Im not here to argue about how well law enforcement does their job. thats a totally seperate issueand deserves its own seperate discussion. the last thing we need to to go off on a tangent. its law enforcments job to enforce the laws. their lack in ability to do so is not a good reason to then limit rights and freedoms to make their jobs easier. our rights should not be an inconvenience to them. they get paid by US to protect and serve US.
sex trafficking and prostitution fits under a general umbralla of what we call domestic abuse (and neglect). law enforcement already have a set protocol for how they uncover cases of domestic abuse, exploitation and neglect of children, spouces and the elderly. but it first starts with abuse being reported. whether it be from victims coming forward themselves or concerned citizens reporting it.
decrim doesnt absolve people from obeying the law and it
doesnt make it harder for cops to do their job. there is no legal way to buy and sex sex from minors. so the legal route doesnt provide cover for that. even for those who worry about youths working in legal brothels. thats dealth with in the same mannor as the porn industry. and the buying and selling of alcohol and cigs. business are inspected reg. decoys are deployed to verify that businesses are obey the law and violators are punished.
you said "children are prostituting themselves". keep in mind that i dont treat cases like this in the same manner as someone who is being threatened or restrained against their will. and a youth that puts themselves at risk is not treated like a victims. youths have sex all the time. sex doesnt automatically go from concentual to abuse with the exchange of money. kids may engage in activity that may be against their best interest and the laws are such that their best interest
are the responsibility of their parents and any adults they come in contact with. we (as adults) are not allowed to do anything that enables youths to engage in deliquent behavior regardless of how the youths feel about it.
if they want to prostitute themselves, that their business. legally, we cannot buy from them, force them to do it or harbor them in an environement that allows them to sell sex willingly.
the legal status of prostitution for concenting adults does not limit
law enforcment ability to protect youths. if anything, they will be harassing and arresting a lot of concenting adults. violating the rights of a lot of concenting adults. before they uncover cases of child prostitution. the protocol for uncovering child prostitution cases doesnt change with decrim. so if it doesnt change, it cant get harder to solve with decrim.
you have to show me an instance where decrim allows special cover for child prostitution that would be impossible to duplicate in an illegal system. in other words, if the vice squat have to deal with the same type of cases in a illegal system. decriminalization wouldnt limit their ability to do their job cause either way (legal or illegal) they have to deal with it anyways.
I truely am at a loss at how to make this simple for you to understand. but i think you need to draw a venn diagram.
YES, there are areas where prostitution and trafficking are linked. but there is also an area where they dont. this area is mutually exclusive. this mutually exclusive area is the area that people are trying to legalize.
you asked more silly question: for you, but what about the people in prostitution that don't want to be there?
the answer is simple. i already answered this question cause you've already asked be before.
to recap. the answer is ENFORCE THE LAWS THAT ALREADY EXIST!
there are laws against trafficking. legalizing concenting adults doesnt prevent cops from going after traffickers. if anything it makes it easier. cause people who do not want to be in the industry can seek help from law enforcement if they want it. the same way we deal with victims of
domestic abuse is the same way we would deal with victimes of human sex trafficking. victims need to have little to no barriers to come forward with complaints and law enforcment must make handling complaints a priority and to offer programs to get victims out when they need it.
the mutually exclusive area is (if you dont know already) is for the market of selling/buying concentual sex amount adults. although linked with trafficking through prostitution they are mutually .
your concern about child abuse has already been refuted. let me recap
1) no one is legalizing child prostitution. law enforcement still have to control it. and when they are not chasing after concenting adults they have more time and resources to protect real victims
2) when a prostitute is of the legal age they have the right to make decisions for themselves. regardless of whether they were abused as kids or started in the industry as a kid. they can choose to remain in it.
there are many former abuse victimes that grow up to become cops, lawyers, doctors, nurses, actors, actresses, business owners, judges, teachers, students...
you are more than happy to trust former child abuse victimes to make decisions about their occupational choice when it comes to the mainstreem. why then would you remove that trust and treat them like they are pathetic peopl unable to make decisions in their own best interests if they chose to remain in the sex industry?
you create a terrible double standard by the way in which you treat workers as disparaged victims. rather than adults who are responsible for their own choices in life. every other person has to take responsibility for all the good and bad decisions they make in life. regret and shame are normal for all of us. so why is it that you are acting like prostitutes should be afforded special considerations that protect them from experienceing regret and shame? prostitution is not the
job a person can get into. even in countries were these women are treated badly and have a difficult time leaving the industry. even street prostitution in first world countries are not irredeemable. there are many women and men that enter and leave the industry of their own choice. there are even men and women who were once exploited while in the industry that leave and go on to better lives. so your " think about the children" argument is bunk. trafficking and child sex will
always be a crime. legalizing prositution only deals with legalizing concenting ADULTS to enter the market. law enforcments still have to do their part to keep kids out of the market. whether that market is legal or not. you treat prostitution, sex trafficing, child sex as if they are all mutually inclusive and legalizing prostitution would mean that the other two would have to be legitimized. thats false.
there are exclusive elements of prostitution that can be legitimized (namely allowing only concenting adults to enter the market legally). concenting adults is not the same as adult having sex with a child and both are not the same as adult forcing another adult into prostitution. so your "what about trafficking" and 'what about child prostitution" is sheer nonsense. either you get the fact all these are different and should be handled differently or you dont.
i just got finished stating that 80% of workers are independant and dont have pimps. and to reduce pimping (not that its inherently bad) is by making it legal for women to be independant and work from home. pimps can have a legitimate role in that the recruit clients. they are marketers. hell there are businesses centered around marketing. what makes pimping dangerouse is when women are in a position were they are employees instead of employers. a good business person hires
staff that does good work that is profitable for the business even when taking into account the cost the employer has to pay their employees for the work. when you have a trafficing situation its based the legal nature of what the workers and pimps are doing. when workers are committing a crime and have a pimp who is also commiting a crime there is room for a dominant person to exploit the weaker because the risks are high. if a woman can make money on her own legally
she then doesnt need a pimp. and so a pimp now is put in a position were they have to make themselves useful to the prostitute to stay employeed. they can be hired and fired like any other marketer or PR personel. violence that goes in stems from the hidden and illegal nature of prostitution. pimps can be exploitive because they have good reason to believe that their victims wont turn them in. they also have incentive to be violent because they also know their vicitm doesnt
need them to be in business. for them to make money. they have to find a way to be controllling. either by being productive OR (which is more likely the case) by enslaving and victimizing the worker. there may always bee a market for trafficing. but regardless of the legal status of prostitution its law enforcment job to keep it under control. like i said about a dozen times now, making prostitution a crime is part of the problem.
you can I can both simply disagree. i think it would change. I grew up in a very religiouse household were I was taught (from a social/religiouse) point of view that prostitutes were dirty, evil, disgusting, pathetic, unworthy, greedy women. and the only time i ever saw one was in the news when they were being handcuffed and taken to jail like criminals. so i saw them as law breakers bad people. conservative media want to convince us that the no real woman wants to be
to be a prostitute. so they are victims now. they are forced by bad abusive pimps. when in reality over 80% of workers are independent and dont have pimps. I am told that they are forced because of drugs. well that may be the case for street walkers but they only make up about 20% of the industry. the public gains a lot of misinformation just from the fact that society deems prostitution a taboo. and prostitutes themselves guarded about their occupation because if the stigma and
and legal implication. so what's left? those who claim to be moral warriors are left to fill out heads with nonsense and convince us that prostitution is all bad. tell us what to think from the time we too young to challenge them on their facts. i was brought up the way my parents and grand parents were brought up. but the cycle stops with me. and a new cycle starts with more people like me who are eager to get sex industry out of the zone of the taboo. i dont
believe that preception will change completely in my generation. but it will change. there have been times in history were prostitutes were considered to be the top of the social ladder. praised, respected... even worshipped. it happened at least once. there is no reason it cant happen again.
and even if preceptions dont change. that still doesnt change the fact that it should be legalized for those that want a legal way to enter the market.
every issue being dicussed or debated has wide implication. prostitution is no different although you try and treat it as such. when it comes to the whole of society we are still left with my oringinal point. its simple. i know people like you dont like simple. you like to complicate things to make it seem like its too difficult to actualize. but its simple.
prostitution is still an option that people can, infact opt in and out of freely. if i were a prostitute. my choice
doesnt impact you any more than if i decided to be a nurse. your choice not to buy my services doesnt impact me any more than if you were to avoid buying any other product from me. on issues that deal with abuse, harm, trafficing, crime. how we would/should deal with prostitution would be no different in how we deal with issues like buying seeling alcohol/cigarettes, domestic violence, rape, murder, domestic slavery, child abuse in general.
all the forseen issues that you can think of that may impact prostitution are already being battled right now in one form or another. worried about kids getting into prositution? well thats the same issue we worry about kids drinking alcohol and buying cigs. we have laws against selling alcohol to kids. we have law enforcement that send out decoys that verify that shop businesses are checking ID before they sell. we have school programs that educate kids on the dangers.
and even with all that we do have kids getting their hands on the stuff. but we dont make it illegal for law abiding, concentind adults from buying and selling the product simply because there may be kids who will get their hands on the stuff.
worried about prositutes getting abused? well 40-90% (depending on country) of married women are abused domesticly. we have laws against it. we enforce those laws by giving women access to law enforcement and programs
that can help them get out of abusive situations. but at the end of the day these women still have the right to choose to stay in an abusive situation if they want. prostitution should be treated no differently. women who want help with abuse should have programs and law enforcement on their side. those who are fine with the risks should be left alone. we dont make it a crime to get married simply because some women may be abused. and we shouldnt make prostitution a criem for
exact same reason. worried about street prostitutes? making prostitution a crime doesnt help them at all. legal or not there will always be street prostitutes. the best way to deal with them is to make what they do legal so they have little to no reason to organize themselves, protect themselves and seek help when they need it. right now its the illegal nature of prostitution as well as social stigma that puts these women at risk.
worried about poverity? well making prostitution a crime doesnt help. it takes away a viable income earning stream from people in the most need. what makes prostitution so attractive to workers is that its the ONLY occupation one can get started in today and make pure profit after their first costomer. most business have huge start up costs and takes 3-10 years to realize a profit. many occupation take years of training and education. a every expensive endevor with a high
opportunity cost (im an economics major). prostitutes are also top earners in most societies. as high as some executives and major companies. so for the poor, its an opporunity to make a hell of a lot of money with the least amount of work. it can be a great equalizer in the gap between the rich and poor for women who run their business in a legitimate way. because many make so much money many are able go to school or start up other businesses and become leaders in their community.
take that away and these poor people are left with low paying job opportunites that are more degrading and back breaking labor.
worried about prostitutes who are drug abusers? like it or not. even drug abusers have to work to put food on their table. and prostitution is one of a few jobs that they can support themselves without getting fired. legal or not. drug abusers will prostitute themselves.trying to take that away from them put society at risk because these desperate
dont simply stop when their job is taken away from them. they move on to actually victimizing law abiding members of society. in trying to "protect" these women(and men) from the dangers and exploitation of the streets. you put them in a situation were they are a danger to the community. were they are at more of a risk to commit seriouse crimes with more seriouse consiquences. im talking about the same women you say are victims of murder, rape and robbery finding themselves
in a situation were they are complicit in crimes consist of murder, rape and robbery.it happens everyday I and, for one, would prefer a woman prostitute herself where she only only a danger to herself then find myself in a situation were that women have to rob or murder me (or anyone i care about) to support herself. call me selfish if you want. but most druggies dont hit a bottom and go straight to rehab just because you take away prostitution as an option to support their habit.
so when i call you sly for being deliberatly vague when you walk about "is thinking about the wider implications of legalising prostitution " but go little into actual specifics about what you are talking about. I STAND BEHIND WHAT I SAID. I took my time and listed all the major"'wide implications" and addressed them and saved you the trouble. so now what?
are you kidding me. right now we are not even on the same page. YES being a maid is related. especially when talking about trafficking. there are different types of trafficking. including slavery and domestic survitude. we dont make being a maid illegal to combat slavery. the same way we shouldnt make prostitution illegal to combat sex trafficking. so we do have laws against enslavement. law enforcement have tricks to combat it. so if you are asking about how do we prevent
sex trafficking than the simple answer is to look at how law enforcment control other forms of trafficking. you also asked another silly question:Since the governments will also benefit, by putting a tax on people that have sex, where will the incentive be, from them, to develop other employment and educational opportunities?.
1) you assume that these works are obliged to get an education. which they are not. if hey want to spend the rest of their lives a prostitutes. so be it
2) everyone pays taxes to the governement. why would you think that a prostitute should be any different or that prostitutes forced to pay taxes burdens them any more than taxes burdens any other employed person. prostitutes from the streets the the high end are in the top 10% of earners in any given country. these women and men are top earners. so why are you worried about how much taxes they have to pay?
the point of getting an education is to get employable skills. a prostitute is someone with employable skills already. if she/he doesnt like prostitution they have an automatic incentive to find other opportuntites including getting an education. what helps this process along is having a sigma free society that accepts prostitutes as normal, respectable people. in societys and countries were prostitutes are seen as "tarnished" and rejected by families and seen as
unemployable because of their occupation puts these women (and men) in a position were they have few opporunties asside from prostitution get help. make them a victim of society we are better able to protect prostitutes when we, as a society, deem them worthy of the same respect and rights that we afford anyone else.
ask your question again. and this time take out prostitute and put in CEO of a mega corperation, maid, or carpeter, janitor... if you see these women as being
equal to any other person in society you will quickly see just how stupid your question really is. when it comes to the choice of education vs working you will find that prostitutes face the same decision making as anyone else and yet you treat them like victimes or worthy of more consideration than others. thats degrading to them because you are , infact viewing them as people incapable of making a good decision that is in their best interest. there are educated prostitutes.
you and i both agree that legalization will not help everybody. BUT NO ONE SAID THAT IT HAS TO HELP EVERYONE! just like we have laws that make it illegal to murder. that doesnt mean that everyone one is safe from being killed. harm reduction is just that. REDUCING HARM not eliminating it. and the fact that we legalization may not help anyone doesnt make the process illigitimate cause the fact is that it may help many. especially those who want help and at the end of the day
we cant force help on people who dont want it. we can only make help available for thse that do want it. i see no problem with that at all. this goes for women of domestic violance, rape victims, drug addicts... all have the right to refuse help and made decisions for themselves. you ask a very silly question :what happens to the people that find themselves in a situation that forces them to have their benefits cut/stopped if they don't accept a job as a prostitute?
the answer is simple. THE SAME THING THAT HAPPENS WITH EVERY OTHER EMPLOYED PERSON. there are a lot of people who hate their jobs but feel like they are forced to work because other opportunitites dont come easy. a prostitution in the situation you posed with your question has the same problems as everyone else. having to make the decision to put up with a shitty job or quit. as long as she doesnt have a gun to her head or is being threatened with violence. i dont give a damn what
what happens to her. the same way I dont give a damn what happens to a woman who scrubs toilet for a living and is then told that she has to work longer hours for less pay. or have her benifits cut. legitimizing prostitution put these women in a situation were they will face the same types of problems the rest of us face. i dont see why you feel the need to protect prostitutes from LIFE's HARD DECISIONS.
Again, no one said anything of changing a sick minds. sick people, regardless of where there is a legal system or not will do bad things. with a legalized system there are few barriers a worker has to cross to protect themselves and seek help when they need it. as for trafficking. legalization is not set up to control that either. I gave the example of domestic servitude by which the fact that people can legally hire mades but the fact that there is a legal market doesnt
mean that slavery and exploitation is stopped.it also doesnt mean that the demand for slave labor will stop. what legalization does is keep concenting adults out of prision so cops can fill it up with actual criminals. its still up to law enforcment to enforce the laws.if trafficking is illegal than law enforcement have to take a priority stance to keep it under control. when they do that, regardless of the legal status of any industry/market, crime rate goes down.
Like I said. no one said anything about crime reduction. right NOW the battle is waging on the RIGHT to for men and women to enter into a legal market for prostitution. even if the harm were to remain consistant and unchanging. its still a fight that should be won in favor of human rights. YES, its believed that as a result of legalization workers (prostitutes and johns) may help many construct a safe environment in which to do business and have the backing of law enforcement
and the justice system to go for protection and to settle disputes. but even if we were to argue that crime were to remain constant or increased. we are still talking about a human rights and the laws against prostitution conflict with it and is inconsistant
NO ONE EVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT REDUCING CRIME! get that straight. what legalization does is gives concenting adults the right to do as they please. so that cops are not wasting their time chasing around these people and can devote their time to actual victims who need/want their help. legalization also reduces barriers for workers and johns to seek help from the authorities. right now, laws make it less likely for either to seek help. so rather than call police or sue in court
both sides are put in a position were violence may be the only way to settle disputes. also when we see rates of crime go up after legalization. what you are most likey seeing is an increase in complaints. when you legalize both sides are more willing to file a complaint and seek help. which is a good thing! its not necessarily that abuse or crime is rising but more vicitms are coming forward. and cops have more money and time to actually make these reports a higher priority.
like i said about 3 or 4 times now. when cops are not chasing after concenting adults they have more time and resources to assist actual victims. with the additional taxes generated for the legal industry more money can be pumped in to better deal with issues like trafficing and child abuse. devote more money and time to actual issues than they would before. but i have to stress again. the aim is not to reduce crime. its to free up resources so cops can actually efficiently go
after people who are actually victimizing people rather than go after concenting, law abiding adults and violating their rights. yes, its possible to see stats indicating that there is a higher rate crime. but thats probably because cops are taking a higher piority to going after criminals and victims are more willing to report abuses.
you claim it doesnt. but i say it addresses ALL. and i've already touched on ALL you've presented on this entire comment section i have no interest to repeat myself.
the issue is no more complex with any other issue.
you are concerned about workers rights? then legalize. cause right now the laws against prostitution violates their rights.
worried about child abuse? legal or not that will always be an issue. but with legalization you are not wasting money or time going after concenting adults and you can focus it on actual victims
worried about trafficing? handle it in the same way you would when it comes to domestic slaves.
worried about public health? well prostitutes and johns have a huge insentive to and do largely use protection. which is something regular people dont do as readily and it
is probably why the general public are more at risk for getting aids and other stds then prostitutes and johns. if you go for legalization, you can even mandate minimum requirements of health testing and saftey standards if you wish. but in general johns and prostitutes that actually use protection of their own volition are far safer then members of the public who are less likely to be as careful.
as for sigma? that too is perpetuated by the fact that the industry is illegal. so not only are prostitutes seen as amoral but criminal too. legitimize the industry by making it an actual occupation with pension, health plans, taxes... reduces that stigma and over time it reduces the alienation of workers and johns.
no one is talking about enslavement. the legalizing movment is about giving concenting adults the ride to decide what they do with their money.
legal or not. cops are still going to see people get exploited. so instead of chasing around concenting adults. they can devote their resources to actual victims. prostitution and enslavement are two seperate issues.
prostitution does not lead to slaverly no more than
criminals have recruited people for both the sex industry and domestic servitude. you can be a maid without being exploited. and you can be a prostitute without being exploited. and if you have a problem with prostitutes becuase there may be people who are going to be trafficed then you should also take issue with maids. cause there is also a wide (less known) trafficing industry surrounding domestic slaves who are documented as housekeepers and nannies.
danger is not paramount. there are a lot of things that are dangerouse. like going to the carnival and getting on a ride. there are risks. we DONT make it illegal for even children to ride. what we do is ensure a level of safety and hold ride makers responsible for keeping up with requirements to operate legally. there are always going to be rides the malfuction. people will be injured or killed, operators/owers that are sloppy. the point is to hold them responsible for
reducing the risks and paying dearly when they fail to do so. the same goes for any other privilage. there are ALWAYS GOING TO BE CHILDREN AND ADULTS WHO ARE ABUSED OR EXPLOITED. no one is trying ot make it legal. so these are issues that will always be of a concern to the authorities and the public. but you dont reduce rights under the guise you are trying to save lives. you save lives my giving people the right to do as they please in a safe way.
ameaneringsoul.... "should be treated accordingly and considered when changing laws."
my answer to that stupid state ment is... DUH!!!!
i dont know what i said to give you the impression that i would disagree cause im saying pretty much the same thing. obvousely the reason why you state is cause you dont want the laws to change but dont want to come out and just say that it is you really want. thats a sly move on your part.
thats the problem with people like you. you " see" too damn much. there are a lot of things that are harmful. fast food, cars vs pedestrians, smoking, alcohol, guns.... freedom gives us all the right to decide how, as individuals we will handle these things. but at the same time we all have a responsibility to each other to be careful and considerate to the welbeing and safety of others. for instance. if you want to smoke, fine. but you dont smoke in doors were there are
other people. you like playing iwth guns? fine, you need to get legal authorization to own and handle one. want to drive? well, not everyone can drive. you have to get the education, training and authorization to do so. and even though people have these rights . we do have peopl who break the rules and hurt others. there are people wo get drunk and act a fool, putting others in danger. there are people become morbidly obese, putting a strain on their family, the
health care system. there are people who even feed their kids fast food. making it highly likely that they will grow up to become obese and have health problems. some would say that feeding kids fast food should be considered a form of child abuse/neglect. hell, we all have the right to marry. even though between 40-90% of women are abused by their spouses. we dont make it illegal to marry, drive, drink, smoke, eat fatty foods, own guns... simply because there may be people
who will be harmed... we find a balance that maximized freedom for all while looking out for the best interest of individuals. legalizing prostitution is ment to give concenting adults the right to do as they please with their money and bodies. that doesnt mean that it makes it ok for people to engage sex trafficing or child abuse. nor will it make it difficult for authorities to control the victimization of people in the sex industry. when it comes to racism. you must realize
While I do agree with you that the social problems associated with prostitution are the real concern and that sexuality should not be commodified, I don't see how it helps the people having to sell their bodies in order to make money to further cement their position in society by criminalising them.
GREAT VID. You hit the nail on the head when you say that it's about the capitalists system's need to commodify our most intimate human qualities. And also, that it's a question for society in general to decide... despite what the YT individualists like to claim. I've done about 20 vids on this subject. And sent one in to this vid, as a response. All the best - Mick
I think that everyone better watch the movie 'Zeitgeist moving forward' here on youtube. It's a 2 hours and 40 minutes documentary movie that tells what's causing to human problems all over the planet, and it suggests a really good solution. Just type the name of the movie in the search bar and you'll get it.
This video is all kinds of awesomeness. xxx13moons - THANK YOU for presenting this subject in its true light. All too often when the subject of the sex industry comes up, the hordes of supporters throw in their extremely weak arguments, completely missing the "forest" and it drives me absolutely insane.
Ultimately, feminism is about women living their own lives according to their own choices. If they want to be stay-at-home moms, prostitutes, or porn stars, it should be their choice and their choice alone. No one can say otherwise. To do so would be the opposite of feminism.
How is prostitution Misogyny? Misogyny is the hatred of women, and prostitution, stripping, pornography are all industries based around the worship of women.
Plus you're argument is based around your own personal views, and trying to push them off on other people without having any facts to back them up with. Remember, while women are making thousands of $ a week, men are getting 4$ behind a Denny's, while society ignores their pain and obsesses about women.
@TheSpazzofMuffins, "the worship of women?" really? Is that REALLY going to be the starting point of your argument? Have you ever watched Porn? Try again son.
@xx13moons Dude your argument doesn't make sense, that there are some that dont like to work in the sex industry, if you paid attention to the peach,they do have some options, they may not pay great but they have them. they just want easy money thats the reason they do sex work . Furthermore just because someone doesn't like a job is not a legitimate reason to make it Ilegal. there are many jobs people hate more, are more boring and pay less than sex. as long as it is not forced its ok
@xx13moons So all porn is equivalent? Are you truly unable to distinguish between say, a video made by a couple who are exhibitionists who wish to share (and maybe make a bit of money off of it) and the type of porn you seem to believe is the only type that exists?
And you may have you opinion about sex being the "most intimate act" etc, but surely you dont expect everyone to have the same opinion towards sex as you, do you? Are they allowed to live differently?
@TheSpazzofMuffins Prostitution is paid rape...period...gee, what could be misogynist about that?
Prostitution, stripping and porn are about the worship of women? Are you freaking kidding me? Do women in these professions get respected by society? No, they're stereotyped and looked down on, even by the men who employ them (to a great extent). Sure a woman can make money in the sex industries, but what does that really say about how our society values women? Nothing good IMO.
@r3v3ng3ofthef4113n If a woman wants to have sex, she'll do it for free. Prostitutes don't want sex, they want money...so basically a man should know (when going to a prostitute) that he is enticing a woman to have sex that she does not want, in exchange for money...empahsis on sex she doesn't want...I didn't say it was forcible rape...
@r3v3ng3ofthef4113n I do understand what you're saying but I just have a different way of looking at things. So what if a man has sex with a prostitute and then runs off with out paying. Has the woman been raped then or just been a victim of theft? I've heard men joke that raping a prostitute is no worse than shoplifting...do you agree?
Dude, you have to take your morals out of the picture. And, well, yeah, prostitution IS the selling of a commodity, sex. Why is this a bad thing? Consensual Adults, by the way.
And what is this silly righteous immature assumption that intimacy is automatically preserved when its void of financial transaction? Are you implying every sexual encounter that wasnt paid for was automatically intimate? Give me a break from the righteous routine please. WTF do care what someone else does with their private life? Like George Carlin said; Why should it be illegal to sell something thats perfectly legal to give away? Your argument is so ridiculous on so many levels.
While this may often be the case it is not always the case. The fact that you and I may believe that sexual intimacy should be cherished doesnt mean we have any right at all to impose that belief upon anyone else. For those who believe that intimacy is not a requirement of sex, your suggesting that they be declined the right to live in accordance to such beliefs, even when no one with the exception of the
Wow, talk about a blatant double standard. Youre making the same fundamental argument that those opposed to gay marriage make. Regardless how you want to present it, youre advocating the legislation of a personal moral position. Laws are an institutionalized enforcement of writings to protect civil liberties. Youre also discriminating when you imply that every prostitute is the victim of dysfunctional or unfortunate circumstances.
You need to ask yourself, do you actually have a point because your assumption is that all sex will be for pay and will be prostituted sex if prostitution is legalized. Quite incorrect.
You should apologize for calling her video 'horrible', don't you think?
Your points are a position I don't share. Aside from that... look around -- we're already here, hoss. There's a reason they say 'sex sells'. And don't forget Amsterdam, plenty of success in their story. And when you say 'consenting', recall for a second that a prostitute is in fact consenting. You can say there's more to sex outside of prostitution, and I might even agree, but only sometimes.
@Hardryv Amsterdam is not a succes at all. The city closed one third of brothels due to crime related to prostitution. The laws are currently being revised for lack of 'succes'. Amsterdam is also focussing on helping to get women out of the business. You cant use it as an example anymore of a succes of legalization.
@summersonset -- I won't challenge your assessment of Amsterdam as I'm not a citizen. I am however a citizen in the United States and the last time I checked the one place that off-film prostitution is legal here is Las Vegas had no prostitution-related crime issues and to date not even a single case of STD transmission. Seems to support legalization well.
It's me again, I just watched her part 2, there she adresses your argument as well - and in my opinion very convincingly. The question I have, do you have any response to that?
However, I do think prositution should be (or stay) decriminalized. Most of those women have enough problems in their lives already without having to deal with legal prosecution.
When a man goes to a hooker he is not buying her like he's buying a bottle of ketchup or light blulb. he's buying her time and services. So FAIL right there
You know, not everyone has the time nor inclination to pursue a relationship with someone of the opposite gender, and so a pay-for-intimacy option should certainly be made available.
As for your complaints in regards to the demographic, where are your complaints about those employed in the fast-food industry? What about the commodification of fast food, which considers profits over customer well-being?
Want to minimize issues? Legalize and regulate it. Problem solved.
Just like Abortion, prostitution will happen weather it is legal or not.
Because of this making it legal and applying all the same health and safety legislation to it as any other job will make the currently very dangerous for the workers trade much much safer.
Illegal abortion results in a great deal of suffering, as does illegal prostitution.
What about people who have the biological urges but absolutely no interest in an intimate relationship with someone. Should I pretend to like a woman just so I can fulfill my needs?
I think it is much better to just pay someone for sex, then you both know where you stand..
I guarantee you if you go around the country to every fast food worker and ask whether if they had other options would they would take them, 100% would say yes! Your stats come from your ass man, i'm sorry. I want to be a prostitute for a bit after school, and it is NOT because I dont have other options! Illegalising it doesnt do shit. Only makes the problem worse.
@imyyz4u Christians are not the only people who desire a clean community. Prostitution being legalized will create a much larger market for human trafficking.
@nocturanas Then go after the traffickers and leave women who just want to make money alone.
In any case throwing the women in jail is not the right thing to do. No one can legally force you to work, throw the pimps in jail and leave the women and their customers alone.
@imyyz4u It is not my something I support, and I base my moral judgement off of the negative aspects of the what you are discussing. That is how we establish morals with some divine origin. Look around and ask yourself how your actions effect your enviroment around you. Good and bad are not perspectives, to maintain the social contract things like this should be shunned.
It seems like you're making every economically disadvantaged woman out to be legally incompentent. Some people work a shitty job because they have no other options. I don't see why (legal, regulated, safe) prostitution is any worse.
There's a problem with your argument about abuse and addiction in prostitutes. Regardless of which part of the world you get your stats from, in most countries in the world it is still (at least officially) illegal. How would you know if it is good or bad?
Your problem isn't really with prostitution it's with the lack of options available to young female unskilled labour. It's an economic issue not a feminist or moral issue at all and trying to dress it up as a moral issue is misleading.
Your argument is 'Young women lack opportunity and therefore prostitution is bad.' and it doesn't hold water. You can claim that lacking opportunity is bad (which it is) but that doesn't make prostitution bad.
Very well said and yes life is hard for women and unfortunately some women are too weak to say no or have no choice; there are some that do - do it by choice believe it or not.. but I agree with you that it demoralizes our society.
@ahmarsidd, yea that may be true but I know she DID watch it because she rated it one star, commented on it and we got into about a 3 hour discussion/argument on the day I made this... lol, so, she just ignored it
Well said sir;prostitution has been given a smug value that is a false paradigm;quite simply i observe it as another inferior parasite industry....Hail Peter Sutcliffe the yorkshire ripper!!
I think, a lot of the time, induvidual freedom is so celebrated that yes, it causes conflict in cases like porn and prostitution - we need to think of "well how will society will be affected as a whole"
I can't think in such selfish ways "ah, well she should do whatever she wants" or the attitude of "whatever floats your boat" it's too bad so many people can't look beyond these ideas.
and who decides whether it does a "society" good or not? freedom of the individual is paramount and should always come first. we construct democracy in such a away to prevent majorities from overwhelmingly imposing its values, preferences, biases, prejudices on minorities. you can disagree with prostitution for what ever reasons you want and opt out.
I should be left to make the same decisions. whats selfish it to think you have a right to decid for the both of us
Bah, she made part 2 or something. I can't believe she believes that this has to do with Christianity? Why can't it do with the direct exploitation, which is what it is...
Liberals are too afraid to challenge these things "everything goes, freedom blah blah" well it's not freedom, it's selling humans.
Sir, thank you for making the video response to xxxThePeachxxx, I could not articulate the debate as well as you did, but I am grateful there are other people out there that feel the same way. Thanks once again.
Well, there is an amount of women, men and transsexuals who enter these fields due to lack of options...I'd just be hard pressed to cite them as the majority. Not like any of this is the good news. I agree with most of what you said here and hope you'll make more videos exploring this subject in the future.
Many strippers enter the profession to alleviate educational expenses, and surprisingly, porn actresses tend to come from middle-income homes....prostitution is the only field where I could see your argument, but the argument still does not necessarily meet with reality. Were these statistics assembled from street walkers, ranches, escort services, stages nationwide, and other sex industry employers?
I think this is "brilliant," meditation on Prostitution. You really covered alot and there are quite a few things here I agree with. Also its a bold and risky view, especially since the consensus on this veers in the opposite direction. However, there is one thing I would disagree with. The idea of women who enter prostitution, porn, stripping, Phone fantasy, BDSM services as women who come from low income homes does not seem accurate.
There's not a whole lot I can say about that, really. We live in the digital age. People have sex, cameras exist; it was only a matter of time before people decided to start using those cameras to record themselves having sex. I think that a good portion of porn is benign. And I in no way advocate "banning" anything (well, simulated violence/rape/pedophilia perhaps.) My arguments are mostly aimed at the type of porn which obviously glorifies violence; and much of the "mainstream" stuff does.
Ok. Now they are. I tried replying twice to "ibnmissing." I said:
"To me, porn devalues sex and love. Like an EMT that responds to a car wrecks, after ten times the detached head doesn't phase him anymore." I agree completely with that; I keep using similar analogies and people don't seem to "get it." Thank you for sharing your insights and commenting!
I know plenty of functioning addicts, does that justify it or make it right. When does the addict become a failure, after they kill somebody behind the wheel ?
To me, porn devalues sex and love. Like an EMT that responds to a car wrecks, after ten times the detached head doesn't phase him anymore.
Sex without love is wrong IMHO, lots of different problems including unwanted children, STD's
The two teens I lectured didn't have a male figure in their lives and I did so only at the Mothers request.
Her oldest son stole her credit card and used it to log on to streaming porn site which resulted in indentity theft because the computer was already infected.
It's a tough stance to take as a guy : ) viewing porn takes away from the real experience of a loving relationship.
As a computer tech I have many moms ask me to lecture their teenage son's when they bring the family computer in for repair because of free porn sites.
I tell them porn is a mis-representation of what love and sex is about and can lead to relationship problems later in life.
porn doesn't misrepresent love, since porn is about sex. Sex and love are 2 independent things. It's like chocolate and peanut butter: sure some people prefer them together, but others are happy with only one sometimes.
As for lecturing teens, you'd be wasting your time. You're a computer tech, and they know it. Why would they listen to moral lessons from *you*, if they don't listen to mom?
Porn is not just about sex. It's about power and abuse. To say that porn = sex is as simplistic as comparing sex & love to peanut butter and chocolate.
Why would kids listen to an outside over their mother? Can you not remember what being a teenager was like? Or maybe it was different for you.
Ah, porn *can* be about power and abuse, but not all is. I'm not even sure I'd say most is. But *all* of it is about sex.
Some people prefer sex and love to go together, while some are happy with only one at a time.
Some people prefer chocolate and peanut butter to go together, while some are happy with only one at a time.
How is the comparison simplistic? There's no more connection between sex& love than between chocolate & peanut butter. It's only that people have made an association.
I agree that sex and love are not the same. I don't agree that porn is about sex. To me porn is about selling the idea, for the most part, that women (or the male substitute) are available for anything that any guy wants to do to them. Hence why so much in porn has nothing to do with sex. It is marketed as sexual, but in my personal experience it seems to shape what we think of as sexual. Like xx13moon I don't know how I feel about amateur stuff. Depends on the presentation.
@Dedgurlsingblu Thank goodness no male has ever been pressured by a woman to have sex.
I honestly wish you could experience being a male who chooses to say "no" to a woman...I am no prize, but its happened, and boy, was the reaction negative, because males are always required to want sex, all the time, I guess. Cant imagine what its like for a conventionally attractive male who says "no".
Of course its impossible a female could ever feel entitled, amirite?
I think you did a very good job in your argument, which is why I give a thumbs up to your video.
However, I do disagree with you.
But I do respect the fact that you presented a compelling argument.
NaomiChambers 1 week ago
I respectfully agree with her ;p
Fireinthedawn 2 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Im not here to argue about how well law enforcement does their job. thats a totally seperate issueand deserves its own seperate discussion. the last thing we need to to go off on a tangent. its law enforcments job to enforce the laws. their lack in ability to do so is not a good reason to then limit rights and freedoms to make their jobs easier. our rights should not be an inconvenience to them. they get paid by US to protect and serve US.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
sex trafficking and prostitution fits under a general umbralla of what we call domestic abuse (and neglect). law enforcement already have a set protocol for how they uncover cases of domestic abuse, exploitation and neglect of children, spouces and the elderly. but it first starts with abuse being reported. whether it be from victims coming forward themselves or concerned citizens reporting it.
decrim doesnt absolve people from obeying the law and it
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
doesnt make it harder for cops to do their job. there is no legal way to buy and sex sex from minors. so the legal route doesnt provide cover for that. even for those who worry about youths working in legal brothels. thats dealth with in the same mannor as the porn industry. and the buying and selling of alcohol and cigs. business are inspected reg. decoys are deployed to verify that businesses are obey the law and violators are punished.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
you said "children are prostituting themselves". keep in mind that i dont treat cases like this in the same manner as someone who is being threatened or restrained against their will. and a youth that puts themselves at risk is not treated like a victims. youths have sex all the time. sex doesnt automatically go from concentual to abuse with the exchange of money. kids may engage in activity that may be against their best interest and the laws are such that their best interest
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
are the responsibility of their parents and any adults they come in contact with. we (as adults) are not allowed to do anything that enables youths to engage in deliquent behavior regardless of how the youths feel about it.
if they want to prostitute themselves, that their business. legally, we cannot buy from them, force them to do it or harbor them in an environement that allows them to sell sex willingly.
the legal status of prostitution for concenting adults does not limit
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
law enforcment ability to protect youths. if anything, they will be harassing and arresting a lot of concenting adults. violating the rights of a lot of concenting adults. before they uncover cases of child prostitution. the protocol for uncovering child prostitution cases doesnt change with decrim. so if it doesnt change, it cant get harder to solve with decrim.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
you have to show me an instance where decrim allows special cover for child prostitution that would be impossible to duplicate in an illegal system. in other words, if the vice squat have to deal with the same type of cases in a illegal system. decriminalization wouldnt limit their ability to do their job cause either way (legal or illegal) they have to deal with it anyways.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I truely am at a loss at how to make this simple for you to understand. but i think you need to draw a venn diagram.
YES, there are areas where prostitution and trafficking are linked. but there is also an area where they dont. this area is mutually exclusive. this mutually exclusive area is the area that people are trying to legalize.
you asked more silly question: for you, but what about the people in prostitution that don't want to be there?
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
How will the change in law affect them?
the answer is simple. i already answered this question cause you've already asked be before.
to recap. the answer is ENFORCE THE LAWS THAT ALREADY EXIST!
there are laws against trafficking. legalizing concenting adults doesnt prevent cops from going after traffickers. if anything it makes it easier. cause people who do not want to be in the industry can seek help from law enforcement if they want it. the same way we deal with victims of
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
domestic abuse is the same way we would deal with victimes of human sex trafficking. victims need to have little to no barriers to come forward with complaints and law enforcment must make handling complaints a priority and to offer programs to get victims out when they need it.
the mutually exclusive area is (if you dont know already) is for the market of selling/buying concentual sex amount adults. although linked with trafficking through prostitution they are mutually .
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
exclusive and thus there are totally different ways for which society to handle both.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
your concern about child abuse has already been refuted. let me recap
1) no one is legalizing child prostitution. law enforcement still have to control it. and when they are not chasing after concenting adults they have more time and resources to protect real victims
2) when a prostitute is of the legal age they have the right to make decisions for themselves. regardless of whether they were abused as kids or started in the industry as a kid. they can choose to remain in it.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
there are many former abuse victimes that grow up to become cops, lawyers, doctors, nurses, actors, actresses, business owners, judges, teachers, students...
you are more than happy to trust former child abuse victimes to make decisions about their occupational choice when it comes to the mainstreem. why then would you remove that trust and treat them like they are pathetic peopl unable to make decisions in their own best interests if they chose to remain in the sex industry?
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
you create a terrible double standard by the way in which you treat workers as disparaged victims. rather than adults who are responsible for their own choices in life. every other person has to take responsibility for all the good and bad decisions they make in life. regret and shame are normal for all of us. so why is it that you are acting like prostitutes should be afforded special considerations that protect them from experienceing regret and shame? prostitution is not the
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
job a person can get into. even in countries were these women are treated badly and have a difficult time leaving the industry. even street prostitution in first world countries are not irredeemable. there are many women and men that enter and leave the industry of their own choice. there are even men and women who were once exploited while in the industry that leave and go on to better lives. so your " think about the children" argument is bunk. trafficking and child sex will
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
always be a crime. legalizing prositution only deals with legalizing concenting ADULTS to enter the market. law enforcments still have to do their part to keep kids out of the market. whether that market is legal or not. you treat prostitution, sex trafficing, child sex as if they are all mutually inclusive and legalizing prostitution would mean that the other two would have to be legitimized. thats false.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
there are exclusive elements of prostitution that can be legitimized (namely allowing only concenting adults to enter the market legally). concenting adults is not the same as adult having sex with a child and both are not the same as adult forcing another adult into prostitution. so your "what about trafficking" and 'what about child prostitution" is sheer nonsense. either you get the fact all these are different and should be handled differently or you dont.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
i just got finished stating that 80% of workers are independant and dont have pimps. and to reduce pimping (not that its inherently bad) is by making it legal for women to be independant and work from home. pimps can have a legitimate role in that the recruit clients. they are marketers. hell there are businesses centered around marketing. what makes pimping dangerouse is when women are in a position were they are employees instead of employers. a good business person hires
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
staff that does good work that is profitable for the business even when taking into account the cost the employer has to pay their employees for the work. when you have a trafficing situation its based the legal nature of what the workers and pimps are doing. when workers are committing a crime and have a pimp who is also commiting a crime there is room for a dominant person to exploit the weaker because the risks are high. if a woman can make money on her own legally
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
she then doesnt need a pimp. and so a pimp now is put in a position were they have to make themselves useful to the prostitute to stay employeed. they can be hired and fired like any other marketer or PR personel. violence that goes in stems from the hidden and illegal nature of prostitution. pimps can be exploitive because they have good reason to believe that their victims wont turn them in. they also have incentive to be violent because they also know their vicitm doesnt
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
need them to be in business. for them to make money. they have to find a way to be controllling. either by being productive OR (which is more likely the case) by enslaving and victimizing the worker. there may always bee a market for trafficing. but regardless of the legal status of prostitution its law enforcment job to keep it under control. like i said about a dozen times now, making prostitution a crime is part of the problem.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
you can I can both simply disagree. i think it would change. I grew up in a very religiouse household were I was taught (from a social/religiouse) point of view that prostitutes were dirty, evil, disgusting, pathetic, unworthy, greedy women. and the only time i ever saw one was in the news when they were being handcuffed and taken to jail like criminals. so i saw them as law breakers bad people. conservative media want to convince us that the no real woman wants to be
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
to be a prostitute. so they are victims now. they are forced by bad abusive pimps. when in reality over 80% of workers are independent and dont have pimps. I am told that they are forced because of drugs. well that may be the case for street walkers but they only make up about 20% of the industry. the public gains a lot of misinformation just from the fact that society deems prostitution a taboo. and prostitutes themselves guarded about their occupation because if the stigma and
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
and legal implication. so what's left? those who claim to be moral warriors are left to fill out heads with nonsense and convince us that prostitution is all bad. tell us what to think from the time we too young to challenge them on their facts. i was brought up the way my parents and grand parents were brought up. but the cycle stops with me. and a new cycle starts with more people like me who are eager to get sex industry out of the zone of the taboo. i dont
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
believe that preception will change completely in my generation. but it will change. there have been times in history were prostitutes were considered to be the top of the social ladder. praised, respected... even worshipped. it happened at least once. there is no reason it cant happen again.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
and even if preceptions dont change. that still doesnt change the fact that it should be legalized for those that want a legal way to enter the market.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
every issue being dicussed or debated has wide implication. prostitution is no different although you try and treat it as such. when it comes to the whole of society we are still left with my oringinal point. its simple. i know people like you dont like simple. you like to complicate things to make it seem like its too difficult to actualize. but its simple.
prostitution is still an option that people can, infact opt in and out of freely. if i were a prostitute. my choice
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
doesnt impact you any more than if i decided to be a nurse. your choice not to buy my services doesnt impact me any more than if you were to avoid buying any other product from me. on issues that deal with abuse, harm, trafficing, crime. how we would/should deal with prostitution would be no different in how we deal with issues like buying seeling alcohol/cigarettes, domestic violence, rape, murder, domestic slavery, child abuse in general.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
all the forseen issues that you can think of that may impact prostitution are already being battled right now in one form or another. worried about kids getting into prositution? well thats the same issue we worry about kids drinking alcohol and buying cigs. we have laws against selling alcohol to kids. we have law enforcement that send out decoys that verify that shop businesses are checking ID before they sell. we have school programs that educate kids on the dangers.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
and even with all that we do have kids getting their hands on the stuff. but we dont make it illegal for law abiding, concentind adults from buying and selling the product simply because there may be kids who will get their hands on the stuff.
worried about prositutes getting abused? well 40-90% (depending on country) of married women are abused domesticly. we have laws against it. we enforce those laws by giving women access to law enforcement and programs
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
that can help them get out of abusive situations. but at the end of the day these women still have the right to choose to stay in an abusive situation if they want. prostitution should be treated no differently. women who want help with abuse should have programs and law enforcement on their side. those who are fine with the risks should be left alone. we dont make it a crime to get married simply because some women may be abused. and we shouldnt make prostitution a criem for
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
exact same reason. worried about street prostitutes? making prostitution a crime doesnt help them at all. legal or not there will always be street prostitutes. the best way to deal with them is to make what they do legal so they have little to no reason to organize themselves, protect themselves and seek help when they need it. right now its the illegal nature of prostitution as well as social stigma that puts these women at risk.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
worried about poverity? well making prostitution a crime doesnt help. it takes away a viable income earning stream from people in the most need. what makes prostitution so attractive to workers is that its the ONLY occupation one can get started in today and make pure profit after their first costomer. most business have huge start up costs and takes 3-10 years to realize a profit. many occupation take years of training and education. a every expensive endevor with a high
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
opportunity cost (im an economics major). prostitutes are also top earners in most societies. as high as some executives and major companies. so for the poor, its an opporunity to make a hell of a lot of money with the least amount of work. it can be a great equalizer in the gap between the rich and poor for women who run their business in a legitimate way. because many make so much money many are able go to school or start up other businesses and become leaders in their community.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
take that away and these poor people are left with low paying job opportunites that are more degrading and back breaking labor.
worried about prostitutes who are drug abusers? like it or not. even drug abusers have to work to put food on their table. and prostitution is one of a few jobs that they can support themselves without getting fired. legal or not. drug abusers will prostitute themselves.trying to take that away from them put society at risk because these desperate
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
dont simply stop when their job is taken away from them. they move on to actually victimizing law abiding members of society. in trying to "protect" these women(and men) from the dangers and exploitation of the streets. you put them in a situation were they are a danger to the community. were they are at more of a risk to commit seriouse crimes with more seriouse consiquences. im talking about the same women you say are victims of murder, rape and robbery finding themselves
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
in a situation were they are complicit in crimes consist of murder, rape and robbery.it happens everyday I and, for one, would prefer a woman prostitute herself where she only only a danger to herself then find myself in a situation were that women have to rob or murder me (or anyone i care about) to support herself. call me selfish if you want. but most druggies dont hit a bottom and go straight to rehab just because you take away prostitution as an option to support their habit.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
so when i call you sly for being deliberatly vague when you walk about "is thinking about the wider implications of legalising prostitution " but go little into actual specifics about what you are talking about. I STAND BEHIND WHAT I SAID. I took my time and listed all the major"'wide implications" and addressed them and saved you the trouble. so now what?
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
are you kidding me. right now we are not even on the same page. YES being a maid is related. especially when talking about trafficking. there are different types of trafficking. including slavery and domestic survitude. we dont make being a maid illegal to combat slavery. the same way we shouldnt make prostitution illegal to combat sex trafficking. so we do have laws against enslavement. law enforcement have tricks to combat it. so if you are asking about how do we prevent
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
sex trafficking than the simple answer is to look at how law enforcment control other forms of trafficking. you also asked another silly question:Since the governments will also benefit, by putting a tax on people that have sex, where will the incentive be, from them, to develop other employment and educational opportunities?.
1) you assume that these works are obliged to get an education. which they are not. if hey want to spend the rest of their lives a prostitutes. so be it
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
2) everyone pays taxes to the governement. why would you think that a prostitute should be any different or that prostitutes forced to pay taxes burdens them any more than taxes burdens any other employed person. prostitutes from the streets the the high end are in the top 10% of earners in any given country. these women and men are top earners. so why are you worried about how much taxes they have to pay?
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
the point of getting an education is to get employable skills. a prostitute is someone with employable skills already. if she/he doesnt like prostitution they have an automatic incentive to find other opportuntites including getting an education. what helps this process along is having a sigma free society that accepts prostitutes as normal, respectable people. in societys and countries were prostitutes are seen as "tarnished" and rejected by families and seen as
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
unemployable because of their occupation puts these women (and men) in a position were they have few opporunties asside from prostitution get help. make them a victim of society we are better able to protect prostitutes when we, as a society, deem them worthy of the same respect and rights that we afford anyone else.
ask your question again. and this time take out prostitute and put in CEO of a mega corperation, maid, or carpeter, janitor... if you see these women as being
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
equal to any other person in society you will quickly see just how stupid your question really is. when it comes to the choice of education vs working you will find that prostitutes face the same decision making as anyone else and yet you treat them like victimes or worthy of more consideration than others. thats degrading to them because you are , infact viewing them as people incapable of making a good decision that is in their best interest. there are educated prostitutes.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
you and i both agree that legalization will not help everybody. BUT NO ONE SAID THAT IT HAS TO HELP EVERYONE! just like we have laws that make it illegal to murder. that doesnt mean that everyone one is safe from being killed. harm reduction is just that. REDUCING HARM not eliminating it. and the fact that we legalization may not help anyone doesnt make the process illigitimate cause the fact is that it may help many. especially those who want help and at the end of the day
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
we cant force help on people who dont want it. we can only make help available for thse that do want it. i see no problem with that at all. this goes for women of domestic violance, rape victims, drug addicts... all have the right to refuse help and made decisions for themselves. you ask a very silly question :what happens to the people that find themselves in a situation that forces them to have their benefits cut/stopped if they don't accept a job as a prostitute?
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
the answer is simple. THE SAME THING THAT HAPPENS WITH EVERY OTHER EMPLOYED PERSON. there are a lot of people who hate their jobs but feel like they are forced to work because other opportunitites dont come easy. a prostitution in the situation you posed with your question has the same problems as everyone else. having to make the decision to put up with a shitty job or quit. as long as she doesnt have a gun to her head or is being threatened with violence. i dont give a damn what
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
what happens to her. the same way I dont give a damn what happens to a woman who scrubs toilet for a living and is then told that she has to work longer hours for less pay. or have her benifits cut. legitimizing prostitution put these women in a situation were they will face the same types of problems the rest of us face. i dont see why you feel the need to protect prostitutes from LIFE's HARD DECISIONS.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Again, no one said anything of changing a sick minds. sick people, regardless of where there is a legal system or not will do bad things. with a legalized system there are few barriers a worker has to cross to protect themselves and seek help when they need it. as for trafficking. legalization is not set up to control that either. I gave the example of domestic servitude by which the fact that people can legally hire mades but the fact that there is a legal market doesnt
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
mean that slavery and exploitation is stopped.it also doesnt mean that the demand for slave labor will stop. what legalization does is keep concenting adults out of prision so cops can fill it up with actual criminals. its still up to law enforcment to enforce the laws.if trafficking is illegal than law enforcement have to take a priority stance to keep it under control. when they do that, regardless of the legal status of any industry/market, crime rate goes down.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Like I said. no one said anything about crime reduction. right NOW the battle is waging on the RIGHT to for men and women to enter into a legal market for prostitution. even if the harm were to remain consistant and unchanging. its still a fight that should be won in favor of human rights. YES, its believed that as a result of legalization workers (prostitutes and johns) may help many construct a safe environment in which to do business and have the backing of law enforcement
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
and the justice system to go for protection and to settle disputes. but even if we were to argue that crime were to remain constant or increased. we are still talking about a human rights and the laws against prostitution conflict with it and is inconsistant
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
yes....
and that is exactly what I said. IMO thats a good thing.
so the fact that you repeat my position back for me makes me think that you disagree with it or see a problem.
yet, you dont state what your problem is.
i want to make sure we are on the same page cause i dont quite know what it is you are for or against.
so please. state your position.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
NO ONE EVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT REDUCING CRIME! get that straight. what legalization does is gives concenting adults the right to do as they please. so that cops are not wasting their time chasing around these people and can devote their time to actual victims who need/want their help. legalization also reduces barriers for workers and johns to seek help from the authorities. right now, laws make it less likely for either to seek help. so rather than call police or sue in court
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
both sides are put in a position were violence may be the only way to settle disputes. also when we see rates of crime go up after legalization. what you are most likey seeing is an increase in complaints. when you legalize both sides are more willing to file a complaint and seek help. which is a good thing! its not necessarily that abuse or crime is rising but more vicitms are coming forward. and cops have more money and time to actually make these reports a higher priority.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
like i said about 3 or 4 times now. when cops are not chasing after concenting adults they have more time and resources to assist actual victims. with the additional taxes generated for the legal industry more money can be pumped in to better deal with issues like trafficing and child abuse. devote more money and time to actual issues than they would before. but i have to stress again. the aim is not to reduce crime. its to free up resources so cops can actually efficiently go
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
after people who are actually victimizing people rather than go after concenting, law abiding adults and violating their rights. yes, its possible to see stats indicating that there is a higher rate crime. but thats probably because cops are taking a higher piority to going after criminals and victims are more willing to report abuses.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
legalization addresses slavery, poverty, workers rights, abuse, trafficking, taxing, sigma, choice, misogyny, public health, murder...
you claim it doesnt. but i say it addresses ALL. and i've already touched on ALL you've presented on this entire comment section i have no interest to repeat myself.
the issue is no more complex with any other issue.
you are concerned about workers rights? then legalize. cause right now the laws against prostitution violates their rights.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
worried about child abuse? legal or not that will always be an issue. but with legalization you are not wasting money or time going after concenting adults and you can focus it on actual victims
worried about trafficing? handle it in the same way you would when it comes to domestic slaves.
worried about public health? well prostitutes and johns have a huge insentive to and do largely use protection. which is something regular people dont do as readily and it
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
is probably why the general public are more at risk for getting aids and other stds then prostitutes and johns. if you go for legalization, you can even mandate minimum requirements of health testing and saftey standards if you wish. but in general johns and prostitutes that actually use protection of their own volition are far safer then members of the public who are less likely to be as careful.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
as for sigma? that too is perpetuated by the fact that the industry is illegal. so not only are prostitutes seen as amoral but criminal too. legitimize the industry by making it an actual occupation with pension, health plans, taxes... reduces that stigma and over time it reduces the alienation of workers and johns.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
no one is talking about enslavement. the legalizing movment is about giving concenting adults the ride to decide what they do with their money.
legal or not. cops are still going to see people get exploited. so instead of chasing around concenting adults. they can devote their resources to actual victims. prostitution and enslavement are two seperate issues.
prostitution does not lead to slaverly no more than
being a maid leads to slavery.
inspite of the fact
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
criminals have recruited people for both the sex industry and domestic servitude. you can be a maid without being exploited. and you can be a prostitute without being exploited. and if you have a problem with prostitutes becuase there may be people who are going to be trafficed then you should also take issue with maids. cause there is also a wide (less known) trafficing industry surrounding domestic slaves who are documented as housekeepers and nannies.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
danger is not paramount. there are a lot of things that are dangerouse. like going to the carnival and getting on a ride. there are risks. we DONT make it illegal for even children to ride. what we do is ensure a level of safety and hold ride makers responsible for keeping up with requirements to operate legally. there are always going to be rides the malfuction. people will be injured or killed, operators/owers that are sloppy. the point is to hold them responsible for
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
reducing the risks and paying dearly when they fail to do so. the same goes for any other privilage. there are ALWAYS GOING TO BE CHILDREN AND ADULTS WHO ARE ABUSED OR EXPLOITED. no one is trying ot make it legal. so these are issues that will always be of a concern to the authorities and the public. but you dont reduce rights under the guise you are trying to save lives. you save lives my giving people the right to do as they please in a safe way.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
ameaneringsoul.... "should be treated accordingly and considered when changing laws."
my answer to that stupid state ment is... DUH!!!!
i dont know what i said to give you the impression that i would disagree cause im saying pretty much the same thing. obvousely the reason why you state is cause you dont want the laws to change but dont want to come out and just say that it is you really want. thats a sly move on your part.
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
thats the problem with people like you. you " see" too damn much. there are a lot of things that are harmful. fast food, cars vs pedestrians, smoking, alcohol, guns.... freedom gives us all the right to decide how, as individuals we will handle these things. but at the same time we all have a responsibility to each other to be careful and considerate to the welbeing and safety of others. for instance. if you want to smoke, fine. but you dont smoke in doors were there are
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
other people. you like playing iwth guns? fine, you need to get legal authorization to own and handle one. want to drive? well, not everyone can drive. you have to get the education, training and authorization to do so. and even though people have these rights . we do have peopl who break the rules and hurt others. there are people wo get drunk and act a fool, putting others in danger. there are people become morbidly obese, putting a strain on their family, the
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
health care system. there are people who even feed their kids fast food. making it highly likely that they will grow up to become obese and have health problems. some would say that feeding kids fast food should be considered a form of child abuse/neglect. hell, we all have the right to marry. even though between 40-90% of women are abused by their spouses. we dont make it illegal to marry, drive, drink, smoke, eat fatty foods, own guns... simply because there may be people
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
who will be harmed... we find a balance that maximized freedom for all while looking out for the best interest of individuals. legalizing prostitution is ment to give concenting adults the right to do as they please with their money and bodies. that doesnt mean that it makes it ok for people to engage sex trafficing or child abuse. nor will it make it difficult for authorities to control the victimization of people in the sex industry. when it comes to racism. you must realize
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
Comment removed
Bigpussycat5 1 month ago
While I do agree with you that the social problems associated with prostitution are the real concern and that sexuality should not be commodified, I don't see how it helps the people having to sell their bodies in order to make money to further cement their position in society by criminalising them.
propergander 5 months ago
GREAT VID. You hit the nail on the head when you say that it's about the capitalists system's need to commodify our most intimate human qualities. And also, that it's a question for society in general to decide... despite what the YT individualists like to claim. I've done about 20 vids on this subject. And sent one in to this vid, as a response. All the best - Mick
mickGPN 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I think that everyone better watch the movie 'Zeitgeist moving forward' here on youtube. It's a 2 hours and 40 minutes documentary movie that tells what's causing to human problems all over the planet, and it suggests a really good solution. Just type the name of the movie in the search bar and you'll get it.
stamstuff 9 months ago
You really have no idea what you are talking about, do you?
PornEqualsFreedom 10 months ago
This is an excellent video. I'm glad I found it again.
GirlonFilm1969 10 months ago
This video is all kinds of awesomeness. xxx13moons - THANK YOU for presenting this subject in its true light. All too often when the subject of the sex industry comes up, the hordes of supporters throw in their extremely weak arguments, completely missing the "forest" and it drives me absolutely insane.
HisPrincessofLight 10 months ago
gravity bless you
RadicalSyndicate 10 months ago
Missed this vid originally. Bet you got alot of shit for it....
FriendOregon 10 months ago
Comment removed
islandalien 10 months ago
Comment removed
islandalien 10 months ago
Ultimately, feminism is about women living their own lives according to their own choices. If they want to be stay-at-home moms, prostitutes, or porn stars, it should be their choice and their choice alone. No one can say otherwise. To do so would be the opposite of feminism.
r3v3ng3ofthef4113n 1 year ago
How is prostitution Misogyny? Misogyny is the hatred of women, and prostitution, stripping, pornography are all industries based around the worship of women.
Plus you're argument is based around your own personal views, and trying to push them off on other people without having any facts to back them up with. Remember, while women are making thousands of $ a week, men are getting 4$ behind a Denny's, while society ignores their pain and obsesses about women.
TheSpazzofMuffins 1 year ago
@TheSpazzofMuffins, "the worship of women?" really? Is that REALLY going to be the starting point of your argument? Have you ever watched Porn? Try again son.
xx13moons 1 year ago 8
@xx13moons Dude your argument doesn't make sense, that there are some that dont like to work in the sex industry, if you paid attention to the peach,they do have some options, they may not pay great but they have them. they just want easy money thats the reason they do sex work . Furthermore just because someone doesn't like a job is not a legitimate reason to make it Ilegal. there are many jobs people hate more, are more boring and pay less than sex. as long as it is not forced its ok
Ddstairclimber 1 year ago
@xx13moons So all porn is equivalent? Are you truly unable to distinguish between say, a video made by a couple who are exhibitionists who wish to share (and maybe make a bit of money off of it) and the type of porn you seem to believe is the only type that exists?
And you may have you opinion about sex being the "most intimate act" etc, but surely you dont expect everyone to have the same opinion towards sex as you, do you? Are they allowed to live differently?
BobChaos23 10 months ago
@BobChaos23 the boundaries of your relations with your palm should be dictated only by you 2, i agree.
amet1980 10 months ago
@TheSpazzofMuffins Prostitution is paid rape...period...gee, what could be misogynist about that?
Prostitution, stripping and porn are about the worship of women? Are you freaking kidding me? Do women in these professions get respected by society? No, they're stereotyped and looked down on, even by the men who employ them (to a great extent). Sure a woman can make money in the sex industries, but what does that really say about how our society values women? Nothing good IMO.
105Mittens 1 year ago
@105Mittens Rape is sex against a woman’s consent. Prostitution is sex with a woman’s consent for a price. Faulty logic is faulty. :(
r3v3ng3ofthef4113n 1 year ago
Comment removed
105Mittens 1 year ago
@r3v3ng3ofthef4113n If a woman wants to have sex, she'll do it for free. Prostitutes don't want sex, they want money...so basically a man should know (when going to a prostitute) that he is enticing a woman to have sex that she does not want, in exchange for money...empahsis on sex she doesn't want...I didn't say it was forcible rape...
105Mittens 1 year ago
@r3v3ng3ofthef4113n I do understand what you're saying but I just have a different way of looking at things. So what if a man has sex with a prostitute and then runs off with out paying. Has the woman been raped then or just been a victim of theft? I've heard men joke that raping a prostitute is no worse than shoplifting...do you agree?
105Mittens 1 year ago
Dude, you have to take your morals out of the picture. And, well, yeah, prostitution IS the selling of a commodity, sex. Why is this a bad thing? Consensual Adults, by the way.
di739 1 year ago
@di739 Seriously!
PornEqualsFreedom 10 months ago
And what is this silly righteous immature assumption that intimacy is automatically preserved when its void of financial transaction? Are you implying every sexual encounter that wasnt paid for was automatically intimate? Give me a break from the righteous routine please. WTF do care what someone else does with their private life? Like George Carlin said; Why should it be illegal to sell something thats perfectly legal to give away? Your argument is so ridiculous on so many levels.
tubeboy8 1 year ago 2
Youre not making an intelligent argument; youre just advocating for laws that adhere to your personal views and opinions. Spectacular Fail.
tubeboy8 1 year ago
@tubeboy8 I totally agree!!
PornEqualsFreedom 10 months ago
While this may often be the case it is not always the case. The fact that you and I may believe that sexual intimacy should be cherished doesnt mean we have any right at all to impose that belief upon anyone else. For those who believe that intimacy is not a requirement of sex, your suggesting that they be declined the right to live in accordance to such beliefs, even when no one with the exception of the
consenting parties is affected.
tubeboy8 1 year ago
Wow, talk about a blatant double standard. Youre making the same fundamental argument that those opposed to gay marriage make. Regardless how you want to present it, youre advocating the legislation of a personal moral position. Laws are an institutionalized enforcement of writings to protect civil liberties. Youre also discriminating when you imply that every prostitute is the victim of dysfunctional or unfortunate circumstances.
tubeboy8 1 year ago
How can a male prostitute be a misogynist?
You need to ask yourself, do you actually have a point because your assumption is that all sex will be for pay and will be prostituted sex if prostitution is legalized. Quite incorrect.
You should apologize for calling her video 'horrible', don't you think?
Getsen42 1 year ago
Your points are a position I don't share. Aside from that... look around -- we're already here, hoss. There's a reason they say 'sex sells'. And don't forget Amsterdam, plenty of success in their story. And when you say 'consenting', recall for a second that a prostitute is in fact consenting. You can say there's more to sex outside of prostitution, and I might even agree, but only sometimes.
Hardryv 1 year ago
@Hardryv Amsterdam is not a succes at all. The city closed one third of brothels due to crime related to prostitution. The laws are currently being revised for lack of 'succes'. Amsterdam is also focussing on helping to get women out of the business. You cant use it as an example anymore of a succes of legalization.
summersonset 1 year ago
@summersonset -- I won't challenge your assessment of Amsterdam as I'm not a citizen. I am however a citizen in the United States and the last time I checked the one place that off-film prostitution is legal here is Las Vegas had no prostitution-related crime issues and to date not even a single case of STD transmission. Seems to support legalization well.
Hardryv 1 year ago
It's me again, I just watched her part 2, there she adresses your argument as well - and in my opinion very convincingly. The question I have, do you have any response to that?
Herbarius 1 year ago
Very good argumentation.
However, I do think prositution should be (or stay) decriminalized. Most of those women have enough problems in their lives already without having to deal with legal prosecution.
Herbarius 1 year ago
When a man goes to a hooker he is not buying her like he's buying a bottle of ketchup or light blulb. he's buying her time and services. So FAIL right there
Zain844 1 year ago
You know, not everyone has the time nor inclination to pursue a relationship with someone of the opposite gender, and so a pay-for-intimacy option should certainly be made available.
As for your complaints in regards to the demographic, where are your complaints about those employed in the fast-food industry? What about the commodification of fast food, which considers profits over customer well-being?
Want to minimize issues? Legalize and regulate it. Problem solved.
SexedUpAtheist 1 year ago
Just like Abortion, prostitution will happen weather it is legal or not.
Because of this making it legal and applying all the same health and safety legislation to it as any other job will make the currently very dangerous for the workers trade much much safer.
Illegal abortion results in a great deal of suffering, as does illegal prostitution.
Quite frankly it is immoral not to legalise it.
believerornot 1 year ago
What about people who have the biological urges but absolutely no interest in an intimate relationship with someone. Should I pretend to like a woman just so I can fulfill my needs?
I think it is much better to just pay someone for sex, then you both know where you stand..
imyyz4u 1 year ago
I guarantee you if you go around the country to every fast food worker and ask whether if they had other options would they would take them, 100% would say yes! Your stats come from your ass man, i'm sorry. I want to be a prostitute for a bit after school, and it is NOT because I dont have other options! Illegalising it doesnt do shit. Only makes the problem worse.
coldfire8840 1 year ago
So, tossing the women who prostitute themselves into jail is the best option?
I say make it legal and offer women other options, If the women really want to get out they can, or not even start in the first place.
Keeping it illegal just makes them criminals on top of everything else.
imyyz4u 1 year ago
@imyyz4u Christians are not the only people who desire a clean community. Prostitution being legalized will create a much larger market for human trafficking.
nocturanas 1 year ago
@nocturanas Then go after the traffickers and leave women who just want to make money alone.
In any case throwing the women in jail is not the right thing to do. No one can legally force you to work, throw the pimps in jail and leave the women and their customers alone.
imyyz4u 1 year ago
@imyyz4u It is not my something I support, and I base my moral judgement off of the negative aspects of the what you are discussing. That is how we establish morals with some divine origin. Look around and ask yourself how your actions effect your enviroment around you. Good and bad are not perspectives, to maintain the social contract things like this should be shunned.
nocturanas 1 year ago
It seems like you're making every economically disadvantaged woman out to be legally incompentent. Some people work a shitty job because they have no other options. I don't see why (legal, regulated, safe) prostitution is any worse.
There's a problem with your argument about abuse and addiction in prostitutes. Regardless of which part of the world you get your stats from, in most countries in the world it is still (at least officially) illegal. How would you know if it is good or bad?
KindlySpastic 1 year ago
Your problem isn't really with prostitution it's with the lack of options available to young female unskilled labour. It's an economic issue not a feminist or moral issue at all and trying to dress it up as a moral issue is misleading.
Your argument is 'Young women lack opportunity and therefore prostitution is bad.' and it doesn't hold water. You can claim that lacking opportunity is bad (which it is) but that doesn't make prostitution bad.
Your stats are nonsense BTW. No citation = fail..
Omniwoof 2 years ago
I understand that u see prostitution immoral, but that again, that is up for each adult to decide, so it is not a relevant argument to creminalize
davidcaro06 2 years ago
Very well said and yes life is hard for women and unfortunately some women are too weak to say no or have no choice; there are some that do - do it by choice believe it or not.. but I agree with you that it demoralizes our society.
iiPierceThruDarkness 2 years ago
It is disrespectful to women.She should be ashamed of herself.
TrynaGetBacToMyLuv 2 years ago
xx13moons If you watch her video it seems apparent that she never watched your response
ahmarsidd 2 years ago
@ahmarsidd, yea that may be true but I know she DID watch it because she rated it one star, commented on it and we got into about a 3 hour discussion/argument on the day I made this... lol, so, she just ignored it
xx13moons 2 years ago
very good points
UltraViolence14 2 years ago
Well said sir;prostitution has been given a smug value that is a false paradigm;quite simply i observe it as another inferior parasite industry....Hail Peter Sutcliffe the yorkshire ripper!!
HITLERSBERLINSANDPIT 2 years ago
I could not have said it better myself. Great job. I completely agree with you.
VvGatubela 2 years ago
Well said! You're a great guy to think the way you do!
Shannah :)
Shannah84 2 years ago
I think, a lot of the time, induvidual freedom is so celebrated that yes, it causes conflict in cases like porn and prostitution - we need to think of "well how will society will be affected as a whole"
I can't think in such selfish ways "ah, well she should do whatever she wants" or the attitude of "whatever floats your boat" it's too bad so many people can't look beyond these ideas.
antiquelens 2 years ago 6
and who decides whether it does a "society" good or not? freedom of the individual is paramount and should always come first. we construct democracy in such a away to prevent majorities from overwhelmingly imposing its values, preferences, biases, prejudices on minorities. you can disagree with prostitution for what ever reasons you want and opt out.
I should be left to make the same decisions. whats selfish it to think you have a right to decid for the both of us
Bigpussycat5 2 months ago
especially under the guise of you believing that it "affects"society (negatively). forget about society. how does it harm you.
you've opted out. you are not selling or buying.
how would it affect you?
Bigpussycat5 2 months ago
Bah, she made part 2 or something. I can't believe she believes that this has to do with Christianity? Why can't it do with the direct exploitation, which is what it is...
Liberals are too afraid to challenge these things "everything goes, freedom blah blah" well it's not freedom, it's selling humans.
antiquelens 2 years ago 4
Peach made a part two? Oh bleh... I'm gonna have to go check that out now.
xx13moons 2 years ago
Sir, thank you for making the video response to xxxThePeachxxx, I could not articulate the debate as well as you did, but I am grateful there are other people out there that feel the same way. Thanks once again.
invest423 2 years ago 4
Well, there is an amount of women, men and transsexuals who enter these fields due to lack of options...I'd just be hard pressed to cite them as the majority. Not like any of this is the good news. I agree with most of what you said here and hope you'll make more videos exploring this subject in the future.
womanwheart 2 years ago
Many strippers enter the profession to alleviate educational expenses, and surprisingly, porn actresses tend to come from middle-income homes....prostitution is the only field where I could see your argument, but the argument still does not necessarily meet with reality. Were these statistics assembled from street walkers, ranches, escort services, stages nationwide, and other sex industry employers?
womanwheart 2 years ago
I think this is "brilliant," meditation on Prostitution. You really covered alot and there are quite a few things here I agree with. Also its a bold and risky view, especially since the consensus on this veers in the opposite direction. However, there is one thing I would disagree with. The idea of women who enter prostitution, porn, stripping, Phone fantasy, BDSM services as women who come from low income homes does not seem accurate.
womanwheart 2 years ago
What do you think about amateur porn?
organdva 2 years ago
There's not a whole lot I can say about that, really. We live in the digital age. People have sex, cameras exist; it was only a matter of time before people decided to start using those cameras to record themselves having sex. I think that a good portion of porn is benign. And I in no way advocate "banning" anything (well, simulated violence/rape/pedophilia perhaps.) My arguments are mostly aimed at the type of porn which obviously glorifies violence; and much of the "mainstream" stuff does.
xx13moons 2 years ago
You are not alone in your beliefs about these subjects. I think the argument you made was right on.
Zaimoren 2 years ago
what the heck, why aren't my comments showing up anymore....
xx13moons 2 years ago
Ok. Now they are. I tried replying twice to "ibnmissing." I said:
"To me, porn devalues sex and love. Like an EMT that responds to a car wrecks, after ten times the detached head doesn't phase him anymore." I agree completely with that; I keep using similar analogies and people don't seem to "get it." Thank you for sharing your insights and commenting!
xx13moons 2 years ago
I've smoked pot, looked at porn and did other things I'm not real proud of.
I'm not pious and righteous, I just feel differently about those things now that I have a few years under my belt.
I was exposed to porno from my older brother at a very young age.
ibnmissing 2 years ago 6
I agree, most teens would not listen to the computer repairman. Your right.
Teen in general think they know it all. This Mom needed a Man's view point and asked me to help.
Having three children, I felt qualified to advise him.
ibnmissing 2 years ago 3
I know plenty of functioning addicts, does that justify it or make it right. When does the addict become a failure, after they kill somebody behind the wheel ?
To me, porn devalues sex and love. Like an EMT that responds to a car wrecks, after ten times the detached head doesn't phase him anymore.
ibnmissing 2 years ago 4
Sex without love is wrong IMHO, lots of different problems including unwanted children, STD's
The two teens I lectured didn't have a male figure in their lives and I did so only at the Mothers request.
Her oldest son stole her credit card and used it to log on to streaming porn site which resulted in indentity theft because the computer was already infected.
Just my opinion : )
ibnmissing 2 years ago 3
It's a tough stance to take as a guy : ) viewing porn takes away from the real experience of a loving relationship.
As a computer tech I have many moms ask me to lecture their teenage son's when they bring the family computer in for repair because of free porn sites.
I tell them porn is a mis-representation of what love and sex is about and can lead to relationship problems later in life.
My two cents : )
ibnmissing 2 years ago 5
ibnmissing: You rock!!!
chocolatepoundcake 2 years ago
porn doesn't misrepresent love, since porn is about sex. Sex and love are 2 independent things. It's like chocolate and peanut butter: sure some people prefer them together, but others are happy with only one sometimes.
As for lecturing teens, you'd be wasting your time. You're a computer tech, and they know it. Why would they listen to moral lessons from *you*, if they don't listen to mom?
jursamaj 2 years ago
Porn is not just about sex. It's about power and abuse. To say that porn = sex is as simplistic as comparing sex & love to peanut butter and chocolate.
Why would kids listen to an outside over their mother? Can you not remember what being a teenager was like? Or maybe it was different for you.
chocolatepoundcake 2 years ago
Ah, porn *can* be about power and abuse, but not all is. I'm not even sure I'd say most is. But *all* of it is about sex.
Some people prefer sex and love to go together, while some are happy with only one at a time.
Some people prefer chocolate and peanut butter to go together, while some are happy with only one at a time.
How is the comparison simplistic? There's no more connection between sex& love than between chocolate & peanut butter. It's only that people have made an association.
jursamaj 2 years ago
A recent study shows abusive porn is not the exception but the rule in top selling porn:
89.8% of the scenes included either verbal or physical aggression
48% contained verbal aggression
82.2% contained physical aggression
94.4% of the aggressive acts were targeted at women
70% of pornography's audience is straight males watching alone
Links to study & video at my channel.
Note: the above can be confirmed by reviewing current best-selling porn titles & their content. See AVN(.)com charts.
AntiPornographyBlog 2 years ago
I agree that sex and love are not the same. I don't agree that porn is about sex. To me porn is about selling the idea, for the most part, that women (or the male substitute) are available for anything that any guy wants to do to them. Hence why so much in porn has nothing to do with sex. It is marketed as sexual, but in my personal experience it seems to shape what we think of as sexual. Like xx13moon I don't know how I feel about amateur stuff. Depends on the presentation.
Dedgurlsingblu 2 years ago 5
@Dedgurlsingblu So much in porn has nothing to do with sex? How do you figure that?
PriscillaRelentless 1 year ago
@Dedgurlsingblu Thank goodness no male has ever been pressured by a woman to have sex.
I honestly wish you could experience being a male who chooses to say "no" to a woman...I am no prize, but its happened, and boy, was the reaction negative, because males are always required to want sex, all the time, I guess. Cant imagine what its like for a conventionally attractive male who says "no".
Of course its impossible a female could ever feel entitled, amirite?
BobChaos23 10 months ago