3100 cold start up the so call piston slap

[RocketFast321]

My mom did not take care it when i left. When i found out the oil leak it was to late. I miss that good motor. See part 2. And i have i video of it back in it's great day. Malibu or not them things 3100 were speedy.

[merk247]

like forged pistons that tick cold. pistons warm up and expand noise gone/almost gone

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

I've noticed that some engines go a lot of miles and never fully fail. That says a lot for today's tighter tolerance engines, and better lubricants. Those that do a lot of easier driving, such as highway driving rather than short- trip, stop-and-go driving will typically have less chance of a major failure. Regardless, it's a crap shoot. Coolant IS leaking into your engine's crankcase and/or cylinders, due to bad intake gaskets. That's ultimately what's causing the lifter tick, WATER in the OIL.

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

Sounds like shit, like always... New lifters, new intake manifold gaskets, along with a coolant flush and refill of GREEN or Yellow mix w/ all types) coolant will fix this problem permanently. Don't forget an oil & filter change also. If you're unlucky, this noise will get much worse. The coolant leaking into the engine will cause a lot of other problems besides the lifter tick. If you want the engine to last, you should always get it fixed as soon as you first hear the ticking start to happen.

[Johnny64ism]

Sounded good 2 me

[jake1110]

My 98 Grand Am has had this exact same piston slap "problem" since 2005ish and still runs just fine with 175K miles. To this day, people still comment that there is something wrong with my engine...but I've been driving this car for 8 years just fine, so I don't really think anything wrong. Just a bad design choice, but it functions normally after warming up.

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@jake1110: It's NOT piston-slap, it's lifter-tick. Most people wouldn't know piston-slap if it slapped them upside their head. It's a common mis-diagnosis by many stupid or uneducated people out there. What happens is this... Over time, the intake gaskets fail and coolant gets into the engine oil. The coolant/oli mix prevents the hydraulic lifters from pumping up properly, creating lots of noise. The lifters are POUNDING into the camshaft and the pushrods, much like hammers hitting nails.

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@jake1110: You ought to fix your car, or eventually it's going to get really bad and that will be the end of your engine. You need intake manifold gaskets, new lifters, GREEN (or Yellow, mixes with all types) coolant (NOT that DexCool crap), and an engine oil & filter change. Not a bad design choice at all. Problem caused by improper material used in production of the OEM intake gaskets, which were not compatible with their DexCool coolant, which degrades them over time from chemical reaction.

[jake1110]

@SuperTurboDiesel2 Gotcha. I actually sold my Grand Am and bought a nice 2010 Fusion Hybrid(city efficiency was important to me and I didn't want a Toyota).

The buyer seemed well aware of my car's issue and still paid me $900 for it(it was salvaged title too). I assume he'll be able to fix it cheaply. It's a shame there's so much misinformation, because the ubiquitous answer always seemed to be "piston slap". Doing further research, I see how Dexcool really screwed the pooch on that one.

[jp198780]

my Aurora did the same, ran fine once warmed..think my Lumina does the same, never really noticed, and that has 58k

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@jp198780: Get it fixed now, and it will outlast the rest of the car. Wait, and evenutally you will have the same problem. Most lifter tick issues happen as the mileage and time increase. The DexCool continues to eat away the garbage OEM intake gaskets used by GM at the assembly plant, and eventually the coolant will get into your oil and cause the lifters to not pump up properly. The trace coolant in the oil will also ruin crank & cam bearings and other items normally lubed by the engine oil.

[jp198780]

@SuperTurboDiesel2 how would i fix that? i think i tried puttin Seafoam in it to see if it would quiet it down, but i guess it didnt really go away. car now has 66k, today

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@jp198780: Read my other replies on this subject. I'll be honest, I'm getting sick of repeating myself. You need new lifters, intake manifold gaskets, Green or Yellow coolant, and an oil change. It is a pretty costly job, but not terribly difficult, just time consuming. Takes around 6 hours or so for a mechanic. Unless you are mechanically inclined and understand cooling systems, I'd recommend you have an experienced tech or auto shop do the work. It's gonna run you around $500 - $700 total.

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@jp198780: Unfortunately, there's NO "magic quick-fix" that will stop the problem. Just gotta bite the bullet and spend the money and get your engine fixed. Once you do, you will be glad you did. BTW, if you can do the repair yourself, you will spend around $350 or less on the parts you need. If you have it done, the shop labor is quite a bit more, often pushing you total expenditure into the $500 to $700 range, as previously mentioned. I have 2 of these jobs scheduled for the upcoming month.

[willschofield82]

@SuperTurboDiesel2 I have to disagree. I've done SEVERAL LIM gaskets, and a few head gaskets if the customer wants the added security since I'm down that far anyways. The lifters aren't the problem. There is a tech bulletin for this from GM. Replace the other three slugs with ceramic coated pistons and the sound you hear goes away without changing anything in the valvetrain. Why did the general recommend only three in their bulletin I'm sure is for cost savings. buy all 6 to make it purr!

[hjewell2]

my 3.1 did that for 178000 miles

[ladygodia]

@hjewell2 what happened to it at 178001 miles?

[hjewell2]

@ladygodia same thing until 225000 then i sold it.

[art128598]

every 3.1 engine i have ever heard makes this knocking sound.

[SuperTurboDiesel2]

@art128598: LOL, not the properly repaired ones! LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!

[tan94319]

i have a question i just got a used 99 chevy malibu and i wanted to know if there is suppose to be something connected above the ect senser because in my MALIBU the are only 2 little metal stick pointing out and i want to know if there is suppose to be something there HELP!!?

[RocketFast321]

@tan94319

i don't see nothing else else above it

[dunn98632]

I hear it but thats nothing ever to worry about.

[grngs1]

Its piston slap, the pistons rattle a bit till the warm up and expand, my 3.4 does it too, not a big deal, drive the car its fine. If it was lifters they would chatter a bit on start up, then quiet down after oil fills 'em. THATS piston slap.

[jungledrum123]

Piston slap sounds more like the engine knock

So ask your self is it knock or tick. I also see comments that folks think piston slap is ok. Well its not. Piston slap will hurt the life of the motor for sure.

[jungledrum123]

Somebody lied to you. The sounds i hear is lifters. Piston slap will be much much louder then this. Although 3.1,3.4,3.8,s are very commen for early morning crank and hearing lifters pump back up. After they sit they tend to lose the seal and just need tlc. Marval oil or a thinner oil for 1k should fix the problem but the real way is to replace the lifters

[oilfield666]

could be lifters...could be piston slap....most ppl fire up their gas engine and dont let it warm up...just go....the aluminum piston in the steel cylinder isnt expanded. making even more wear. only going to get worse......try changing your oil more often or even checking it once in awhile

[12lipa]

If the sound goes away when the engine gets to its normal operating temperature, then this condition is normal. The piston compressions rings have not yet expanded to it's designed circumference when it's cold and the piston will slap. When the engine gets to it operating temperature and you can still hear the noise, then something is wrong.

[a2sonbull]

thats not piston slap.its your lifters just drain out 2 qts oil add 2 bottles marvell mystery oil and then change oil after 100 miles of driving normal no hot rodding it. use 5w30 valvoline with a fram filter it worked for me on 3.1 and a 3.4 liter.

[dirtandgrease]

Most new cars have self adjusting lifters which wear out after a while. Eventually they take a little longer to self adjust. Whatever you do, avoid using Rislone or thick oil additives, the oil will have a tougher time traveling through the engine (until the engine is warm). If your engine is aluminum, the trick is to find a thin oil that has good heat and friction protection. If you have a cast iron engine, the opposite is usually true, the thicker the oil, the better.

[clayster2]

gm 3.1 and 3.4 always do this. had a 2004 buick that did it before it hit 10,000 miles. took it to gm multiple times. kept telling me nothing. wrong. i just deal with it. doesnt get any worse. just cold start.

[95corsicav6]

yep thats piston slap, mine has it too. i have a 95 corsica. its completely normal as long as it goes away when it warms up. piston slap does not harm the engine in any way, unless you gun it while the slapping is still happening. it will continue to do that for the life of the car, but don't be surprised when the car is still running at 300,000 miles.

[Nsphere]

your over thinking it, its nothin serious

[uknowwatimsayin]

How does piston slap effect a car or is it just the sound? I say this as i've seen a car with it which is VERY cheap!!! =]

[RocketFast321]

I don't think i does. It just somthing they do when they are cold. To me it's the lifters.

[sideburns2009]

It is the pistons. They are aluminum and they expand quite a bit when they warm up so they were manufactured slightly smaller than they need to be to give way for the expanding they do once they are warm. Some have said synthetic 5w-30 oil helps keep the noise down a good bit. They all do this, from day one. Even the 3400 variant, like the one in my gma's 2002 impala with 53k miles on it.

[hurilo]

@RocketFast321 Piston slap doesn't effect the car at all. They get cold, contract, allowing more room for movement. After they get hot, they'll expand back into a tight fit. It is a very common noise and does sound alot like a shot lifter.

[Motorfordtoyota]

@RocketFast321 The pistons in these engines are loose fitting untill they warm up, thus causing the slap when cold. But, it should ONLY happen when the engine is cold. The loose fitting pistons cause less damage to the engine, and increase life. IF you let your car warm up!

[quentinm1995]

@RocketFast321 it is the lifters

[QueenSayuri]

@uknowwatimsayin In another video, a guy said GM designed the pistons a bit looser. As the car warms up the pistons will get tighter and the noise will disappear (or get better). They designed it this way so the car won't be as hot. At least, that's what he said...makes sense to me tho. :P

[FSDU5]

@uknowwatimsayin cars probably long gone... But its been heard that it really doesn't affect the car or its engine life. I've searched high and low and came to the conclusion that it's caused by the piston having just a little bit of room to move around in the cold cylinder shaft once warmed up by combustion or coolant.

[mikekamyszek1]

new pcv i see

[wantadecentusername]

only lifters 3.1l rare ly get piston slap 5.3l are most common for it and my 4.8l has a touch of the nasty gift to

[santawi]

Your timing chain guides and tensioner need to be checked. Its not piston slap, may be just noisy valve lifter.

[jimmy101112000]

My brother has a 1997 oldsmobile cutlass Supreme with the 3100 engine. That sound is piston slap. Its nothing major since it goes away when warmed up. What happened is that the pistons have teflon embedded in the skirt section. As the engine gets older more of the teflon wears off and then it starts banging the skirt against the cylinder as the engine runs. But the clearance gets tighter as the pistons gets hot and the noise goes away.

BTW the oldsmobile has 196,000 miles and counting.

[SpencerX2Productions]

I have a 1995 Buick Century with the same engine and same sound. You might want to try runing 10W-30 oil in it until it gets really cold out. I've found that helps reduce the "slaping" sound a little.

[IJackeDisLaptopNWhat]

i got the same exact engine in my grand am gt

[dimented24x7]

One problem Ive run into with these is wear at the rocker fulcrums and pushrod ends. They wipe out after a while and allow the lash to open up, causing valvetrain noise. Another issue is the composite intake gaskets.They break down over time. If (more like when) you do ultimately have to pull the intake for new gaskets, have a look at the rockers and pushrods. Id be willing to be that at least one will be excessively worn.

[jimmy101112000]

I seen the intake gaskets fail but not any rocker arms or pushrods. Those are not hard to replace. The lower intake can be a PITA to do.

[THOMASOAKMAN]

Its a GM Kill It

[g0ldrush]

Make a compression tes you'll probaly find the one that is knocking

[franck0011]

yeah your true ... its the lifters..... i had a olsdmobile with 3100 and i had the same thing when its cold.... and now i got a grand am with a 3400 and does same thing when cold .... its just a loose in the lifter and when it warm up it 'expand' and the loose is gone....

[ESESW1FTY323]

doesnt sound like your rod bearings...

[RocketFast321]

It's the lifters. Look at part 2. After 2 years still doing it. Still running great.

[bucks2743]

lifters ticking

[chelsierox]

its just the lifters

[RocketFast321]

I know but i would not get views if i said lifters. Everybody thinks it the pistons. Also look at the video response.

[midgetmayo]

mine makes the same sound lol

[mobman713]

@RocketFast321 lol youre right about the lifters but i LOL'ed when you said you wouldnt get views haha, good video anyways :)

[Elwiney]

@chelsierox What are the lifters

[fatman1000kg]

my moms pontiac montana does that too

[midgetmayo]

what car is it?

[loudmouthz]

My 95 Grand Prix has had that since day one. Thats was 14 years and two trannies ago.

[franck0011]

its not piston slap ... its the lifters ... me too my 3100 do this when its cold

[RocketFast321]

I know, i should make a updated video

[stevecurwin]

Would you make an Updated video

one of yo drving it on a cold day or warm day

[RocketFast321]

ok....

[stevecurwin]

YEp in deed it the way for the Engine to warm up faster it normal

[L88WOW]

I have a 99 Monte Carlo with the 3.1, sounds just like yours at cold start. I run engine easy till it warms up, has 134,000 miles on it and I use Castrol GTX Hi-mileage 10W30 every 3000 miles.

[jtreign9097]

thats normal on cold start mine has 213k and still works perfect but it does this in the cold. its just how these engines are. its not a problem its lifter tick not piston slap. it takes time for the oil to get to the lifters on a cold start due to all the oil being in the pan. when its warm its silent but if not silent at warm then that means its been overheated and u ruined the motor.

[fuku2bitch]

TIMING CHAIN

[fuku2bitch]

TIMING CHAIN :>

[RocketFast321]

nope at 1:06 is what it sounds like when it warms up. To this day it still ticks/rattles at cold start up. But I always knew it was never piston slap.

[jlicb4c]

I don't really hear any piston slap. I do hear the injectors and accessories.

[RocketFast321]

You don't hear the rattle around :30?

[jlicb4c]

Yeah injectors and accessories. Mostly injectors (they do make noise)

Trust me I have heard piston slap and that ain't it.

[edyman87]

i had same problem with my car. go get mobil 1 5w30 and u wont hear the noise anymore.

[sevastian74]

When I first got it mine did it too. I have a 00 Malibu LS, did the same thing on cold mornings. Im in Florida so a cold morning is like 65 degrees. It only does it until it warms up. I also did the Rislone thing, and switched it over to synthetic oil, and now it doesn't do it anymore.

[edyman87]

Good job thats what I did too. I went grabbed some rislone, switched to Mobil 1 5w30 synthetic oil. And now it sounds like Mercedes Benz loll. The Mobil 1 synthetic is little expensive but is well worth it.

[glucosemeter]

has anybody replaced head gaskets in a 3.1 before. is it easy or hard. let me know plz

[infinity3jif]

are you sure its the head gaskets and not the intake gasket I just had my head gaskets and intake gasket done on my 1997 chevy lumina the intake gaskets on these engines also makes oil and water mix together but yea it was'nt hard to me

[edyman87]

i paid 800 bucks to get my intake manifold gasket replaced.

[infinity3jif]

let me put it like this its not easy either

[importhater56401]

Head and intake gaskets for a 3100 are a royal pain in the ass. At a shop, both of those put together are almost 20 hours of labor.

I thought that my head and intake gaskets were shot on my 3100, since i had a very large coolant leak, but while my bro was prepping to do those 2, he noticed that the main seal(front engine cover) was soaking wet, and the gasket was mush...

So a new front seal went in, and it's like brand new.

[edyman87]

sell the car right now before it gets worst. i did that with my car. and after 4 months there was antifreaze leak from everywhere. the gaskets are shit on the 3.1 engines but the headgasket is really good.

[stevecurwin]

mine does it and never gotten worse

[stevecurwin]

that normal piston sound there built so they can expand more easier when they warm up adn it easier on the engine

[Tramp1973]

The 3.1 3.4L engines were shit. there is actually a web page how to sue GM over these piston slaping pieces of shit. it all so includes most GM engines currently made. it also includes a class action law suit going on to sue GM right now so if you own a 3.1, 3.4, 4.3, and various other v8's google search it and sue them. Before they go bankrupt lol.. wish i could post the web page but You tube will not let you !

[AeonBlueApocalypse]

I am an owner of a 2001 chevrolet malibu and i have experienced a similar problem with my 3.1 liter v6. When the car was started i got a really loud clunking and ticking noise that would increase with rpms when i drove would eventually quiet when it warmed up. I thought it was just valve noise from sticky lifters so i bought some rislone from auto zone. you replace a quart of your oil with it when you change it. Sure enough within 5 minutes of driving it went away and hasnt come back since. :)

[infinity3jif]

thats a piston slap nothing to worry about mines been doin that for years I have a 1997 Lumina just hit 200'000 miles and the plastic radiator blew

[stevecurwin]

hey iwas wondering if you could take more videos if that ok with you of you driving so we can hear the power in this engine

[ThoughtSpeaker]

This vid has helped me figure out the noise my car was making!

Just recently developed, same engine, just about time for an oil change. Is it still running fine?

[RocketFast321]

oh yea, but when it was 30f it did not tick weird

[stevecurwin]

there built like this so they can warm up alot faster as there mroe room for the piston to expand

[93grandamgt]

maybe weak oil pump plus the 3100 are known for having some kind of knock just how they were made.

[eurocrisp]

sounds like valvetrain or timing components as opposed to piston slap. could also just be noisy hydraulic lifters..

[wonka109]

I agree

[softsongs]

i have a 94 cutlass and the switch is stuck on it, well i changed it but its still wont start...can any1 help

[south301976]

Change the oil to synthetic and then change it again after 1000 miles and she will per, do not put thicker oil in this car, it will make the oil pump work harder and make it sound worse, these engines were designed for thin oil.

[themanytoys15]

USE SEAFOAM AND THEN CHANGE YOUR OIL WITH 10w-40 AND ADD ENGINE RESTORER AND IT SHOULD SHUT UP!!!

[RocketFast321]

the motor runs fine, its just on cold start-up. And on days like 32f it does not even tick on cold start-up. As you see at the end you relly can't hear the motor.

[themanytoys15]

well, i know what you mean, mine used to do that too on cold start but not anymore, you should try it and also you will feel the engine running smoother and better, just give it a try. My grand am runs like new! no bull shit!

[RocketFast321]

The is i would not even use ENGINE RESTORER in my 84 buick wagon

[dewangxp]

As a revision on 2005 3100 engine according to GM Powertrain website

A change in the compound used to plate the pistons helps reduced the clearance between the piston and wrist pin so that during cold starts, the noise cased by these components is significantly reduced or eliminated.

[dewangxp]

According to abridged version of TSB 01-06-01-005 Engine - Ticking Noise on Cold Start Up

Date: January, 2001

Subject:

Cold Engine Tick Noise

(Replace Pistons)

Cause

The noise may be caused by excessive piston to bore clearance during cold engine operation resulting from the specific piston design used in cylinders 1 through 4.

Important : Note that this is a customer annoyance issue, and does not affect the durability or life of the engine.

[dewangxp]

As for my 2000 Chevrolet Malibu, bought with 88,157 miles in 2004 and now has 170,000 miles on it, the 3100 still runs fine.

[jesterof84]

yay 3.1... yup my 94 3.1 and my 92 do that funny shit you can hear the injectors on these its not the valve train taping ... i miss my cavi :(

[boostphone59788888]

I got a 97 Monte Cralo with a 3.1 and it does the same thing

[indyguy3400]

kpj200.....That makes no sense what you said. Piston slap is caused by excessive clearance in the cylinder..its the piston shaking a bit untill it expands and the clearance is takin up between the skirt and cylcinder bore. Dont know what you mean by starving...and open it up a bit..last thing you want to to is rattle a piston harder than it already is.

[L88WOW]

Sounds just like the valve train clatter in my 99 Monte Carlo 3.1 I'm running Castrol GTX Hi-mileage 10W30 with Wix oil filter. Just replaced intake gaskets at 118,000. Going to run this car into the ground.

[IDriveAFord1284]

sounds a lot better than most. Head gasket will need replacement around 110,000 miles.

[RocketFast321]

Head gaskets are the last thing you worry about on this motor

[jayguy173]

i can hear valvetrain use better oil

[gooseknack]

That's valve train noise, not piston slap!

[RocketFast321]

What ever it is I know it not piston slap

[chknbro]

common problem on the junk GM v6 engines.

[kpj200]

piston slap happens when motor isnt tended to properly , the slap means its starving for a cold start open the throttle up a bit

[KDAY24]

Actually my car does the same thing, the pistons inside the cylinder are smaller than the cylinder so that when they warm up they expand to fit the cylinder. From what I hear it's normal. 8-)

[stevecurwin]

coudl you make another vidoe of it wheni t warms up adn use pressing onteh gas peddle a bit

[dough3208]

pistonslap(dot)com Piston slap is NOT normal . My 2000 Malabu is way louder than that on a cold start more engine wear less fuel mileage, GM should replace every engine that does this..

[RocketFast321]

That's the thing I belive it not piston slap, more than likly it's the lifters

[dough3208]

I think its piston slap 2 mechanics said thats what it was in my car and it sounds almost exactly the same just not quite as loud I thought it was the lifters too.. Whatever it is GM made crappy loose engines for awhile and they should have recalled and fix them for free my 2000 Malibu has 125,000 Km/ 77000 miles and it sounds like an old dieing diesel for the first 10 mins after being started.

[RocketFast321]

Gm would go bankrupt. The 3100 came out in 94, also they would have to replace all the 3400s too.

[pauliscool2991]

3500s and now 3900 also

[icankickmagda]

my Lumina's 3100 does the same thing, but it goes away after a couple minutes of warming up

[Sicj]

our 2003 malibu has the same engine does the same thing im sure that yours gets hella lound when its cold does it not? When it knocks its annoying as hell this is why imma try to get her a Toyota instead... even though i hate foreign cars they last a bit longer in the long run.

[RocketFast321]

It not that loud, you can't even hear it when the windows are up. But when it's in the 30s it does sound like some type of diesel

[Sicj]

ok but is the engine being damaged or is this like "typical gm engineering" for this series? The lil woman goes crazy over any noises that car makes.

[RocketFast321]

nope see how it runs when it's warm.

[jedykid]

To make it clear to you, all 3.1L will have this noise and will have this noise even with a brand new engine or parts. Like stated previously: alum piston requires expansion to settle in bore and stop the "knocking noise".

[stevecurwin]

my Pontiac Montana 2002 Does the Same thing

but it tottaly normal

[RazorRC3]

I hate these 3100 & 3400 engines. It's a pain to do a tune up on these, along as replace the serp belt with some of the engines because of the passanger side bracket in the way. Plus you have to support the engine in order to take that bracket out. The eventual coolant leak, in the "valley" is typical! It's hard to bleed this system when you got a freaking cooling core in the way, in the radiator Even with the stupid bleed screws it doesn't help much!

[sideburns2009]

I know exactly what it is. I had a 1996 Oldsmobile Achieva SL with the 3100 V6. When GM designed it with aluminum pistons, the pistons expand as they heat up so GM designed it with room around the pistons for them to expand once it warmed up. The pistons are slightly loose when its cold and make the notorious "slapping" noise until it warms up and they expand, taking up the extra room, this is when the noise stops.

[renesisrx8]

Another thing I did was that I got the car up to 5500 rpm that day. That was a first.

[renesisrx8]

Anyone know if its ok to use shell v-power in these engines? I filled mine up with it a few days ago and thats when i really started to notice this noise.

[renesisrx8]

mine does the same fucking thing

it drives me crazy.

[ponchochan]

Lifters, I know it says 5w-30 required but when I had my 3100 I just put 10W-30 in it synthetic and it shut it up. No joke. Check out my vids.

[scc24540]

yeah thats one of the many many gremlins gm had in the 2800-3400 series. it will go away. shoot i even rebuilt one and with brand new parts it still did this. so i guess its just a straight up factory defect

[ghbbb123]

Yeah the 3400 in my pontiac grand am does the exact same thing. From what I hear it's pretty common in the 3100, 2800, and 3400 engines. It doesn't really hurt anything as long as it goes away once the engine warms up all the way.