Watson and his little clan of scam artists made over 77.5 million US from their fund raising which magically just vanishes because I see no difference in anything relating to the seal hunt.
As to the Paul Watson quote at the end, I say BULLSHIT. He spends every day he has either on his ship, or fundraising so he can help save endangered sea animals. The amount of money he makes from it goes into the Irwin, or one of his other projects. He's a modern day super fucking hero
Most Newfoundland sealers would go out and kill seals even if there was no profit in it. They just enjoy the feeling of killing small defenseless animals, it makes them feel like they are "real men", when, in fact, they are just cowards...
@Chris153758 On what basis do you dare to say such a thing. The people that are sealing do it strictly as a living, a hard living, a living that has been a part of our heritage for a long long time. Men went on the ice to make a living for their families and died in the process, it is NOT done for pleasure, it's done for survival. It's an honest living and not one man on the ice can be called a coward.
@theworldofnintendo middle of a bar dt?? If he's a real man himself he'd go into the middle of one of our outport communities and see how they respond.... That, will be an ASS KICKIN' he'll never forget
@Chris153758 Don;t know how I missed your babbled nonsense but to answer your statements. Recently prices for pelts went down dramatically and most sealers never went out to the hunt. Wonder how long it will be before the government announces a cull. To make the comparison between controlling human populations and other animal populations is ridiculous. We manage other species based on our impact on the world around us. To not do so would be highly irresponsible.
@Chris153758 Yeah Chris, they risk their lives just for the thrill of it. It has nothing to do with feeding their families or sheltering them. Why don't you go have a nice bowl of arsenic?
Humans cannot even control their own population growth, yet some humans have the arrogance to believe that they have the right to "manage" the populations of other species.
@Chris153758 Imagine that, unsubstantiated, unintelligent hate filled comments from the anti side. How typical. I think I would have a heart attack if I ever saw any statements from the anti side based on fact and showed the slightest shred of knowledge on the issue. The seals killed are independent animals thus they can not be considered baby animals.
@waterdropprod Most of the seals killed are less than one month old. They are unable to swim and feed themselves, so they are extremely vulnerable and can hardly be described as "independent". The young seals are also in a docile, sedentary state, which is a physiological adaptation to help them conserve their fat stores. The seal hunters take advantage of the young seal's vulnerability, which makes them barbarians in my book. Feel free to have a heart attack any time you like.
the fact of the matter is the canadian harp seal is the perfect cover child for animal rights groups, and it has absolutely nothing to do with the welfare of the species itself. The fact that these animal rights groups focus all their attention on a species which is not by any means endangered is appalling, and shows that these groups have little regard for the protection of animals, which don't gain them publicity or funds.
YOu cite Paul Watson, but there are greedy people everywhere, unfortunatelly. But again, the personal greed of one person does not negate the legitimacy of the overall goal of the protesters. You are not logical in your argument, AT ALL. Obviously you are content with the sitution but a lot of peole think differently and are not into generously exploiting nature.
ofizs, nature is not being exploited my friend. A cull of seals is going to happen whether there is an industry attached to it or not. BTW, Wally Watson was talking about all seal hunt protest groups. Effectively what people beleive today is based on 40 year old lies.
Plus what "human" conduct means to you is clearly not the same what a lot of us would think. It is a subjective term. Just because accoding to you protesters (but who knows what other causes individuals support , by the way) do not take up the cause of saving all the endanger species does not make their fight against baby seal slaughter any less valid.
ofizs, sure it does. So we stand by and watch species go extinct because there is more money to be made fighting for well populated species. I call that highly irresponsible. As stated above, seals, like kangaroos and many many other species around the world will continue to be culled regardless of the industry being shut down. Same sealers killing the same seals, only difference being it will animal rights groups will be able to stop lying as the hunt will truly be 100% government funded.
So if a species is not endangered, it's ok to kill them. Why?? Because humans have been generously killing all kinds of animals so we should not even question this practice? Baby seals are killed only for their fur, for greed and vanity. Who cares if there is plenty of them. That does not make it right to kill helpless creatures in a cruel way. Hakapis can be effective, but it depends on the person who uses it. A lot of time the strike is not efficient and they skin them alive.
It is the protesters that are claiming the seals are threatened to exaggerate the impact of a hunt that does not in any way threaten them.
1.4 Million of them are born each year.
Seal meat is consumed in Newfoundland/Labrador and Quebec. And if it weren't for the propagandists lying about heavy metal contamination the meat would sell more.
The EFSA report commissioned by the EU could not establish a failure rate and in the end recommended training. The removal of the hunt is unnecessary.
ofizs, why not? Seals are not babies when killed, they are killed mainly to control populations but unlike the EU we use the animal for fur products, meat, oil and maybe even heart valves soon. Most who use the hakapik are professional about what they do and a few cases caught on video by animal rights groups does not represent the hunt. There is none and nor has there ever been any proof of skinning alive.
Obviously you don't have a clue about wildlife management, why it is done and how it actually helps wildlife species. Do you drive a car? Use wood based products? Use plastic? Own imported goods? Eat vegetables and grains? If the answer to any of these is yes then you support the killing of animals.
Oh my God, how the animals and plants could survive all millenniums without wildlife
management?
I don't support all the suffer of farm animals and wild animals cause I don't eat animal products.
I'm a vegan. I try to avoid everything I can in order to save the animals. I never killed an animal with my car till today because I drive very carefully. I don't use planes. I eat only ecologically produced food.
What are you doing to save the planet and to avoid the suffering of animals?
You do understand how human civilization has changed over the "millenniums" right? Increase in pollution and all that which we didn't get from riding horses etc. let me break it down for you in simple terms, we have a much greater impact on the world around us today than we did even 50 years ago. Through the use of this thing called science we know that for the most part, the animals we hunt will be dead by natural causes anyway, much more suffering.
Ecologically produced food? Very good seeing all food originating from plant or animal can be classified as such. You did not answer the rest of my questions. which leads me to beleive you support the killing of animals. What do I do? I recycle, reduce the amount of crap I send to landfills, cut back on the amount I drive, rescued multiple animals from shelters, give to the SPCA and on occasion I hunt which I think is avoiding the suffering of animals...for sure you won't understand that one.
In a nutshell, wildlife management is the practice of identifying how many of a species should exist in a particular area based on available food source and other factors. This is done to maintain a healthy population as a weak population is susceptible to starvation & disease. Depending on the scientific findings, hunting quotas are either raised,lowered or non-existent. Decisions based on science instead of emotion in relation to caring for animals.
In 2002, the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association found that 98% of all seals were killed in an acceptably humane manner. Similarly, a 2005 report funded by the World Wildlife Fund concluded that, the Canadian harp seal hunt is professional and highly regulated by comparison with seal hunts in Greenland and the North Atlantic. It has the potential to serve as a model to improve humane practice and reduce seal suffering within the other hunts.
Coffin, if people would rather confront this vid in closed forums as I have seen rather then here in a truly open forum then that speaks volumes about the quality of their arguments.
And the absence of your comments on the videos addressing the invalidity of this one speaks volumes of the quality of your own arguments. Once challenged, they fall flat.
Coffin, for one I do not have the time to run around youtube defending myself and secondly, the one time I did defend myself against a complete no mind I was banned from vid posting after I blatantly proved the person wrong when I pointed out information he was quoting from the EFSA report was not actually in the report, so why would I continue when I offer a completely open arena here to discuss the issue. So how about you make your points rather than undefended blanket criticisms.
Basically the troll is threatening to respond to every one of your posts in order to harass you with repetition.
He thinks he can get you to shut up or annoy you enough to say something he can use to try to redeem himself with the other antis.
We're dealing with an adult with the mentality of a child, that doesn't understand that Youtube has suspended him three times and has permanently banned him.
This video is a long since debunked piece of antiquated pro seal hunt garbage. The only people to have made money off the seal hunt were Canadian politicians who propped it up as a pseudo platform for "creating jobs". What a bunch of blind, patriotic horse shit. Any government could create jobs through subsidies, the only question is, will they insult the globe in the process. The people of NL are innocent. The politicians need to be lynched.
Coffin or should I call you Playboy, no need to counter as there isn't really anything to counter. I would like to see your information for debunking the video as I have not seen it nor have I seen a good argument against it since it has been up, says much about the anti position. Politicians get paid the same amount regardless and in relation to votes I don't see how they will garner any great amount of votes by being pro hunt. In fact the issue represents a mine field for them, anything else?
That's cool waterdropprod, Pretend like I didn't leave the very post you are responding too. You act like a broken record. The very man with whose quote you open your video has made the best argument against your video. Watch the video, "Cousteau and the Rights of Future Generations". Your quote is an antique issued by a much younger and less educated Cousteau that makes the statement he does in the video "Rights of Future Generations". Don't cringe too much watching it.
Coffin, if I wanted to pretend you didn't make the comment I would have just deleted it. Obviously you misunderstand, surprise, the reason why the quote was used in the vid. Since that quote was used the harp seal population has tripled while three seal species were added to the endangered list and one has gone extinct.
Coffin cont, The anti movement has absolutely nothing to do with the increase in harp seal population. Hopefully you can now understand how the quote, which states attention must be placed on the species at risk, applies. You claiming he was uneducated blah, blah which is nothing more than a distraction from this fact...understand now?
toons, this is almost too ridiculous to answer...almost. I guess we ditch national parks, the auto industry, farming (at times), and a plethora of other industries and institutions which don't make Canada money. Politicians are useless, I think everyone can agree on that and their only concern is getting elected and staying in office but the only people who have made money from the seal hunt are animal rights groups.
They both claim there isn't enough policing AND that too much money is being spent on policing.
They complain that seal meat is left on the ice AND claim it's not edible whenever someone tries to sell it.
And whenever people try to get a straight answer from them they flood the discussion with emotional rhetoric and try to make the person trying to get real answers out to be a supporter of cruelty.
Even the generic troll's idiotic threats are proof that these people are willing to do anything to justify their cause, including libel and abuse.
Youtube has permanently banned this troll yet he comes back and tries to fool people into believing they had no just cause to terminate his many accounts by stating that he's a victim of undue flagging.
LOL ! I've been a member since March 2006 and have an impeccable record. You created your account two days back specifically to harass me.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out that you're that desperate troll that had his account suspended numerous times by Youtube last month for numerous violations.
I bet you even exposed yourself in that comment that you just deleted.
pat, ans where did this tidbit of news come from? I know some dolt Chinese musician had a photoop with some seals as I am sure her press agent told her it would be a good idea and the SPCA in China supported her. Other than that I have not seen any news about seal products out of China.
ERSABETTA follows with: "EU ban speaks of hypocrisy" The EU ban speaks of international opinion to close 1 of the most ridicules & disgusting industries on the Earth, more bans will follow, & ur pelts will be worth no more than a dollar.
CANUCKTUNES states "You also attacked the Inuit"
NO
it's not worth attacking, most inuit don't support the seal hunt, most don't need the profit
Most seal profit goes to Norway, income is fine in Norway, the hunts r a financial loss for Canada
So you were not attacking the Inuit when you stated "if you can't live in the ANTARCTIC... move. you life off of death, blood-lust, and crime. MOVE" and stated you'd like to punch Mary Simon in the face for wearing a seal skin coat ?
You can't escape your own statements and ignorance (arctic vs antarctic, etc). Don't even try.
why the fuck is the entire world taking our hydro money, dumping oil on our coast, fishing on our coast, giving us shit in every possible way. and you wont even let us hunt seals, even tho many other countries do it. for fuck sakes, can't you all just you know...fuck off?
Pat, it is hypocrisy as multiple countries in the EU kill seals and kill roughly the same percentage of thier seal populations annually as Canada does of harp seals. If that's not hypocrisy I don't know what is.
Ersabetta said: "...activist evidence has been cut up to shreds so that the whole process from strike or shot to skinning is not shown"
Hmm, the EU ban speaks for itself.
EU has concluded that the Canadian seal hunts is inherently inhumane, based on scientific evidence, veterinary recommendations,, eyewitness reports, and photographic and film evidence.
The EU commissioned report's "Summary Of Opinion" ends with this sentence :
"As a way to help ensure the humane killing of
seals, the three-step method of effective hitting/shooting, effective monitoring, and effective bleeding-out, as well as a fourth step of effective implementation should be recommended."
It doesn't end with a recommendation for a ban or statement stating that all of the methods used are "inherently inhumane".
Furthermore, patzivota22, you condemned several methods in your comments that the EFSA recommends on pages 94 and 95 of their report (EFSA-Q-2007-118).
You condemned the bleeding out procedure., the use of rifles and guns, and the use of hakapiks and clubs on young animals.
You also attacked the Inuit, in contradiction to the exemption.
Pat, Actually the scientific study of the seal hunt for the EU resulting in the EFSA report backed the findings of the IVWG report in saying the analysis of video is very difficult even for trained veterinarians.
WATERDROPPROD said: "do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it?"
hm.... YES>
you have actually not seen any footage of these hunts. A simple cruise on YouTube can bring you to hundreds of videos. And some where the skinning is shown, no consciousness is checked, some videos you can see show the seals moving when being skinned.
sealers do not care for a single life, their brutality and blood lust makes AL-QAEDA look like a JOKE
IFAW hired veterinarians for look at three years of their footage to confirm live skinning for their March 2001 report. Footage that they swore contained live skinning in their statements to the press.
You know where I'm going with this, right ?
"18 seals were observed to be skinned, on average this occurred 60 seconds after the
initial strike. It is uncertain which of these seals were bled or had a level of
consciousness checked to ensure that they were not skinned while conscious."
Oh geez, the experts have a difficult time observing video evidence and reaching any conclusions that the seals have been skinned alive and you think you can? Ever hear of "continuity"? That makes it difficult to assess any live skinning because the activist evidence has been cut up to shreds so that the whole process from strike or shot to skinning is not shown.
how are you considering this humane when you bash their skulls in and drive spikes through their heads, some still alive? there's no emotion in there. the pure opposite of humane.
one thing I've found all too common with EVERY sealer is they always have to change the subject. every killer and poacher has this same exact mindset.
you have to remember Canadians, you hunt polar bears (for fun) which are steps away from endangered.
pat, I'm not a sealer but I can guarantee I won't skirt the topic. Over 95% of seals killed are shot, not clubbed. Seals whcih are spiked for dragging are dead, if you see side to side movement in video this is a swimming reflex, nerve reactions after death.
yes, the seals are shot from a distance, left on the ice to suffer a slow death, than the sealer comes along and smashes their skull in if she's not dead. independent veterinarians (IFAW) relase facts of less that 20% or seals do not have fractured skulls, canadian govt says otherwise, as always, theyve also concluded that most sealers do not check if the seal is fully dead before skinning,
corruption is loosing as it always should, so is this ridicules lusted industry
Pat, independent veterinarians? I don't think so. The lead vet worked for wspa another animal rights group. Another started working for IFAW and the report was written by the IFAW. This is ignoring the fact that they only looked at 100 seals, roughly. For the greatest portion of kills, seals do not suffer any more than any other hunted animal.
sealers have been offered alternatives, such as 'seal brushing'.SSCS have attempted on multiple occasions to introduce this idea to the sealers, even finding a businessman who offered more money for each brushed seal than the sealers could make from the pelt. the idea was rejected time after time.
The sealers reasoning for rejection? As one sealer put it in 1999 in the Magdelein Islands, "Seals r meant to b clubbed, not brushed. We don't want nothing 2 do with no faggoty idea like that"
Pat, I tell you what. Next year you grab yourself a comb and I'll find a way to get you out to the Front so you can brush some seals...see how many fingers you come back with. Furthermore, brushing does not solve the problem of population management.. Lastly the comments of one sealer do not represent the activity as a whole nor the people who take part in it. Of course, if all this information comes form the SSCS if is highly questionable as they are admitted liars. cont....
Pant, cont.... I find it hard to believe a business person would pay the same as a they would for a pelt for the small amount of loose hair one would get from brushing a seal.
pop. management? wtf? What management? U blame the seals for killing cod stocks when ur own over-fishing has done just that,
all the sealers have the same exact mindset... KILL, KILL, KILL, no, 1 comment represents them all very well, i got many more, they've done the same things they've always done, they still kill pregnant mothers, they still dont check 2 see if the seal is alive or not before skinning, nothings changed,
SSCS are liers? tell me something ur fisheries has said that is true?
Pat,where have I blamed seals for destroying cod stocks? Now you feel you can speak for all sealers, I have to say this is getting impressive. Where is your proof of these statements? The hunt does not open until after the cows, female seals, have given birth. You seem to be just one in a long line of individuals who like to spout off about this issue when you don;t ahve a clue about it. Yes the SSCS are liars as admitted by paul watson himself. Tell me where DFO has lied with some form of proof
You want Proof DFO lied. Got the court documents right here. Trial of more than 100+ sealers charged for killing & selling illegal bluebacks, AFTER the blueback/whitecoat law. Want names? Averill Baker representing the Crown. Defendants including Mark Small, Jack Troake, George Saunders. Killing bluebacks was/is illegal. DFO told them it was ok. Right there: DFO LIE! And this is documented corroborated eyewitness testimony recorded into the permanent judicial case record in Provincial Court!
Alumni, that is your eureka moment? Wow, now there is reason to nail em to a cross eh? But thank you for actually offering some form of proof although of what exactly I am not sure. Was this an officially released perspective of DFO or was it something along the lines of an answer given by one person who happened to work for DFO? Don't get me wrong here, I'm not a fan of DFO by any stretch of the imagination but I don't buy into the whole conspiracy theory.
Pat,just about everything that originates from the sscs is a fabrication or mass stretching of the truth. Any angle they can try to exploit they do without any regard for fact as they're motto seems to be do what ever it takes to achieve their goals. Decisions on any issue should be based in fact which is something the sscs ignores. Seals are not skinned alive and there isn't a piece of proof to substantiate the claim. Doing so would be totally counterproductive.
Speed that they want to kill the seals is proof, from the fact that most of them don't check for consciousness before skinning is proof.
Please tell me a lie from the SSCS? They're currently destroying the lie fed illegal Japanese whalers beautifully. & right now preventing illegal finning n Guatemala perfcty, hand-in-hand w/law enforcement
It's hard to find a conservation society that has used more of every dollar directly on the field than the SSCS
pat, do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it? Let me answer that for you...no you don't. Paul watson has stated ""It doesn't matter what is true; it only matters what people believe is true" and "If you dont know an answer, a fact, a statistic, then ... make it up on the spot." He supports and promotes lying. Everything they say is a lie.
waterdoped wrote: "do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it? "
ANSWER is YES.
And it's been turned over to Authorities. Hopefully you will soon be reading about their court case in the telegram & the provincial court Records.
in the meantime, you'll just have to wait. But go ahead, sit there still trying to dispute it. But unfortunately you will find out all too soon, it's the real deal.
Pat, watson has claimed the remains of seals causes hypoxia. Anyone who knows anything about hypoxia will tell you that this is an absolutely ridiculous statement with no foundation in truth whatsoever. He claims there was once something like 50 million seals and his proof of this is supposedly basque whaler records, anyone who knows anything about what basque whalers endured they know they never had time to sail out and count millions of seals let alone knowing it would be impossible.
The seal skull is thin and fractures result in unconsciousness, so they feel nothing. IFAW's March 2001 report concurs.
The vast majority of them bleed out and die of their injuries or the extra procedures, before they're dragged into the ship and skinned. And many of them still appear to be alive because of a pronounced postmortem reflex. Again, IFAW's March 2001 report concurs and recommends the extra procedures that were introduced in the hunt.
so you live in a house in an urban setting I would assume , Probably in Europe or America?
In europe Illegal Abortions of Humans occur about 2 to 1 over the quota for the Seal Hunt. Seal Eat Cod, They Eat Bate in Lobster Traps and the infect fish with worms referred to as Cod Worms . Why is it that you can think of Abortion as a European Lifestyle Choice and these fishermen can protect the greater economics in regards to a threat to our Economy ? Seals are not endangered
stop changing the subject, abortion? wtf... some sealers have even admitted to cutting open seals on their boats with baby seals falling out of the carcass... still alive, then they throw the babies overboard to drown (taken by Fergus Foley, Department of Fisheries and Oceans), and you complain about abortion in Europe? hm?
exactly. bye bye sealers. maybe the local drugstore is hiring? well, I don't see anyone hiring serial killers, really.
So this agrument about baby seals being between 3 weeks and fourteen weeks old . How old is a Veal Cow in Europe when it is harvested for french cuisine? What about REAL live human babies that millions are aborted in Europe at a rate Greater then any place on earth. If their is any moral of the Story with these hypocrites from Europe is the can fling there propaganda thick for their own agenda but Human Life is Absolutely out of the Question . This it the View of these EX sex workers
Billions of male baby chicks get shredded alive within hours of their hatching in the states and they don't bat an eye. And even if they go vegan, they're still responsible for the death of millions of animals in their fields.
The vineyards of Europe are also farmed and then there's the foie gras...
BTW, that's a billion per year and the harp seal has the same conservation status as the domesticated chicken on the IUCN 2008 Red List ; "Least Concern"
Playboy is a Male Whore . He has this background in common with Paul MacCartneys' Ex .
The thing is we have to get the Europeans for come over and show us how to efficiently KILL. The have experience with 6 milliion jews and about 500,000 Illegal Abortions annually not to mention for every 100 births in Europe there are 125 abrotions. FACTs from the WHO. Yeah something to preach morality from a Europe who are without any morales
I also debunked your, "Why aren't you protecting endangered seals?" argument in my video, False Comment #11". Perhaps you should have listed the activist groups that actually do protect them like, NWF, Greenpeace, WWF and Earth Justice. They are equally available to us to donate money to and many of us do.
Also, ever heard of a thing called The Endangered Species Act of 1972. It protects 3 of the 5 seals listed as threatened or endangered. When Hawaiian monk seals come ashore they are treated like rock stars. Escorted by armed security guards, they can kick sand in the face of the biggest body builder on the beach only to be rewarded with a tropical drink served to them in a coconut with a parasol sticking out of it.
playboy, and your point is? Seeing the species teeters on the brink of extinction, treating it like a rock star is of little value and it would seem the ESA is not sufficient but I am sure it makes the Hawaiian monk feel all warm and fuzzy. Man you have a bizarre way of TRYING to make a point. I am sure harp seals would be treated with the same reverence if they were in the same situation but as it stands they are grossly overpopulated.
playboy, apparently they need more help as one species has gone extinct and two more species are just about there. Seeing we are about to loose two seal species I can't say I see the need to give money to stopping a hunt which will be replaced with a cull...giving your money for nothing.
This seal clubbing is disgusting, we don't need the fur, we don't need the meat. Why is it still going on, is it just a bad habit like nicotene, again why do you do it????
Fur and leather is an environmentally friendly renewable resource that will not pollute our earth like the petroleum based faux products.
As long as it is managed properly and the species is not threatened than so be it.
If you are against fur than you must be against leather. Don't wear it and you can do your part. Wear faux products than I accuse you of polluting the earth.
As for the whole baby thing, I can't buy into that. Chickens are killed at 6 weeks. I won't stop eating chicken. KFC
tommysch are so ignorant as to believe your statement is true, the worlds trawler/longline fishing fleets are what is eradicating the fish population not the seals.
kessman, harp seals eat 5.5-6.5 million metric tonnes of biomass annually, Canada lands 1.2 metric tonnes annually. Not sure I would be pointing the ignorance finger at tommy. Both of you are actually right, human overfishing depleted many fish species and now bloated harp seal populations threaten those depleted species. Unfortunately the lowly threatened fish will not garner the same attention as the over populated harp seal.
you make a valad point waterdropprod, however it is not the fault of the seals that the fish stocks are very depleted, it seems mankind destroys one thing after another all for money not food, food is a by product of greed and you can find disasters everywhere not just here with the poor seals and the clubbers, I ask the question though how many people would be out on the ice flows culling seals if there was no reward??
Kezzman, using the same logic we could sit here and demonize most things that people do. Our society is built upon obtaining money to survive and sealing is part of a fisherman's annual income/survival. The reality is that we are on the still in the learning stages in how to manage marine species. The funny thing is that even though the harp seal is a success story in this regard it gets the most negative press. I believe the scientists are doing thier best to advance the study of ...cont.
Kezzman,cont.... fish species. Many of the species depleted by the 70's and 80's dragger fishery are starting to make a slow come back. While it was humans who depleted the fish stocks it was also humans who studied, learned and made drastic changes to stop a complete disaster. As it stands the harp seal hunt is a model for wildlife management with small increases to herd population every year while being hunted at a sustainable level.
Now that nobody wants seal fur anymore, and only 4% of the landable biomass of the harp seals killed is sold as meat., will the seal hunt continue? Seals are being shot and clubs for target practice. The difference between just making money, and greed are outlined in the White, Canadian commercial seal hunt. It's morally reprehensible and because it is when people are shown what happens, they stop buying baby seal products. Most people don't stop buying beef when they see how it is produced.
playboy, as I have been saying all along, market value or demand does not matter. As the Canadian gov. announced. If the commercial seal hunt ends a cull will replace it, only difference is nothing of the animal will be used. As usual you speak from the position of the imperial we and not from a point of fact, your delusions are not necessarily reality. To the best of my knowledge the people who bought seal products in the EU are upset that there is going to be a ban so what's you point exactly?
Obviously I used "nobody" as a relative term since the price of seal pelts dropped over 200% in 3 years. Watch my video "False Comment #9: Jacques Cousteau supported the hunt". You're spinwork video has been completely debunked. As for Cousteau, your antiquated quote by the man himself, Jacques, is irrelevant since shortly before his death he issued an all encompassing conservation statement on all aquatic wild life. As I've said before if a cull is proven as needed, I would not oppose it.
playboy, you are the spin doctor here as I never said Cousteau agreed with the hunt nor did I even imply it. I would have thought it quite evident that through his quote he recognized it as a non-issue. Apparently the painfully obvious is lost on some people.
Some people need fur, some people need meat, and other people need the fish that the seals eat. Just because YOU don't need/want it, doesn't mean you should be able to dictate what other people can eat and wear.
I don't eat much beef at all and I don't need it, but I certainly wouldn't tell someone else they cannot eat it, especially when I eat other animals and wear leather shoes.
mamasylum, thanks. The population info comes from the Department of Fisheries and Oceans Canada. The endangered seal info came from the IUCN red list of endangered species. Actually the list in the vid is inaccurate as one species has gone extinct since it was made. The info on what species anti groups help can be found or not found on their websites. The Watson interview and other info can be found at thesealfishery (dot) com, interview is under the audio visual section.
People all around the world is going for emotions and that's why it has become really big thing. I really like this video because it is well said and you don't get to see same video's people make over and over again for publicity. People who have never seen or experienced are going to believe everything protesters say just because...
waterdropprod are you idiot of something?, so you don't care about cruelty? you can say whatever you want and post all jaques cousteau said in his entire life, and that wont change the fact that the seal slaughter is one of the cruelest treatments for animal, hopefully someday someone will club you or anyone in your family repeatedly in the head so you get to understand
Are hump back whales cute canucktunes? Are they endangered? Are they even threatened? No, no and no. Your, "You only protect them because they're cute." comment is a long dead argument. In fact I've cataloged it and made a video called "False Argument #2".
lesliesu1, Where is your proof? I have watched every anti video out there and in many cases there is nothing wrong with the kills they show even though the commentary leads people to believe there is. If I added up all the cases of poor killing practices on all the videos over the years they have been filmed it would be lucky to represent maybe 0.00001% of the animals killed over that time. I hope you have something far better to base you allegations on.
Just like your video...pure spin. Jacques quote was from over 30 years ago. In that time animals like the North Atlantic Cod. which Jacques would have dismissed as stable have been pushed on to the "threatened" list. The quote lives in a bygone era which becomes as parabolically irrelevant as the curve of human population.
Playboy, have we not discussed this already? In reality it is quite relevant as he made his statements about a herd whcih was 1/3 the size it is today.
It's funny how you drop a quote from the World Wildlife Fund. Who, admittedly only work on conservation issues, hence the "Panda" on their logo. They protect endangered species. What's more, they give the IFAW contact information on the very webpage they give their statement on. Another irrelevant quote when it comes to the Canadian seal slaughter.
Playboy, you see this is where you seem to be deficient in this issue. Attention span. The video does not contain a quote from the WWF. You need to pay better attention to the things you comment on otherwise you come off as not knowing what you are talking about. Go figure. Yes the WWF works for conservation proving this is not a conservation issue. Reports from veterinarians prove it is a humane slaughter. Your point?
LoL! Apparently you are less familiar with your own material than I am. @ 3:24 Your quote, "Animal welfare dictates the killing of animals is acceptable as long as it is done in a humane and conservation insured" hasn't even finished rolling yet when you flash the WWF logo.. You need to pay better attention to the things you Vlog on otherwise you come off as not knowing what you are talking about. Go figure.
playboy, moron. Those are my words stating the essential ideals of the animal welfare ideology. The groups logos are shown because they are animal welfare groups. Do you find people talk slower to you than others and use finger puppets to make their points with you?
Oh come'on now. You don't expect me to be THAT naive do you? You know damn well what the WWF has to say about the Canadian seal hunt so you put their logo in your video. I know you'd love to believe you are working against a bunch of pea-brained morons, but the truth is I've been able to show you down on most of the data you present to us in your video. But compliments to you; I wouldn't attack any seal hunt supporters video unless it was a challenge. That or it was just plain funny.
playboy, nice attempt at diverting from the fact that you were wrong, laughably so. In fact, it would seem that most of your interpretation of video is wrong, at least what I have seen from you anyway. In reality you have not showed me down on anything. In fact , I have had to repeatedly point your misinterpretations out to you and your use of incorrect information. The WWF has repeatedly stated over many years that it finds the hunt to be completely sustainable.
Veterinarian reports are done on animals where a pathology necropsy can be performed. Unfortunately this is not possible with 5000 out of every 100,000 harp seals struck since they are stuck and lost. An element of the hunt which arguable both inhumane AND unresearchable. Just because data isn't collectible doesn't mean it does not exist. A philosophy that has been force-fed to most veterinarians studying the slaughter, as I pointed out to canucktunes.
Face it, you should be bending over and kissing the ground animal activists walk on. Without them we/you probably wouldn't have harp seals to rely on at all. They'd probably be extinct.
Playboy, lol. A groups of people who do not believe in animal management. Animal activists have "rescued" thousands of animals from fur farms and released them into the wild where they die. Animal activist fight this issue unconcerned of what will happen to an unchecked harp seal population. Animal activists are the epitome of lots of action little thinking.
Although I admire actions by groups like A.L.F. the releasing of fur animals doomed to die anyway acts mostly as messages of awareness to the public of the actions going on in their own back yards. If they are released into habitats where the carrying capacity is unable to support a population of 400 mink, at least they have died for a noble cause. In my eyes the deaths of a few hundred go to stop the inevitable deaths of hundreds of thousands more I consider these animals martyrs.
playboy, lol. How ridiculous. I would imagine the mink is comforted by the fact it is a martyr as it starves to death because it doesn't know how to forage for food. Nothing to do with if the environment can sustain them they just don't know how to fend for themselves.
When I had a cat. It was never taught to hunt, yet, not :30 minutes after I had let it outside for the first time it had already caught and was eating a lizard. Anymore baseless rhetoric?
Playboy, so did you have to go mull that over for awhile even after you accepted it and then you come back with more senseless cross species comparisons. "Domestic mink are found to have 19.6% smaller brains, 8.1% smaller hearts, and 28.2% smaller spleens than wild mink. Because of these physical differences, domestic mink may not be suited for life in the wild. A University of Copenhagen study found that most domestic mink that escape from fur farms die in less than two months."
These activists do love their tit for tat fantasies, don't they ?
Veterinarians were hired to catalog the violations shown in three years of raw footage by IFAW for their March 2001 report and could not confirm one case of live skinning. And even their other findings were disputed as early as September 2002 by the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association. But of course bias is assumed by these activists because that group is Canadian, even though there is no vested interest like that in IFAW.
CT. Most of the video I've seen of thrashing seals are like most biologists say, "swim reflex". However, there are a myriad of videos which show seals still fully conscience gurgling blood from their nostrils or gasping for air through crushed esophagi, long since abandoned on the ice. Further, As I point out in my video, False Comment #5. Apparently a 5% struck and lost rate is not tabulated into the stats on inhumanity since compounded that and the failed first time stun rate would (cont.)
(cont.) exceed the 4-6.6% mis-stun rate of abattoirs in the USA. As shown by Fink '07a, frequently sealers do not use the tested equipment and fall outside the observations made by EFSA 2007. What's more, abundant video also exists of just plane "swing and a miss". And by that I mean, miss the head all together with and land blows to other parts of the torso of the seal. Very humane. I've never seen someone try to stun a cow by tagging its ass. (continued)
playboy, in the EFSA study the term "frequently" is not used as you are implying it has been here. Talk about spin doctor. The equipment they make reference to are gaffs and boat hooks. Gaffs are boat hooks. The Gaff was the main method of killing seals years ago but it falls outside of the regulations based on its length. While this can be an effective tool for dispatching a young seal for some reason its was deemed shorter instruments should be used.
You are apparently living in a world of denial here on Youtube. I see you don't log on very often. This must be why you have missed over 20 pages of seal hunt videos wherein gaffs and clubs and boat hooks are documented as still being used. If you'd like I can build a video for you personally and I you can pop some popcorn (I like butter on mine) and have a Pepsi. It'll be a great night "in".
Playboy, a gaff is a boat hook. it would seem that you and Fink have some studying to do. Clubs are an acceptable tool if they fall within the size and weight restrictions. The EFSA study and the IVWG report both stated it is hard for experts to analyze protester video let alone an armchair activist such as you. Trained veterinarians have different perspectives on the same video so you can hold off on what is sure to be a highly inaccurate analysis. Ya your sure showing me playboy.
Lastly, It would be interesting to "cume" all this together and come up with a grand total of all violations, struck and lost, left for dead, misplaced blows and then see where we stand. Certainly well beyond the "publicly acceptable" 4-6.6% of abattoirs.
I also suppose you have a good answer for the ol' question, If hakapiks were/are such efficient stunning tools, why would there ever have to be a second blow?
playboy, regulations demanded a three strike rule for each seal. even if the seal moves and the sealer misses the second and third blow will finish the job. So for most of society it is ok to shot a big game animal and track it as it bleeds out but it is not ok for a seal to be injured then killed 1 second later? What elevates the seal to this mystical pedestal of yours?
Why would there be a need for a 3 strikes rule if the hakapik is/was so humane?
You asked "What elevates the seal to this mystical pedestal of yours?"
That question has been answered to you ad noseum. True to seal hunt supporter form, I'm not shocked at all you are asking the question yet again. The seal hunt is frivolous, it targets baby animals, it cost the Canadian tax payers millions.
playboy, the tax payers line is a strawman. Protesters whined about monitoring so monitoring was increased and even today they still whine about monitoring but now they say your spending too much money on monitoring. They have effectively created their own argument. the hunt targets juvenile animals which are independent and self sufficient creatures. They are also pollutant free which allows us to use their oil and eat the meat. cont.
Playboy, I watched a couple before I realized there was no need to watch anymore which is why I don't know what you are referencing and am not going to go looking through the inane prattle in your videos to find it. If you are saying the meat of a 1-3 month old seal is polluted in some way I guess we can add that to the list of incorrect information which originates from you.
Try, not inspected for some of the most basic foodborne illnesses like Botulism, Trichinosis or Brucellosis. Every meat product coming out of (or staying in) Canada is inspected for them (bush meat exceptions), yet because of pressure from the DFO the CFIA doesn't inspect for them. Ersabette and I have already had a winded exchange on the topic. Search: "Exercise Caution - Do Your Research" You'll find it all.
playboy, seeing thousands of people in Newfoundland and Labrador, Quebec, Nova Scotia and PEI eat seal I am surprised there is not one news story that I know of reporting any of these people contracting either of the food borne illnesses you list. Inuit in the north eat seal raw and I have not heard of cases of these illnesses there either. I know people who eat seal all the time for most of their lives and they have never has issue. Just more smoke and mirrors and poor information.
playboy, cont... It is not a point of DFO or CFIA pressure senior conspiracy theorist. I believe If food products do not cross provincial boundaries they are not subject to federal law but fall under provincial law. Seal meat has not been transported outside of provincial boundaries for years. Nobody inspects the meat of any hunted animal for personal use and guess what, don't hear of widespread illness from those meats either.
Wow. With their eyes on Europe, Both Korea and China are consumers of Canadian seal meat products and although done in limited amounts, seal meat is distributed throughout Canada. According to the DFO (where all of this comments facts come from) there were just under a million dollars worth of seal meat exported in 2003. Most of it seal penis, I'm sure. The DFO's, Fullest Possible Commercial Use of Seals policy reveals in no subtle manner the future aspirations of the bureau.
Do you have any more current data? I'm sure you'll be equally as disappointed with seal meat's demand in the global market as the 2003 number allude to.
WDP - First PB complains that the meat of the seal is virtually wasted, used only by a few and then complains that is it not being inspected for disease. What the....???
I just searched the Canadian Food Inspection Agency for "Seal Meat" and found that when seal meat is exported to South Korea, this appears on the certificate of inspection :
"Canada has not reported any animal contagious diseases listed by the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE) in seals, and there are no associated animal health restrictions required for Canadian seal meat for human consumption."
Exports to Hong Kong are also inspected and their Certificate of Origin and Hygiene contain the following :
"The seal meat/products are derived from animals that have passed post-mortem inspection conducted by a qualified inspector in Canada. The seal meat/products are wholesome and fit for human consumption."
This customs declaration was again found on the CFIA site.
playboy, cont..A sealer can swing a hakapik three times in say three seconds. Even if it takes three strikes, three seconds is a very efficient killing time. Other forms of hunting are readily acceptable even though in many cases death takes longer than three seconds.
Playboy, I would imagine the deviance is acceptable considering the difference between the ultra controlled environment of an abattoir and that of the ice flows. What exactly is the "tested equipment"? If you mean hakapik or rifle I would think if sealers are not using the regulated equipment then it would have been caught on much more video than the one case that I can think of from last year where the person was charged and convicted for doing so.
If there are such great discrepancies, as you point out, then seal hunt supporters need to live up to them and drop the argument that the seal hunt is not unlike an abattoir. It couldn't be any farther removed from one, both in principle and in practice. Your admission that the seal hunt is not ultra controlled like an abattoir are grounds enough to contest the findings of EFSA's psudo conclusion.
For more on unregulated equipment see "Fink 2007a" (ref: EFSA Q-118-2007)
Hi lesliesu1 My response here is to canucktunes. - Never tire of making the same debunked comments over and over and over and over again to steer people away from the actual facts are you CT? Although I am a fan of the raw data presented by the EU report I still have reservations with there conclusion that the hunt has no wide spread incidents of inhumanity in it. After all the commission repeated says "very few reliable data are available in regards to most of the methods used to kill seals."
In addition I see that you post comments on other videos, (which you have an obsessive appetite for doing) saying that I said the European committee was "bought" by seal hunt interests. Indeed, you told me at one point many say that. However, I did not. I said, after reviewing the bios on all the panel members, it is clear that the majority are from Scandinavian countries. Countries with seal hunt friendly histories. They would probably have also absolve OJ.
playboy, just a guess but maybe this was due to the knowledge base of these people in the area of seal biology etc. I don't know how many Italians or Greeks etc. who might have a driving interest in seals and find themselves on a panel of experts. Just applying a shred of common sense.
playboy, well as I have shown before you misquote this report and seem to make things up whcih don't exist in it. I love how you are willing to give it great credence as it seems to be your only source but then question it's accuracy when it does not agree with you perspective. Regarding reliable data, if most of the data they received was "observer" video what does that say about the video "evidence" of "observers"?
If you take the EFSA page for page, and stack it up next to all the peer reviewed studies done on the Canadian seal hunt you will find that the EFSA stacks up just about as high alone next to all other material. THAT is why I mention it so much, because there is so much of it. Additionally, I also quote the DFO and Aquaculture Management reports as well. You seem to have a more mosquito like recollection of who I use to cite my info than I do on the EFSA. See my videos for more "FACT" sources.
y u guys kill poor seals?? They so cute!!! GO DIE ALL OF YOU KILLERS!
TheDyllmeister 1 month ago
Watson and his little clan of scam artists made over 77.5 million US from their fund raising which magically just vanishes because I see no difference in anything relating to the seal hunt.
Peglegkickboxer 4 months ago
Look up for yourself what happened to Paul Watson the last time he came to Newfoundland.
sylviajh14 8 months ago
As to the Paul Watson quote at the end, I say BULLSHIT. He spends every day he has either on his ship, or fundraising so he can help save endangered sea animals. The amount of money he makes from it goes into the Irwin, or one of his other projects. He's a modern day super fucking hero
beccadante 8 months ago
@beccadante look up Paul Watson CBC, you can hear the quote in Watson's voice my little sheep.
nathanburns 1 week ago
i love newfoundland and danny williams is the best i,m from nova scotia
FaithForever52 1 year ago
Most Newfoundland sealers would go out and kill seals even if there was no profit in it. They just enjoy the feeling of killing small defenseless animals, it makes them feel like they are "real men", when, in fact, they are just cowards...
Chris153758 1 year ago
@Chris153758 On what basis do you dare to say such a thing. The people that are sealing do it strictly as a living, a hard living, a living that has been a part of our heritage for a long long time. Men went on the ice to make a living for their families and died in the process, it is NOT done for pleasure, it's done for survival. It's an honest living and not one man on the ice can be called a coward.
tiredofBS2 1 year ago
@Chris153758 I would dear you to say that in the middle of a bar in downtown St.Johns and see how long it would take for you to get your ass kicked.
theworldofnintendo 1 year ago
@theworldofnintendo middle of a bar dt?? If he's a real man himself he'd go into the middle of one of our outport communities and see how they respond.... That, will be an ASS KICKIN' he'll never forget
uglee555 1 year ago
@Chris153758 Don;t know how I missed your babbled nonsense but to answer your statements. Recently prices for pelts went down dramatically and most sealers never went out to the hunt. Wonder how long it will be before the government announces a cull. To make the comparison between controlling human populations and other animal populations is ridiculous. We manage other species based on our impact on the world around us. To not do so would be highly irresponsible.
waterdropprod 1 year ago
@Chris153758 Yeah Chris, they risk their lives just for the thrill of it. It has nothing to do with feeding their families or sheltering them. Why don't you go have a nice bowl of arsenic?
nathanburns 1 week ago
Humans cannot even control their own population growth, yet some humans have the arrogance to believe that they have the right to "manage" the populations of other species.
Chris153758 1 year ago
Seal hunters are barbarians that indulge their blood lust by killing baby seals...
Chris153758 1 year ago
@Chris153758 Imagine that, unsubstantiated, unintelligent hate filled comments from the anti side. How typical. I think I would have a heart attack if I ever saw any statements from the anti side based on fact and showed the slightest shred of knowledge on the issue. The seals killed are independent animals thus they can not be considered baby animals.
waterdropprod 1 year ago
@waterdropprod Most of the seals killed are less than one month old. They are unable to swim and feed themselves, so they are extremely vulnerable and can hardly be described as "independent". The young seals are also in a docile, sedentary state, which is a physiological adaptation to help them conserve their fat stores. The seal hunters take advantage of the young seal's vulnerability, which makes them barbarians in my book. Feel free to have a heart attack any time you like.
Chris153758 1 week ago
the fact of the matter is the canadian harp seal is the perfect cover child for animal rights groups, and it has absolutely nothing to do with the welfare of the species itself. The fact that these animal rights groups focus all their attention on a species which is not by any means endangered is appalling, and shows that these groups have little regard for the protection of animals, which don't gain them publicity or funds.
scotianovable 1 year ago
Hallelujah!
waterdropprod 1 year ago
YOu cite Paul Watson, but there are greedy people everywhere, unfortunatelly. But again, the personal greed of one person does not negate the legitimacy of the overall goal of the protesters. You are not logical in your argument, AT ALL. Obviously you are content with the sitution but a lot of peole think differently and are not into generously exploiting nature.
ofizs 2 years ago
ofizs, nature is not being exploited my friend. A cull of seals is going to happen whether there is an industry attached to it or not. BTW, Wally Watson was talking about all seal hunt protest groups. Effectively what people beleive today is based on 40 year old lies.
waterdropprod 1 year ago
Plus what "human" conduct means to you is clearly not the same what a lot of us would think. It is a subjective term. Just because accoding to you protesters (but who knows what other causes individuals support , by the way) do not take up the cause of saving all the endanger species does not make their fight against baby seal slaughter any less valid.
ofizs 2 years ago
ofizs, sure it does. So we stand by and watch species go extinct because there is more money to be made fighting for well populated species. I call that highly irresponsible. As stated above, seals, like kangaroos and many many other species around the world will continue to be culled regardless of the industry being shut down. Same sealers killing the same seals, only difference being it will animal rights groups will be able to stop lying as the hunt will truly be 100% government funded.
waterdropprod 1 year ago
So if a species is not endangered, it's ok to kill them. Why?? Because humans have been generously killing all kinds of animals so we should not even question this practice? Baby seals are killed only for their fur, for greed and vanity. Who cares if there is plenty of them. That does not make it right to kill helpless creatures in a cruel way. Hakapis can be effective, but it depends on the person who uses it. A lot of time the strike is not efficient and they skin them alive.
ofizs 2 years ago
It is the protesters that are claiming the seals are threatened to exaggerate the impact of a hunt that does not in any way threaten them.
1.4 Million of them are born each year.
Seal meat is consumed in Newfoundland/Labrador and Quebec. And if it weren't for the propagandists lying about heavy metal contamination the meat would sell more.
The EFSA report commissioned by the EU could not establish a failure rate and in the end recommended training. The removal of the hunt is unnecessary.
canucktunes 2 years ago
ofizs, why not? Seals are not babies when killed, they are killed mainly to control populations but unlike the EU we use the animal for fur products, meat, oil and maybe even heart valves soon. Most who use the hakapik are professional about what they do and a few cases caught on video by animal rights groups does not represent the hunt. There is none and nor has there ever been any proof of skinning alive.
waterdropprod 1 year ago
@waterdropprod i like the way you think. ofizs obviously doesn't have the facts straight.
djazr 1 year ago
Killing of animals should stop all over the world.
The killing of seals and the killing of sheep. The killing of moose and the killing of mice. Every killing should stop!
natija08 2 years ago
Obviously you don't have a clue about wildlife management, why it is done and how it actually helps wildlife species. Do you drive a car? Use wood based products? Use plastic? Own imported goods? Eat vegetables and grains? If the answer to any of these is yes then you support the killing of animals.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Oh my God, how the animals and plants could survive all millenniums without wildlife
management?
I don't support all the suffer of farm animals and wild animals cause I don't eat animal products.
I'm a vegan. I try to avoid everything I can in order to save the animals. I never killed an animal with my car till today because I drive very carefully. I don't use planes. I eat only ecologically produced food.
What are you doing to save the planet and to avoid the suffering of animals?
natija08 2 years ago
You do understand how human civilization has changed over the "millenniums" right? Increase in pollution and all that which we didn't get from riding horses etc. let me break it down for you in simple terms, we have a much greater impact on the world around us today than we did even 50 years ago. Through the use of this thing called science we know that for the most part, the animals we hunt will be dead by natural causes anyway, much more suffering.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Ecologically produced food? Very good seeing all food originating from plant or animal can be classified as such. You did not answer the rest of my questions. which leads me to beleive you support the killing of animals. What do I do? I recycle, reduce the amount of crap I send to landfills, cut back on the amount I drive, rescued multiple animals from shelters, give to the SPCA and on occasion I hunt which I think is avoiding the suffering of animals...for sure you won't understand that one.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
In a nutshell, wildlife management is the practice of identifying how many of a species should exist in a particular area based on available food source and other factors. This is done to maintain a healthy population as a weak population is susceptible to starvation & disease. Depending on the scientific findings, hunting quotas are either raised,lowered or non-existent. Decisions based on science instead of emotion in relation to caring for animals.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
In 2002, the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association found that 98% of all seals were killed in an acceptably humane manner. Similarly, a 2005 report funded by the World Wildlife Fund concluded that, the Canadian harp seal hunt is professional and highly regulated by comparison with seal hunts in Greenland and the North Atlantic. It has the potential to serve as a model to improve humane practice and reduce seal suffering within the other hunts.
Loadmeup101 2 years ago
Have you ever searched your username "waterdropprod" here on Youtube? You'll find plenty of answers to your seal hunt banter.
CoffinCornerX 2 years ago
Coffin, if people would rather confront this vid in closed forums as I have seen rather then here in a truly open forum then that speaks volumes about the quality of their arguments.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
And the absence of your comments on the videos addressing the invalidity of this one speaks volumes of the quality of your own arguments. Once challenged, they fall flat.
CoffinCornerX 2 years ago
Coffin, for one I do not have the time to run around youtube defending myself and secondly, the one time I did defend myself against a complete no mind I was banned from vid posting after I blatantly proved the person wrong when I pointed out information he was quoting from the EFSA report was not actually in the report, so why would I continue when I offer a completely open arena here to discuss the issue. So how about you make your points rather than undefended blanket criticisms.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Coffin cont, considering your first weak attempt concerning Cousteau's quote I figure this should be a cake walk.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Basically the troll is threatening to respond to every one of your posts in order to harass you with repetition.
He thinks he can get you to shut up or annoy you enough to say something he can use to try to redeem himself with the other antis.
We're dealing with an adult with the mentality of a child, that doesn't understand that Youtube has suspended him three times and has permanently banned him.
canucktunes 2 years ago
This video is a long since debunked piece of antiquated pro seal hunt garbage. The only people to have made money off the seal hunt were Canadian politicians who propped it up as a pseudo platform for "creating jobs". What a bunch of blind, patriotic horse shit. Any government could create jobs through subsidies, the only question is, will they insult the globe in the process. The people of NL are innocent. The politicians need to be lynched.
Go ahead. Counter away.
CoffinCornerX 2 years ago
Coffin or should I call you Playboy, no need to counter as there isn't really anything to counter. I would like to see your information for debunking the video as I have not seen it nor have I seen a good argument against it since it has been up, says much about the anti position. Politicians get paid the same amount regardless and in relation to votes I don't see how they will garner any great amount of votes by being pro hunt. In fact the issue represents a mine field for them, anything else?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
That's cool waterdropprod, Pretend like I didn't leave the very post you are responding too. You act like a broken record. The very man with whose quote you open your video has made the best argument against your video. Watch the video, "Cousteau and the Rights of Future Generations". Your quote is an antique issued by a much younger and less educated Cousteau that makes the statement he does in the video "Rights of Future Generations". Don't cringe too much watching it.
CoffinCornerX 2 years ago
Coffin, if I wanted to pretend you didn't make the comment I would have just deleted it. Obviously you misunderstand, surprise, the reason why the quote was used in the vid. Since that quote was used the harp seal population has tripled while three seal species were added to the endangered list and one has gone extinct.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Coffin cont, The anti movement has absolutely nothing to do with the increase in harp seal population. Hopefully you can now understand how the quote, which states attention must be placed on the species at risk, applies. You claiming he was uneducated blah, blah which is nothing more than a distraction from this fact...understand now?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
toons, this is almost too ridiculous to answer...almost. I guess we ditch national parks, the auto industry, farming (at times), and a plethora of other industries and institutions which don't make Canada money. Politicians are useless, I think everyone can agree on that and their only concern is getting elected and staying in office but the only people who have made money from the seal hunt are animal rights groups.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The activists are media manipulators.
They both claim there isn't enough policing AND that too much money is being spent on policing.
They complain that seal meat is left on the ice AND claim it's not edible whenever someone tries to sell it.
And whenever people try to get a straight answer from them they flood the discussion with emotional rhetoric and try to make the person trying to get real answers out to be a supporter of cruelty.
(cont)
canucktunes 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
(cont)
Even the generic troll's idiotic threats are proof that these people are willing to do anything to justify their cause, including libel and abuse.
Youtube has permanently banned this troll yet he comes back and tries to fool people into believing they had no just cause to terminate his many accounts by stating that he's a victim of undue flagging.
canucktunes 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
LOL ! I've been a member since March 2006 and have an impeccable record. You created your account two days back specifically to harass me.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out that you're that desperate troll that had his account suspended numerous times by Youtube last month for numerous violations.
I bet you even exposed yourself in that comment that you just deleted.
canucktunes 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Impersonation is considered harassment by the TOS.
canucktunes 2 years ago
Cool News Viewers:
This month: China is thinking of a ban on all seal products from Canada!
This criminal trade is going under QUICK.
patzivota22 2 years ago
Cool News Viewers:
patzivota22 is a gay homo who likes men
massacrution 2 years ago
pat, ans where did this tidbit of news come from? I know some dolt Chinese musician had a photoop with some seals as I am sure her press agent told her it would be a good idea and the SPCA in China supported her. Other than that I have not seen any news about seal products out of China.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
ERSABETTA follows with: "EU ban speaks of hypocrisy" The EU ban speaks of international opinion to close 1 of the most ridicules & disgusting industries on the Earth, more bans will follow, & ur pelts will be worth no more than a dollar.
CANUCKTUNES states "You also attacked the Inuit"
NO
it's not worth attacking, most inuit don't support the seal hunt, most don't need the profit
Most seal profit goes to Norway, income is fine in Norway, the hunts r a financial loss for Canada
patzivota22 2 years ago
So you were not attacking the Inuit when you stated "if you can't live in the ANTARCTIC... move. you life off of death, blood-lust, and crime. MOVE" and stated you'd like to punch Mary Simon in the face for wearing a seal skin coat ?
You can't escape your own statements and ignorance (arctic vs antarctic, etc). Don't even try.
canucktunes 2 years ago
why the fuck is the entire world taking our hydro money, dumping oil on our coast, fishing on our coast, giving us shit in every possible way. and you wont even let us hunt seals, even tho many other countries do it. for fuck sakes, can't you all just you know...fuck off?
massacrution 2 years ago
Pat, it is hypocrisy as multiple countries in the EU kill seals and kill roughly the same percentage of thier seal populations annually as Canada does of harp seals. If that's not hypocrisy I don't know what is.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Ersabetta said: "...activist evidence has been cut up to shreds so that the whole process from strike or shot to skinning is not shown"
Hmm, the EU ban speaks for itself.
EU has concluded that the Canadian seal hunts is inherently inhumane, based on scientific evidence, veterinary recommendations,, eyewitness reports, and photographic and film evidence.
Is based on a little more than footage.
patzivota22 2 years ago
And where in the EU report have they determined this? Yes, the EU ban does speak for itself, it speaks of hypocrisy.
Ersabette 2 years ago
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The EU commissioned report's "Summary Of Opinion" ends with this sentence :
"As a way to help ensure the humane killing of
seals, the three-step method of effective hitting/shooting, effective monitoring, and effective bleeding-out, as well as a fourth step of effective implementation should be recommended."
It doesn't end with a recommendation for a ban or statement stating that all of the methods used are "inherently inhumane".
canucktunes 2 years ago
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Furthermore, patzivota22, you condemned several methods in your comments that the EFSA recommends on pages 94 and 95 of their report (EFSA-Q-2007-118).
You condemned the bleeding out procedure., the use of rifles and guns, and the use of hakapiks and clubs on young animals.
You also attacked the Inuit, in contradiction to the exemption.
canucktunes 2 years ago
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BTW, this is what patzivota22 stated about the Inuit in another video's comments :
"if you can't live in the ANTARCTIC... move. you life off of death, blood-lust, and crime. MOVE."
Yes, she used the word Antarctic. And in regards to Mary Simon, president of President of Inuit Tapiriit Kanatami, she stated :
"look at that seal coat she's wearing... I want to punch her in the face so bad"
And why is she so angry ? Because she wants harp seals to "hang with their families".
canucktunes 2 years ago
Pat, Actually the scientific study of the seal hunt for the EU resulting in the EFSA report backed the findings of the IVWG report in saying the analysis of video is very difficult even for trained veterinarians.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
WATERDROPPROD said: "do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it?"
hm.... YES>
you have actually not seen any footage of these hunts. A simple cruise on YouTube can bring you to hundreds of videos. And some where the skinning is shown, no consciousness is checked, some videos you can see show the seals moving when being skinned.
sealers do not care for a single life, their brutality and blood lust makes AL-QAEDA look like a JOKE
patzivota22 2 years ago
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IFAW hired veterinarians for look at three years of their footage to confirm live skinning for their March 2001 report. Footage that they swore contained live skinning in their statements to the press.
You know where I'm going with this, right ?
"18 seals were observed to be skinned, on average this occurred 60 seconds after the
initial strike. It is uncertain which of these seals were bled or had a level of
consciousness checked to ensure that they were not skinned while conscious."
canucktunes 2 years ago
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Oh geez, the experts have a difficult time observing video evidence and reaching any conclusions that the seals have been skinned alive and you think you can? Ever hear of "continuity"? That makes it difficult to assess any live skinning because the activist evidence has been cut up to shreds so that the whole process from strike or shot to skinning is not shown.
Ersabette 2 years ago
Pat, please refer me to video which shows the series of events I have described. It does not exist on youtube or anywhere else.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
how are you considering this humane when you bash their skulls in and drive spikes through their heads, some still alive? there's no emotion in there. the pure opposite of humane.
one thing I've found all too common with EVERY sealer is they always have to change the subject. every killer and poacher has this same exact mindset.
you have to remember Canadians, you hunt polar bears (for fun) which are steps away from endangered.
patzivota22 2 years ago
pat, I'm not a sealer but I can guarantee I won't skirt the topic. Over 95% of seals killed are shot, not clubbed. Seals whcih are spiked for dragging are dead, if you see side to side movement in video this is a swimming reflex, nerve reactions after death.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
yes, the seals are shot from a distance, left on the ice to suffer a slow death, than the sealer comes along and smashes their skull in if she's not dead. independent veterinarians (IFAW) relase facts of less that 20% or seals do not have fractured skulls, canadian govt says otherwise, as always, theyve also concluded that most sealers do not check if the seal is fully dead before skinning,
corruption is loosing as it always should, so is this ridicules lusted industry
patzivota22 2 years ago
Pat, independent veterinarians? I don't think so. The lead vet worked for wspa another animal rights group. Another started working for IFAW and the report was written by the IFAW. This is ignoring the fact that they only looked at 100 seals, roughly. For the greatest portion of kills, seals do not suffer any more than any other hunted animal.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
sealers have been offered alternatives, such as 'seal brushing'.SSCS have attempted on multiple occasions to introduce this idea to the sealers, even finding a businessman who offered more money for each brushed seal than the sealers could make from the pelt. the idea was rejected time after time.
The sealers reasoning for rejection? As one sealer put it in 1999 in the Magdelein Islands, "Seals r meant to b clubbed, not brushed. We don't want nothing 2 do with no faggoty idea like that"
bingo.
patzivota22 2 years ago
Pat, I tell you what. Next year you grab yourself a comb and I'll find a way to get you out to the Front so you can brush some seals...see how many fingers you come back with. Furthermore, brushing does not solve the problem of population management.. Lastly the comments of one sealer do not represent the activity as a whole nor the people who take part in it. Of course, if all this information comes form the SSCS if is highly questionable as they are admitted liars. cont....
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Pant, cont.... I find it hard to believe a business person would pay the same as a they would for a pelt for the small amount of loose hair one would get from brushing a seal.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
pop. management? wtf? What management? U blame the seals for killing cod stocks when ur own over-fishing has done just that,
all the sealers have the same exact mindset... KILL, KILL, KILL, no, 1 comment represents them all very well, i got many more, they've done the same things they've always done, they still kill pregnant mothers, they still dont check 2 see if the seal is alive or not before skinning, nothings changed,
SSCS are liers? tell me something ur fisheries has said that is true?
patzivota22 2 years ago
Pat,where have I blamed seals for destroying cod stocks? Now you feel you can speak for all sealers, I have to say this is getting impressive. Where is your proof of these statements? The hunt does not open until after the cows, female seals, have given birth. You seem to be just one in a long line of individuals who like to spout off about this issue when you don;t ahve a clue about it. Yes the SSCS are liars as admitted by paul watson himself. Tell me where DFO has lied with some form of proof
waterdropprod 2 years ago
You want Proof DFO lied. Got the court documents right here. Trial of more than 100+ sealers charged for killing & selling illegal bluebacks, AFTER the blueback/whitecoat law. Want names? Averill Baker representing the Crown. Defendants including Mark Small, Jack Troake, George Saunders. Killing bluebacks was/is illegal. DFO told them it was ok. Right there: DFO LIE! And this is documented corroborated eyewitness testimony recorded into the permanent judicial case record in Provincial Court!
AlumniAdmin835 2 years ago
Alumni, that is your eureka moment? Wow, now there is reason to nail em to a cross eh? But thank you for actually offering some form of proof although of what exactly I am not sure. Was this an officially released perspective of DFO or was it something along the lines of an answer given by one person who happened to work for DFO? Don't get me wrong here, I'm not a fan of DFO by any stretch of the imagination but I don't buy into the whole conspiracy theory.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Pat,just about everything that originates from the sscs is a fabrication or mass stretching of the truth. Any angle they can try to exploit they do without any regard for fact as they're motto seems to be do what ever it takes to achieve their goals. Decisions on any issue should be based in fact which is something the sscs ignores. Seals are not skinned alive and there isn't a piece of proof to substantiate the claim. Doing so would be totally counterproductive.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Speed that they want to kill the seals is proof, from the fact that most of them don't check for consciousness before skinning is proof.
Please tell me a lie from the SSCS? They're currently destroying the lie fed illegal Japanese whalers beautifully. & right now preventing illegal finning n Guatemala perfcty, hand-in-hand w/law enforcement
It's hard to find a conservation society that has used more of every dollar directly on the field than the SSCS
SSCS: animal exploiters WORST nightmare
patzivota22 2 years ago
pat, do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it? Let me answer that for you...no you don't. Paul watson has stated ""It doesn't matter what is true; it only matters what people believe is true" and "If you dont know an answer, a fact, a statistic, then ... make it up on the spot." He supports and promotes lying. Everything they say is a lie.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
waterdoped wrote: "do you have an uncut video of a sealer killing a seal, not checking for consciousness and then skinning it? "
ANSWER is YES.
And it's been turned over to Authorities. Hopefully you will soon be reading about their court case in the telegram & the provincial court Records.
in the meantime, you'll just have to wait. But go ahead, sit there still trying to dispute it. But unfortunately you will find out all too soon, it's the real deal.
But we'll let you wait & stew on it.
AlumniAdmin835 2 years ago
Alumni, I'll believe it when I see it and for the time being it does not represent any form of proof of anything.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Pat, watson has claimed the remains of seals causes hypoxia. Anyone who knows anything about hypoxia will tell you that this is an absolutely ridiculous statement with no foundation in truth whatsoever. He claims there was once something like 50 million seals and his proof of this is supposedly basque whaler records, anyone who knows anything about what basque whalers endured they know they never had time to sail out and count millions of seals let alone knowing it would be impossible.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
You clearly haven't read up on the issue.
The seal skull is thin and fractures result in unconsciousness, so they feel nothing. IFAW's March 2001 report concurs.
The vast majority of them bleed out and die of their injuries or the extra procedures, before they're dragged into the ship and skinned. And many of them still appear to be alive because of a pronounced postmortem reflex. Again, IFAW's March 2001 report concurs and recommends the extra procedures that were introduced in the hunt.
canucktunes 2 years ago
so you live in a house in an urban setting I would assume , Probably in Europe or America?
In europe Illegal Abortions of Humans occur about 2 to 1 over the quota for the Seal Hunt. Seal Eat Cod, They Eat Bate in Lobster Traps and the infect fish with worms referred to as Cod Worms . Why is it that you can think of Abortion as a European Lifestyle Choice and these fishermen can protect the greater economics in regards to a threat to our Economy ? Seals are not endangered
paultaylor42 2 years ago
stop changing the subject, abortion? wtf... some sealers have even admitted to cutting open seals on their boats with baby seals falling out of the carcass... still alive, then they throw the babies overboard to drown (taken by Fergus Foley, Department of Fisheries and Oceans), and you complain about abortion in Europe? hm?
exactly. bye bye sealers. maybe the local drugstore is hiring? well, I don't see anyone hiring serial killers, really.
are any of us saying they r endangered? no.
patzivota22 2 years ago
Pat, this is an old story from an old hunt. Present day, seals are not killed while they carry their young.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
So this agrument about baby seals being between 3 weeks and fourteen weeks old . How old is a Veal Cow in Europe when it is harvested for french cuisine? What about REAL live human babies that millions are aborted in Europe at a rate Greater then any place on earth. If their is any moral of the Story with these hypocrites from Europe is the can fling there propaganda thick for their own agenda but Human Life is Absolutely out of the Question . This it the View of these EX sex workers
paultaylor42 2 years ago
Billions of male baby chicks get shredded alive within hours of their hatching in the states and they don't bat an eye. And even if they go vegan, they're still responsible for the death of millions of animals in their fields.
The vineyards of Europe are also farmed and then there's the foie gras...
canucktunes 2 years ago
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BTW, that's a billion per year and the harp seal has the same conservation status as the domesticated chicken on the IUCN 2008 Red List ; "Least Concern"
canucktunes 2 years ago
Playboy is a Male Whore . He has this background in common with Paul MacCartneys' Ex .
The thing is we have to get the Europeans for come over and show us how to efficiently KILL. The have experience with 6 milliion jews and about 500,000 Illegal Abortions annually not to mention for every 100 births in Europe there are 125 abrotions. FACTs from the WHO. Yeah something to preach morality from a Europe who are without any morales
paultaylor42 2 years ago
I also debunked your, "Why aren't you protecting endangered seals?" argument in my video, False Comment #11". Perhaps you should have listed the activist groups that actually do protect them like, NWF, Greenpeace, WWF and Earth Justice. They are equally available to us to donate money to and many of us do.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Also, ever heard of a thing called The Endangered Species Act of 1972. It protects 3 of the 5 seals listed as threatened or endangered. When Hawaiian monk seals come ashore they are treated like rock stars. Escorted by armed security guards, they can kick sand in the face of the biggest body builder on the beach only to be rewarded with a tropical drink served to them in a coconut with a parasol sticking out of it.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, and your point is? Seeing the species teeters on the brink of extinction, treating it like a rock star is of little value and it would seem the ESA is not sufficient but I am sure it makes the Hawaiian monk feel all warm and fuzzy. Man you have a bizarre way of TRYING to make a point. I am sure harp seals would be treated with the same reverence if they were in the same situation but as it stands they are grossly overpopulated.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
playboy, apparently they need more help as one species has gone extinct and two more species are just about there. Seeing we are about to loose two seal species I can't say I see the need to give money to stopping a hunt which will be replaced with a cull...giving your money for nothing.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
This seal clubbing is disgusting, we don't need the fur, we don't need the meat. Why is it still going on, is it just a bad habit like nicotene, again why do you do it????
kezzman2 2 years ago
Fur and leather is an environmentally friendly renewable resource that will not pollute our earth like the petroleum based faux products.
As long as it is managed properly and the species is not threatened than so be it.
If you are against fur than you must be against leather. Don't wear it and you can do your part. Wear faux products than I accuse you of polluting the earth.
As for the whole baby thing, I can't buy into that. Chickens are killed at 6 weeks. I won't stop eating chicken. KFC
kennedydive 2 years ago
Because if you dont kill them the fish population will be eradicated and in the end the seal will all die of starvation.
tommysch 2 years ago
tommysch are so ignorant as to believe your statement is true, the worlds trawler/longline fishing fleets are what is eradicating the fish population not the seals.
kezzman2 2 years ago
kessman, harp seals eat 5.5-6.5 million metric tonnes of biomass annually, Canada lands 1.2 metric tonnes annually. Not sure I would be pointing the ignorance finger at tommy. Both of you are actually right, human overfishing depleted many fish species and now bloated harp seal populations threaten those depleted species. Unfortunately the lowly threatened fish will not garner the same attention as the over populated harp seal.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
you make a valad point waterdropprod, however it is not the fault of the seals that the fish stocks are very depleted, it seems mankind destroys one thing after another all for money not food, food is a by product of greed and you can find disasters everywhere not just here with the poor seals and the clubbers, I ask the question though how many people would be out on the ice flows culling seals if there was no reward??
kezzman2 2 years ago
Kezzman, using the same logic we could sit here and demonize most things that people do. Our society is built upon obtaining money to survive and sealing is part of a fisherman's annual income/survival. The reality is that we are on the still in the learning stages in how to manage marine species. The funny thing is that even though the harp seal is a success story in this regard it gets the most negative press. I believe the scientists are doing thier best to advance the study of ...cont.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Kezzman,cont.... fish species. Many of the species depleted by the 70's and 80's dragger fishery are starting to make a slow come back. While it was humans who depleted the fish stocks it was also humans who studied, learned and made drastic changes to stop a complete disaster. As it stands the harp seal hunt is a model for wildlife management with small increases to herd population every year while being hunted at a sustainable level.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Now that nobody wants seal fur anymore, and only 4% of the landable biomass of the harp seals killed is sold as meat., will the seal hunt continue? Seals are being shot and clubs for target practice. The difference between just making money, and greed are outlined in the White, Canadian commercial seal hunt. It's morally reprehensible and because it is when people are shown what happens, they stop buying baby seal products. Most people don't stop buying beef when they see how it is produced.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, as I have been saying all along, market value or demand does not matter. As the Canadian gov. announced. If the commercial seal hunt ends a cull will replace it, only difference is nothing of the animal will be used. As usual you speak from the position of the imperial we and not from a point of fact, your delusions are not necessarily reality. To the best of my knowledge the people who bought seal products in the EU are upset that there is going to be a ban so what's you point exactly?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Obviously I used "nobody" as a relative term since the price of seal pelts dropped over 200% in 3 years. Watch my video "False Comment #9: Jacques Cousteau supported the hunt". You're spinwork video has been completely debunked. As for Cousteau, your antiquated quote by the man himself, Jacques, is irrelevant since shortly before his death he issued an all encompassing conservation statement on all aquatic wild life. As I've said before if a cull is proven as needed, I would not oppose it.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, you are the spin doctor here as I never said Cousteau agreed with the hunt nor did I even imply it. I would have thought it quite evident that through his quote he recognized it as a non-issue. Apparently the painfully obvious is lost on some people.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Some people need fur, some people need meat, and other people need the fish that the seals eat. Just because YOU don't need/want it, doesn't mean you should be able to dictate what other people can eat and wear.
I don't eat much beef at all and I don't need it, but I certainly wouldn't tell someone else they cannot eat it, especially when I eat other animals and wear leather shoes.
Fleefles 2 years ago
enough said..
thanks waterdropprod for the video
anyway, may i ask where do you get the information?
i was doing a anti-seal hunt campaign, until i found out that several misinformation from the animal protester... i realized i was being fooled
magnasylum 2 years ago
mamasylum, thanks. The population info comes from the Department of Fisheries and Oceans Canada. The endangered seal info came from the IUCN red list of endangered species. Actually the list in the vid is inaccurate as one species has gone extinct since it was made. The info on what species anti groups help can be found or not found on their websites. The Watson interview and other info can be found at thesealfishery (dot) com, interview is under the audio visual section.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
People all around the world is going for emotions and that's why it has become really big thing. I really like this video because it is well said and you don't get to see same video's people make over and over again for publicity. People who have never seen or experienced are going to believe everything protesters say just because...
Lenskibro 2 years ago
Lenskibro, cheers. It's good to see there are still those who use their common sense and ability to employ critical thinking.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Well Done!
kennedydive 2 years ago
Thanks kennedy, much appreciated
waterdropprod 2 years ago
waterdropprod are you idiot of something?, so you don't care about cruelty? you can say whatever you want and post all jaques cousteau said in his entire life, and that wont change the fact that the seal slaughter is one of the cruelest treatments for animal, hopefully someday someone will club you or anyone in your family repeatedly in the head so you get to understand
lesliesu1 2 years ago
The European Union commissioned a report from the European Food Safety Authority who published the results in December 2007.
The methods used were determined to be humane in this report. It's even mentioned in the summary of the report.
So basically you assume it's cruel simply because these animals are cute, not because you in any way did research on the subject.
canucktunes 2 years ago
Are hump back whales cute canucktunes? Are they endangered? Are they even threatened? No, no and no. Your, "You only protect them because they're cute." comment is a long dead argument. In fact I've cataloged it and made a video called "False Argument #2".
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
No it isn't. Just because stupid AR groups film the worst treatment an animal receives and says its the "norm," doesn't mean its true.
Its like when they film a sad beat up pitbull and say all pitbulls are abused and used to fight as an excuse to euthanize them all.
I hope you don't eat meat or use any animal products whatsoever. According to AR groups you're no better than a serial killer.
Fleefles 2 years ago
lesliesu1, Where is your proof? I have watched every anti video out there and in many cases there is nothing wrong with the kills they show even though the commentary leads people to believe there is. If I added up all the cases of poor killing practices on all the videos over the years they have been filmed it would be lucky to represent maybe 0.00001% of the animals killed over that time. I hope you have something far better to base you allegations on.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Just like your video...pure spin. Jacques quote was from over 30 years ago. In that time animals like the North Atlantic Cod. which Jacques would have dismissed as stable have been pushed on to the "threatened" list. The quote lives in a bygone era which becomes as parabolically irrelevant as the curve of human population.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, have we not discussed this already? In reality it is quite relevant as he made his statements about a herd whcih was 1/3 the size it is today.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
It's funny how you drop a quote from the World Wildlife Fund. Who, admittedly only work on conservation issues, hence the "Panda" on their logo. They protect endangered species. What's more, they give the IFAW contact information on the very webpage they give their statement on. Another irrelevant quote when it comes to the Canadian seal slaughter.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, you see this is where you seem to be deficient in this issue. Attention span. The video does not contain a quote from the WWF. You need to pay better attention to the things you comment on otherwise you come off as not knowing what you are talking about. Go figure. Yes the WWF works for conservation proving this is not a conservation issue. Reports from veterinarians prove it is a humane slaughter. Your point?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
LoL! Apparently you are less familiar with your own material than I am. @ 3:24 Your quote, "Animal welfare dictates the killing of animals is acceptable as long as it is done in a humane and conservation insured" hasn't even finished rolling yet when you flash the WWF logo.. You need to pay better attention to the things you Vlog on otherwise you come off as not knowing what you are talking about. Go figure.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, moron. Those are my words stating the essential ideals of the animal welfare ideology. The groups logos are shown because they are animal welfare groups. Do you find people talk slower to you than others and use finger puppets to make their points with you?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Oh come'on now. You don't expect me to be THAT naive do you? You know damn well what the WWF has to say about the Canadian seal hunt so you put their logo in your video. I know you'd love to believe you are working against a bunch of pea-brained morons, but the truth is I've been able to show you down on most of the data you present to us in your video. But compliments to you; I wouldn't attack any seal hunt supporters video unless it was a challenge. That or it was just plain funny.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, nice attempt at diverting from the fact that you were wrong, laughably so. In fact, it would seem that most of your interpretation of video is wrong, at least what I have seen from you anyway. In reality you have not showed me down on anything. In fact , I have had to repeatedly point your misinterpretations out to you and your use of incorrect information. The WWF has repeatedly stated over many years that it finds the hunt to be completely sustainable.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Veterinarian reports are done on animals where a pathology necropsy can be performed. Unfortunately this is not possible with 5000 out of every 100,000 harp seals struck since they are stuck and lost. An element of the hunt which arguable both inhumane AND unresearchable. Just because data isn't collectible doesn't mean it does not exist. A philosophy that has been force-fed to most veterinarians studying the slaughter, as I pointed out to canucktunes.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Face it, you should be bending over and kissing the ground animal activists walk on. Without them we/you probably wouldn't have harp seals to rely on at all. They'd probably be extinct.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, lol. A groups of people who do not believe in animal management. Animal activists have "rescued" thousands of animals from fur farms and released them into the wild where they die. Animal activist fight this issue unconcerned of what will happen to an unchecked harp seal population. Animal activists are the epitome of lots of action little thinking.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Although I admire actions by groups like A.L.F. the releasing of fur animals doomed to die anyway acts mostly as messages of awareness to the public of the actions going on in their own back yards. If they are released into habitats where the carrying capacity is unable to support a population of 400 mink, at least they have died for a noble cause. In my eyes the deaths of a few hundred go to stop the inevitable deaths of hundreds of thousands more I consider these animals martyrs.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Indeed the actions of activists are more well thought out than you would ever want to give credit for.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, ok. Its just a well thought out plan to look stupid so it lulls us into a false sense of security.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
playboy, lol. How ridiculous. I would imagine the mink is comforted by the fact it is a martyr as it starves to death because it doesn't know how to forage for food. Nothing to do with if the environment can sustain them they just don't know how to fend for themselves.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
When I had a cat. It was never taught to hunt, yet, not :30 minutes after I had let it outside for the first time it had already caught and was eating a lizard. Anymore baseless rhetoric?
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, so did you have to go mull that over for awhile even after you accepted it and then you come back with more senseless cross species comparisons. "Domestic mink are found to have 19.6% smaller brains, 8.1% smaller hearts, and 28.2% smaller spleens than wild mink. Because of these physical differences, domestic mink may not be suited for life in the wild. A University of Copenhagen study found that most domestic mink that escape from fur farms die in less than two months."
waterdropprod 2 years ago
These activists do love their tit for tat fantasies, don't they ?
Veterinarians were hired to catalog the violations shown in three years of raw footage by IFAW for their March 2001 report and could not confirm one case of live skinning. And even their other findings were disputed as early as September 2002 by the Canadian Veterinary Medical Association. But of course bias is assumed by these activists because that group is Canadian, even though there is no vested interest like that in IFAW.
canucktunes 2 years ago
CT. Most of the video I've seen of thrashing seals are like most biologists say, "swim reflex". However, there are a myriad of videos which show seals still fully conscience gurgling blood from their nostrils or gasping for air through crushed esophagi, long since abandoned on the ice. Further, As I point out in my video, False Comment #5. Apparently a 5% struck and lost rate is not tabulated into the stats on inhumanity since compounded that and the failed first time stun rate would (cont.)
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
(cont.) exceed the 4-6.6% mis-stun rate of abattoirs in the USA. As shown by Fink '07a, frequently sealers do not use the tested equipment and fall outside the observations made by EFSA 2007. What's more, abundant video also exists of just plane "swing and a miss". And by that I mean, miss the head all together with and land blows to other parts of the torso of the seal. Very humane. I've never seen someone try to stun a cow by tagging its ass. (continued)
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, in the EFSA study the term "frequently" is not used as you are implying it has been here. Talk about spin doctor. The equipment they make reference to are gaffs and boat hooks. Gaffs are boat hooks. The Gaff was the main method of killing seals years ago but it falls outside of the regulations based on its length. While this can be an effective tool for dispatching a young seal for some reason its was deemed shorter instruments should be used.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
You are apparently living in a world of denial here on Youtube. I see you don't log on very often. This must be why you have missed over 20 pages of seal hunt videos wherein gaffs and clubs and boat hooks are documented as still being used. If you'd like I can build a video for you personally and I you can pop some popcorn (I like butter on mine) and have a Pepsi. It'll be a great night "in".
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, a gaff is a boat hook. it would seem that you and Fink have some studying to do. Clubs are an acceptable tool if they fall within the size and weight restrictions. The EFSA study and the IVWG report both stated it is hard for experts to analyze protester video let alone an armchair activist such as you. Trained veterinarians have different perspectives on the same video so you can hold off on what is sure to be a highly inaccurate analysis. Ya your sure showing me playboy.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Lastly, It would be interesting to "cume" all this together and come up with a grand total of all violations, struck and lost, left for dead, misplaced blows and then see where we stand. Certainly well beyond the "publicly acceptable" 4-6.6% of abattoirs.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
I also suppose you have a good answer for the ol' question, If hakapiks were/are such efficient stunning tools, why would there ever have to be a second blow?
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, regulations demanded a three strike rule for each seal. even if the seal moves and the sealer misses the second and third blow will finish the job. So for most of society it is ok to shot a big game animal and track it as it bleeds out but it is not ok for a seal to be injured then killed 1 second later? What elevates the seal to this mystical pedestal of yours?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Why would there be a need for a 3 strikes rule if the hakapik is/was so humane?
You asked "What elevates the seal to this mystical pedestal of yours?"
That question has been answered to you ad noseum. True to seal hunt supporter form, I'm not shocked at all you are asking the question yet again. The seal hunt is frivolous, it targets baby animals, it cost the Canadian tax payers millions.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, the tax payers line is a strawman. Protesters whined about monitoring so monitoring was increased and even today they still whine about monitoring but now they say your spending too much money on monitoring. They have effectively created their own argument. the hunt targets juvenile animals which are independent and self sufficient creatures. They are also pollutant free which allows us to use their oil and eat the meat. cont.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Yeah. It's clear that you don't watch any of my videos. If you did you wouldn't have entered the "It's safe to eat their meat" arena.
The floor is yours.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, I watched a couple before I realized there was no need to watch anymore which is why I don't know what you are referencing and am not going to go looking through the inane prattle in your videos to find it. If you are saying the meat of a 1-3 month old seal is polluted in some way I guess we can add that to the list of incorrect information which originates from you.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Try, not inspected for some of the most basic foodborne illnesses like Botulism, Trichinosis or Brucellosis. Every meat product coming out of (or staying in) Canada is inspected for them (bush meat exceptions), yet because of pressure from the DFO the CFIA doesn't inspect for them. Ersabette and I have already had a winded exchange on the topic. Search: "Exercise Caution - Do Your Research" You'll find it all.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, seeing thousands of people in Newfoundland and Labrador, Quebec, Nova Scotia and PEI eat seal I am surprised there is not one news story that I know of reporting any of these people contracting either of the food borne illnesses you list. Inuit in the north eat seal raw and I have not heard of cases of these illnesses there either. I know people who eat seal all the time for most of their lives and they have never has issue. Just more smoke and mirrors and poor information.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
playboy, cont... It is not a point of DFO or CFIA pressure senior conspiracy theorist. I believe If food products do not cross provincial boundaries they are not subject to federal law but fall under provincial law. Seal meat has not been transported outside of provincial boundaries for years. Nobody inspects the meat of any hunted animal for personal use and guess what, don't hear of widespread illness from those meats either.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Wow. With their eyes on Europe, Both Korea and China are consumers of Canadian seal meat products and although done in limited amounts, seal meat is distributed throughout Canada. According to the DFO (where all of this comments facts come from) there were just under a million dollars worth of seal meat exported in 2003. Most of it seal penis, I'm sure. The DFO's, Fullest Possible Commercial Use of Seals policy reveals in no subtle manner the future aspirations of the bureau.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, 2003 hey. This is 2009 which is why I stated that it has not been transported for years. Are you misinterpreting everything you read?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Do you have any more current data? I'm sure you'll be equally as disappointed with seal meat's demand in the global market as the 2003 number allude to.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
WDP - First PB complains that the meat of the seal is virtually wasted, used only by a few and then complains that is it not being inspected for disease. What the....???
Ersabette 2 years ago
I just searched the Canadian Food Inspection Agency for "Seal Meat" and found that when seal meat is exported to South Korea, this appears on the certificate of inspection :
"Canada has not reported any animal contagious diseases listed by the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE) in seals, and there are no associated animal health restrictions required for Canadian seal meat for human consumption."
canucktunes 2 years ago
Exports to Hong Kong are also inspected and their Certificate of Origin and Hygiene contain the following :
"The seal meat/products are derived from animals that have passed post-mortem inspection conducted by a qualified inspector in Canada. The seal meat/products are wholesome and fit for human consumption."
This customs declaration was again found on the CFIA site.
canucktunes 2 years ago
playboy, cont..A sealer can swing a hakapik three times in say three seconds. Even if it takes three strikes, three seconds is a very efficient killing time. Other forms of hunting are readily acceptable even though in many cases death takes longer than three seconds.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Playboy, I would imagine the deviance is acceptable considering the difference between the ultra controlled environment of an abattoir and that of the ice flows. What exactly is the "tested equipment"? If you mean hakapik or rifle I would think if sealers are not using the regulated equipment then it would have been caught on much more video than the one case that I can think of from last year where the person was charged and convicted for doing so.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
If there are such great discrepancies, as you point out, then seal hunt supporters need to live up to them and drop the argument that the seal hunt is not unlike an abattoir. It couldn't be any farther removed from one, both in principle and in practice. Your admission that the seal hunt is not ultra controlled like an abattoir are grounds enough to contest the findings of EFSA's psudo conclusion.
For more on unregulated equipment see "Fink 2007a" (ref: EFSA Q-118-2007)
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, I found the info on unregulated equipment and explained it in another post.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
Hi lesliesu1 My response here is to canucktunes. - Never tire of making the same debunked comments over and over and over and over again to steer people away from the actual facts are you CT? Although I am a fan of the raw data presented by the EU report I still have reservations with there conclusion that the hunt has no wide spread incidents of inhumanity in it. After all the commission repeated says "very few reliable data are available in regards to most of the methods used to kill seals."
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
In addition I see that you post comments on other videos, (which you have an obsessive appetite for doing) saying that I said the European committee was "bought" by seal hunt interests. Indeed, you told me at one point many say that. However, I did not. I said, after reviewing the bios on all the panel members, it is clear that the majority are from Scandinavian countries. Countries with seal hunt friendly histories. They would probably have also absolve OJ.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
playboy, just a guess but maybe this was due to the knowledge base of these people in the area of seal biology etc. I don't know how many Italians or Greeks etc. who might have a driving interest in seals and find themselves on a panel of experts. Just applying a shred of common sense.
waterdropprod 2 years ago
playboy, well as I have shown before you misquote this report and seem to make things up whcih don't exist in it. I love how you are willing to give it great credence as it seems to be your only source but then question it's accuracy when it does not agree with you perspective. Regarding reliable data, if most of the data they received was "observer" video what does that say about the video "evidence" of "observers"?
waterdropprod 2 years ago
If you take the EFSA page for page, and stack it up next to all the peer reviewed studies done on the Canadian seal hunt you will find that the EFSA stacks up just about as high alone next to all other material. THAT is why I mention it so much, because there is so much of it. Additionally, I also quote the DFO and Aquaculture Management reports as well. You seem to have a more mosquito like recollection of who I use to cite my info than I do on the EFSA. See my videos for more "FACT" sources.
XB70Playboy 2 years ago
Playboy, thats all well and good but it is useless to have a source if you misquote it and make reference to things in it that simply don't exist.
waterdropprod 2 years ago