Tory Lisbon Treason Treaty referendum promise meltdown (03Nov09)

[cujo9]

i dont see anyone trying to fight this treaty except whimper and squeal about it.

keep your little coward head in your backside and watch x factor , thats it go on good little sheep.

who is actively trying to fight this travesty of a treaty ?

[PhilEng77]

UKIP are the only party than can save us from this mess.

[TooDarnSoulful]

POT calling Kettle!! Labour lied in it's manifesto ....just the same as the tories ...although at least the tories do have a point ...it will be LAW so it is rather fuitle. My personal view is we need to have a vote and then go to Europe with a MANDATE that we do not want bigger government we want smaller more comptetent Government ..than this SHOWER in at the moment!!

[Arcturo765]

everyone is on Camerons case about his u turn over the referendum which is fair enouh but the main focus of peoples anger should be directed at Gordon Brown, he is the twat who went ahead and signed it in the first place..why is no one giving him any grief? he just seems to be carrying on with his wreckless policies whilst the conservatives get all the flak.

[britdog01]

Well done for selling us down the river, and please give more money to the banks.

Traitors the lot of them.

proud of my country...............

ashamed of my goverments..........

[Sillysod]

This is retarded... How can you have a referendum on a Constitution that has already been ratified ? Logically, you now hold one on whether to be a full member or not - which I hope and think will be the case. IT'S BEEN RATIFIED...!

I thought all understood that, and that's what Cameron said. The question is what will he do now, I believe he will say tomorrow.

[asmodeus585]

There's no point in having a referendum on Lisbon Treaty now, but UK still could have one on whether or not Britain should stay in the EU.

In my opinion it would be better for UK to get out of it but mostly in political terms, ie. UK should still belong to Schengen and have free trade agreements with the Union.

[Sillysod]

Well said mate & it would be a major part to fully re-uniting this country, to remove our being a member of the EU totally, but remain friends.

Although it will take a strong and non-selfserving government to do that of course.

[Franzjosefderzweite]

The UK does not even belong to Schengen now. Do you suggest, it should leave the EU but join Schengen?

[asmodeus585]

@Franzjosefderzweite No, in my opinion the best option would be for EU to radically change itself into sth less leftist. Charles de Gaulle believed in Europe with cooperating nations, not in some quasi-federal state. Europe should be more about true cooperation when it is genuinely needed and less about bureaucracy and its absurd rules.

[Franzjosefderzweite]

I think you confuse something here. Left or right political views can be independent of the question if one favors or opposes supranational integration. This can be illustrated by the fact that the extreme of the left and the right oppose the EU. At the same time moderates from both sides, can either be supportive of opposed to supranational structures.

The EU can principally do both, follow a leftist or rightist policy. This mostly depends on the political majority in Europe and in the EU.

[asmodeus585]

Apparently, it's not wholly true. Typical rightist policies are pro-freedom and against bureaucracy, meanwhile EU is mostly about paper work. But then again, politics is always politics and it's a game in which rarely anyone truly thinks about the well-being of others.

[Franzjosefderzweite]

Not quite. Rightist views can reach from libertarian to reactionary big brother authoritarianism. Thats a pretty broad range of possibilities.

[asmodeus585]

@Franzjosefderzweite Maybe, but then I don't call them rightist anymore. For instance, to me, Bush wasn't a right-wing politician, because he opposed civil liberties and used terror to promote his Big Brother policies. If people calling themself right or left wing can do anything, then those definitions don't matter anymore.

[Franzjosefderzweite]

Isn't what you call right then rather Libertarian?

[asmodeus585]

To me right is about being libertarian when it comes to economy and education, but being rather conservative (in classical sense) when it comes to family, culture and foreign policy. I give you an example on the issue of homosexuality: a rightist to me would be someone who don't care what you do in bed unless you're announcing it to the whole world and saying that you're pround of it. Rightist would be against any discrimination of gay, but wouldn't support any special gay rights, etc.

[Franzjosefderzweite]

Well, then you may be a classic conservative, in the narrow sense. I was referring to right views in a broader sense... but anyway.

[79jethro]

It's official, Communism is coming to Britain now!  Prepare for the abolition of civil liberties, ridiculous income tax rises and imprisonment in gulags for free speech and free thought. Britain needs to sucede from this illegal Communist regime through any means neccessary!

[allan3141]

Has anybody noticed democracy is dead? Does anyone care? Government after government has lied to us. Are we really just going to let it go? This issue is huge. The people have not been consulted or allowed to say no! THE PEOPLE should boycot the next election or vote UKIP or BNP.

[Ckererec]

Tories, just the same as the other 3, is this the best we can come up with? clegg, brown and cameron?

We don't have any leaders with any spine or actual truth, may as well just demolish parliament for all the good it'll do us.

[mbb05jb]

if i ever see gordon brown or tony blair in person, i'm going to sock him in the face.

[midr06]

The Tories are Eurosceptic, the only REAL party that are, they're just realistic. They'll be weighing up the merits of being in or out of the EU which will probably be what it will come down to now Labour have have betrayed the British public on holding a referendum. I trust them in the direction they will take, particularly with Hague as Foreign Secretary.

[chilies83]

Hague will be one of the finest Foreign Secretaries we've ever had. I only wish he could be Prime Minister.

[chigs1977]

1st step on the way to a Facist European Super State.......

[roflcopter2006]

Wrestle 'some' powers back? As bad as labour are, at least they're openly honest about their desire to surrender all the UK's powers to a federal europe. The conservatives on the other hand seem to be totally for it also, but at the same time try to convince people they're not.

Look at Cameron just the other day.. "We're against having the position of a European President, but if we have to have one... bla bla bla"

scum, all of them.

[Fleshious]

Bastards

[danielhewson]

Gordon Brown is a fucking traitor