Fact: Atheism is older than god; it predates all religions and all notions of gods; atheism is eternal in the context of the run of Humanity, and it will be there (as always) to pick up the pieces after religion fails. ALL gods and ALL supernatural phenomena are MYTH, NOTHING more.
THe Christian sounds completely full of ignorance. He comes off as a good man, but his common sense gets thrown out the window when discussing religion. I've seen Dawkins get handed in debates, but not by this guy. This was easy work for Dawkins.
Part 2: "Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, But to those called by God to salvation, both Jews and Gentiles, Christ is the power of God and the wisdom of God." 1 Cor. 1: 18-24
Only one message to all atheists who rely on their lame human intellect, God is Spirit, ofcourse you can't understand, anyway, here: Part 1: "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate." Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age?"
Snakes doesn't talk. Genesis is a fairytale. A creation story. Therefore, Jesus become meaningless since the thing he corrected only happened in a fairytale.
all you have to do is look up in your personal time and say hey if there is a God show yourself to me. even ask is the bible the truth. he will respond to you 100%. he can respond in dreams, a vision, maybe an audible voice. depending how God wants to respond. so this is the way to get the evidence. its really basic and simple. God revealing himself to you. you can ask as many times as you want to so you can get confirmation that the bible is the facts of life. thus this debate is put to rest
Listening to this man make his points. I have deciphered that god is a sadistic, benevolent manipulator of 'life'; For someone so powerful with such hatred for 'wrongdoing' he does a lot of horrible things himself. What does he care if every human prays to him, or if one disobeys him. He is this god figure., he is all powerful, he can turn cities to salt if he wants to. I have no need to mystify myself with the ludicrous tales and followings of this destructive, almost human by nature, force.
god is love and he wants us to love and praise him if you had aperfect kingdom wouldnt you want the ones who love you in it.god cant be around evil look what happend to satan he threw him out
Go and actually read the Bible. Read the old testament. Read how much of a monster God is. He commanded people to kill their own family members if they tried to lore them away from him. He commanded people to stone their defiant sons to death.
@MrJohndl that way we are like anamals live with no consequences we could justify our sins i agree about stupid religion religion is bad a relationship with jesus is what its all about
this isnt even the worst video of this guy - if you havent already, try fishing out the video of another part of this discussion were the guy thinks we lived for millions of years without eyes.
Who is the muppet that Dawkins is talking to here?, I am an atheist and could defend Christian doctrine better than this. Hitch would have destroyed this guy in 30 seconds, Dawkins has a much softer approach. Not one thing this guy said amounted to anything more than "because the Bible tells me so",
Richard Dawkins is trying so hard to be patient and have a conversation with this religious lunatic! One one side, you have a man brain washed to the hilt that God exists, and on the other side we have an intelligent rational human being who is struggling to reason with this other man!
I think the whole reason for Christ, was because...He was the only perfect sacrifice to atone Gods wrath against mankind. This had to be done in order for Him to "display" his love...so that we could see His love. If God just said "I forgive you" it would not mean as much to us. But God went as far as to display it for all of us...which is why it is so powerful and compelling.
Whats is so moral about redemption thru human sacrifice and scape goating? Where is the morality of paying for another man's sin with NO REGARD to the party that has been wronged in the first place?
@dkthg God is PERFECT in every way, He is perfect love, wisdom.. - but God is also perfect in righteousness, and He cannot let SIN go without punishment. Ofcourse He could forgive sin without sacrafice, He is ALMIGHTY, but that would violate His righteousness, and He would deny Himself by doing that. God said: "As far as heavens are above the Earth, so is my mind above your human mind." You cannot comprehend nor understand God with your mind, all you can do is to decide to believe Him.
Lennox could have explained the necessity of vicarious atonement better. The trial analogy is appropriate, because the judge/God has a dual personality: infinite love as well as infinite justice. It's the justice part that some people forget. What Dawkins may not understand is that if the judge merely lets the defendant go, then he is a corrupt judge, even if the defendant is sincerely sorry. What Jesus did, according to Christianity, was "pay the fine".
Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.' John 14:6. Jesus said He is 'the' way, not 'a' way which means that Jesus is the only way, there is no other way to the Father. What could be clearer?
richards question of why didnt god just forget adams sin is simple. it isnt just about his sin, its why he sinned. satan bassically told adam "u dont need god, u can rule urself". obviously we've seen we cant rule or govern ousrelves. and satan posted a chalenge toward all of gods creation, if god would have just started a new, even the angels might have questioned if they really need god. how is humanity doing??? bad, why? godless...
@ananiasacts Say what you want about original sin, all you have to go off of is an argument of epithet fallacy. I have shown evidence that orignal sin is real and all you have done is objected to without any counterexample or evidence. Furthermore, everyone has a world view and every child will (in a way) inherit some of that world view from who they spend time with. Even if I block my religious views from my kids, someone else will influence them with theirs.
'please Richard see my heart, and not my intellect'. That man has such a gentle spirit. I would have loved to see this conversation continue on, however as 'TheAtheistAussie stated', he is no intellectual match for Richard Dawkins. Having said that, I think his mannerism alone is a testament to the Christian faith, and for me out shines any argument Dawkins could present. Good video.
Richard Dawkins' main argument in this video is that God could have forgiven us without the sacrifice of Jesus. However, this shows that he does not completely understand the issue. Can light be in the pretense of darkness? Of course not. In the same sense, our holy God cannot be in the presence of sin. He needed something that could eliminate our imperfection for good, the only thing that could do that is a perfect sacrifice; Jesus Christ.
@CrossAlliance, I really don't understand what you're trying to say. If Jesus didn't actually die, or only died for a short period, then what exactly got "sacrificed?" Also, how does an immoral act (ie. punishing a totally innocent person for the crimes of the guilty) atone for anything? It seems to be a more heinous crime that the ones it is intended to redress. The sad thing about all of this is that your religion appears to undermine the very sense of decency that you claim it establishes.
@ananiasacts If I am broke and in jail can I bail you out? No because we're both in the same boat! A sinner cannot make atonement for another sinner and animals were insufficient because they could only cover up past sins, a perfect, holy sacrifice can make atonement for all sins past and future. Jesus did die, regardless how long he was dead for, he died. The reason we can trust that He was who He said He was (God) is that He rose again. That's why we worship Him, He died so we don't have too.
@CrossAlliance, There isn't anything anyone can do to redress my sins against someone else. Only I can do that. I'm a bit amazed that there are so many people who actually believe in human sacrifice as a solution to any problem. But then I find the god that you worship to be a deeply immoral monster. The first and last commandments are thought crimes. Ordering Abraham to slaughter his son to prove his love of god seems like something that only an incredibly wicked scumbag would even think of.
@ananiasacts Not only did Abraham prove his love for God but also that he was faithful and would obey the Lord. If anyone is going to start the entire nation of Israel, make sure it's a faithful man! And I might agree with you had Abraham actually killed his son, but He didn't. The Lord wouldn't let him. In fact we don't believe in human sacrifice, read Exodus 22:29 which commands us not to do that. What makes you think that you (a sinner) can become perfect and holy by yourself? Good luck
@CrossAlliance Any decent father would have told God to go do one had he have asked them to kill their son. God is totally immoral for asking in the first place and Abraham is a complete arse for even thinking about it. And whether god wouldn't have let him or not is immaterial really, Abraham wasn't to know that!
@Linkacious1 Who are you to tell an almighty and loving God that He is not right in doing something? He is perfect, you aren't. Also, remember that other religions at the time are practicing human sacrifices so Abraham could have easily thought this was the norm for religion. Clearly people were not as protective of their children back then, different times and different circumstances. And it all goes back to the fact
@CrossAlliance Quite simply because my morals are better than his, and I would imagine yours are too. Unless of course you think stoning children to death, or asking people to kill their own children to prove something is ok. The god of the bible is an egotistical tyrant and I wouldn't worship him even if it was proven that he did actually exist.
Thanks for the friendly debate though, makes a refreshing change ;)
@CrossAlliance, Such inane remarks. The whole story of Jesus is riddled with deep immorality. Are you so morally bankrupt as a person that you believe that a child should be punished for the crimes of it's ancestors? If not to forgive the "original sin" of Genesis then what is the point of Jesus' death? I think you must be an intrinsically wicked person. With even a modicum of decency you would be deeply repulsed by virtually every aspect of the Abrahamic faiths. They are all deeply evil.
@ananiasacts That's where you are wrong. I am not perfect but me and my true Christian brothers and sisters devote our lives to making other people's lives better so you have no right to call me "an intrinsically wicked person." Furthermore, do you teach children to steal from cookie jars, to lie, or to betray other people? Of course not! If you agree with original sin or not, it is evident all around us. There is a reason you must teach a child to be good or they will be wicked.
@CrossAlliance, the very fact that you share that filth with your children proves you're a wicked person--you're denying their constitutional rights. A child has no opportunity to opt out of religious indoctrination from their parents. If you were a decent person you'd actually shelter then from ALL religious ideology until they are adults and can actually evaluate the dogma objectively. The very idea of original sin deeply psychotic. No child is responsible for the deeds of their ancestors!
Dawkins, Dawkins Dawkins, my man, the need for a Savior speaks to a couple of issues, 1. Ransom required a perfect sacrifice, 2. the Savior was to demonstrate the love of God in person and 3. show man how he should live
@jordan6030 Typical religious attitude, lol. Let's burn the unbeliever, if you dont follow my religion I will force my religion onto you, failing that I will kill you.
@WhipBlackPeople Well he made a comment saying why don't we burn bibles and Kurans...so I just argued the opposite. Personally I won't kill you...I'll pray for you!
A man's objective morality is impaired when he undergoes long periods of religious indoctrination, just as the man in this video.
Sure, an all-powerful judge willing to sacrifice his own son to redeem a sinner might sound incredibly noble - but only in a monotheistic worldview which advocates the extolling of a higher being. Remove those romantic preconditions and one would immediately recognize it as what Dawkins rightly describes as "hideous".
So God being Just - that is He must accept e demons' accusations- and being Love - He must find a way for us all, has to go through e bloody process to save us.It takes discipline to do so.Men still can accept God while we are in the flesh but the moment we r out of the body, we cannot decide to accept or not, just like angels and demons.Richard's view on Love s not complete or I can say it is fleshly love. Also, Richard has different world view so no point to evangelize to him through debates.
Think about earthly parents, everyday forgives the child without any disciplining him or her. Just forgive, it will make the child very spoiled. The interviewer also forgot one thing that the demons were angels and they rebelled against God. Their natures cannot changed. They cannot be redeemed or convinced to come back to God. So if God does not die for us Himself, the demons will have all rights to accuse men and say "they must be not forgiven, but in Hell with us".
For me, it would be more terrible that men should live forever with their evil natures in their hearts. That is not Hell after all? Another thing, the interviewer forgot about the JUSTICE that God has to deal with. Love is not a simply forgiving anyhow or anyway. Love is knowing what is right to do for others. We forgive others because we are also sinful ourselves so we cannot judge. But consider us getting into heaven with our sinful natures, it will corrupt heavens anyway.
I think the interviewer did not do a good job. For example, he was just trapped by Richard's "that's horrible idea" of "killing someone for someone". Well Richard tries to look at the physical point of view but whereas Christianity's point is on the spiritual point of view. It is horrible to see someone killed but it is even more horrible to see men having evils in their hearts. After all flesh is still flesh but the spirits are what matter to God.
I don't want to get attacked by a bunch of angry atheists but the answer to that question is, Jesus and God our different but the same. God's son, Jesus was not like when we have a son or a daughter. Our children might resemble us or have our characteristics but they are not us, they are themselves. Jesus was God in the flesh, so yes it was God who hung on the cross for our sins so to speak...
@poohjigga So your god punished humanity because a sinister snake that he created convinced two people to eat some fruit, and then he lessened the punishment a bit because he turned himself into a person that temporarily died? It's beautiful isn't it?
@megadethman101 Imagine a marble balancing on a toothpick. That is perfect balance. However, when someone comes over and bumps it, the marble falls. Adam was perfect but when influenced by evil (Satan) he fell. He was perfect, but was corrupted.
@megadethman101 I do. Adam was created imperfectly, thats why he messed up. And if God, being "all powerful", knew he was imperfect....why punish him???
@2010richard may be you could ask him if you created something wouldnt you want to test it maybe he is able to keep it from himself he needs to enjoy himself everything works with opposite good evil night day cold hot etc etc were not god just mad in his image
Drop your egos, and accept Jesus into your heart. Jesus let the the Romans crucify him, so he could rise from the dead, which he did on Easter Sunday. Jesus could have saved himself at any moment, but he laid down his life to save you all from your sins, and so when you die you will have everlasting life. Our souls are in our physical bodies while you are alive. But when you die your soul will leave your body and either go to heaven or hell. God cant accept you, if you don't accept him. God bles
Your right accept Jesus and the one that tried to save his life. Satan offered him rulership of the world. If you love Jesus then love the one that tried to save him, Satan.
Poor chap in blue obviously indocrinated at birth....but that religion for you..rapes you of reason/thinking clearly....You only have to look the guy grasping at anything to keep himself in his fantasy world
1. No evidence, man was ever perfect
2. No evidence man has never been immortal
But this guy just pulls as much crap out of his ass...and thinks its truth..with nothing to provide LOL
so funny the deluded and delusional guy in blue...adam was made perfect..so perfect beings can be disobedient and fail tests. Thus if thats the case he cant be perfect..perfect never deviates from perfection...the right choice is always made, by default .....Imperfection and failing tests/disobedience only comes of a creator who is also imperfect, who created of course imperfect adam
@petecxcx1 here is an example: we know from roman tax records that there was no census any time near jesus' birth, let alone a ludicrous one making people go back to where they were born for no reason. But there was a prophecy that the messiah would be from bethlehem, and everyone knew jesus was from nazareth. So they made it up.
@petecxcx1 thats true. 30 years after jesus' death the gospels are written by people who never met him but believed he was the son of god. How do you know they didnt make the story fit the prophecies?
Scripture is full of prophecies that have been fulfiled. Work your way around Isaiah 53...written hundreds of years before Christ lived...and completely fulfiled. That's just one of countless more.
P.S. When you're dead you'll find out the truth. LOL
I feel sorry for the religious guy in this debate, he can't argue intellectually with Dawkins but you can tell he's a nice guy, it's a shame he's been blinding by religion. Still religious or not i respect his mannerism.
@TheAtheistAussie I couldn't agree more. I feel we should talk about belief. We shouldn't avoid the holes in religious thinking, but that doesn't mean that we need to hate the person.
Christians say to hate the sin, love the sinner. I think atheists can do at least that well if not better. We should educate with compassion and humility. All of us are guilty of believing things that aren't true.
No not really at all-if you are not particularly impressed with his "performance", then I would direct you instead to some of the many compelling and insightful presentations and discussions here on YT w/great Christian speakers like Allistaire McGrath and John Lennox (both of whom have solid scientific credentials).It is really Prof Dawkins who is off-base here and unable to see the value of eternal things beyond this life when every human being will bow before Jesus Christ
@TheAtheistAussie I recon the religious guy argued quite well...I also think richard dawkins made the biggest no-show on earth - failing to show up to an Intellectual debate with Dr William Lane Craig!
@jordan6030 You must have watched a show no one else did. They already debated along with Hitchens too and your craig dude got owned again and again. Here Dawkins pretty much took it easy on this old guy. Fail
Dead-to-the-spirit deluded "God Delusion" author & blithering fool scientist goon Richard Dawkins another "leader" given 2 the profane masses is another useful idiot 4 Jesuit machinations
Jesuitical; pertaining to the Jesuits or their principals; designing; cunning; deceitful; prevaricating
The Jesuit Order completely altered the education system 2 suit their Evo-Hoax Agenda to discredit the Bible
Papacy cant have their Counter Reformation 2nd Dark Age DESPOTISM til Bible's destroyed folks
. God has declared ( all men are sinners) there is no innocent people, look at your life and you will notice that you have lied and i bet you have stolen at least once and if you even look upon a woman or man and had sexual thoughts it is as if you did commit the very act. Why is this? Becasue God looks upon the heart. Your not innocent, But WOW, what a forgiving God we have. I can only hope you can see this before, it is too late. I am praying for you. Part 2 Thank you
@Stan6468 Noone is innocent and noone is perfect. I don't need a "god" to tell me that; it's common sense. I dont need anyone to pay for my "sins" and i didn't ask. Enjoy your delusions but LEAVE ME OUT OF IT. This is part 1.
He should have no problem with rejection then, love carries on loving despite rejection...or does he turn angry and hold a grudge...opps never loving ...never forgiving
First of all I didn't say all people are murders, i was using a example of a Judge in our earthly way of life and how he must hold to the standard of Justice. The point is if a human Judge who isn't perfect has a standard of Justice
(How much more God who is perfect and Holy and His Justice) You are being unfair and not reading or thinking of what i said. I only ask you be fair and balanced. This is part 1
I also take it you go round requesting people in life, to go and kill members of their family [e.g. abraham sons].....as for you [according to your beliefs] this is a moral and just request
So thus, seeing you think this is that case..please do this same request to a police officer...tell me how it works out for you LOL LOL
If you believe something to be true, its is literally true to yourself. Athiests will never understand that people believe in god because its something they truly believe in. they will never believe in god because its something they will never believe in. for example you believe you are male or female, therefore you are and many transgendered people feel this way and make themselves the gender they believed they were. I would love a friendly debate.
i laughed out loud in the 9:15 mark. he went from reading Scripture to outlandish speculation. "...there could have been a conversation between father & son..."???
Mr Dawkins keeps on asking if God is all powerful then just forgive--God is Just and Holy and He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free. God will not do that and He is Just but instead He sent His Son and His Son Jesus wanted to do this with Joy and accept the punishment so we could be with God and have a relationship again This is amazing and beautiful and i feel very sorry for Mr. Dawkins. I will pray for him.
@Stan6468 So all people are "murderers" for what was done thousands of years before they were born? I think that is horrible to make innocent people pay for the crimes of another. And even if I accepted that premise, you think it is justice to punish someone who is innocent of a crime (Jesus) for the crimes of someone else? And by this punishment clear the names of everyone else? Also as long as you're being respectful it is Prof. Dawkins :)
"Mr Dawkins keeps on asking if God is all powerful then just forgive--God is Just and Holy and He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free"
1. Man can forgive, more than any god..man doesnt need to kill anyone to forgive...Thus man is more powerful than your god :)
2. You fail to see, punishment fits the crime....your fictional god fails in that repect..he has to punish you forever, he just cant get that anger out of his system
"He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free"
But your god does let murders go free if they except your zombie jesus
Murderer gets heaven
A non believer firefighter, saves many people/children/babies during his life..burns forever LOL
Lets not go as low as your gods standards, that each time we need to forgive we kill a member of our familys.....there will be no humans left......not all things are possible for your god..he cant forgive, without killing something LOL LOL
The reason why Christ had to suffer--God is a Just God and He cannot allow sin to go unpunished--Imagine a Judge allowing a murderer to go free knowing his guilt and the evidence points to his guilt. A GOOD Judge cannot do that. GOD cannot do this as well, Jesus says he will go down to earth and accept the punishment for mankind but Jesus is Holy and Perfect and by His death- Now those who believe- thier sins are redeemed and God is Just for he did punish the sins and we are forgiven.
Forget William Lane Craig, Frank Turek, Lee Strobel & the other pseudo-intellectual theologians.
THIS POOR SAP is how almost all believers actually think. That is to say, they haven't thought thru the logical implications of their religious beliefs at all, and when confronted with these inconvenient facts, they painfully fumble for a way to square the circle.
It's sad and pathetic.
The stupid, it hurts...and it's the most popular thing around!!!
ooo .. God gave us free will and choose any thing...... how do you deal with the discrepancy of God already planned for the future for the things you will become .... now thats not free will...how contradictory !!!!! stupid Theists
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa I fricking hate these Atheist idiots who can't think for themselves and can only respond with fake scientific theory as if it was fact. They are blind fools.
@AuthorStevenI know what you mean...it must be annoying having to listen to people present empiracle evidence that debunks 2000 year old bronze-age fairytales. Those stupid atheist scientists and their repeatable tests. Just like all this other stuff fake science theories, you know like medicine, electricity, the internet, hydroelectric damns, combustion engine, telephone, cellphones, toothpaste etc...Yeah, PH.D scientists are really stupid. Much better to just read a incoherent book (bible).
@AuthorSteven I know what you mean...it must be annoying having to listen to people present conclusions based on empiracle evidence that debunks 2000 year old bronze-age fairytales. Those stupid atheist scientists and their verifiable repeatable tests. Those dummies and their other fake science theories that gave us things like medicine, electricity, the internet, hydroelectric damns, combustion engine, telephone, cellphones, toothpaste etc...Yeah, PH.D scientists are really stupid and blind.
my heart pumps blood it all it does, i think with my brain, if you care for the future as species, we have to rid us of this fairy tales, the bible is made up, as a book is a great book so is the lord of the rings. That means i have to worship iluvatar and hate morgot, where is the evidence thanks i rest my case
I would have loved to hear Dawkins ask the interviewer why an all powerful creator would not remove this design flaw from the eye or even more why he would commit the error in the first place.
@MrWagman11 These answers would be a move to avoid answering the real question and would go in a direction of agreeing that you have no logical explanation. It's not an answer an intelligent person would give to reply to an intelligent questioner.
I'm not atheist, but I see that atheists like Dawkins have a far superior concept of morality. torturing someone else, sacrificing others, & needless sacrifices are wrong. What kind of morality is it to require your own son be killed cuz someone else ate an apple? Christians have lost their way arguing that love is death. I feel that if Christians want to be a part of the future they'll have to finally put down their Bibles which pits them against science, reality & what love really is.
@journeyond Immoral concepts like what? Slavery? Bias against women? How to treat non-believers? Christians have alternative explanations to all those things. It's just a matter of how you read the Bible. I'm not a Christian, but if you are against Christianity simply because you think the Bible is immoral despite other people telling you the alternative ways to interpret the passages, that's not being fair. u know what i mean?
The only problem I have with you is that morality is something to be defined by your social environment and those who teach you. Meaning depending on your society morality might have a different meaning.
@journeyond If you take a stand on a topic like this and you write words like: "What kind of morality is it to require your own son be killed cuz someone else ate an apple?" You are simply ignorant of Christian beliefs. You try to "be moral" without morality... And to the quote I've provided I may add: and what if he didn't sacrifice his son and then everybody would die? You put too much simplicity trying not to be wise but to laugh at Christians. Is it ok to have this disguise?
@journeyond Why you have to use those words: I'm not atheist, but I see that atheists like Dawkins have a far superior concept of morality. torturing someone else, sacrificing others, & needless sacrifices are wrong" to be regarded as a reasonable man and then you simply laugh at Christians beliefs...
@journeyond 2000 years ago crucifixion was a lot more common then now. And 2000 years ago animal sacrifices were common, it was seen as pleasing the Gods. And for those who argue that Jesus gave his life, sacrificed himself.. The almighty God could have chosen to simply not give us sin. Anyway.. I think its amazing how people try to fit in a 2000 year morality these days. It's just as outdated as trying to make a fire to get warm, while we just can turn up the heating.
Then again, God was the one who created Adam, so God knew exactly he was going to commit the sin, and then punishes him for that. Much like dropping a vase and then blaming said vase when it smashes on the ground.
Absolutely not. There is no "position" to consider. Debate depends on substantiated evidential fact not immoral bronze-age wishful thinking. Can you imagine Dawkins coming out with the same sort of "Just because it is - it says in the bible" type of response this buffoon offers?
The story of Jesus is the same myth as Dionysos, Mithras, Attis and hundreds of other "son of gods". They performed the same miracles, were the same age, had the same number of disciples and all that.
What it all comes down to is the worship of the sun disguised in parables, stories, allegories and myths. To have a discussion about Jesus in terms of a historical person is absolutely ludicrious!
The judge going to jail for thief wouldn't solve anything because the injured party remains injured and you're undermining the whole point of the justice system, which is to discourage thieving in the first place!
To extend the metaphor, killing your own son as an equivalent sacrifice for somebody else's crime doesn't address the problem of the crime in the first place.
It's doubly worse because an all-powerful god can simply decide to fix the problem instead of going through all these contortions.
Dead-to-the-spirit deluded "God Delusion" author & blithering fool scientist goon Richard Dawkins another "leader" given to the profane masses is another useful idiot for Jesuit machinations-C.O.
Jesuitical: pertaining to the Jesuits or their principals; designing; cunning; deceitful; prevaricating
The Jesuit Order completely altered the education system to suit their Evo-Hoax agenda to discredit the Bible. They cant have a Satanic society of 'Do as Thou Wilt' if people still follow the Bible
@ivlfounder You must not watch or read very much by Richard Dawkins if you think that's true. Now you're just making things up just like Bill O'Reilly. I don't believe he's made himself look foolish yet. Not in his professional career.
@ivlfounder I have, and the only thing he 'admits' to is that there is a Possible, Reasonably Acceptable case could be made for the existence of a god. The bottom line of atheism, being agnosticism, and knowing that most if not all Atheists concede to the Minute Possibility that there was a god, this argument has made no progress for Theists. We've admitted our agnosticism from the beginning, we just believe the statistic point more toward No than Yes. But Yes will always be possible. I win. Bye
Fact: Atheism is older than god; it predates all religions and all notions of gods; atheism is eternal in the context of the run of Humanity, and it will be there (as always) to pick up the pieces after religion fails. ALL gods and ALL supernatural phenomena are MYTH, NOTHING more.
detroitboy65 1 day ago
THe Christian sounds completely full of ignorance. He comes off as a good man, but his common sense gets thrown out the window when discussing religion. I've seen Dawkins get handed in debates, but not by this guy. This was easy work for Dawkins.
reedickyaluss 3 days ago
Part 2: "Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, But to those called by God to salvation, both Jews and Gentiles, Christ is the power of God and the wisdom of God." 1 Cor. 1: 18-24
27zer06 5 days ago
Only one message to all atheists who rely on their lame human intellect, God is Spirit, ofcourse you can't understand, anyway, here: Part 1: "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate." Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age?"
27zer06 5 days ago
@4:40 dude says "god gave us free will", I hear "god gave us the rope to hang our selves"
Polydynamix 5 days ago
Snakes doesn't talk. Genesis is a fairytale. A creation story. Therefore, Jesus become meaningless since the thing he corrected only happened in a fairytale.
aboyborninjune 5 days ago
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all you have to do is look up in your personal time and say hey if there is a God show yourself to me. even ask is the bible the truth. he will respond to you 100%. he can respond in dreams, a vision, maybe an audible voice. depending how God wants to respond. so this is the way to get the evidence. its really basic and simple. God revealing himself to you. you can ask as many times as you want to so you can get confirmation that the bible is the facts of life. thus this debate is put to rest
udoherkommer 1 week ago
Listening to this man make his points. I have deciphered that god is a sadistic, benevolent manipulator of 'life'; For someone so powerful with such hatred for 'wrongdoing' he does a lot of horrible things himself. What does he care if every human prays to him, or if one disobeys him. He is this god figure., he is all powerful, he can turn cities to salt if he wants to. I have no need to mystify myself with the ludicrous tales and followings of this destructive, almost human by nature, force.
S66Alex 1 week ago
god is love and he wants us to love and praise him if you had aperfect kingdom wouldnt you want the ones who love you in it.god cant be around evil look what happend to satan he threw him out
papagaryel 1 week ago
@papagaryel
Photo of Jesus with caption underneath - "Love me.....or burn". That just about sums up how completely retarded your religion is.
MrJohndl 1 week ago
@papagaryel
Go and actually read the Bible. Read the old testament. Read how much of a monster God is. He commanded people to kill their own family members if they tried to lore them away from him. He commanded people to stone their defiant sons to death.
itzahazylife 1 week ago
the atheist thinks he is smarter than god he could ask all those questions on judgment day just before eternity in hell.the
papagaryel 1 week ago
Religious: KILL THE HERETICS!
Atheists:
Agnostics: *walking past, whistling*
Atheists: AGNOSTICS!WITH US! NOW!!
Agnostics: We don't want to cause a fu-
ATHEISTS: YOU'RE WITH US!! YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BELIEVE THAT RELIGION AND GOD IS RUBBISH, THAT'S WHAT YOU DO!! NO ARGUMENTS
Agnostics: oh..errrmm...alright then.....
DA296/Buddhists/hindus/anyone else who doesn't really give a shit: Come, fellow agnostics, and believe whatever you like.
DA296 1 week ago
You can't reason with religious people. Their brains have turned to mush.
MrJohndl 2 weeks ago 5
@MrJohndl i honestly believe this to be true figuratively of course
2010richard 1 week ago
'Adam was made perfect' Rubbish. There was no Adam. Evolution is the reason we are here. Stupid religion.
MrJohndl 2 weeks ago
@MrJohndl that way we are like anamals live with no consequences we could justify our sins i agree about stupid religion religion is bad a relationship with jesus is what its all about
papagaryel 1 week ago
@papagaryel
There is no Jesus. The guy died 2000 years ago, assuming he ever lived in the first place. You're wrong, I'm right. Goodbye.
MrJohndl 1 week ago
Faith is a disease of the mind. Evidence, evidence, evidence. That's all.
MrJohndl 2 weeks ago
this isnt even the worst video of this guy - if you havent already, try fishing out the video of another part of this discussion were the guy thinks we lived for millions of years without eyes.
lightspeedchump 3 weeks ago
What a Christian tool, can't even reason with him
espyd21c 3 weeks ago
Who is the muppet that Dawkins is talking to here?, I am an atheist and could defend Christian doctrine better than this. Hitch would have destroyed this guy in 30 seconds, Dawkins has a much softer approach. Not one thing this guy said amounted to anything more than "because the Bible tells me so",
SteveMakesAmillion 3 weeks ago
Dawkins for the win!
MrLzender 4 weeks ago 2
Poor religion, just not going to make it as we evolve
kraqore79 1 month ago
Richard Dawkins is trying so hard to be patient and have a conversation with this religious lunatic! One one side, you have a man brain washed to the hilt that God exists, and on the other side we have an intelligent rational human being who is struggling to reason with this other man!
MyDustyman 1 month ago
because GOD had to give us the potential to do evil otherwise we would be robots.
MrBeefreetwo 1 month ago
I think the whole reason for Christ, was because...He was the only perfect sacrifice to atone Gods wrath against mankind. This had to be done in order for Him to "display" his love...so that we could see His love. If God just said "I forgive you" it would not mean as much to us. But God went as far as to display it for all of us...which is why it is so powerful and compelling.
MrKoJack9 1 month ago
Whats is so moral about redemption thru human sacrifice and scape goating? Where is the morality of paying for another man's sin with NO REGARD to the party that has been wronged in the first place?
dkthg 1 month ago 8
@dkthg God is PERFECT in every way, He is perfect love, wisdom.. - but God is also perfect in righteousness, and He cannot let SIN go without punishment. Ofcourse He could forgive sin without sacrafice, He is ALMIGHTY, but that would violate His righteousness, and He would deny Himself by doing that. God said: "As far as heavens are above the Earth, so is my mind above your human mind." You cannot comprehend nor understand God with your mind, all you can do is to decide to believe Him.
27zer06 5 days ago
Lennox could have explained the necessity of vicarious atonement better. The trial analogy is appropriate, because the judge/God has a dual personality: infinite love as well as infinite justice. It's the justice part that some people forget. What Dawkins may not understand is that if the judge merely lets the defendant go, then he is a corrupt judge, even if the defendant is sincerely sorry. What Jesus did, according to Christianity, was "pay the fine".
Thagomizer 1 month ago
@KingdomSeeker2012 it would be clearer if I could understand why an omnipotent god made it so that his son was 'the only way'
allln19 1 month ago
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Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.' John 14:6. Jesus said He is 'the' way, not 'a' way which means that Jesus is the only way, there is no other way to the Father. What could be clearer?
KingdomSeeker2012 1 month ago
richards question of why didnt god just forget adams sin is simple. it isnt just about his sin, its why he sinned. satan bassically told adam "u dont need god, u can rule urself". obviously we've seen we cant rule or govern ousrelves. and satan posted a chalenge toward all of gods creation, if god would have just started a new, even the angels might have questioned if they really need god. how is humanity doing??? bad, why? godless...
lowercase18 1 month ago
Wow, this guy is an idiot.
truesonofdorn 1 month ago
Lol Dawkins says something intellectual then the guy say's "That's a very good question." lol
vanskiid 1 month ago
This guy is totally dense.
rupertoldham 2 months ago
@ananiasacts Say what you want about original sin, all you have to go off of is an argument of epithet fallacy. I have shown evidence that orignal sin is real and all you have done is objected to without any counterexample or evidence. Furthermore, everyone has a world view and every child will (in a way) inherit some of that world view from who they spend time with. Even if I block my religious views from my kids, someone else will influence them with theirs.
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
Haha you can see Dawkins squirming with disbelief.
TheBurmanUnicorn 2 months ago
I never believed in a God and I never understood why you can buy those christian doctrines.
I wished someone who believes those things could explain to me very clear how it is to believe and how to buy those doctrines...
If you have to believe then why don't search for a smarter God and better doctrines?
balouthewatz 2 months ago
"See my heart, not my intellect."? Then why debate at all?
mikelheron20 2 months ago
The Christian is to gentle on Richard Dawkins
decosteve71 2 months ago
'please Richard see my heart, and not my intellect'. That man has such a gentle spirit. I would have loved to see this conversation continue on, however as 'TheAtheistAussie stated', he is no intellectual match for Richard Dawkins. Having said that, I think his mannerism alone is a testament to the Christian faith, and for me out shines any argument Dawkins could present. Good video.
PBHF20 2 months ago
Richard Dawkins' main argument in this video is that God could have forgiven us without the sacrifice of Jesus. However, this shows that he does not completely understand the issue. Can light be in the pretense of darkness? Of course not. In the same sense, our holy God cannot be in the presence of sin. He needed something that could eliminate our imperfection for good, the only thing that could do that is a perfect sacrifice; Jesus Christ.
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance, I really don't understand what you're trying to say. If Jesus didn't actually die, or only died for a short period, then what exactly got "sacrificed?" Also, how does an immoral act (ie. punishing a totally innocent person for the crimes of the guilty) atone for anything? It seems to be a more heinous crime that the ones it is intended to redress. The sad thing about all of this is that your religion appears to undermine the very sense of decency that you claim it establishes.
ananiasacts 2 months ago
@ananiasacts If I am broke and in jail can I bail you out? No because we're both in the same boat! A sinner cannot make atonement for another sinner and animals were insufficient because they could only cover up past sins, a perfect, holy sacrifice can make atonement for all sins past and future. Jesus did die, regardless how long he was dead for, he died. The reason we can trust that He was who He said He was (God) is that He rose again. That's why we worship Him, He died so we don't have too.
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance, There isn't anything anyone can do to redress my sins against someone else. Only I can do that. I'm a bit amazed that there are so many people who actually believe in human sacrifice as a solution to any problem. But then I find the god that you worship to be a deeply immoral monster. The first and last commandments are thought crimes. Ordering Abraham to slaughter his son to prove his love of god seems like something that only an incredibly wicked scumbag would even think of.
ananiasacts 2 months ago
@ananiasacts Not only did Abraham prove his love for God but also that he was faithful and would obey the Lord. If anyone is going to start the entire nation of Israel, make sure it's a faithful man! And I might agree with you had Abraham actually killed his son, but He didn't. The Lord wouldn't let him. In fact we don't believe in human sacrifice, read Exodus 22:29 which commands us not to do that. What makes you think that you (a sinner) can become perfect and holy by yourself? Good luck
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance Any decent father would have told God to go do one had he have asked them to kill their son. God is totally immoral for asking in the first place and Abraham is a complete arse for even thinking about it. And whether god wouldn't have let him or not is immaterial really, Abraham wasn't to know that!
Linkacious1 2 months ago
@Linkacious1 Who are you to tell an almighty and loving God that He is not right in doing something? He is perfect, you aren't. Also, remember that other religions at the time are practicing human sacrifices so Abraham could have easily thought this was the norm for religion. Clearly people were not as protective of their children back then, different times and different circumstances. And it all goes back to the fact
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance Quite simply because my morals are better than his, and I would imagine yours are too. Unless of course you think stoning children to death, or asking people to kill their own children to prove something is ok. The god of the bible is an egotistical tyrant and I wouldn't worship him even if it was proven that he did actually exist.
Thanks for the friendly debate though, makes a refreshing change ;)
Linkacious1 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance, Such inane remarks. The whole story of Jesus is riddled with deep immorality. Are you so morally bankrupt as a person that you believe that a child should be punished for the crimes of it's ancestors? If not to forgive the "original sin" of Genesis then what is the point of Jesus' death? I think you must be an intrinsically wicked person. With even a modicum of decency you would be deeply repulsed by virtually every aspect of the Abrahamic faiths. They are all deeply evil.
ananiasacts 2 months ago
@ananiasacts That's where you are wrong. I am not perfect but me and my true Christian brothers and sisters devote our lives to making other people's lives better so you have no right to call me "an intrinsically wicked person." Furthermore, do you teach children to steal from cookie jars, to lie, or to betray other people? Of course not! If you agree with original sin or not, it is evident all around us. There is a reason you must teach a child to be good or they will be wicked.
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance, the very fact that you share that filth with your children proves you're a wicked person--you're denying their constitutional rights. A child has no opportunity to opt out of religious indoctrination from their parents. If you were a decent person you'd actually shelter then from ALL religious ideology until they are adults and can actually evaluate the dogma objectively. The very idea of original sin deeply psychotic. No child is responsible for the deeds of their ancestors!
ananiasacts 2 months ago
Dawkins, Dawkins Dawkins, my man, the need for a Savior speaks to a couple of issues, 1. Ransom required a perfect sacrifice, 2. the Savior was to demonstrate the love of God in person and 3. show man how he should live
vptiro 2 months ago
The stupidity in this one is strong....
MrBigInfidel 2 months ago
We need to gather up all the Bible's & Qurans together and burn all of them, and start afresh.
WhipBlackPeople 2 months ago
@WhipBlackPeople why don't we gather all the atheists and burn them instead?
jordan6030 2 months ago
@jordan6030 Typical religious attitude, lol. Let's burn the unbeliever, if you dont follow my religion I will force my religion onto you, failing that I will kill you.
WhipBlackPeople 2 months ago
@WhipBlackPeople Well he made a comment saying why don't we burn bibles and Kurans...so I just argued the opposite. Personally I won't kill you...I'll pray for you!
jordan6030 2 months ago
Really good debate. Don't get heated over this people. Religious debates are necessary but not worth getting frustrated over.
tiland520 2 months ago
A man's objective morality is impaired when he undergoes long periods of religious indoctrination, just as the man in this video.
Sure, an all-powerful judge willing to sacrifice his own son to redeem a sinner might sound incredibly noble - but only in a monotheistic worldview which advocates the extolling of a higher being. Remove those romantic preconditions and one would immediately recognize it as what Dawkins rightly describes as "hideous".
ChowMeinChowdown 2 months ago
So God being Just - that is He must accept e demons' accusations- and being Love - He must find a way for us all, has to go through e bloody process to save us.It takes discipline to do so.Men still can accept God while we are in the flesh but the moment we r out of the body, we cannot decide to accept or not, just like angels and demons.Richard's view on Love s not complete or I can say it is fleshly love. Also, Richard has different world view so no point to evangelize to him through debates.
vuhairick 2 months ago
Think about earthly parents, everyday forgives the child without any disciplining him or her. Just forgive, it will make the child very spoiled. The interviewer also forgot one thing that the demons were angels and they rebelled against God. Their natures cannot changed. They cannot be redeemed or convinced to come back to God. So if God does not die for us Himself, the demons will have all rights to accuse men and say "they must be not forgiven, but in Hell with us".
vuhairick 2 months ago
For me, it would be more terrible that men should live forever with their evil natures in their hearts. That is not Hell after all? Another thing, the interviewer forgot about the JUSTICE that God has to deal with. Love is not a simply forgiving anyhow or anyway. Love is knowing what is right to do for others. We forgive others because we are also sinful ourselves so we cannot judge. But consider us getting into heaven with our sinful natures, it will corrupt heavens anyway.
vuhairick 2 months ago
@TwistedLemniscate I sent the reply in a message still learning how this mobile YouTube works
poohjigga 2 months ago
I think the interviewer did not do a good job. For example, he was just trapped by Richard's "that's horrible idea" of "killing someone for someone". Well Richard tries to look at the physical point of view but whereas Christianity's point is on the spiritual point of view. It is horrible to see someone killed but it is even more horrible to see men having evils in their hearts. After all flesh is still flesh but the spirits are what matter to God.
vuhairick 2 months ago
I don't want to get attacked by a bunch of angry atheists but the answer to that question is, Jesus and God our different but the same. God's son, Jesus was not like when we have a son or a daughter. Our children might resemble us or have our characteristics but they are not us, they are themselves. Jesus was God in the flesh, so yes it was God who hung on the cross for our sins so to speak...
poohjigga 2 months ago
@poohjigga So your god punished humanity because a sinister snake that he created convinced two people to eat some fruit, and then he lessened the punishment a bit because he turned himself into a person that temporarily died? It's beautiful isn't it?
TwistedLemniscate 2 months ago
Wow.... Christians are inept....
DreamxLand420 2 months ago
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Jesus loves you, Dawkins! Convert to Jesus and He will save you from eternal death!
sarotran 2 months ago
Hitchens would have made this guy cry.
13game3 2 months ago
Adam was made perfect yet he fucked up? doesn't sound to perfect to me. anyone else agree?
megadethman101 2 months ago 32
@megadethman101 Imagine a marble balancing on a toothpick. That is perfect balance. However, when someone comes over and bumps it, the marble falls. Adam was perfect but when influenced by evil (Satan) he fell. He was perfect, but was corrupted.
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@CrossAlliance beautifully put.
PBHF20 2 months ago
@PBHF20 thanks :)
CrossAlliance 2 months ago
@megadethman101 I do. Adam was created imperfectly, thats why he messed up. And if God, being "all powerful", knew he was imperfect....why punish him???
2010richard 3 weeks ago
@2010richard may be you could ask him if you created something wouldnt you want to test it maybe he is able to keep it from himself he needs to enjoy himself everything works with opposite good evil night day cold hot etc etc were not god just mad in his image
papagaryel 1 week ago
@megadethman101 It's the "intelligent" design. Same goes with conjoined twins, babies born dead, etc.
tontsa911 1 week ago
@megadethman101 only god is perfect he gave us free will if he didnt we would be zombies
papagaryel 1 week ago
Drop your egos, and accept Jesus into your heart. Jesus let the the Romans crucify him, so he could rise from the dead, which he did on Easter Sunday. Jesus could have saved himself at any moment, but he laid down his life to save you all from your sins, and so when you die you will have everlasting life. Our souls are in our physical bodies while you are alive. But when you die your soul will leave your body and either go to heaven or hell. God cant accept you, if you don't accept him. God bles
RyanNeville69 2 months ago
@RyanNeville69
Your right accept Jesus and the one that tried to save his life. Satan offered him rulership of the world. If you love Jesus then love the one that tried to save him, Satan.
SuperBenzid 2 months ago
This is a waste of time. Neither seemed to have a educated point of view.
onemarktwoyou 2 months ago
what would u be called if u belive in god but not religion
kdotmj 2 months ago
@kdotmj What god do you believe in then?
Plopkap 2 months ago
@Plopkap christain
kdotmj 2 months ago
religion is nonsense.
MatthewDavine 2 months ago
If Adam was a perfect being why would he be so immature and ignorant to take the apple.
TrueMusicCentral 2 months ago
Poor chap in blue obviously indocrinated at birth....but that religion for you..rapes you of reason/thinking clearly....You only have to look the guy grasping at anything to keep himself in his fantasy world
1. No evidence, man was ever perfect
2. No evidence man has never been immortal
But this guy just pulls as much crap out of his ass...and thinks its truth..with nothing to provide LOL
devante11 3 months ago
so funny the deluded and delusional guy in blue...adam was made perfect..so perfect beings can be disobedient and fail tests. Thus if thats the case he cant be perfect..perfect never deviates from perfection...the right choice is always made, by default .....Imperfection and failing tests/disobedience only comes of a creator who is also imperfect, who created of course imperfect adam
devante11 3 months ago
@petecxcx1 here is an example: we know from roman tax records that there was no census any time near jesus' birth, let alone a ludicrous one making people go back to where they were born for no reason. But there was a prophecy that the messiah would be from bethlehem, and everyone knew jesus was from nazareth. So they made it up.
0TheGuru0 3 months ago
@petecxcx1 thats true. 30 years after jesus' death the gospels are written by people who never met him but believed he was the son of god. How do you know they didnt make the story fit the prophecies?
0TheGuru0 3 months ago
Scripture is full of prophecies that have been fulfiled. Work your way around Isaiah 53...written hundreds of years before Christ lived...and completely fulfiled. That's just one of countless more.
P.S. When you're dead you'll find out the truth. LOL
petecxcx1 3 months ago
"that's a very good questoon!" is all the man says, LMAO
fabioemerim 3 months ago
I feel sorry for the religious guy in this debate, he can't argue intellectually with Dawkins but you can tell he's a nice guy, it's a shame he's been blinding by religion. Still religious or not i respect his mannerism.
TheAtheistAussie 3 months ago 17
@TheAtheistAussie I couldn't agree more. I feel we should talk about belief. We shouldn't avoid the holes in religious thinking, but that doesn't mean that we need to hate the person.
Christians say to hate the sin, love the sinner. I think atheists can do at least that well if not better. We should educate with compassion and humility. All of us are guilty of believing things that aren't true.
BrooklynRagtag 2 months ago
No not really at all-if you are not particularly impressed with his "performance", then I would direct you instead to some of the many compelling and insightful presentations and discussions here on YT w/great Christian speakers like Allistaire McGrath and John Lennox (both of whom have solid scientific credentials).It is really Prof Dawkins who is off-base here and unable to see the value of eternal things beyond this life when every human being will bow before Jesus Christ
shieldsff 2 months ago
@TheAtheistAussie I recon the religious guy argued quite well...I also think richard dawkins made the biggest no-show on earth - failing to show up to an Intellectual debate with Dr William Lane Craig!
jordan6030 2 months ago
@jordan6030 You must have watched a show no one else did. They already debated along with Hitchens too and your craig dude got owned again and again. Here Dawkins pretty much took it easy on this old guy. Fail
spareaxe 1 month ago
8:15 - 8:22 LOL
TheAtheistAussie 3 months ago
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Dead-to-the-spirit deluded "God Delusion" author & blithering fool scientist goon Richard Dawkins another "leader" given 2 the profane masses is another useful idiot 4 Jesuit machinations
Jesuitical; pertaining to the Jesuits or their principals; designing; cunning; deceitful; prevaricating
The Jesuit Order completely altered the education system 2 suit their Evo-Hoax Agenda to discredit the Bible
Papacy cant have their Counter Reformation 2nd Dark Age DESPOTISM til Bible's destroyed folks
SpencerBenedict2nd 3 months ago
You can pray for me.....and i'll THINK for you. Part 2 Thank You.
dkthg 3 months ago
. God has declared ( all men are sinners) there is no innocent people, look at your life and you will notice that you have lied and i bet you have stolen at least once and if you even look upon a woman or man and had sexual thoughts it is as if you did commit the very act. Why is this? Becasue God looks upon the heart. Your not innocent, But WOW, what a forgiving God we have. I can only hope you can see this before, it is too late. I am praying for you. Part 2 Thank you
Stan6468 3 months ago
@Stan6468 Noone is innocent and noone is perfect. I don't need a "god" to tell me that; it's common sense. I dont need anyone to pay for my "sins" and i didn't ask. Enjoy your delusions but LEAVE ME OUT OF IT. This is part 1.
dkthg 3 months ago
@Stan6468
"But WOW, what a forgiving God we have."
He should have no problem with rejection then, love carries on loving despite rejection...or does he turn angry and hold a grudge...opps never loving ...never forgiving
Get Well Soon, from your childhood indocrinations
devante11 3 months ago
First of all I didn't say all people are murders, i was using a example of a Judge in our earthly way of life and how he must hold to the standard of Justice. The point is if a human Judge who isn't perfect has a standard of Justice
(How much more God who is perfect and Holy and His Justice) You are being unfair and not reading or thinking of what i said. I only ask you be fair and balanced. This is part 1
Stan6468 3 months ago
@Stan6468
I also take it you go round requesting people in life, to go and kill members of their family [e.g. abraham sons].....as for you [according to your beliefs] this is a moral and just request
So thus, seeing you think this is that case..please do this same request to a police officer...tell me how it works out for you LOL LOL
devante11 3 months ago
If you believe something to be true, its is literally true to yourself. Athiests will never understand that people believe in god because its something they truly believe in. they will never believe in god because its something they will never believe in. for example you believe you are male or female, therefore you are and many transgendered people feel this way and make themselves the gender they believed they were. I would love a friendly debate.
gunshow911 3 months ago
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i laughed out loud in the 9:15 mark. he went from reading Scripture to outlandish speculation. "...there could have been a conversation between father & son..."???
really???
konzen15 3 months ago
Comment removed
konzen15 3 months ago
classic case how a good, decent and well-intentioned man can be messed-up by religion.
konzen15 3 months ago
Mr Dawkins keeps on asking if God is all powerful then just forgive--God is Just and Holy and He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free. God will not do that and He is Just but instead He sent His Son and His Son Jesus wanted to do this with Joy and accept the punishment so we could be with God and have a relationship again This is amazing and beautiful and i feel very sorry for Mr. Dawkins. I will pray for him.
Stan6468 3 months ago
@Stan6468. You pray for him, he'll think for you.
trocknickel 3 months ago
@Stan6468 So all people are "murderers" for what was done thousands of years before they were born? I think that is horrible to make innocent people pay for the crimes of another. And even if I accepted that premise, you think it is justice to punish someone who is innocent of a crime (Jesus) for the crimes of someone else? And by this punishment clear the names of everyone else? Also as long as you're being respectful it is Prof. Dawkins :)
JovialJewels 3 months ago
@Stan6468
"Mr Dawkins keeps on asking if God is all powerful then just forgive--God is Just and Holy and He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free"
1. Man can forgive, more than any god..man doesnt need to kill anyone to forgive...Thus man is more powerful than your god :)
[cont]
devante11 3 months ago
@Stan6468
2. You fail to see, punishment fits the crime....your fictional god fails in that repect..he has to punish you forever, he just cant get that anger out of his system
"He cannot just say "I forgive" anymore than a Judge could allow a murderer who is found guilty go free"
But your god does let murders go free if they except your zombie jesus
Murderer gets heaven
A non believer firefighter, saves many people/children/babies during his life..burns forever LOL
devante11 3 months ago
@Stan6468
"God will not do that and He is Just"
So, "just" gods murder their sons LOL
Lets not go as low as your gods standards, that each time we need to forgive we kill a member of our familys.....there will be no humans left......not all things are possible for your god..he cant forgive, without killing something LOL LOL
devante11 3 months ago
The reason why Christ had to suffer--God is a Just God and He cannot allow sin to go unpunished--Imagine a Judge allowing a murderer to go free knowing his guilt and the evidence points to his guilt. A GOOD Judge cannot do that. GOD cannot do this as well, Jesus says he will go down to earth and accept the punishment for mankind but Jesus is Holy and Perfect and by His death- Now those who believe- thier sins are redeemed and God is Just for he did punish the sins and we are forgiven.
Stan6468 3 months ago
Forget William Lane Craig, Frank Turek, Lee Strobel & the other pseudo-intellectual theologians.
THIS POOR SAP is how almost all believers actually think. That is to say, they haven't thought thru the logical implications of their religious beliefs at all, and when confronted with these inconvenient facts, they painfully fumble for a way to square the circle.
It's sad and pathetic.
The stupid, it hurts...and it's the most popular thing around!!!
LetReasonPrevail1 3 months ago
Dawkins cleans up every time. Love! xxxxxxxx
anitahobart 3 months ago
I can't believe christians actually believe the bible is non-fiction.
lovergal1984 3 months ago
ooo .. God gave us free will and choose any thing...... how do you deal with the discrepancy of God already planned for the future for the things you will become .... now thats not free will...how contradictory !!!!! stupid Theists
IvanderHaisley 3 months ago
Dawkins: "The Bible is so morally bankrupt. I don't like it."
Christian: "The Bible says God loves us."
Dawkins: "You're talking about the Bible again and I don't like that."
gilkwad 3 months ago
The Mob-Boss Analogy totally applies here.
Pantera4LifeXTX 3 months ago
I fucking hate these religious idiots who can not think for themselves and can only respond with scripture bullshit.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 3 months ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa LOL
Dawkins was attacking the morality of scripture. So why can't the scripture defend itself.
Don't call anyone an idiot, I haven't seen in my whole youtube life a theist calling an atheist an idiot.
kidasterorig111 3 months ago
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@kidasterorig111 fuck you, you are an idiot too.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 3 months ago
@aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa I fricking hate these Atheist idiots who can't think for themselves and can only respond with fake scientific theory as if it was fact. They are blind fools.
AuthorSteven 3 months ago
@AuthorStevenI know what you mean...it must be annoying having to listen to people present empiracle evidence that debunks 2000 year old bronze-age fairytales. Those stupid atheist scientists and their repeatable tests. Just like all this other stuff fake science theories, you know like medicine, electricity, the internet, hydroelectric damns, combustion engine, telephone, cellphones, toothpaste etc...Yeah, PH.D scientists are really stupid. Much better to just read a incoherent book (bible).
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 3 months ago
@AuthorSteven I know what you mean...it must be annoying having to listen to people present conclusions based on empiracle evidence that debunks 2000 year old bronze-age fairytales. Those stupid atheist scientists and their verifiable repeatable tests. Those dummies and their other fake science theories that gave us things like medicine, electricity, the internet, hydroelectric damns, combustion engine, telephone, cellphones, toothpaste etc...Yeah, PH.D scientists are really stupid and blind.
aaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaaqaa 3 months ago
@AuthorSteven lmfao!!! you fooooooool!! lol!!
theonlywayisgay 3 months ago
my heart pumps blood it all it does, i think with my brain, if you care for the future as species, we have to rid us of this fairy tales, the bible is made up, as a book is a great book so is the lord of the rings. That means i have to worship iluvatar and hate morgot, where is the evidence thanks i rest my case
legolasgreenleaff 4 months ago
"See my heart, not my intellect." In other words, give me credit for having good intentions, whether or not my beliefs make any sense.
Ugh.
ClumsyRoot 4 months ago
This guy talking with Dawkins just sounds plain stupid.
MrWagman11 4 months ago 6
@MrWagman11 how
AuthorSteven 3 months ago
I would have loved to hear Dawkins ask the interviewer why an all powerful creator would not remove this design flaw from the eye or even more why he would commit the error in the first place.
Chris197980CH 4 months ago
@Chris197980CH Ah! An easy answer. "It's all part of God's plan." Or. "God works in mysterious ways."
MrWagman11 3 months ago
@MrWagman11 These answers would be a move to avoid answering the real question and would go in a direction of agreeing that you have no logical explanation. It's not an answer an intelligent person would give to reply to an intelligent questioner.
Chris197980CH 3 months ago
@Chris197980CH But my answers are what we usually hear from Christians. Sad, but true.
MrWagman11 3 months ago
Comment removed
ta986468 4 months ago
Comment removed
RichieJohnSauls 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ta986468 Is that a threat?
RichieJohnSauls 4 months ago
hehehe nice appeal to irrelevant emotion at 9 minutes in... believe me because I will be sad if you don't
TheMogulmonster 4 months ago
I'm not atheist, but I see that atheists like Dawkins have a far superior concept of morality. torturing someone else, sacrificing others, & needless sacrifices are wrong. What kind of morality is it to require your own son be killed cuz someone else ate an apple? Christians have lost their way arguing that love is death. I feel that if Christians want to be a part of the future they'll have to finally put down their Bibles which pits them against science, reality & what love really is.
journeyond 4 months ago 17
in fact arguing the Bible is literally 100% true is morally wrong if you actually read it, as it advocates immoral concepts and things.
journeyond 4 months ago
@journeyond Immoral concepts like what? Slavery? Bias against women? How to treat non-believers? Christians have alternative explanations to all those things. It's just a matter of how you read the Bible. I'm not a Christian, but if you are against Christianity simply because you think the Bible is immoral despite other people telling you the alternative ways to interpret the passages, that's not being fair. u know what i mean?
Casshyr 4 months ago
@journeyond
They should read the bible first to learn why they should put it away.
housekilla457 4 months ago
@journeyond LOL
I concur. We are both non-atheists.
The only problem I have with you is that morality is something to be defined by your social environment and those who teach you. Meaning depending on your society morality might have a different meaning.
kidasterorig111 3 months ago
@journeyond If you take a stand on a topic like this and you write words like: "What kind of morality is it to require your own son be killed cuz someone else ate an apple?" You are simply ignorant of Christian beliefs. You try to "be moral" without morality... And to the quote I've provided I may add: and what if he didn't sacrifice his son and then everybody would die? You put too much simplicity trying not to be wise but to laugh at Christians. Is it ok to have this disguise?
slownikqwerty 3 months ago
@journeyond Why you have to use those words: I'm not atheist, but I see that atheists like Dawkins have a far superior concept of morality. torturing someone else, sacrificing others, & needless sacrifices are wrong" to be regarded as a reasonable man and then you simply laugh at Christians beliefs...
slownikqwerty 3 months ago
@journeyond 2000 years ago crucifixion was a lot more common then now. And 2000 years ago animal sacrifices were common, it was seen as pleasing the Gods. And for those who argue that Jesus gave his life, sacrificed himself.. The almighty God could have chosen to simply not give us sin. Anyway.. I think its amazing how people try to fit in a 2000 year morality these days. It's just as outdated as trying to make a fire to get warm, while we just can turn up the heating.
Ranokian 2 months ago
@journeyond wow. if only more religious people had your point of view, the world would be a much better place.
ultim4t32 2 months ago
Then again, God was the one who created Adam, so God knew exactly he was going to commit the sin, and then punishes him for that. Much like dropping a vase and then blaming said vase when it smashes on the ground.
Voiderify 4 months ago
"I'm asking you to consider my position".
Absolutely not. There is no "position" to consider. Debate depends on substantiated evidential fact not immoral bronze-age wishful thinking. Can you imagine Dawkins coming out with the same sort of "Just because it is - it says in the bible" type of response this buffoon offers?
blackmore4 4 months ago
The story of Jesus is the same myth as Dionysos, Mithras, Attis and hundreds of other "son of gods". They performed the same miracles, were the same age, had the same number of disciples and all that.
What it all comes down to is the worship of the sun disguised in parables, stories, allegories and myths. To have a discussion about Jesus in terms of a historical person is absolutely ludicrious!
Elmgren76 5 months ago
At 7+ minutes.
The judge going to jail for thief wouldn't solve anything because the injured party remains injured and you're undermining the whole point of the justice system, which is to discourage thieving in the first place!
dhx84 5 months ago
@dhx84
To extend the metaphor, killing your own son as an equivalent sacrifice for somebody else's crime doesn't address the problem of the crime in the first place.
It's doubly worse because an all-powerful god can simply decide to fix the problem instead of going through all these contortions.
dhx84 5 months ago
At 4+ minutes.
So why the fuck didn't God forgive Adam?
dhx84 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Dead-to-the-spirit deluded "God Delusion" author & blithering fool scientist goon Richard Dawkins another "leader" given to the profane masses is another useful idiot for Jesuit machinations-C.O.
Jesuitical: pertaining to the Jesuits or their principals; designing; cunning; deceitful; prevaricating
The Jesuit Order completely altered the education system to suit their Evo-Hoax agenda to discredit the Bible. They cant have a Satanic society of 'Do as Thou Wilt' if people still follow the Bible
SpencerBenedict2nd 5 months ago
Dawkins 1 Religious nutcase 0
lavars 5 months ago 14
@lavars
Dawkins does well when he takes on religious nut cases.
When he takes on intellectuals he frequently ends up looking foolish.
ivlfounder 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ivlfounder
'When he takes on intellectuals he frequently ends up looking foolish.'
Really? Frequently? Care to show some examples?
chrisbevan1000 5 months ago
@ivlfounder You must not watch or read very much by Richard Dawkins if you think that's true. Now you're just making things up just like Bill O'Reilly. I don't believe he's made himself look foolish yet. Not in his professional career.
Sinisterage 4 months ago
@Sinisterage
Watch him attempt to take on Lennox.
ivlfounder 4 months ago
@ivlfounder I have, and the only thing he 'admits' to is that there is a Possible, Reasonably Acceptable case could be made for the existence of a god. The bottom line of atheism, being agnosticism, and knowing that most if not all Atheists concede to the Minute Possibility that there was a god, this argument has made no progress for Theists. We've admitted our agnosticism from the beginning, we just believe the statistic point more toward No than Yes. But Yes will always be possible. I win. Bye
Sinisterage 4 months ago
@Sinisterage
Oh it sounds like you just watched one of the debates.
Try watching them both.
Or are you afraid to face reality?
ivlfounder 4 months ago