@ersabette This is a good statement Ersabette, last time I checked the EU were taking a rather unhelpful stance. Has this moved on at all from the NFL perspective? I would be quite happy to shovel a few spade fulls of 'lobbying' at my MEP if you think it might be helpful to the cause.
@sobranie007 Thanks! Any and all support is welcome. There are no new developments in the EU ban that I'm aware of. Canadian Gov't is focusing on markets in China while they wait on the WTO. It's ironic that the EU now has the largest seal slaughter.
@Ersabette could you give us some of the stats on the EU's seal slaughter? It would be interesting to see how our politicians in Europe reconcile it with the ban on
@sobranie007 "Greenland kills about 70,000 harp seals a year for both commercial and domestic use....Denmark’s own annual hunt is the equivalent of all of Canada’s total 2010 seal harvest. Norway continues on with an annual seal hunt, Iceland is in much the same situation where an “underground” commercial hunt has existed for years along with the practice of an extensive harp seal cull to protect salmon pops. Finland, Ireland, Scotland...England also support similar annual seal culls.
@Ersabette I believe all you say Ersabette, but I'm afraid you're preaching to the converrted. It's those biggots in the EU that have to move. I'll see what I can do ....
@Ersabette Interesting to note that Iceland's seal hunters have been forced underground by the authorities - I wish they'd do the same thing to their bankers .....
@travshow At the time it had to do with how I thought the seals were killed. I also remember watching a video in 10th grade of whitecoat being skinned alive. Years later during my research I discovered that "photographers" paid a sealer to do that even though that was not how it was done. I had a preconcieved notion of sealing formed by ARA's. As I've gotten older I have a better understanding of how the world works. If I didn't have any issue with sealing I wouldn't discuss it so passionately.
@travshow First I asked if you had reviewed and included the pro-side and shared my thought of what it would mean if you had not included that information. Asking is not a form of bias but yes, I am skeptical of your video. I was once very into PETA and against sealing myself. I believe what makes the most sense to me and the ARA side makes none. Good luck on your exam. It was a pleasure. Take care!
@travshow Ah so you have reviewed and included the pro-side as well, peer reviewed reports from EFSA, CVMA, Malouf, IVWG, etc, etc because if not your dramatic conclusion is biased and nothing more than a collection of ARA material (that has not been peer reviewed) all neatly put into one place for easy viewing. If the ARA's themselves, after over 40 years, have not been able to do what you propose you are about to, I'm sorry but I doubt your "evidence" will hold any weight.
@travshow ARA's, who mind you have the funds and then some, have been trying to "tell the truth" and prove the seal hunt is unnecessary and inhumane,etc for over 40 years and have failed but let me know when your saving grace is up and I'll have a look.
.@Ersabette and i am repeating ITS NOT HUMANE to kill seals cruelly .You are repeating this:"Oh look they are overpopulating so we must kill 400000 of them like in a fps game or else they will starve and we wont have an healthy(ahaha) herd.please get it its not YOUR JOB to mass murder a species to balance their population.Diseases, starvation, birth and death rates etc are all dynamics of a population so forming healthy herds is just a pathetic excuse.
Wow, you must sit at your computer all goddamn day trashing the truth about what's happening out there. You only take the words from those who decieve, lie. Where's YOUR proof that you pull from your fat seal ass and not others!
@Melissa4U1987 Interesting, I ask you who you were out on the ice with and what experience you have that makes your opinion superior to my own and you flat out ignore that but continue to claim I am the one taking others words for it because I haven't personally been out on the ice. You are doing the exact same thing.
@Ersabette Well then, practice what you preach and go out there on your own and see first hand what they do, and then come back and try to tell me otherwise. Where do you live in Canada?
@Melissa4U1987 Why should I, you haven't. Besides, I'm not the one claiming I don't know what I'm talking about because I haven't been on the ice. I'm pretty close to those that have been though. Read my profile if you want to know where I live. I'm going to take a guess and say you haven't lived any where but in a city.
@Ersabette I live in the country bitch and always have been, I know what the environment and animals go through on a daily basis! I see first hand the destruction that humans cause. What the hell would you know, you live in an "urban area". No environment there at all.
If not using your common sense or using compassion towards another species makes you human...then what the hell are the rest of us? Guess we are smart Aliens or something. We care about the world and it's creatures like from the movie "The Day the Earth Srood Still". "We are here to save the planet and animals from "humans""
@Melissa4U1987 Your idea of saving animals causes them more suffering. If the hunt stops (which you fight for) a gov't sponsored cull will replace it to manage their populations. If not they will suffer a slow death by starvation and/or disease. How's that for compassion?
@Ersabette How the hell does it cause them more suffering?!?!? People make mistakes and then make excuses for the things they've done. You are barbaric!
There is nothing wrong with the seals population, the problem lies with human population destroying everything including species of animals. There is no compassion in humans, especially not you!
@Melissa4U1987 I'm not making excuses at all. The seals are increasing in numbers despite the hunt that removes 4-6% of the over-all population. I don't know about you but I need to eat just like the seals and I refuse to fill my face with unhealthy, cancer causing processed foods. Your arguments are fallacious and a complete waste of my time. When you wish to contribute something worthwhile let me know.
@Ersabette That's what you call owning a farm and growing or raising your own food. Oh, and I don't know about you, but I don't wanna fill my face with unhealthy mercury poison! "I refuse to fill my face with unhealthy, cancer causing processed foods."...but you have no problem with poision or giving others poison.
@Melissa4U1987 It is hypocritical to claim it's okay to raise cattle for food but not kill from the wild. Farming is not viable throughout the whole of NL. I would love to have my own garden but it's not possible. I do buy locally and organic as much as possible. The seals that are killed have not had time to accumulate the level of mercury that exists in older seals.
@Ersabette Farms are TOTALLY different then from the wild. The wild is in balance, well it was until you lunatics started stirring up BS destroying what use to be perfection. If you guys are sooooooo hard up about money and food....MOVE! DUH!
@Melissa4U1987 In the basic sense that animals are killed for our use, no, farming is no different that killing from the wild. Many wild species are not in balance, due to over-regulation/protection rendering them in many cases over-populated for their habitats. In fact, I'd much rather use a wild resource than one that has been caged up all it's life. Many people in urban areas are hard up as well, moving is not always the answer.
@Ersabette "Many wild species are not in balance, due to over-regulation/protection rendering them in many cases over-populated for their habitats."
WRONG AGAIN! If it wasn't for the human SPECIES to start destroying environments and habitats, everything WOULD be in balance. They aren't overpopulated, humans are.They aren't invading our space when they come on our porches or near our homes, we are invading their homes. MORE and MORE people populate into areas which were NOT meant for us to be
@Ersabette There are other areas in the world that is deserted or whatever that have no humans in between different places. Places where you have to travel a long time in order to find another rest stop. THOSE are the places where humans can live.. NOT cut down forests and dig up wetlands for some sleezy mansion!
@Melissa4U1987 Completely unrealistic. If those places are still deserted they are most likely unhabitable, too far from a source of water for example. Even so trees would still need to be cut down to provide shelter (even for a shack) and heat.
@Ersabette Ever heard of "green housing" My you don't know much. Anyways, They are deserted because people don't wanna live there BECAUSE there is no people. Nothing there to do, nothing to see. There is water, but people are just too damn lazy to look for it.
@Melissa4U1987 And the same thing will eventually happen in these places as is happening right now. Moving the problem isn't going to solve the problem.
@Ersabette The animals would only starve to death if you keep fishing THEIR food! Which their diet only consits of 3% of cod, so they won't starve...actually the more seals there are, the less the polar bears and orcas have to starve. Your not only doing damage to the seals, but to the WHOLE ecosystem!!! FOR SHAME!!! You are a disgrace for a Canadian! How dare you call yourself a canadian when you like to have blood on your hands!
@Melissa4U1987 Do the math: 6.9 millions seals by 3% and that's a lot of cod, not to mention that over all, seals consume more fish than all the fisheries off Canada's coasts take from the water. I think you'd also be interested in a recent poll conducted on the Canadian attitudes towards sealing and it would seem that your opinion of the hunt and towards your countrymen is a minority view. If you'd like to see the poll I'll send you the link.
@Ersabette Do you know how much is 3%? Why don't you do the real math, if you are such a mathwiz! 3% is like a decimal to what the fisheries take. Seals MIGHT catch at the maximum 5 fish per day (if they can find) them, but the fisheries can catch THOUSANDS in nets in a day. Yeah, that doesn't equal out, nor is there any comparrison.
I know what the poll is, and no it isn't the minority, I'll send you ther REAL estimate!
@Melissa4U1987 Seals are opportunist feeders which means they eat whatever is available to them and as much of it as they can. They eat much more than 5 fish a day. @ 6.9 million seals, my stats that the seals consume more fish then all the fisheries in Canada is correct, fishing being a seasonal occupation, the seals kill and eat fish all year long.
@Ersabette well yeah you would too if that's all you had to eat. What else are they suppose to fucking eat?? Seaweed? Go get some brains and some real facts.
It's THEIR fish, it's not your fish, it's NATURE. It's not yours to decide what they can or cannot eat, and when to eat it. Animals come first before humans, animals die, we ALL die! That's a fact for you right there! One thing dies out of the ecosystem, the rest falls with it.
Seasonal my ass!They don't have icebreakers for nothing!
@Melissa4U1987 Humans are a part of nature, we rely on nature as much as other species. If we cease to kill other animals it will not solve anything, only create more problems because we would need to create other means to feed ourselves. If you want to hate on humans you go for it but I doubt you'll be first in line to help decrease our population as you put it. Fishermen here on the east coast do not fish throughout the winter, approx Oct-April. Seals don't stop feeding then as well.
@Ersabette Yes it will solve everything. People only kill animals out in the wild because of human overpopulation! Stop populating and start decreasing, you will see an astounding difference. The more humans populate, the more they need food, so they get it wherever they can because of starvation BECAUSE there are too many people to feed! THAT IS A FACT! AND THAT IS THE PROBLEM NOW!
Regular joes might not fish in winter, but industries do. Why the hell do you think they got icebreakers? HMMM?
@Melissa4U1987 People have killed animals in the wild for eons, well before our own numbers exploded. That is not why wild animals are killed. However, apply that same logic to the seals. They will become overpopulated and starve which is why to keep healthy herds so many need to be removed. It is those regular joes that we're talking about, the fishermen whose fisheries do not take out of the water as much as the seals.
@Ersabette NO...humans need to be removed. Then everything will be in balance once again. They are already starving due to the lack of ice and other animals are starving because there aren't enough seals.
The same can be said about humans..."They will become overpopulated and starve which is why to keep a healthy population, so many need to be removed!"
@Ersabette you are far from being scientific with your low canadian iq.sorry for telling this but YOU/WE ARE NOT THE ONES to decide the population of a wild animal.In your sick perspective we hunt them to end their missery with a mass murder.Ecosystem has its balance in itself for all cases(starvation, diseases etc)You are telling us that we can kill 400000 seals because they are surplus not even thinking about the food chain and the role of the seals in it apart from killing them cruelly.
@freakquency85 Your discrimination is disgusting. I'm not sure what world you think you live in but we as humans are part of that ecosystem. We depend on nature just as much as the seals and to think by not hunting seals we are doing them a favour is much more harmful than humanely removing a percentage to keep healthy herds. It is because of the food chain (which we are a part) that balance occurs. It is greed that causes an unbalance in nature threatening whole species.
@Ersabette Yes i am dicriminating the ones that shares your sick ideas.I am blaming the canadians who havent guts to protest against their government.Its also applicable for japan for their mass murder of whales, dolphins and also for the ones in my country.Yes i am dicriminating all these people because i am sick of this cruelty and their defenders, any insult isnt just enough for them.Go and do some more research about ecosystem before mixing 7 billion overpopulated humans to subject
@freakquency85 You're right, it's not humane to kill seals cruelly. The Canadian commercial seal hunt is not an example of this. "the clubbing of seal pups is, when properly performed, at least as humane as, and often more humane than, the killing methods used in commercial slaughterhouses, which are accepted by a majority of the public" Malouf '86 Why is it acceptable for a killer whale or a polar bear to rip a seal a part but it's cruel when a human shoots them all in the same name of survival
@freakquency85 "An ecosystem is a complex set of relationships among the living resources, habitats, and residents of an area. It includes...animals, fish,...and people...Everything that lives in an ecosystem is dependent on the other species and elements that are also part of that ecological community. If one part of an ecosystem is damaged or disappears, it has an impact on everything else.' Therefore Yes, it is my job and yours to sustain and balance populations. If our own numbers are going
@Ersabette to continue to rise each one of us has a responsibility to nature to protect it and not overindulge in her resources which we most certainly depend on. Starvation/disease can wipe out the whole herd rendering them extinct. 400,000 was set with the food chain in mind. Harp seals consume more fish than all the fisheries across Canada take from the water. That's a significant impact on their habitats, 9million seals is not sustainable.
@Ersabette You are wrong about the facts that can wipe out a species.forms of disease and starvation in ideal habitat(especially untouched by humans ) isnt capable to entirely wipe out a species.There will be immune individuals in population as well as the ones live on despite starvation.The real problem is humans sticking their nose into everything that affects the pop. from demolition of natural habitats to excessive hunting.So murdering an individual pop. is far away from being a solution
@freakquency85 If there is no food left to feed them the whole herd will go extinct. No animal regardless of it's strength or immunity can survive starvation. Humans "stick their nose into everything "because we are a part of the ecosystem. As I said, if one part of an ecosystem is damaged or disappears it has an impact on everything else. I certainly do not agree with excessive hunting however it is because of sustainable hunting that species are able to thrive.
@Ersabette Extinction of a healthy(by means of healthy i mean sufficient number of anmals in a balanced ecosystem) because of starvation and diseases is highly unlikely. Fact that drives a species to extinct is humanity itself by overpopulating, hunting and other interventions by human hand.Any increase in seal population will lead an increase in their hunters population and will eventually bring the resource rivalry among the population which brings balance to it without human intervention.
@freakquency85 The seals ecosystem is not balanced. Fish stocks are dwindling as the seal herd increases. 2010/2011 pop estimations put the seals at around 9 million, 2006 estimates was 4-6 million. The hunters are decreasing in numbers, the last 2 years catches were far below the set quota. Seals were pupping 2 mos early this year and 100s were found dead ashore, all signs of over population. Humans intervene even indirectly. There is absolutely no way for humans to exist and not effect nature.
@Ersabette You're right We are already doing enough cruelty in slaughterhouses and i am against any kind of cruelty to animals at all.i am not that kind of a person saying seals are too cute to murder but crocodiles, buffalos etc are ok.the question here is more of a moral one than a logical one.As human beings has the ability to reason anyone with conscience can say that this kind of action is inhumane and also not essential for food and economic purposes let alone skinning.ıts fairly evitable
@freakquency85 You must be against polar bears and orcas feeding on seals then too? What happens in the wild is much more inhumane than what happens during the hunt. To allow seals to starve when we can prevent it is inhumane and cruel. Humans are also predators and balance is maintained because of our hunting. Living in a rural area I do depend on wildlife like seals as a means of food. Having food shipped in is expensive which is why for sealers this industry is so important.
@Ersabette Of course not.I am saying that the humanity must prevent any kind of intervention to a wild animal population that doesnt naturally meant to be on their diet.Polars and orcas are natural hunters of seals we are not.Also before first european sealers came there were ~30 million harp seals which the canadians excessive hunt drops it to 1.8 million(their minimum) by 70's and now the estimation is on 5 million.So the seals consuming fish stocks is only a hype to justify such cruel actions
@freakquency85 Man has always fed upon the land and sea including seals, for 1000s of years. We feed on what's local to us. Who are you to say what we are naturally meant to have on our diets? Perhaps you feel unhealthy processed foods is what we are meant to eat just so we don't intervene on wild pops? What pop models was used to count all those seals 100s of years ago? I repeat, recent survey was taken ('10/'11) and puts the seals pop at 9million strong, the largest on record.
@Ersabette Now this is ridiculous.you are justifying this hunt by giving hunts took place 1000s of years ago.And yes we may be omnivore animals but i am sure that seals arent meant to be on our diet since our origins rooted from africa and its our intelligence which makes us survive on extreme conditions not our strength but thats not the point.I am repeating only if we set aside our humanity we can do such actions.Dont tell me this is humane.Efsa rep. mentions how humane it is pls dont be blind
@freakquency85 The way the world worked before the industrial age apart from improper sanitation was much healthier than how we live now. Again, we feed on what's local to us because it's convenient. I wouldn't expect someone surrounded by trees to survive on fish. We need strength to obtain food. Food/water and shelter is what keeps us alive. Our intelligence is fed by proper nutrition. Have you ever tried functioning (physically and mentally) while malnourished? EFSA reps do say how humane
@Ersabette the hunt is and then ignored or flat out didn't read their own report and voted against the importation of seal products because it's "inhumane"!
@Ersabette you are doing circles again by missing the point.Its not vital to hunt seals for you for fisheries and anybdy living in canada at all.Its an off season catch for greedy hunters and thats all.I am sure without the seal hunt they can deplete fish stocks in a decade for "proper nutrition"In my point of view if any intervention to wild life is evitable so evite.Its not only for seals its applicable for crocodiles, sharks, elephants, dolphins any wild animal murdered by same ideas.
@freakquency85 How ignorant and intolerant you are of differing lifestyles. For people living in rural, coastal communities the seal hunt, fishing and hunting is vital. Sealing is not "an off season catch for greedy hunters." Sealing makes up part of their income or perhaps you missed that part? Taking what we need to surive is not being greedy. Murder is a human related term or you have to apply that to the vary seals you are trying to protect because they too "murder" other species.
@Ersabette yeah with an average %20 part of their income be realistic and grow up pls.The problem is here that the canada has superior life standarts comparing any other country.Please dont justify your pointless idea with that.I am living in turkey and here many people live considerably lower life standarts comparing to any of you in rural areas without the need of beating an animal to death.Dont wait for me to say ohh poor little sealers they will die if they dont commit their annual crime.
@freakquency85 Would you be willing to give up 20% of your income? That's almost 1/4, could you afford that? Your prejudice of Canada is unfounded. There are many here living lower life standards as well. Perhaps if these poeple utilized natural resources they would be in a better position, instead many focus on dumpsters or hand-outs. I don't want your pity and neither do the sealers. I can't speak for them but I'm not complaining about my life. It is when people like yourself try to tell me
@Ersabette If thats the problem is that bloody %20 convince your govt and millions of environmentalist includng me will happily donate your total 56 million in a day.Perhaps your govt can cut the military budget by %0.25 and pay that money to your poor sealers.
@freakquency85 We don't want your hand-outs in place of a perfectly viable industry. It is only because of you "environmentalists' (HA! yeah right) that the industry is in turmoil. You fight to shut down markets thinking that will stop the slaughter but are ignorant that the seals will be killed anyhow because they need to be. You cry the seal hunt is inhumane but sentence the seals to slow painful death by starvation/disease! I think you need to brush up on what being an environmentalist is.
@Ersabette You also forget that this is part of their 'annual' income. Are you going to make that 5%-35% loss of income to the sealers EVERY year? I doubt it.
@Ersabette Arggh when will you understand that starvation and diseases are natural processes.Do some research about the tasmanian devils and individuals immune to face tumor disease in a population(also in a pop. facing extinction) or african buffalos and the immune individuals in isolated herds .Its completely natural but our greed destroying wild life makes fairly difficult than it is.
@freakquency85 The seal hunt is not destroying the species. They are not endangered. Up until 2 years ago when catch rates were high they were thriving. Since then we are seeing early pupping and 100s dead seals washing ashore. I'm not interested in the tasmanian devils, how can a land animal compare to an sea creature? If you become diseased than I hope you do absolutely nothing about it because according to you it's a "natural process". Seals do not have many predators to do what humans are
@Ersabette doing now - keeping the pop in check. That is why a food chain even exists or nothing could survive because no habitat could sustain such an over abundance of all species. Like it or not, we are a part of the food chain.
@Ersabette hahah you are out of your mind.Land animals or not its not the point but you couldnt get it.I am telling diseases happen in herds but the immune individuals will be present in any herd.Its pointless to say "but its a land animal blabla"also omparing humans with that is another fault.Beleive or not we already are defeating vast majority of diseases with our immune system(for viral inf. its completely) and also our body produces cancer cells and manage to destroy them if its functional
@freakquency85 İ am trying to tell you by giving these examples is we hunt them or not the herd will survive without intervention.Their pop. will fluctuate but stronger individuals will live on.So the idea of hunting seals to end their misery isnt justified at all.
@freakquency85 and also its not canadian govts job to decide whether the pop of harp seals is adequate or not.We are living in a world with many factors affecting nature and wild life.Considering the extinct species in last century and the global warming we cant ensure a species future by looking at numbers.5million 9 million whatever it is can be adequate for them to survive now but cant think it will be in future.
@freakquency85 That is why gov't employs scientists to advise gov't officials. Looking at the numbers has worked for over 40 years of regulated hunting. Must be doing something right if the pop has exploded to where it is now.
@Ersabette or maybe its just because we caused a dramatic decrease of seals natural hunters in sea and land life?Making two wrongs doesnt make a right.
@freakquency85 "we hunt them or not the herd will survive without intervention" if this is true then let bygones be bygones. If you do not agree with hunting don't do it but accept that others have a different lifestyle then you. It's also not to end their misery, it's to prevent it. We can not predict the outcome of the seals because other species may have survived similar situations. Seals are a natural, renewable resource. To favour synthetics in place of natural causes more damage.
@freakquency85 The cause of our disease is due largely to improper nutrition. So you are suggesting we allow the seals to continue to glutton themselves on fish until the fish are all gone - the sealers then not only losing sealing but fishing as well. Removing humans from the equation is not the answer. Humans will utilize the earth but we need to do it responsibily. Stopping sealing is not responsible unless they're endangered.
@Ersabette You are giving example with extreme cases which in our discussion is pointless.You dont have any stats about the fish that seals consume and you cant tell it exactly either.You are talking hypothetically.You are right about the fact that the fish population will decrease but it wont be as dramatically as you said.Dont forget seals arent the only natural hunters of fish you can count a thousand species in sea life as well.
@freakquency85 Seals do consume fish, they are also opportunist feeders which means they eat what's available to them. Considering that that seals consume more fish than all the fisheries across Can. take from the water it really doesn't matter what species they eat. Add 9 million seals to all those other predators of fish including humans and we have an unbalanced ecosystem. There is video of a few seals corning a large school of cod and herring in a cove to feed at their leisure.
@Ersabette I know also dolphins tend to hunt in the same way. they may be opportunist they may eat a lot but i am telling that if we share an ecosystem we have to tolerate other species hunting down a part of a population cruelly isnt the answer for that.wild life survived millions of years without any human intervention and undoubtly will survive without it.
@freakquency85 its also neither vital nor profitable in any sense regarding the statistics.You know anything wont change in your life standarts in case of a ban on seal hunt by canadian govt.The only people who can defend such an act would be a sealer or a sealers relative. Any other idea doesnt come to my mind. Thanks god any reasonable people with commonsense is against those crimes.
@freakquency85 I don't know who you think you are telling me it won't change in my life or the sealers! You don't know anything about me or them. It is obvious you are getting your information from the likes of PeTA, IFAW, SSCS and HSUS. The majority agree with seal hunting. "6 out of 10 Canadians
indicated that they accept seal hunting by any hunter where populations are not endangered and animal
welfare is respected." There is nothing out there saying otherwise, even internationally.
@Ersabette So this proves??Ask anyone their opinion including so called 3rd world countries and including developing countries you will get a %85 against the seal hunt.Isolated from the economic and local factors its one of the most inhumane things in the world.Try to gather 3 people supporting this and get them to canadian embasy but you know you cant.
@freakquency85 Oh please, you're speaking hypothetically. There is nothing saying that the majority is against seal hunting. The fact of the matter is that the majority just doesn't care or there would be much larger turn outs to these protests but time and again when PeTa shows up it hardly draws any kind of crowd, regardless where it's to. EFSA's report states the hunt is humane, so do other peer reviewed reports. What peer reviewed reports have PeTa or IFAW conducted on the hunt? None.
@freakquency85 Why is it okay for a polar bear or a orca to rip a seal a part but it is cruel for a man to shoot one to feed his family? Please answer me that.
@Ersabette If you have ability to reason then you are different from any species.This is what makes you different from other animals this is what makes you defend and oppose ideas.Please dont try to justify this with a such lame way.
@freakquency85 It's not lame at all, it's perfectly logical. Polar bears and orcas kill seals to survive, so does man. Reason or not we all need to survive. I would argue though that animals are able to reason as well.
@Ersabette so you cant survive without eating seal meat or wearing a fur lol.Any animal including orcas and polar bears(which unfortunately facing extinction or at least threatened) hunts to survive yes.But on our case its not even close about the survival please dont mention about survival, you are not in a post apocalytic world or facing a nuclear winter.Be realistic and pls answer me.is that hunt evitable?, do we need that? do i need to hunt animals for their fur?
@freakquency85 The sealers sell the pelt for what...MONEY which yes is also required to surivive. A meal of seal saves me from having to buy something. I would love to have my own garden but I don't have the land to do so. I buy locally and refrain from buying factory farmed meat as much as possible. Fish, moose and seal, all that we caught or hunted ourselves makes up a lot of my meals so we can use our money to keep a roof over our head. This is reality, it may not be yours but it's mine.
@freakquency85 Yes, we do need the hunt. For ourselves and the seals. If you can afford to buy all your meals from the grocery store then no, you don't need to hunt but accept that others live differently from you. It doesn't make it wrong because you can live another way.
@Ersabette Also sealing hasnt got any important economic role on fisheries.The totla income generated from the hunts is set to be 56million dollars a year and this hunts impact on fishermans earnings is just a 5 percent.So it hasnt any significant role at all let alone seal products are forbidden in eu and US.Of course you can depend on wild life when its needed but this mass murder is evitable if you look at the numbers.The sealers should have some mercy in place of a 5% in their pocket
@freakquency85 Sealing is significant to a sealer and can represent anywhere from 5% to 35% of a sealers income. Activists complain that the seal is wasted and do everything in their power with all their millions of dollars to shut down the markets that beter utilize the seal. Our gov't is working on a market in China, IFAW was there too counteracting their efforts. Regardless of that, the industry comes secondary after wildlife management. If we are going to use wildlife we must manage it.
What may be obvious to you is not obvious for everyone. These pictures were taken by me on our way to our crab grounds. The use of the hakapik or club makes up about 5% of the hunt. Rifles are primarily used to kill the seals. Evolution does have its place to benefit society. Evolving from using natural, renewable, biodegradable and sustainable resources like the seals will not benefit man, beast or planet, only hinder them. Oh hey, your ignorance is showing!
Taking the skin off a babie seal isnt a resource, FUR is NO LONGER NECESARY in a society since the stone age! we now have dozens of none living resources for making clothes! but hey! Lets all go with our Clubs and start a killing rampage for "Necesary" babie FUR :D
@Lastthief Fur and seals are a resource that is necessary. The synthetic alternatives you speak of do not support a sustainable future - they are made with non renewable resources like petroleum. Perhaps you should look into how your food and clothing are produced and chemically treated with harmful toxins. Synthetics are not healthy for man or planet and a synthetic life is not one I wish to lead.
Baby seals have not been killed since the late 1980's as far as I know. Yet every video I've watched and every anti seal poster all have baby seals. What's up with that?
@GESSO217 You're right, the babies have not been hunted for over 20 years and yet the whitecoated image continues to be used because it brings in the money as does the brutal image of the hakapik even though it is hardly used in the hunt. Without these activist groups can not sell their campaign.
Seals aren't overpopulated yet but they are at risk if the hunt stops which will result in a government sponsored cull. Please research the importance of wildlife management. What are you doing about our over population?
@Lastthief It is an honest question and something you should be looking into. There are many things you can do that will make a huge difference like choosing products that are sustainably manufactured like organics and natural. Some green practises like composting and recycling can also make a difference. It's not just about our numbers, it's about how sustainably we choose to live that is important and synthetics are not the answer.
Interesting, What evidence to you have to support this statement? She does not appear to be insane in any way. She has made some very sane and mature statements.
here is the problem Ersabette with the ECoNUTTERS . There are EuroSnobs.
6 million JEWS DEAD during world war 2 . over 50 million dead in Europe because of their last in a long line of Continental land wars.
You are right about the truth not being on their propaganda or no room for decent .One Man Censor is another Mans Propagandist is another Mans Eurotrash who are the finest examples of Hypocrisy throughout the history of Mankind.
Let's look at it this way: Right now we have a hunt that manages the harp seal pop, is monitored and provides income to familes because much of the seal is utilized. Remove the hunt and the herd goes unchecked, the pop continues to increase and the seals begin to starve and/or die of disease. A cull will then be needed, it will not be monitored and little to nothing of the seal will be used because there are no longer any markets. The seals will be treated like they are in the UK, as pests and
permitted to be killed on the spot. Anyone can buy, bait and put out a trap to kill a pesky mouse in their basement, perhaps not checking to see if the problem is taken care of until they head off for work the next morning. Who knows how long it took that mouse to die but that is acceptable and will also be acceptable for the seals. So, which is worse, a hunt that is monitored, the seals are killed to sustain people and manage the seals pop or consider the seals as pests and not care at all?
thats a good point. its funny the meat eaters seem to do more for animals than all these vegan activists. they just talk a lot but dont do anything in their personal lives except quit eating meat. i had humane mouse traps before when i had a mouse problem. i used these little boxes where the door opens then locks shut. then i took the little creatures in my car and drove 20 miles just to free them in the woods. how many vegans would do that? they just talk a lot about how superior they are.
Then they cry wolf when those statements are directed back at them. I too have recieved my share of unpleasantries. They will not stop me from speaking out. These kind of statements only reveal that people, regardless of what side they are on have nothing more intelligent to say.
Thanks Bran! I saw the article. What I find frustrating is that rather than confirm the facts themselves people blindly believe these misquotes and feed off them. It also doesn't matter when those misquotes are corrected - these people are too involved emotionally to consider anything else.
Paul Watson, Green Peace and many other organisations are the only reason White Coats are not killed today.
THEY SAVED THEM!
99% of the seals killed so far by Newfoundlanders have been white coats. Do the maths and you will see that I don't lie. Not killing white coats is a recent change.
I think the people who got the white coats protection have every right to display them as a sign of their victories so far.
Nearly 22 Years ! That's how long it's been since whitecoats have not legally been hunted in Canada.
Yet a recent cartoon from one of the activists featured white coats being killed. Why ? Because he obviously thought whitecoats had been hunted more recently than 1987.
More than 95% of the seals hunted are 1 to 3.5 months of age according to the EFSA, and harp seals shed their white coats well before three weeks. They started shedding before two weeks.
Then there's the fact that most of the people posting these generic white coat picture slide shows here on Youtube weren't even born by 1987 or old enough to have protested the hunt up to 1986.
How could anyone 21 and under possibly be using them "as a sign of their victories so far" ? It's even highly questionable whether people under 32 can use that excuse because they would have been 10 years old or less during the main protests in 1986.
They are an achievment we can be proud of. If it wasn't for our actions, they would be being killed still today.
Soon we will get the rest of the Harp seals protection, and then we are coming to save your Moose and Cod too!
:)
We do this because we care, and because NL has potential to be the best tourism destination on the planet. The place is a goldmine, why can nobody see that?
Beautiful scenery, animals and even people when not emotional.
You speak of emotion when emotion is the very thing that carries your campaign to stop the hunt! Moose? Oh my... Moose and caribou in some areas in NL are actually OVER populated. Their habitats can not sustain them, heard that about the caribou right from a DFO observers mouth.
Did you know that cars are running into trees as well?
They are totally over populated and need to be destroyed. Its honestly not humans its the trees! They hate us for our freedom!
Natural populations stabilise by themselves. Something the DFO would discover if they ever gave them a chance instead of always trying to play god and usually failing.
In Australia we have started using chemical nuetering darts very successfully. Just break the breeding and no killin!
I have heard from more than one activist who have said why wait until the seals are extinct before doing something, I say why wait until they are starving to death or dieing from disease before acting. Really, I do love this higher morality and righteousness "something the DFO would discover [...]" and you're not government why exactly? I mean, you know better than the experts, right? Of course, what's good for Australia automatically becomes good for everyone else. Mmmhmmm
Sometimes the balance does not return and in the end one species, usually the prey, dies out in that general area. And for the most part it is in some way the fault of us, humans. Either way, it is possible, and quite possibly happening. Should action not be taken to prevent this?
We already have tourist destinations featuring harp seals in Atlantic Canada and they aren't that popular. And these are more accessible than the ice flows of the Gulf Of St. Laurence, where no seals are commercially hunted so the seal hunt is not relevant to the lack of tourists there.
There is also eco tourism already in the Gulf of St. Laurence but it isn't successful because people want to touch them, which would cause these seals to starve to death.
That said I find it rather interesting that you would bring up cod when Canada was not responsible for the foreign overfishing, that as a member of Greenpeace you should have been aware of.
When the cod fishery was suspended in Canada foreign fishermen continued resulting in protests by Greenpeace.
This went on for years and I don't see why you would think the situation is so amusing as to offer a smiley face after mentioning it.
"There is also eco tourism already in the Gulf of St. Laurence but it isn't successful because people want to touch them, which would cause these seals to starve to death."
Wow.
Don't you guys have gloves in Canada?
And somehow I dont think the small potential that a few seal pups might be abandoned in any way compares to hundreds of thousands of them being killed?
The slightest smell triggers a reaction in moms, who just leave out of confusion or disgust. This would cause deaths, which would be hypocritical for you to support.
Yours is a pipe dream that has yet to be justifies by the eco-tourism figures that currently exist. You're just desperately trying to tie tourism to the hunt and it fails.
"The slightest smell triggers a reaction in moms, who just leave out of confusion or disgust. This would cause deaths, which would be hypocritical for you to support."
Somehow I doubt some tourism that resulted in worst case scenario a few pups being abandoned in any way compares to 300,000 being killed by the skin and organ traders!
So you see no hypocrisy there ? That's rather interesting.
The numbers just don't add up in regards to tourism and the only way it would is if every whelping area were flooded with tourists, resulting in these shy animal scampering off elsewhere or remaining to be contaminated with our smell.
In one statement you claim tourism will fix it all and then in another statement you claim there wont be any ice because of global warming for these animals to give birth on.
How the hell are tourists supposed to view baby seals on ice that isn't there ?!
Make up your damn mind and come to the table with something tangible !
I have an idea!!!! How about we stop animal testing and start testing on humans, I don't think the small potential that a few humans might die or suffer in any way compares to the hundreds of thousands of them being saved!! Since you inspired this break through how about you volunteer first!!
As I recall I said animals, not seals specifically and I'm quite sure you are aware of the millions of people saved because of animal testing. I'm also sure I do not have to explain my comment further as I was using your own words to make my point.
I did a search thru peer reviewed articles on 2 databases and I couldn't find a single one with harp seal testing that could be considered something that would save a human life.
There is a huge swing towards human testing these days. Nothing ethical, just gives better results and the animal testing is expensive.
We are lucky that we have India as our medical playground!
Its easy, the DFO class seal penis as 'seal organ'. If you doubt that Canada is the world leader in animal penis exports why dont you contact the DFO for further infomation?
Thats what I did, and I have tonnes of data here in an info pack they sent me.
What was the specific number or address you had used to contact DFO? I want to be sure that when I contact them I will recieve the same "info pack" you did.
Still waiting for that contact information for DFO. I checked the site but there's a few numbers and addresses to choose from, I'd like the one you used, if you could pass that on I'd appreciate it.
Hello, thanks for watching. Did you read the video descpription? Notice the username that is not my own that has been tagged, actually check out the links provided, especially the second to last one that is to a video that is connected to that username? I really don't think so because if you had this video would made sense and you would not have said what you did.
deadfishfloating: I have read that it is illegal to trade harp seal penis in Canada, where are you getting your info? Have you heard of bully sticks? If you have a dog most likely you have given one to him/her to gnaw on and perhaps not even know that it's bulls penis. You may also have given your dog pigs ears and/or snout or maybe cow hooves. Besides what you may give to your pet who knows what you could find in your local grocery store or market.
in response is that the seal hunters have found a way around this and now ship the whole carcus to China so they can not be told they are just shipping/selloing seal penis'. This also allows them to say they are exporting 90% of the seal meat to China with the intentional ruis that it's all to be eaten. It's not. Only the penis is eaten.
Actually, the biggest buyer of harp seal penis back when there was a small trade in the 80s was Canada. In 1987 large vessels were prohibited from hunting seals, what this means is that there is not enough room in the smaller boats to bring back whole carcasses. Sure, a sealer or two may sneak and send a few off but not on the grand scale you imply with your generalizations. I have asked sealers about the penis trade and they do not do it nor have they heard of anyone else doing it either.
This teenager, juzu4me, claimed he had the ability to see everywhere I was going on the internet and thereby accused me of visiting illegal subject websites. I told him if that was the case he should tell me what my favorite military collecting website was. No response, of course. Classic. His motivations were obvious. I'm not liked in certain very small circles for my position, but I am loved in much, much larger ones. I guess it's the other way around for you, huh Canucktunes?
For me it is not about being liked, it is about standing up for what is right which I will continue to do as it is my right to do so. Throughout your recent comments here you have contradicted yourself, filing a complaint for Canuck's repeated reports of violations and defamation however this is [atleast] your second complaint filed. I suppose what you're asking is for us to mind our own business when we see something questionable. I would rather express my concerns to YouTube and let them
decide then stay silent when speaking up could have made a difference. You do not want your personal info released however force that info from others with your accusations - Canuck's occupation for instance. You speak of opiniated debate yet say you are posting truth and fact. You say we threaten banishment for not sharing the same opinion however you banish us from your videos, regardless of your excuse for doing so it is still banishment and censorship.
Thank God there are people like you around.
StJohnsSealer 2 weeks ago
@ersabette This is a good statement Ersabette, last time I checked the EU were taking a rather unhelpful stance. Has this moved on at all from the NFL perspective? I would be quite happy to shovel a few spade fulls of 'lobbying' at my MEP if you think it might be helpful to the cause.
sobranie007 8 months ago
@sobranie007 Thanks! Any and all support is welcome. There are no new developments in the EU ban that I'm aware of. Canadian Gov't is focusing on markets in China while they wait on the WTO. It's ironic that the EU now has the largest seal slaughter.
Ersabette 8 months ago
@Ersabette could you give us some of the stats on the EU's seal slaughter? It would be interesting to see how our politicians in Europe reconcile it with the ban on
the import of seal products from Canada
sobranie007 8 months ago
@sobranie007 "Greenland kills about 70,000 harp seals a year for both commercial and domestic use....Denmark’s own annual hunt is the equivalent of all of Canada’s total 2010 seal harvest. Norway continues on with an annual seal hunt, Iceland is in much the same situation where an “underground” commercial hunt has existed for years along with the practice of an extensive harp seal cull to protect salmon pops. Finland, Ireland, Scotland...England also support similar annual seal culls.
Ersabette 8 months ago
@Ersabette I believe all you say Ersabette, but I'm afraid you're preaching to the converrted. It's those biggots in the EU that have to move. I'll see what I can do ....
sobranie007 8 months ago
@sobranie007 Thank you, I appreciate that.
Ersabette 8 months ago
@Ersabette Interesting to note that Iceland's seal hunters have been forced underground by the authorities - I wish they'd do the same thing to their bankers .....
sobranie007 8 months ago
@travshow At the time it had to do with how I thought the seals were killed. I also remember watching a video in 10th grade of whitecoat being skinned alive. Years later during my research I discovered that "photographers" paid a sealer to do that even though that was not how it was done. I had a preconcieved notion of sealing formed by ARA's. As I've gotten older I have a better understanding of how the world works. If I didn't have any issue with sealing I wouldn't discuss it so passionately.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@travshow First I asked if you had reviewed and included the pro-side and shared my thought of what it would mean if you had not included that information. Asking is not a form of bias but yes, I am skeptical of your video. I was once very into PETA and against sealing myself. I believe what makes the most sense to me and the ARA side makes none. Good luck on your exam. It was a pleasure. Take care!
Ersabette 11 months ago
@travshow Ah so you have reviewed and included the pro-side as well, peer reviewed reports from EFSA, CVMA, Malouf, IVWG, etc, etc because if not your dramatic conclusion is biased and nothing more than a collection of ARA material (that has not been peer reviewed) all neatly put into one place for easy viewing. If the ARA's themselves, after over 40 years, have not been able to do what you propose you are about to, I'm sorry but I doubt your "evidence" will hold any weight.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@travshow ARA's, who mind you have the funds and then some, have been trying to "tell the truth" and prove the seal hunt is unnecessary and inhumane,etc for over 40 years and have failed but let me know when your saving grace is up and I'll have a look.
Ersabette 11 months ago
.@Ersabette and i am repeating ITS NOT HUMANE to kill seals cruelly .You are repeating this:"Oh look they are overpopulating so we must kill 400000 of them like in a fps game or else they will starve and we wont have an healthy(ahaha) herd.please get it its not YOUR JOB to mass murder a species to balance their population.Diseases, starvation, birth and death rates etc are all dynamics of a population so forming healthy herds is just a pathetic excuse.
freakquency85 11 months ago
Wow, you must sit at your computer all goddamn day trashing the truth about what's happening out there. You only take the words from those who decieve, lie. Where's YOUR proof that you pull from your fat seal ass and not others!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Interesting, I ask you who you were out on the ice with and what experience you have that makes your opinion superior to my own and you flat out ignore that but continue to claim I am the one taking others words for it because I haven't personally been out on the ice. You are doing the exact same thing.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Well then, practice what you preach and go out there on your own and see first hand what they do, and then come back and try to tell me otherwise. Where do you live in Canada?
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Why should I, you haven't. Besides, I'm not the one claiming I don't know what I'm talking about because I haven't been on the ice. I'm pretty close to those that have been though. Read my profile if you want to know where I live. I'm going to take a guess and say you haven't lived any where but in a city.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette I live in the country bitch and always have been, I know what the environment and animals go through on a daily basis! I see first hand the destruction that humans cause. What the hell would you know, you live in an "urban area". No environment there at all.
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Wrong, read my profile again. I do not live in an urban area at all, I used to.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette still the same, home is where the heart is, and yours is tarnished.
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Home is where the heart is, that is true. My heart is here and this is my home.
Ersabette 1 year ago
If not using your common sense or using compassion towards another species makes you human...then what the hell are the rest of us? Guess we are smart Aliens or something. We care about the world and it's creatures like from the movie "The Day the Earth Srood Still". "We are here to save the planet and animals from "humans""
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Your idea of saving animals causes them more suffering. If the hunt stops (which you fight for) a gov't sponsored cull will replace it to manage their populations. If not they will suffer a slow death by starvation and/or disease. How's that for compassion?
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette How the hell does it cause them more suffering?!?!? People make mistakes and then make excuses for the things they've done. You are barbaric!
There is nothing wrong with the seals population, the problem lies with human population destroying everything including species of animals. There is no compassion in humans, especially not you!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 I'm not making excuses at all. The seals are increasing in numbers despite the hunt that removes 4-6% of the over-all population. I don't know about you but I need to eat just like the seals and I refuse to fill my face with unhealthy, cancer causing processed foods. Your arguments are fallacious and a complete waste of my time. When you wish to contribute something worthwhile let me know.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette That's what you call owning a farm and growing or raising your own food. Oh, and I don't know about you, but I don't wanna fill my face with unhealthy mercury poison! "I refuse to fill my face with unhealthy, cancer causing processed foods."...but you have no problem with poision or giving others poison.
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 It is hypocritical to claim it's okay to raise cattle for food but not kill from the wild. Farming is not viable throughout the whole of NL. I would love to have my own garden but it's not possible. I do buy locally and organic as much as possible. The seals that are killed have not had time to accumulate the level of mercury that exists in older seals.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Farms are TOTALLY different then from the wild. The wild is in balance, well it was until you lunatics started stirring up BS destroying what use to be perfection. If you guys are sooooooo hard up about money and food....MOVE! DUH!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 In the basic sense that animals are killed for our use, no, farming is no different that killing from the wild. Many wild species are not in balance, due to over-regulation/protection rendering them in many cases over-populated for their habitats. In fact, I'd much rather use a wild resource than one that has been caged up all it's life. Many people in urban areas are hard up as well, moving is not always the answer.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette "Many wild species are not in balance, due to over-regulation/protection rendering them in many cases over-populated for their habitats."
WRONG AGAIN! If it wasn't for the human SPECIES to start destroying environments and habitats, everything WOULD be in balance. They aren't overpopulated, humans are.They aren't invading our space when they come on our porches or near our homes, we are invading their homes. MORE and MORE people populate into areas which were NOT meant for us to be
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Where do you expect humans to live, on the moon? Be real.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette There are other areas in the world that is deserted or whatever that have no humans in between different places. Places where you have to travel a long time in order to find another rest stop. THOSE are the places where humans can live.. NOT cut down forests and dig up wetlands for some sleezy mansion!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Completely unrealistic. If those places are still deserted they are most likely unhabitable, too far from a source of water for example. Even so trees would still need to be cut down to provide shelter (even for a shack) and heat.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Ever heard of "green housing" My you don't know much. Anyways, They are deserted because people don't wanna live there BECAUSE there is no people. Nothing there to do, nothing to see. There is water, but people are just too damn lazy to look for it.
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 And the same thing will eventually happen in these places as is happening right now. Moving the problem isn't going to solve the problem.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Getting rid of the problem will solve the problem. The problem is humans. GOODBYE HUMANS!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 As I said, I doubt you'd be the first in line for that one. Hypocrit.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette not a hypocrite, YOU ARE!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Ersabette The animals would only starve to death if you keep fishing THEIR food! Which their diet only consits of 3% of cod, so they won't starve...actually the more seals there are, the less the polar bears and orcas have to starve. Your not only doing damage to the seals, but to the WHOLE ecosystem!!! FOR SHAME!!! You are a disgrace for a Canadian! How dare you call yourself a canadian when you like to have blood on your hands!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Do the math: 6.9 millions seals by 3% and that's a lot of cod, not to mention that over all, seals consume more fish than all the fisheries off Canada's coasts take from the water. I think you'd also be interested in a recent poll conducted on the Canadian attitudes towards sealing and it would seem that your opinion of the hunt and towards your countrymen is a minority view. If you'd like to see the poll I'll send you the link.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Do you know how much is 3%? Why don't you do the real math, if you are such a mathwiz! 3% is like a decimal to what the fisheries take. Seals MIGHT catch at the maximum 5 fish per day (if they can find) them, but the fisheries can catch THOUSANDS in nets in a day. Yeah, that doesn't equal out, nor is there any comparrison.
I know what the poll is, and no it isn't the minority, I'll send you ther REAL estimate!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Seals are opportunist feeders which means they eat whatever is available to them and as much of it as they can. They eat much more than 5 fish a day. @ 6.9 million seals, my stats that the seals consume more fish then all the fisheries in Canada is correct, fishing being a seasonal occupation, the seals kill and eat fish all year long.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette well yeah you would too if that's all you had to eat. What else are they suppose to fucking eat?? Seaweed? Go get some brains and some real facts.
It's THEIR fish, it's not your fish, it's NATURE. It's not yours to decide what they can or cannot eat, and when to eat it. Animals come first before humans, animals die, we ALL die! That's a fact for you right there! One thing dies out of the ecosystem, the rest falls with it.
Seasonal my ass!They don't have icebreakers for nothing!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Humans are a part of nature, we rely on nature as much as other species. If we cease to kill other animals it will not solve anything, only create more problems because we would need to create other means to feed ourselves. If you want to hate on humans you go for it but I doubt you'll be first in line to help decrease our population as you put it. Fishermen here on the east coast do not fish throughout the winter, approx Oct-April. Seals don't stop feeding then as well.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette Yes it will solve everything. People only kill animals out in the wild because of human overpopulation! Stop populating and start decreasing, you will see an astounding difference. The more humans populate, the more they need food, so they get it wherever they can because of starvation BECAUSE there are too many people to feed! THAT IS A FACT! AND THAT IS THE PROBLEM NOW!
Regular joes might not fish in winter, but industries do. Why the hell do you think they got icebreakers? HMMM?
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 People have killed animals in the wild for eons, well before our own numbers exploded. That is not why wild animals are killed. However, apply that same logic to the seals. They will become overpopulated and starve which is why to keep healthy herds so many need to be removed. It is those regular joes that we're talking about, the fishermen whose fisheries do not take out of the water as much as the seals.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette NO...humans need to be removed. Then everything will be in balance once again. They are already starving due to the lack of ice and other animals are starving because there aren't enough seals.
The same can be said about humans..."They will become overpopulated and starve which is why to keep a healthy population, so many need to be removed!"
Which in FACT we are!!!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Melissa4U1987 Your comment "humans need to be removed" is borderline criminal. Humans have many more means of death than seals.
Ersabette 1 year ago
@Ersabette May death be upon all who thinks like you! Criminal or not, it is needed!
Melissa4U1987 1 year ago
@Ersabette you are far from being scientific with your low canadian iq.sorry for telling this but YOU/WE ARE NOT THE ONES to decide the population of a wild animal.In your sick perspective we hunt them to end their missery with a mass murder.Ecosystem has its balance in itself for all cases(starvation, diseases etc)You are telling us that we can kill 400000 seals because they are surplus not even thinking about the food chain and the role of the seals in it apart from killing them cruelly.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Your discrimination is disgusting. I'm not sure what world you think you live in but we as humans are part of that ecosystem. We depend on nature just as much as the seals and to think by not hunting seals we are doing them a favour is much more harmful than humanely removing a percentage to keep healthy herds. It is because of the food chain (which we are a part) that balance occurs. It is greed that causes an unbalance in nature threatening whole species.
Ersabette 11 months ago
Comment removed
freakquency85 11 months ago
@Ersabette Yes i am dicriminating the ones that shares your sick ideas.I am blaming the canadians who havent guts to protest against their government.Its also applicable for japan for their mass murder of whales, dolphins and also for the ones in my country.Yes i am dicriminating all these people because i am sick of this cruelty and their defenders, any insult isnt just enough for them.Go and do some more research about ecosystem before mixing 7 billion overpopulated humans to subject
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 You're right, it's not humane to kill seals cruelly. The Canadian commercial seal hunt is not an example of this. "the clubbing of seal pups is, when properly performed, at least as humane as, and often more humane than, the killing methods used in commercial slaughterhouses, which are accepted by a majority of the public" Malouf '86 Why is it acceptable for a killer whale or a polar bear to rip a seal a part but it's cruel when a human shoots them all in the same name of survival
Ersabette 11 months ago
@freakquency85 "An ecosystem is a complex set of relationships among the living resources, habitats, and residents of an area. It includes...animals, fish,...and people...Everything that lives in an ecosystem is dependent on the other species and elements that are also part of that ecological community. If one part of an ecosystem is damaged or disappears, it has an impact on everything else.' Therefore Yes, it is my job and yours to sustain and balance populations. If our own numbers are going
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette to continue to rise each one of us has a responsibility to nature to protect it and not overindulge in her resources which we most certainly depend on. Starvation/disease can wipe out the whole herd rendering them extinct. 400,000 was set with the food chain in mind. Harp seals consume more fish than all the fisheries across Canada take from the water. That's a significant impact on their habitats, 9million seals is not sustainable.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette You are wrong about the facts that can wipe out a species.forms of disease and starvation in ideal habitat(especially untouched by humans ) isnt capable to entirely wipe out a species.There will be immune individuals in population as well as the ones live on despite starvation.The real problem is humans sticking their nose into everything that affects the pop. from demolition of natural habitats to excessive hunting.So murdering an individual pop. is far away from being a solution
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 If there is no food left to feed them the whole herd will go extinct. No animal regardless of it's strength or immunity can survive starvation. Humans "stick their nose into everything "because we are a part of the ecosystem. As I said, if one part of an ecosystem is damaged or disappears it has an impact on everything else. I certainly do not agree with excessive hunting however it is because of sustainable hunting that species are able to thrive.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Extinction of a healthy(by means of healthy i mean sufficient number of anmals in a balanced ecosystem) because of starvation and diseases is highly unlikely. Fact that drives a species to extinct is humanity itself by overpopulating, hunting and other interventions by human hand.Any increase in seal population will lead an increase in their hunters population and will eventually bring the resource rivalry among the population which brings balance to it without human intervention.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 The seals ecosystem is not balanced. Fish stocks are dwindling as the seal herd increases. 2010/2011 pop estimations put the seals at around 9 million, 2006 estimates was 4-6 million. The hunters are decreasing in numbers, the last 2 years catches were far below the set quota. Seals were pupping 2 mos early this year and 100s were found dead ashore, all signs of over population. Humans intervene even indirectly. There is absolutely no way for humans to exist and not effect nature.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette You're right We are already doing enough cruelty in slaughterhouses and i am against any kind of cruelty to animals at all.i am not that kind of a person saying seals are too cute to murder but crocodiles, buffalos etc are ok.the question here is more of a moral one than a logical one.As human beings has the ability to reason anyone with conscience can say that this kind of action is inhumane and also not essential for food and economic purposes let alone skinning.ıts fairly evitable
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 You must be against polar bears and orcas feeding on seals then too? What happens in the wild is much more inhumane than what happens during the hunt. To allow seals to starve when we can prevent it is inhumane and cruel. Humans are also predators and balance is maintained because of our hunting. Living in a rural area I do depend on wildlife like seals as a means of food. Having food shipped in is expensive which is why for sealers this industry is so important.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Of course not.I am saying that the humanity must prevent any kind of intervention to a wild animal population that doesnt naturally meant to be on their diet.Polars and orcas are natural hunters of seals we are not.Also before first european sealers came there were ~30 million harp seals which the canadians excessive hunt drops it to 1.8 million(their minimum) by 70's and now the estimation is on 5 million.So the seals consuming fish stocks is only a hype to justify such cruel actions
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Man has always fed upon the land and sea including seals, for 1000s of years. We feed on what's local to us. Who are you to say what we are naturally meant to have on our diets? Perhaps you feel unhealthy processed foods is what we are meant to eat just so we don't intervene on wild pops? What pop models was used to count all those seals 100s of years ago? I repeat, recent survey was taken ('10/'11) and puts the seals pop at 9million strong, the largest on record.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Now this is ridiculous.you are justifying this hunt by giving hunts took place 1000s of years ago.And yes we may be omnivore animals but i am sure that seals arent meant to be on our diet since our origins rooted from africa and its our intelligence which makes us survive on extreme conditions not our strength but thats not the point.I am repeating only if we set aside our humanity we can do such actions.Dont tell me this is humane.Efsa rep. mentions how humane it is pls dont be blind
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 The way the world worked before the industrial age apart from improper sanitation was much healthier than how we live now. Again, we feed on what's local to us because it's convenient. I wouldn't expect someone surrounded by trees to survive on fish. We need strength to obtain food. Food/water and shelter is what keeps us alive. Our intelligence is fed by proper nutrition. Have you ever tried functioning (physically and mentally) while malnourished? EFSA reps do say how humane
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette the hunt is and then ignored or flat out didn't read their own report and voted against the importation of seal products because it's "inhumane"!
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette you are doing circles again by missing the point.Its not vital to hunt seals for you for fisheries and anybdy living in canada at all.Its an off season catch for greedy hunters and thats all.I am sure without the seal hunt they can deplete fish stocks in a decade for "proper nutrition"In my point of view if any intervention to wild life is evitable so evite.Its not only for seals its applicable for crocodiles, sharks, elephants, dolphins any wild animal murdered by same ideas.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 How ignorant and intolerant you are of differing lifestyles. For people living in rural, coastal communities the seal hunt, fishing and hunting is vital. Sealing is not "an off season catch for greedy hunters." Sealing makes up part of their income or perhaps you missed that part? Taking what we need to surive is not being greedy. Murder is a human related term or you have to apply that to the vary seals you are trying to protect because they too "murder" other species.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette yeah with an average %20 part of their income be realistic and grow up pls.The problem is here that the canada has superior life standarts comparing any other country.Please dont justify your pointless idea with that.I am living in turkey and here many people live considerably lower life standarts comparing to any of you in rural areas without the need of beating an animal to death.Dont wait for me to say ohh poor little sealers they will die if they dont commit their annual crime.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Would you be willing to give up 20% of your income? That's almost 1/4, could you afford that? Your prejudice of Canada is unfounded. There are many here living lower life standards as well. Perhaps if these poeple utilized natural resources they would be in a better position, instead many focus on dumpsters or hand-outs. I don't want your pity and neither do the sealers. I can't speak for them but I'm not complaining about my life. It is when people like yourself try to tell me
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette I can't live this way, I have to live your way that I have a problem with.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette If thats the problem is that bloody %20 convince your govt and millions of environmentalist includng me will happily donate your total 56 million in a day.Perhaps your govt can cut the military budget by %0.25 and pay that money to your poor sealers.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 We don't want your hand-outs in place of a perfectly viable industry. It is only because of you "environmentalists' (HA! yeah right) that the industry is in turmoil. You fight to shut down markets thinking that will stop the slaughter but are ignorant that the seals will be killed anyhow because they need to be. You cry the seal hunt is inhumane but sentence the seals to slow painful death by starvation/disease! I think you need to brush up on what being an environmentalist is.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette You also forget that this is part of their 'annual' income. Are you going to make that 5%-35% loss of income to the sealers EVERY year? I doubt it.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Arggh when will you understand that starvation and diseases are natural processes.Do some research about the tasmanian devils and individuals immune to face tumor disease in a population(also in a pop. facing extinction) or african buffalos and the immune individuals in isolated herds .Its completely natural but our greed destroying wild life makes fairly difficult than it is.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 The seal hunt is not destroying the species. They are not endangered. Up until 2 years ago when catch rates were high they were thriving. Since then we are seeing early pupping and 100s dead seals washing ashore. I'm not interested in the tasmanian devils, how can a land animal compare to an sea creature? If you become diseased than I hope you do absolutely nothing about it because according to you it's a "natural process". Seals do not have many predators to do what humans are
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette doing now - keeping the pop in check. That is why a food chain even exists or nothing could survive because no habitat could sustain such an over abundance of all species. Like it or not, we are a part of the food chain.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette hahah you are out of your mind.Land animals or not its not the point but you couldnt get it.I am telling diseases happen in herds but the immune individuals will be present in any herd.Its pointless to say "but its a land animal blabla"also omparing humans with that is another fault.Beleive or not we already are defeating vast majority of diseases with our immune system(for viral inf. its completely) and also our body produces cancer cells and manage to destroy them if its functional
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 İ am trying to tell you by giving these examples is we hunt them or not the herd will survive without intervention.Their pop. will fluctuate but stronger individuals will live on.So the idea of hunting seals to end their misery isnt justified at all.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 and also its not canadian govts job to decide whether the pop of harp seals is adequate or not.We are living in a world with many factors affecting nature and wild life.Considering the extinct species in last century and the global warming we cant ensure a species future by looking at numbers.5million 9 million whatever it is can be adequate for them to survive now but cant think it will be in future.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 That is why gov't employs scientists to advise gov't officials. Looking at the numbers has worked for over 40 years of regulated hunting. Must be doing something right if the pop has exploded to where it is now.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette or maybe its just because we caused a dramatic decrease of seals natural hunters in sea and land life?Making two wrongs doesnt make a right.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 And not doing anything about it doesn't make it right either. I have to go. Hopefully we can continue this at a later time. Take care!
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette alright take care.sorry for harsh words in first posts.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 "we hunt them or not the herd will survive without intervention" if this is true then let bygones be bygones. If you do not agree with hunting don't do it but accept that others have a different lifestyle then you. It's also not to end their misery, it's to prevent it. We can not predict the outcome of the seals because other species may have survived similar situations. Seals are a natural, renewable resource. To favour synthetics in place of natural causes more damage.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@freakquency85 The cause of our disease is due largely to improper nutrition. So you are suggesting we allow the seals to continue to glutton themselves on fish until the fish are all gone - the sealers then not only losing sealing but fishing as well. Removing humans from the equation is not the answer. Humans will utilize the earth but we need to do it responsibily. Stopping sealing is not responsible unless they're endangered.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette You are giving example with extreme cases which in our discussion is pointless.You dont have any stats about the fish that seals consume and you cant tell it exactly either.You are talking hypothetically.You are right about the fact that the fish population will decrease but it wont be as dramatically as you said.Dont forget seals arent the only natural hunters of fish you can count a thousand species in sea life as well.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Seals do consume fish, they are also opportunist feeders which means they eat what's available to them. Considering that that seals consume more fish than all the fisheries across Can. take from the water it really doesn't matter what species they eat. Add 9 million seals to all those other predators of fish including humans and we have an unbalanced ecosystem. There is video of a few seals corning a large school of cod and herring in a cove to feed at their leisure.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette I know also dolphins tend to hunt in the same way. they may be opportunist they may eat a lot but i am telling that if we share an ecosystem we have to tolerate other species hunting down a part of a population cruelly isnt the answer for that.wild life survived millions of years without any human intervention and undoubtly will survive without it.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 its also neither vital nor profitable in any sense regarding the statistics.You know anything wont change in your life standarts in case of a ban on seal hunt by canadian govt.The only people who can defend such an act would be a sealer or a sealers relative. Any other idea doesnt come to my mind. Thanks god any reasonable people with commonsense is against those crimes.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 I don't know who you think you are telling me it won't change in my life or the sealers! You don't know anything about me or them. It is obvious you are getting your information from the likes of PeTA, IFAW, SSCS and HSUS. The majority agree with seal hunting. "6 out of 10 Canadians
indicated that they accept seal hunting by any hunter where populations are not endangered and animal
welfare is respected." There is nothing out there saying otherwise, even internationally.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Protests against seal hunting were held outside the Canadian embassy in London England. 3 PeTa protesters showed up. THREE!
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette So this proves??Ask anyone their opinion including so called 3rd world countries and including developing countries you will get a %85 against the seal hunt.Isolated from the economic and local factors its one of the most inhumane things in the world.Try to gather 3 people supporting this and get them to canadian embasy but you know you cant.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Oh please, you're speaking hypothetically. There is nothing saying that the majority is against seal hunting. The fact of the matter is that the majority just doesn't care or there would be much larger turn outs to these protests but time and again when PeTa shows up it hardly draws any kind of crowd, regardless where it's to. EFSA's report states the hunt is humane, so do other peer reviewed reports. What peer reviewed reports have PeTa or IFAW conducted on the hunt? None.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Why is it okay for a polar bear or a orca to rip a seal a part but it is cruel for a man to shoot one to feed his family? Please answer me that.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette If you have ability to reason then you are different from any species.This is what makes you different from other animals this is what makes you defend and oppose ideas.Please dont try to justify this with a such lame way.
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 It's not lame at all, it's perfectly logical. Polar bears and orcas kill seals to survive, so does man. Reason or not we all need to survive. I would argue though that animals are able to reason as well.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette so you cant survive without eating seal meat or wearing a fur lol.Any animal including orcas and polar bears(which unfortunately facing extinction or at least threatened) hunts to survive yes.But on our case its not even close about the survival please dont mention about survival, you are not in a post apocalytic world or facing a nuclear winter.Be realistic and pls answer me.is that hunt evitable?, do we need that? do i need to hunt animals for their fur?
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 The sealers sell the pelt for what...MONEY which yes is also required to surivive. A meal of seal saves me from having to buy something. I would love to have my own garden but I don't have the land to do so. I buy locally and refrain from buying factory farmed meat as much as possible. Fish, moose and seal, all that we caught or hunted ourselves makes up a lot of my meals so we can use our money to keep a roof over our head. This is reality, it may not be yours but it's mine.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Yes, we do need the hunt. For ourselves and the seals. If you can afford to buy all your meals from the grocery store then no, you don't need to hunt but accept that others live differently from you. It doesn't make it wrong because you can live another way.
Ersabette 11 months ago
@Ersabette Also sealing hasnt got any important economic role on fisheries.The totla income generated from the hunts is set to be 56million dollars a year and this hunts impact on fishermans earnings is just a 5 percent.So it hasnt any significant role at all let alone seal products are forbidden in eu and US.Of course you can depend on wild life when its needed but this mass murder is evitable if you look at the numbers.The sealers should have some mercy in place of a 5% in their pocket
freakquency85 11 months ago
@freakquency85 Sealing is significant to a sealer and can represent anywhere from 5% to 35% of a sealers income. Activists complain that the seal is wasted and do everything in their power with all their millions of dollars to shut down the markets that beter utilize the seal. Our gov't is working on a market in China, IFAW was there too counteracting their efforts. Regardless of that, the industry comes secondary after wildlife management. If we are going to use wildlife we must manage it.
Ersabette 11 months ago
What may be obvious to you is not obvious for everyone. These pictures were taken by me on our way to our crab grounds. The use of the hakapik or club makes up about 5% of the hunt. Rifles are primarily used to kill the seals. Evolution does have its place to benefit society. Evolving from using natural, renewable, biodegradable and sustainable resources like the seals will not benefit man, beast or planet, only hinder them. Oh hey, your ignorance is showing!
Ersabette 2 years ago
Taking the skin off a babie seal isnt a resource, FUR is NO LONGER NECESARY in a society since the stone age! we now have dozens of none living resources for making clothes! but hey! Lets all go with our Clubs and start a killing rampage for "Necesary" babie FUR :D
Lastthief 2 years ago
@Lastthief Fur and seals are a resource that is necessary. The synthetic alternatives you speak of do not support a sustainable future - they are made with non renewable resources like petroleum. Perhaps you should look into how your food and clothing are produced and chemically treated with harmful toxins. Synthetics are not healthy for man or planet and a synthetic life is not one I wish to lead.
Ersabette 2 years ago
Baby seals have not been killed since the late 1980's as far as I know. Yet every video I've watched and every anti seal poster all have baby seals. What's up with that?
GESSO217 2 years ago
@GESSO217 You're right, the babies have not been hunted for over 20 years and yet the whitecoated image continues to be used because it brings in the money as does the brutal image of the hakapik even though it is hardly used in the hunt. Without these activist groups can not sell their campaign.
Ersabette 1 year ago
Seals aren't overpopulated! WE ARE! Stop playing smart and grow up
Lastthief 2 years ago
Seals aren't overpopulated yet but they are at risk if the hunt stops which will result in a government sponsored cull. Please research the importance of wildlife management. What are you doing about our over population?
Ersabette 2 years ago
what I'm I doing about our overpopulation?! what kind of question is that?? there is nothing to do
Lastthief 2 years ago
@Lastthief It is an honest question and something you should be looking into. There are many things you can do that will make a huge difference like choosing products that are sustainably manufactured like organics and natural. Some green practises like composting and recycling can also make a difference. It's not just about our numbers, it's about how sustainably we choose to live that is important and synthetics are not the answer.
Ersabette 2 years ago
crazy bitch...
gabriel2034 2 years ago
Ad hominem.
Ersabette 2 years ago
Interesting, What evidence to you have to support this statement? She does not appear to be insane in any way. She has made some very sane and mature statements.
GESSO217 2 years ago
@GESSO217 Thank you. It's much easier to claim I'm insane then to debate difficult points.
Ersabette 1 year ago
here is the problem Ersabette with the ECoNUTTERS . There are EuroSnobs.
6 million JEWS DEAD during world war 2 . over 50 million dead in Europe because of their last in a long line of Continental land wars.
You are right about the truth not being on their propaganda or no room for decent .One Man Censor is another Mans Propagandist is another Mans Eurotrash who are the finest examples of Hypocrisy throughout the history of Mankind.
paultaylor42 2 years ago
You go Girl
Redfox161616 2 years ago
Thanks!!
Ersabette 2 years ago
I get it, it's a rotting world, so let's make it worse!
I like the logic here!
theroaringbutterfly 3 years ago
Let's look at it this way: Right now we have a hunt that manages the harp seal pop, is monitored and provides income to familes because much of the seal is utilized. Remove the hunt and the herd goes unchecked, the pop continues to increase and the seals begin to starve and/or die of disease. A cull will then be needed, it will not be monitored and little to nothing of the seal will be used because there are no longer any markets. The seals will be treated like they are in the UK, as pests and
Ersabette 3 years ago
permitted to be killed on the spot. Anyone can buy, bait and put out a trap to kill a pesky mouse in their basement, perhaps not checking to see if the problem is taken care of until they head off for work the next morning. Who knows how long it took that mouse to die but that is acceptable and will also be acceptable for the seals. So, which is worse, a hunt that is monitored, the seals are killed to sustain people and manage the seals pop or consider the seals as pests and not care at all?
Ersabette 3 years ago
thats a good point. its funny the meat eaters seem to do more for animals than all these vegan activists. they just talk a lot but dont do anything in their personal lives except quit eating meat. i had humane mouse traps before when i had a mouse problem. i used these little boxes where the door opens then locks shut. then i took the little creatures in my car and drove 20 miles just to free them in the woods. how many vegans would do that? they just talk a lot about how superior they are.
bigusdikus0 3 years ago
the AR fools stage those propaganda vids anyway. how do u think they got those phony seal bashing vids in the 80s?
bigusdikus0 3 years ago
leave the newfies alone and stay out of their business unless ur gonna live there!
bigusdikus0 3 years ago
Then they cry wolf when those statements are directed back at them. I too have recieved my share of unpleasantries. They will not stop me from speaking out. These kind of statements only reveal that people, regardless of what side they are on have nothing more intelligent to say.
Ersabette 3 years ago
Thanks Bran! I saw the article. What I find frustrating is that rather than confirm the facts themselves people blindly believe these misquotes and feed off them. It also doesn't matter when those misquotes are corrected - these people are too involved emotionally to consider anything else.
Ersabette 3 years ago
Paul Watson, Green Peace and many other organisations are the only reason White Coats are not killed today.
THEY SAVED THEM!
99% of the seals killed so far by Newfoundlanders have been white coats. Do the maths and you will see that I don't lie. Not killing white coats is a recent change.
I think the people who got the white coats protection have every right to display them as a sign of their victories so far.
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
Nearly 22 Years ! That's how long it's been since whitecoats have not legally been hunted in Canada.
Yet a recent cartoon from one of the activists featured white coats being killed. Why ? Because he obviously thought whitecoats had been hunted more recently than 1987.
More than 95% of the seals hunted are 1 to 3.5 months of age according to the EFSA, and harp seals shed their white coats well before three weeks. They started shedding before two weeks.
There's no point in showing whitecoats.
canucktunes 3 years ago
Then there's the fact that most of the people posting these generic white coat picture slide shows here on Youtube weren't even born by 1987 or old enough to have protested the hunt up to 1986.
How could anyone 21 and under possibly be using them "as a sign of their victories so far" ? It's even highly questionable whether people under 32 can use that excuse because they would have been 10 years old or less during the main protests in 1986.
canucktunes 3 years ago
IT WAS ACTIVISTS LIKE US THAT SAVED WHITECOATS!
They are an achievment we can be proud of. If it wasn't for our actions, they would be being killed still today.
Soon we will get the rest of the Harp seals protection, and then we are coming to save your Moose and Cod too!
:)
We do this because we care, and because NL has potential to be the best tourism destination on the planet. The place is a goldmine, why can nobody see that?
Beautiful scenery, animals and even people when not emotional.
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
You speak of emotion when emotion is the very thing that carries your campaign to stop the hunt! Moose? Oh my... Moose and caribou in some areas in NL are actually OVER populated. Their habitats can not sustain them, heard that about the caribou right from a DFO observers mouth.
Ersabette 3 years ago
OMG
I love this attitude.
Did you know that cars are running into trees as well?
They are totally over populated and need to be destroyed. Its honestly not humans its the trees! They hate us for our freedom!
Natural populations stabilise by themselves. Something the DFO would discover if they ever gave them a chance instead of always trying to play god and usually failing.
In Australia we have started using chemical nuetering darts very successfully. Just break the breeding and no killin!
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
I have heard from more than one activist who have said why wait until the seals are extinct before doing something, I say why wait until they are starving to death or dieing from disease before acting. Really, I do love this higher morality and righteousness "something the DFO would discover [...]" and you're not government why exactly? I mean, you know better than the experts, right? Of course, what's good for Australia automatically becomes good for everyone else. Mmmhmmm
Ersabette 3 years ago
Sometimes the balance does not return and in the end one species, usually the prey, dies out in that general area. And for the most part it is in some way the fault of us, humans. Either way, it is possible, and quite possibly happening. Should action not be taken to prevent this?
rockthecasba16 3 years ago
Well, here's a reality check for you :
We already have tourist destinations featuring harp seals in Atlantic Canada and they aren't that popular. And these are more accessible than the ice flows of the Gulf Of St. Laurence, where no seals are commercially hunted so the seal hunt is not relevant to the lack of tourists there.
There is also eco tourism already in the Gulf of St. Laurence but it isn't successful because people want to touch them, which would cause these seals to starve to death.
canucktunes 3 years ago
That said I find it rather interesting that you would bring up cod when Canada was not responsible for the foreign overfishing, that as a member of Greenpeace you should have been aware of.
When the cod fishery was suspended in Canada foreign fishermen continued resulting in protests by Greenpeace.
This went on for years and I don't see why you would think the situation is so amusing as to offer a smiley face after mentioning it.
Hmm...
canucktunes 3 years ago
"There is also eco tourism already in the Gulf of St. Laurence but it isn't successful because people want to touch them, which would cause these seals to starve to death."
Wow.
Don't you guys have gloves in Canada?
And somehow I dont think the small potential that a few seal pups might be abandoned in any way compares to hundreds of thousands of them being killed?
The maths alone speak volumes
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
The slightest smell triggers a reaction in moms, who just leave out of confusion or disgust. This would cause deaths, which would be hypocritical for you to support.
Yours is a pipe dream that has yet to be justifies by the eco-tourism figures that currently exist. You're just desperately trying to tie tourism to the hunt and it fails.
canucktunes 3 years ago
"The slightest smell triggers a reaction in moms, who just leave out of confusion or disgust. This would cause deaths, which would be hypocritical for you to support."
Somehow I doubt some tourism that resulted in worst case scenario a few pups being abandoned in any way compares to 300,000 being killed by the skin and organ traders!
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
So you see no hypocrisy there ? That's rather interesting.
The numbers just don't add up in regards to tourism and the only way it would is if every whelping area were flooded with tourists, resulting in these shy animal scampering off elsewhere or remaining to be contaminated with our smell.
(cont)
canucktunes 3 years ago
(cont)
You people aren't thinking anything through.
In one statement you claim tourism will fix it all and then in another statement you claim there wont be any ice because of global warming for these animals to give birth on.
How the hell are tourists supposed to view baby seals on ice that isn't there ?!
Make up your damn mind and come to the table with something tangible !
canucktunes 3 years ago
The point is more that these pups will then starve to death, a horrible excruciating death. In a hunt they are more likely to die quickly.
rockthecasba16 3 years ago
I have an idea!!!! How about we stop animal testing and start testing on humans, I don't think the small potential that a few humans might die or suffer in any way compares to the hundreds of thousands of them being saved!! Since you inspired this break through how about you volunteer first!!
Ersabette 3 years ago
And pray tell what great advances has this 'tety' on seals brought humanity?
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
I'm not sure I understand what 'tety' is?
Ersabette 3 years ago
Which scientific break thru are you chasing with experiments on seals?
I am curious because I am interested in the hundreds of thousands of 'people' who are to be saved.
Saved from what?
What people?
Tell me more :)
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
As I recall I said animals, not seals specifically and I'm quite sure you are aware of the millions of people saved because of animal testing. I'm also sure I do not have to explain my comment further as I was using your own words to make my point.
Ersabette 3 years ago
I did a search thru peer reviewed articles on 2 databases and I couldn't find a single one with harp seal testing that could be considered something that would save a human life.
There is a huge swing towards human testing these days. Nothing ethical, just gives better results and the animal testing is expensive.
We are lucky that we have India as our medical playground!
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
Its easy, the DFO class seal penis as 'seal organ'. If you doubt that Canada is the world leader in animal penis exports why dont you contact the DFO for further infomation?
Thats what I did, and I have tonnes of data here in an info pack they sent me.
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
What was the specific number or address you had used to contact DFO? I want to be sure that when I contact them I will recieve the same "info pack" you did.
Ersabette 3 years ago
Still waiting for that contact information for DFO. I checked the site but there's a few numbers and addresses to choose from, I'd like the one you used, if you could pass that on I'd appreciate it.
Ersabette 3 years ago
this entire video is an example of 'generalization'
Did you make up assumptions as you went along?
commerciallolita 3 years ago
Hello, thanks for watching. Did you read the video descpription? Notice the username that is not my own that has been tagged, actually check out the links provided, especially the second to last one that is to a video that is connected to that username? I really don't think so because if you had this video would made sense and you would not have said what you did.
Ersabette 3 years ago
Sealers from Canada supply and keep afloat the worlds penis trade. How can anyone not consider them to be barbarians?
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
deadfishfloating: I have read that it is illegal to trade harp seal penis in Canada, where are you getting your info? Have you heard of bully sticks? If you have a dog most likely you have given one to him/her to gnaw on and perhaps not even know that it's bulls penis. You may also have given your dog pigs ears and/or snout or maybe cow hooves. Besides what you may give to your pet who knows what you could find in your local grocery store or market.
Ersabette 3 years ago
in response is that the seal hunters have found a way around this and now ship the whole carcus to China so they can not be told they are just shipping/selloing seal penis'. This also allows them to say they are exporting 90% of the seal meat to China with the intentional ruis that it's all to be eaten. It's not. Only the penis is eaten.
deadfishfloating 3 years ago
Actually, the biggest buyer of harp seal penis back when there was a small trade in the 80s was Canada. In 1987 large vessels were prohibited from hunting seals, what this means is that there is not enough room in the smaller boats to bring back whole carcasses. Sure, a sealer or two may sneak and send a few off but not on the grand scale you imply with your generalizations. I have asked sealers about the penis trade and they do not do it nor have they heard of anyone else doing it either.
Ersabette 3 years ago
This teenager, juzu4me, claimed he had the ability to see everywhere I was going on the internet and thereby accused me of visiting illegal subject websites. I told him if that was the case he should tell me what my favorite military collecting website was. No response, of course. Classic. His motivations were obvious. I'm not liked in certain very small circles for my position, but I am loved in much, much larger ones. I guess it's the other way around for you, huh Canucktunes?
XB70Playboy 3 years ago
For me it is not about being liked, it is about standing up for what is right which I will continue to do as it is my right to do so. Throughout your recent comments here you have contradicted yourself, filing a complaint for Canuck's repeated reports of violations and defamation however this is [atleast] your second complaint filed. I suppose what you're asking is for us to mind our own business when we see something questionable. I would rather express my concerns to YouTube and let them
Ersabette 3 years ago
decide then stay silent when speaking up could have made a difference. You do not want your personal info released however force that info from others with your accusations - Canuck's occupation for instance. You speak of opiniated debate yet say you are posting truth and fact. You say we threaten banishment for not sharing the same opinion however you banish us from your videos, regardless of your excuse for doing so it is still banishment and censorship.
Ersabette 3 years ago