Freedom From Religion - Part 4: A Final Appeal

[delinkme]

OK were the heck is part 5

[marieilaria418]

i am not an initiate of santeria/lucumi but at a cuban i am familiar with it of course. santeria pervades all cuban culture and much of caribbean/latin american culture. i know the orishas, i know certain folkloric stories, etc. it's a rich and beautiful practice. it is full of culture. i would liken it to hinduism and catholicism because there is a belief in a one true god but most practitioner seek the help or orishas/saints/demi-gods to help them with the everyday.

[marieilaria418]

...you should educate yourself more on lucumi/santeria and other african diasporic religions. i feel like you should attend certain services and talk to practioners with an open mind to understand two sides of the story. i am white and latina. so i understand that for anglo america it may appear foreign, pagan, etc to see an animal sacrifice but others need to be more open-minded to the beliefs, practices, and traditions of other cultures. try not to be so close-minded.

[marieilaria418]

to outsiders the lucumi/santeria religion can appear primitive, barbaric, etc. but really it's a religion like any other. and i think when you deeper behind the meaning of certain traditions/rituals (ie animal sacrifice) that you will find a profound philosophy/theology that is equal to any other religion. and just like any other religion (christianity, judaism, islam, buddhism, etc.) there are practitioners and priests that probably don't represent the religion as it should be. i feel like...

[marieilaria418]

wow. you really went to a lot of trouble to stop these santeros. i understand that melendez probably wasn't the most diplomatic or the nicest person to deal with but really? i just wonder what your true motives were. it appears that you are attacking a belief that you do not understand. i see that you reached out to certain groups but i mean...i feel like after doing this project that you should take the time to educate yourself about a religion/cultural practice that you have no idea about.

[gatomjp]

@marieilaria418 I appreciate your comments. The issue at stake here is not a deeper understanding of the religion. I believe I did research it's origins quite a bit. However, whether I understood it or not, the practices that Melendez was performing were illegal in that part of the city.

The issue is ultimately that the law was applied differently to him than it would have been to anyone else simply because of religion. That is wrong.

[naiely81503]

where is the next part? I don't see it. Was it taken down? :( I want to know how this all ended.

[kutulu6]

If this individual is breaking the ethics and laws of Santeria than the Orishas will exact their punishment. I know its hard for you non believers to understand but thats the truth I have seen many who have defied the Divine Laws and were severly punished. If on the other hand there is harrasment because of religious prejudice than expect the wrath of the Orishas to be exacted, sounds cruel but that is the way things go.

[janhanjanhan]

Melendez is obviously dangerous lunatic. What I don't understand is why would anybody go through this much trouble just becouse religious privileges bothered him? If animal rights would bother him I would understand. From what I heard it seams that Mike wouldn't have problem with goat slaughter if anybody could do it, what seems to be bothering him is the fact that somebody has the privilege to do this because of religious beliefs. I think animal rights should be above religious rights.

[harrychestwigg]

whatever happen to part 5?

[philnoll]

Has freedom of religion gone too far? Is the Islamification of America under way? Perhaps 9/11 was just Islam saying "we run new york."

The blood runs deep. And we are being relentlessly persecuted for non-religious beliefs, or as the leftists have so cleverly coined it, religious intolerance.

As usual, every right you have is an extra duty, and the political issues are all based on the economic brackets of each neighborhood. Sad. True. Universal.

[gatomjp]

@philnoll Well put!!

[curt4187]

If I ever go to court about weed, I'm going to say I'm a Buddhist and a priest... Think they could still charge me? If not, I'm gonna start growing tomorrow!

[vjyancey]

In conclusion..your girlfriend made the "CHOICE" to move out of her home. It is clear that the sacrifices was done on the Priest's property and not hers. I must admit that animal sacrifice can be disturbing to some. But the sacrifice is a case of "freedom of religion" while the teachers "choice" to relocate is "freedom from religion."

[gatomjp]

@vjyancey May I remind you that the keeping or handling of farm animals was against the zoning regulations of that area. Would she have been allowed to raise llamas in her backyard, for instance? No she would not. Did we really have all the "choices" that you seem to think we did?

[FamousRaia]

I know what its like to feel alone! To not be able to sleep because of disturbing circumstances.

[edwdixon5]

Well, it wasn't "just" religion, Mike. He also happened to be a bully and a coward. Sucker punching a guy who's trying to bring some reason to the matter and threatening a lone woman, while sneaking around and damaging her property? I don't know much about what he' s a priest of, but I know a punk when I see one.

[FamousRaia]

@edwdixon5 Exactly! This guy was made the teacher feel unsafe in her own home. Threats and vandalism is a crime!

[Maresonic]

The "Film Maker" keeps referring to himself in third person,

He keeps referring to his girlfriend as "the teacher". This is depersonalization. I could understand if it was a matter of anonymity but he says his name while one the phone. This guy created more drama for "the teacher" than her neighbour did. Why didnt the "film maker" help remove " the teacher "from the situation. He created the drama that "forced" her from her home. get a life, - Get medication guy.

[FamousRaia]

@Maresonic wow. Created more drama for the teacher? That's the whole point. People try to vary away from drama so they don't stand up for what they value. I am proud of his girlfriend who was a teacher that was willing to speak about such acts. She may have helped someone along the way, and make one feel as if they are not alone. Are we supposed to just sit in silence to avoid drama? The only drama he created was trying to confront him to stop killing, because it was an annoyance.

[Maresonic]

@FamousRaia

She (the film maker) didn't speak out, did she speak at all? on a personal level

The "film Maker" doest seem like a much support to "the teacher"

but more of a hindrance just sayin'

Is the issue annoyance? should we all act like this when we are annoyed were you standing up for animal rights? Nope -as you said it was an annoyance. You can't control your neighbours. Close the blinds. and give the teacher a back rub.

[gatomjp]

@Maresonic You missed the point entirely.

[Dustin8872]

I thought sick stuff like this died out centuries ago. I guess there's no hope for some people.

I don't think I should complain about the fundamentalist Christians in my area as much as much as I do. Sure, they like to think they're better than anyone else, but they're not sick-minded.

And yes, you can call me closed-minded, prejudiced, etc., but animal sacrifice is sick. Shit like this is what I would expect from a tribal society.

[1paige]

if you do s/a reply to me okeii i want to ask you abute S/A if you do not mind my freinds mom does it and my friend is not alwd to tell she older but if you can take to me thats cool thank you .

[puertoricoindepencia]

Im sorry but this is really not illegal as long as he killed the goats right, I'm a Santero and everything seems okay to me and my neighbours don't complain about sacrifice

[gatomjp]

@puertoricoindepencia Thank you for you comment but there was no livestock allowed in this neighborhood. Shouldn't everyone have to follow the same rules?

[PutaLoca11]

You're a really cheesy bastard! Why didn't you help the teacher out and move her into your crappy place? Or get a place together? You're a fucking miserat!

[FamousRaia]

@PutaLoca11 em.. because she wanted to be a home owner. He went back and explained that. She didn't want to leave. She wanted to have a home of her own, in a peaceful neighborhood. He never said she couldn't come stay with him. Thats not the point. The point was, this lady wanted to live in her own home, and this guy was killing animals next door, and she could hear it.. it was scary. She has every right to live in peace. Why don't you ask how she is doing ??

[TheSaritaXD]

lol well i just use my common sence, i mean im not even santera butt i am very intrested in it and might do ocha one day, butt yea, i just think logically... i clean my house with herbs and everything butt i dont go and scream and throw things out in the middle of the streets... i guess it just depends on the type of person... and yea as long as we all respect each others and out relligions, things should get better.. and leanr how to act around the ppl that arent from our religions.

[FamousRaia]

@TheSaritaXD  Thank you! : )

[TheSaritaXD]

well yuu do have a point there, i would have used a little bit more umm how do yuu call it, like i would have kept it a little more secret, i wouldnt like it if some guy/girl went out on the streets holding a cross screaming at everyone that we need to go to church.. and i would have closed the door to the shed the dude had or would have just done my orisha room inside the house so that nobody would see or hear anything.. butt yea, we have taken freedom of religion a little too far.

[mikepulcinella]

You are a reasonable person and I'm sure that if we had been living next door to you we wouldn't have had a problem. I do not want to take away anyone's freedom to worship.

[FamousRaia]

Like Mike said, where does one person's freedom begin to take away another person's freedom? Sure, The first amendment gives us the freedom of religion, but when this freedom disturbs other people's rights, or belief's, is it right? Hector could have mad a bargain. He could have toned it down, done it quietly. Did it somewhere else.. I don't know..

[TheSaritaXD]

k, i respect what yuur saying mike and i understand where yuur coming from. yuu would need to know the religion and everything involved with it to fully understand that some of the things yuu said were wrong, butt thats ok cuz like i said yuur not part of the religion. im also glad that ochundayo made a video response. now people will see both sides. butt again i respect yuu and yuur videos and nice job. plz dont hesitate to reply. i would be fully honored to hear from yuu. muchlove from hialeah

[mikepulcinella]

Thank you for your kindness and understanding. I am aware that my knowledge of the religion is incomplete. However, the issue here is not whether or not I understand the religion perfectly, but if ANY religion should be allowed to bypass the laws of a community. Have we taken freedom of religion too far?

[777DLB]

@mikepulcinella This is exactly the point. Religious freedoms aside, the rotting carcasses and stench are something that no one should have to put up with. Did the neighbors ever offer to remove the waste instead of letting it sit there?

[RompeChocha305]

mike getting justice ain't gonna make the teacher get back with u, ur blowing this whole thing up.

[StrongmanTaylor]

Mike all the FFR videos have been top notch. Remember to post on MM and let the other guys know.....

Easton

[oshundayo]

Hey Mike, just watched your vid... Thanks for posting at the beginning that this was not a response to my series of videos. This will eliminate confusion that this is a continued attack after our dialogue we've been developing.

The ending was a nice touch to what's coming ahead.

For those of you who are not aware, Mr Pulcinella and I are developing a diaglogue where he and I can jointly put all these debatable and controversial issues into a balanced perspective that both sides can respect.

[mikepulcinella]

Yes, the words "illegal activity" are used in this video once again. That is not a rebuttal to your videos but merely reflects my viewpoint as of a month or so ago when I started to put this together. I felt I had to finish this off to show the full story before we went into a dialog.