Paul Krugman - The Two Men Responsible for the Housing Mess

[Premier112]

"You're wrong: the trend in the world since the 80's is de-regulation and, with it, growing inequalities."

You can blabber on at the mouth for three more pages if you want, you are completely full of imbecilic bull pucket.

Claiming less regulation since the 80's is about as far from reality as you can get. Regulations haven't done anything but expand consistently since 1950.

No, I am Not wrong. You live in a complete fantasy world.

Until you accept reality, I'm through talking to you.

[Premier112]

"Spare us the Austrian Mises baloney."

How about a big plate of burn in hell.

You bunch fucked the economy and then, you want to blame free markets and Austrian economists because your philosophy didn't have yet more control? After regulation has exponentially rose for the past decades, and subprimes was the more highly regulated

aspect.

AND, 999/1000 of you couldn't predict the downturn, and you laugh at the other tiny fringe of keynesians that did as well?

I know what, Fuck you all. : )

[KrugmanTheKing]

@Premier112

You're wrong: the trend in the world since the 80's is de-regulation and, with it, growing inequalities. You're being a nice example of the national myth as Hobsbawm explained, creating a past that never occurred.

Free-trade treaties and the constant retiring of the State in industrialized countries from sectors such as education and health care... that's neoliberalism, not an applied keynesian political approach.

[KrugmanTheKing]

@Premier112

There's a reason why Stiglitz criticized the Washington consensus and the behavior of the organizations within it, saying it's their tendency to free everything without bothering to regulate properly that leads to the issues, including economic volatility, you find in non-developed nations. The analysis rests on complex mathematical structure of utility maximization in a context of imperfect markets which is of course always the case.

[KrugmanTheKing]

@Premier112

Without perfect information and perfect competition, your austrian-inspired models fall apart like a house of cards in front of a tornado and I'd like to see you prove me a perfect information markets can be the only type you find in an entire economy... neoclassical ideas are gross estimations which are wonderfully useful when trying to look at specific things, but if you use them in a macroeconomic context, you end up with absurd conclusions.

[KrugmanTheKing]

@Premier112

A free market bears within inherent failures and will result in a less than Pareto efficient result.

[clintcastle]

Krugman cant find anyone on the republican side that predicted the housing crisis.... That's either a lie or he is retarded. Ron Paul stood on the floor of the congress and gave a 10 minute speech about it in 2001.

[mpc91]

@clintcastle - It's easy to say you can't find something when you didn't look.

As for Krugman, he predicted because he called for it. It's not really prescient, he specifically called for a housing bubble in 2001.

It's like me predicting what I'm going to have for dinner tonight.

[KrugmanTheKing]

@mpc91

Not a single economist on Earth would ever ask for overpricing. Not a single one, let alone a Nobel prize laureate. Quote the exact line in its context and explain where he asked for governments to de-regulate financial markets to ensure that loans were granted until households were caught owing more than they earn...

I'm sure in the same move you're stupid enough to think Krugman proposed aliens were a solution like many others did at Fox...

[mpc91]

@KrugmanTheKing - "To fight this recession the Fed needs more than a snapback; it needs soaring household spending to offset moribund business investment. And to do that, as Paul McCulley of Pimco put it, Alan Greenspan needs to create a housing bubble to replace the Nasdaq bubble." - Paul Krugman NYT 8/2/2002.

What deregulation occurred? That did not cause the crisis. The Federal Reserve and Fannie Mae did that.

[KrugmanTheKing]

@mpc91

The issue at hand here is that Krugman have mathematical models telling him what he has to say about intervention and, you, well... you have beliefs. Inequality is growing intellectually too!

[mpc91]

@KrugmanTheKing - Would it be too cheap to point out the grammatical error in your post attempting to diminish me intellectually? It should be, "Krugman has" not "Krugman have". Not really important, just worth noting.

If his mathematical models ignore reality and are based on flawed premises, then one would be far better off without them. I have facts, historical evidence, and clear patterns of events. You have nothing but hero worship of a statist hack.

[aon10003]

The fundamentals are strong, they ate using exactly the same words that Arthur Schaffer used in the video Peter Schiff was right.

[jjenson2006]

Krugman CAUSED the housing bubble

blog. mises. org/10153/krugman-did-cause-th­e-housing-bubble/

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

According to that article, Krugman caused the Housing Bubble by suggesting in 2000, during the middle of a recession, that the Fed should lower interests rates. I didn't see the part though where Krugman said they should be kept low for the next nine years.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set

Excerpt from Krugmans article:

“To fight this recession the Fed needs more than a snapback; it needs soaring household spending to offset moribund business investment. And to do that, as Paul McCulley of Pimco put it, Alan Greenspan needs to CREATE A HOUSING BUBBLE to replace the Nasdaq bubble.” Emphasis is mine.

When did he suggest raising rates? I hear crickets.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

Go and read Krugman's op-ed. He wasn't advocating the Fed do this, he was describing what they were trying to do, and hoping for. "Need" here does not mean "ought." Paul McCulley was being critical of Greenspan, accusing him of trying to create a housing bubble to replace the internet bubble.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set WTF are you talking about? When someone states that the economy needs soaring household spending and that to do that the Fed needs to create a housing bubble, it means just that.

Krugman has ALWAYS been for lowering interest rates. In fact, he thinks they should be lower right now. This guys toxic advice is what got us where we are right now. When the dot bomb went off, we should have taken a meaningful resession right there and then...but no, the Keynesians have to "fix it".

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

Look for Krugman's article "Dubya's Double Dip." The whole time he is describing what the Fed hopes to accomplish, and what must occur for the Fed to attain its goals. He is not giving advice to the Fed as to what it *ought* to do. In fact, his tone is pessimistic and ends by asking "Who, exactly, is about to start spending a lot more? "

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set I read that article. He was agreeing that the Fed needs to create a housing bubble. I've never seen this guy state that the Fed needs to raise interest rates. It's always, "we need to keep the consumer spending." Krugman is a puppet for the elite.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

Puppet for the elite? Do you know who wants to raise interest rates? Who wants austerity now? The bankers, the elite. This would give even greater returns to their investments. Raising interest rates with so much unemployment will only benefit the financial sector which is why so many plutocrats push that kind of nonsense.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set "Do you know who wants to raise interest rates?"

For one, I do!

"Who wants austerity now?"

I do!!

"The bankers, the elite."

You can't be serious! Why would the banks want their costs to rise? Don't you know what happens to their entire portfolio of houses when the rates rise? Why would the elite want rates to rise? LOL

The financial sector will collapse when long term rates rise and they will eventually, even if the Fed doesn't raise short term rates.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

Look at the second-to-the-last paragraph in "Dubya's.." Does "need" in that part mean Krugman advocates for a recovery so that Greenspan could save face on the Bush tax cuts? No! He's totally against the Bush tax cuts. The whole article is analysis about what would have to happen in order for the Fed and the Bush administration to save face, not what he thinks they ought to do.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set "not what he thinks they ought to do. "

Exactly what is it in your own words that HE thinks they OUGHT to do? Usually when someone criticizes in an article, they usually state somewhere in it what they ought to do, otherwise their article is moot. From what I read, he wanted a housing bubble and that's what he got.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

You can certainly fairly criticize Krugman for writing an article that offers only criticism and no solutions of his own. That is my point: he doesn't say what the Fed ought to do, other than to convey pessimism as to why and what they were hoping to achieve at the time.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set Well, I know what I read and I know what Krugman wants to do. He's a Keynesian economist who RECOMMENDED lower rates, both pre and post bubble. Everything he wants to do HURTS the economy. We NEED the economy to restructure. We need capital to flow where the market wants it to, not where some "expert" thinks it should flow. We need exesses to be wrung out. None of this can even start to happen until interest rates rise and asset values plummet.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

Spare us the Austrian Misses baloney. The economy has already restructured, the market has already decided where it thinks capital should flow: up to the elite who aren't spending it or hiring. The US is awash with capital, and they are not going to move it no matter how high interests rates get because there is no demand.

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set You don't know what you're talking about. You have no economic understanding of what is going on as you are brainwashed by the far left.

If the economy restructured, house prices would be very low, most of the banks would go under, companies would be hiring and PK wouldn't be saying "we need to prevent restructuring".

You also proved to me you don't know what monetary policy is. Do some research before you make pitiful comments.

[Empty0Set]

@jjenson2006

And if you want to know when Krugman thinks we should raise interests rates, look for "When should the Fed raise rates? (even more wonkish)"

[jjenson2006]

@Empty0Set and in this article, Krugman recommended keeping rates low. He actually stated that the Fed should keep interest rates on hold for at least 2 more years. That was in 2009. It's 2011, two years later. Now go ask Krugman what the Fed should do with rates......yup, keep them low.

In his article he states: "the Fed shouldn’t tighten until unemployment drops to 6.25%."

Well, unemployment hasn't dropped to 6.25% and it's not going to for at LEAST another 5 years!



[johammbass]

Keynesian economics fail. Krugman - just another retard

[fvecc]

And yet all the things that Krugman et al advised Obama to use in an attempt to fix the economy have made the problems much worse. Keynesian economics and a loose monetary policy are obvious failures.

Only one man predicted all of the recent bubbles and recessions and correctly traced those problems back to the Federal Reserve and the Keynesians in Congress.

Ron Paul 2012!

[StunnedByStupidity]

Boy it's ironic with all those placards saying 'Change We Need' at the 4:00 mark - Obama is appallingly crap at politics - he is the autocue king and just defines the term 'style over substance'. Krugman is great and has won an award for THE most accurate talking head on TV. And Gram is a complete and utter scum bag who needs to be punished in THE most terrifying way imaginable for a rich person - HE SHOULD BE MADE POOR and all his money given to the victims of his APPALLING actions...

[optionsupdate]

when was the original broadcast