@eatingYSSUP If you are a white male of female in this western world then it's more than likely at one point your ancestors were Catholics or at least Christians themselves. Congrats, you're descended from a long line of child molesters.
not everyone brings religion into this arguement i haven been to church since i was like 5 and i am pro life, its morals right and wrong a life is a life is a life whats there not to get all life starts some where dosent matter its shape or form its still life
@idkwia666 I am amoderator of the atheist and agnostic prolife league on facebook. If you're interested in secular, logical arguments for the prolife position you should check out my channel.
"Reproductive health care services" so THATS what they call it these days.. and excuse me but abortion is MURDER and so i think its pretty important....btw i love how they didn't film that stand that shows what aborted babies REALLY look like...
I heard a muslim imam talking about why the rise in christians converting to Islam in europe and america.
His reply was Muslims are happy to give birth to muslim, a child is a gift that should be loved. Christian are happy to kill bablies before they can make an expression on the world.
The rise of muslims is growing, alot of people want 2 go back to tradition. I f u dont want 2 get pregnant keep your legs shut or us a condom. we need more christians not muslims.
sandro, my point is that it is incorrect to think that ABC prevents abortion. ABC encourages sexual addictions, sexual irresponsibility, by attempting to divorce one of the two main purposes of the act which Nature has deemed to be important, from the act: procreation.
In attempting to alter the natural consequences of the action by using unnatural man-made means, we not only are ultimately unsuccessful, but we create new and worse problems.
a choice they were only able to make when becoming aware of it. Something that most people are not.
Most are kept ignorant of it by either never being given info on it, presented with misconceptions, or even being blatantly lied to. Billings and Creighton methods of NFP have been around as long as the Pill, yet no OB/GYN ever offers info on it, or suggests it. And the experience of those of us who so use it, is our dr.s have even tried to dissuade us from using it!
If more women were presented with info on NFP, more women would choose it for themselves. And why not? It is just as effective as the Pill, w/out any health side-effects, & we can use it not only to prevent pregnancy, but to attain pregnancy. Plus it is free.
So why are people not aware of it?
Because no one makes $ off of it, so no one has $ to promote it. There is no one to put NFP commercials on TV like the Pill.
So us women sacrifice our health in ignorance so that others can make $
And yes, I am po'd, because you claimed I have no right to life, DISCRIMINATING against me because of the POTENTIAL of what MAY have happened in my childhood, and now you won't even address it.
Who are you to say that I or anyone else should've been killed just because I (we) MIGHT'VE been abused as a child?
Thousands? Try hundreds of thousands. Estimates range anywhere form 200,000 to 400,000 peaceful marchers. I myself rode with a group all the way from Tulsa, OK. That's right, 25 hours on a bus to come to Washington, D.C. to defend the most basic human right of all: Life.
Death never gets enough death - it always wants more and more - Just before Hitler came into full power A woman whose husband worked for Hitler once asked Hitler to put to death her severly deformed 2 yr old child - of course - Hitler agreed - the main reason was to test the Public to see if there would be a Public Outcry - There was None - shortly thereafter Hitler ordered the Mass Extermination of Jews. watch out America
At last -- an unbiased presentation of what actually went on January 22 (I should know, I was there). Usually there are a handful of "pro-choice" people, and up to 200,000 pro-life people. It was good to see the reporter go back and forth from one group to the other, covering both sides and doing so extensively, and also finally, at last, giving the pro-life people a chance to actually speak. Also nice to see plenty of shots of the crowd -- almost never shown in mainstream media.
You seem to have missed the essential part of my argument. The Bible does not believe abortion is wrong. Women have the right to liberty and justice as well, anyway. Or maybe to you they don't. I can't convince you that the gag rule has caused the deaths of thousands of women, but I'm glad you are losing, for the sake of the Earth and freedom. I'm sure God kills 1/3 of fetuses for a really great reason, I'll let you two figure that out.
Mangina9000 what are you talking about? Leave the Bible out and look at what fetal imagery, surgery and therapy shows. It shows a growing individual human being capable of being operated upon in the womb. If you think it's ok to eliminate the fetus and cause it pain please don't dance around the facts- just say it. Say that it is OK to eliminate a human in the womb because the mother should have the choice to be burdened or not.
Yes, and what does the law say? Those fetuses in the 3rd trimester are hardly ever "operated on" or aborted, only in severe medical emergencies. You are part of the Fetus Cult, programmed by misinformation, uncaring of women who are suffering across the world. What a terrible person you are.
Depends upon what state you are in. MD is particularly barbaric with allowances for abortion at any time for "defects." Talk about Nazi philosophy right here in USA. Have you ever seen a picture of a 3 month unborn human or 2 month? They are just as human as you and I. So what is your view then? Abortion any time for any reason? Isn't that the only sure way to stop women from suffering?
Do you really believe "late term" abortions are honestly performed "any time for any reason?" The tiny percentage of unfortunate women that have to make this choice should not have to do so with your misguided influence. If you feel that a woman should be tied down and forced to deliver a child diagnosed with, say, Harlequin Syndrome, you are a fucking monster.
You are the monster for deciding that a human life should be exterminated because of "defects." Maybe you are so irate because you did that yourself and cant get over the shame and guilt. Human life is human life no matter how small or "defective."
Though please feel free to post ads on craigslist offering to adopt children with harlequin syndrome, as to not appear to be quite such a tyranical hypocrite.
And what say you when the day after you painfully kill the fetus suffering from HS they come out with a vaccine that cures it? You probably say, too bad, too late. I had to go on with my life free of defective human garbage. What if your parents didn't like what they saw in your fetal biopsy and they took you out by saline or d&c -- how would you have liked that?
Tell the wonderful souls who developed cures for once incurables like measles, tuberculosis, polio, testicular cancer, Hansen's disease, Hodgkin's disease, the list goes on an on, that they are insane. You have no faith in human ingenuity, choosing instead to solve your problem like you would a rat-- by painful death, or a mistake -- by deletion. Embrace hope, care for the helpless and the poor, and believe in the triumph of medical advances. Once they cure AIDS so much will be known.
You have no right to talk about the "wonderful souls" who have developed vaccines for viruses and diseases. Congenital genetic disorders cannot be "vaccinated." Not that that means anything to you. Don't even talk about AIDS. If it were not for Ronald Reagan calling AIDS "gay cancer" and dismissing it, the Pentagon wouldn't be calling it one of the greatest security risks to our country. Who cares what you think\feel anyway? Your beliefs are based on cultist delusion. Fetus Cult = BS.
Yes all is woe and failure -- that is your tune you sadsack excuse for an American. Look to leading biotech companies like Genentech which are developing genetic therapies. It is only a matter of time before HS and other genetic disorders are cured. Why be so pessimistic about human ingenuity? You probably would have said it was crazy to think we could ever put a man in space or touch Mars.
I'm exceptionally optimistic about genetic therapies (many of which require stem cell research). You are way off point. When you are ready to adopt a child with the brain of a vegetable who is in constant pain, then perhaps you have some ground to walk on, or if you are willing to personally tie a woman down to force her to bear a baby that has a tiny % of living in any case, then you can talk.. You voted for a person that severely hindered our ability to research those very technologies.
Mangina, prolife does not have any problem with stem cell research as long as it doesn't destroy human Life in the process. There are different types of stem cell research, and prolife supports all but the one that destroys human life. No workable results have come from such research. Embryonic stem cells have proven to be completely uncontrollable & unpredictable, & human life was destroyed to use them
Adult stem cells have already given us results that are being used. Let's go with what works
Not your decision. And you aren't "prolife," you are Fetus Cult. The Fetus Cult is ridiculous and dangerous. Thankfully, you people have lost, and we won't really have to deal with you again except on some various message boards where you will no doubt scream and cry and beat your version of the Bible against your heads, being incapable of absorbing the diachrony of technics and time (google "technics and time"). Good luck, maybe one day you'll care about the 500,000 women you've killed.
That's correct Sandro. Thanks to the fetus cult and conservative Christians (if they were fundamentalists and stuck to the Bible they would believe that fetuses were not human beings) there has been MORE abortions than before, since they believe that teaching women in third world countries about contraception is sinful. Fucking idiots. Thank God they're out of politics, right?
Actually, what has increased the number of abortions, believe it or not, have been the increased availability of contraceptives. Conditioning people to believe that they must have sex and cannot control themselves had led to increased condom use AND increased numbers of abortions. Those who pushed Roe v Wade, by the way, promised that a decrease in teenage pregnancies would be the result. Instead, the opposite has happened.
There is absolutely no evidence of that. Please provide a report that wasn't produced by a great fundamentalist man of God like Ted Haggard that backs that up. Oh that's right, "science is bad." All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions, I guess you care more about the sacredness of sperm than you do about fetuses, so you can't even get your bizarre twist on ethics and Christianity right. The Fetus Cult is ridiculous, and so are you.
Mangina: "All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions"
Along those lines, all evidence PROVES, not "suggests" that legalizing abortion has increased abortions. If you choose to present the "gag rule" as a bad thing because it is "suggested" that it has increased abortions, then you need to also take a stand that legalized abortion is a much worse thing in order not to be a hypocrite.
If you don't think abortion is sinful, then why do you have a problem with "the gag rule" increasing it as your statement ""All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions" states that you do?
Or are you saying that you support the gag rule? Your comments were leading me to believe you do not, then you made this statement.
The point you're trying to make is all rather confusing.
It is confusing, isn't it? My point is that if YOU find abortion sinful or wrong, why would your stance on the subject not want to weigh the benefits of preventing it. You say, wrongly, that teaching women in poor rural areas about contraception increases pregnancies. It doesn't, it prevents pregnancies. It also prevents AIDS. We can both "benefit" from the recent repealing of the gag rule: Lowered AIDS rates, lowered pregnancy rates, lowered abortion rates. Get it?
You "believe" lots of things, that doesn't mean they're true. Quite the opposite, the Fetus Cultists believe all sorts of nonsense that jeopardize the health of people across the planet.
Well, in regards to abortion itself, it is not a matter of personal "belief," it is a matter of objective truth. It is very clear that an individual human life begins at conception. We no longer live in medieval times. We live in the 21st Century -- and now it is more clear than ever before than an individual human life begins at conception.
yes, stem cells are doing great things in both Europe AND the United States. But none of those stem cells 'doing great things' are embryonic stem cells.
sandro, I have researched it. Embryonic stem cells may be promising in some researcher's opinions, but it is only that: an opinion. Many do not share it because despite all the time/money put into embryonic stem cells, they continue to leave us empty handed. All research results with embryonic stem cells have proven them to be unpredictable and uncontrollable.
If all that time/money had instead been put into adult stem cells, which continues to have workable results, we would be far better off
Minxcomic, I agree, and the hyped up possibility of curing Alzeihmer's or what have you through embryionic stem cell applications is so much thin veneer of justification for abortion and, ultimately, eugenics. But even if there was a promise of such a cure by these means -- it should not be followed, otherwise it becomes a promise the fulfilment of which destroys our very humanity. What if scientists thought 2 mo. infant brain tissue held the cure for cancer? Harvest though the infant dies?
For embryonic stem cell research to be conducted, a unique human life is willfully destroyed.
Evil always gives us false promises, false hopes in order to get us to do more evil. Evil will always use other evil done, to justify doing more evil.
Even if such stem cells could be harnessed as some have hope they will be, the final results will still be evil-based, and ultimately no good can come from it.
Death of humans by other humans can only beget more de
Actually I have researched this issue and Embronic stem cells have caused cancer in rats and some patients. Where Adult stem cells have been proven to help patients around the world.
So what if some "progressive" scientists experimented with two month old infant brain tissue and found it cured breast cancer. Does that make it ok to start harvesting brain tissue from those infants?
In 1968, Pope Paul VI prophesied in "Humanae Vitae" that with an increase use of contraception there would also be an increase of abortion. The concept shocked people and was considered to be an 'extreme example'. No way would we ever consider abortion to be acceptable. That would be appalling. Such was the general consensus that pooh-poohed the Pope's prediction.
Now we have people who say "abortion will always happen."
We've become comfortable enough with this evil, so on we go to the next.
Actually the more abortions, the less child abuse. Contraception is for those who DO NOT want to be pregnant, so that john paul prophecy is non related. What about those who have the baby only to abuse it?
2) according to the National Incidence Study of Child Abuse and Neglect, (a non-partial agency) child abuse, which was theorized by proabortion advocates to be expected to decrease if abortion became legal, instead increased "dramatically" since the legalization of abortion. (I will post the numbers below)
The numbers they provide also show that while the abortion rate has decreased so has the child abuse rate.
The NIS is a congressionally mandated effort to provide estimates for child abuse/neglect in the US. NIS-1 was conducted in 1979-80 and published in 1981. NIS-2 conducted in 1986-7, published 1988. NIS-3 conducted in 1993-4 ,published 1996. The following represents estimates of the number of children maltreated:
NIS-1 (1980): 625,100
NIS-2 (1986): 931,000
NIS-3 (1993): 1,553,800
Compared with the #of abortions in these years, the theory that abortion decreases child abuse is proven to be false
So if abortion were illegal mothers would not beat and kill their kids? I doubt that. I think ppl should have children when they can afford them (emotionally as well)
They should have sex knowing very well that they may get pregnant and be prepared to take care of the baby or give up for adoption , not go around the corner to the clinic to have a doctor kill him/her
Ppl do not have them w htat intention.I never said that, you did. Alot of parents don't give a shit about the kids they have, also dont care about the way they are treated. Ever see it? I haev.
I am not 'acting' like hitler. His regime was based on ethnicity not poverty. Furthermore you dont seem to have any solutions to abuse or unwanted pregnancy. You are just another religious nut.
Just tell him his mother is PRO-LIFE or he would not be talking to you now. Tell him that he is God's gift as much as he gives us challenge...he may will learn the truth when his wife does abortion and he feels the pain of the loss of his unborn child. Tell him to search for the truth in the Bible (Rom 6:23 KJV) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
You are acting like hitler .We have people that go into abused houses and get those babies out in many cases they are taken out of the abused situation. people have sex they should very well know that there is a chance that they could get pregnant .
No I am not acting like hitler you are.See how easy it is to make associations without validity. Not every person who has sex is irresponsible. What about rape, vasectomies and tubal ligations. What about menopause. What 50 yr old women would want to raise a child all over again?
No matter what the case , abortion is unacceptable and you know it . The 50 year old woman knows the consequence to sex.Rape is not an acception two wrongs dont make a right .hitler
sandro, both my brother and I were abused as kids. My brother more severe then I. However both of us are grown, are contributing members of society, volunteer and help others, and are raising families in a non-abusive environment. My bro has even gotten awards for his work.
Oh, and we were poor too when we were growing up.
By your perspective, Mom should've had a right to abort us out of fear of what our father would do to us.
Yes that is right. I am glad that YOUR situation worked out for you. I just think the woman has a choice to determine if she can take care of children.
You made several statements claiming that children who are likely to be abused should be aborted instead
So I ask you, WHO ARE YOU, or anyone else, to say that I, because I had the potential to be abused, have no right to live? I would like to know, because you claim you know that it would be better off that I was aborted then born.
Since you made the statement, please answer the question to tell me why you believe I have no right to live
Who am i? What do you want my name, SS, drivers??? I am A citizen that believes in the womans right to choice. I am not a judge, but neither can you. Who are you to deny choice? I already said it is unfair. But in life things happen where unfit parents need to decided whether they can take care of the child or not. What do you want to know?
sandro, it is not a game for me, because you have come right out and stated that it would be better for potentially abused people to be aborted instead of born. This means that you have made a determination ON MY LIFE.
I don't think your saying that it would be better if I was dead within my mother's womb is a game!
It is not for you to decide what goes on in womans body???
You made a decision about MY body, and I am a woman.
No i didnt . I said you have the right to decide. Not the gov't , me or the fetus(it can't). I can say anything I want. What ppl like you do is twist words to make them say what you want.
No,even you stated that I did not have the right as a fetus (and they can make a choice...just watch any ultrasound of an abortion, you can see the fetus's choice as they struggle to live.)
Nope, you did not say I have a right to decide to the question I asked, you said that to a question I did not ask at all, because you keep avoiding the question I did ask.
sandro: "no I didn't" Oh yes sir, you did! Copy/paste YOUR words: "Actually the more abortions, the less child abuse." "Furthermore many parents have no problem ill treating their kids. The less born the better " "The less abused children bornt he better" "Furthermore you dont seem to have any solutions to abuse or unwanted pregnancy. " YOUR solution? Abortion. Hence, you have made it clear that those who MIGHT be abused have no right to live Discrimination pure and simple
yeah and that is true. but not all abortions occur b/c of abuse. Its not discrimination, its the situation.I ask again what is your solution? You dont seem to understand that life is dealt w in diff ways.
Never said they did. This whole thread between you & I was because you believe that it is better that those of us which MAY be abused be aborted. And that IS discrimination!
No, you didn't use the word "may", I did only because there is no way we can determine which children will be abused and which will not be. There are liklihoods, but no way to determine. So it is only a POTENTIAL. Only abortion doesn't leave children potentially dead.
"You dont seem to understand that life is dealt w in diff ways."
What brings you to this conclusion? I know life is dealt with in different ways. I also know that not all ways of dealing with life are legal, nor should they be so just because some people choose it for their life.
I had already presented it to you. Build society up again with a sense of responsibility, knowing that there are consequences to our actions. Break our addiction to sex. It took a quite a few decades for us to attain it, it will take a few for us to break free from it. But until we do, we will suffer the consequences of our actions, which includes child and domestic abuse
It's all a part of the culture of death in which we live.
Break our addiction to sex? Who will do this. How will you impact what ppl do in their bedroom. Child abuse happens for many reasons. Poverty is one of them.
"How will you impact what ppl do in their bedroom."
I'd rather rephrase the question "how will WE impact what..."
The same way it has always been done. The same way that brought us to this point to begin with. Society has impacted people to drastically alter how they view and treat sex these last 50 yrs, so it cannot be denied that it can be done.
We need to restore sex to how nature intends it to be. The environment shows us what happens when we ignore the designs of nature.
ARe you kidding me...society has impacted...that isnt saying shit! It certainly wont affect the abortions that happen tomorrow. I think you want to say, that people need to start seeing the fetus as important as the born child. That aint gonna happen. Viewing sex in a diff way wont do a thing. Ppl who use protection can still get pregnant. Shit happens.
sandro: "ARe you kidding me...society has impacted...that isnt saying shit!"
Are you claiming that society does not impact how we view things?
Do you honestly believe that the media, public education facilities, advertising, t.v./radio broadcasts, film, music, other forms of entertainment like games, do not impact how we view things?
Do you honestly believe that groups with an agenda do not turn to such areas to affect our perception as a society? Their writings prove otherwise
sand: "It certainly wont affect the abortions that happen tomorrow"
I made that point when I stated "It took a quite a few decades for us to attain it, it will take a few for us to break free from it"
Not much done in any area will have a big effect in one day. This short-sighted thinking we have has brought us to this point were we see abortion commonplace when a mere 40 yrs ago it was a horrifying concept to us.
sand:"I think you want to say that people need to start seeing the fetus as important as the born child"
No, what I DO say, since you brought it up (it is not along the lines we were speaking of but is true also) is that people need to RETURN to seeing the fetus as important as the born child, for that is how it has always been. In fact it was considered MORE horrifying to kill the unborn then the born. Ever see the movie "The Seven Samurai"? It has a great line which is a good example of this
Except for a few sociopaths, we already recognize the humanity of those who die in war, and the harm of war, and still it continues, right or wrong.
However if society AGAIN recognized the humanity of the fetus (as it has done so from time beginning until the recent brainwashing of the last few decades), abortion could not continue, for there is no justification for the horror of it.
For abortion to continue to be legal, it is vital that the humanity of the unborn be not recognized.
Yeah and we recognize aboriton as well...the world already has 6 billion ppl. Get over it.
No one denies the fetus is human,why the hell ldo you think it is difficult for women to do. Lifes circumstances cause that choice. It is not so simple to 'just have it'. And you have is talk.
On the contrary, quite a few people do deny the fetus is human life.
So now that I am aware that you recognize the fetus's humanity, are you telling us that you say it is o.k. for a woman to kill her human child because that human inconveniences her for 9 months?
A society where most women abort because they feel it's their ONLY choice is NOT a "pro-choice" society, rather a "pro-abortive" society!
With few exceptions, only the prolife orgs are doing actual work to fix that, trying to get more choices and support to women in crisis pregnancies, and we're getting fought at every point. Why? Because less abortions means less $ for those in the abortion industry who have a lot of $ to promote their agenda
Women become pregnant when men and women have have sexual intercourse during the 5 days of a woman's cycle when she is fertile. And most of the time pregnancies do not result even then.
So except in the case of rape which constitute less then 1% of all abortions, women are pregnant because of a choice they have already made.
This is not "circumstance", but rather a result of a choice, an action decided upon
Never said it was. However in testimonies from pro-choice men, many have said "the woman can just have an abortion" (and some go on to say, 'why should I have to pay child support for a child she choose not to abort? We agreed not to have children, she should've just aborted!)
Also women have spoken of being told to "just have an abortion" by their boyfriends, husbands, parents, or employers who find reasons for firing them if they do not.
The "just have an abortion" crowd is NOT the prolife viewpoint. Many in the prolife groups ARE post-abortive women. Having an abortion is what made them prolife.
That's all that is available for me to do on YouTube, 'talk' and watch.
I know that you know my life extends beyond youtube, because I am confident that yours does also. Please admit that you know as much about my life beyond youtube as I do yours. Telling me all I have is talk when you know nothing about my life is ...well, I think you can figure it out
sand: "Viewing sex in a diff way wont do a thing."
Oh but it has, it does, and it will.
"Ppl who use protection can still get pregnant."
Hence the whole reason why the increase use of artificial birth control has increased abortion
"Shit happens"
Good example of how warped our society is in regards to sex and pregnancy. This is only a recent development to consider pregnancy as "shit", or a disease to be avoided at all costs, even to the point of harming women's bodies and health
BC has led to less abortions. You will never win this one. Man had been doing this sice the beginning of time. YOu fail to see it. Spend time helping those poor kids that are already here in foster care, hosp, etc. Stop being obsessed w what will never stop.
Granted it is hard to look up the studies that show this as most of the studies that pop up on an internet search are sponsored by those who manufacture BC and perform abortions. If people stopped using Artificial BC, and started using NFP more and as a result had less abortions, many rich people would be out of a good deal of $ as BC is the biggest moneymaker in prescriptions, and abortions which is very related is a big $maker too.
However I have kept recommending you to look up the actual tables of how many abortions have been performed next to tables of birth control use, and you see them rise and fall in tandem. This is what convinced me. You cannot argue with the facts.
If people have sex accepting the responsibility of the risk they are taking, if the pregnancy happens they will not abort as they have already accepted the responsibility.
If people have sex using BC thinking that they have a right to sex without the natural consequential risk, if a pregnancy occurs, they think they have a right not to be pregnant and are more likely to choose abortion.
Abortion is running away from the natural consequences of our actions
People can do what they want. Accept it! The less BC used the more abortions. Why ? BC not all women who get pregnant want to be. My own grandmother had 12 children! Did she want to...NO! The woman decides my friend , not you!
sandro: "BC not all women who get pregnant want to be"
Artificial Birth Control is not our only option!
have you heard of NFP? Not the archaic 'rhythm method', but NFP?
Chances are really good you have not.
The reason why is because no one makes money off of it. And ABC (artificial birth control) is the biggest prescriptive money maker by far, tho anti-depressants are catching up... that too is related as the Pill causes depression in women and many are on anti-depressants.
ABC is not necessary. NFP has proven over and over to be just as if not more effective then the Pill,
Couples who use NFP have a 99.3% effectiveness rate when avoiding pregnancy, a 81% rate in trying to acquire pregnancy (including infertile couples!), a .01% rate in abortion if an unwanted pregnancy occurs, and .01% child abuse rate (remember the argument between us?), and a 4% divorce rate.
Once again proving, that when we work with Nature with her design, things work for the best, naturally.
whereas, once again, when you look at the tables of ABC use next to the tables of abortion rates, next to the tables of child abuse rates, next to the tables of divorce rates, they rise in fall in very similar rates. They are related.
This again proves, when we think we are smarter then our natural design, Nature proves us wrong with forcing us to deal with the consequences of our actions, and it is never pleasant.
ABC users think they have a right to sex w/out the natural consequences. When the natural consequences sneak thru despite our attempts to handicap our bodies by drugged sterilization, we get upset, after all, don't we have a right to sex w/out dealing with the natural consequences?
Hence more abortions.
It is like sending out a letter to someone saying "we are getting married, you are NOT invited, do not come". When they show up, you kick them out.
Rather people working with their bodies to avoid pregnancy (NFP), not only have healthier bodies, but by the very nature of the practice, they accept a pregnancy, tho rare, may occur
So on the .7% chance that a pregnancy DOES result, almost all do not abort. They are responsible for the consequence of their action.
Much like a bridal couple simply not sending an invite to someone they do not want there.If the person shows up anyways, the won't kick him out, they just set up another plate
Your raTIONale is very poor. You have no grip on real life. Prayer /talking to someone about change in sexual practices(what a joke) is not going to work. I notice you said nothing about the other issues mentioned. Typical
kmc: talking to someone about change in sexual practices(what a joke) is not going to work.
I did not claim that just talking to others was going to work. That indeed is silly. Much more brought us to this point, it will take the same to make us healthy again.
Many factors, including but not limited to talking has changed our sexual practices from one extreme (the Victorian view) to another extreme (present view). Neither extreme is healthy and we should strive to become healthy
Changing our sexual practices has been going on since the early 1940s. It took on a full fledge shouting and propaganda in the '60s. Now we are suffering the consequences of the action of going to an opposite extreme.
The middle ground is what we need. A healthy respect for each other as men and women which INCLUDES our fertility. Full womanhood, full manhood.
Nature has made us the way we are for a reason. When we alter that for any reason, we become as the environment: pretty messed up
Studies show that the "wanted" children (either present or future) who live with women who have abortions have a much higher incidence of being abused AFTER the abortion.
Just to name 2 of many:
~"Relationship Between Induced Abortion and Child Abuse and Neglect: Four Studies," Pre- and Perinatal Psychology Journal 8(1):43-63 Fall 1993;
~"Associations between voluntary and involuntary forms of perintal loss and child maltreatment among low-income mothers," Acta Paediatrica 94, 2005.
Tiny % . . .today there is a report that they have got a cure for Bubble Syndrome disease. Tomorrow who knows what will be discovered. There is never a REQUIREMENT to destroy life. In fact look at the pitiful results from embryionic research compared to adult cell applications. And don't whine about no fed funds -- plenty of private funds are there. You remind me of the old Dr. Mengele, the one who pioneered experimentation on "subhuman" life.
Mother Teresa offered to take all unwanted babies, all of them when she was here in the US. Did NBC report that? Her Order continues on. Ask anyone of them to take care of a baby -- No matter who that baby is, and they will. They see God in every human. Your attitude degrades us all by treating innocent human life as so much waste. You don't even offer simple painkillers to cut the pain of saline or d/c or suction. I wonder if you would as generous as Obama and offer a Comfort Room.
Her order does continue on, and I appreciate what she did in nurturing people die. It's nice that she rescued a baby from a garbage can. In countries where abortion is not available, where contraception is not available, and where women (and their babies) can potentially be harmed by their culture, what you propose is not an option. Ironically, thanks to conservative Christian meddling with NGOs and the gag rule, abortion rates have gone up drastically in poor countries.
all catholics are child molesters
eatingYSSUP 1 year ago
@eatingYSSUP If you are a white male of female in this western world then it's more than likely at one point your ancestors were Catholics or at least Christians themselves. Congrats, you're descended from a long line of child molesters.
Bobanamanamo 9 months ago
not everyone brings religion into this arguement i haven been to church since i was like 5 and i am pro life, its morals right and wrong a life is a life is a life whats there not to get all life starts some where dosent matter its shape or form its still life
idkwia666 1 year ago
@idkwia666 I am amoderator of the atheist and agnostic prolife league on facebook. If you're interested in secular, logical arguments for the prolife position you should check out my channel.
WarThemedRevolution 6 months ago
give me librety or give me DEATH!!!! no plz no death!!
lalaland141 2 years ago
"Reproductive health care services" so THATS what they call it these days.. and excuse me but abortion is MURDER and so i think its pretty important....btw i love how they didn't film that stand that shows what aborted babies REALLY look like...
evilhand3 2 years ago
I heard a muslim imam talking about why the rise in christians converting to Islam in europe and america.
His reply was Muslims are happy to give birth to muslim, a child is a gift that should be loved. Christian are happy to kill bablies before they can make an expression on the world.
The rise of muslims is growing, alot of people want 2 go back to tradition. I f u dont want 2 get pregnant keep your legs shut or us a condom. we need more christians not muslims.
smp236520 2 years ago
And what exactly is WRONG with Muslims? Nothing. All of the Muslims I've ever met were good people.
evilhand3 2 years ago
Every baby deserves the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
DeanClark68 2 years ago 10
@DeanClark68 Deformed babies?
I am pro-life except for babies with deformations or too much chromosome or too less.
I understand why women would want to abort their baby because they don't want to put their child in pain or to be made fun of in life.
blooshla 8 months ago
Can't interview a group of foolish pro-life activist without someone mentioning GOD. Never fails...
Hockeygirl4 2 years ago
@Hockeygirl4 Thank GOD it never fails......
centerfield34 2 years ago
pro life
theHSCP 2 years ago 4
i see myself in the beginning!!! :)
xojonaslovexo21 2 years ago 2
where what time frame?
dacatholicbandorgan 2 years ago
I think you can see Fr.Frank Pavone in the backround at 2:30.
dacatholicbandorgan 2 years ago
Finally, some the real press speaking on the issue.
dacatholicbandorgan 2 years ago
Comment removed
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro, my point is that it is incorrect to think that ABC prevents abortion. ABC encourages sexual addictions, sexual irresponsibility, by attempting to divorce one of the two main purposes of the act which Nature has deemed to be important, from the act: procreation.
In attempting to alter the natural consequences of the action by using unnatural man-made means, we not only are ultimately unsuccessful, but we create new and worse problems.
In using natural means, we are successful.
Minxcomix 2 years ago 2
"That was their choice."
a choice they were only able to make when becoming aware of it. Something that most people are not.
Most are kept ignorant of it by either never being given info on it, presented with misconceptions, or even being blatantly lied to. Billings and Creighton methods of NFP have been around as long as the Pill, yet no OB/GYN ever offers info on it, or suggests it. And the experience of those of us who so use it, is our dr.s have even tried to dissuade us from using it!
Minxcomix 2 years ago 2
If more women were presented with info on NFP, more women would choose it for themselves. And why not? It is just as effective as the Pill, w/out any health side-effects, & we can use it not only to prevent pregnancy, but to attain pregnancy. Plus it is free.
So why are people not aware of it?
Because no one makes $ off of it, so no one has $ to promote it. There is no one to put NFP commercials on TV like the Pill.
So us women sacrifice our health in ignorance so that others can make $
Minxcomix 2 years ago 6
So well said! Contraception = money.
ariaane 2 years ago
not about money...its baout not wanting pregnancy...you are saying it should be free.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Abortion does not prevent child abuse, rather it is the ultimate child abuse because it mutilates our Little Ones in a most inhumane way.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
And yes, I am po'd, because you claimed I have no right to life, DISCRIMINATING against me because of the POTENTIAL of what MAY have happened in my childhood, and now you won't even address it.
Who are you to say that I or anyone else should've been killed just because I (we) MIGHT'VE been abused as a child?
And don't deny you said it, because you did.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
bahaha! They sound like zombies!!!!
Hockeygirl4 2 years ago
you are so dense.
AtTheCornerCafe 2 years ago
its also in the bible that killing is right if god says so.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Thousands? Try hundreds of thousands. Estimates range anywhere form 200,000 to 400,000 peaceful marchers. I myself rode with a group all the way from Tulsa, OK. That's right, 25 hours on a bus to come to Washington, D.C. to defend the most basic human right of all: Life.
KolbeKrew 2 years ago
Death never gets enough death - it always wants more and more - Just before Hitler came into full power A woman whose husband worked for Hitler once asked Hitler to put to death her severly deformed 2 yr old child - of course - Hitler agreed - the main reason was to test the Public to see if there would be a Public Outcry - There was None - shortly thereafter Hitler ordered the Mass Extermination of Jews. watch out America
dovecry2 3 years ago
Nice shot at :58 showing what a stressful situation those escorts have in dealing with all those harassing "anti's".
Sure hope that's decaf, otherwise her blood pressure might go up...what with all the stress and all.
sarcasticwhip 3 years ago
reproductive heathcare? Honsltey? Come on. Abortion is the murder of an unborn child, not something like a cold. Heathcare is for sickness not life
shantastic10 3 years ago
OH MY GOD we are thanking about life coming out from GOd still babys dont kill them
swettlove 3 years ago
I think it's a shame in a way that the international news gave this march more coverage than the domestic media.
sulkow82 3 years ago
Yes. This is the most balanced report I have seen on the pro-life march. And it's from...Russia Today!
chrisman737 3 years ago
At last -- an unbiased presentation of what actually went on January 22 (I should know, I was there). Usually there are a handful of "pro-choice" people, and up to 200,000 pro-life people. It was good to see the reporter go back and forth from one group to the other, covering both sides and doing so extensively, and also finally, at last, giving the pro-life people a chance to actually speak. Also nice to see plenty of shots of the crowd -- almost never shown in mainstream media.
chrisman737 3 years ago
I totally agree with you. It is about as balanced as it gets. Thank you RT.
mattlewis66 3 years ago
Goodness, this newscast is bias
QuinteroDude 3 years ago
Pro-choice = pro-abusing gods gift of choice
FilthyPeasant124 3 years ago
You seem to have missed the essential part of my argument. The Bible does not believe abortion is wrong. Women have the right to liberty and justice as well, anyway. Or maybe to you they don't. I can't convince you that the gag rule has caused the deaths of thousands of women, but I'm glad you are losing, for the sake of the Earth and freedom. I'm sure God kills 1/3 of fetuses for a really great reason, I'll let you two figure that out.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Mangina9000 what are you talking about? Leave the Bible out and look at what fetal imagery, surgery and therapy shows. It shows a growing individual human being capable of being operated upon in the womb. If you think it's ok to eliminate the fetus and cause it pain please don't dance around the facts- just say it. Say that it is OK to eliminate a human in the womb because the mother should have the choice to be burdened or not.
mattlewis66 3 years ago
Yes, and what does the law say? Those fetuses in the 3rd trimester are hardly ever "operated on" or aborted, only in severe medical emergencies. You are part of the Fetus Cult, programmed by misinformation, uncaring of women who are suffering across the world. What a terrible person you are.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Depends upon what state you are in. MD is particularly barbaric with allowances for abortion at any time for "defects." Talk about Nazi philosophy right here in USA. Have you ever seen a picture of a 3 month unborn human or 2 month? They are just as human as you and I. So what is your view then? Abortion any time for any reason? Isn't that the only sure way to stop women from suffering?
mattlewis66 3 years ago
Do you really believe "late term" abortions are honestly performed "any time for any reason?" The tiny percentage of unfortunate women that have to make this choice should not have to do so with your misguided influence. If you feel that a woman should be tied down and forced to deliver a child diagnosed with, say, Harlequin Syndrome, you are a fucking monster.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
You are the monster for deciding that a human life should be exterminated because of "defects." Maybe you are so irate because you did that yourself and cant get over the shame and guilt. Human life is human life no matter how small or "defective."
mattlewis66 3 years ago
Thank God you people lost. 500,000 dead women in 8 years, really... Thank God you people lost.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Though please feel free to post ads on craigslist offering to adopt children with harlequin syndrome, as to not appear to be quite such a tyranical hypocrite.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
And what say you when the day after you painfully kill the fetus suffering from HS they come out with a vaccine that cures it? You probably say, too bad, too late. I had to go on with my life free of defective human garbage. What if your parents didn't like what they saw in your fetal biopsy and they took you out by saline or d&c -- how would you have liked that?
mattlewis66 3 years ago
A vaccine that cures it. Jesus Christ you people are insane.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Tell the wonderful souls who developed cures for once incurables like measles, tuberculosis, polio, testicular cancer, Hansen's disease, Hodgkin's disease, the list goes on an on, that they are insane. You have no faith in human ingenuity, choosing instead to solve your problem like you would a rat-- by painful death, or a mistake -- by deletion. Embrace hope, care for the helpless and the poor, and believe in the triumph of medical advances. Once they cure AIDS so much will be known.
mattlewis66 3 years ago
You have no right to talk about the "wonderful souls" who have developed vaccines for viruses and diseases. Congenital genetic disorders cannot be "vaccinated." Not that that means anything to you. Don't even talk about AIDS. If it were not for Ronald Reagan calling AIDS "gay cancer" and dismissing it, the Pentagon wouldn't be calling it one of the greatest security risks to our country. Who cares what you think\feel anyway? Your beliefs are based on cultist delusion. Fetus Cult = BS.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Yes all is woe and failure -- that is your tune you sadsack excuse for an American. Look to leading biotech companies like Genentech which are developing genetic therapies. It is only a matter of time before HS and other genetic disorders are cured. Why be so pessimistic about human ingenuity? You probably would have said it was crazy to think we could ever put a man in space or touch Mars.
mattlewis66 3 years ago
I'm exceptionally optimistic about genetic therapies (many of which require stem cell research). You are way off point. When you are ready to adopt a child with the brain of a vegetable who is in constant pain, then perhaps you have some ground to walk on, or if you are willing to personally tie a woman down to force her to bear a baby that has a tiny % of living in any case, then you can talk.. You voted for a person that severely hindered our ability to research those very technologies.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Mangina, prolife does not have any problem with stem cell research as long as it doesn't destroy human Life in the process. There are different types of stem cell research, and prolife supports all but the one that destroys human life. No workable results have come from such research. Embryonic stem cells have proven to be completely uncontrollable & unpredictable, & human life was destroyed to use them
Adult stem cells have already given us results that are being used. Let's go with what works
Minxcomix 3 years ago
Not your decision. And you aren't "prolife," you are Fetus Cult. The Fetus Cult is ridiculous and dangerous. Thankfully, you people have lost, and we won't really have to deal with you again except on some various message boards where you will no doubt scream and cry and beat your version of the Bible against your heads, being incapable of absorbing the diachrony of technics and time (google "technics and time"). Good luck, maybe one day you'll care about the 500,000 women you've killed.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
I believe the women to whom you referred were killed by ABORTIONS, not by pro-life people. Think about it.
Also, Roe v. Wade will be overturned. Even the original Jane Roe is now pro-life. It is just a matter of time.
chrisman737 3 years ago
Just b/c Roe is now pro life mean nothing. no one can force a woman who have a child. Some of the pro lifers dont even believe in condoms!
sandroeleven 3 years ago
That's correct Sandro. Thanks to the fetus cult and conservative Christians (if they were fundamentalists and stuck to the Bible they would believe that fetuses were not human beings) there has been MORE abortions than before, since they believe that teaching women in third world countries about contraception is sinful. Fucking idiots. Thank God they're out of politics, right?
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Actually, what has increased the number of abortions, believe it or not, have been the increased availability of contraceptives. Conditioning people to believe that they must have sex and cannot control themselves had led to increased condom use AND increased numbers of abortions. Those who pushed Roe v Wade, by the way, promised that a decrease in teenage pregnancies would be the result. Instead, the opposite has happened.
chrisman737 3 years ago 3
There is absolutely no evidence of that. Please provide a report that wasn't produced by a great fundamentalist man of God like Ted Haggard that backs that up. Oh that's right, "science is bad." All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions, I guess you care more about the sacredness of sperm than you do about fetuses, so you can't even get your bizarre twist on ethics and Christianity right. The Fetus Cult is ridiculous, and so are you.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Mangina: "All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions"
Along those lines, all evidence PROVES, not "suggests" that legalizing abortion has increased abortions. If you choose to present the "gag rule" as a bad thing because it is "suggested" that it has increased abortions, then you need to also take a stand that legalized abortion is a much worse thing in order not to be a hypocrite.
Minxcomix 3 years ago
As I don't think abortion is sinful, I don't see how I'm a hypocrite.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
If you don't think abortion is sinful, then why do you have a problem with "the gag rule" increasing it as your statement ""All evidence suggests that the gag rule has increased abortions" states that you do?
Or are you saying that you support the gag rule? Your comments were leading me to believe you do not, then you made this statement.
The point you're trying to make is all rather confusing.
Minxcomix 3 years ago
It is confusing, isn't it? My point is that if YOU find abortion sinful or wrong, why would your stance on the subject not want to weigh the benefits of preventing it. You say, wrongly, that teaching women in poor rural areas about contraception increases pregnancies. It doesn't, it prevents pregnancies. It also prevents AIDS. We can both "benefit" from the recent repealing of the gag rule: Lowered AIDS rates, lowered pregnancy rates, lowered abortion rates. Get it?
Mangina9000 3 years ago
And no one should force a child to die.
chrisman737 3 years ago
that is the way life works..unfair.
sandroeleven 3 years ago
You "believe" lots of things, that doesn't mean they're true. Quite the opposite, the Fetus Cultists believe all sorts of nonsense that jeopardize the health of people across the planet.
Mangina9000 3 years ago
Well, in regards to abortion itself, it is not a matter of personal "belief," it is a matter of objective truth. It is very clear that an individual human life begins at conception. We no longer live in medieval times. We live in the 21st Century -- and now it is more clear than ever before than an individual human life begins at conception.
chrisman737 3 years ago 3
incorrect minx...in europe stem cells are doing great things. Eggs are not chickens!
sandroeleven 3 years ago
sandraoeleven,
yes, stem cells are doing great things in both Europe AND the United States. But none of those stem cells 'doing great things' are embryonic stem cells.
Please recheck your facts.
Minxcomix 3 years ago 2
Stem cell research in europe is promising. Do you know why? B/c they are immature and can become any kind of cell. Reseach it.
sandroeleven 3 years ago
sandro, I have researched it. Embryonic stem cells may be promising in some researcher's opinions, but it is only that: an opinion. Many do not share it because despite all the time/money put into embryonic stem cells, they continue to leave us empty handed. All research results with embryonic stem cells have proven them to be unpredictable and uncontrollable.
If all that time/money had instead been put into adult stem cells, which continues to have workable results, we would be far better off
Minxcomix 3 years ago 2
Minxcomic, I agree, and the hyped up possibility of curing Alzeihmer's or what have you through embryionic stem cell applications is so much thin veneer of justification for abortion and, ultimately, eugenics. But even if there was a promise of such a cure by these means -- it should not be followed, otherwise it becomes a promise the fulfilment of which destroys our very humanity. What if scientists thought 2 mo. infant brain tissue held the cure for cancer? Harvest though the infant dies?
mattlewis66 3 years ago 2
For embryonic stem cell research to be conducted, a unique human life is willfully destroyed.
Evil always gives us false promises, false hopes in order to get us to do more evil. Evil will always use other evil done, to justify doing more evil.
Even if such stem cells could be harnessed as some have hope they will be, the final results will still be evil-based, and ultimately no good can come from it.
Death of humans by other humans can only beget more de
Minxcomix 3 years ago 2
not true
sandroeleven 3 years ago
Actually I have researched this issue and Embronic stem cells have caused cancer in rats and some patients. Where Adult stem cells have been proven to help patients around the world.
lippazon19 3 years ago 2
So have i and its promising. Must be some right wing lie. Coulter says that kind of stuff.
sandroeleven 3 years ago
So what if some "progressive" scientists experimented with two month old infant brain tissue and found it cured breast cancer. Does that make it ok to start harvesting brain tissue from those infants?
mattlewis66 3 years ago
No it does not make it right. As usual ppl like you choose extreme examples. But abortion will always happen and why not use the tissue.
sandroeleven 3 years ago
In 1968, Pope Paul VI prophesied in "Humanae Vitae" that with an increase use of contraception there would also be an increase of abortion. The concept shocked people and was considered to be an 'extreme example'. No way would we ever consider abortion to be acceptable. That would be appalling. Such was the general consensus that pooh-poohed the Pope's prediction.
Now we have people who say "abortion will always happen."
We've become comfortable enough with this evil, so on we go to the next.
Minxcomix 3 years ago
Actually the more abortions, the less child abuse. Contraception is for those who DO NOT want to be pregnant, so that john paul prophecy is non related. What about those who have the baby only to abuse it?
sandroeleven 3 years ago
sandra
1) It is Paul IV, not John Paul II
2) according to the National Incidence Study of Child Abuse and Neglect, (a non-partial agency) child abuse, which was theorized by proabortion advocates to be expected to decrease if abortion became legal, instead increased "dramatically" since the legalization of abortion. (I will post the numbers below)
The numbers they provide also show that while the abortion rate has decreased so has the child abuse rate.
Minxcomix 3 years ago
The NIS is a congressionally mandated effort to provide estimates for child abuse/neglect in the US. NIS-1 was conducted in 1979-80 and published in 1981. NIS-2 conducted in 1986-7, published 1988. NIS-3 conducted in 1993-4 ,published 1996. The following represents estimates of the number of children maltreated:
NIS-1 (1980): 625,100
NIS-2 (1986): 931,000
NIS-3 (1993): 1,553,800
Compared with the #of abortions in these years, the theory that abortion decreases child abuse is proven to be false
Minxcomix 3 years ago
So if abortion were illegal mothers would not beat and kill their kids? I doubt that. I think ppl should have children when they can afford them (emotionally as well)
sandroeleven 3 years ago
They should have sex knowing very well that they may get pregnant and be prepared to take care of the baby or give up for adoption , not go around the corner to the clinic to have a doctor kill him/her
onclave6 2 years ago
or they can terminate if they want. Humans are not gods we are evolved,from the animal kingdom. Doyou think we should kill animals to eat them?
sandroeleven 2 years ago
of couse God condones killing animalto eat in the Bible. I am a meat eater.Killing is right if God says so but he never condoned abortion.
onclave6 2 years ago
You obviously don't have children and/or don't understand the sanctity and miracle of life.
AtTheCornerCafe 2 years ago
Like i said...life is unfair...I accept that. Adoption does not always work.This issuei s sooo hard for fundamentaist christians.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
not true .you made that up . Also People do not have babies only to abuse them . I dont beleive you know one case in which this happended .
onclave6 2 years ago 2
Ppl do haev kids that end up being abused. Ever heard of it? What nonsense.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
People do not have children with the intention of abusing them ,that wa my point give me a case that says different .Wise guy
onclave6 2 years ago
That doesnt stop the fact that the still end up being abused. So what you say is useless!
sandroeleven 2 years ago
your point was that people have babies with the intentions of abusing them . I challenged you to find some case in wich that happened you cannot .
onclave6 2 years ago
Ppl do not have them w htat intention.I never said that, you did. Alot of parents don't give a shit about the kids they have, also dont care about the way they are treated. Ever see it? I haev.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Furthermore many parents have no problem ill treating their kids. The less born the better
sandroeleven 2 years ago
The less born the better? Ok Hitler what an evil thing to say .
onclave6 2 years ago
The less abused children bornt he better. YOu ppl always use the word Hitler like it suddenly makes you right.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Act like Hitler I will call you
Hitler . You did say that people have babies with teh direct intetnion of abusing them its on this page with your name on it .
onclave6 2 years ago
I am not 'acting' like hitler. His regime was based on ethnicity not poverty. Furthermore you dont seem to have any solutions to abuse or unwanted pregnancy. You are just another religious nut.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Just tell him his mother is PRO-LIFE or he would not be talking to you now. Tell him that he is God's gift as much as he gives us challenge...he may will learn the truth when his wife does abortion and he feels the pain of the loss of his unborn child. Tell him to search for the truth in the Bible (Rom 6:23 KJV) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
melioped 2 years ago
I agree with you, this person just can't see the big picture.
Hockeygirl4 2 years ago
such an ass...'direct intention' what right wing bullshit. that is how you ppl slant things to fit them into your own opinion....
sandroeleven 2 years ago
You are acting like hitler .We have people that go into abused houses and get those babies out in many cases they are taken out of the abused situation. people have sex they should very well know that there is a chance that they could get pregnant .
onclave6 2 years ago
No I am not acting like hitler you are.See how easy it is to make associations without validity. Not every person who has sex is irresponsible. What about rape, vasectomies and tubal ligations. What about menopause. What 50 yr old women would want to raise a child all over again?
sandroeleven 2 years ago
No matter what the case , abortion is unacceptable and you know it . The 50 year old woman knows the consequence to sex.Rape is not an acception two wrongs dont make a right .hitler
onclave6 2 years ago
onclav...i hate the unfairness of our world but understand why women get abortions. In fact RU 486 will makes protestors a thing of the past.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro, both my brother and I were abused as kids. My brother more severe then I. However both of us are grown, are contributing members of society, volunteer and help others, and are raising families in a non-abusive environment. My bro has even gotten awards for his work.
Oh, and we were poor too when we were growing up.
By your perspective, Mom should've had a right to abort us out of fear of what our father would do to us.
Who are you to say I had no right to live?!!
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Yes that is right. I am glad that YOUR situation worked out for you. I just think the woman has a choice to determine if she can take care of children.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Sorry sandro, but that does not answer my question.
Who are you, or anyone else, even my mother, to say that I have no right to live?
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Like i said it is not fair, but the woman is the one to decide whether she can care for a child.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro, you still have not answered my question!
Minxcomix 2 years ago
You made several statements claiming that children who are likely to be abused should be aborted instead
So I ask you, WHO ARE YOU, or anyone else, to say that I, because I had the potential to be abused, have no right to live? I would like to know, because you claim you know that it would be better off that I was aborted then born.
Since you made the statement, please answer the question to tell me why you believe I have no right to live
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Who am i? What do you want my name, SS, drivers??? I am A citizen that believes in the womans right to choice. I am not a judge, but neither can you. Who are you to deny choice? I already said it is unfair. But in life things happen where unfit parents need to decided whether they can take care of the child or not. What do you want to know?
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sand "What do you want my name, SS, drivers?"
Would these things tell me what right you have to determine that I had no right to live?
"I am not a judge"
And yet you judged me, all abused children, and any child that may potentially be abused
"Who are you..."
A former fetus whom you determined had no right to life
"...to deny choice?"
I do not deny choice. I allow everyone the choice to continue to live. Why do you support the legal denying of this choice?
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sandro: "What do you want to know?"
Why you think discriminating against potentially abused children by ending their lives before they are born is o.k.
It's very prejudiced and intolerant of you.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
I support choice just like you w out the nonsense.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro, it is not a game for me, because you have come right out and stated that it would be better for potentially abused people to be aborted instead of born. This means that you have made a determination ON MY LIFE.
I don't think your saying that it would be better if I was dead within my mother's womb is a game!
It is not for you to decide what goes on in womans body???
You made a decision about MY body, and I am a woman.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
No i didnt . I said you have the right to decide. Not the gov't , me or the fetus(it can't). I can say anything I want. What ppl like you do is twist words to make them say what you want.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
I have the right to decide? To decide what?!
To be abused or not?
Obviously not.
To be aborted or not?
No,even you stated that I did not have the right as a fetus (and they can make a choice...just watch any ultrasound of an abortion, you can see the fetus's choice as they struggle to live.)
Nope, you did not say I have a right to decide to the question I asked, you said that to a question I did not ask at all, because you keep avoiding the question I did ask.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Minxcomix 2 years ago
yeah and that is true. but not all abortions occur b/c of abuse. Its not discrimination, its the situation.I ask again what is your solution? You dont seem to understand that life is dealt w in diff ways.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
"not all abortions occur b/c of abuse"
Never said they did. This whole thread between you & I was because you believe that it is better that those of us which MAY be abused be aborted. And that IS discrimination!
No, you didn't use the word "may", I did only because there is no way we can determine which children will be abused and which will not be. There are liklihoods, but no way to determine. So it is only a POTENTIAL. Only abortion doesn't leave children potentially dead.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
"You dont seem to understand that life is dealt w in diff ways."
What brings you to this conclusion? I know life is dealt with in different ways. I also know that not all ways of dealing with life are legal, nor should they be so just because some people choose it for their life.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sandro: "I ask again what is your solution?"
I had already presented it to you. Build society up again with a sense of responsibility, knowing that there are consequences to our actions. Break our addiction to sex. It took a quite a few decades for us to attain it, it will take a few for us to break free from it. But until we do, we will suffer the consequences of our actions, which includes child and domestic abuse
It's all a part of the culture of death in which we live.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Break our addiction to sex? Who will do this. How will you impact what ppl do in their bedroom. Child abuse happens for many reasons. Poverty is one of them.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
"How will you impact what ppl do in their bedroom."
I'd rather rephrase the question "how will WE impact what..."
The same way it has always been done. The same way that brought us to this point to begin with. Society has impacted people to drastically alter how they view and treat sex these last 50 yrs, so it cannot be denied that it can be done.
We need to restore sex to how nature intends it to be. The environment shows us what happens when we ignore the designs of nature.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
ARe you kidding me...society has impacted...that isnt saying shit! It certainly wont affect the abortions that happen tomorrow. I think you want to say, that people need to start seeing the fetus as important as the born child. That aint gonna happen. Viewing sex in a diff way wont do a thing. Ppl who use protection can still get pregnant. Shit happens.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro: "ARe you kidding me...society has impacted...that isnt saying shit!"
Are you claiming that society does not impact how we view things?
Do you honestly believe that the media, public education facilities, advertising, t.v./radio broadcasts, film, music, other forms of entertainment like games, do not impact how we view things?
Do you honestly believe that groups with an agenda do not turn to such areas to affect our perception as a society? Their writings prove otherwise
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sand: "It certainly wont affect the abortions that happen tomorrow"
I made that point when I stated "It took a quite a few decades for us to attain it, it will take a few for us to break free from it"
Not much done in any area will have a big effect in one day. This short-sighted thinking we have has brought us to this point were we see abortion commonplace when a mere 40 yrs ago it was a horrifying concept to us.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sand:"I think you want to say that people need to start seeing the fetus as important as the born child"
No, what I DO say, since you brought it up (it is not along the lines we were speaking of but is true also) is that people need to RETURN to seeing the fetus as important as the born child, for that is how it has always been. In fact it was considered MORE horrifying to kill the unborn then the born. Ever see the movie "The Seven Samurai"? It has a great line which is a good example of this
Minxcomix 2 years ago
You can give the same argument for war... do you feel the need to defend all the ppl who die unfairly as a result of that.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Except for a few sociopaths, we already recognize the humanity of those who die in war, and the harm of war, and still it continues, right or wrong.
However if society AGAIN recognized the humanity of the fetus (as it has done so from time beginning until the recent brainwashing of the last few decades), abortion could not continue, for there is no justification for the horror of it.
For abortion to continue to be legal, it is vital that the humanity of the unborn be not recognized.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Yeah and we recognize aboriton as well...the world already has 6 billion ppl. Get over it.
No one denies the fetus is human,why the hell ldo you think it is difficult for women to do. Lifes circumstances cause that choice. It is not so simple to 'just have it'. And you have is talk.
kmcl11 2 years ago
kmc: "the world already has 6 billion ppl. Get over it. "
What point are you trying to make here. There could be a few. Please clarify which point you are trying to make. Thank you
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kmc: "No one denies the fetus is human"
On the contrary, quite a few people do deny the fetus is human life.
So now that I am aware that you recognize the fetus's humanity, are you telling us that you say it is o.k. for a woman to kill her human child because that human inconveniences her for 9 months?
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kmc: "why the hell ldo you think it is difficult for women to do?"
because:
-deep down we know it is wrong.
-society instead of supporting women in crisis pregnancies do not see the importance of doing so since such women can 'just abort'.
-90% of the women who choose abortion say they did so because they believed it was their ONLY choice.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
A society where most women abort because they feel it's their ONLY choice is NOT a "pro-choice" society, rather a "pro-abortive" society!
With few exceptions, only the prolife orgs are doing actual work to fix that, trying to get more choices and support to women in crisis pregnancies, and we're getting fought at every point. Why? Because less abortions means less $ for those in the abortion industry who have a lot of $ to promote their agenda
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kmc: "Lifes circumstances cause that choice."
It is not "life's circumstances".
Women become pregnant when men and women have have sexual intercourse during the 5 days of a woman's cycle when she is fertile. And most of the time pregnancies do not result even then.
So except in the case of rape which constitute less then 1% of all abortions, women are pregnant because of a choice they have already made.
This is not "circumstance", but rather a result of a choice, an action decided upon
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kcm:" It is not so simple to 'just have it'."
Never said it was. However in testimonies from pro-choice men, many have said "the woman can just have an abortion" (and some go on to say, 'why should I have to pay child support for a child she choose not to abort? We agreed not to have children, she should've just aborted!)
Also women have spoken of being told to "just have an abortion" by their boyfriends, husbands, parents, or employers who find reasons for firing them if they do not.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
The "just have an abortion" crowd is NOT the prolife viewpoint. Many in the prolife groups ARE post-abortive women. Having an abortion is what made them prolife.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
"And you have is talk."
That's all that is available for me to do on YouTube, 'talk' and watch.
I know that you know my life extends beyond youtube, because I am confident that yours does also. Please admit that you know as much about my life beyond youtube as I do yours. Telling me all I have is talk when you know nothing about my life is ...well, I think you can figure it out
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sand: "Viewing sex in a diff way wont do a thing."
Oh but it has, it does, and it will.
"Ppl who use protection can still get pregnant."
Hence the whole reason why the increase use of artificial birth control has increased abortion
"Shit happens"
Good example of how warped our society is in regards to sex and pregnancy. This is only a recent development to consider pregnancy as "shit", or a disease to be avoided at all costs, even to the point of harming women's bodies and health
Minxcomix 2 years ago
BC has led to less abortions. You will never win this one. Man had been doing this sice the beginning of time. YOu fail to see it. Spend time helping those poor kids that are already here in foster care, hosp, etc. Stop being obsessed w what will never stop.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sand: "BC has led to less abortions."
Granted it is hard to look up the studies that show this as most of the studies that pop up on an internet search are sponsored by those who manufacture BC and perform abortions. If people stopped using Artificial BC, and started using NFP more and as a result had less abortions, many rich people would be out of a good deal of $ as BC is the biggest moneymaker in prescriptions, and abortions which is very related is a big $maker too.
It is logical.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
However I have kept recommending you to look up the actual tables of how many abortions have been performed next to tables of birth control use, and you see them rise and fall in tandem. This is what convinced me. You cannot argue with the facts.
The less BC used, the less abortions.
It is logical...
Minxcomix 2 years ago
No its not. If a woman has sex w/o and gets pregnant , will she automatically want the kid...no. That is illorgical.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
"If a woman has sex w/o and gets pregnant , will she automatically want the kid...no"
That is not what I said, you missed my point entirely.
I have to go right now, I cannot write more right now
Minxcomix 2 years ago
The less BC used, the less abortions.
If people have sex accepting the responsibility of the risk they are taking, if the pregnancy happens they will not abort as they have already accepted the responsibility.
If people have sex using BC thinking that they have a right to sex without the natural consequential risk, if a pregnancy occurs, they think they have a right not to be pregnant and are more likely to choose abortion.
Abortion is running away from the natural consequences of our actions
Minxcomix 2 years ago
People can do what they want. Accept it! The less BC used the more abortions. Why ? BC not all women who get pregnant want to be. My own grandmother had 12 children! Did she want to...NO! The woman decides my friend , not you!
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro: "BC not all women who get pregnant want to be"
Artificial Birth Control is not our only option!
have you heard of NFP? Not the archaic 'rhythm method', but NFP?
Chances are really good you have not.
The reason why is because no one makes money off of it. And ABC (artificial birth control) is the biggest prescriptive money maker by far, tho anti-depressants are catching up... that too is related as the Pill causes depression in women and many are on anti-depressants.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
ABC is not necessary. NFP has proven over and over to be just as if not more effective then the Pill,
Couples who use NFP have a 99.3% effectiveness rate when avoiding pregnancy, a 81% rate in trying to acquire pregnancy (including infertile couples!), a .01% rate in abortion if an unwanted pregnancy occurs, and .01% child abuse rate (remember the argument between us?), and a 4% divorce rate.
Once again proving, that when we work with Nature with her design, things work for the best, naturally.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
whereas, once again, when you look at the tables of ABC use next to the tables of abortion rates, next to the tables of child abuse rates, next to the tables of divorce rates, they rise in fall in very similar rates. They are related.
This again proves, when we think we are smarter then our natural design, Nature proves us wrong with forcing us to deal with the consequences of our actions, and it is never pleasant.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
ABC users think they have a right to sex w/out the natural consequences. When the natural consequences sneak thru despite our attempts to handicap our bodies by drugged sterilization, we get upset, after all, don't we have a right to sex w/out dealing with the natural consequences?
Hence more abortions.
It is like sending out a letter to someone saying "we are getting married, you are NOT invited, do not come". When they show up, you kick them out.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
who cares if they are aborted thats life.....there is no solution. giving all these stats mean nothing.....
kmcl11 2 years ago
"who cares if they are aborted thats life..."
no that's death
ByTheirFruits 2 years ago 3
no that's LIFE!!! Our life
sandroeleven 2 years ago
Sandro, please explain how abortion is your life.
ByTheirFruits 2 years ago
You made a comment "no that's death". I responded.
sandroeleven 2 years ago
sandro,
yes, you responded.
I was asking you to explain the response.
ByTheirFruits 2 years ago
Rather people working with their bodies to avoid pregnancy (NFP), not only have healthier bodies, but by the very nature of the practice, they accept a pregnancy, tho rare, may occur
So on the .7% chance that a pregnancy DOES result, almost all do not abort. They are responsible for the consequence of their action.
Much like a bridal couple simply not sending an invite to someone they do not want there.If the person shows up anyways, the won't kick him out, they just set up another plate
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Your raTIONale is very poor. You have no grip on real life. Prayer /talking to someone about change in sexual practices(what a joke) is not going to work. I notice you said nothing about the other issues mentioned. Typical
kmcl11 2 years ago
kmc: Your raTIONale is very poor. You have no grip on real life.
You have popped into an ongoing discussion. Have you read all the interaction between sandro and I?
kmc: You have no grip on real life.
I disagree, I think I have quite a good grip on real life, just not a short-sighted view on it.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kmc: talking to someone about change in sexual practices(what a joke) is not going to work.
I did not claim that just talking to others was going to work. That indeed is silly. Much more brought us to this point, it will take the same to make us healthy again.
Many factors, including but not limited to talking has changed our sexual practices from one extreme (the Victorian view) to another extreme (present view). Neither extreme is healthy and we should strive to become healthy
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Changing our sexual practices has been going on since the early 1940s. It took on a full fledge shouting and propaganda in the '60s. Now we are suffering the consequences of the action of going to an opposite extreme.
The middle ground is what we need. A healthy respect for each other as men and women which INCLUDES our fertility. Full womanhood, full manhood.
Nature has made us the way we are for a reason. When we alter that for any reason, we become as the environment: pretty messed up
Minxcomix 2 years ago
kmc: I notice you said nothing about the other issues mentioned.
Once again, have you read all the interaction?
And yes I didnt address all of the issues, because to do so would be many posts. Neither has sandro addressed all my issues.
kmc: Typical
This is typical of all people on youtube debates due to the set up of the word limit on youtube comments
Minxcomix 2 years ago
"Child abuse happens for many reasons. Poverty is one of them."
Absolutely.
Abortion does not resolve poverty.
Abortion is not an answer to poverty.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Studies show that the "wanted" children (either present or future) who live with women who have abortions have a much higher incidence of being abused AFTER the abortion.
Just to name 2 of many:
~"Relationship Between Induced Abortion and Child Abuse and Neglect: Four Studies," Pre- and Perinatal Psychology Journal 8(1):43-63 Fall 1993;
~"Associations between voluntary and involuntary forms of perintal loss and child maltreatment among low-income mothers," Acta Paediatrica 94, 2005.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
sandro, your statement: "support of choice"
IS nonsense unless you believe that abortion is the ONLY choice women make and/or making abortion illegal would mean no women would choose one.
Minxcomix 2 years ago
Tiny % . . .today there is a report that they have got a cure for Bubble Syndrome disease. Tomorrow who knows what will be discovered. There is never a REQUIREMENT to destroy life. In fact look at the pitiful results from embryionic research compared to adult cell applications. And don't whine about no fed funds -- plenty of private funds are there. You remind me of the old Dr. Mengele, the one who pioneered experimentation on "subhuman" life.
mattlewis66 3 years ago 4
Mother Teresa offered to take all unwanted babies, all of them when she was here in the US. Did NBC report that? Her Order continues on. Ask anyone of them to take care of a baby -- No matter who that baby is, and they will. They see God in every human. Your attitude degrades us all by treating innocent human life as so much waste. You don't even offer simple painkillers to cut the pain of saline or d/c or suction. I wonder if you would as generous as Obama and offer a Comfort Room.
mattlewis66 3 years ago 3
Her order does continue on, and I appreciate what she did in nurturing people die. It's nice that she rescued a baby from a garbage can. In countries where abortion is not available, where contraception is not available, and where women (and their babies) can potentially be harmed by their culture, what you propose is not an option. Ironically, thanks to conservative Christian meddling with NGOs and the gag rule, abortion rates have gone up drastically in poor countries.
Mangina9000 3 years ago