Should Christians Follow The Old Testament? (The Torah)

[FoodMoTron3k]

God's law is His plumb line. Without it, there is no way to measure what is straight. It is His standard which to live by. Yeshua said that there will be people that practice no law, and He will tell them, "I never knew you".

[NOMENTALREGRESSION]

What about Animal Sacrifices? Are we still required to hold them??

[TheEDU511]

@NOMENTALREGRESSION That is a great question. Actually no, we are not required to make sacrifices. There is no Temple at this time and sacrifices are restricted to the Temple proper. We cannot however dismiss the other valuable mitzvot found in the Torah.

[flatfoot561]

An Jesus Himself has been.called the living Torah.

[flatfoot561]

I'm sorry it just gets me when we will read like fir example, psalm119. When David professed his love for His law an we sit an go amen. But,ask we implement like observe the Sabbath an we go, , o no! Were not under law but, grace ..I have word, Gods law compared to the like some of us lived before Yeshua came in .is grace..

[flatfoot561]

I have been observing Torah for many years. Little by little of course, why do so many Christians have a problem with it? Do you follow the ten commandments? If so,you observe Torah. If our Father structures torah your life in your life don't resist. Some men and woman comming out of pagan lifestyles need a new way to live. What better way than our Gods way?

[yodheytheway]

Its hard to remember why I ever thought I shouldn't obey the Torah. Today the question is not Should I follow Torah, but why shouldn't I? Yeshua suffered and gave his life to redeem me, so why shouldn't I do my best to obey him? It's not a big deal to stop eating unclean foods, keep the Sabbath or any other commandment that Christianity typically ignores, if my hearts desire is to please God. Real faith is to hear and to obey. How can anyone say they love him if they don't keep his commandments?

[turtle212]

do you believe the old testament law that states that women that wear clothing made of more than one type of material should be stoned? Ya better get some rocks

[TakeAStandForTruth]

There is a huge difference between obeying the Law because we are commanded to obey Gods law in generic pin pointing and telling Gentiles to obey the Mosaic Covenant. Paul Nison is confusing Romans which says δικαιωματα του νομου "the requirement of the law" verses Acts 15:5 "It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses." Which the sages said, Acts 15:25 But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing.

[Nobleronin4]

@TakeAStandForTruth -get deeper- Gentiles don't have a seperate revelation of the gospel. The Gospel has not changed since the beginning. If you quote Acts 15:25 then you have to be aware of Acts 15:19-21. Context of both passages is so that both peoples Jew and Gentiles could have immediate fellowship and not have them (gentiles) jump through hoops BUT learn the remainder of G-D's commands on the Sabbath per verse 21. But by all things let the Holy Spirit lead.

[Nobleronin4]

@TakeAStandForTruth The foreigners who came out of Egypt with the Israelites and attached themselves to the God of Israel, eventually were accepted by Israel AS Israel. Those foreigners are a pictures of today's gentile who comes in faith to the Messiah of Israel. This is why in Eph. 2 Paul says we WERE gentiles and aliens of the Commonwealth of Israel, but now through Messiah's blood are "fellow citizens." As fellow citizens are we not to walk as The Messiah walked?

[Nobleronin4]

@TakeAStandForTruth ....Not meaning to argue but to shed some light on replacement theology, which divorces itself from the commands of The Almighty but walks in the gospel of a religious system that cherry-picks what it chooses to believe. That is why we have literally 38,000 different denominations...(Something is wrong). With love!

[yodheytheway]

@TakeAStandForTruth It seems that gentiles were never required to be circumcised to be saved. Circumcision is how a person became a Jew.. This debate in the new testament was if a person needed to become a Jew to be saved and the answer was no. They came to this conclusion from the standards set forth in the Torah. The law of Moses (Torah) was and is required for everyone to be in right standing with God, but it takes time to learn it so we are under grace as we learn to hear and obey.

[TakeAStandForTruth]

@yodheytheway You can't say its a requirement seeing James and the Elders said this is not their obligation Acts 21:25

[TakeAStandForTruth]

Paul the problem with your theology is that it is against the sages teachings of whom Yakov (James) said in Acts 15:25 "But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing." You are actually doing what Paul said when he rebuked Jews for making Gentiles think they have to keep the Mosaic Covenant as it is written in opposition to that in Acts 15:25 and Col 2:16. Your making Gentiles confused. Only Jews are obligated to keep the law of Moses

[panzermachinepanzer]

@TakeAStandForTruth Context of Colosians 2: Col 2:8 See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to HUMAN tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the world, and not according to Christ. Col 2:21-22 "Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch" (referring to things that all perish as they are used)--according to HUMAN precepts and teachings?

[siholgs]

Paul talked about those who wanted to keep the law, be careful not to fall into false teachings. Do not fall from grace!

I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law. You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

(Gal 5:3-4)

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs If you watch this video carefully nobody here was saying we are justified by the law. Nobody in this video claims we are justified by circumcision. Please study Galatians carefully before quoting it.

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer so, if you're not justified by doing it, why are you doing it? for fun?

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs Mat 5:17-19 "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. ...until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer Jesus came to accomplish all. The Law ends there.

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. KJV

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer Jesus broke the Sabbath and He teaches us to do so, is Jesus the least?

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs which commandment regarding the Sabbath did He broke?

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer You read the bible, no? John 5:18 Love is the fulfillment of law. [...] for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. Romans 13:8

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs Please tell me which commandment about the Sabbath did Jesus broke. The Law teaches us how to love our neighbors and God, John 5:18 and Roman 13:8 does not say we should ignore commandments how to love God and fellow men

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer Read Exodus. Roman 13:8 says love FULFILLS law, meaning if we love, we fulfill the law, it's done. Hence, there is no need to observe the law of Moses. Observe the law of love, it's greater! God bless!

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs It is the Law of Moses that commands us to love your neighbour how can you say ignore the Law? Lev 19:18 "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD. RD your God. "

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer Friend, exactly, if you love, you will not avenge, if you love, you will not sin against your body (adultery), if you love, you will not kill, and go on, if you love, you will not envy others, and go on. Love fulfills the law. Observe the law of love and you observe the law. God bless!

[panzermachinepanzer]

@siholgs All these you mentioned contain in the Law of Moses.

[siholgs]

@panzermachinepanzer All of those are contained in love but the law of Moses does not contain love. John 1:17

[yodheytheway]

@siholgs God's definition of love is often quite different than mans. Two people often have a hard time agreeing what loving behavior is. This is why we still need the Torah. It is Gods own standard of love, holiness, healthy living and justice and even how to care for our environment. Its a very good standard which we should observe as Jesus did. Perhaps in the world to come we will all know instinctively how to love, but in this life, we are all still a work in progress.

[siholgs]

@yodheytheway God's definition is indeed different than man's, why do you think God became a man? So, that He can show they kind of love He wants. So, if you want to know God's definition of love, look at Christ, not the Torah, well actually the Torah points to Jesus. So, if again, it's not the Torah, it's Jesus Christ. Read John 1:17. Jesus loves you man.

[yodheytheway]

@siholgs How can you look at Christ? He is in heaven. All we have is the New Testament and the New Testament tells us that Christ kept the law perfectly. If we want to know what keeping the law perfectly is, then we need to know and understand the law. We are supposed to live as he lived, not live however we decide. Even Jesus said that he only did what his father told him to do, so we should also do what the father tells us to do and he tells us what to do in the old testament.

[siholgs]

@yodheytheway I guess you forgot that we have the Holy Spirit. That's how you know Christ, starting by reading about Him and then having the personal relationship with God through His Spirit. Are we supposed to be beaten and crucified as well? And become a Jew? Or must we live like Christ spiritually? Meaning full of compassion and truth? Yes, the Father doesn't tell us to keep the law of Moses. Read 2 Corinthians 3:6

[Truthnspector]

@panzermachinepanzer You can't ignore the law if you don't know Jesus.  You are still under it and will experience the wrath. Love fulfills the Law if you are already saved, but if you are not, you are still under the law. Romans 7:7 also, the law is a schoolmaster to bring those who don't know Jesus to Him through faith, Galatians 3:24

Bible says, I had not known sin but by the law..Romans 7:7

[panzermachinepanzer]

@Truthnspector 1Jn_3:4 "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."; Rom_6:15 "What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid."

[Truthnspector]

@siholgs That is true if you are saved through Christ Jesus, but if you are not, you are still under the law. Romans 7:7 also, the law is a schoolmaster to bring those who don't know Jesus to Him through faith, Galatians 3:24

[siholgs]

@Truthnspector This video is for people who are supposedly saved. The point is if you believe you are saved, there is no point in keeping the law. You're talking about a whole different topic.

[yodheytheway]

@siholgs Jesus was accused of breaking the sabbath but he did not break it in any way. If you will read the Torah and study the requirements given for keeping the sabbath, you will see that he did not break it. It is lawful to heal on the sabbath.

[siholgs]

@yodheytheway There's a very good reason reason why Jesus said that He is the Lord of Sabbath. If you know what I mean :)

[yodheytheway]

@siholgs I'm not sure what you mean. If you mean that because he is the lord of the sabbath, he had the authority to break it or change it to sunday, then I strongly disagree with that. If you mean that he is lord of the sabbath, because his father declared the seventh day holy at creation & knows the proper way to keep it holy then I would agree with that and also that we ought to observe that special set apart day with him and not make it like every other day.

[siholgs]

There's no such thing as "hebrew" root of our Messiah. Our Messiah came from HEAVEN. We're called to be citizen of Heaven, not to be "hebrews".

How is it that you fail to understand that I did not speak about bread? Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees." Then they understood that he did not tell them to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees. (Mat 16:11-12)

[EleVenn28]

I can't find him on facebook, Can you put a link?

[panzermachinepanzer]

What is sad is some Messianic Jews are actually discouraging non-Jews telling them not to observe the Torah.

[simdes13]

Yeshua is NOT G-D...

[davegooley]

Here is another Scripture verse to remember. Proverbs 28:9, "He who turns away his ear from hearing the Torah, even his prayer is an abomination."

[Yeshuaismyshepher]

Do you know what I see? if that when people don't want to follow Eloheen's commandments is because they DO NOT LOVE HIM, rather they love themselves more..1st Commandment that Y'shua said is the One: Love your God with all your heart, mind and soul. Shalom!

[davegooley]

The one Torah Robert spoke about is in Exodus 12:49, "There is one Torah for the native-born and the stranger that sojourns among you."

[NWOIS666]

@davegooley  Amen !!