@sooowatsup100 hahahaha 4 times...crazy like a fox. bang bang bang bang, i say shoot more thugs. gangs attacking people should be shot...kill them all i say. shoot them until your bullets are gone. when someone drops a shoping cart on your wifes head or a bucket with concrete on you brother or dad. will you feel the same way?
@billman501 i don't disagree with what he did. these black thugs are a drag on society. however, i'm still pretty sure goetz is mentally ill. i mean who dedicates their life to urban squirrels??
Ramseur, on the kids Goetz shot, just died at the age of 45 of a drug OD/suicide. in 1985, he falsely reported to police that two men hired by Goetz had kidnapped and attempted to kill him. also in '85, Ramseur held the gun while an associate raped, sodomized and robbed a pregnant eighteen-year-old woman. no big loss here right?
Mr. Goetz did the right thing back in 1984 and I still agree with him completely. I was and am still one of his admirers. I wish him All The Best for a Merry Christmas and the Best of New Years and for all the years to come. The work he is doing helping out the Squirrels in New York Parks is absolutely fantastic. GO BERNIE....
Oh bullshit if he'd a pulled his gun and shot them ,the 4 thugs with sharpened screwdrivers would have sensed his unwillingness to use it and stuck him. 3 of them IMMEDIATELY went on to commit more violent crimes and bounce in and out of prison (once for 25 years) the 4th never hurt anyone else only because he was crippled.
@jackle5000 = usually true but read comments from some who said they were black and agreed with Mr. Goetz and supporters then and now. Those who disagree R usually worthless scum bags like ones shot. I am non white and non black but I do not care what = race, nationality, religion, etc. anyone is. Anyone committing a criminal act on any human being or animal deserves 2 B killed on the spot. All decent blacks want these people killed as much as any other decent person does.
@curtisjones400 Really? I'm from Detroit so I don't know the whole story. All I know is that if five dudes approached me at the same time I'd be dumpin on em too! But if they ran away, then it's on him and it's not self-defense anymore...
@curtisjones400 They still posed a danger to the general public. Here's a thought: you wont have to worry about getting shot in your spinal cord if you aren't a piece of shit violent criminal.
@autismpete actually a couple of them kept at it, one got a 25 yr sentence for rape and another one was hit with parole violations when he got caught robbing people
But if Goetz felt he was in so much danger due to the amount of crime in New York City, why didn't he simply leave instead of sticking a gun in his pants and waiting around for a risky confrontation? Whether those young black guys threatened him or not, I can't help but get the feeling he was looking for a reason to use that gun.
I lived through this as a New Yorker. Every sane person backed him. He became a hero, and rightly so. He IS a hero. I'm afraid if that happened today, he would spend the rest of his life in prison. The Al Sharptons and Jesse Jacksons would see to that.
The problem is that the 4 black guys didn't explicitly threaten him. They had screwdrivers in their possession, but never showed them or pulled them out. They also had a criminal history, but Goetz didn't know about it so that isn't relevant to his actions. He also shot one guy in the back after he was either down or retreating. All of that is always going to cast some doubt on whether his use of force was reasonable or excessive.
I see a gentle soul in this video, not a killer. He did what he had to do. I think all sane people should be allowed to carry guns, because there are a lot of crazies out there, and there is no longer such a thing as a fair fight.
What I see in Goetz is a normally passive and meek individual (a total nerd) who's usually a nice quiet guy but one day got sick and tired of being picked on (he had been mugged twice before the famous subway shooting), and he decided to go look for a little revenge. I can sympathize, but cannot approve. NYC was a crime-ridden shithole back then, and he would've been better off just leaving. He wouldn't have gotten in all that legal trouble and be living in squalor like he is now.
Berni, you were our hero in Newark NJ and you will always be our hero. Everyone should have a gun that's a good guy and kill all the scumbags of the world when they come looking for trouble.
@ssuuppeerrbbooyy i agree i don't believe that race was the primary factor-Bernard Goetz had been robbed twice before he was extremely paranoid and i belive that he would have shot anybody reguardless of race
It should be legal to kill someone any time they try to rob you, especially if they use a weapon. Also it should be legal to carry concealed knives and guns in public.
That shooting is one of the greatest miscarriages of justice in U.S. History. How is shooting one of the kids while he was sitting, and another while he was running away self defense? Goetz is a sociopath and nothing more, and anyone who calls him a hero is either a racist, sociopath or both.
If you saw the recent show that aired about Mr. Goetz you might understand more. In a situation like that a person only has seconds to react and with proper training will react the way Goetz did. He show all 4 in a matter of seconds. That is great marksmanship. They were going tio rob him and if they weren't looking for trouble then that boy would still be walking. Race played no role in this situation. Mr. Goetz would have taken care of business not matter what color those punks were.
@goetzfan He went back to the paralyzed kid and said something to the effect of "here's another one" but he was out of ammo. The kid who got paralyzed never even left his seat. Shooting a person who is seated, then attempting to shoot him again after he is clearly neutralized is not justified, PERIOD. And this is about race because prejudice is the reason that pieceof shit isn't on prison where a nut like him belongs.
@TheCircle000 You can say what you want but in my eyes Goetz is and always will be a hero to me. The only bad thing that happened was he had a 5 shot revolver and not a six to give another shot to the paralyzed punk. I only hope to shake Goetz's hand one day or buy him dinner.
@goetzfan Actually I am not saying what I "want" I am saying what is true. The "punk" who never moved and Goetz attempted to then murder after there was UNDENIABLY no threat whatsoever, didn't deserve what happened to him. He didn't move, and even after he was fully neutralized Goetz tried to kill him. THAT IS NOT A JUSTIFIED SHOOTING!
@TheCircle000 Goetz had seconds to react and when he decided to shoot he did the right thing and shot them all. If one goes then they all go because you don't know how they are going to react. He was robbed and beaten before and made sure it was not going to happen again. He did not know the kid was paralyzed so he wanted to make sure the kid got what was coming.
@goetzfan "Shoot them all" That is very irrational thinking. You can't just shoot everyone in your vicinity regardless of whether they are a real threat or not. Goetz was fully aware that Cabey was incapacitated when he attempted to shoot him again. That is not self defense legally or morally!
@TheCircle000----Why do people like you always try to defend a a life-long criminal, and make the victim a crimal & the criminal a victim?????????????? It's people like you who keep bringing society down.
@TheCircle000 You are right it IS about race. A group of racist black guys wanting to rob a lone,vulnerable looking white guy who they assumed would be an easy mark.
@Chrisdrumz Cabey never even moved and he got paralyzed. But just as you have said (proving my point) "this is a group of racist black guys wanting to rob a lone, vulnerable looking white guy" How was Cabey robbing him if he didn't even move??? This proves my point. Racist people like you can't possibly conceive that maybe not all young black boys are criminals!
@TheCircle000 You seem to be under the impression that Cabey was just some guy who just happened to be there perhaps "just along for the ride",he wasn't,he was no innocent victim. He was a part of that group and was guilty by association. Contrary to what you may think,I am fully aware not all young black males are criminals,however these guys certainly were.
@Chrisdrumz Guilt by association? No you actually have to do something to be guilty of a crime. Not just so happen to be with people who may or may not have allegedly plotting to rob someone. Cabey never moved, then Goetz attempted to shoot him again when he was clearly incapacitated. That's not self-defense and Goetz should have served time and prison for what he did. But racism won.
@TheCircle000 Wait,are you implying these guy's were simply wanting Goetz to give them $5? Are you implying they had no intention of mugging him? Do you believe had he simply refused to give them the money there would not have been trouble? Are you under the impression HAD an assault on Goetz taken place Cabey would not have gotten involved? C'mon now,let's face reality. Let's face the reality of a New York subway in the early 80's. It's NOT racism. It's fear,and self preservation.
@Chrisdrumz I am not 100% saying either possibility. Only those men who got shot truly know. All I know is that Goetz's actions were unreasonable. He could have pulled the gun and used it as a threat rather than pulling the trigger. He shot one as he was running away, then Cabey while he was sitting. People have the responsibility to ensure that there is a definite threat before using deadly force. Someone running away is clearly not a threat. Maybe Texans think it's acceptable, not me.
@TheCircle000 Lol. I like the Texans swipe. For the record i'm no Texan. Born and raised in Brooklyn New York. The old "Threat" argument huh? Yeah,he could've just pulled ou the gun and waved it around. I'm sure they would've ran. Had you been in his situation perhaps you wouldn't have found shooting them very UNREASONABLE(especially had you previously been mugged and beaten).
@Chrisdrumz I wasn't at all trying to imply you were from Texas. I am from Chicago. What I think is that you are looking at this situation in a very "black and white" manner. Look at the full complexity of what happened. Sure, you can argue that at the time he was "surrounded" that he can assume he is in danger, but once someone is running away, a self-defense claim goes out the window. So maybe in the beginning he was defending himself, after they ran, HE became the attacker.
Oh bullshit you weren't there...."using the gun as a threat w/o pulling the trigger" WTF they all had sharpened screwdrivers out and were ready to stick him, any delay would have been fatal. Except the one he put in a wheelchair, all the others went on to commit violent crimes and went to prison. When FOUR people surround someone with deadly weapons, they don't deserve one last chance, they'd just view it as weakness and start sticking you.
@TheJomogogo I wasn't there but plenty of witnesses said that Cabey never eve moved from his seat, yet he was shot like an animal. Just because the rest went on to live bad lives doesn't mean they were going to rob him. Have you also ever considered the fact that this miscarriage of justice may have had negative psychological effects and may have contributed to their future life of crime?
You are clearly in denial "just because the rest of them went on to rape and kill others doesn't mean they were going to rob him" you stupit fuck and as far as Cabey "never moving from his seat" that's because he was about to stab goetz when he shot him then Cabey sat down so STFU you nig loving faggit
@TheJomogogo AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I am literally on the floor laughing at how ridiculous you are. Someone using the N word is calling me a racist? I'm not using low life racist words like you. I am examining facts to have a true debate. If you shoot a man who is sitting down (Cabey) , that is not self-defense. Obviously you are not capable of an intelligent debate because you quickly resort to name calling and racist slurs.
how can he be a hero he was so scared he had to shoot?how bout we all shot each other every time we get scared . by the way the kid might of did a yo mama joke. it must been a good one.lol
Mr goetz, i grew up in N.Y.C. and your right you had to watch your back all the time because their was always people looking to mug you. I'm glad you didn't go to jail because you took care of some bad hoodlums , who turned out to be real bad anyway. I think you were the hero N.Y. needed just most were to afraid to act i was also mugged two times. I is nice to see someone took out the trash. What you did made me feel like i can be more at ease now.
Bernie stepped up to the plate that day. That squirrel can bite him and give him rabies.but a real animal can sense when a human is not a threat . Real animals don't go out to fuck with people. Bernie prevented a lot future incidents like his from happening and thus saved many lives from being taken. Peace and Respect to you Mr Goetz.
@AmazingKnifeThrower you say he couldn't fight like a man which means you know that an altercation was going to happen between one man and 4 thugs (that's fair right). Bernie evened the score and shot 4 pieces of S&%T. They all have been in trouble with the law again after that night except for the one in the wheel chair (upstanding citizens right). Bernie served justice that night and you cannot say anything bad about him to me.
Bernie is the BEST! I have no doubt that his actions deterred countless other criminal bullies, like the wastes of human protoplasm who picked on him.
That is so cool! I did not know squirrels could be so charming and playful. Wonderful to see and so Amazing to know you are a Vegetarian! Like most of the brilliant people in Earth's Historical Cultures :)
To continue, those why try and play the race card are pathetic. And why Goetz was told to pay compensation to the one he injured is beyond a joke ... I hope he doesn't pay a penny.
Berhard Goetz wouldn't even have been indicted if it had happened today.
When all is said and done, 4 youths surrounded him on a train (on his own) and demanded money off him in a threatening manner, In 1980s NYC, people were routinely shot and killed for similar demands.
I'm surpised this was never made into a Hollywood movie.
@daveevans1000 Simple....Hollywood would never do it because it would give the people a real heroe to look up to and not the phony heroes Hollywood wants us to look at in the movies.
@tjrxk7 You couldn't have said that any better!!!!!!!!!! GREAT COMMENT. It's nice to know that there are still some people out there with a lot of common sense.
@daveevans1000 I don't know if you know this-----------but so far----he has not paid out a penny. He is a very smart man. This is truly one guy that should never be underestimated!!!!!!!!!
Sometimes we need people like Bernie Goetz to send the message to the police and the courts: "If you don't do your damn jobs, we citizens will do it for you." Both the police and legal system sometimes need a good kick in the ass anytime they get lazy, soft-headed, or corrupt.
@WeAreDevo456 However, I'd rather that the police do their jobs. This means of course going after those who violate other people's rights, property and lives instead of occupying themselves with harassing minorities, cancer patients, political dissidents, gun owners, homosexuals (if the town/city has anti-sodomy laws), and small business owners. Because I'd hate to see anyplace in the US to degenerate into anarchy and mob rule because the police there had become bullies and cowards.
@WeAreDevo456 i, myself feel i have no rights. the legal people who have authority have sleazy ways of doing things. i've dealt w/ attorneys before. lots of them are scums. not to put down the justice system it's just very bad. i hate going to jury duty. the justice system is basically for the rich & powerful. it's painfu when a good person suffers. it seems that the justice system protects the bad people. you're right. it is corrupted. anyway enjoy your life to the fullest. good comment.
walking through Un.Square park this evening-4/27.Saw Bernie get bitten on thumb by his pet squirrel.I assisted him with some napkins to stop the bleeding.He was very thankfull but grew a little squirrelly when people started to take notice and snap pictures.He thanked me again and walked into the sunset,like the man with no name.
If you had a gun in your pocket (because you were sick of being mugged) and four thugs wanted to rob you. or attack you with screwdrivers, what would you do?
I suppose you'd just lay back and take it right?
I don't care what color you are, that would just be stupid and possibly suicidal.
well...regardless, Id say Antwun Parker was the retarted one (now dead) for trying to rob a pharmacy..I mean, think about it, if him and his buddy hadnt gone into that place with a gun, trying to rob it, then he MIGHT still be alive. They started the ball rolling, dont you get that? Just like the guys Goetz shot, they started it off with him..and its no small coincidence that all of those guys eventually went to prison for other robberies, and a rape of a pregnat woman. Damn, you dont get it!!!
I would feel the same way if it were white thugs that got killed, by the way..its not about racism, it is about responding to fear, anger, adrenaline, and the instinct for self preservation..just think, if Goetz wouldve killed em all, he would have stopped alot of future violent crimes, and saved that pregnant 19 yr old girl from being raped and sodomized at gunpoint...but Im sure you think thats okay too, since you support criminals so proudly, you fucking ignorant fool.
@TheDSwartz Nicely put!!!!!!!!!!!! I am so sick of people who defend criminals, and criticze the victims. It seems to me that there are more & more people out there who have this attitude---------------"What's good is really bad, and what's bad is really good". These are people who bring society down. A guy like Bernie helps bring society backup. I grew up in NYC as a teen in the 1980's, and I remember that era very well. Bernie was definitely defending himself. Police help was not there.
For all you guys who want to incriminate a squirrel loving vigilante, consider these events. Bernie now spends his life raising squirrels and advocating vegetarianism. James Ramesuer, one of the four men, brutally raped a pregnant nineteen year old teenager as soon as he recovered from his wounds and is now serving jail time. The other tried to hire hitmen to kill Bernie. In my eyes, Bernie should have ended their pathetic lives that day.
Haha no not a racist, just sick of people trying to rob him. Your saying his a racist but who is the one calling him a honkey and a cracker?. You idiot, those people deserved to get shot, did you hear that one of them got convicted of rape after that incident?, its a shame he didnt kill them all.
@AmazingKnifeThrower you say he couldn't fight like a man which means you know that an altercation was going to happen between one man and 4 thugs (that's fair right). Bernie evened the score and shot 4 pieces of S&%T. They all have been in trouble with the law again after that night except for the one in the wheel chair (upstanding citizens right). Bernie served justice that night and you cannot say anything bad about him to me.
@AmazingKnifeThrower----What makes you think that a MAN is a person who can fight? I grew up in NYC with many street fighting tough guys. A lot of them are not men. They can fight real good, but they are pieces of trash. They are not responsible, and don't know how to work and hold down a job like a real man. You need to learn what a real man is. If those 4 thugs were "real men", they would not have messed with Bernie in the first place. They thought he was an easy target. They admitted that!!!!
@michaelmirraandmarc he could of went with sumthing a little less lethal like a knife or peper spray or he could of even shot out there legs BUT there wuz no need for him 2 shoot the guy tht did nottin at all and paralyz him
@AmazingKnifeThrower Well----maybe, but if you knew what NYC was like in the 1970's & 80's you would understand why he carried a gun, and not those items that you mentioned. Those guys were (& probably still are) trash. One of them raped a pregnant 19 year old after Bernie shot him. Why on earth would anyone worry about these guys lives---when all they do is terrorize other people? They have no conscience. Bernie---a good guy who bothers nobody--was helping society. He works for his money!!!!!!!
@goetzfan Right...Because shooting a man who was sitting down, then attempting to shoot him again while he squirms, paralyzed and in pain is such a righteous man. You are obviously as nutty as Goetz.
It wasn't like Goetz snapped one day. He had experienced a history of mugging and intimidation in NYC. On previous occasions, he brandished his revolver to scare potential muggers - he went further this time.
No American, no matter their race, deserves to have to go about their day in fear. I'm sure Goetz put fear into the minds of countless would-be criminals; he's a hero.
I wish more people would rely on themselves rather than be victims. Bernhard Goetz is a hero. The only thing he did wrong was letting ANY of those POSs live. The resulting criminal and civil trial shows that prosecutors and the police are more worried about the rights of criminals than the well being of their victims. Frankly if your not going to protect yourself, who will? the police? the court? LOL. Thank god for people like Brenie we need more people like that.
This video shows how this hero has so much respect for innocent life. Since I neither like McCain, nor Hitlery, nor Osama, I am voting for Bernie in the next presidential election.
I hear he is a vegetarian. He would be an excellent advocate for animal rights. Of course of type of animals that tried to mug him would either be put in a cage or humanly put to sleep if they were too violent and out of control.
I'm inclined to agree with egocentress. If what he/she(?) says is accurate, then it definitely sounds like Bernie *was* looking for trouble. Those muggers he shot could easily have *not* been muggers. They could have easily been some dumb street kids trying to scare some poor unsuspecting person. The fact that they *were* muggers doesn't make what Bernie did right. The fact that they were just makes him *lucky*.
I share an office with Bernie. I know his story through and through. He was on his way to meet friends, who, by the way, still meet downtown. It was xmas time. Also, he had been carrying that gun for over a year before using it. He was not out looking for trouble. He had the gun to protect himself if it came to that.
in that case, i have been misinformed... what i know about the story is just what i have read from different (not necessarily credible) sources... i will concede to peapod8 that if Bernie really was on his way to meet friends and has been carrying a gun on his person for over a year, then it does sound more likely that Bernie shot those muggers in self defence
Well...those muggers admitted that they were going to mug Benard Goetz. Secondly, they committed more crimes after they recovered from their injuries. One of them held a gun on a pregnant woman while another man raped and sodomized her. So I disagree and feel that Bernard Goetz was right.
did those muggers really tell Bernie, before Bernie shot them, that they were going to mug him? if they did, then that makes Bernie's story a lot less controversial than it has usually been made out to be.
if they did not, then consider this: someone just like Bernie could be in very similar situation and have made the exact same choice, except in this case those guys weren't muggers. keep in mind that this person also doesn't know that these guys weren't muggers. is this person right or wrong?
The persons in both scenarios were equally unsure if the people that approached them were muggers or not (I'm assuming they didn't tell Bernie they were gonna mug him).
If Bernie is right and the other guy is wrong, that means that what makes a person's actions right or wrong can be determined by facts that may not be available to him/her.
But shouldn't the moral quality of a person's actions only be determined by the knowledge that he/she immediately has available?
No offense but your kind of bouncing around on the subject. "Moral quality of a persons action?" A person can't always tell or have the knowledge that they are going to be mugged or attacked. And not all mugging victims were told that they were going to mugged. Some victims were just attacked and others were asked for a cigarette and was punched in the face. Some people have street smarts and can have an idea who's a dirt bag.
The man did what he had to do.
BLACKBEARD71870 3 weeks ago
uh, can u say mentally ill??
sooowatsup100 1 month ago
@sooowatsup100 hahahaha 4 times...crazy like a fox. bang bang bang bang, i say shoot more thugs. gangs attacking people should be shot...kill them all i say. shoot them until your bullets are gone. when someone drops a shoping cart on your wifes head or a bucket with concrete on you brother or dad. will you feel the same way?
billman501 4 weeks ago
@billman501 i don't disagree with what he did. these black thugs are a drag on society. however, i'm still pretty sure goetz is mentally ill. i mean who dedicates their life to urban squirrels??
sooowatsup100 4 weeks ago
Ramseur, on the kids Goetz shot, just died at the age of 45 of a drug OD/suicide. in 1985, he falsely reported to police that two men hired by Goetz had kidnapped and attempted to kill him. also in '85, Ramseur held the gun while an associate raped, sodomized and robbed a pregnant eighteen-year-old woman. no big loss here right?
belairjeff 1 month ago
@belairjeff Ahhh, so the thug lived and died in pure agony. Good.
Khultan 1 month ago
Mr. Goetz did the right thing back in 1984 and I still agree with him completely. I was and am still one of his admirers. I wish him All The Best for a Merry Christmas and the Best of New Years and for all the years to come. The work he is doing helping out the Squirrels in New York Parks is absolutely fantastic. GO BERNIE....
OtrTruckDriverRibet 1 month ago
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curtisjones400 1 month ago
@OtrTruckDriverRibet Goetz did not have to shoot those guys-all he had to do was pull out his gun
curtisjones400 1 month ago
@curtisjones400
Oh bullshit if he'd a pulled his gun and shot them ,the 4 thugs with sharpened screwdrivers would have sensed his unwillingness to use it and stuck him. 3 of them IMMEDIATELY went on to commit more violent crimes and bounce in and out of prison (once for 25 years) the 4th never hurt anyone else only because he was crippled.
Blahblobify 1 month ago
I think it's safe to say that anyone arguing against Mr Goetz is black or of non-white origin.
jackle5000 1 month ago
@jackle5000 = usually true but read comments from some who said they were black and agreed with Mr. Goetz and supporters then and now. Those who disagree R usually worthless scum bags like ones shot. I am non white and non black but I do not care what = race, nationality, religion, etc. anyone is. Anyone committing a criminal act on any human being or animal deserves 2 B killed on the spot. All decent blacks want these people killed as much as any other decent person does.
OtrTruckDriverRibet 1 month ago
Comment removed
curtisjones400 2 months ago
@curtisjones400 Really? I'm from Detroit so I don't know the whole story. All I know is that if five dudes approached me at the same time I'd be dumpin on em too! But if they ran away, then it's on him and it's not self-defense anymore...
autismpete 2 months ago
@curtisjones400 They still posed a danger to the general public. Here's a thought: you wont have to worry about getting shot in your spinal cord if you aren't a piece of shit violent criminal.
XmXFLUXmX2 2 months ago 2
Mr. Goetz, I would be honored to shake your hand!
SEVASTRA22 2 months ago 3
@autismpete actually a couple of them kept at it, one got a 25 yr sentence for rape and another one was hit with parole violations when he got caught robbing people
808gamerhawaii 4 months ago 2
@autismpete
But if Goetz felt he was in so much danger due to the amount of crime in New York City, why didn't he simply leave instead of sticking a gun in his pants and waiting around for a risky confrontation? Whether those young black guys threatened him or not, I can't help but get the feeling he was looking for a reason to use that gun.
logik316 5 months ago
I lived through this as a New Yorker. Every sane person backed him. He became a hero, and rightly so. He IS a hero. I'm afraid if that happened today, he would spend the rest of his life in prison. The Al Sharptons and Jesse Jacksons would see to that.
thecatatemyhomework 6 months ago
@thecatatemyhomework
The problem is that the 4 black guys didn't explicitly threaten him. They had screwdrivers in their possession, but never showed them or pulled them out. They also had a criminal history, but Goetz didn't know about it so that isn't relevant to his actions. He also shot one guy in the back after he was either down or retreating. All of that is always going to cast some doubt on whether his use of force was reasonable or excessive.
logik316 5 months ago
I see a gentle soul in this video, not a killer. He did what he had to do. I think all sane people should be allowed to carry guns, because there are a lot of crazies out there, and there is no longer such a thing as a fair fight.
This man is a hero. Do not doubt that.
matchheads 7 months ago 8
@matchheads But he didn't do what he should have, use a .357 and shoot their testicles out of their new assholes.
weiner66 6 months ago
@matchheads
What I see in Goetz is a normally passive and meek individual (a total nerd) who's usually a nice quiet guy but one day got sick and tired of being picked on (he had been mugged twice before the famous subway shooting), and he decided to go look for a little revenge. I can sympathize, but cannot approve. NYC was a crime-ridden shithole back then, and he would've been better off just leaving. He wouldn't have gotten in all that legal trouble and be living in squalor like he is now.
logik316 5 months ago
I heard about this man on The "Aftermath" with william shatner. How does he play with the squirrel like that? Their wild...
HomicidalDavid 7 months ago
fuck me bernie, fuck me
MrJudas666666 7 months ago
Anyone who shoots a nigger is a hero of mine!!!!!
MegaJohnnywadd 8 months ago 2
AMERICAN HERO, no questions about it!
x4nit0s 8 months ago
I dare you to run over his squirrel!!
jabmalassie 8 months ago
What a hero, and hes kind to animals, just dont f@ck with him
ybot1983 1 year ago
Berni, you were our hero in Newark NJ and you will always be our hero. Everyone should have a gun that's a good guy and kill all the scumbags of the world when they come looking for trouble.
wolf2351 1 year ago
he's a very creepy guy...
metsoIomita 1 year ago
He did the right thing. Not very civilized, but it cost society less (at least if he had killed them)
BlacksVideos 1 year ago
Bernie Goetz will Goetz you!
ReadmanJ 1 year ago
Obviously the 2 dislikes are people who don't know his story or 2 of the 4 scumbags he shot!
mattsnow81 1 year ago 9
The real Charles Bronson!
JohnFromSpace 1 year ago
would this guy shot 4 white guys trying to mug him? i think he would.
ssuuppeerrbbooyy 1 year ago
@ssuuppeerrbbooyy i agree i don't believe that race was the primary factor-Bernard Goetz had been robbed twice before he was extremely paranoid and i belive that he would have shot anybody reguardless of race
curtisjones400 1 year ago
He's a nut
Superplatanoman 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Superplatanoman only a nigger would say that.
lmneozoo 1 year ago
It should be legal to kill someone any time they try to rob you, especially if they use a weapon. Also it should be legal to carry concealed knives and guns in public.
XanaduZune 1 year ago
@XanaduZune it is.
7commenter7 1 year ago
That shooting is one of the greatest miscarriages of justice in U.S. History. How is shooting one of the kids while he was sitting, and another while he was running away self defense? Goetz is a sociopath and nothing more, and anyone who calls him a hero is either a racist, sociopath or both.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
If you saw the recent show that aired about Mr. Goetz you might understand more. In a situation like that a person only has seconds to react and with proper training will react the way Goetz did. He show all 4 in a matter of seconds. That is great marksmanship. They were going tio rob him and if they weren't looking for trouble then that boy would still be walking. Race played no role in this situation. Mr. Goetz would have taken care of business not matter what color those punks were.
goetzfan 1 year ago
@goetzfan He went back to the paralyzed kid and said something to the effect of "here's another one" but he was out of ammo. The kid who got paralyzed never even left his seat. Shooting a person who is seated, then attempting to shoot him again after he is clearly neutralized is not justified, PERIOD. And this is about race because prejudice is the reason that pieceof shit isn't on prison where a nut like him belongs.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 You can say what you want but in my eyes Goetz is and always will be a hero to me. The only bad thing that happened was he had a 5 shot revolver and not a six to give another shot to the paralyzed punk. I only hope to shake Goetz's hand one day or buy him dinner.
goetzfan 1 year ago
@goetzfan Actually I am not saying what I "want" I am saying what is true. The "punk" who never moved and Goetz attempted to then murder after there was UNDENIABLY no threat whatsoever, didn't deserve what happened to him. He didn't move, and even after he was fully neutralized Goetz tried to kill him. THAT IS NOT A JUSTIFIED SHOOTING!
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 Goetz had seconds to react and when he decided to shoot he did the right thing and shot them all. If one goes then they all go because you don't know how they are going to react. He was robbed and beaten before and made sure it was not going to happen again. He did not know the kid was paralyzed so he wanted to make sure the kid got what was coming.
goetzfan 1 year ago
@goetzfan "Shoot them all" That is very irrational thinking. You can't just shoot everyone in your vicinity regardless of whether they are a real threat or not. Goetz was fully aware that Cabey was incapacitated when he attempted to shoot him again. That is not self defense legally or morally!
TheCircle000 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheCircle000----Why do people like you always try to defend a a life-long criminal, and make the victim a crimal & the criminal a victim?????????????? It's people like you who keep bringing society down.
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 You are right it IS about race. A group of racist black guys wanting to rob a lone,vulnerable looking white guy who they assumed would be an easy mark.
Chrisdrumz 1 year ago
@Chrisdrumz Cabey never even moved and he got paralyzed. But just as you have said (proving my point) "this is a group of racist black guys wanting to rob a lone, vulnerable looking white guy" How was Cabey robbing him if he didn't even move??? This proves my point. Racist people like you can't possibly conceive that maybe not all young black boys are criminals!
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 You seem to be under the impression that Cabey was just some guy who just happened to be there perhaps "just along for the ride",he wasn't,he was no innocent victim. He was a part of that group and was guilty by association. Contrary to what you may think,I am fully aware not all young black males are criminals,however these guys certainly were.
Chrisdrumz 1 year ago
@Chrisdrumz Guilt by association? No you actually have to do something to be guilty of a crime. Not just so happen to be with people who may or may not have allegedly plotting to rob someone. Cabey never moved, then Goetz attempted to shoot him again when he was clearly incapacitated. That's not self-defense and Goetz should have served time and prison for what he did. But racism won.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 Wait,are you implying these guy's were simply wanting Goetz to give them $5? Are you implying they had no intention of mugging him? Do you believe had he simply refused to give them the money there would not have been trouble? Are you under the impression HAD an assault on Goetz taken place Cabey would not have gotten involved? C'mon now,let's face reality. Let's face the reality of a New York subway in the early 80's. It's NOT racism. It's fear,and self preservation.
Chrisdrumz 1 year ago
@Chrisdrumz I am not 100% saying either possibility. Only those men who got shot truly know. All I know is that Goetz's actions were unreasonable. He could have pulled the gun and used it as a threat rather than pulling the trigger. He shot one as he was running away, then Cabey while he was sitting. People have the responsibility to ensure that there is a definite threat before using deadly force. Someone running away is clearly not a threat. Maybe Texans think it's acceptable, not me.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000 Lol. I like the Texans swipe. For the record i'm no Texan. Born and raised in Brooklyn New York. The old "Threat" argument huh? Yeah,he could've just pulled ou the gun and waved it around. I'm sure they would've ran. Had you been in his situation perhaps you wouldn't have found shooting them very UNREASONABLE(especially had you previously been mugged and beaten).
Chrisdrumz 1 year ago
@Chrisdrumz I wasn't at all trying to imply you were from Texas. I am from Chicago. What I think is that you are looking at this situation in a very "black and white" manner. Look at the full complexity of what happened. Sure, you can argue that at the time he was "surrounded" that he can assume he is in danger, but once someone is running away, a self-defense claim goes out the window. So maybe in the beginning he was defending himself, after they ran, HE became the attacker.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000
Oh bullshit you weren't there...."using the gun as a threat w/o pulling the trigger" WTF they all had sharpened screwdrivers out and were ready to stick him, any delay would have been fatal. Except the one he put in a wheelchair, all the others went on to commit violent crimes and went to prison. When FOUR people surround someone with deadly weapons, they don't deserve one last chance, they'd just view it as weakness and start sticking you.
TheJomogogo 1 year ago
@TheJomogogo I wasn't there but plenty of witnesses said that Cabey never eve moved from his seat, yet he was shot like an animal. Just because the rest went on to live bad lives doesn't mean they were going to rob him. Have you also ever considered the fact that this miscarriage of justice may have had negative psychological effects and may have contributed to their future life of crime?
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000
You are clearly in denial "just because the rest of them went on to rape and kill others doesn't mean they were going to rob him" you stupit fuck and as far as Cabey "never moving from his seat" that's because he was about to stab goetz when he shot him then Cabey sat down so STFU you nig loving faggit
TheJomogogo 1 year ago
@TheJomogogo Hahaha! Classic! A racist calling ME an idiot! LMFAO!
TheCircle000 1 year ago
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TheJomogogo 1 year ago
@TheJomogogo AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I am literally on the floor laughing at how ridiculous you are. Someone using the N word is calling me a racist? I'm not using low life racist words like you. I am examining facts to have a true debate. If you shoot a man who is sitting down (Cabey) , that is not self-defense. Obviously you are not capable of an intelligent debate because you quickly resort to name calling and racist slurs.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
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TheJomogogo 1 year ago
@TheJomogogo OK I'm done with you child. I'm more interested in debating with intelligent logical people.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
@TheCircle000
Yeah why don't you hook up with the three silverbacks that Goetz shot, they'd love to hear from you.
TheJomogogo 1 year ago
how can he be a hero he was so scared he had to shoot?how bout we all shot each other every time we get scared . by the way the kid might of did a yo mama joke. it must been a good one.lol
eastside4life100 1 year ago
Thats pretty cool, nice dude. Did you know Deathwish with Charles Bronson was inspired by Goetz?
crmfghtr 1 year ago
@crmfghtr No it wasn't. Death Wish came out in 1974, Goetz did the killings in 1984. I'd say the movies might have inspired him to do it.
fishandplankton 1 year ago
Mr goetz, i grew up in N.Y.C. and your right you had to watch your back all the time because their was always people looking to mug you. I'm glad you didn't go to jail because you took care of some bad hoodlums , who turned out to be real bad anyway. I think you were the hero N.Y. needed just most were to afraid to act i was also mugged two times. I is nice to see someone took out the trash. What you did made me feel like i can be more at ease now.
094644621 1 year ago
this faggot got raped in the joint,this guy can burn in
hell
yungsandifer 1 year ago
Bernie stepped up to the plate that day. That squirrel can bite him and give him rabies.but a real animal can sense when a human is not a threat . Real animals don't go out to fuck with people. Bernie prevented a lot future incidents like his from happening and thus saved many lives from being taken. Peace and Respect to you Mr Goetz.
vintagezigg 1 year ago
go bernie!
earinsound 1 year ago
@AmazingKnifeThrower you say he couldn't fight like a man which means you know that an altercation was going to happen between one man and 4 thugs (that's fair right). Bernie evened the score and shot 4 pieces of S&%T. They all have been in trouble with the law again after that night except for the one in the wheel chair (upstanding citizens right). Bernie served justice that night and you cannot say anything bad about him to me.
goetzfan 1 year ago
@goetzfan even though there were four of them wen bernie pulled out the peice he didn't even the fight a gun is four chicken shits
AmazingKnifeThrower 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
He shot some Guys
PuppyPetite 1 year ago
my hero for sure... he did the right thing.
cherylkrebs 1 year ago
Bernie's da man!
curea229 1 year ago
He's a compassionate man. I have a great deal of respect for him.
ar4216 1 year ago
Bernie is the BEST! I have no doubt that his actions deterred countless other criminal bullies, like the wastes of human protoplasm who picked on him.
rrrina 1 year ago
That is so cool! I did not know squirrels could be so charming and playful. Wonderful to see and so Amazing to know you are a Vegetarian! Like most of the brilliant people in Earth's Historical Cultures :)
theroaringbutterfly 1 year ago
@theroaringbutterfly your not saying people who eat meat arent brilliant are you?
ChromeGhost0219 1 year ago
At least he decided not to be a victim when he was attacked by feral beasts! Society needs more like him!! It's too bad he didn't kill them all!!
beatnikjd 1 year ago 2
one of my heros of the 20th century....Bernie Goetz forever!!
dallas1963 2 years ago 2
This man is a true American hero. Right up there with Joe Horn
shamantrainer 2 years ago 5
Bet you're thinking Tom Horn or Joe Hill or maybe some other guy that shoots 14 year olds.
fishmountain2004 2 years ago
To continue, those why try and play the race card are pathetic. And why Goetz was told to pay compensation to the one he injured is beyond a joke ... I hope he doesn't pay a penny.
daveevans1000 2 years ago 2
Berhard Goetz wouldn't even have been indicted if it had happened today.
When all is said and done, 4 youths surrounded him on a train (on his own) and demanded money off him in a threatening manner, In 1980s NYC, people were routinely shot and killed for similar demands.
I'm surpised this was never made into a Hollywood movie.
daveevans1000 2 years ago 2
@daveevans1000 Simple....Hollywood would never do it because it would give the people a real heroe to look up to and not the phony heroes Hollywood wants us to look at in the movies.
tjrxk7 2 years ago 6
@tjrxk7 You couldn't have said that any better!!!!!!!!!! GREAT COMMENT. It's nice to know that there are still some people out there with a lot of common sense.
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
@daveevans1000 "I'm surpised this was never made into a Hollywood movie"
Probably because Death Wish had already been made in 1974 featuring a mugger shot on the New York subway.
therudeboy77 1 year ago
@daveevans1000 I don't know if you know this-----------but so far----he has not paid out a penny. He is a very smart man. This is truly one guy that should never be underestimated!!!!!!!!!
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
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daveevans1000 2 years ago
Bernie is no racist at all, and racism has absolutely nothing to do with the matter. Bernie just protected himself.
Michele640 2 years ago 2
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Fortay83 2 years ago
Come ask me for $5 Fortay83, think you're a tough fuckin gangsta, lets see it, I'll wear my blue coat.
cidshroom 2 years ago 2
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Fortay83 2 years ago
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Fortay83 2 years ago
@Fortay83 I do. And I did.
TheDSwartz 2 years ago
what did this guy do again?
ChromeGhost0219 2 years ago
Berne Goetz is a hero!
Michele640 2 years ago 16
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Fortay83 2 years ago
@Fortay83 Come to the hood for what? lmfao
TheDSwartz 2 years ago
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Fortay83 2 years ago
Sometimes we need people like Bernie Goetz to send the message to the police and the courts: "If you don't do your damn jobs, we citizens will do it for you." Both the police and legal system sometimes need a good kick in the ass anytime they get lazy, soft-headed, or corrupt.
WeAreDevo456 2 years ago 29
@WeAreDevo456 However, I'd rather that the police do their jobs. This means of course going after those who violate other people's rights, property and lives instead of occupying themselves with harassing minorities, cancer patients, political dissidents, gun owners, homosexuals (if the town/city has anti-sodomy laws), and small business owners. Because I'd hate to see anyplace in the US to degenerate into anarchy and mob rule because the police there had become bullies and cowards.
WeAreDevo456 1 year ago
@WeAreDevo456 i, myself feel i have no rights. the legal people who have authority have sleazy ways of doing things. i've dealt w/ attorneys before. lots of them are scums. not to put down the justice system it's just very bad. i hate going to jury duty. the justice system is basically for the rich & powerful. it's painfu when a good person suffers. it seems that the justice system protects the bad people. you're right. it is corrupted. anyway enjoy your life to the fullest. good comment.
d4seasons 11 months ago
@WeAreDevo456 HERO
aleisterktk 8 months ago
walking through Un.Square park this evening-4/27.Saw Bernie get bitten on thumb by his pet squirrel.I assisted him with some napkins to stop the bleeding.He was very thankfull but grew a little squirrelly when people started to take notice and snap pictures.He thanked me again and walked into the sunset,like the man with no name.
rtw416 2 years ago
This guy ought to run for President! He's got my vote!!!!!!
skoggit 2 years ago 10
bernies a legend ! its a shame they all didnt die though
dannyLLLLLL 2 years ago 8
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Fortay83 2 years ago
If you had a gun in your pocket (because you were sick of being mugged) and four thugs wanted to rob you. or attack you with screwdrivers, what would you do?
I suppose you'd just lay back and take it right?
I don't care what color you are, that would just be stupid and possibly suicidal.
Save the race card for something relevant cupcake
kingazzaman 2 years ago
@Fortay83 ...how do you feel about the Jerome Ersland case in Oklahoma?
TheDSwartz 2 years ago
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Fortay83 2 years ago
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Fortay83 2 years ago
well...regardless, Id say Antwun Parker was the retarted one (now dead) for trying to rob a pharmacy..I mean, think about it, if him and his buddy hadnt gone into that place with a gun, trying to rob it, then he MIGHT still be alive. They started the ball rolling, dont you get that? Just like the guys Goetz shot, they started it off with him..and its no small coincidence that all of those guys eventually went to prison for other robberies, and a rape of a pregnat woman. Damn, you dont get it!!!
TheDSwartz 2 years ago 3
I would feel the same way if it were white thugs that got killed, by the way..its not about racism, it is about responding to fear, anger, adrenaline, and the instinct for self preservation..just think, if Goetz wouldve killed em all, he would have stopped alot of future violent crimes, and saved that pregnant 19 yr old girl from being raped and sodomized at gunpoint...but Im sure you think thats okay too, since you support criminals so proudly, you fucking ignorant fool.
TheDSwartz 2 years ago 2
@TheDSwartz Nicely put!!!!!!!!!!!! I am so sick of people who defend criminals, and criticze the victims. It seems to me that there are more & more people out there who have this attitude---------------"What's good is really bad, and what's bad is really good". These are people who bring society down. A guy like Bernie helps bring society backup. I grew up in NYC as a teen in the 1980's, and I remember that era very well. Bernie was definitely defending himself. Police help was not there.
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
This man is a Hero! We should all go out and do what he did. Take back the streets from the scum bags!
thebing69 3 years ago 5
"If you smart flex; I'm lettin' off like Bernard Goetz"- Big L
cbappa1 3 years ago
For all you guys who want to incriminate a squirrel loving vigilante, consider these events. Bernie now spends his life raising squirrels and advocating vegetarianism. James Ramesuer, one of the four men, brutally raped a pregnant nineteen year old teenager as soon as he recovered from his wounds and is now serving jail time. The other tried to hire hitmen to kill Bernie. In my eyes, Bernie should have ended their pathetic lives that day.
kervish558 3 years ago 20
"i just ran out of bullets" he said
Templae123 2 years ago 4
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Fortay83 2 years ago
Haha no not a racist, just sick of people trying to rob him. Your saying his a racist but who is the one calling him a honkey and a cracker?. You idiot, those people deserved to get shot, did you hear that one of them got convicted of rape after that incident?, its a shame he didnt kill them all.
dannyLLLLLL 2 years ago 4
I wonder how you fans of Mr. Goetz feel about John White in Long Island!
BlacksAreBeautiful 3 years ago
John White did the right thing, NY laws need to be changed.
ClassicFIHD 3 years ago
Goetz IS a hero.
moondogjack1978 3 years ago 5
bernie needs to get laid
bro20076 3 years ago
I'm voting for Bernie for President !!!
RasputinSir 3 years ago
I think Bernie needs a girlfriend.
seka1986 3 years ago
you're the best, bernie! your fan,crazziejoe.
crazziejoe 3 years ago
peapod, I tried to e-mail you a response but it would not go through because I am not on a friend list. How can I send you an e-mail
goetzfan 3 years ago
I didn't know he ran for mayor. I wonder why he didn't win. I would move back just to vote for him.
goetzfan 3 years ago
everyone should be very hapy to know that he was running for mayor.
IzChAuJa123 3 years ago
Yeah, Goetz is the shit. I'm pretty sure there would have been alot more muggings by those guys if he hadn't wounded and paralyzed those guys.
p0sthuman13 3 years ago
Goetz is a hero.
goetzfan 3 years ago 14
I like your user name: goetzfan .
peapod8 3 years ago
@goetzfan yea how wuz he hero he shot 4 guys tht were not doing anything juss cuz he couldn't fight like a man
AmazingKnifeThrower 1 year ago
@AmazingKnifeThrower you say he couldn't fight like a man which means you know that an altercation was going to happen between one man and 4 thugs (that's fair right). Bernie evened the score and shot 4 pieces of S&%T. They all have been in trouble with the law again after that night except for the one in the wheel chair (upstanding citizens right). Bernie served justice that night and you cannot say anything bad about him to me.
goetzfan 1 year ago
@AmazingKnifeThrower
Great comment --- I can see from your extraordinary command of the English language that you are a proud graduate of Moron School.
wildetaube 1 year ago
@AmazingKnifeThrower----What makes you think that a MAN is a person who can fight? I grew up in NYC with many street fighting tough guys. A lot of them are not men. They can fight real good, but they are pieces of trash. They are not responsible, and don't know how to work and hold down a job like a real man. You need to learn what a real man is. If those 4 thugs were "real men", they would not have messed with Bernie in the first place. They thought he was an easy target. They admitted that!!!!
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
@michaelmirraandmarc he could of went with sumthing a little less lethal like a knife or peper spray or he could of even shot out there legs BUT there wuz no need for him 2 shoot the guy tht did nottin at all and paralyz him
AmazingKnifeThrower 1 year ago
@AmazingKnifeThrower Well----maybe, but if you knew what NYC was like in the 1970's & 80's you would understand why he carried a gun, and not those items that you mentioned. Those guys were (& probably still are) trash. One of them raped a pregnant 19 year old after Bernie shot him. Why on earth would anyone worry about these guys lives---when all they do is terrorize other people? They have no conscience. Bernie---a good guy who bothers nobody--was helping society. He works for his money!!!!!!!
michaelmirraandmarc 1 year ago
Okay, lets see you his situation with 4 monkey niggers about to fuck you up.
nomorenigsplease 1 year ago
@goetzfan Right...Because shooting a man who was sitting down, then attempting to shoot him again while he squirms, paralyzed and in pain is such a righteous man. You are obviously as nutty as Goetz.
TheCircle000 1 year ago
GO BERNIE!!
MkUltraVolunteer 3 years ago 2
He did the right thing. Those guys were going to rob him and he doesn't have to put up with it.
Naturyl 3 years ago 5
It wasn't like Goetz snapped one day. He had experienced a history of mugging and intimidation in NYC. On previous occasions, he brandished his revolver to scare potential muggers - he went further this time.
No American, no matter their race, deserves to have to go about their day in fear. I'm sure Goetz put fear into the minds of countless would-be criminals; he's a hero.
megan4197 3 years ago 7
Hi Bernard,things arent much better in NYC subways. Can you come out of retirement? Thanks
plumprandy 3 years ago 6
charles bronson = Bernhard Goetz
attie3 3 years ago 5
We need more heroes like Bernie Goetz who will stand up to peices of shit like that.
RobertBruceBanner 3 years ago 7
I wish more people would rely on themselves rather than be victims. Bernhard Goetz is a hero. The only thing he did wrong was letting ANY of those POSs live. The resulting criminal and civil trial shows that prosecutors and the police are more worried about the rights of criminals than the well being of their victims. Frankly if your not going to protect yourself, who will? the police? the court? LOL. Thank god for people like Brenie we need more people like that.
FutureWarrior2006 3 years ago 6
What's a POS? Because that's the name of the Welfare machine where I used to work.
inlovewithi 3 years ago
Piece Of Shit.
FutureWarrior2006 3 years ago
he seriously looks like he's going to wring its neck in the last shot.
aardmark85 3 years ago
Goetz shot in self-defense, he did what any other other person would have done under such circumstances.
Michele640 3 years ago 8
This video shows how this hero has so much respect for innocent life. Since I neither like McCain, nor Hitlery, nor Osama, I am voting for Bernie in the next presidential election.
takebackourtemple 3 years ago 2
If you knew Bernie like I do, you would be amazed at how he can relate to these creatures. Better than Elly May Clampett.
peapod8 3 years ago
I hear he is a vegetarian. He would be an excellent advocate for animal rights. Of course of type of animals that tried to mug him would either be put in a cage or humanly put to sleep if they were too violent and out of control.
takebackourtemple 3 years ago
I'm inclined to agree with egocentress. If what he/she(?) says is accurate, then it definitely sounds like Bernie *was* looking for trouble. Those muggers he shot could easily have *not* been muggers. They could have easily been some dumb street kids trying to scare some poor unsuspecting person. The fact that they *were* muggers doesn't make what Bernie did right. The fact that they were just makes him *lucky*.
DistortedLens 3 years ago
I share an office with Bernie. I know his story through and through. He was on his way to meet friends, who, by the way, still meet downtown. It was xmas time. Also, he had been carrying that gun for over a year before using it. He was not out looking for trouble. He had the gun to protect himself if it came to that.
peapod8 3 years ago 3
in that case, i have been misinformed... what i know about the story is just what i have read from different (not necessarily credible) sources... i will concede to peapod8 that if Bernie really was on his way to meet friends and has been carrying a gun on his person for over a year, then it does sound more likely that Bernie shot those muggers in self defence
DistortedLens 3 years ago 2
Thanks for the post peapod! I always wondered what happened to Bernie. Give him my best.
M3028 3 years ago 3
Well...those muggers admitted that they were going to mug Benard Goetz. Secondly, they committed more crimes after they recovered from their injuries. One of them held a gun on a pregnant woman while another man raped and sodomized her. So I disagree and feel that Bernard Goetz was right.
M3028 3 years ago 2
did those muggers really tell Bernie, before Bernie shot them, that they were going to mug him? if they did, then that makes Bernie's story a lot less controversial than it has usually been made out to be.
if they did not, then consider this: someone just like Bernie could be in very similar situation and have made the exact same choice, except in this case those guys weren't muggers. keep in mind that this person also doesn't know that these guys weren't muggers. is this person right or wrong?
DistortedLens 3 years ago
I'm not sure what your trying to ask me. I can say that not all shootings are justified.
M3028 3 years ago
According to your scenario, that person would be wrong.
M3028 3 years ago
The persons in both scenarios were equally unsure if the people that approached them were muggers or not (I'm assuming they didn't tell Bernie they were gonna mug him).
If Bernie is right and the other guy is wrong, that means that what makes a person's actions right or wrong can be determined by facts that may not be available to him/her.
But shouldn't the moral quality of a person's actions only be determined by the knowledge that he/she immediately has available?
DistortedLens 3 years ago
No offense but your kind of bouncing around on the subject. "Moral quality of a persons action?" A person can't always tell or have the knowledge that they are going to be mugged or attacked. And not all mugging victims were told that they were going to mugged. Some victims were just attacked and others were asked for a cigarette and was punched in the face. Some people have street smarts and can have an idea who's a dirt bag.
M3028 3 years ago
Obviously they were muggers or worse, look at their crimes after they recovered from the shooting! I mean hello, he should have killed them all
Calodyne 2 years ago 11
one of the kids he shot was in my global history teacher's class.
kennneth81891 4 years ago
I like what he said on the train. "You don't look so bad, here's another." BLAM! Worthy of a Bronson movie.
castingtherunes 4 years ago 3
Witnesses claimed he didn't say that, they think Goetz may have thought he said that because he had an adrenaline black out, but who knows.
giggan1 3 years ago