunning the survivors?
USA and Britain lied about lampshades, lied about the "soap"-story, lied about KATYN and lied about so many other things, are trustworthy people.
And the thousands of Dresdners who saw it with their own eyes, are all nutters of course.
Could it be possible that Soviet fighters did the strafing as by this time the Soviet front lines were ever closer to Eastern Germany and Dresden itself?
Eye witnesses along with some historians claim that P-51s escort fighters from the 20th FG strafed surviving fire victims; this contradicts the fact that the 20th FG accompanied bomber groups that went off course and bombed Prague instead of Dresden that day.
Strafing activities are neither mention on German nor American records.
TheMrPangloss is a disgusting troll.
RosyCrucifier 2 days ago
for the american woman how had lost her husband sorry but in dresden were 25000 dead people who didn`t earned this shit....
MultiW350i 3 days ago
@MultiW350i When the heroes of the Luftwaffe destroyed Warsaw in Sept 1939, they started the fashion for city bombing r? While Dresden was being bombed, V2 rockets were still falling indiscriminately on London, rockets still at that time being made in Mittelbau-Dora by slave labourers, 20,000 of whom were hung, shot, beaten or starve to death in the process? Wollt ihr den totalen Krieg? Wollt ihr ihn, wenn nötig, totaler und radikaler, als wir ihn uns heute überhaupt erst vorstellen können?
eddie123e 3 days ago
@eddie123e shut your face, you British slave-trading bastard.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e
Dora-Mittelbau = 20 000 starved (Allied guilt)
YALTA-Holocaust = over 3.7 German children, women, elderly and POW's starved (Allied guilt)
Hiroshima, Dresden, Axis cities = ovver 1 Million burned alive by your warcriminal killers Churchill and Roosevelt.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie What about the over 3 Million German civilians, murdered by you Allied pigs after the war was over?
What about the 1 Million children and women, burnt to ashes alive by your sick mad psychopath killer Churchill?
While Churchill's Allied soldiers were burning little children with a grin on their face, Allied dictator Stalin murdered 39 Million innocents in Allied concentration camps like Vorkuta, Murmansk, Astrakhan, Rostov-on-Don, Sverdlovsk and other Allied death camps.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e Your warcriminal pig Arthur Harris has invented bombing civilians in 1920.
Warsaw was many years later, and it was a military city., as the Polish army had retreated to Warsaw.
Hitler asked the Polish army to surrender, they refused, so Warsaw was taken by force. That's war.
The Germans had offered peace to Churchill over 20 times in 1939 and 1940. But this insane massmurderer Churchill wanted to set the whole world on fire.
And so he did.
Elberiver11 19 hours ago
TheMrPangloss Neo Nazi Shit Stain on YT
MissyPANGLOSS 3 days ago
WELL SAID ED
NaziBoyPangloss 4 days ago
@eddie123e excuse me - but you are totaly brainwashed - you are a very poor man ...
limbodance 4 days ago
@limbodance Eddie is a zionist and a mad psychopath
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
The people who could have stopped the bombing of Dresden and the needless deaths of hundreds of thousands of Germans and Allies were German generals who knew the war was over but kept on fighting. There was no bombing after the surrender and the surrender should have happened many months earlier. Stalingrad and the invasions at Normandy and Italy made defeat inevitable - the Generals knew it but still refused to give up - that's not bravery - that's stupidity and Dresdeners paid the price.
eddie123e 5 days ago
@eddie123e Yes hitlers generals were hard core criminals. Slaughtering german civilians didnt really effect them. The air campaigns against the german cities didnt really effect the outcome of the war It was a waste of allied soldiers and materiel. They should have concentrated on railways etc. During the Vietnam war the large scale air campains against north vietnamese cities didnt really effect the outcome of the war either. I understand you hate as you lived through the war though
Siegthor 4 days ago
@Siegthor Concentrating on railways is pointless - destroying them with the then bombing aiming technology was impossible and in any event, they are easy to repair if you happen by chance to hit one. ITs people who fight and people who wage wars - its people who make bombs and bombers and that makes them legitimate targets. I hate not one single German - Lothar Goebbels was a personal friend and I lived with a German family for many years. I simply accept the reality that was Germany in WW2
eddie123e 4 days ago
@eddie123e Exacly, concentrating on railway is pointless -.
that is why sick massmurderer Churchill targeted women, children, babies, hospitals and Red-Cross stations.
Churchill started the bombing war on Germany on 11th May 1940, the very same night he became fascist leader of Britain (he was not elected). This sick pervert warcriminal could not wait to kill children.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e Of course you don't hate us, why should you?
But what if we hate - YOU?
You abominable little dwarf.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@Siegthor halt die Fresse
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e
The Germans could do nothing to stop the Allied war machine. Churchill and Roosevelt wanted the extermination of the German people. Type in Google: MORGENTHAU PLAN.
Germany had made over 20 peace offers to Churchill already in 1939. The war could have stopped within weeks - but the Allies wanted world war.
The only culprits of this terrible war were:
1. Dicator Stalin
2. Warcriminal Roosevelt
3. The sick mad killer Churchill, who is the main culprit of BOTH world wars.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
The war was certainly horrible - you got that right and yes, the gas chambers no longer operated because the SS wanted the evidence destroyed bu the killing went on. I lived in the Uk at hat time and the V2 rockets were still falling on the south of England.- rockets that were still being made in Mittelbau-Dora - chekc it out! The people were still dying in Belsen and many other camps - indeed, because of German brutality, they carried on dying for months after the war..
eddie123e 5 days ago
@eddie123e Mittelbau-Dora was starved by the Allies: Allied warcriminals systematically bombed the railway for German food-supply , which caused the Jews to starve. Later on the "innocent" Allies would make up the "lampshade" story, one of countless lies., to blackmail the Germans to pay Trillions.
The "gas-chamber" story on German soil is a lie - nobody was ever gassed on German soil,. ALL Jews starved and died of Typhus.
100 percent Allied guilt - not German guilt.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e The only places were children and women on German soil were gassed, were the Dresden cellars, where innocent children were asphyxiated and poisoned by warcriminal Winston Churchill.
Churchill and his Allies killed over 1 Million innocents in Dresden, Tokyo, Hamburg, Nagasaki, Sweenemunde, Hiroshima a.o. Axis cities.
This hideous warcriminal pig should have been tried and hanged at Nuremberg 1946.
Elberiver11 19 hours ago
Be assured that unlike you, I am neither sick nor illegitimate. I did not learn history from the vomit and the vomiters who infest site likes this. I lived through WW2 and walked among the death pits in Bergen Belsen in June 1945. I have a close connection with the Goebbels family in that Lothar Goebbles, a nephew of Dr J was a personal friend while he was a student at Bonn University. I know yu cant help being a freak but you could at least try to broadcast your stupidity so widely.
eddie123e 5 days ago
Right up to the time of liberation, the herioes of the third reich were still killing innocent people in the death camps. The Dresdeners were not innocent civilians - they were active and willing participants in the war - they supplied men and materials for the front. Dresdeners turned out en masse whenever their beloved Fuehrer visited the city - they couldn't raise their hands high enough or scream 'Sieg Heil' loud enough. War is terrible - which is a very good reason for not starting one.
eddie123e 5 days ago
@eddie123e Sick Bastard!
georgeclowni 5 days ago
Poison Gas was still being produced in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden right up to the bombing. Are we not supposed to mention that Dresdens anti-aircraft guns were removed by German generals to protect themselves against the Russians. Are we not supposed to mention that? The truth is not negotiable.
eddie123e 5 days ago
Those who portray Dresden as a war cime carried out by the cowards of the USAAF and RAF might consider that it was the heroes of the Luftwaffe that introduced the tactic of city bombing when these kind heroes used their tactic of 'friendly bombing' destroyed Warsaw in Sept 1939 killing ten times more people than were killed Dresden. You sow the wind. You reap the whirlwind.
eddie123e 5 days ago
@eddie123e the fact that the nazis murdered women children doesnt make the slaughter of german civilians less a crime. Lol it didnt even serve any real military purpose.
Siegthor 5 days ago
@Siegthor Yes. It did serve a very real military purpose. It stopped the gas production in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden - it took pressure of the Red Army - it gave comfort to the Londoners who were still having rockets falling on them and it sent a very clear message to the German generals that in refusing to surrender in a war they knew they could not win, they were causing hundreds of thousands of Allied and civilian deaths. It also comforted the starving millions in the death camps.
eddie123e 5 days ago
@eddie123e All it did was to increase the horrors of the war
It was 3 months before the end of the war the gas chambers werent running any more
Siegthor 5 days ago
@Siegthor Auf deutschem Boden gab es keine Gaskammern.
Elberiver11 20 hours ago
@eddie123e True - that's what the warcriminals Churchill and Harris told her crews: To bomb "gas factories".
Today we know, these "gas factories" never existed, and the British pilots did not know they were systematically exterminating German children, babies and mothers with PHOSPHOROUS, turning 250 000 innocents into human torches. Biggest massacre in human history.
Churchill had lied to his own people - just like he lied to the whole world.
Elberiver11 19 hours ago
@Elberiver11 The biggest massacre in the Human History was the sack of Baghdad in 12th century, with 2 000 000 Arabs killed by Hulagu, a Mongol Chieftain.
Yes, Dresden, it was with its ca. 250 000 deaths one of the quickest and most effective slaughters of civilian population. The Western Allied were the true masters in this.
TheMrPangloss 2 hours ago
Interesting that the Nazi sympathisers who portray Dresden was a war crime dont mention the fact that while Dresden was being bombed, V2 rockets were still falling indiscriminately on London, rockets made in Mittelbau-Dora by slave labourers, 20,000 of whom were shot, hung, beaten or starved to death in the process. It is very clear that Dr Goebbels spirit lives on. "Wollt ihr den totalen Kreig? Wollt ihr ihn totaler und radikaler, als wir ihn uns heute überhaupt erst vorstellen können?
eddie123e 5 days ago
What kind propaganda it is ? German Nazi did much more disaster in whole Europe like one air raid RAF pilot over the Dresden.Start from Poland to Russia and from Dunkierq to London. Germany Lufftwafe bombing Warsaw.Moscow,Kiev, Minsk,Stalingrad, and hundred other citys turns all of them to flat, killing hundreds thousends people. Luftwaffe with black cross and swastika on the wings it was flying death over the Europe from 1938-1945
redstar205 5 days ago
you sowed the wind now reap the worlwind!.
to bomb other countries poland,france,russia,holland and most of all london and expect no bombs back is such arrogance of the nazi mentality.
kingbleah 1 week ago
the low flying planes might have been russians?
scrollandkey 1 week ago
It is too bad Hitler didn't take Russia and all of this could have been avoided and Germany would have been the Empire it deserved to be, and then all of these victims would be cheering their leader like they did during the good times, instead of experiencing this horrible bombing. Germany gambled and this is the result of the loss. The British were no better than the Nazi's after the bombing of Dresden. Sad story and heart breaking.
Mycterizian 1 week ago
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SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
MsNAZIBOMBER 1 week ago
RAF and USAAF have just cleaned and washed our earth from nazi pigs !!!
ArthurHarisBomber 2 weeks ago
@ArthurHarisBomber HATES germans.
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago
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@Elberiver11 SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
MsNAZIBOMBER 1 week ago
@ArthurHarisBomber Armer Irrer.....
lamprecchtm 2 weeks ago
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The End Of the World March 2012,the Feast of Purim, Christ returns to avenge his elect, more info google ebiblefellowship
itsovermarch2012 2 weeks ago
Dresden - The Real Holocaust The 13th February 1945 Death and hatred of the United States and England Never forget!.
The42697 3 weeks ago 2
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NEVER FORGET! Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more
FlagMrPangloss 3 weeks ago
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@The42697 SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
MsNAZIBOMBER 1 week ago
This is stupid! Why bomb it three times!? WHY? Hitler can't use that city? What's the point of all this?
wavepsychic 3 weeks ago 2
@wavepsychic The same theroy (German WW1) of shooting a man in the stomach not to kill but to mortally wound and use up valuable resource and people to aid him...
malcstag 3 weeks ago
And this is somehow not as bad as the Holocaust? I'd rather be in a concentration camp!
wavepsychic 3 weeks ago
@Elberiver11 Roosevelt wanted war in Europe; the American public didn't. However the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor and that gave Roosevelt the justification to wage war on Japan. Germany is allied to Japan and declared war on us which made it okay for us to attack them.
I don't think it was right to have engaged in terror-bombing against the Germans, but the Germans engaged in terror-bombing against the British. Hitler did tell the Luftwaffe to break the British will. That's terror-bombing
KJLesnick 3 weeks ago
@KJLesnick No,you are wrong. Hitler at first forbade the Luftwaffe to bomb back. Britains started bombing German cities, it took almost a year until Germany bombed back.
Hitler had made enough peace offers to Britain, over 20 peace offers, but the British kept bombing. Hitler's deputy HESS even flew to Britain to bring peace.
The peace bringer was arrested, and Britain dragged the USA into war, thus turning it into world war. Official history is fraud - written by the perpetrator.
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago 2
@KJLesnick Germans did NOT use terror-bombing, but strategic bombing, always in connection with ground troops or as retaliation.
Coventry was centre of the British war machine, Nr. 1 primary military target. London docks were the aim, not the housing areas. But America and Britain even passed a law which said that housing areas were the aim, not military sites.
Allies killed 1 Million children and women in Axis cities. This is called "Democracy". It prolonged the war.
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago
@KJLesnick Germany did NOT declare war on you. Read about the Lend-Lease Act, which put the USA into state of war on Germany on March 11 1941.
Roosevelt ordered to attack German ships in Summer 1941 , this was an official order. America has started countless wars on countries who did less than that, e.g. the fake "Gulf of Tonkin" incident, which was a lie by _US-president Johnson to start war on Japan.
Germans ships did not shoot back, until half a year later in Dec. 1941.
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago 2
@Elberiver11 PS on Vietnam, not Japan
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago
@KJLesnick you americans should stop to insult the germans and accusing them, making them look like criminals.
have a look at who really started both world wars, and ask yourself why we speak English, and not German.
And notice, the same two countries that started war on Germany in 1914/1917 and in 1939/1941, are the same two countries that bomb Iraq, Libya, Pakistan and many other countries today.
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago
@Elberiver11 Cry baby.
SatansToeTango 1 week ago
@KJLesnick You compare the few broken streets in London to the Hell-fire in Dresden? In Dresden you can walk over 12 squares miles, without seeing a single old house.
I recommend you watch the newsreels of London 1945, completely untouched streets like Picadilldy Circus or Regent Str in Downtown London, untouched houses, people dancing, fun, shops open, buses running. In Dresden, there *were* no streets and no humansover 12 squares miles: A death zone. And you dare compare that?
Elberiver11 2 weeks ago 2
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@Elberiver11 SHORT LIST OF CITIES BOMBED BY NAZI GERMANY
Guernica, Wieluń, Warsaw, Belgrade, Rotterdam, York, Norwich,Bath,Coventry, Glasgow, Bristol, London (76 consecutive nights) Dublin, Odessa, Kiev, Pinsk, Krakov,,Minsk, Moscow, Stalingrad, Kursk, Smolensk and many more.
MsNAZIBOMBER 1 week ago
@Elberiver11
I recommend you watch the newsreels of London VE-Day 1945: /-Wb1ViP3QMY
Then stuff a tampon n your constantly bleeding ass and go see a doctor and a shrink.
SatansToeTango 1 week ago
@Elberiver11 The fact that the Luftwaffe didn't kill as many people as the RAF is not relevant when both operated under the aim of terror-bombing.
KJLesnick 3 weeks ago
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Google these to read the extensive list of Nazi War Crimes.
"Coventry Blitz"~ "War crimes of the Wehrmacht"~ "Wormhoudt massacre"~'Ardenne Abbey massacre'~"Distomo massacre "~"Le Paradis massacre"~"Ardeatine massacre"~"Oradour-sur-Glane massacre'~"Malmedy massacre"~"Ochota massacre"~"Marzabotto massacre"~"Wola massacre"~"Tulle massacre"~"Huta Pieniacka massacre"
If that doesn't make you sick enough search "SS-Totenkopfverbände" for filth beyond all reason.
Enjoy.
HitlerFagClub 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 I don't think the Treaty/Dictate of Versailles was was right. All it did was lead to another war. It was even realized by some even back in the late 19-teens that it would lead to the Germans wanting to seek revenge.
Despite your assertions as to what the US would do, Germany could not declare war as any nation couldn't declare war if they were occupied after being defeated. Still there's such a thing as being a sore winner just as there is such a thing as being a sore loser.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
@KJLesnick It was not just "not right", it caused world war two. Every historian knows that.
Besides, it was not a treaty. Are you American? Then by your own American law, it was not a treaty but a dictate.
Due to American or British law , or any other democratic law, a treaty is a legal act, provided all parties have agreed by free will and consent.
When you protest against it, its not consent.
Elberiver11 3 weeks ago
@KJLesnick No, you are wrong again. It was not about "seeking revenge". If was mainly about freeing millions from alien rule and from alien occupation. You insult those people by calling them "sore losers". Do you insult the graves of the Jews as "sore losers", too? They certainly were losers. So is that something to mock about?
In any case its amazing how little people know about the Versailles dictate. It caused invasions, death and war. Long time before Hitler was even known.
Elberiver11 3 weeks ago
@KJLesnick Exactly, Germany could not start war to free their countymen, because they were occupied, disarmed and depleted.
But still, you are distracting because you seem to hate to face the truth:
What would any nation do, if they were occupied by alien tanks invading? Would they want to throw those alien aggressors of their land? And what if a man came along who would promise to do that, would they cheer him and vote for him?
No nation would ever tolerate alien rule.
Elberiver11 3 weeks ago
@KJLesnick The main thing you are trying to distract from: How is a war in Europe America's business anyway? America had no right to change Germany's borders, thus forcing millions under the yoke of Alien tyranny.
I know you dont like the issue. But Americans would start war far sooner than Germany did, if their country was occupied by hostile neighbouring states. The reason why this is inconceivable to you is because America HAS no hostile invading neighbours.
Elberiver11 3 weeks ago
Elberiver is TheMrPangloss in Drag The Fat Nazi Twat
TheMrBlockTheHood 1 month ago
Have you guys ever heard of General Giulio Douhet? General Douhet wrote a book in 1921 called Command of the Air. It advocated using bombers to fly over cities and drop poison gas, explosives, and incendiaries as a means to destroy enemy industry and cause mass murder to terrorize the population to the point that they would either beg their government for surrender or overthrow it with a government willing to do so.
Effectively he wanted to undo all the progress the Geneva Conventions made.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
@Elberiver11
No, Germany started WW2 when it invaded Poland which was an ally of England. Hitler pushed things quite a lot and the British and French let them get away with it. You can only push things far before they snap-back against you. In 1941 the Germans launched massive bombing campaigns on Britain to destroy their war-making capability and crush their morale.
Just as the Luftwaffe was inspired by Giulio Douhet's ideas regarding terror bombing, so was the RAF.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
@KJLesnick Britain declared war on Germany therefore starting WW2.Britain had promised to come to Polands aid should they be attacked.
silver760 1 month ago
@KJLesnick Poland had occupied German land, holding 2.1 Million Germans captive. This is what started war. Germany did not "declare world war" as you claim.
Its the Allies who try to lay the blame on the Germans. So you are trying that too? lol
We all know that Allied history is fake. I have neither the time, nor the mind to list all the Allied lies and educate brainwashed people. Whoever wants to believe Hollywood-TV show fake history, is welcome to do so.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 C'mon, you don't actually believe that? Hitler had his men disguise as Polish soldiers and attack Germany in order to paint the Polish as being an enemy as to justify war.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
@KJLesnick Its funny you always try to silence about what lead to this war.
History is not a matter of belief, dude, we are not in a church here.
Poland had invaded German land in 1919 and held 2.1 Million Germans captive. French and Czechs did the same. Would the USA tolerate Mexican tanks invading Texas or California and their fellow countrymen to be put under alien rule?
America would never tolerate that for a single day. But its funny you expect the Germans to.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11
Are you talking about the Treaty of Versailles?
KJLesnick 1 month ago
@KJLesnick You probably mean the "Dictate" of Versailles. According to American law or British law its not a treaty. The signature was extorted, which is something like "force to consent".
Most Americans dont know anything about the consequences of Versailles. They think it was a "humilitation" only.
It meant enslavement, terror and alien rule for millions of people, military invasions and occupation for millions of peoplem, starvation, civil war and destruction of families.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@KJLesnick PS I actually refer to the consequences of Versailles, the whole years through the 1920ies and 30ies. Rathern than Versailles itself. Most people dont know anything about that.
If someone invaded the USA or England with tanks and 100 000 soldiers, trying to occupy these countries and force millions under the invader's rule, the USA and England would immediately start war.
But exactly this happened to the Germans in the 1920ies, and nobody did bat an eyelid.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
The Germans did not tolerate Alien invaders to have millions of Germans occupied. Its amazing how little you know about history.
What you beliefe to be "Poland" in the interwar period, was not the land of Poles but an artificially created country whose Population was not Poles, but containing millions of non-Poles: 2.1 Million Germans, 6 Mio. Ukrainians and others.
None of these people were asked whether they wanted to live under Polish tyranny. They were forced under alien rule.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@KJLesnick The "disguise" thing you mention has nothing to do with the millions of German civilians, enslaved under alien rule.
Everybody knows today, that the Dictate of Versailles was the reason for WW II. It placed millions of people under alien tyranny, tore families apart and caused desaster.
When you forbid democratic elections for millions of people, it's not democracy.
You should research the situation in Europe between 1919 - 1933. A war does not come out of the blue.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11
Wurzburg and Pforzheim seemed almost to be continuations of Dresden. They were largely destroyed because the allied forces had run out of large targets of serious importance and were looking for built up areas that they could smash and burn.
Admittedly Wurzburg had some supply depots that were destroyed, whether Pforzheim really did have a decentralized industrial base rigged through the city, no clue but it reeked of a pretext.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
Under Eisenhower's orders POW's were starved to death as a deliberate policy even when sufficient food was available. Since the policies going on at the camps were against the Geneva Convention, Eisenhower decided to redesignate the POW's as Disarmed Enemy Forces (DEF); then claimed the Geneva Conventions didn't apply.
This bears an eerie similarity to the way Bush (and now Obama) labeled people Enemy Combatants to avoid following the Geneva Convention in the same fashion.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
General Patton actually released his prisoners after VE Day even though the DEF camps were very much in operation. Eisenhower was furious about it and Eisenhower ordered him to stop though it would seem Patton just ignored the order. Admittedly Patton had some fascist leanings which might have been why he did what he did.
I think both Fascism and Communism are the greatest plagues to ever affect the modern world. I don't think it's right to mistreat POW's either.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
Churchill and Roosevelt burnt 1 Million children and women to ashes alive in German and Japanese cities.
These two Allied warcriminals should have been tried & hanged for Genocide.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11
The USAAF usually bombed by day and generally preferred to hit specific industrial targets, and transportation systems such as railways and ship-yards. Dresden seemed to be more of an exception than the rule.
The RAF generally bombed at night. Targets were either of cultural value (i.e. Nikolaiarche in Hamburg) or stuff that would just burn. Bombs were used to blast the roofs off, and firebombs to set the timber structures ablaze. The goal was to maximize civilian fatalities.
KJLesnick 1 month ago
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Elberiver11 1 month ago
@KJLesnick Würzburg, Pforzheim, Sweenemunde, Kassel etc were all precision-bombings indeed -
Americans and British both murdered children and women with great precision.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
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If Dresden was an exception, what was Würzburg then? Pforzheim? Sweenemunde?
In Sweenemunde, the US-warcriminals attacked a city overcrowded with women and children refugees. The survivors of this Allied massmurder reported how they walked over mounds of corpses, torn-off children's heads , arms, legs.
So why is Sweenemunde never mentioned? 20 000 were murdered here by Americans and British, so why does Allied-written history only mention Coventry with some 500 deaths?
Elberiver11 1 month ago
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Göbbels was a little orphan-boy comapare to British chief-propagandist SEFTON DELMER.
Sefton Delmer invented "black propaganda" and used it for the British 1941 - 1945. "Black Propaganda" works with lies, deception, fraud, falsehood and is the most evil form of Propaganda ever used by a nation.
The aim was to discredit Germany and to blacken and foul her name by any means, including lies. Allied-written history is the continuaton of Delmer's "black propaganda".
Elberiver11 1 month ago
Pangloss why do you post JUDEN VERMIN
NaziBoyPangloss 1 month ago
A terrible thing to have to live through (or die through). But this should be a lesson to all leaders in the world not to start a war - because you never know how far it will drag you down into hell. Hitler promised the German people a heaven lasting 1,000 years, what they really got was another matter.
Stoory 1 month ago
@Stoory If the British and their fine French friends had not enslaved millions of Germans under alien rule in Versailles 1919 and brought mass-poverty, civil war, state bankrupcy and alien invasions over Germany in the 1920ies, then there wouldn't even have been any Hitler.
It's funny how the British and Americans still use "helping Poland" as a pretext for their the destruction of Germany, when in truth it was them who created the Polish-German conflict in Versailles 1919.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Stoory PS: Churchill used the same "'1000 years" metaphors. Nothing special. When leaders try to agitate, they always promise "broad, sunlit uplands" and stuff.
Only difference: Churchill whipped up anti-german hate in England and FEAR, although Germany never had any hostility towards England - and Churchill knew that.
Hitler, however, might be reproached for all sorts of things, but he never whipped up hate against the English.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
THE MR PANGLOSS NEO NAZI WHORE
TheMrBlockTheHood 1 month ago
@TheMrBlockTheHood AND FAGGOT
Piss4Pangloss 1 month ago
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Bombing Dresden was fully justified by an enemy which had already destroyed dozens of cities - murdered millions in death, slave labourer and concentration camps - an enemy still engaged in making poison gas in Chemische Fabrik Goye in Dresden and still launching V2 rockets against London - rockets still being made in Mittlebau-Dora by slaves, 20,000 of whom were hung, shot, beaten or starved to death - how else were we stop this murdering regime which was refusing to end an unwinnable war?
eddie123e 1 month ago
Is it not astonishing how Goebbels words live on.It was he who invented the term 'revenge weapons' and he was the first to claim 250,000 dead in Dresden. When the Allies bombed Germany, that was 'terror bombing' by RAF cowards and when the Luftwaffe destroyed Warsaw in 1929 killing 240,000 in 1939 that was the heroes of the Luftwaffe. Goebbels would be very proud of some of the freaks who post here.
eddie123e 2 months ago
@eddie123e You little dumb dwarf with your silly Göbbels-nonsense. lol Why dont you make up something new? We have heard it all before.
Let's talk about something new: The British propaganda-expert Sefton Delmer, who worked for the British Political Warfare Executive (PWE) to spread anti-German hate propaganda.
Sefton Delmer was one of Britain's de-facto Propaganda ministers.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@eddie123e Göbbels was a little orphan-boy comapare to British chief-propagandist SEFTON DELMER.
Sefton Delmer invented "black propaganda" and used it for the British 1941 - 1945. "Black Propaganda" works with lies, deception, fraud, falsehood and is the most evil form of Propaganda ever used by a nation.
The aim was to discredit Germany and to blacken and foul her name by any means, including lies.
You, Eddie, carry on the tradition of British "black propaganda".
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 Prior to Dresden, Great Britain had undergone massive bombing raids on all her major cities whether they were a base for munitions or not. Judging Dresden by modern day standards is wrong, it has to be judged by the time in which World War 2 took place, by the standards of the time. London, Coventry, Plymouth, Bristol etc were all beautiful cities and tens of thousands of innocent civilians died due to the German Luftwaffe fire bombs, V1 flying bombs and V2 rockets.
RedGoblinus 1 month ago
@RedGoblinus LOL and where did the "massive"" bombing come from?
The British bombed Germany, so the Germans bombed you back. Learn history, little dummy. lol
What you call "massive", was a petty little joke compared to the atrocities your warcriminal grandfather unleashed on millions of civilians. How dare you compare London, a city almost untouched by war, to the Dresden Holocaust in which your Grandfather wiped a whole city off the map over 12 square miles?
Hoodlums.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 german started war what should you expect its war for god sake
damislav 1 month ago
@damislav Yes, i have learned this nonsense at school, too.
I recommend you take a good encyclopedia or a scientific book, rather than watching your silly Hollywood-.TV shows. Then you will find out thaBritish Empire, USA and France all started war on Germany. Not the other way round.
Why should the winner blame himself? Nobody would ever do that.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 London was not "a city almost untouched by war" as you claim. During the 'blitz', the city of London was bombed by the Luftwaffe for 76 consecutive nights and more than one million London houses were destroyed or damaged.
RedGoblinus 1 month ago
London started bombing Germany on May 10th 1940.
First German bombs back on London, where the fire came from:
September 1940.
Learn history. lol
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@RedGoblinus well, in that case you do not know your own capital, mate. Just like you do not know your own country's history.
So how come on the newsreels 1945 you see untouched streets , people smiling and walking in the streets, buses running and shops open, like usual?
In Dresden there were not even any streets or houses or people left - a death zone, not a single human being in sight: a desert.
So you claim, London was a "death zone"? lol
See people dancing in London 1945.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 Go to the central areas of any major British city and you'll find that most of the buildings are post World War 2. That's because the German Luftwaffe bombed the old buildings out during the blitzkrieg of 1940/41. This is especially true of Plymouth in South West England. The only big towns that were spared were Oxford and Blackpool because Adolf Hitler wanted Oxford as the new English capital and Blackpool as a Third Reich pleasure resort had he conquered England.
RedGoblinus 1 month ago
@RedGoblinus Its our troll again! Oh, put a sock in it!
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@RedGoblinus 76 consecutive nights, and how many consecutive nights has the British aggressor murdered German children and women?
1000 nights?
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@Elberiver11 Just defending Nazi Germany is telling that you are some fascist.Second Germans broke Treaty of Versaille,they conquer almost all Europe,they attack Poland and holocaust happen,they attack Soviet Russia,install Croatia as puppet country(100 000 people killed),Operation Himmler was made for attacking Poland. What do you think that Allied soldiers should do.Germans were not surrendering.
damislav 1 month ago
@damislav LOL me, defending the Nazis? I dont even talk abvout the Nazis. Its rather you, insulting the German nation and trying to justify Allied warcrimes and Bombing-Holocausts.
What the Allied soldiers should have done? They should have gone home and end the war. Germany had made over 20 peace offers to the Allies.
Read "The Hess-deception" by British historian Martin Allen, Harper-Collins, London /England.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@RedGoblinus
V1 and V2 = retaliation for British warcrimes
You started the war on us. Learn history, dummy.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
Phosphor nicht gut, Uranium 235 oder Plutonium gut! JA! JA! JA!
AR15fan 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The quote from Don Nielsen (who was then a B-17 aircraft-commander -- I made a mistake earlier about that, sorry) does raise the question as to how many pilots (at least US) were mislead about the nature of their mission.
Interestingly there were many pilots who had horrible nightmares and believed they'd burn in hell for what they did. There's no such thing as hell, but it's nice to know that there were some who felt remorse for what they did...
KJLesnick 2 months ago
A website dedicated to RAF Bomber Command admitted that P-51's from the USAAF were ordered to strafe people fleeing the city...
KJLesnick 2 months ago
Dit is zeker niet normaal meer,maar zolang er mensen zijn op deze mooie planeet, ben ik bang dat dit zeker niet de laatste keer zal zijn dat we elkaar afmaken,af en toe denk ik wel is,we verdienen het niet om op deze aarde rond te mogen lopen,we vernietegen toch alles wat hier leeft.
shadowdelft 3 months ago
This shows only that the Allies were not a bit better than the Germans.
MrCrunkwear 3 months ago 2
@MrCrunkwear who started the war, who killed millions in death camps & experimented on thousands of children and adults in the most vile and horrific fashion
who began civillian bombing, who was obsessed with world domination and the illimination of all non approved races
How dare you make such a twisted comment. All war is vile, but the difference was the allies sole aim was to end the war not start one unlike the Germans & Japanese
trackend 1 month ago
@trackend Governments start wars, not women and children. There is no excuse for carnages like this.
But Britain needs these excuses in order to conceal the Allied war crimes and crimes against the humanity.
As much as we agree that the Nazi goverment was evil and committed crimes, it is not any excuse to make firebombing acceptable. Each crime is unique and to be judged separately regardless some other. The Dresden raid by the RAF and USAAC is a war crime.
TheMrPangloss 1 month ago
"who started the war"
How many wars did the U.S. begin after the ww2? How many foreign territories did it invade?
Besides, Britain and the U.S. and their establishments started to prepare Germany and Russia for destruction and war already in 1890s when it appeared that Germany challenged Anglo-Saxon world economically and would have joined its pools of resources with Russia. That lead to the "Entente" and to the plans how to chop powers into pieces in the continent one after another.
TheMrPangloss 1 month ago
@trackend LOL who started the war? You Britishers started the war between Poland and Germany in Versailles 1919, it was you who actually created the conflict. You enslaved over 2.0 Million Germans under Alien rule and you made Polish tanks invade Germany in 1919. The Germans logically took the land back that YOU had stolen.
And what about the Allied death camps? And what about British atrocities? Remember, you Britishers exterminated the Red Indians - first Holocaust in history.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
@trackend type in google "EISENHOWER'S DEATH CAMPS" and click on images -
see pictures of Allied death camps which murdered millions.
Elberiver11 1 month ago
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KJLesnick 1 month ago
This was one of the most tragic attacks of WW 2 on civilian Populace. There were no Men there only Women and Children and Senirors!! But it was Wart and Hitler attacked Coventry England with V 2 Rockets! This was the revenge!
BluesHarp60 3 months ago
@BluesHarp60 If this was justified as revenge, then with the history of Britain, it should go through 100 times worse than this.
bravo45 3 months ago
@BluesHarp60; nop, the v-2's were a hitler's revenge for the bombing on civilians targets, check the dates of the first attacks.
RicardoxParedes 2 months ago
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KJLesnick 4 months ago
@spitroastfor8
Yes, yes we're very impressed with your views on total war. The problem is that under that mentality anything is acceptable -- even bayonetting pregnant women (which the Japanese did). Are you saying that the Allies should have bayonetted pregnant women too?
Because that's the direction your argument flows.
KJLesnick 4 months ago
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KJLesnick 4 months ago
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KJLesnick 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Giorginomare
Yup, during Dresden, the RAF were sent in to smash and torch a city and kill civilians. That was the entire objective -- kill so many people that it would destroy German morale and cause whoever lived to flee in terror with the aim of blocking roads which the German troops were approaching through to keep them from moving eastward.
Apparently all you have to do is win the war and all the wrongdoing becomes okay.
KJLesnick 4 months ago
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KJLesnick 4 months ago
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KJLesnick 4 months ago
Allies were war criminals too...Damn....
Giorginomare 5 months ago
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KJLesnick 5 months ago
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KJLesnick 5 months ago
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KJLesnick 5 months ago
Next time, though, don't plan for and start the war, don't build gas chambers, don't kill six million Jews, don't stand with Nazis, and don't wage war as your predecessors did against civilians.
hwhope321 5 months ago
@hwhope321 I hope you that you are well aware that every single thing you point out is arguable. Furtheremore, had Weakileaks existed at the time the war took place we might have known a very different version of history. Your comment simply vents an unbearable display of ignorance. I "hwhope" you are aware of that too as you base your stance on simple flimsy conventional and , thank heavens now, easily breakable arguments.
johndaubal 5 months ago
11:20 "NO WAY DID WE GO DOWN AND DO ANY STRAFING", of course not.
You have been highly moral people and never harmed a single child or mother, never set fire onto a whole fucking city, and never threw any children into a fucking FIRESTORM.
TERRORISTS & MURDERERS . You dirty people should all have been tried and hanged for warcrimes and atrocities on innocent civilians.
It's so disgusting to hear all those American and British liars trying to whitewash their Phosporous-Holocaust.
Elberiver11 6 months ago 2
Look at 10:25 "Many Dresdners BELIEVED they had seen strafers".
"There is no evidence in the Allies' records". Well, of course not. Why should they write down how they systematically exterminated people, either by fire or machingunning the survivors?
USA and Britain lied about lampshades, lied about the "soap"-story, lied about KATYN and lied about so many other things, are trustworthy people.
And the thousands of Dresdners who saw it with their own eyes, are all nutters of course.
Elberiver11 6 months ago 2
eerrrrrrr hello, the Do-217s and 88s dropped tonnes of phosphorous on london, but of course we did it to u, there is no moderation in total war!!!!
spitroastfor8 6 months ago
Could it be possible that Soviet fighters did the strafing as by this time the Soviet front lines were ever closer to Eastern Germany and Dresden itself?
Eye witnesses along with some historians claim that P-51s escort fighters from the 20th FG strafed surviving fire victims; this contradicts the fact that the 20th FG accompanied bomber groups that went off course and bombed Prague instead of Dresden that day.
Strafing activities are neither mention on German nor American records.
Eurofighter19 7 months ago