Paul McKeever on Byline (Brian Lilley, Sun TV)

[dudebud007]

@fpontario.....you know this is all cool and shit about cut this tax, cut that tax but where is the fp gonna find the extra income money as the difference for all that ? ? ?

[libertariancfo]

If by superficial you mean simple, then you're right. The only moral use of force is to protect life, liberty and property. To use force for any other purpose is immoral. Simple enough?

For example, it is wrong for me to force my neighbour at the point of a gun to pay for my child's education. It doesn't matter how many people vote in favour of doing this, it is still wrong. We elect politicians to represent us, and somehow it's okay for them to do what is wrong for us simple citizens.

[andyman1233333332]

excuse my ignorance but what is the difference between the freedom party and the libertarian party??



[Sluttybags]

@andyman1233333332 In one sentence, the difference is that libertarians want "least government" based on an floating abstraction of "freedom", whereas as FP wants "better" or "good government" based on principles derived from Man's nature as rational being. This means that in general, libertarians aren't philosophically grounded enough to have a principled stance on freedom as a part of Man's nature, so that a libertarian government would be left open to any more principled opposition.

[andyman1233333332]

@Sluttybags thx for the info i'm going to have to do more research before the election

[Sluttybags]

@andyman1233333332 McKeever has a set of videos that get deeper into the philosophical differences starting at metaphysics, moving through epistemology, to ethics and politics, but I'm unable to link them. Just go to his channel for all of 'em, labelled "Freedom School, Ep. 3".

I think these are a pretty good set of videos for an introduction to the metaphysical basis for freedom. McKeever has many other videos that are bit more academic in content, but presented conversationally.

[johnycannuk]

@Sluttybags Spoken like someone who doesn't know what a "libertarian" is.

FWIW, I some of the Freedom Party stuff and some of the Libertarian Party of Ontario. And I hate some of theri stances - the FP drug policy is a muddled mess trying have it both ways (I support total legality for all drugs - drug abuse is a medical issue not a criminal one) and the LP is rehashing the meanspirited statist "tough on crime" horseshit as the Tories.

Not sure I'd vote for either of them, frankly...

[Sluttybags]

@johnycannuk Please feel free to correct me, and be sure to include how libertarians philosophically derive their concept of freedom. I say libertarians' concept of freedom is superficial at best.

FpO's policies are based on the philosophy of Objectivism, and must include the context of Ontario politics. Would you say it's a good election strategy to say "We think all drugs should be legal and no punishments will be served for drug abusers who violate rights because it's a medical condition?"

[ch1kusoo]

@Sluttybags I always saw FP as more of a pragmatic libertarian party rather than an idealistic libertarian party like the LPC.

[islandmuffin]

Liberty!

[Sluttybags]

Nice to see FP in the more mainstream media. Finally!

[TorontoLibertarian]

Freedom FTW!