Forks Over Knives - Dr. Neal Barnard on Diabetes

[FathomIessJoy]

I know I should spout propaganda, but the truth is NOBODY on Barnards diet has EVER reversed diabetes.

"reversal" would imply getting to normal levels. Barnard's studies show after 74 weeks (a year and a half) the best he can do is get to around a 7.71% average HbA1c. Not reversed, not even controlled according to the ADA.

Healthy levels are in the 4.6% to 5.4% range. And that's the scientific fact.

[90Rush]

To the argument below: tbh, people think a typical LCHF diet and a typical vegan diet are polar opposites, but I believe they are more similar than you might think.

Both make you eat more good stuff: fresh fruits and vegetables; you have to eat more vegetables after ditching all those pasta and bread. It's common sense.

Both encourage reading food labels, and both remove all those bad stuff: soft drinks, sweets, bad oils, etc etc etc.

[recherche56]

Well my A1c went from 9.6 to 7.5 on Dr. Barnard's diet.

So you can spank off to whatever 'busted myth' bs you want.

On the other hand, if you want to get your blood surgar under control just try the diet for a few months.

[90Rush]

@recherche56 A quick question, does Dr. Barnard's diet allow you to drink coke and eat low fat brownies?

And just what do you think is the problem?

[recherche56]

@90Rush - Refined sugar & items made from white flour are no nos. So forget all those sugar soft drinks like coke, sprite, Dr Pepper, Red Bull, Root Beer, etc... Even Tea. which is normally a good choice, is often sweetened to death. Your brownies are PROBABLY made with white flour & lots of refined surgar, so again no. The PROBLEM is a high glycemic index - i.e. huge rapid sugar influx - not good in general and VERY bad for poor surgar control crowd.

[90Rush]

@recherche56 That's right! Still think an typical LCHF diet (say, paleo diet) is so different from Dr.Barnard's diet?

[FathomIessJoy]

@recherche56 "...Well my A1c went from 9.6 to 7.5 on Dr. Barnard's diet..."

So you admit that your diabetes is still uncontrolled on Barnard's diet, haha! The criteria for reversing diabetes would be NORMAL A1c which is 4.6% to 5.4%

Low-carb diets are superior for diabetes control in every respect.

nutritionandmetabolism(dot)com­/content/6/1/21

Oh wait, I'm a vegan nutjob... I keep posting the truth instead of my misinformation!

[FathomIessJoy]

@FathomIessJoy BTW "One female patient had an increased physical activity level during the study period in spite of our instructions. However, her increase in physical activity was no more than one hour of walking per day, four days a week. She had implemented an 11%-carbohydrate diet without any antidiabetic drug, and her HbA1c level decreased from 14.4% at baseline to 6.1% after 3 months and had been maintained at 5.5% after 6 months. "

From 14.4% to 5.5% ... eat THAT.

[LCHFinCanada]

.. or is it your assertion that in every study I've mentioned, as well as in all countries that defy your hypothesis (France, most of Europe, in fact) that all people eating saturated fat exercise more than all people that don't eat it?

That's not just statistically improbable, it's almost insane to think, actually. It seems a pretty desperate stretch of somebody unwilling to accept the evidence contrary to their beliefs.

[LCHFinCanada]

No, it's easy to ASSUME that exercise was the confounder not accounted for in the data.

To suggest that all the people eating more saturated fat exercised more than all the people eating less saturated fat is absurd. The scenario is not only statistically unlikely, but statistically improbable.

Especially as it's not what studies that confirm that saturated fat is healthy show.

The scientific evidence is clear, the lipid hypothesis is a busted myth.

[LCHFinCanada]

I could go on, but you get the point. The Cholesterol scam is a scam. The lipid Hypothesis is disproven repeatedly.

Saying anything else is ridiculous and just trolling or spreading propaganda.

[llwayneio]

@LCHFinCanada Cholesterol is one risk factor, populations with lower chd risk while having a higher cholesterol dont disprove the idea that cholesterol plays a part in chd. The populations could have been engaging in dietary and lifestyles factors which negated the risks. I think your thoughts on catelli's agenda sound paranoid, its pretty easy to understand that exercise was the confounder that wasnt accounted for in that data.

[LCHFinCanada]

How about a study done by Gilman, et al and published in the Journal of the American Medical Association found that …

THE MORE SATURATED FAT YOU EAT, THE LESS LIKELY YOU ARE TO SUFFER A STROKE.

[LCHFinCanada]

Then there’s the statistic that half of all heart attacks occur in people with “normal” total cholesterol. This fact was reported without much fanfare in an eye-open­ing 1996 article by Dr. William Castelli, who was director of the Framingham study research group at the time.

[LCHFinCanada]

By contrast, you don’t read much about a population study that showed how the French have the highest total cholesterol levels in Europe—about 250—but the lowest incidence of heart disease. Or how a 10-year study on the Greek island of Crete FAILED TO RECORD A SINGLE HEART ATTACK despite its participants having an average total cholesterol of well over 200.

[LCHFinCanada]

Cholesterol / heart-disease theory is a con perpetuated by big-pharma with the media as it's willing tool.

To this day, practically all of what has been published about cholesterol—and received media attention—supports the current cholesterol paradigm. Worse, it appears to have the backing of the pharmaceutical and low-fat food industries, as well as leading regu­latory agencies and medical organizations.

[bluri49]

Wow! What maturity. Anyways there are extremes on both ends. I find it interesting however that Paula Deen who just announced that she has been diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes 3 yrs ago!! And now finally announces it "because she didn't know what to do with it at the time" and "didn't know much about it" What a coincidence that she now makes the announcement while being compensated by a pharmecuetical company. Meanwhile she has a cooking show making food with tons of fat and sugar!

[AlbertaBeefy]

Is it possible people are getting AWAY from the fact that this video is about Neal Barnard speaking about DIABETES...

It's not about saturated fat / lipid hypothesis folks.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver there's really no point debating anything with you. You're unreasonable, unwilling to show any evidence backing up your claims. You cannot refute (or don't care) that low cholesterol = shorter lifespan...

So you're pretty brainwashed and I cannot fix that.

I contend the ONLY argument for veganism is the ethical one. All science is inconclusive and you cannot, regardless of how loud you yell and scream like a lunatic, prove otherwise.

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada I've just provided you with a wealth of evidence from the most prestigous science and medical bodies in Norther America, backing my "claims". We can trade insults back and forth. Even most meat eaters will assert that your fringe theories are made without considertion of logic, common sense or science. Veganism is not only the most ethical choice of existence but it is also in relation to human health. Animal products cause premature death and chronic disease FACT.

[ConcreteRiver]

@ConcreteRiver I suggest you spend your time on YT in a more constructive manner instead of trolling these videos by life changing medical professionals like Dr. Barnard, with whom you don't agree with. Fried meat and butter are NOT slimming or healthy foods. The most militant vegan or voracious frat boy carnivore will all agree on that.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver It's not about whether I agree with him - Barnard didn't even do a proper study before making the claim that diabetes is best treated with a plant-based diet. Because he's a propagandist.

Can you quickly explain why the hundreds of studies done under the IDF (International Diabetes Federation) show low-carb is best for treatment of diabetes?

Do you even KNOW what Barnards success stories were - that the "reversal" never even got people to healthy glucose levels?

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver good lord you're thick. You may not think butter is healthy, but dozens of low-carb vs. low-fat studies prove you wrong. How do you argue those?

No studies conclusively prove saturated fat causes heart disease.

Studies do conclusively prove low-carb better than low-fat for both glycemic control and weight loss. How do you explain that? By calling me names?? roflmao.

I'm now done with you. You're the real troll.

[llwayneio]

@LCHFinCanada you argue for a lchf diet by saying that low cholesterol = shorter lifespan, but at the same time you say that dietary fat has no effect on cholesterol and that carbs raise cholesterol? Seems a little inconsistent. Also that Dr. William Castelli quote has been taken out of context

[LCHFinCanada]

@llwayneio No sir, I said low-cholesterol = shorter lifespan in argument to the lipid hypothesis.

There's no inconsistency here. You're looking at two entirely different subjects.

[llwayneio]

@LCHFinCanada There is inconsistency, you say eating a high saturated fat diet lowers cholesterol but at the same time argue that a low cholesterol level is an indicator of poor health, do you not see the contradiction? In regards to the castelli quote he says "That quote is correct but its' interpretation by Atkins and Sugar Busters and others is wrong." the data was indicating that higher activity levels were responsible for the lower body weight and cholesterol.

[LCHFinCanada]

@llwayneio No, I said that very low levels under 150 show a higher risk of mortality.

Many vegans keep saying saturated fat is bad, that cholesterol is bad, and I'm arguing that NO, it's not. Don't you get THAT?

Too little cholesterol isn't healthy according to the science. Dropping refined carbs/sugars and eating saturated fat will lower cholesterol, but not to dangerous levels. Maybe read the research on it yourself.

[LCHFinCanada]

@llwayneio castelli likes to argue that because he's pro-veg. But he said what he said, and meant it.

[LCHFinCanada]

@llwayneio Lets hear from other people from Framingham:

Retired Vanderbilt University biochem­ist George Mann—who helped develop the world-famous Framingham heart disease study that raised interest in cholesterol—later described the cholester­ol hypothesis as “the greatest scam ever perpetrated on the American public.”

[LCHFinCanada]

@llwayneio and how do you figure the Dr. William Castelli quote was taken out of context?

[LCHFinCanada]

@LCHFinCanada BTW, you realize Castelli was VERY RELUCTANT to admit what he said, but when faced with the data had no choice.

He still personally believes in the lipid hypothesis, despite all the evidence to the contrary. He's admitted that too.

You can say it's "out of context" but the truth is, WHAT I QUOTED WAS THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH and he won't deny even having said it, but tries to obfuscate it.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver I haven't read it and don't own it so cannot comment.

But I'm not using 1967 data, so what's your point?

[LCHFinCanada]

And, one more "nail in the head" of Framingham's coffin:

"For those participants who were over age 50, lower cholesterol rates were associated with a higher risk of death from CHD and all causes. In fact, for every 1 mg/dl drop in cholesterol levels, there was a 14% increase in heart related death, and an 11% increase in overall mortality."

In other words, declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death from all causes, not just CHD.

So what DID Framingham prove, again?

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada LOL. You are a funny troll.

Framingham has proved exactly what I said it proved. People with cholesterol levels below 150 do not suffer CVD or heart attacks. Dr Castelli himself stated

" People with total cholesterol levels under 150 just don't get heart disease."

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver And people with low cholesterol die earlier than those with high cholesterol. Well established fact.

How do you explain that?

Cholesterol is important for a long, healthy life, period. The only association with heart disease remains cholesterol HIGHER than 300, and that only with men. Proven by framingham and other studies, btw.

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada Oh so now your change your tune, troll!! Elevated levels of cholesterol in the body are great and guarantee a long healthy life WITH THE EXCEPTION of men over 300. So once cholesterol levels do increase to above 300, what is your suggestion? Should one take steps to limit or cessate their intake of dietary cholesterol?? Do they risk early death or CVD should this elevated cholesterol level continue? What is truly sick is trying to back up your claims with science.FFS

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver I'm not changing any tune. I've stated the same thing all along - There IS NO EVIDENCE THAT DIETARY INTAKE OF FAT CORRESPONDS TO HEART DISEASE.

That's all I've ever said.

There is also no evidence that dietary intake of healthy fats increases our serum cholesterol.

Maybe learn to read what I write. Geesh.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver There are many reasons for high cholesterol that have nothing to do with diet.  In some people, it's genetics. My mother ate the healthiest diet (even by vegan standards) you can imagine, and had high cholesterol.

Some are genetically predisposed to it.

There is considerable evidence now pointing to intake of refined/processed carbs/sugars being the cause of increased dietary cholesterol. Not fats (except trans fats,those are scary.)

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada I think you need to look at the Lipid Cholesterol Risk Chart, google is your friend, troll. Lower levels of Cholesterol almost guarantee you will never develop heart disease. And meat eaters and others who consume high levels of animal products almost always have very high cholesterol levels. But again that doesn't matter to you does it!!! The more cholesterol that one eats, the better eh!!!LOL

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Wow, I'm the troll?

Lower levels of cholesterol are PROVEN to be predictors of earlier mortality.

[LCHFinCanada]

Further, regrading Framingham. This is a DIRECT QUOTE from the study:

"There is, in short, no suggestion of any relation between diet and the subsequent development of CHD in the study group"

The study also showed no relationship between cholesterol, coronary heart disease and DIET.

So how, in heaven's name, do you figure Framingham proved these things? You're just repeating vegan dogma without reading studies yourself, aren't you?

[LCHFinCanada]

Re: Framingham: Forty years after the start of this study, its director, Dr. William Castelli, reluctantly admitted, In Framingham, the more saturated fat one ate, the more cholesterol one ate, the more calories one ate, the lower the person's serum cholesterol.

We found that the people who ate the most cholesterol, ate the most saturated fat, and ate the most calories, weighed the least and were the most active.

[LCHFinCanada]

@LCHFinCanada Also, framingham DID find an association between high serum cholesterol and risk for future heart disease, but only an association - which isn't proof.

It was also ONE of TWO HUNDRED FORTY such "risk factor" associations found, and has never been proven.

Evidence is that more than 50% (some studies show 75%) of people having heart attacks have normal blood serum cholesterol.

The lipid hypothesis has, in over 50 years, never been proven. Only discredited.

[LCHFinCanada]

Vegans often only rely on older studies - it's true that prior to a decade ago, dietary fat WAS "linked" (correlation doesn't = causation) to cancer. After dozens of studies trying to prove the theory, they all failed.

Eventually studies looked at the inverse - and they now conclude dietary fat intake has nothing to do with cancer and heart disease - except possibly TRANS FAT intake.

[LCHFinCanada]

For example: A recent U.S. government study has found that a low-fat diet does not significantly reduce the risk of breast cancer, heart disease or stroke and does not reduce the risk of colorectal cancer in postmenopausal women. (Journal of the AMA)

How can that be if what you say is right?

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada American Diatetics Association, American Medical Association, Tufts University School of Medicine, American Kidney Foundation, American College of Cardiology, National Academy of Science, The Mayo Clinic, The Cleveland Clinic, The American College of Nutrition, British Medical Journal, American Journal of Clinical Nutrition and countless others have all released papers, articles, and studies showing the dangers of a high cholesterol and saturated fat intake.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Not a one conclusive. In fact, many of the same organizations have released papers showing the reverse. What's your point?

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada Westerners are eating more saturated fat, more cholesterol and more animal proteins than ever before. The intake of meat and dairy products have skyrocketed. And North Americans are fatter and sicker than they've ever been. There is no question that hyrdogenated oils and refined sugary junk food are also part of the problem. But to be a cholesterol apologist on top of it, You are just kidding yourself pal

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver actually, western people decreased their intake of fats AND increased their carbohydrate intake as heart disease skyrocketed.  Of course this was primarily refined/processed carbs.

This would indicate a main contributor is refined/processed carbs, not fat.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Why would anyone continue to believe in a 50 year old, unproven, oft-debunked theory? You're kidding YOURSELF, pal.

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada LOL. Removed your troll post did ya?! Very trollish of you. To suggest that there is no scientific data to show the dangers which animal products pose to the human health exists, you further deepen your stupidity:

The Cornell China Study(aka The China StudyDr. T Colin Campbell and Dr Junshi Chen-proves high animal product intake increases cancer and CVD mortality. Framingham Heart Study(ongoing since 1948) proves high saturated fat and cholesterol intake leads to CVD

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver I was going to re-write it, and when I refreshed YOUR post was also gone. couldn't find it again to respond to.

[ConcreteRiver]

@LCHFinCanada You deleted your post and chose to reply under a different YT username, a common tactic amongst paleo/primal trolls.

These exhaustive studies were NEVER "debunked" as you assert by any independent or scientifically unbiased group or organization. Of course when you show how unhealthy and dagerous that animal fat and animal proteins are to the human body, you're going to get people who eat and sell these products to people, very angry and upset.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Well, I hate to tell you this, I deleted one post and then replied under THIS username, as it's the only one i got. But hey, believe whatever.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver so, what make you of the dozens of studies that show increasing saturated fat intake improves all markers of cardiovascular disease?

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Framingham never proved any such thing. Maybe REALLY look at the study, rather than just unadjusted data.

Same with The China Study. It's been debunked by numerous people, not just Denise Minger (who all vegans think is like the vegan antichrist now, roflmao).

The China Study also proved nothing, and used unadjusted data for it's conclusions. When called on this, Campbell references Mingers unadjusted data... Pot - meet kettle.

His study is bunk.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver also, It's interesting that Campbell - a noted vegan for many years, and a member of pro-vegan-propaganda agency PCRM - obviously started the book with a bias toward veganism (don't say he didn't, that's bull), and still managed to be easily debunked by anyone with any scientific background.

Yet independent studies and those funded by the meat industry can't be debunked by vegans...

Your "proof" is lacking. Every other scientific study done debunks it, period.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver Other noted vegan authors: Barnard (Diabetes), Esselstyn (Heart Disease) make grandiose claims also easily debunked.

The truth is veganism is healthier than a Standard American Diet. That's true.

There is no vegan study that has ever concluded meat is unhealthy. They all rely on unadjusted data, confounding variables and people to stupid to understand.

You probably buy into Esselstyn's and Barnard's theories too though, even though they're quite full of it.

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver got anything OTHER than the oft-debunked china study?

[LCHFinCanada]

@ConcreteRiver ... and, how is asking you to provide scientific evidence trolling?

If that's trolling, you have a lot to learn. But then again, most vegans do - they just won't listen to fact.

I can present you dozens of studies showing meat is healthy. Studies showing vegans get more colorectal cancer than non-vegans. Showing Mormons (meat-eaters) getting less of all cancers than 7th-day adventists (vegans) ... but you'll likely discount that because you like your ignorance.

[anwallad]

I am looking to eat foods with protein and low in sugar salt and potassium. Where do I go.

[mooncooninc83]

@anwallad You should check out a man by the name of Dr. Sebi. He's been speaking about this stuff for decades now. He's documented as curing HIV/AIDS, diabetes, lukemia, cancer, and other diseases.

[90Rush]

Also, we Chinese don't eat loads of carbs. We eat rice in small bowls, not in those huge plates. Cooked rice is also full of water.

[90Rush]

Well, I'm from China. My only relative who has metabolic syndromes is a cousin. She is obese, so logically she cuts all meat from her diet but strangely, she just keeps getting fatter. My mom eats loads of fat. She loves pig hooves. My grandparents love quail eggs. Both have loads of cholesterol. Strangely none of them get fat...

[6713joe]

@90Rush

good post. How about the comparison of sugar intake?. Especially non fruit sugars. I know you have not done a study on them, but you know a little about their eating habits.

[AlbertaBeefy]

OK, I've read Dr. Esselstyn's study - but it does not prove that the reversal was the elimination of meats/fats. It could easily have been the elimination of all the refined sugars and flours, etc. And, in fact, people lower their serum cholesterol lower on a LCHF diet than his results claim.

In order for any study like his to be valid, they MUST prove it's the elimination of meats, by having more than one group. His was not a randomized controlled study, and is therefore worthless.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy You need to read the book he doesn't elimante all flours as he allows whole grain pastas and breads as long as there is no oil and still people reversed their disease. 

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog so, he eliminates all REFINED floury and sugary products, and eliminates all refined/processed (and completely unnatural) oils...

... and you conclude it's the meat? How?

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy just use your own logic for the paleo diet also as they conclude carbs are the problem even from whole foods and should be limited even though the base of all the longest-lived populations was starch and not meat. Meat is part of the problem not all of the problem just like the oils are part of the problem

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog "longest-lived" is due to advances in medical and health science, better-safety in working conditions, better-access to health care, etc.

It's not about the diet. We'd live even longer if we'd cut out refined crap.

I'm not saying veganism is wrong - people are free to eat a meat-free lifestyle if they want. I truly believe it's the REFINED, PROCESSED, GENETICALLY-MODIFIED carbs that are the problem. And sugars - almost all except fresh fruit. Refined/processed crap is the killer.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy cool man I wish you the best with whatever you do!

[AlbertaBeefy]

@BeautyEnhancements4U Nope, neither sad nor desperate. I just don't like the promotion of misinformation.

I'm not even saying Vegan lifestyles aren't healthy - if you want to be vegan, go for it. I *AM* saying a low-carb/high-fat diet is also very healthy, especially for heart health.

Fresh veggies are great. Fresh fruits (in moderation for us diabetics) are great. Meats are also great.

What's not great is genetically modified soybeans, genetically modified wheat, and refined crap.

[BeautyEnhancements4U]

@AlbertaBeefy GM should banned. It's dangerous and wrong on every level.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@BeautyEnhancements4U Amazingly, we DO have something in common, LOL.

[BeautyEnhancements4U]

@AlbertaBeefy Yeah, of course we do. And I'm sorry I was a complete twat... Youtube must have bought out the worse in me. I was wrong to swear and be bad tempered. Thank you for teaching me. God/dess bless you x x x

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy Yeah I'm a shill??lol Calm down bro. Anyways fat is a problem as shown in essesltyn's study (you shoud read it) and when it's cut out everything improves. A hig-carb low fat plant based diet is the only one proven in peer-reviewed studies to reverse heart disease. When are these paleo guys gonna publish their studies that show the same.  Judge by results not by theory.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog tell you what, I'll read it, but please be aware I'll do so with a critical review stance and do my best to show why fats aren't bad... Fair 'nuff?

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog BTW, there are many studies on paleo. Many. Just hit google, type in "paleo diet", choose 'scholar' and look a them all.

Amazingly, they show paleo improves heart health, among other things.

Again though, paleo cuts out all refined sugars, starches, grains, etc. When both a paleo diet and a vegan diet are cutting out the same products with the same results, it's only common-sense to conclude the "bad guy" in the diet is those products...

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy There is a reason there is peer review and why people put their studies up for peer review to show it is legit. The only diet to reverse heart disease using this method is a high carb low fat plant based diet with starch being the main calorie source (rice,quinoa,potatoes,corn,etc­)

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog I understand well the process of peer-review. But none of this is actually factual... it's very misleading "science". Heck, I'd actually classify it as psuedo-science.

Don't believe me? Read a very interesting review/critique here at the RAW FOOD SOS blog. You'll find it easily if you want to.

Care to counter any of that very articulate, scientific argument against forks over knives?

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy Denise minger is just a random blogger and hasn't really debunked anything. I've read her articles already.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog That "random blogger" has gathered all her information from very reputable scientists. I've read the studies myself now as well as what other scientists have to say.

Believe me, your "random blogger" has far more nutritional education that ANY medical doctor gets in university. (And I would know, I've been there.)

Don't take my word for it, check out other information of nutrition at Zoe Harcombe's website. She's a Cambridge-educated nutritionist and obesity expert.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog Also, regarding "peer review" ... it's flawed, doesn't work and rarely dooms an inconclusive or misleading study. It's rigged.

Google "research study peer review doesn't work" if you don't believe me.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy what's more credible than peer-review then?

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog Only honesty and the intelligence to review an article yourself, rather than simply skipping to the "conclusions" page.

that's the problem with most of these - research scientists are paid to try to reach a certain conclusion... so they twist their data or have obvious gaps in order to reach said conclusion.

Some outright lie.

Peer-review has many, many problems. Unfortunately, the only solution is for people to educate themselves and not take what a scientist has to say... they lie.

[82Bdog]

@lovebigboobs29 All the longest-lived populations ever studied ate a high carb-low fat plant based diet and meat was a very small percentage (less than 3%), which would make his reccommendations closest to what they ate. The okinawans were (before 1950 when they became westernized) a great example and had the most centenarians of any population ever studied. Almost 70% of cals were from sweet potatoes. This same diet has reversed type 2 diabetes and heart disease in studies also.

[lovebigboobs29]

@82Bdog Wrong a balanced diet with meat included in your meals is the best diet. Okinawans ate mainly fish so thats a meat. Nothing can reverse those diseases. You listen to too many vegan idiot doctors then real facts. Meat is not bad for you as long as red meat which is the fattier meat is moderated to twice a week and the other times eat chicken and fish. Limit fried food. Any nutrition course tell you that as well a nutritonlists.

[82Bdog]

@lovebigboobs29 No they didn't if you read credible studies on what they ate pre-1950 they ate very little fish at all so little it must have been used as a condiment. Any nutritionist is not getting the results these doctors you insult are getting. Moderation is dangerous and has been said for years while heart disease and cancer in the western world goes up.

[lovebigboobs29]

@82Bdog You're incorrect. Moderation is healthy. Eating lean chicken and fish is also healthy. These doctors that are vegan are nutjobs. The diseases aren't going up do to animal product consumption.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog Ornish and Esselstyn also recommend eating less sugars and refined carbs.  Their results are from reducing carbs, THAT'S IT.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy they don't reduce carbs. It's a high carb diet, yes they take out refined carbs but they don't reduce carbs. That's IT

[AlbertaBeefy]

This guy is a vegan paid by PETA (yes, his organization that he runs is funded by PETA) to push a vegan lifestyle.

Dietary fat doesn't equate to bodyfat. Body fat comes when excess insulin meets excess carbohydrate / blood glucose. Duh. He doesn't seem to understand science, like most people with an agenda to make money.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy You fool! This guy has been reversing diabetes in patients for years with his diet reccomendations and the diet he reccommends just so happens to be the only diet clinically proven to reverse heart disease(dr.'ornish and esselstyn) A high carb-low fat plant based diet is the best and is closest to what all the longest-lived populations ever studied ate.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog I'm the fool?? Perhaps you should actually read research articles.

People on his diet control diabetes better because he recommends they cut sugars and processed carbs. Results have nothing to do with veganism. Also, you're wrong on the ornish/esselstyn diet being the only to reverse heart disease. That's very flawed research.

Read some REAL articles before spouting off crap.

If you think I'm a fool, link me to ONE proper controlled trial showing otherwise, OK? I have the facts.

[82Bdog]

@AlbertaBeefy That's your problem quit reading articles and read actual peer-reviewed studies or at least read people who back up what they say with credible studies. Jeff novick is a good example as he backs up everything he says with credible studies. Dr.neal barnard reverses diabetes in patients with a high-carb diet plant based diet and esselstyn and ornish reversed heart disease in patients and they all published their studies. There's your proof.

[AlbertaBeefy]

@82Bdog It's not the plant-based diet, it's the reduction of sugars, refined carbs, etc. Those are what's causing the issues, including heart disease.

All the peer-reviewed research studies point to this. Maybe google some? I know I did and found about 15 in 5 minutes...

[lovebigboobs29]

@VPolito111 I agree I know this guy is a joke. He is trying to screw with peoples health and make them worst.

[LordAngus1992]

@terrillcase1 Correction: Us vegans are the saviors of this planet and anyone opposing us is the "bad guy". Enjoy your chicken, you will be rewarded with a heart attack.

[MightyJabroni]

@LordAngus1992

How do you want to convince anyone from anything if you start flat out with that they are all assholes to begin with and deserve to die? Maybe you would do a greater service to your cause if you wouldn't come across like an elitist prick. What is important more for you? To debate and communicate something about your lifestyle or to look really tough on the internet?

[aLittleInsanityVideo]

@monodentate Thanks for the heads-up!! I know what I'll be watching this evening! =)

[2c4u222]

UNLESS the breastfeeding mom drinks milk. The only kid I know with Type 1 was breastfed, as were all her siblings.

[jprcfp]

Saw FOK on Netflix and highly recommend it. I've been vegan 17 months now and have lost 70 lbs blood sugar in normal range and cholesterol has dropped significantly I feel better than in 20 years! Dr Barnard book changed my life for which I am grateful!

[couponconsultant]

It's on Netflix NOW...on instant play.

[jdonnella]

It's on Netflix! Caught it the other night.

[adkpinecone]

Excellent! :-)

[sueryun]

what about soy milk? im assuming that okey. and there's almond milk, i hear coconut milk is good too

[NeoPeasant]

Warning - Dr. Neal Barnard is an infamous vegan zealot. He cares nothing for your health, only for your potential conversion to vegan-ness. He starts with the ideology that humanity should be vegan and goes around cherry picking data trying to support it.

[MightyJabroni]

The only thing that can be problematic with vegan nutrition is a possible lack of Vit B 12 (which is produced by bacterias). I personally cut all eggs, dairy products and with the exception of fish any other meat out of my nutrition. And I honestly can tell that I feel great!

I don't advocate to neccesarily live without meat. But peple in the western countries eat too much of it - WAY too much! Same goes for white sugar and white flour. And dairy products are so overated - it's laughable.

[LordAngus1992]

@MightyJabroni Stop eating fish. It reduces your B12 levels. Find out what your B12 levels are in the first place before you presume you have a deficiency. If you are deficient, it's not caused by a deficiency in fish, it's caused by the B12 producing micro-flora being sterilized from produce and acidic foods such as meat killing the same micro-flora in your intestinal lining. As a result, cutting out the fish alone may solve the problem. If not, get injections.

[MightyJabroni]

@LordAngus1992

Fish reduces B12 levels? How looks the nutritional mechanism that makes this come about?

[lovebigboobs29]

@LordAngus1992 Fish doesn't reduce B12 levels. Just like meat doesn't cause diabeties.

[MightyJabroni]

@NeoPeasant

Anyway - the key isn't the strict reduction of animal products alone. It is what you eat instead. Being something like a junkfood vegan is really a bad idea. If animal products just play a very little role in your nutrition and the by far bigger part of your nutrition is covered by fresh vegetables and fruit, complex carbs and unsaturated fats you are absoloutely going towards the right direction.

[LordAngus1992]

@NeoPeasant It's hard not to be a zealot as a vegan, that's like saying the allies during WW2 were zealots, it's a matter of good and evil. If he doesn't care about anyone's health, then why does he dedicate his life to improving people's health? It's a scientifically proven fact that humans are supposed to be vegan which is not an ideology at all. He does not cherry pick either, he doesn't need to, there is nothing that proves him wrong.

[LordAngus1992]

@NeoPeasant Omnivores are the cherry pickers, you ignore all vegan success stories and instead pick out the ones who failed on a Vegan diet because they did it wrong and are worse off eating animal products anyways.

[stockinettestitch]

@NeoPeasant Evidence? You give nothing in your post but attacks on him, nothing to back it up.

[rnm354]

@NeoPeasant --"He cares NOTHING about your health".???? Shame on you for such a stupid comment and for such statements that have nothing to do with reality or FACT!

[av3ed]

I've seen it twice. It's life changing.

[fleshpeddler]

I've read the publication that Dr. Barnard references in this video, and while it does show that his low-fat vegan diet is slightly better at lowering some of the biomarkers associated with diabetes (which may not have been enough to benefit the patient's well-being), it doesn't compare the diet to one that is nutritionally similar to his vegan diet.

Was it the "vegan" or "different nutritional profile" aspect that helped? Can't a non-vegan use an identical dietary strategy to combat Type II?

[fleshpeddler]

I've read the publication that Dr. Barnard references in this video, and while it does show that his low-fat vegan diet is slightly better at lowering some of the biomarkers associated with diabetes (which may not have been enough to benefit the patient's well-being), it doesn't compare the diet to one that is nutritionally similar to his vegan diet.

Was it the "vegan", or "different nutritional profile" aspect that helped? Can't a non-vegan use an identical dietary strategy to combat Type II?

[82Bdog]

@fleshpeddler I guess if they can keep the fat low but that would be nearly impossible. I mean a piece here and there may be ok but not neccessary. Read dr. ornish and esselstyn's studies also where they used the same diet to reverse heart disease and esselstyn noticed in one patient that cutting out even the little bit of olive oil in his diet was neccessary for reversal of his disease.

[lovsoup]

Our hormones need good fat too

[GedderzGaming]

what rubbish!

[lovsoup]

Goat Milk is healthier than Cows milk. Many people report their digestive problems improve with Goat yogurt, goat feta, goat whey or goat protein. it's has bioorganic sodium instead of calcium like cows milk making them more limber too and their casein is smaller so it's able to be absorbed into human gut easier. Check out Abunda life.com about Amazing Benefits of goat milk. Hopefully this comment won't be denied becuz so many people feel better with pasture raised goats

[lovsoup]

Not ALL fat is bad... cooked fats, especially PUFA (unsaturated fats) are terrible and transfats ... our brain is made of fat. we need some good fat

[renzi28]

The question that comes to mind from watching this is:

Does human breast-milk contain casein like cow's milk does?

[BlueEagle8]

Can you post the video on milk/dairy and how it causes osteoporosis by creating an acidic environment.

[LauraaBaybbiiee]

Thumbs up if SteveO sent you here :')

[SibelCatana]

@BitterGnome Me too! :)

[aLittleInsanityVideo]

Really looking forward to seeing the full length feature film... It's not coming to my area, so I'm hoping it will be available online or Netflix at some point! God Bless!

[mscashwell]

@aLittleInsanityVideo Interesting film. You may pre-order the book "FOK". Also, the main docs in the film have other related books as well. Hopefully, youtube will make it available for viewing through their movies links. I noticed that "Food, Inc." is available there.

[maslater1313]

@mscashwell Food, Inc. is about government control of our food and GM foods...not nutrition. NOT a good movie at all. FOK is about eating a healthy diet and avoiding degenerative diseases by way of eating right....not Micheal Pollan trying to sell books. Do not recommend Food, Inc. FOK will be available on DVD by Sept.