Ian Dunbar has no clue what he is talking about. This trash science agenda is merely misrepresentation and exploitation at its worse. I put out an open challenge to any pigeon behaviorist who can answer my specific questions regarding conditioning, influence, learning theory and behavior. What a joke.
@aboutdogtraining3 not in the least, I'm actually a bit of a fan. He actually had a big sit down with millan for a copy of his magazine. Some of his stuff, like his take on puppy accidents I think is a bit out to lunch and his social media outlet was a bit underutilized IMO, but no, not jealous.
I followed this guy on various social networking sites and he spent 99% of his time bragging about the posh gallery or fancy restaurant he was going to.
for all the " and now the dog is euthanized" fighters... he never said why. And if he was euthinized for his problems, then chances are Ian wasn't around. Most of you guys don't know Dr.Dunbar did a multi-year scientific study on Dog aggression.
I share Ian's vision for the future! Understanding and accepting your dog for what he/she is is the first step to being able to mold them into a pleasant companion. Be the leader and teach by example.
I loved this video, thank you very much. I am getting my family a puppy, we have three children and they are thrilled. I agree with everything you had to say and I look forward to watching many more vids before our bundle of joy arrives~
I'm a Cesar fan and I like the video. But just as many people give Cesar a bad rap because they use anger and uncontrolled rage in their attempt at domination with no attempt at communication, many of his antagonists in th PP camp are equally, if not more, violent and accusatory when they try to browbeat those who do not agree 100% with their dogma. Anyone who cares enough to discuss dog training also cherishes their relationship with their dog, The methods should be their own choice.
@PaulAndMuttley 20 years ago, many people would agree with you. But the salient issue at the moment is, science (and anecdotal evidence) has discovered so many things about how dogs learn, their genetic origins, their ancestor's social behaviour and the domestic dogs' social behaviour- as pets and as feral dogs. And all the evidence is against what Millan speaks about. People can make their own choices, but there is now a clear line between what is true about dogs and what isn't.
Respond to this video... So for me, it's silly to use physical methods with our dogs, or think of our relationship (and dogs' relationships with other dogs) as hierarchical, because there is no ethological value to them- which people used to believe there was. Cesar says some good things, don't get me wrong, but usually those things are completely out-weighed by the inaccurate advice. We need a good role-model for owners who just want to do the best for their dogs- and Cesar isn't it anymore.
ok so, he went to someones house to help their aggressive dog, didnt fix the problem, and now that dog is euthanized? the hell? im sick and tired of all these +R ppl humanizing dogs and not using alternative methods that would rehabilitate aggressive dogs. like sending the dog to a real dog behaviorialist. youre not going to cookie the aggression away.
@H15A5H1 Real dog behaviourists are the ones who use motivational methods like food, toys etc. And if you listened closely to what Dr Dunbar was saying, it wasn't that he couldn't help the dog but it was the owners who were not putting the time and effort into their dog. Without an owner's compliance, it's very difficult to make headway into serious behaviour issues. That dog was probably on a court order to be euthanised, so it was out of Dunbar's hands when the owners made mistakes again.
I find it fascinating that dog training relates so well to many other areas in life. This is awesome stuff right here :] It really gives a broader view on what to do in different situations.
@HiveDes There was no specific punishment which is the point..... The dog was made aware of what was expected of him and corrected without anger or aggression. Just like kids or spouses, the energy you put out will be dished right back to you.
There is an exception to every rule. Life will be easier for all involved if we accept what we have and deal with each situation individually.
maybe this guys good,but slutwell is bad and puts nice dogs down.honestly check out "bengie" its the episode she tried to cover up...and her forum bans you if u mention it..
I cannot say enough how much I love Dr. Dunbar. I've heard him speak in conferences, seen him work, and seen him in a more personal setting. He is an amazing man, and no one can convince me otherwise! Its stupid to force someone to see truth when they've got their noses buried in lies. I've already learned to not argue with ignorant trainers (Cesar followers). Just lead by example, be gracious, but firm in your beliefs. Cheers to all the good trainers on here from a younger gen. trainer!
this guy is the same as victoria slutwell they are "trainers" and are fairly useless when it comes to corection. they cant stop a dog from trying to kill another dog,all they can do is get a dog to sit! what good is that? useless twats fuck off and watch cesar millan.a guy who knows what hes doing.
@wreckedrasclad cesars better than victoria slutwell.cesar doesnt tell families over the phone that they should put down theyre dog,because she cant train it. this dumbar guy and slutwell,still use negitive corection,they use loud bangs and noises.just because they like to feel superior claiming better methods.
@timHYPERLITE You clearly haven't seen the episode where Cesar used a remote training collar on the dog. The way he was using it was in a NEGATIVE way. So, where is your justification in that for him? Please educate yourself. How is an alpha roll, harsh jerk on a choke chain, and slight kick to the rump not considered a negative correction? I'm not being sarcastic... I seriously wish to understand your logic and thinking.
@Mewsaphine sure agreed sometimes all trainers loose it and loose there cool.BUT cesar hasnt told anyone to put theyre dog down. look on the internet for its me or the dog,bengi put down. victoria gave up and told family OVER THE PHONE that they should give up and put the dog down.sure cesar uses negartive training but ive never seen him give up and say that a dog should be put down.the food/obedience training is ok,but if a dogs life is on the line,victoria will have him put down.
@timHYPERLITE I wasn't able to find that episode, but contrary to your belief, not all dogs can be saved! Some dogs are too dangerous to humans and other animals alike (poor breeding/mental issues) that they are not safe to have in society. Because of this danger level they need to be humanely put down. It is more humane for the dog, and the responsible thing to do. I train, and specialize in aggression cases, and I KNOW when there is no hope. It is sad, but very much a reality.
@timHYPERLITE What a ridiculous comment. Real dog behaviour is about a lot more than what Cesar Millan preaches. Cesar uses old methods that Dr Ian Dunbar was using 20 years ago. Luckily, people like Dunbar have researched further and understand more about dog behaviour than anything. Dunbar has helped many aggressive dogs and was a chief assessor in the Diane Whipple case, who was killed by two dogs walking to her home.
'sit' is easy... how do you get your dog to 'come' when he'd rather sniff another dog's asshole? He talks about how easy it is but doesn't tell you shit. This guy's just another articulate fraud.
@6annon He gives you the answer, you now have to think by yourself to find what the dogs like more that sniffing another dog. Simple no? Just find something he likes more.
I HAVE A MASTIFF WHO I TRAINED WITH REWARDS AN ALSO USING LEASH JERKS SCRUFF SHAKES AND POWER ROLLS WHO IS NOW TO NO ONES FAULT BUT MINE FOR TRAINING BEFORE PROPERLY EDUCATING MYSELF HAS ISSUES WITH AGGRESSION. I HAVE TRAINED MY 3 GREAT DANES, RED BONE AND RAT TERRIER USING POSITIVE REWARD BASED TRAINING WITHOUT THE USE OF ANY DOMINANCE WHO ALL COULD COMPETE IN OBEDIENCE COMPETITION WHO SHOW NO SIGNS OF AGGRESSION ARE BEING CERTIFIED FOR THERAPY WORK. CESARS METHODS ARE NOT NECESSARY
BULLIES ARE VIEWED AS INSECURE IN THEMSELVES!!! PEOPLE WHO ARE IN CONTROL AND POWERFUL DO NOT NEED DOMINANCE TO GET THE REACTION THEY WANT OR NEED TO PROVE THEY ARE A LEADER OR POWERFUL. SCRUFF SHAKES, LEASH JERKS, POWER ROLLS AND ALL THAT IS NOT ANYTHING MORE THAN BULLYING YOUR DOG AND SHOWING YOUR DOG YOUR NOT IN CONTROL, YOU DO NOT NO AN EFFECTIVE WAY TO GET HIM TO DO WHAT YOU ASK AND THAT YOUR SIMPLY A BULLY WHO IS UNDESERVING OF HIS RESPECT AND NEEDS TO BE DOMINATED!
THE IDEA OF DOMINATING YOUR DOG SO IT WILL NOT BE DOMINATING IS IGNORANCE. I CAN STAND OVER MY KIDS LIKE A DRILL SARGENT COMMANDING THEM TO DO THE THINGS I WANT THEM TO DO AND CHANCES ARE THEY WILL DO IT BUT A MORE EFFECTIVE AND EVEN QUICKER EASIER WAY TO DO IT IS TO SHOW THEM WHAT I EXPECT AND SEEING IT THROUGH. YOUR DOG MY LISTEN TO YOU USING DOMINANCE AND FEAR BUT 90 % OF THE TIME THEY WILL FREEZE UP AND IN THE END NOT RESPECT YOU.
YOU CAN BE A STRONG MINDED PERSON BUT EVER BEEN SITTING IN A ROOM AND SOMEONE WALKS IN WHOSE PRESENCE ALONE IS INTIMIDATING? THIS IS THE ONLY CONTROL CESAR HAS OVER THE DOGS IN HIS SHOW. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO EXPECT THE DOGS ON HIS SHOW TO CONTINUE TO ACT THE SAME WAY WHEN CESAR IS NOT WITH THE DOG BECAUSE NOT EVERYONE THE DOG COMES IN CONTACT WITH WALKING DOWN THE STREET WILL HAVE THE SAME DEMEANOR SO THEREFORE IT IS NOT EFFECTIVE TRAINING.
@gentlegiants1 u have some poitns, but you are missing the POINT. because, what c.m. is doin is TRYING TO CORRECT A FUCKED UP DOG!!! you are all mistaking training from early age with CORRECTION of unwanted behaviour..which is not likely to happen...a fucked up dog in most cases is a fucked up dog.
we simply have a agreement she knows i am the leader and she can choose to obey or not if its trivial if it is important she knows i have a reason why
i never "trained" my dog more then to shit outside and to sit if theres soemthing good for her. and how to manipulate chicks.
I raised my dog as i would raise my child. she knows the diffrence between a genuine reason to shout and a me getting annoyed reason.
i never hurt her (except for one incidence she tried to wake me when she was a puppy and her razor sharp uppy teeth hit my balls lol in short puppy learned to fly)
Good news cschaffh: A favor to the readers: I will terminate this lame back and forth commenting we are engaged in. You remind me of a high school friend who told me he believed that one can be a scientist and still have a belief in a sky god or other things for which there is no evidence. Nope --- the two are singularly contradictory. No true scientist can believe in a sky god or any other supernatural force, just as one can't know the science of dog learning and still value Milan.
That is good news. After all how many times can I ask for actual citations so we can discuss actual data and the overstated conclusions many people have perpetuated. So in others words you can believe in the middle ground of agreeing about exercise (perhaps even of not rewarding unwanted behavior) but you won't agree to anything else. That's OK. It is actually in the middle. You ignore that observing the results of Cesar's training activities is evidence. By definition. It was fun. Bye.
Science is not a vague reference to a single article with limited relevance to your hypothesis. Your hypothesis is clear: Science shows that everything Cesar teaches is wrong. aka "nothing to offer", zero. I have already shown your premise false, so spending the next 7 years searching for data showing everything he says is false will be waste of time. Remember, I only criticized Dunbar's tone of voice. Dunbar and Cesar may both be wrong at times. My argument is that you definitely are.
Cesar has only one valuable lesson: provide as much exercise to your dog as the dog can tolerate. The rest of his chant is junk. I never asserted a 'premise' or 'hypothesis.' Using words like that does not confer credibility to your comments.
I emplore you to actually read what you write before clicking the 'post comment' button. Your sentences are filled mostly with inane ideas that you try to make relevant to some point that only you are aware of. Cesar Milan has NO training, education, or credentials in behavioral science or animal ethology, and knows no more about dogs than the cadre of 'traditional' trainers that have been pushing the same tired old methods since 1953. Cesar has only made dogs' lives harder by perpetuating myths
I'm still bothered by this. keeg, you actually admit that you don't know what the hell Cesar means when he teaches his theories. Calm assertive body language is a cornerstone of his method. How can you criticize something you don't understand and call it science? It is actually bias. In more rigorous fields, scientists will insist important experimental results are repeated and confirmed independently before fully accepting them. This is science.
Yes, I do admit that the concept of 'calm assertive' is foreign to me, but that's because no one, including Cesar (and he's been challenged to do this) can define it or assert the criteria that chracterize it. Cesar adheres to 'dominance theory,' which is too complicated for him to actually understand, and he also believes that dogs are pack animals, which they're not, and he believes in an erroneous concept referred to as an 'alpha dog,' which doesn't exist.
He caught my attn talking about the boy on the plane. I see it in my training classes with dogs and owners who get so frustrated rather than reverting to training. Ughh.
I am in the middle ground camp between Dunbar and Cesar. What strikes me about this talk is his disdain for dog owners (and people in general). He is so abrasive he is "punishing" the audience for listening, and then he wonders why people stop listening. There is a better way to tell people they are wrong. I disagree that a dog (like mine) would rather die than feel momentary discomfort, but agree that as soon as the dog reduces aggression you should switch to PR and simply saying No.
You obviously did not actually LISTEN to his talk. Also, there is no 'middle ground' in dog training: There is that which is based on the science of animal learning (Dunbar) and that which is based on the same old school methods used since the 1950s and based on erroneous suppositions (Milan).
keeg021985, I look forward to discussing specifics of science of dog learning with you. Please provide the citations of peer reviewed articles that conclusively demonstrate that a "middle ground" in fact does not exist in dog training. Also please only list those that specifically deal with aggressive dogs who will bite humans. SInce you assume incorrectly that I did not listen to the talk, you are already starting off wrong. Let's hear what you know about the science.
There is no middle ground between science and non-science, thus no middle ground between Dunbar and Milann. That assertion by you assumes that they both have something to offer, but Milan doesn't. His methods are not new and are based on erroneous conclusions drawn from artificially constructed wolf packs in the 1940s and 1950s. You can find links to many papers on canine ethology on the American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior (AVSAB) site. By the way, I hold an MS in Animal Ethology.
In addition, I have no idea what you mean by 'aggressive dogs who will bite humans,' since any dog, given sufficient reason (in the dog's mind) will bite a human. Several studies over the past 10 years (check out the most well known one by the Univ of Pennsylvania) have provided clear evidence that highly reactive dogs, as well as those who have a history of frequent, unprovoked aggression, can be helped only through R+ methods with concurrent counter-conditioning.
Do you agree is it important to exercise your dog's mind and body?
Do you agree that you should not reinforce unwanted behavior with attention or praise?
If you answer yes, then you are contradicting yourself that Cesar has nothing to offer. To answer your question, I mean dogs who have not been raised with Dr. Dunbar's methods and have grown to be reactive and aggressive generally. Please list more specific info on the U Penn study. Authors?
Actually, I know which one you refer to, it seems to be the default counterargument, despite clear faults in drawing parallels to Cesar's techniques. It does in fact demonstrate that confrontational methods can create aggression if used incorrectly. Unfortunately, this is also true of positive methods, as owners will attest when they have tried to calm aggression by rewarding them. This is the only legitimate conclusion allowed by the data of the study.
You either don't comprehend the studies, have been reading garbage, or sinply chose to make things up as you go along (just like Milan). Confrontational methods 'can create agression of used incorrectly'? Confrontational methods are almost always incorrect in their use and almost always cause an increase in reactivity. Also, where did you read that R+ training with rewards is used to calm aggression? True aggression can never be cured by R+ training alone.
To continue: Very few owners have the formal training and knowledge to use desensitivity and counter-conditioning methods to help a truly aggressive dog. What are you talking about? Who advises to reward a dog for aggressive behavior?
I agree very few uniformed dog owners will use effective techniques to change a dog's behavior, particularly aggression. I have spoken with several trainers who say only R+ should be used. At least you have started using comments like "almost", rather than your previous knee jerk absolutist statements of before. It is concerning you did not bother to inform yourself what specific techniques I was for or against before your rant. Enjoy your career, I will enjoy my objective unbiased thinking.
You disclosed your thinking when you stated you stood in the 'middle ground' between science and the junk of Milan --- it was then that I concluded your comments were worthless.
Here is new hypothetical research: A sample of 140 humans were observed in their homes as someone entered the house and instructed them to hand over their wallets. 25% resisted and showed aggression. Clear proof to use positive methods? What if 25% were approached by someone wearing a ski mask and the rest were approached by police officers. The data does not show (nor did it test) that calm assertive (correct) use of the techniques will not work.
What is hypothetical research? I have never heard of such a thing. Also, the example of the 'hypothetical research' you give is out of left field and doesn't relate whatsoever to using R+ methods to train dogs. Also, what the hell is 'calm, assertive' mean? Try getting away from the Cesar videos and go study animal ethology for 6-7 years, then come back and we can talk further.
Unfortunately, credentials mean very little. 7 years of biased thinking is still biased thinking. Often times people use metaphors to explain concepts, I apologize if this was overly sophisticated. It was to point out that the study by design documented the results of uninformed dog owners. You (and others) choose to take the results to support unsubstantiated blanket statements. I am still interested in any additional relevant research, if you have any to provide.
Hahaha! Me too! I suggest his books too! I think in order to train a dog you need to be able to communicate with them... And since they will not ever speak English we need to learn their language in order to teach them ours. That is my favorite part of training: the communication.
Dr. Dunbar is completely different from Cesar Millan. Cesar uses physical means to reprimand a dog and Dr. Dunbar uses redirection with positive rewards for desirable behavior. I would also like to point out that Dr. Dunbar has degrees relating to this topic and more experience than Cesar. I am a positive reinforcement trainer and have found it to be enjoyable for the dog and person. Could a child use Cesar's method? No. Because it is dangerous. Using PR a child could train the average dog.
Yeah 0566davies! I completely agree. Different doesn't necessarily equate to better. I am a full on Cesar Milan admirer. 4 years ago I was a cat person. After watching Cesar I'm a dog person ready to step up to the responsibility.
I have worked with dogs for many years. I cant understand why people are arguing over who is the best behaviourist! I am sure both men do what they can in the interests of animal welfare.
Always remember (and yes I have worked with TV), only the best bits are shown!
Instead of being abusive, open up your minds, listen and learn. Use that which YOU can apply and put to the bottom of your tool kit that which seems irrelevant. You may use or adapt it for own use one day.
I thought this was a beautiful talk, the segue into the similarities of how we treat animals and how we behave in the family unit was brilliant. As was his observation that people who are in a position of power over others would do all of society a service if they stopped using intimation and betrayal of trust as control tactics. I very much appreciate this post.
There isn't really anything in the video that he says that I didn't know and that is just from watching Cesar Millan. Cesar Millan preaches pretty much the same things! Except this guy had to put a dog down! CM would have took the dog and saved it's life!!!!!
there isn't much difference from what Cesar says. Cesar teaches calmness to get a dog to do something. This guy doesn't say anything that I didn't already know from watching Cesar
este tipo es un articulista y conferensista, aunque lo que dice son puras estupideces. como es posible que digan que es excelente, hasta un chango puede enseniar lo que el ensenia a sus perros, sentarse y echarce. si alguien tiene algun video de Dunbar entrenando un perro encerio, con abediencia avanzada y encadenando comportamientos complejos, porfavor envienmelo, a los amantes de el, les reto a que me envien un video con un perro verdaderamente entrenado y no burradas de sentado y echado.
Ian Dunbar has been around for a very long time. It is highly probable that Ceaser Milan got a lot of his information from Ian. Victoria Stillwell also. I like all 3 and I think they are all wonderful trainers. I know Ian's techniques work as I trained my dogs with positive reinforcement...it works...it is also what Victoria uses. Ceasar's methods are also very effective. choose your own method and stick with it. Be consistent and kind to your dog. Remember, your dog loves you!!
cesar got his info from ian ? ian is a dog trainer cesar rehabilates them ian couldnt train a dog in a red zone case a dog thats fearfull and wont accept food he is only good if you by a puppy and train it but what if you get one from a shelter and it trys to attack you are you gona tell it to sit get real dude ian sucks get off his dick if you like him then use his method
and the shock collar was to save a dog's life, a dog that was obsessed with chewing tractor tires, and previously had its eye pop out of her head as she was crushed by it once, yet still continues chasing it. The collar was set to a mild setting, not enough to cry out in pain or convulse but to surprise it when it gets near the tires in a way not associated to thw owner's correcting the dog, but to the tires.
badabingrockford, what are you talking about ? Did YOU see the show ? Cesar wasn't in the tractor, he was outside and waiting for the dog to get near to use the shock collar. After a while the dog stopped wanting to go after the tire and got over her dangerous obsession.
and,"quit hating on Cesar ", I'm not hating on Cesar, if you payed more attention you would see I'm trying to justify his use of the shock collar.
This guy mentions he couldn't fix an aggressive dog and he was later euthanized. Ceaser only gets bad rep because he has methods that work on dogs other trainers would give up on and consider unfixable dogs that need to be put down becuase their methods failed. People keep mentioning that he Cesar "chokes dogs, and uses shock collars" The "choking" was for a red zone dog that could really hurt someone, like the dog mentioned in this video that had to be euthanize,
The dog could have been euthanized because of the law, and even Cesar cannot bend the law unfortunately. Secondly, personally I think "red zone dogs" should be handled with far more care than other normal dogs. Choking a normal dog is already totally unnecessary to teach a dog anything. Now choking and shocking red zone dogs that badly need help, it downright unethical and inhumane.
One myth Dunbar likes to debunk is the idea that "dominance" means yelling, screaming and physically punishing the dog.
In fact, getting blue in the face is often seen by the dog as weakness, not strength. True alpha dogs don't carry on like that. It's Dunbar's style of calm, consistent, but decisive leadership that best mimics an alpha dog.
i cant even finish this one, i do agree that it is possible, and actualy quite easy to train a male or female dog without violence, but he starts this whole little bit with a huge mis conception, a full grown dog is just like an adolescent wolf, of cource a gama female can keep a bone away from an alpha male, but in wolf culture an alpha female would beat the shit out of an alpha male for even trying to take the bone, i'll continue in a reply
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
the thing that pisses me off so much is that he appears to think it odd that an inferior female would be able to beat a superior male of the species, he is simply missing the point of the way dogs brains work, think of a human, how many men do you think would grab food out of a woman's hand if you didnt know where the next food was coming from, not many, but still quite a few, well in wolf, and general wild culture, they DO NOT OVERCOME INSTINCT......,
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
if the girl wolf doesnt want to give the male wolf the bone, all he can do is irritate her, and hell in wolfs the alpha female would once again just come and WHIP HIS ASS, the fact is that the idea of that lemon juice or the newspaper over the head, while not directly, over time origionated from the NATURE of the wolf clan, i do not belive it is neccicary to use violence to mimic
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
this nature, but i can not continue to watch this video based on that huge mis-conception, perhaps he corrects it later in, but he did make it appear that the female was the weaker of the species, while it is quite the opposite, for evolutionary and culturual reasons, only remember that, dogs realy ARE wolves
The term "alpha" when it comes to wolves is highly misleading and misunderstood. It's been gone from discriptions about wolves in the wild for a decade, because wolves don't organize their packs like that.
What you're talking about is what is seen by wolves in captivity under highly stressfull situations. This has nothing to do with dogs.
Aggression never goes away - the object is to train the dog, or use behavior modification techniques, to lower the threshold at which that dog will react badly. But, no one can guarantee that such a dog will never aggress again. Some owners will elect to euthanize for that reason. Others will elect to train, condition, and manage the dog. But, no positive owner that I know advises owners to euth dogs. It's a fallacy.
You are right you can't compare Cesar to Dunbar. Cesar is a guy who grew up in Mexico and no education, Dunbar is a brainiac, he is a DVM and a professor at Berkley. The best behaviorist out there. If you like to control your dog with fear and punishment then practice Millan's methods which I'm sure you do wrong anyway. Cesar makes things up as it goes and he admits it, and news Daddy the dog was trained by someone else daddy is Shutzhund ii so yeah good luck with tsst and kicking you dog!
Okay a few things here 1DAYASADOG. Cesar does NOT train with Punishment and fear. Daddy was owned by cesar when he was 4 months old. Cesar NEVER says do these techniques on all dogs. He does it to unstable dogs. FYI, I have followed his techniques my whole life and my dogs are 100% FINE. By the way, these dogs I have are american bulldogs(scott breed) and american pit bulls. Please look at all angles before you make assumptions. Cesar saves dogs that trainers cant do.
And punishes Dogs with P+. The dog has no idea why! Dominance! Yah, Thats it. Lets scare the sh**t out of them and they will obey us. Yes, they will obey; they will obey out of fear.
Ian Dunbar is the genius, not Cesar. If you knew anything about animal behavior you'd know better than to make such statements. The point is to train without force.
His threefold formula of exercise, discipline, and affection is simple and effective. My 3 little dogs are happy to get a morning and evening walk, have boundaries at mealtimes and limits on where they can go in the house and what they can do! Cesar Rocks!
PLEASE DO NOT COMPARE THIS DISGUSTING DOG TRAINER TO CESAR MILLAN!
His threefold formula of exercise, discipline, and affection is simple and effective. My 3 little dogs are happy to get a morning and evening walk, have boundaries at mealtimes and limits on where they can go in the house and what they can do! Cesar Rocks!
PLEASE DO NOT COMPARE THIS DISGUSTING DOG TRAINER TO CESAR MILLAN!
I really liked your video and your channel. If you need any help getting this video or channel exposed I use a site called tubeviews.(net) It has really helped like 20 of my main videos get to the top in position. Its nice.
Well for me, I see the methodology of dog training akin to raising a human child. You teach the dog good behaviors right from the beginning, and the "parents" and any applicable "siblings" have to agree on how the dog is to behave. Meaning human children are not to reward bad behavior even though it might be cute.
If someone is going to say something as ignorant as that, I wouldn't bother paying any attention to them. Remember? In dog training, ignore the behaviors you don't want and reward the ones you do. =)
"husband is easier to train... If you have got a Rottie?" Not a fan of that breed Ian? lol Great video anyhow. If only people got the simple idea. Instead of punishing wrong behaviors ask for right behaviors. Dogs so often are smarter then their owners. Hopefully this video will change a few mind sets. Thanks
I find it interesting when people talk about e collars and choke collars because they need to look at dogs in the wild, or even at home, and the fights they have for dominance.
and what he also forgot to mention is we show dogs what those rules are before we correct them for disobeying. We show them first by placing them and rewarding. Correction come in when they know the command and refuse to obey.
It is not fair to correct a dog when it does not know what it is being corrected for.
I am not a fan of this guy, but I am not a fan of Cesar either
i am entirely with you on this one, but i prefer cesar on this one. i am a dog trainer and i have yet to correct a dog for something i hadnt previously shown him how to do. i think that makin up human rules for dogs is just fine, as long as u show the dog what u want correctly first... this man has the sort of mentality that leads to training methods that dont work with all dogs and when it doesnt, these trainers will say put him down... idiot
DoggRazor, it is a myth that positive trainers tell owners to put dogs down because the training doesn't work. What is sometimes true is that people do not implement training well, or do not themselves wish to incur the liability of having an aggressive dog. I have never told a client to euthanize their dog - that is ALWAYS an owner decision.
point taken and understood, but it is a myth that you can train a dog through only positive training, especially when ur training an owner to train his dog.
Actually, the myth is that you must use coercion or force just because you are training an aggressive dog. And, it's also a myth that you cannot train owners to train their dogs using positive training. The real myth is that there are never any negative consequences for the dog during training. Those consequences do not have to cause pain or fear to be effective.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
i think that this opinion is a lil up its own ass. of course u dont have to use force to train a dog whther he is aggressive or not. but when a client has an aggressive dog and wants him to obey and stop being aggressive now and doesnt necessarily have the money or time to train the dog without leash correction, what are you gonna do, tell him to give his dog away? put it down? how about if the dog is always running away in the streets, u wait til he gets hit by a car or react?................
Well for starters, I've been training a lot longer than you - started with your methods and graduated to more positive approach because it was more effective. There will always be clients who don't listen, or who don't have money. But, the assumption that positive training and management take longer than corrective training is false. But, when you are 22 and all puffed up because you train pit bulls and dobermans, you can't see that. All you see is the stupid dominance hype.
@heartdogs i think that what you both need to see is that just like for dogs there is a time and a place....its applies to us as well...there is a time and a place for different "approaches"..and depends on what you are dealing with...both work to an extent depending on when and where and why you use it
@DreamComeTrueK9 - Certainly there are different techniques that trainers can employ, however, it's interesting how many trainers still base their training on the concept of dominance and linear hierarchy, when we now know that dogs, while they are certainly social animals with dominant and submissive behaviors, are NOT pack driven in the sense that people have historically thought of wolves.
@sequoyahbean i feel that word play gets too much involved at times when it comes to "training". there must be positive reinforcment and their must be a leadership assertive guiding figure for the dog to follow at times. its also important to understand the difference between discipline and punishment. they can be two different things. u might not have 2 b more dominant than a dog but u often do need 2 correct and show them that their display of dominance in most cases is not tolerated as well.
If you have a client that doesn't have the time or money to train his dog without using harsh punishment...you need to get a better class of clients. People who can't commit the time & money to have a dog be a respectable member of society need to be educated, not trained to bully animals.
wonderful theories, and beautifully explained... I agree and try to live and train with that kind of love and care... Why would anyone want their dog to expect anything but pure love from their human counterpart, as they walk into a room? Thanks you for posting! Rick Caran and Jilli Dog
TV problems need to be solved in a time-limited, yet entertaining way. Solid, consistent effort over long periods doesn't really make for exciting television programming with a wide appeal. I think a TV series would compromise any animal trainer's practice. Fortunately Dunbar is a good lecturer, which makes for fun short presentations.
I heard he sold million of books, dvd's,so Why NETGEO didn't give a show to Ian Dunbar instance of Cesar Millan? Maybe we'll never know. I think Dr. Ian Dunbar didn't want to deal with red zone dogs and compromise his reputation.
I do hope that Ian can be seen on TV soon again, we need someone who can show that Cesar Millan is not the way since his followers are so fanatical and only seem to believe something if they see it on TV!
This guy seems to know what he is taking about, but I never knew this guy was even around. I like what heard but I need to see this guy in action. If anyone was videos of Ian Dunbar in action please up load them. I tired of seeing the same old Cesar on TV.
fantastic talk. It is so nice to hear someone who makes perfect sense talk about dogs and dog training, and to hear someone whoes only agenda is to promote great relatioships between owners and their dogs. A must.
Ah, the penny has dropped. I've just realised why Ian comes across as so pissed off. Because he resents the recognition and subsequent success of Cesar Milan! How ridiculously insecure. This ludicrous argument over whether a long list of degrees and credentials make you a better dog behaviourist. Would Louis Hamilton be a better racing driver if he were better read on 'racing phychology'? Deal with it Ian. And calm down. Stop threatening to 'punch people out' - it's not worthy of respect.
Dr. Dunbar does not resent the success of Cesar. Ian Dunbar has written a multitude of books on dogs and their behaviour. His frustration in this talk, if you pay attention to what he is saying is that he is frustrated with people being stupid dog owners. Both Dr. Dunbar and Cesar know the signals that dogs give, and both can interpret them into human terms, however most people cannot. That is the main philosophy behind both their teaching methods: it's not dog training, it's human training
What a frustrated angry man. Have you ever heard Cesar Milan say that he wanted to 'punch someone out'? Cesar Milan, who is referred to in this talk, although not named, has a calm, assertive, friendly personality. But he is also the pack leader of his dogs. Dogs need a pack leader. Its just nature - you can't compete with that. But Ian just seems to have a really frustrated angry attitude. Thats not a leader I'd find easy to respect. I wouldnt want to be his dog either, that's for sure.
Ian Dunbar has no clue what he is talking about. This trash science agenda is merely misrepresentation and exploitation at its worse. I put out an open challenge to any pigeon behaviorist who can answer my specific questions regarding conditioning, influence, learning theory and behavior. What a joke.
dalemk90 3 weeks ago
@aboutdogtraining3 not in the least, I'm actually a bit of a fan. He actually had a big sit down with millan for a copy of his magazine. Some of his stuff, like his take on puppy accidents I think is a bit out to lunch and his social media outlet was a bit underutilized IMO, but no, not jealous.
TheDavidMarr 1 month ago
Oh and if your puppy craps on the floor, don't think that you've completely botched you chances of raising a decent dog like he makes it out to be.
TheDavidMarr 1 month ago
I followed this guy on various social networking sites and he spent 99% of his time bragging about the posh gallery or fancy restaurant he was going to.
TheDavidMarr 1 month ago
@TheDavidMarr you sound jealous.
AboutDogTraining3 1 month ago
for all the " and now the dog is euthanized" fighters... he never said why. And if he was euthinized for his problems, then chances are Ian wasn't around. Most of you guys don't know Dr.Dunbar did a multi-year scientific study on Dog aggression.
AlienXCherie 2 months ago
I share Ian's vision for the future! Understanding and accepting your dog for what he/she is is the first step to being able to mold them into a pleasant companion. Be the leader and teach by example.
GreatDaneCourse 3 months ago
I loved this video, thank you very much. I am getting my family a puppy, we have three children and they are thrilled. I agree with everything you had to say and I look forward to watching many more vids before our bundle of joy arrives~
FamilyGoingRaw 4 months ago
" I would have punched him out" , what a great example to set to your dog!
bonusbarclay 6 months ago
I'm a Cesar fan and I like the video. But just as many people give Cesar a bad rap because they use anger and uncontrolled rage in their attempt at domination with no attempt at communication, many of his antagonists in th PP camp are equally, if not more, violent and accusatory when they try to browbeat those who do not agree 100% with their dogma. Anyone who cares enough to discuss dog training also cherishes their relationship with their dog, The methods should be their own choice.
PaulAndMuttley 6 months ago
@PaulAndMuttley 20 years ago, many people would agree with you. But the salient issue at the moment is, science (and anecdotal evidence) has discovered so many things about how dogs learn, their genetic origins, their ancestor's social behaviour and the domestic dogs' social behaviour- as pets and as feral dogs. And all the evidence is against what Millan speaks about. People can make their own choices, but there is now a clear line between what is true about dogs and what isn't.
mydogkanskidrums 6 months ago
Respond to this video... So for me, it's silly to use physical methods with our dogs, or think of our relationship (and dogs' relationships with other dogs) as hierarchical, because there is no ethological value to them- which people used to believe there was. Cesar says some good things, don't get me wrong, but usually those things are completely out-weighed by the inaccurate advice. We need a good role-model for owners who just want to do the best for their dogs- and Cesar isn't it anymore.
mydogkanskidrums 6 months ago
I love this man! How can 24 people not like this video? Ahhh, must be Caesar fans, lame!
thewhitemosquito 7 months ago
Are you Ian???
hifreak1c 8 months ago
ok so, he went to someones house to help their aggressive dog, didnt fix the problem, and now that dog is euthanized? the hell? im sick and tired of all these +R ppl humanizing dogs and not using alternative methods that would rehabilitate aggressive dogs. like sending the dog to a real dog behaviorialist. youre not going to cookie the aggression away.
H15A5H1 9 months ago
@H15A5H1 Real dog behaviourists are the ones who use motivational methods like food, toys etc. And if you listened closely to what Dr Dunbar was saying, it wasn't that he couldn't help the dog but it was the owners who were not putting the time and effort into their dog. Without an owner's compliance, it's very difficult to make headway into serious behaviour issues. That dog was probably on a court order to be euthanised, so it was out of Dunbar's hands when the owners made mistakes again.
mydogkanskidrums 6 months ago
I find it fascinating that dog training relates so well to many other areas in life. This is awesome stuff right here :] It really gives a broader view on what to do in different situations.
zDreamerkid 9 months ago 5
Can someone please explain to me what the punishment was in his example with the dog that had agression problems in the kitchen?
HiveDes 10 months ago
@HiveDes There was no specific punishment which is the point..... The dog was made aware of what was expected of him and corrected without anger or aggression. Just like kids or spouses, the energy you put out will be dished right back to you.
There is an exception to every rule. Life will be easier for all involved if we accept what we have and deal with each situation individually.
hannahcrx 9 months ago
Ian Dunbar! This is one of the most impressive speeches about dogs I can imagine and I can comprehend!
nikiosko 10 months ago
I will never understand why dog trainers get so hot headed about these matters. Particularly when the issue seems to be positivity.
TheTHINNERALBUM 10 months ago
maybe this guys good,but slutwell is bad and puts nice dogs down.honestly check out "bengie" its the episode she tried to cover up...and her forum bans you if u mention it..
timHYPERLITE 10 months ago
I cannot say enough how much I love Dr. Dunbar. I've heard him speak in conferences, seen him work, and seen him in a more personal setting. He is an amazing man, and no one can convince me otherwise! Its stupid to force someone to see truth when they've got their noses buried in lies. I've already learned to not argue with ignorant trainers (Cesar followers). Just lead by example, be gracious, but firm in your beliefs. Cheers to all the good trainers on here from a younger gen. trainer!
Mewsaphine 11 months ago 18
this guy is the same as victoria slutwell they are "trainers" and are fairly useless when it comes to corection. they cant stop a dog from trying to kill another dog,all they can do is get a dog to sit! what good is that? useless twats fuck off and watch cesar millan.a guy who knows what hes doing.
timHYPERLITE 11 months ago
@timHYPERLITE what a prick you are? Yea some guy on t.v. is bound to be better. He's on t.v.
wreckedrasclad 11 months ago
@wreckedrasclad cesars better than victoria slutwell.cesar doesnt tell families over the phone that they should put down theyre dog,because she cant train it. this dumbar guy and slutwell,still use negitive corection,they use loud bangs and noises.just because they like to feel superior claiming better methods.
timHYPERLITE 11 months ago
@timHYPERLITE You clearly haven't seen the episode where Cesar used a remote training collar on the dog. The way he was using it was in a NEGATIVE way. So, where is your justification in that for him? Please educate yourself. How is an alpha roll, harsh jerk on a choke chain, and slight kick to the rump not considered a negative correction? I'm not being sarcastic... I seriously wish to understand your logic and thinking.
Mewsaphine 11 months ago
@Mewsaphine sure agreed sometimes all trainers loose it and loose there cool.BUT cesar hasnt told anyone to put theyre dog down. look on the internet for its me or the dog,bengi put down. victoria gave up and told family OVER THE PHONE that they should give up and put the dog down.sure cesar uses negartive training but ive never seen him give up and say that a dog should be put down.the food/obedience training is ok,but if a dogs life is on the line,victoria will have him put down.
timHYPERLITE 11 months ago
@timHYPERLITE I wasn't able to find that episode, but contrary to your belief, not all dogs can be saved! Some dogs are too dangerous to humans and other animals alike (poor breeding/mental issues) that they are not safe to have in society. Because of this danger level they need to be humanely put down. It is more humane for the dog, and the responsible thing to do. I train, and specialize in aggression cases, and I KNOW when there is no hope. It is sad, but very much a reality.
Mewsaphine 11 months ago
@timHYPERLITE What a ridiculous comment. Real dog behaviour is about a lot more than what Cesar Millan preaches. Cesar uses old methods that Dr Ian Dunbar was using 20 years ago. Luckily, people like Dunbar have researched further and understand more about dog behaviour than anything. Dunbar has helped many aggressive dogs and was a chief assessor in the Diane Whipple case, who was killed by two dogs walking to her home.
mydogkanskidrums 10 months ago
This is the philosophy of dog training not actual methods to train a dog.
CadenRolland 1 year ago
'sit' is easy... how do you get your dog to 'come' when he'd rather sniff another dog's asshole? He talks about how easy it is but doesn't tell you shit. This guy's just another articulate fraud.
6annon 1 year ago
@6annon He gives you the answer, you now have to think by yourself to find what the dogs like more that sniffing another dog. Simple no? Just find something he likes more.
grejotte 1 year ago
Comment removed
oxtotl 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Dog are to wolves
as
People are to chimps and apes...
A true alpha would kiss you off and wouldn't need you, so no such thing in domestic dogs.
There are situational hierarchies and status roles.
The idea of Alpha is perpetuated BS
oxtotl 1 year ago
lol, they drive 'my' car
this guy is hilarious
SoldierCyfix 1 year ago
As always, Ian Dunbar ROCKS!
CyberDaze1 1 year ago
Comment removed
gentlegiants1 1 year ago
I HAVE A MASTIFF WHO I TRAINED WITH REWARDS AN ALSO USING LEASH JERKS SCRUFF SHAKES AND POWER ROLLS WHO IS NOW TO NO ONES FAULT BUT MINE FOR TRAINING BEFORE PROPERLY EDUCATING MYSELF HAS ISSUES WITH AGGRESSION. I HAVE TRAINED MY 3 GREAT DANES, RED BONE AND RAT TERRIER USING POSITIVE REWARD BASED TRAINING WITHOUT THE USE OF ANY DOMINANCE WHO ALL COULD COMPETE IN OBEDIENCE COMPETITION WHO SHOW NO SIGNS OF AGGRESSION ARE BEING CERTIFIED FOR THERAPY WORK. CESARS METHODS ARE NOT NECESSARY
gentlegiants1 1 year ago
@gentlegiants1 On the internet, ALL CAPS = SCREAMING. ;-)
briankroekerdesign 1 year ago
BULLIES ARE VIEWED AS INSECURE IN THEMSELVES!!! PEOPLE WHO ARE IN CONTROL AND POWERFUL DO NOT NEED DOMINANCE TO GET THE REACTION THEY WANT OR NEED TO PROVE THEY ARE A LEADER OR POWERFUL. SCRUFF SHAKES, LEASH JERKS, POWER ROLLS AND ALL THAT IS NOT ANYTHING MORE THAN BULLYING YOUR DOG AND SHOWING YOUR DOG YOUR NOT IN CONTROL, YOU DO NOT NO AN EFFECTIVE WAY TO GET HIM TO DO WHAT YOU ASK AND THAT YOUR SIMPLY A BULLY WHO IS UNDESERVING OF HIS RESPECT AND NEEDS TO BE DOMINATED!
gentlegiants1 1 year ago
THE IDEA OF DOMINATING YOUR DOG SO IT WILL NOT BE DOMINATING IS IGNORANCE. I CAN STAND OVER MY KIDS LIKE A DRILL SARGENT COMMANDING THEM TO DO THE THINGS I WANT THEM TO DO AND CHANCES ARE THEY WILL DO IT BUT A MORE EFFECTIVE AND EVEN QUICKER EASIER WAY TO DO IT IS TO SHOW THEM WHAT I EXPECT AND SEEING IT THROUGH. YOUR DOG MY LISTEN TO YOU USING DOMINANCE AND FEAR BUT 90 % OF THE TIME THEY WILL FREEZE UP AND IN THE END NOT RESPECT YOU.
gentlegiants1 1 year ago
YOU CAN BE A STRONG MINDED PERSON BUT EVER BEEN SITTING IN A ROOM AND SOMEONE WALKS IN WHOSE PRESENCE ALONE IS INTIMIDATING? THIS IS THE ONLY CONTROL CESAR HAS OVER THE DOGS IN HIS SHOW. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO EXPECT THE DOGS ON HIS SHOW TO CONTINUE TO ACT THE SAME WAY WHEN CESAR IS NOT WITH THE DOG BECAUSE NOT EVERYONE THE DOG COMES IN CONTACT WITH WALKING DOWN THE STREET WILL HAVE THE SAME DEMEANOR SO THEREFORE IT IS NOT EFFECTIVE TRAINING.
gentlegiants1 1 year ago
@gentlegiants1 u have some poitns, but you are missing the POINT. because, what c.m. is doin is TRYING TO CORRECT A FUCKED UP DOG!!! you are all mistaking training from early age with CORRECTION of unwanted behaviour..which is not likely to happen...a fucked up dog in most cases is a fucked up dog.
Soho1977 9 months ago
interesting, very very interesting.
brenyboy26 1 year ago
we simply have a agreement she knows i am the leader and she can choose to obey or not if its trivial if it is important she knows i have a reason why
thejlx 1 year ago
i never "trained" my dog more then to shit outside and to sit if theres soemthing good for her. and how to manipulate chicks.
I raised my dog as i would raise my child. she knows the diffrence between a genuine reason to shout and a me getting annoyed reason.
i never hurt her (except for one incidence she tried to wake me when she was a puppy and her razor sharp uppy teeth hit my balls lol in short puppy learned to fly)
but now dasy she is quite old by now
thejlx 1 year ago
He will be in El Cerrito tommorrow for the grand opening of Bruce King Memorial Dog Park. I can't wait!
Star16 1 year ago
Makes you rethink the "training" process altogether!
Excellent, thank you!
TheChaplinLover 1 year ago
Good news cschaffh: A favor to the readers: I will terminate this lame back and forth commenting we are engaged in. You remind me of a high school friend who told me he believed that one can be a scientist and still have a belief in a sky god or other things for which there is no evidence. Nope --- the two are singularly contradictory. No true scientist can believe in a sky god or any other supernatural force, just as one can't know the science of dog learning and still value Milan.
keeg021985 2 years ago
That is good news. After all how many times can I ask for actual citations so we can discuss actual data and the overstated conclusions many people have perpetuated. So in others words you can believe in the middle ground of agreeing about exercise (perhaps even of not rewarding unwanted behavior) but you won't agree to anything else. That's OK. It is actually in the middle. You ignore that observing the results of Cesar's training activities is evidence. By definition. It was fun. Bye.
cschaffh 2 years ago
@keeg021985
It was a civilized, interesting argument, though! (I didn't read all of it but what I did read was intriguing)
kilroywashere123 1 year ago
Science is not a vague reference to a single article with limited relevance to your hypothesis. Your hypothesis is clear: Science shows that everything Cesar teaches is wrong. aka "nothing to offer", zero. I have already shown your premise false, so spending the next 7 years searching for data showing everything he says is false will be waste of time. Remember, I only criticized Dunbar's tone of voice. Dunbar and Cesar may both be wrong at times. My argument is that you definitely are.
cschaffh 2 years ago
Cesar has only one valuable lesson: provide as much exercise to your dog as the dog can tolerate. The rest of his chant is junk. I never asserted a 'premise' or 'hypothesis.' Using words like that does not confer credibility to your comments.
keeg021985 2 years ago
I emplore you to actually read what you write before clicking the 'post comment' button. Your sentences are filled mostly with inane ideas that you try to make relevant to some point that only you are aware of. Cesar Milan has NO training, education, or credentials in behavioral science or animal ethology, and knows no more about dogs than the cadre of 'traditional' trainers that have been pushing the same tired old methods since 1953. Cesar has only made dogs' lives harder by perpetuating myths
keeg021985 2 years ago
I'm still bothered by this. keeg, you actually admit that you don't know what the hell Cesar means when he teaches his theories. Calm assertive body language is a cornerstone of his method. How can you criticize something you don't understand and call it science? It is actually bias. In more rigorous fields, scientists will insist important experimental results are repeated and confirmed independently before fully accepting them. This is science.
cschaffh 2 years ago 2
Yes, I do admit that the concept of 'calm assertive' is foreign to me, but that's because no one, including Cesar (and he's been challenged to do this) can define it or assert the criteria that chracterize it. Cesar adheres to 'dominance theory,' which is too complicated for him to actually understand, and he also believes that dogs are pack animals, which they're not, and he believes in an erroneous concept referred to as an 'alpha dog,' which doesn't exist.
keeg021985 2 years ago
He caught my attn talking about the boy on the plane. I see it in my training classes with dogs and owners who get so frustrated rather than reverting to training. Ughh.
bslbeachbum 2 years ago
I am in the middle ground camp between Dunbar and Cesar. What strikes me about this talk is his disdain for dog owners (and people in general). He is so abrasive he is "punishing" the audience for listening, and then he wonders why people stop listening. There is a better way to tell people they are wrong. I disagree that a dog (like mine) would rather die than feel momentary discomfort, but agree that as soon as the dog reduces aggression you should switch to PR and simply saying No.
cschaffh 2 years ago
You obviously did not actually LISTEN to his talk. Also, there is no 'middle ground' in dog training: There is that which is based on the science of animal learning (Dunbar) and that which is based on the same old school methods used since the 1950s and based on erroneous suppositions (Milan).
keeg021985 2 years ago
keeg021985, I look forward to discussing specifics of science of dog learning with you. Please provide the citations of peer reviewed articles that conclusively demonstrate that a "middle ground" in fact does not exist in dog training. Also please only list those that specifically deal with aggressive dogs who will bite humans. SInce you assume incorrectly that I did not listen to the talk, you are already starting off wrong. Let's hear what you know about the science.
cschaffh 2 years ago
There is no middle ground between science and non-science, thus no middle ground between Dunbar and Milann. That assertion by you assumes that they both have something to offer, but Milan doesn't. His methods are not new and are based on erroneous conclusions drawn from artificially constructed wolf packs in the 1940s and 1950s. You can find links to many papers on canine ethology on the American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior (AVSAB) site. By the way, I hold an MS in Animal Ethology.
keeg021985 2 years ago
In addition, I have no idea what you mean by 'aggressive dogs who will bite humans,' since any dog, given sufficient reason (in the dog's mind) will bite a human. Several studies over the past 10 years (check out the most well known one by the Univ of Pennsylvania) have provided clear evidence that highly reactive dogs, as well as those who have a history of frequent, unprovoked aggression, can be helped only through R+ methods with concurrent counter-conditioning.
keeg021985 2 years ago
Congratulations on earning your master's degree.
Do you agree is it important to exercise your dog's mind and body?
Do you agree that you should not reinforce unwanted behavior with attention or praise?
If you answer yes, then you are contradicting yourself that Cesar has nothing to offer. To answer your question, I mean dogs who have not been raised with Dr. Dunbar's methods and have grown to be reactive and aggressive generally. Please list more specific info on the U Penn study. Authors?
cschaffh 2 years ago
Actually, I know which one you refer to, it seems to be the default counterargument, despite clear faults in drawing parallels to Cesar's techniques. It does in fact demonstrate that confrontational methods can create aggression if used incorrectly. Unfortunately, this is also true of positive methods, as owners will attest when they have tried to calm aggression by rewarding them. This is the only legitimate conclusion allowed by the data of the study.
cschaffh 2 years ago
You either don't comprehend the studies, have been reading garbage, or sinply chose to make things up as you go along (just like Milan). Confrontational methods 'can create agression of used incorrectly'? Confrontational methods are almost always incorrect in their use and almost always cause an increase in reactivity. Also, where did you read that R+ training with rewards is used to calm aggression? True aggression can never be cured by R+ training alone.
keeg021985 2 years ago
To continue: Very few owners have the formal training and knowledge to use desensitivity and counter-conditioning methods to help a truly aggressive dog. What are you talking about? Who advises to reward a dog for aggressive behavior?
keeg021985 2 years ago
I agree very few uniformed dog owners will use effective techniques to change a dog's behavior, particularly aggression. I have spoken with several trainers who say only R+ should be used. At least you have started using comments like "almost", rather than your previous knee jerk absolutist statements of before. It is concerning you did not bother to inform yourself what specific techniques I was for or against before your rant. Enjoy your career, I will enjoy my objective unbiased thinking.
cschaffh 2 years ago
You disclosed your thinking when you stated you stood in the 'middle ground' between science and the junk of Milan --- it was then that I concluded your comments were worthless.
keeg021985 2 years ago
Here is new hypothetical research: A sample of 140 humans were observed in their homes as someone entered the house and instructed them to hand over their wallets. 25% resisted and showed aggression. Clear proof to use positive methods? What if 25% were approached by someone wearing a ski mask and the rest were approached by police officers. The data does not show (nor did it test) that calm assertive (correct) use of the techniques will not work.
cschaffh 2 years ago
What is hypothetical research? I have never heard of such a thing. Also, the example of the 'hypothetical research' you give is out of left field and doesn't relate whatsoever to using R+ methods to train dogs. Also, what the hell is 'calm, assertive' mean? Try getting away from the Cesar videos and go study animal ethology for 6-7 years, then come back and we can talk further.
keeg021985 2 years ago
Unfortunately, credentials mean very little. 7 years of biased thinking is still biased thinking. Often times people use metaphors to explain concepts, I apologize if this was overly sophisticated. It was to point out that the study by design documented the results of uninformed dog owners. You (and others) choose to take the results to support unsubstantiated blanket statements. I am still interested in any additional relevant research, if you have any to provide.
cschaffh 2 years ago
So, credentials mean very little, eh? I've been told that a few times in my life, but only by people who didn't have any credentials. Am I surprised?
keeg021985 2 years ago
Place 3 dog trainers together. The only thing 2 will agree upon is that the third one is wrong!!!
0566davies 2 years ago 2
I suggest this video to alot of people with dog problems :D
BrawMe 2 years ago
Hahaha! Me too! I suggest his books too! I think in order to train a dog you need to be able to communicate with them... And since they will not ever speak English we need to learn their language in order to teach them ours. That is my favorite part of training: the communication.
chelseaeryn 2 years ago
Oh yeaaaah, I never thought of the pups hopping on ur knees, then getting bigger and disciplined for something they were previous crooned for doing.
Wow that'd be so cool to have a dog that would send a note to someone! My #1 rules are love, socialize, & take time.
FangnclawX 2 years ago
I love your #1 rules, they are right on!
chelseaeryn 2 years ago
They've served me well with the pooches. ^^
FangnclawX 2 years ago
Dr. Dunbar is completely different from Cesar Millan. Cesar uses physical means to reprimand a dog and Dr. Dunbar uses redirection with positive rewards for desirable behavior. I would also like to point out that Dr. Dunbar has degrees relating to this topic and more experience than Cesar. I am a positive reinforcement trainer and have found it to be enjoyable for the dog and person. Could a child use Cesar's method? No. Because it is dangerous. Using PR a child could train the average dog.
chelseaeryn 2 years ago
More people need to think like this. Now a days not many do..
BrawMe 2 years ago
Yeah 0566davies! I completely agree. Different doesn't necessarily equate to better. I am a full on Cesar Milan admirer. 4 years ago I was a cat person. After watching Cesar I'm a dog person ready to step up to the responsibility.
This is a great talk-lots of valid points.
Lifewhisperer 2 years ago
An observation: people who support Cesar use a lot of profanity. Maybe we should get Cesar to pinch you guys every time you swear.
da0217 2 years ago
I have worked with dogs for many years. I cant understand why people are arguing over who is the best behaviourist! I am sure both men do what they can in the interests of animal welfare.
Always remember (and yes I have worked with TV), only the best bits are shown!
Instead of being abusive, open up your minds, listen and learn. Use that which YOU can apply and put to the bottom of your tool kit that which seems irrelevant. You may use or adapt it for own use one day.
0566davies 2 years ago 7
I thought this was a beautiful talk, the segue into the similarities of how we treat animals and how we behave in the family unit was brilliant. As was his observation that people who are in a position of power over others would do all of society a service if they stopped using intimation and betrayal of trust as control tactics. I very much appreciate this post.
Dehzee 2 years ago 2
There isn't really anything in the video that he says that I didn't know and that is just from watching Cesar Millan. Cesar Millan preaches pretty much the same things! Except this guy had to put a dog down! CM would have took the dog and saved it's life!!!!!
JohnnyRu131 2 years ago
there isn't much difference from what Cesar says. Cesar teaches calmness to get a dog to do something. This guy doesn't say anything that I didn't already know from watching Cesar
JohnnyRu131 2 years ago
este tipo es un articulista y conferensista, aunque lo que dice son puras estupideces. como es posible que digan que es excelente, hasta un chango puede enseniar lo que el ensenia a sus perros, sentarse y echarce. si alguien tiene algun video de Dunbar entrenando un perro encerio, con abediencia avanzada y encadenando comportamientos complejos, porfavor envienmelo, a los amantes de el, les reto a que me envien un video con un perro verdaderamente entrenado y no burradas de sentado y echado.
maktubsivana 2 years ago
Ian Dunbar has been around for a very long time. It is highly probable that Ceaser Milan got a lot of his information from Ian. Victoria Stillwell also. I like all 3 and I think they are all wonderful trainers. I know Ian's techniques work as I trained my dogs with positive reinforcement...it works...it is also what Victoria uses. Ceasar's methods are also very effective. choose your own method and stick with it. Be consistent and kind to your dog. Remember, your dog loves you!!
666pizzaman 2 years ago
cesar got his info from ian ? ian is a dog trainer cesar rehabilates them ian couldnt train a dog in a red zone case a dog thats fearfull and wont accept food he is only good if you by a puppy and train it but what if you get one from a shelter and it trys to attack you are you gona tell it to sit get real dude ian sucks get off his dick if you like him then use his method
badabingrockford 2 years ago
@badabingrockford you got the point. people are jsut palin ignorant and see what they want to see. cheers
Soho1977 9 months ago
Comment removed
JenaferMORT 2 years ago
would love to meet Ian Dunbar, he's amazing
snuggliepuppy 2 years ago 3
Intelligent conversation instead of ten-second "reality TV" no-attention span, simplicity. Good luck with that, Cesar-heads.
dingomama 2 years ago 3
You are a moron. You really think Cesar's show is fake? You think his techniques are fake?
bobbydigital85 2 years ago
KEVIN SALEM
joeyjupiter77 2 years ago
and the shock collar was to save a dog's life, a dog that was obsessed with chewing tractor tires, and previously had its eye pop out of her head as she was crushed by it once, yet still continues chasing it. The collar was set to a mild setting, not enough to cry out in pain or convulse but to surprise it when it gets near the tires in a way not associated to thw owner's correcting the dog, but to the tires.
PassThePopkorn 2 years ago
did you watch the show how you gonna give the dog a correction wen your in the tractor your a fuckin idiot quit hating on cesar
badabingrockford 2 years ago
badabingrockford, what are you talking about ? Did YOU see the show ? Cesar wasn't in the tractor, he was outside and waiting for the dog to get near to use the shock collar. After a while the dog stopped wanting to go after the tire and got over her dangerous obsession.
and,"quit hating on Cesar ", I'm not hating on Cesar, if you payed more attention you would see I'm trying to justify his use of the shock collar.
PassThePopkorn 2 years ago
@PassThePopkorn maybe he should have stopped and try talking to a dog instead LOL
Soho1977 9 months ago
Comment removed
PassThePopkorn 2 years ago
This guy mentions he couldn't fix an aggressive dog and he was later euthanized. Ceaser only gets bad rep because he has methods that work on dogs other trainers would give up on and consider unfixable dogs that need to be put down becuase their methods failed. People keep mentioning that he Cesar "chokes dogs, and uses shock collars" The "choking" was for a red zone dog that could really hurt someone, like the dog mentioned in this video that had to be euthanize,
PassThePopkorn 2 years ago
The dog could have been euthanized because of the law, and even Cesar cannot bend the law unfortunately. Secondly, personally I think "red zone dogs" should be handled with far more care than other normal dogs. Choking a normal dog is already totally unnecessary to teach a dog anything. Now choking and shocking red zone dogs that badly need help, it downright unethical and inhumane.
Munira125 2 years ago 4
Ian Dunbar started the APDT in 1993.
darrelhager 2 years ago
makes alot of sence,I should tell it to my dogs trainer,lol
gameiohfreak 2 years ago
One myth Dunbar likes to debunk is the idea that "dominance" means yelling, screaming and physically punishing the dog.
In fact, getting blue in the face is often seen by the dog as weakness, not strength. True alpha dogs don't carry on like that. It's Dunbar's style of calm, consistent, but decisive leadership that best mimics an alpha dog.
Marcuskristicus 2 years ago
i cant even finish this one, i do agree that it is possible, and actualy quite easy to train a male or female dog without violence, but he starts this whole little bit with a huge mis conception, a full grown dog is just like an adolescent wolf, of cource a gama female can keep a bone away from an alpha male, but in wolf culture an alpha female would beat the shit out of an alpha male for even trying to take the bone, i'll continue in a reply
kght222 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
the thing that pisses me off so much is that he appears to think it odd that an inferior female would be able to beat a superior male of the species, he is simply missing the point of the way dogs brains work, think of a human, how many men do you think would grab food out of a woman's hand if you didnt know where the next food was coming from, not many, but still quite a few, well in wolf, and general wild culture, they DO NOT OVERCOME INSTINCT......,
kght222 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
if the girl wolf doesnt want to give the male wolf the bone, all he can do is irritate her, and hell in wolfs the alpha female would once again just come and WHIP HIS ASS, the fact is that the idea of that lemon juice or the newspaper over the head, while not directly, over time origionated from the NATURE of the wolf clan, i do not belive it is neccicary to use violence to mimic
kght222 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
this nature, but i can not continue to watch this video based on that huge mis-conception, perhaps he corrects it later in, but he did make it appear that the female was the weaker of the species, while it is quite the opposite, for evolutionary and culturual reasons, only remember that, dogs realy ARE wolves
kght222 2 years ago
Comment removed
kght222 2 years ago
No, and they haven't been wolves for over 15.000 years! Read a book people....
Bastarden 2 years ago 3
The term "alpha" when it comes to wolves is highly misleading and misunderstood. It's been gone from discriptions about wolves in the wild for a decade, because wolves don't organize their packs like that.
What you're talking about is what is seen by wolves in captivity under highly stressfull situations. This has nothing to do with dogs.
steinbr 2 years ago 15
@steinbr
Dog are to wolves
as
People are to chimps and apes...
A true alpha would kiss you off and wouldn't need you, so no such thing in domestic dogs.
There are situational hierarchies and status roles.
Alpha is perpetuated BS
oxtotl 1 year ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
@steinbr
Dog are to wolves
as
People are to chimps and apes...
A true alpha would kiss you off and wouldn't need you, so no such thing in domestic dogs.
There are situational hierarchies and status roles.
The idea of Alpha is perpetuated BS
oxtotl 1 year ago
mans a genius,been to his seminars,loved them.
jaymillwall 2 years ago 5
Aggression never goes away - the object is to train the dog, or use behavior modification techniques, to lower the threshold at which that dog will react badly. But, no one can guarantee that such a dog will never aggress again. Some owners will elect to euthanize for that reason. Others will elect to train, condition, and manage the dog. But, no positive owner that I know advises owners to euth dogs. It's a fallacy.
heartdogs 2 years ago
You are right you can't compare Cesar to Dunbar. Cesar is a guy who grew up in Mexico and no education, Dunbar is a brainiac, he is a DVM and a professor at Berkley. The best behaviorist out there. If you like to control your dog with fear and punishment then practice Millan's methods which I'm sure you do wrong anyway. Cesar makes things up as it goes and he admits it, and news Daddy the dog was trained by someone else daddy is Shutzhund ii so yeah good luck with tsst and kicking you dog!
1DayAsADog 2 years ago
Okay a few things here 1DAYASADOG. Cesar does NOT train with Punishment and fear. Daddy was owned by cesar when he was 4 months old. Cesar NEVER says do these techniques on all dogs. He does it to unstable dogs. FYI, I have followed his techniques my whole life and my dogs are 100% FINE. By the way, these dogs I have are american bulldogs(scott breed) and american pit bulls. Please look at all angles before you make assumptions. Cesar saves dogs that trainers cant do.
bobbydigital85 2 years ago
And punishes Dogs with P+. The dog has no idea why! Dominance! Yah, Thats it. Lets scare the sh**t out of them and they will obey us. Yes, they will obey; they will obey out of fear.
1SOF1 2 years ago
Ian Dunbar is the genius, not Cesar. If you knew anything about animal behavior you'd know better than to make such statements. The point is to train without force.
emberz21 2 years ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
WE LOVE CESAR!
His threefold formula of exercise, discipline, and affection is simple and effective. My 3 little dogs are happy to get a morning and evening walk, have boundaries at mealtimes and limits on where they can go in the house and what they can do! Cesar Rocks!
PLEASE DO NOT COMPARE THIS DISGUSTING DOG TRAINER TO CESAR MILLAN!
CESAR MILLAN THE DOG WHISPERER IS A GENIUS!
inmendhamOwnsU 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
WE LOVE CESAR!
His threefold formula of exercise, discipline, and affection is simple and effective. My 3 little dogs are happy to get a morning and evening walk, have boundaries at mealtimes and limits on where they can go in the house and what they can do! Cesar Rocks!
PLEASE DO NOT COMPARE THIS DISGUSTING DOG TRAINER TO CESAR MILLAN!
CESAR MILLAN THE DOG WHISPERER IS A GENIUS!
inmendhamOwnsU 2 years ago
He is so right, and yet it's sooo easy to forget his message.
iglooworkshop 2 years ago
Everyone needs to listen to this fellow. He should be on television. He was once on Patricia McConnell's old Petline show, which I also loved.
Retrieverman1 2 years ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
I really liked your video and your channel. If you need any help getting this video or channel exposed I use a site called tubeviews.(net) It has really helped like 20 of my main videos get to the top in position. Its nice.
that is very awesome i love this
Sagewaer 2 years ago
Well for me, I see the methodology of dog training akin to raising a human child. You teach the dog good behaviors right from the beginning, and the "parents" and any applicable "siblings" have to agree on how the dog is to behave. Meaning human children are not to reward bad behavior even though it might be cute.
Lots of cookies and love helps too. :-)
kirkygirl 2 years ago
Garbage. Now we have standup dog training shows with a book smart clown? When dogs start caring about PH.D's I might take this guy seriously.
MrClaytonBigsby1 2 years ago
I really hope you dont have a dog, you are a jerk!!!!! You really dont understand the the very basics in life do you lol!!!
RATTER15 2 years ago
If someone is going to say something as ignorant as that, I wouldn't bother paying any attention to them. Remember? In dog training, ignore the behaviors you don't want and reward the ones you do. =)
ShelterDogs 2 years ago
"husband is easier to train... If you have got a Rottie?" Not a fan of that breed Ian? lol Great video anyhow. If only people got the simple idea. Instead of punishing wrong behaviors ask for right behaviors. Dogs so often are smarter then their owners. Hopefully this video will change a few mind sets. Thanks
asrotties 2 years ago
reminds me a little of stewie griffin, this dude. lol.
lmm9607 2 years ago
I find it interesting when people talk about e collars and choke collars because they need to look at dogs in the wild, or even at home, and the fights they have for dominance.
djdragon181 2 years ago
He is so awesom, I have shared this video with so many people.
buckfush12 3 years ago
dunbar changed dog training and behaviour work dramatically for the l
better many years ago. Knows what he is talking about and practices what he preaches. Great stuff. :-))
kirid23 3 years ago 2
its so stupid.... wt u forgot to mention is that we dont only make up rules and correct when they disobey... but we reward when they obey. idiot.
DoggRazor 3 years ago
and what he also forgot to mention is we show dogs what those rules are before we correct them for disobeying. We show them first by placing them and rewarding. Correction come in when they know the command and refuse to obey.
It is not fair to correct a dog when it does not know what it is being corrected for.
I am not a fan of this guy, but I am not a fan of Cesar either
Koreagrrl 2 years ago 2
i am entirely with you on this one, but i prefer cesar on this one. i am a dog trainer and i have yet to correct a dog for something i hadnt previously shown him how to do. i think that makin up human rules for dogs is just fine, as long as u show the dog what u want correctly first... this man has the sort of mentality that leads to training methods that dont work with all dogs and when it doesnt, these trainers will say put him down... idiot
DoggRazor 2 years ago
DoggRazor, it is a myth that positive trainers tell owners to put dogs down because the training doesn't work. What is sometimes true is that people do not implement training well, or do not themselves wish to incur the liability of having an aggressive dog. I have never told a client to euthanize their dog - that is ALWAYS an owner decision.
heartdogs 2 years ago
point taken and understood, but it is a myth that you can train a dog through only positive training, especially when ur training an owner to train his dog.
DoggRazor 2 years ago
Exactly. Balance is important.
Koreagrrl 2 years ago
Actually, the myth is that you must use coercion or force just because you are training an aggressive dog. And, it's also a myth that you cannot train owners to train their dogs using positive training. The real myth is that there are never any negative consequences for the dog during training. Those consequences do not have to cause pain or fear to be effective.
heartdogs 2 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
i think that this opinion is a lil up its own ass. of course u dont have to use force to train a dog whther he is aggressive or not. but when a client has an aggressive dog and wants him to obey and stop being aggressive now and doesnt necessarily have the money or time to train the dog without leash correction, what are you gonna do, tell him to give his dog away? put it down? how about if the dog is always running away in the streets, u wait til he gets hit by a car or react?................
DoggRazor 2 years ago
Well for starters, I've been training a lot longer than you - started with your methods and graduated to more positive approach because it was more effective. There will always be clients who don't listen, or who don't have money. But, the assumption that positive training and management take longer than corrective training is false. But, when you are 22 and all puffed up because you train pit bulls and dobermans, you can't see that. All you see is the stupid dominance hype.
heartdogs 2 years ago 17
@heartdogs i think that what you both need to see is that just like for dogs there is a time and a place....its applies to us as well...there is a time and a place for different "approaches"..and depends on what you are dealing with...both work to an extent depending on when and where and why you use it
DreamComeTrueK9 1 year ago
@DreamComeTrueK9 - Certainly there are different techniques that trainers can employ, however, it's interesting how many trainers still base their training on the concept of dominance and linear hierarchy, when we now know that dogs, while they are certainly social animals with dominant and submissive behaviors, are NOT pack driven in the sense that people have historically thought of wolves.
sequoyahbean 1 year ago
@sequoyahbean i feel that word play gets too much involved at times when it comes to "training". there must be positive reinforcment and their must be a leadership assertive guiding figure for the dog to follow at times. its also important to understand the difference between discipline and punishment. they can be two different things. u might not have 2 b more dominant than a dog but u often do need 2 correct and show them that their display of dominance in most cases is not tolerated as well.
DreamComeTrueK9 1 year ago
If you have a client that doesn't have the time or money to train his dog without using harsh punishment...you need to get a better class of clients. People who can't commit the time & money to have a dog be a respectable member of society need to be educated, not trained to bully animals.
rsuebaru 2 years ago 3
Bullcrap. Matcho, Dominance-focused bullcrap.
Bastarden 2 years ago
Horsepucky. crosseyed, kneejerk horsepucky.
ManVsSelf 2 years ago
There is a difference between dog training and dog psychology. Ian Dunbar is a dog trainer...Cesar Millan is a dog psycholgist/behaviorist.
Cesar doesn't deal with sit, stay and rollover. Cesar deals with dogs that are about to hurt someone or themselves.
shoolerbop 3 years ago
A dog trainer and behaviorist is the same thing. When you train a dog, you are modifying their behavior.
modogg42 3 years ago
Comment removed
corgs1 3 years ago
LOL!! you have NO IDEA what you are talking about!!
kirid23 3 years ago
Ian Dunbar is AMAZING!! I've read his books, but never heard him speak. He has revolutionized what we know about animal training. 5**
rogersmmr 3 years ago 2
wonderful theories, and beautifully explained... I agree and try to live and train with that kind of love and care... Why would anyone want their dog to expect anything but pure love from their human counterpart, as they walk into a room? Thanks you for posting! Rick Caran and Jilli Dog
rickcaran 3 years ago 2
TV problems need to be solved in a time-limited, yet entertaining way. Solid, consistent effort over long periods doesn't really make for exciting television programming with a wide appeal. I think a TV series would compromise any animal trainer's practice. Fortunately Dunbar is a good lecturer, which makes for fun short presentations.
RussianAlfonso 3 years ago
I heard he sold million of books, dvd's,so Why NETGEO didn't give a show to Ian Dunbar instance of Cesar Millan? Maybe we'll never know. I think Dr. Ian Dunbar didn't want to deal with red zone dogs and compromise his reputation.
belvdr31cb 3 years ago 2
HE'S UNBELIEVABLE!!!!very nice speech...thanks
isacris34 3 years ago
summary: there are no bad dogs, just bad owners.
If you liked this, go check out some of his books, they are fantastic.
ovescovo 3 years ago
I do hope that Ian can be seen on TV soon again, we need someone who can show that Cesar Millan is not the way since his followers are so fanatical and only seem to believe something if they see it on TV!
Bastarden 3 years ago
You might want to have a look at Dogtown, if you haven't already. It isn't Ian personally, but it is more positive than Cesar Millans's methods.
naisayd 3 years ago
This guy seems to know what he is taking about, but I never knew this guy was even around. I like what heard but I need to see this guy in action. If anyone was videos of Ian Dunbar in action please up load them. I tired of seeing the same old Cesar on TV.
modelrailroadmaster 3 years ago 3
Check out DogStarDaily on here. It has lots of videos of Dr. Dunbar training dogs and teaching dog classes.
HeartsongforGod 3 years ago 2
Our fantastic veterinarian was absolutely firm about dog training: "Go with Sirius. Ian Dunbar is the best there is."
marymactavish 3 years ago 3
fantastic talk. It is so nice to hear someone who makes perfect sense talk about dogs and dog training, and to hear someone whoes only agenda is to promote great relatioships between owners and their dogs. A must.
claudiahoyle 3 years ago 5
This has been flagged as spam show
Ah, the penny has dropped. I've just realised why Ian comes across as so pissed off. Because he resents the recognition and subsequent success of Cesar Milan! How ridiculously insecure. This ludicrous argument over whether a long list of degrees and credentials make you a better dog behaviourist. Would Louis Hamilton be a better racing driver if he were better read on 'racing phychology'? Deal with it Ian. And calm down. Stop threatening to 'punch people out' - it's not worthy of respect.
frosty8968 3 years ago
Dr. Dunbar does not resent the success of Cesar. Ian Dunbar has written a multitude of books on dogs and their behaviour. His frustration in this talk, if you pay attention to what he is saying is that he is frustrated with people being stupid dog owners. Both Dr. Dunbar and Cesar know the signals that dogs give, and both can interpret them into human terms, however most people cannot. That is the main philosophy behind both their teaching methods: it's not dog training, it's human training
ovescovo 3 years ago 3
But i have seen your beloved Cesar Milan put electric e collars on dogs and strangle them with choke collars !
You dont see Dr Ian Dunbar doing that now do you!?
EBTerriers 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
What a frustrated angry man. Have you ever heard Cesar Milan say that he wanted to 'punch someone out'? Cesar Milan, who is referred to in this talk, although not named, has a calm, assertive, friendly personality. But he is also the pack leader of his dogs. Dogs need a pack leader. Its just nature - you can't compete with that. But Ian just seems to have a really frustrated angry attitude. Thats not a leader I'd find easy to respect. I wouldnt want to be his dog either, that's for sure.
frosty8968 3 years ago