Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition Presentation: Part 1

[weopon77]

4th edition is crap. Goodbye creativity and imagination, hello streamline. ....yay.

[adamthegreat888]

my friend plays the edition from the 70's and has a ll the books, theyre worth a lot

[SalchichaPolaca]

2 hours to check a grapple =O oinonpo

[Wiigc64]

dnd of the future. lol an oximorone

[Moredread25]

Ah grapple - the most uslessly involved skill ever.

Also I personally will not be buying 4th edition.

[dylanmcdonald95]

I dunno... I play 3.5 just because my PHB I got as a gift a few years back was in v3.5. I actually don't have a fancy notebook laptop, (not even a desktop for that matter), so I don't really think that I will paly the version.

[Santaxe]

LoL! Dnd assisted by a computer... wheres the fun in that. I'll just play 3.5... and if I'm gonna stare at a computer for anything else, it'll be WoW.

[Metaf0ur]

I just wanted to thank the guys over at Wizards of the Coast for putting together this application in which you can play D&D online. I've had a very hard time scheduling a time where myself and a group of my friends can all meet up and play together, this application has solved that issue and will give some new life to the game.

[KellionBane]

4.5 is going to be released 2 years after they release 4th... Just watch.

[LordGodStronghold]

Wow, who didn't see the need for all players to have a laptop coming? I know a WOTC ex-employee and he promises 'they got this one right' but I'll stick with Ed 1 (as anyone can play ed 2+) :)

[PharaunMizzrym]

3.0, 3.5, and 4.0 sux

1st and 2nd 4Ever! ;)

[PharaunMizzrym]

3.0, 3.5, 4.0 sux

1st and 2nd 4EVER. ;)

[Perrelle]

Sure are a lot of whiners and cry-babies around here. What exactly is wrong with having the option to play online if you are unable to meet in person or for some other reason? What is so terrible about streamlining the rules so that you can spend less time looking things up and more time enjoying yourselves?

[SMLawrence8]

WELL......personally I kinda like the idea. I dont see it as an insult.. as a DM I love anything to assist in running the game better. I spend about 10-20 hours per adventure that we play.. and we play 2-4 times a month. I want anything that can help me build equally exciting and fun games with out spending as much time one it.

[Adelryk]

I have a problem to understand how they can still name D&D 4th Ed. a "Roleplaying" game. I mean, come on !!! We'll end up playing characters that are "supposed" to do specific things (with their limitless amount of "how to play that class" crap) on a computer with people we dont see. There is WoW for that kinf of play. In D&D, I want to SEE my friends ROLEPLAYING while I describe an IMAGINARY world.

Let's hope thet dont forget the RP in RPG.

[Silverthumb]

This sounds way less like "Hey guys, we've got a really cool new game" and more like "Hey guys, listen to our sales pitch lol afro buy it."

[necrobestialerotic]

looks to me like WotC ran out of ideas for new supplements to 3 and 3,5.

[theoriginalpailio]

the enthusiasm from the audience is almost deafening.

[GearsandBeers]

you dont need a damn computer to play, they specifically say it is just there to help keep the DM more organized. IT IS NOT NEEDED TO PLAY, YOU DO NOT NEED IT TO PLAY. They specifically say it multiple times on the website and on the podcast

[atla18]

-.-

ilkl stick with w/e version i got myself into with the friends (3.0/3.5)

i dont feel like gettin a versino on my comp just to rely on a computerized system. you cant glitch with a pencil and paper can you

[andrew01292]

Capitilist Pigs! In Soviet Union game play you!

[ghu83]

i will NEVER use 4th edition, neither as a player, neither as a dm.

[g8kpr3000]

These guys are geniuses... Produce a game, reinvent it every 5 years with a "new edition" with "new rules" that don't mesh with the old rules. So then you have to continually buy new books at $40 a pop, plus supplements etc. Then in 2013, they'll come up with the 5th edition.

[faeauriel]

I love how with every update, they say they got it right and talk about all the things wrong with the previous version. So, will 5th edition be another "here's where we went wrong and how we have fixed it" type of thing?

I'll try 4th, but likely will stick to 3.5

[Fernt]

Car companies are the same goddamn way, they keep coming out with "new and improved" cars just to make more money. 2008 model? I'll stick with the 2003 model for the rest of my life, thank you very much!

PS :/

[Norwaian]

But don't try to complain because they're making a new edition. Just don't buy it. I will, though.

[Norwaian]

But don't act like it's a bad thing that they're a company that has to stay in business by making money. If they could keep releasing content to make DnD as a whole better by just taking donations from people, I'm sure they would. But they have to make money somehow, and I think they're doing a good job of trying to keep DnD fans happy. I mean, even if you don't like their design, you can make up your own rules adjustments. Nobody's stopping you.

[Norwaian]

Wizards is publishing a new edition of the game for people that want it. I personally think that wizards are overpowered, and fighters aren't balanced with other classes, and level 10+ games are very hard to handle with the 3.5 rules. So I'd like to get 4th edition. If you don't want to, you don't have to. If you're happy with 3.5, nobody's making you go buy 4th.

[Norwaian]

If you're happy with 3.5, then don't buy 4th edition. If you'd like to "upgrade" to 4th edition, then buy it. It's that simple. There's no arguement here.

[Adamquest64]

This computer $#^* is \!%^ing bull$#!% the whole reason I wanna play D&D is to GET AWAY FROM TV AND COMPUTER SCREENS!!

[swhunter]

My friends and I started playing in the mid-90s under 2nd edition, and we reluctantly adapted to 3rd and 3.5, which we really liked. I can't see us upgrading again -- this is nonsense. Dungeons & Dragons, as someone wrote elsewhere, is a pencil-and-paper game. The integration of computers and online components sounds interesting, I suppose, but it isn't for us. And I imagine it isn't going to be for a lot of people.

[aarondirebear]

I agree, simplifying everything until there are no rules left is bullshit. People who dont like 3.0/3.5 are criebabies who hate vancian spellcasting, and yet thing mages deserve MORE nerfings.

[afrokid53]

SON OF A...!

[ladycygnet]

Ugh...my playgroup is planning on sticking with 3.5. It's not as if we're all made of money and can afford notebook computers. It seems that WotC is catering to children, people with money, and people who are afraid of reading and basic math.

[Berseker000]

I have been playing D&D for nine years and think this new version it´s like Online-game. I don´t like it.

[cruxvader]

It is true, the followers of Thay have taken over Dungeons and dragons

[xeviq]

People... WotC isn't money hungry. Hasbro is. WotC just doesn't want to make Hasbro mad and make them think that the gaming wing of the business is usless.

[kaulomenos]

im gonna cry i love you all,D&D til we die

[ashensnow]

In general the idea of including more online content and access is interesting. On the other hand making an entire new edition to incorporate it is painful. I bought every 3.0 book that came out and repeated that pattern with 3.5. After spending thousands of dollars on previous editions that the designers knew were obsolete when they put them on the market I am not inclined to support the company any longer.

[Nero24200]

Ditto. Some 3.5 Edition books havn't even been released yet. Personally, I think the update is stupid. They're going to split the market into two groups, one half which bought so many splat books from previous editions, and the other half which think 4th Edition is a good idea. One group, will stop buying from Wizards once they have enough splat books to satisfy.

[mountainousmike]

It seems to me like 4th edition is a blatant cash grab by WotC, and as someone who has spent HUNDREADS of dollars already on 3.0 AND 3.5 sourcebooks (including complete sets of BOTH corebooks) I have to say: screw you!

I've been running my playgroup's campaign since 3.5 first came out, and I'm seriously considering giving up on D&D until maybe 5th edition comes out. WotC can fleece some other sucker for the next five years.

[AilenStormfist]

Well.. Lets see.. Who do you really think Wizards is publishing this for? The gamer who has been faithful to their game for years? or to the 7 year old kid gettin mommy to buy it for them. As with many game systems (GW) they don't target their current audience. they target their new ones.

[ch1qui]

As everything, they target what they have plus new ones. They target everything. Welcome to capitalism!

[jasonrroberts099]

...Urgh. Terrible news. Time to cough up more GP everyone. 3.5 was too much as it was. (And it added fine with high levels, btw)

[Rokkos13]

DoctorSalt: The end of true roleplaying? Only if we as costomers allow it. There is the possibility, for instance, of not upgradig the game. There is also a whole lot of other roleplaying games.

[Pheonexking]

If you started playing in like, 1989 or something, stick with what you like. But my table is young, Highschool aged, modern, and forward-thinking. My table has been figureing out ways to incorperate computers since we realized it was easier to mess with a Char. Sheet on a laptop. And honestly, what the narrator says is true "Its the same game". They're just stremlineing it.

[muslcop]

I am not really convinced of this 4th edition stuff yet. Categorizing classes with computer-game "roles" does not sit well with me.  If you want a wizard that can heal or a rogue that is a front-line combatant, you can ALREADY do that by substituting abilities. So where are the BIG sweeping changes in 4th that we saw from 2nd to 3rd? What would make me WANT to buy the books all over again?

[PoliteElliot]

This looks like a low grade dodgy pirate copy.

Could Wizards put the original presentation online instead of a version videotaped from the auditorium plz.

[Cloudimage05]

This will be the end of TRPG. Damn you Wizards!!!

[SheduCrew]

They could have at least gotten a decent public speaker to do this presentation! Honestly, these guys were horrible up there. :(

[UbdU]

Yes, I knew something was wrong with 3.0 and 3.5. It doesn't scale well at high levels for one thing.

When one long time player from back during 2nd edition, and two newer players out of five total can't keep up with the rules mess 11th level+ games become, there's something wrong.

[zaphodzarniwoop]

Mmm. I never realised anything was wrong with 3.5. It took me and my group a while to get a nice pace in combat and make things fun and cinematic, but we made it there. I don't really need a new edition of the game, though I can see how it might make getting into D&D easier if they simplified a few things.

Anyways I hate the marketing strategy Wizards uses, they pump out too many books too fast, often at the expense of quality. I'm sticking to 3.5, and Iron Kingdoms.

[PointBoom]

Just continue the old rules their still good or even go backwards to second (which is really forward)

[rook187]

We're upset that we have to spend $100+ again just to play a game! It may well be a better game but when they come out with a new version every couple of years, it puts quite a bite in the wallet of players.

[senorcupcake]

Who do they think they are? Buying three more core rulebooks the summer of 2008 could seriously deplete my Spore fund! :(

[coljac]

Roleplaying source book writers don't make engaging public speakers. Who knew?

[Bardish]

2nd edition rocks all the way, the systems (3rd&3.5) were all involving rules about ONLY&ONLY fighting, like they say GRAPPLE, come on people, i was letting pcs grapple foes ages ago:) and there was the feeling of role play, powerful mages roaming the land, and their towers were out of most leds' reach, now 20th level fighter can come out slay 20 of those mages just because he has +20 save against spells, it was requiring more than a simple attack roll to overcome the power of many things...

[Eaglos]

These were the most retard people I have ever seen in DnD. "Can I go now? Can I go now?" How many times must someone ask about THAC0 in order to remember it.

Another bullcrap comercial

[mountainousmike]

The THOC0 jokes were lame when people first made them 15+ years ago.

How many people actually playing 2nd Edition actually had difficulty with the basic algebraic principles involved?

[Grungydan]

My guess is "none". Frankly, "2nd edition was hard" was just a buzz phrase that WotC said over and over until new players that have never even seen 2nd edition (or any other edition) started repeating it as mystical truth. WotC knows marketing, and its games suck.

[pokemonredversion]

That better be his real accent, so you can't really blame him for doing it shittily. Insipid jokes and speaking. Yay.

[robertmfreeman]

Every re-release of the D&D system has been better than the last, so I don't know why some people are upset. In order for D&D to continue, it has to update and re-sell itself, mainly to new, younger players who have never played before. If it doesn't, it's going to die out just like it did in the early 90's. There's nothing wrong with selling an update, especially if the update is a genuine improvement.

[Aariumn]

ok... lol wizards realized the 2nd edition D&D was in fact not "better" than the first edition, witch explains why 3rd & 3.5 resemble 1st edition in terms of mechanics. They also took the only "good" thing about second edition witch was the new "realms" & revise them with these "new mechanics" of 1st edition. Now there are reasons why they would release a 4th edition 5 years after the release 3.5...

[Aariumn]

one money, the bottom line is money, two they are losing a lot of "MONEY" to Ever Crack II, World of War Crack, Crack Wars and other large media RPG's, & last but not least... R-tards that can't gain the competence to understand very simple rules, well need the rule simplified & drawn out in Crayola crayon. That is the true of the matter, and truthfully they make money of me as well. The reason for this is... Ravenloft, they release the lands of mist & they make money of me too. suck

[ReOberon75]

I still play with the 2nd Edition. More fun and a lot of goods online for free. 3 & 3.5 are real crap. We start to play with them few years ago and after a couple of months we resold the manuals. But maybe i'm just an old, grumpy player....However, it's nice to se the game evolving (even if the results are, as stated before, quite crappy).

[muslcop]

Actually you'll find that 2nd Edition was crap with all the endless tables. 3 & 3.5 is a LOT more intuitive and you spend far less time calculating things (like THAC0) and other nonsense and more time having fun. I rarely played until 3rd edition. That said, I am not really convinced of this 4th edition stuff yet.

[burtonmoore]

Myself and my group aren't upset at a revision, it's how soon it is coming out that bothers us. Maybe if they waited about 3 more years, then this wouldn't be so annoying.

[zapzan]

I completely agree, this edition has come way too soon. And if they expect people to pay another 100+ just so they can play the game, then they're going to have a rude awakening.

[sciphan]

Actually 3.0 was very flawed. which is why 3.5 came out so quickly. But it was still all about power-gaming. Nothing but trading blows.

[TNAROHfan]

Second edition came out in the late 80's and 3.0 came out in what 2000? I was fine with that 10+ or so years in not such a bad length of time for a games mechanics to evolve, and not so bad to have to have to buy new core system rule books. Every few years sucks!!

[TNAROHfan]

Wow this may be finally the think that makes me give up dungeons and Dragons for good. I have been kind of slowly moving away from it since 3.5 came out just a few short years ago and now it looks like they have the idea that they are going to be able to milk their customers every few years with a whole new system!! I SAY NO!

[andashealladh]

I agree with you, my god, they where warned about the electronic invasion. Now after years of saying no, they're trying to play catchup, good luck. I have better things to spend my money on than 4.0.0.0.0.1 and more on each 4.#.#.#.#.#

Besides, there are much better systems out there that have more play and adding computers to it (like Hârn) will allow for the return of proper RPG gming instead of this high powered gaming BS.

[andashealladh]

It does make me wonder though if WOW would exist if they had jumped on the MMORPG bandwagon ealier. This all looks like a PATHETIC hald assed attempt to me.

Imho, D&D is dead, I just wish it had got better (I began in '83) instead of getting lame and moldy....

[gameperson]

Why doesn't magic have this kinda thing?

[t3z2pulm]

WoC has become such a terrible revolving door of useless rulebooks. A competent DM simply doesn't need a thousand books. I understand WoC is in this to make money, but I think they've gone way overboard.

[FUNCHOMCLALA]

PHB, DMG, MM. All you need.

[merskin]

you people must not get out much...paid for by Hiliary Clinton

[waterpollos88]

lol cool, slightly nerdy but cool.

[Moose134609]

They are so nervous, that is the spirit of D&D in it's purest form!!!!

[kyros1986]

reminds me of some teachers on the first day of classes and its overly quiet.

[whiteknight669]

2nd Edition All The Way!!!

[Inmemorial]

I think it's about cash... 3.0, 3.5 and now 4.0. It's not the same anymore. I will stay on the 3.5 edition.

[Hobbitgoth]

I just started a V. 3.5 storyline, I guess I can just use it as "Classic Play" in a sense. What do you guys think?

[Ratonga]

Wow.. 3rd really hasnt been out very long.. that made me realise.

[juergen]

D&D 4 reminds me of Tekken 4. I sure hope it's not gonna be like the Tekken 4 of the D&D series lol.

[Excaliburproxy]

I am stoked! And stoked is the only word which describes my elation and deep rooted, almost childlike, anticipation for the coming of 4th edition. I can't wait to play a half decent fighter!

[tgv150]

More fun in 1978 (even with a module that didn't come out until 1981)?

Until 4e, keep on playing 3e - it looks, erm, great here. WotC says thank$ :)

[LyndonJohnson]

Sweet Holy Avenger!

[lestef23]

they didnt tell 4th ed was coming out to keep sellin the third...

[cdfreester]

These guys look and sound like a couple of typical corporate marketing spin-doctors. I wonder how long they practiced the presentation. Why can't they just talk and dialogue instead of speak like they're reading script?

[tarhun]

wow, corporate marketing, you think? almost as if they're... I don't know, marketing a product?

[moksone]

ho paura... molta paura della wizards. Come della blizzard...

[treedog669]

I'm still waiting for D&D Virtual Reality.

[Aneutralshadeofblack]

In 2008, DMs are no longer necessary, being instead replaced by seekrut military AIs run by TSR (their disappearance was a scam). Thus, the DMG comes out late.

[mrbreo]

Interesting. I'm looking forward but then again, I saw this comming when 3.5 came out.

[rogue8649]

The DMG comes out TWO MONTHS after the PHB????? WTF?

[Rage220]

The reason for this is so that players can get used to character creation

[Lseelba]

Basic grapple rules aren't bad. It's when you are on a flying mount and get grappled by a grell monk that the whole rules system breaks down.

[bakomusha]

by the light of pelor!