Overture to Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg

[baroqueman1]

This is a fine recording of a stirring work. However, the imagery is very disturbing even now, although I am aware of the fact that nowadays a number of Jewish conductors/ musicians play Wagner's works. I trust that the pictures shown on the video are meant to portray the macabre irony of the whole Nazi situation, as opposed to being pro-Nazi. Certainly the last image epitomizes the horrifying truth which belies Wagner's beautiful music and indeed perhaps Wagner's own outlook.

[hamster6791]

Could You not spoil such a great music with such a disgusting last picture? Nethertheless, thanks for posting this Masterpiece.

[bag3lmonst3r]

Why in fk are you ranting on about sculpture by Breker, Auschwitz, Troost, nix nix nix...

Why aren't you telling us the most important thing : which orchestra is playing this?

Nazi skinhead pieceashit

[williamofocham]

@bag3lmonst3r

1. Chicago Symphony ORch. conduced Solti.

2. This is not the most important thing.

3. I am not a Nazi - watch it until the end.

[MrAlexKeaton]

I love this music.

[guinguette07]

This juxtaposition is absurd. Richard WAGNER died in 1883 (Hitler was not even born).

[scientistpatrick]

Actually, although Wagner died in 1883, he had a great influence on Hitler.

[mrhorn2001]

right, so you can connect hitler to wagner but you cannot connect wagner to hitler. thus the juxtaposition is indeed stupid. everybody tries to do that simply because hitler was a wagner fan. it doesn't mean wagner would have been a hitler fan.

[vHumboldt77]

@scientistpatrick --that's as far-fetched as to say that George Washington had an influence on Herbert Hoover....A simple fact makes this type of silly statements (no offense) moot --Daniel Baremboim, probably one of the best orchestra conductors of the present day, himself an Argentinian of Jewish religion, has had the guts of bringing Wagner to Israel. There you have a free-spirited man that knows to do away with people's prejudices and values the essential, not the circumstancial....

[scientistpatrick]

@vHumboldt77 It obviously isn't as far-fetched as George Washington influencing Herbert Hoover, although even that isn't absurd at all; without George Washington, there would be no country in which Herbert Hoover was president.

[vHumboldt77]

@scientistpatrick --yes, everything's related to everything....but you got my point about the absurd of demonizing Wagner's music, because a regime the guy didn't even dream of used his music for its own dreadful purposes...

[scientistpatrick]

@vHumboldt77 I'm afraid that you have misunderstood me, then, because I'm not demonizing Wagner's music; I am just pointing out that Wagner was an anti-semitic, and of course Baremboim wouldn't agree with Wagner on almost anything related to Israel, Judaism, or just anything semitic in general. The opera (to the extent of my knowledge) does not contain any anti-semitic quotes or "hidden messages", and I am not asserting that.

[nekokuroninja]

Alemania peleaba por su gente y tenian honor y valor, y sin embargo por el otro lado, los aliados mastros de las mentiras y difamacion, asesinaron niños, mujeres y ancianos, como hoy en dia.

[mrcoolgenius]

Hitler played this at many of his rallies. He also played Mahler, until it was unearthed that Mahler was Jewish. Hitler just wanted something coherently German, not something nationalistic in itself. Die Meistersinger isn't an opera about nationalism, and National Socialism certainly didn't influence it, even though Wagner was a known anti semite. The opera shouldn't be discredited just because Hitler used Wagner's music so much or even for Wagner's ideologies. It's still great music!

[3tristan]

I agree. It is so you have explained here.

[nor888vast695]

The truth of the matter is that there are probably 10 million young men from north europe & N. american that wouldn't hesitate to fight for Germany. Now y'all should understand that There is big Germany & smaller German states. 600,000 soldiers of their own Freewill. Foreign men were mostly posted in the Waffen SS. Waffen SS: another name for shock troops. The Waffen SS isn't guilty of anything. The Latvian SS men march every year to commenorate their service. It pisses the Russians off.

[RichardAtwoodRichard]

It's only sound, guys. It's whatever YOU do with it. Fission makes energy; YOU choose to use it for lightbulbs, or for bombs.

[alexeyev2001]

Wagner was a giant as a Hitler! You are all wrong!

[nor888vast695]

If Germany had not be treated so dispicably in the 1920s WWII may never have happened. This era has been over for a long time. If the US would stop its wars of aggression so a select few can loot a country of it's treasue we would have no enemies. You can lay this at the feet of George I & son. The Russians have made it clear that they had been treated shitty by the US and resented it. The US has nothing: no manuf. infrastructure; dilapidated transportation system; lying leaders; war criminals.

[COAchilles]

After WWI the US under Wilson tried to organize a reasonable peace treaty between Germans French and British, the French were blood thirsty after the long war and the previous century of war with Germany Hungary and the Prussians. With British sourness towards Germany the talks were pretty much in favor of punishing Germany as much as possible. Wilson then tried to make a "United Nations" like organization but failed in its purpose when congress told Wilson to stop pursuing a peaceful Europe.

[COAchilles]

The treaty of Virsallies turned into a joke and it did not help that Russia was also in favour of throwing the book at Germany. The resulting "League of Nations" became a tool in which they could further impose unfair rules on the losers of WWI instead of a mean to prevent a Great War from ever happening again like Wilson intended.

such cruel treatment made it easy for Hitler to use Germany for his own gains.

[3tristan]

Wagner the giant and Hitler the misfit.

Belongs not together.

OK, Wagner was antisemiet. And so was Martin Luther and much other famous people. But they were no killers.....

[nor888vast695]

You should read the history of Jewish kommissars massacring Russians in the 1917-1945 era especially in the 1930s. There you'll find the true killers. And if you read close enough about Vidkun Quisling you would understand why he became a Nazi and so would any other europeans if they had seen what Quisling had seen in russia.

[3tristan]

bla, bla, bla.....

[nor888vast695]

The truth does hurt. There aren't any more Nazis & no more commisars killing Russians. Why don't you go run and pout in your little corner of the world.

[nor888vast695]

10 million dead kulaks kinda puts these kommissars into the same league as the "Death's Head" SS who guarded the camps. Same thing happened here in the Civil War. Henry Wirz, a Swiss immigrant, was the commander of the camp at Andersonville, GA. He was hung as a war criminal after the war. Lee got his citizenship back. There was no way the South could exit from that war or treat the Union prisoners better. The troops in the field had zip also. The South bit off more than they could ever chew.

[MattiasXL]

The 'true' killers? Anyone who kills, regardless of the circumstances, is a killer.

[COAchilles]

I'm not sure what massacre you are talking about, After Alexander the II and before Soviet Russia the jews were treated with fierce antisemitism largely due in part to Alexander the III bigoted opinions of them during that time a great many jews left Russia.

[mingweicello]

who is the conductor of the recording?

[chrshammer]

It's not Hans Knappertbusch, he is my favorite. I especially like Rhine Journey. I would guess Solti or Karajan or one of the other generic Wagner conductors. They are good, but at times they are lacking.

[nemo1620]

Monumental Greco-Roman architecture that reduces humans to the scale of ants; statues of stony-faced nude musclemen -- the fantasies of man trying to convince himself and the world that he is a living god.

Compare it with Frederick the Great's palace Sans Souci.

[shachar10]

The world should not forget what happend then. Yet, despite his antisemeitism, Wagner's music does not belong to the nazies. Stephan Hocking also enjoyed his music. So why not showing the Spheres instead? It is a music which moves the planets, is it not?

[RedSeaView]

Indeed Wagner was popular on Third Reich, and as i know Hitler wanted that magnificent piece of music to be played at the begining of every party conference - but yet Wagner died about the time Hitler was born - so why spoiling and connecting this beautifull music with the atrocities of that era?

[williamofocham]

Wagner had an enormous influence on Hitler. Not the other way round, I agree.

[nor888vast695]

Hitler was very close to the family Wagner. Wagner's son was a queer but he fathered 3 children with his "wife." The wife was courted by Hitler but she felt that he hadn't risen for enough politically so she turned down his proposal. The world might have been different but we'll never know.

[partmaudite]

What is the relationship between Die Meistersinger and any of these images?

Please explain. Die Meistersinger is about love, the limits and uses of tradition, and is set in a peaceful little town that has only a nightwatchman as an authority figure. German fascism is a vitalist philosophy of nature and will attempting to service mass mobilization for counter-revolution, militarism, nationalism, and statism.

Man..this is the dumbest montage on Youtube.

[BoogiepopDosntLaught]

I beleive the pictures are just there to emphasize on the song's German background, and even though it wasn't quite a good thing, Nazism is a large portion of it's past.

Becides, music videos like these are not made for the eyes, they are what you close off everything to and just listen, or work on another browser. You should try to just enjoy yourself for a while.

[williamofocham]

No the pictures are there to remind us of the close connection between Wagner's music and National Socialism.

[williamofocham]

The opera was undeniably used as propaganda tool by Hitler. The stirring nationalism of the music is moving & at the same time repelling. The deliberate anti-semitic portrayal of Beckmesser is well-known (compare Mimi in the Ring). The relationship between the Wagner family and Hitler &c &c.

I have liked this piece for many years but it has a sinister background.

[partmaudite]

Much of what you said is of dubious merit. First, most Wagner scholars are aware that the connection between Nazism and Wagner is minimal and did not go much beyond Hitler. Parts of the Meistersinger were used in The Triumph of the Will but not the parts above.

[partmaudite]

I do not think we should adopt Hitler's misunderstanding of this opera. He may have seen nationalist themes in it but they are not very strong and instead the opera seems to be a discussion on the merits and limits of tradition.

[partmaudite]

The relationship between Wagner's daughter in law and Hitler should not be used to suggest a connection between Wagner's music, his themes, and the philosophy of German fascism.

Beckmesser was clearly not a Jewish character and neither is Mimi. There is no textual evidence that these are representations of Wagner's image of Jews. These issues are discussed at length in the postscript to Magee's "The Tristan Chord."

[partmaudite]

Your last statement that the Meistersinger has a sinister background is silly.  Even if it was used for sinister purposes, its background was not sinister. Please check a timeline. Pay attention to the date this was written and the dates associated with the rise of German fascism.

And have you listened to the entire opera? Please tell me the fascist themes in that opera. I will listen.

[williamofocham]

One important theme of the opera is nationalism. Within a year of the premiere the opera was performed across Germany in 1870. As one of the most popular and prominent German operas during the Unification of Germany in 1871, it became a symbol of patriotic German art, and Hans Sachs' final warning at the end of Act 3 on the need to preserve German art from foreign threats became a rallying point for German nationalism.