A miracle of deliverance, achieved by Valour... is manifest in us all .. but we must be careful not to assign to this deliverance the attributes of a victory... for wars are not won by evacuations" ~ Winston Churchill
@lassisvugaris: I spotted identical fragments in different episodes of this Battlefront series. I think I saw the same shot of the same British machinegunner in both Crete and Dunkirk.
Interesting, but some parts are clearly made made later in the war. Some british soldiers are wearing the mk.3 helmet and PIATs. There is even part of a
Sherman showing. And in one scene you can see SdKfz 251 Ds and germans wearing camouflage smocks and helmet-covers. Could be SS, but not likely.
All those guys were the core of the British Army in the next 5 years. respect to all those young Britons who have lost their lives in that terrible war
im from the USA and it sadens me to see other USA peeps making fun of what happened at that war before we entered it and they need to do more research on how WW2 started and how it ended before they open there mouths because alot of brits and other lost lives before we came and i respect them for the stuff they had to indure before we came in.i tip my hat and my heart to them men
mouthy fat yank ,you cant win wars look at vietnam and cuba ,you got no history half of your country is named by us, new york for example after our royal family,we was fighting zulus 50 to 1 before your country was even born.
@hartwell2nd oh and the zulu wars took place around 1879 many years since the US gained their independence from the British Empire and Defeated them twice. And I thought our education system sucked : )
@hartwell2nd First Zulus defeated the British at the Battle of Isandlwana before Rorke's Drift. The zulus then took there guns from the british army they defeated. And at rorkes drift they were only engineers defending themselves. they did not defeat the zulus the zules gave up because of how brave the men were. and as of the US the british did no care they were more concerned about the war in france
@hartwell2nd as of The war of 1812 scholars hold that the war constituted a British victory and an American defeat. They argue that the British achieved their military objectives in 1812 (by stopping the repeated American invasions of Canada it was America that declared war on britan and britan stoped it. the real loosers were the natives they lost land etc
You - an American, are trying to take the piss out of the British for fighting indigenous, poorly-armed natives, while armed with vastly superior weapons?
Have you read any of your own history?
Are you not aware of the irony of your own statement, you come from a country which committed genocide against your own native population, and as far as I am aware, Sitting Bull never had machine guns or artillery either.
fuck u u yanky piece of shit ur country was to scared to go to war in the first place and clumsy at war with so called friendly fire ,and if it were not for the british settlers and influence in the new world now usa, threr would be no usa so suck out u american prick
@theafc2009 Please, can we all just drop the hatred between us? The war is already over. It's been over for almost 70 years. Instead of bickering amongst yourself foolishly, honor the sacrifice those brave men in WW2, regardless of their cultural backgrounds.
@theafc2009 I am an American and I don't really like what you say. if someone insulted you or your country insult the abuser, not the nation. the same can be said about the Germans. you started this bloody war, but I did not offend all the Germans I even respect you ( the Germans ) in the future please be more indulgent
No, you suck at being a human being! I bet if you were in the same situation as those Brit troops were at dunkirk, you would be shitting your pants and crying like a baby. Don't play the big man while your sitting safely behind your computer.
@aubs2 today, the USA is oversized, overfed, overwieght nation where the idea of a healthy meal is 3 big macs, mechanicaly recovered chicken nuggets and a 4 litre bottle of coca cola balanced out with two lettuce leaves. The popular stereotrype of the fat, stupid american is mostly justified by the fact that until recently the country had a leader who couldn't spell his own name, let alone read the piece of paper which told him that america had to invade iraq because Saddam wasnt sharing his oil
@nondescriptproducts So wrong, so stupid, so tit sucking on your welfare state. So pathetic, so commie, so Clement Attlee. You fucking losers. You will be in front of a muslin judge in 20 years. And, this from an admirer of the UK (erstwhile UK).
@aubs2 However most americans didnt even know where iraq was so merely assumed that it wasn't their problem. Most Americans think that Europe is in America... what chance do they have. So go cry into your happy meal aubs2 you fat american dickhead
from what i learnt from History Channel's latest series Apocalypse Story of WW2...Hitler gave the order to stop the panzers....n let goerings lufwaffe do the attacking.
either he totally believed in goerings promises or he wanted go easy on the british....expecting a peace treaty in return.after all its a well known fact hitler did not want war with britain.
Nazi regime was jeopardazing the Brit Empire and the nazi had to be beaten at all cost even if it had to cost millions of inocent lifes just for the greed of few millions had to pay a bitter price. ALL THIS RICH COUNTRYS THEY HAVE BLOOD DRIPPING FROM THEIR GOLD...LUXURY AND DEVELOPMENT FOR THE RICH... FAMINE, MISERY AND SLOW DEATH TO THE POOR ...CHURCHILL ,ROOSEVELT STALIN, HITLER, MUSSOLINE AND THE JAPANESE KING THEY'RE ALL THE SAME.
Well ... If the end justifies the means so they are all the same... The second war was a war for resources and no for territories as many people think...Stalin was a mass murderer as Churchill search about Dresden and you will see...Churchill could had avoided war and daved millions of lives ...But he did not want to...
The nazi army could have destroyed the allies army entirely if they want to with 3 days they had air suport of more than 1000 planes the mighty Panzer divisions and more than Half million infantry soldiers but they allowed the allies to evacute for 9 days but it wasn't enough to convince the Brits
My Fav Film is "Dunkirk" (1958) with John Mills, Robert Urquhart, Ray Jackson.! my fav scene is where the wiltshire regiment "Strays" confront the "DON-R " on his dispatch bike ! To Quote , " He thinks we are Ruddy fifth columnist's" ................Soz for being Sad but its a Bloody good Film !
Unfortunately youtube gives people with distorted historical opinion the ability to air their ignorant views, with a lack of real history to challenge them. I'm half annoyed at myself for wasting the time to explain it....
and thirdly as 82spartans says, Goering asked for the honour of destroying the BEF on the beaches with his prized Luftwaffe. It was a mistake on the German behalf, enabling the British to turn a devastating defeat in France to their favour, in the sense that the morale boost given by the success of the evacuation was huge. The idea that Hitler was a merciful man and spared the BEF if conspiracy theory, which can only be expected when only a handful of sources are read.
The belief in the argument that Hitler did not want to destroy the BEF is misguided (to put it kindly). It is true that Hitler had respect for the British as a nation prior to the outbreak of war, however he did not spare us or want to sue for peace in may 1940. The order to halt was given to the panzers for a number of reasons; firstly because they needed to refuel and repair, secondly because the Germans were unaware how bad the situation was for the BEF and failed to push home the advantage;
"It was the promise to Hermann Goring. Adolf Hitler gave him this target, Dunkirk, as a 'prize'... but he f*cked up.
This is Goring's first major military blunder, and therefore the first for Hitler."
-the82spartans (original comment)
The response:
"Hitler spared the British Army for ideological reasons and nothing more. If Hitler wanted the BEF crushed it would have been so. Hitler was a merciful man."
Strangely, my late father, who fought through the whole of WW2, was in France in 1939, and at Dunkirk (where he lost many of his closest friends), would have disagreed with your opinion that the German planes who bombed and strafed the beach non-stop for 4 days, were being 'merciful'.
You absolute total wanker, you're exhibiting the Yanks' usual tenuous grip on historical reality.
@jackHNv I would agree with you if I had said that, however I merely re-posted the words of some idiot who was trying to convince me that Hitler 'let them escape' as I have been debunking that BS for years. You must be very proud of you're father. As for that other jerk, he was the 'wanker'. My contention is that was the first of many military blunders. 325k men escaping to fight again later was huge for the Allies and moral in general. Cheers!
And yes, I am proud of him, he went through 6 years of what must have been a hell we can't possibly imagine, and as far as I could see, came out a balanced, normal person.
Once again, sorry to blame you for someone else's stupidity.
What else do you think that a Panzer commander or Infantry commander would say to his young troops who themselves would then go on to write in their diaries of anything else but admiration for Adolf Hitler and the 'victory' after Dunkirk?
Never mind.
I am not going to bother with a response to that end all statement.
No proof, only speculation you offer to this debate.
If you find a valid document defining the Germans action to pull back / let up attack on BEF at Dunkirk, let me know.
If not, then drop this argument, as its piss in bucket.
How many Anti-tank rounds would make a real difference anyway? The BEF & Allies were routed... still no victory is claimed except for the vanquished that escaped the beach to fight again.
Were the soldiers & diaries you speak of close personal friend to der Furher?Youre talking in circles, much like the Luftwaffe dumbfounded above Dunkirk Bay. lol
@FinalWar1444 Presumably he didn't want to slaughter the British POWs the SS massacred in a barn on the retreat to Dunkirk either? Or the 1000s of French and British troops drowned in the ships the Luftwaffe sank?
@jackHNv You British pigs massacred 10 times more innocents in British-India within 4 years only, than the SS killed in their whole lifetime. Stop hiding your British holocausts and British atrocities, you wicked British racists, its known today anyway. So what's the point in keep no with your lies,. when the whole world knows it anyway? LOL
@Elberiver11Every European power committed terrible acts in the days of empire-building, but the British were nowhere near as bad as many other European powers - that's why we have a Commonwealth, when no other ex-empirical power does.
Just ask the rest of the world which country has a history to be proud of - we 'British pigs' or you Germans, with your barbaric, murdering, racist past.
I'm proud of what my father and grandfather fought for and against - can you say the same thing.
@jackHNv Well, at least the Germans fought communism ... This can't be said of the UK or the USA who actually helped the Societ Union conquering large parts of Europe. Until today these countries still suffer from Socialist dictatorship. I'm proud my family fought and died in the fields of Russia. And no, I'm not German.
@VlaanderenVrijI'm guessing you're Finnish? If so, you fought because the Russians invaded you didn't you? Finland did indeed, fight bravely, but it's unfortunate that you sully that memory by puttinh them in the same sentence as the Germans, who murdered millions of jew, gypsies, gays, mentally ill and handicapped people for no reason at all, and most Finns would feel the same way as I do. For whatever reason, being allied to Nazi Germany was nothing to be proud of.
Panzer units would have accepted surrender with a white flag, yes?
After all, German planning was to 'divide and conquer' so the Germans could have split up the resistance on the beach, as they were killing them anyway. Right?
The BEF left tons and tons of ammo, guns, fuel on the beach.
I do believe that the BEF may have been fresh out of Anti-tank weapons... but that doesn't support your argument at all.
WTF, are you high? I can't prove weapons, but can only give statistics, which is better than 'theory' I guess. OK, I'll give it a go, as the British say. According to the account in the aforementioned book: "What did they leave behind?" (pg. 265 'Facts about Dunkirk', again, 1964 publish date) -Hard Cash: No figures -Guns (no breakdown) 2,472 -Vehicles (no distinction) 63,879 -Motorcycles: 20,584 -Ammo: 76,097 tons of ammo (generic) -164,929 tons of petrol (gasoline)
Well, you can maybe identify weapons yourself if you could only get off the bottle and view what was left behind in the filming of the carnage left after Dynamo.
The Germans Panzer commanders wanted to attack, but the glory was to be for Goring.
If Adolf Hitler was trying to earn brownie points with the British, bombing the BEF on the beach while waiting for evacuation (op: Dynamo) would not be the way to do it.
Instead, he could have forced surrender of the BEF, then let them go after a short stay and that would have been much better received in England.
Hitler spared the British Army for ideological reasons and nothing more. If Hitler wanted the BEF crushed it would have been so. Hitler was a merciful man.
I can see intimidation factor being in play, even after already routing them. The Allies already knew of the Luftwaffe and what it could do, such as the invasion of Poland, & the bombing of Rotterdam, Holland for example.
Not true. I watched every one, but it seems there was a number missing... like #7 or so in this series.
I have no doubt he would have like to partner with the Britts, but Churchill said no way.
It was the RAF that kept the Luftwaffe at bay during the evacuation of BEF at Dunkirk. In addition, the German bombs delivered by air & thus landing in the sandy beach at Dunkirk negatively affected the potential impact of the bomb's lethality.
And read the new research by British Archives, the Hess files reveal who wanted war, and who did not. Germany had made several Peace offers in 1941 to the British Empire, even offering to leave Poland. But Britain wanted war, this is the only reason why the world war was fought: Because Britain wanted it. The "helping Poland" was a fraud, a pretext to try to destroy Germany. Hitler and the nazis played no role. Britain tried to achieve hegemony in Europe, that is all.
no one knows, why hitler gave the order to stop! Some people say that it is because he wanted a truce with great britain after he took control above central europe, others say it is because he thought that the "luftwaffe" would be able to destroy the whole british army. The Wehrmacht had to stop so they couldn't crush the British and France troops left. But one thing is clear, their morale was low. The "Stuka" bombardement and superiority of the germans was depressing
yes and no. It's true the French fought on for four days under General Molinié, thereby keeping seven German divisions from the assault on Dunkirk, but some of the british units came back and fought back. It is also true on the ground it was the French who held the line while the last remaining British were evacuated. Despite concentrated artillery fire and Luftwaffe strafing and bombs, the French stood their ground.
Thats not completely accurate, and remember the reason why British forces had to retreat was due to the failure of the French forces to hold their line, caused a 50mile break in the allied line.
@Perversus666 My father was in the rearguard at Dunkirk, and got out on the last day, as far as I am aware he wasn't French. Unless Hackney was a French colony.
true it is amazing that they kept going for so long espacilly agais the british who had everything to fight for.Surey hittler knew he could never win the war,considering that britian promised that it would bring 54 other counties agaist Germany(the common wealth)as well as fighting America,France and russia,he must have knew he couldn'
this film makes the navy look like idiots. they use little boats to take the people off the beach to the distroyers. and they new they would get bombed. and killing british troops while there retreting isnt going easy on us at all.
A panzer attack on guys with just rifles would have been a bloodbath. The British Army would have been slaughtered and atleast 75% if the Brits would have been killed. You should be greatful Herr Hitler didn't want to destroy his Aryan cousins, but only get them on his side.
There we go: massive myth No 1. Hitler wanted to go easy on the British because he wanted to bestow 'peace with honour'. It's rubbish.
It was a strategic error on the part of a German High Command nervous about its heavy losses to the British in the north. All documentary evidence points to this fact.
The 'soft war' nonsense was a rationalisation dreamed-up decades ago by ill-informed historians unable to grasp the concept of Hitler's strategic confusion and guesswork.
yes it was a strategic mistake. but hitler made this decision in expectation of peace among two white whatever racial featured nations. i would not go as far to expect him to have an alliance with britan, but he was (lets say) hoping that the british would accept his noble act.
his generals would not agree with the führer. if it had been for them, the british forces would have been destroyed. thats what we hear from our vets.
(We must remember, though, that the 'Pause' was as inexplicable to the British as it was to German commanders in the field. The British government regarded it as 'happy HItler hubris'. I guess I was taking that view too.)
You're right, of course: there must have been some political motive, however misguided, for the stop command. Rommel himself was frustrated by what he saw as - militarily - a ridiculous order to give up total victory.
even in common diaries like Hans von Luck and Sigfried Knapp say Hitler gave the order to stop. You don't seem well read or intelligent at this point. Just ignorant.
Yes, your idle Hitler ordered the Panzers to stop.... and for what reason?
To give a big fat prize to big fat Goring! lol
Just for shits and giggles, I'll look for diaries... but that is not going to prove Hitler stopped to 'spare' the BEF. That is just a pipe dream for Hitler apologists.
Ignorance is bliss. It seems at least I've read one book that you have not.
Since you have so many pleasantries for me, let me in turn comment on your character.
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hoogelande 3 months ago
To the people who say they were cowards. They escaped to fight another day, which is better than dying for nothing.
Tommyfungun 6 months ago
A miracle of deliverance, achieved by Valour... is manifest in us all .. but we must be careful not to assign to this deliverance the attributes of a victory... for wars are not won by evacuations" ~ Winston Churchill
celticlofts 9 months ago
@lassisvugaris: I spotted identical fragments in different episodes of this Battlefront series. I think I saw the same shot of the same British machinegunner in both Crete and Dunkirk.
LGuitarB 10 months ago
Interesting, but some parts are clearly made made later in the war. Some british soldiers are wearing the mk.3 helmet and PIATs. There is even part of a
Sherman showing. And in one scene you can see SdKfz 251 Ds and germans wearing camouflage smocks and helmet-covers. Could be SS, but not likely.
lassisvulgaris 11 months ago
@lassisvulgaris Who did the voice over? Who was being interviewed? When was the documentary created? If what you say is true, this must be condemned.
P1B1U1H1 9 months ago
@lassisvulgaris Theres even a shot of a panther at 2 minutes . just a typically badly made american documentery im afraid
sosseries 6 months ago
The British retreat was pretty orderly and well-organized.
notaire2 11 months ago
Hey guys chill out and less of the nastiness. Read my Dad's Dunkirk memoir at grimdetermination.co.uk - that will chill you allright. Thanks, Paul
paulcheall 1 year ago
All those guys were the core of the British Army in the next 5 years. respect to all those young Britons who have lost their lives in that terrible war
MrS5099 1 year ago
THE BRITISH RAN AWAY AT DUNKIRCK; HAHAHAHA!!!
COWARDS !!!! hahahah!!!!
Elberiver11 1 year ago
im from the USA and it sadens me to see other USA peeps making fun of what happened at that war before we entered it and they need to do more research on how WW2 started and how it ended before they open there mouths because alot of brits and other lost lives before we came and i respect them for the stuff they had to indure before we came in.i tip my hat and my heart to them men
brass76 1 year ago
Good coverage of Dunkirk at itv com/meridian-west/dunkirk-memories27688/
manonthetelly 1 year ago
it's was the last battle of France, 100.000 french soldiers,,,dead in two months !
christmar67 1 year ago
mouthy fat yank ,you cant win wars look at vietnam and cuba ,you got no history half of your country is named by us, new york for example after our royal family,we was fighting zulus 50 to 1 before your country was even born.
brookeruk 1 year ago
@brookeruk lol fighting naked africans with rifles.......
hartwell2nd 1 year ago
@hartwell2nd oh and the zulu wars took place around 1879 many years since the US gained their independence from the British Empire and Defeated them twice. And I thought our education system sucked : )
hartwell2nd 1 year ago
@hartwell2nd First Zulus defeated the British at the Battle of Isandlwana before Rorke's Drift. The zulus then took there guns from the british army they defeated. And at rorkes drift they were only engineers defending themselves. they did not defeat the zulus the zules gave up because of how brave the men were. and as of the US the british did no care they were more concerned about the war in france
viperreturns 1 year ago
@hartwell2nd as of The war of 1812 scholars hold that the war constituted a British victory and an American defeat. They argue that the British achieved their military objectives in 1812 (by stopping the repeated American invasions of Canada it was America that declared war on britan and britan stoped it. the real loosers were the natives they lost land etc
viperreturns 1 year ago
@hartwell2nd Am I getting this right?
You - an American, are trying to take the piss out of the British for fighting indigenous, poorly-armed natives, while armed with vastly superior weapons?
Have you read any of your own history?
Are you not aware of the irony of your own statement, you come from a country which committed genocide against your own native population, and as far as I am aware, Sitting Bull never had machine guns or artillery either.
jackHNv 1 year ago
@jackHNv Aye yes you are correct sir, but I was not the one bragging about about the slaughter of poorly armed natives!
hartwell2nd 1 year ago
is this history a la walt disney?
muttman325 1 year ago
The panzers had already been mauled trying to take Dunkirk, that is the reason for the decision to allow the Luftwaffe to attack.
The US was divided on WWII.. a lot of the Republican party was friendly to if not overtly pro-Nazi
cailleanmc 2 years ago 7
@cailleanmc
Nop... The panzer vigorously to eliminate dunkirk poket but AH order to halt that why the reason,, Not been mauled
KotobKotob 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
the british suck, look at them today. the us coast guard is bigger than their navy.
aubs2 2 years ago
fuck u u yanky piece of shit ur country was to scared to go to war in the first place and clumsy at war with so called friendly fire ,and if it were not for the british settlers and influence in the new world now usa, threr would be no usa so suck out u american prick
theafc2009 2 years ago
@theafc2009 Please, can we all just drop the hatred between us? The war is already over. It's been over for almost 70 years. Instead of bickering amongst yourself foolishly, honor the sacrifice those brave men in WW2, regardless of their cultural backgrounds.
LEGOMANIAC419 1 year ago
@theafc2009 I am an American and I don't really like what you say. if someone insulted you or your country insult the abuser, not the nation. the same can be said about the Germans. you started this bloody war, but I did not offend all the Germans I even respect you ( the Germans ) in the future please be more indulgent
MrS5099 1 year ago
fuck usa
theafc2009 2 years ago
No, you suck at being a human being! I bet if you were in the same situation as those Brit troops were at dunkirk, you would be shitting your pants and crying like a baby. Don't play the big man while your sitting safely behind your computer.
Weedtoker590 2 years ago 10
@aubs2
shut up you fucking yank
leedsmad92 2 years ago
25 year old US bitch - what the fuck would you know about anything ?
davehardinguk 2 years ago
Too bad you couldn't send the US coast guard to vietnam, perhaps you wouldn't have been buttfucked by a peasant army.
UKboy040687 1 year ago
Comment removed
MrS5099 1 year ago
@UKboy040687 just like you in America the greatest power of that time was buttfucked in own colonies by a peasant army
MrS5099 1 year ago
@aubs2 today, the USA is oversized, overfed, overwieght nation where the idea of a healthy meal is 3 big macs, mechanicaly recovered chicken nuggets and a 4 litre bottle of coca cola balanced out with two lettuce leaves. The popular stereotrype of the fat, stupid american is mostly justified by the fact that until recently the country had a leader who couldn't spell his own name, let alone read the piece of paper which told him that america had to invade iraq because Saddam wasnt sharing his oil
nondescriptproducts 1 year ago
@nondescriptproducts So wrong, so stupid, so tit sucking on your welfare state. So pathetic, so commie, so Clement Attlee. You fucking losers. You will be in front of a muslin judge in 20 years. And, this from an admirer of the UK (erstwhile UK).
yaknbo 1 year ago
@aubs2 However most americans didnt even know where iraq was so merely assumed that it wasn't their problem. Most Americans think that Europe is in America... what chance do they have. So go cry into your happy meal aubs2 you fat american dickhead
nondescriptproducts 1 year ago
@nondescriptproducts you're a fucking asshole I won't insult your nation because
I don't hate England or other British country and because not all of your countrymen are such motherfuckers
MrS5099 1 year ago
from what i learnt from History Channel's latest series Apocalypse Story of WW2...Hitler gave the order to stop the panzers....n let goerings lufwaffe do the attacking.
either he totally believed in goerings promises or he wanted go easy on the british....expecting a peace treaty in return.after all its a well known fact hitler did not want war with britain.
gengar77 2 years ago 2
Heroes were the soldiers who fought a war that they did not understand & the civilians that had to endure this carnage
UkCSantos 2 years ago 2
So you could say "Heroes were everyone who was alive durung this time of war."?
strawberryxkiss5 2 years ago
Nazi regime was jeopardazing the Brit Empire and the nazi had to be beaten at all cost even if it had to cost millions of inocent lifes just for the greed of few millions had to pay a bitter price. ALL THIS RICH COUNTRYS THEY HAVE BLOOD DRIPPING FROM THEIR GOLD...LUXURY AND DEVELOPMENT FOR THE RICH... FAMINE, MISERY AND SLOW DEATH TO THE POOR ...CHURCHILL ,ROOSEVELT STALIN, HITLER, MUSSOLINE AND THE JAPANESE KING THEY'RE ALL THE SAME.
UkCSantos 2 years ago
UkCSantos
So you think that that Churchill was the same as Stalin??
Please explain the difference between East and West europe?
CandelarioGaIvan 2 years ago
Well ... If the end justifies the means so they are all the same... The second war was a war for resources and no for territories as many people think...Stalin was a mass murderer as Churchill search about Dresden and you will see...Churchill could had avoided war and daved millions of lives ...But he did not want to...
robross80 2 years ago
robross80
Ya your right they could have given up to the Germans.
That would have been the end of the war. The murder slaughter and exterminations that would have followed are another thing.
What are you joking or something???????
Churchill was entrusted by the British people with the responsibility of acting in the best interest of Britain and its citizens.
Not the people of Dresden.
CandelarioGaIvan 2 years ago
The nazi army could have destroyed the allies army entirely if they want to with 3 days they had air suport of more than 1000 planes the mighty Panzer divisions and more than Half million infantry soldiers but they allowed the allies to evacute for 9 days but it wasn't enough to convince the Brits
UkCSantos 2 years ago
Hitler had HALTED the attack in order to convince the Allies that he did not want war... He hoped that Brits would give.
UkCSantos 2 years ago
My Fav Film is "Dunkirk" (1958) with John Mills, Robert Urquhart, Ray Jackson.! my fav scene is where the wiltshire regiment "Strays" confront the "DON-R " on his dispatch bike ! To Quote , " He thinks we are Ruddy fifth columnist's" ................Soz for being Sad but its a Bloody good Film !
muddyfox4x4 2 years ago
Unfortunately youtube gives people with distorted historical opinion the ability to air their ignorant views, with a lack of real history to challenge them. I'm half annoyed at myself for wasting the time to explain it....
A HISTORIAN
ToggleberryFinn 2 years ago 2
and thirdly as 82spartans says, Goering asked for the honour of destroying the BEF on the beaches with his prized Luftwaffe. It was a mistake on the German behalf, enabling the British to turn a devastating defeat in France to their favour, in the sense that the morale boost given by the success of the evacuation was huge. The idea that Hitler was a merciful man and spared the BEF if conspiracy theory, which can only be expected when only a handful of sources are read.
ToggleberryFinn 2 years ago
The belief in the argument that Hitler did not want to destroy the BEF is misguided (to put it kindly). It is true that Hitler had respect for the British as a nation prior to the outbreak of war, however he did not spare us or want to sue for peace in may 1940. The order to halt was given to the panzers for a number of reasons; firstly because they needed to refuel and repair, secondly because the Germans were unaware how bad the situation was for the BEF and failed to push home the advantage;
ToggleberryFinn 2 years ago
I don't understand why this belief that Hitler didn't want to destroy the british army.
He could have asked the Brits for a sease fire and let them leave. Instead he had the luftwaffe attack their transports?
CandelarioGaIvan 2 years ago
Candel
I am in 100% agreement with you
americaneagle1967 2 years ago
First came Dunkirk and then came BOB... all within the span of one year.
Peace was not to be, so what now?
Next?
The plan to invade GB... first the Germans needed to attain air superiority for operation Sea lion.
Why mess around at this point with England?
Head east for ladinstorm and forget Sea lion & BOB.
Hitler & Goring were still trying to kill Dunkirk Soldier evacuees? lol
the82spartans 2 years ago
...whats up with this argument? I've read most of the posts but im still at a loss...
turbocheese 2 years ago
"It was the promise to Hermann Goring. Adolf Hitler gave him this target, Dunkirk, as a 'prize'... but he f*cked up.
This is Goring's first major military blunder, and therefore the first for Hitler."
-the82spartans (original comment)
The response:
"Hitler spared the British Army for ideological reasons and nothing more. If Hitler wanted the BEF crushed it would have been so. Hitler was a merciful man."
-FinalWar1414
This is the argument about Dunkirk battle.
the82spartans 2 years ago
@the82spartans
Strangely, my late father, who fought through the whole of WW2, was in France in 1939, and at Dunkirk (where he lost many of his closest friends), would have disagreed with your opinion that the German planes who bombed and strafed the beach non-stop for 4 days, were being 'merciful'.
You absolute total wanker, you're exhibiting the Yanks' usual tenuous grip on historical reality.
jackHNv 1 year ago
@jackHNv I would agree with you if I had said that, however I merely re-posted the words of some idiot who was trying to convince me that Hitler 'let them escape' as I have been debunking that BS for years. You must be very proud of you're father. As for that other jerk, he was the 'wanker'. My contention is that was the first of many military blunders. 325k men escaping to fight again later was huge for the Allies and moral in general. Cheers!
the82spartans 1 year ago
@the82spartans I apologise completely, I got it wrong.
And yes, I am proud of him, he went through 6 years of what must have been a hell we can't possibly imagine, and as far as I could see, came out a balanced, normal person.
Once again, sorry to blame you for someone else's stupidity.
jackHNv 1 year ago
What else do you think that a Panzer commander or Infantry commander would say to his young troops who themselves would then go on to write in their diaries of anything else but admiration for Adolf Hitler and the 'victory' after Dunkirk?
Never mind.
I am not going to bother with a response to that end all statement.
the82spartans 2 years ago
Denial ain't just a river in Egypt...
the82spartans 2 years ago
Also left at Dunkirk:
416,940 tons of stores (food stuffs?)
BEF Gen. Gort reported 69,111 men killed, wounded or taken POW.
40,000 French troops later taken POW after Dunkirk fell.
The RAF had 32 squadrons w/just 16 operative at one time.
The Luftwaffe had bombed the Dunkirk docks on 5-31-40... Is that part of the order to 'let them escape'?
Bollocks! HELL NO, I say.
As the Russians say: 'You need to learn a history.' lol
the82spartans 2 years ago
he didn't want them to escape, but he didn't want to slaughter them either.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Over 60k killed troops at retreat to Dunkirk?
Yeah, he didn't what to slaughter them... sure he didn't.
Like he didn't want to slaughter the 1000 or so civilians either who live in or near Dunkirk.
Get a clue... your boy messed up.
the82spartans 2 years ago
Then a military blunder, yes?
the82spartans 2 years ago
Are you speaking to Hitler 'beyond the grave'?
No proof, only speculation you offer to this debate.
If you find a valid document defining the Germans action to pull back / let up attack on BEF at Dunkirk, let me know.
If not, then drop this argument, as its piss in bucket.
How many Anti-tank rounds would make a real difference anyway? The BEF & Allies were routed... still no victory is claimed except for the vanquished that escaped the beach to fight again.
Agreed?
the82spartans 2 years ago
Try stopping tanks with Spitballs.
The actual halt order exists and is written in various diaries of soldiers.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Were the soldiers & diaries you speak of close personal friend to der Furher?Youre talking in circles, much like the Luftwaffe dumbfounded above Dunkirk Bay. lol
It is you, who can't show jack.
BFD if the BEF had no ATW.
the82spartans 2 years ago
@FinalWar1444 Presumably he didn't want to slaughter the British POWs the SS massacred in a barn on the retreat to Dunkirk either? Or the 1000s of French and British troops drowned in the ships the Luftwaffe sank?
jackHNv 1 year ago
@jackHNv You British pigs massacred 10 times more innocents in British-India within 4 years only, than the SS killed in their whole lifetime. Stop hiding your British holocausts and British atrocities, you wicked British racists, its known today anyway. So what's the point in keep no with your lies,. when the whole world knows it anyway? LOL
Elberiver11 1 year ago
@Elberiver11Every European power committed terrible acts in the days of empire-building, but the British were nowhere near as bad as many other European powers - that's why we have a Commonwealth, when no other ex-empirical power does.
Just ask the rest of the world which country has a history to be proud of - we 'British pigs' or you Germans, with your barbaric, murdering, racist past.
I'm proud of what my father and grandfather fought for and against - can you say the same thing.
jackHNv 1 year ago
@jackHNv Well, at least the Germans fought communism ... This can't be said of the UK or the USA who actually helped the Societ Union conquering large parts of Europe. Until today these countries still suffer from Socialist dictatorship. I'm proud my family fought and died in the fields of Russia. And no, I'm not German.
VlaanderenVrij 5 months ago
@VlaanderenVrijI'm guessing you're Finnish? If so, you fought because the Russians invaded you didn't you? Finland did indeed, fight bravely, but it's unfortunate that you sully that memory by puttinh them in the same sentence as the Germans, who murdered millions of jew, gypsies, gays, mentally ill and handicapped people for no reason at all, and most Finns would feel the same way as I do. For whatever reason, being allied to Nazi Germany was nothing to be proud of.
jackHNv 5 months ago
RAF claimed to have shot down or destroyed 265 aircraft in 9 days, Royal Navy claimed 35 destroyed w/ 21 heavily damaged.
The Luftwaffes own casualty list 727 aviators KIA or missing, including 129 officers.
You can read The Sands of Dunkirk by Richard Collier. Its rather boring, but gives a detailed account of Operation Dynamo.
The Nazi regime were fanatical record keepers. One may think there would be facts on paper to find out if Hitler decided to let them escape Dunkirk.
the82spartans 2 years ago
the tanks would have ground them into dust. the brits had no AT weapons left. A Fuhrer order saved the BEF
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Panzer units would have accepted surrender with a white flag, yes?
After all, German planning was to 'divide and conquer' so the Germans could have split up the resistance on the beach, as they were killing them anyway. Right?
The BEF left tons and tons of ammo, guns, fuel on the beach.
I do believe that the BEF may have been fresh out of Anti-tank weapons... but that doesn't support your argument at all.
Face it, your argument is pure speculation.
the82spartans 2 years ago
show me at weapons the BEF had at this point
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
the82spartans 2 years ago
not one at weapon mentioned.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Well, you can maybe identify weapons yourself if you could only get off the bottle and view what was left behind in the filming of the carnage left after Dynamo.
What don't you understand?
the82spartans 2 years ago
you don't even know what the fuck an AT weapon is it seems.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
What order was that? Is there any proof of such an order?
Sorry, but I'm not buying what you are selling.
the82spartans 2 years ago
The Germans Panzer commanders wanted to attack, but the glory was to be for Goring.
If Adolf Hitler was trying to earn brownie points with the British, bombing the BEF on the beach while waiting for evacuation (op: Dynamo) would not be the way to do it.
Instead, he could have forced surrender of the BEF, then let them go after a short stay and that would have been much better received in England.
the82spartans 2 years ago
"we now know that Hitler did not want to destroy the BEF, because he had visions of a German, English alliance against Russia." ~ End quote
That is the biggest act of mercy in military history. How can anyone say German soldiers aren't good ?
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
It was the promise to Hermann Goring. Adolf Hitler gave him this target, Dunkirk, as a 'prize'... but he f*cked up.
This is Goring's first major military blunder, and therefore the first for Hitler.
the82spartans 2 years ago
Hitler spared the British Army for ideological reasons and nothing more. If Hitler wanted the BEF crushed it would have been so. Hitler was a merciful man.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
I cannot believe you. Hitler was merciful, eh? I sincerely doubt that.
Gloves were off and the BEF were fair game.
If he 'spared them' then why did the Luftwaffe press the attack?
the82spartans 2 years ago
he wanted to intimidate them and show Germany's air power.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
OK.
I can see intimidation factor being in play, even after already routing them. The Allies already knew of the Luftwaffe and what it could do, such as the invasion of Poland, & the bombing of Rotterdam, Holland for example.
the82spartans 2 years ago
the Luftwaffe was only getting started. watch my playlist on my page called Hitler's war.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
I watched the entire series.
I don't see anything new or different to convince me he let the BEF escape Dunkirk on purpose.
I did see some of your posts, and it is clear to me what you believe.
the82spartans 2 years ago
read mein kampf
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
no need to revisit the drivel of a racist...
the82spartans 2 years ago
Hitler spared these men for racial and ideological reasons. what can't you understand ?
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
If you watched even the first video in the series you would have a different opinion. you obviously did not watch jack.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Not true. I watched every one, but it seems there was a number missing... like #7 or so in this series.
I have no doubt he would have like to partner with the Britts, but Churchill said no way.
It was the RAF that kept the Luftwaffe at bay during the evacuation of BEF at Dunkirk. In addition, the German bombs delivered by air & thus landing in the sandy beach at Dunkirk negatively affected the potential impact of the bomb's lethality.
the82spartans 2 years ago
Read "The Hess Deception", by British historian Martin Allen
Elberiver11 2 years ago
And read the new research by British Archives, the Hess files reveal who wanted war, and who did not. Germany had made several Peace offers in 1941 to the British Empire, even offering to leave Poland. But Britain wanted war, this is the only reason why the world war was fought: Because Britain wanted it. The "helping Poland" was a fraud, a pretext to try to destroy Germany. Hitler and the nazis played no role. Britain tried to achieve hegemony in Europe, that is all.
Elberiver11 2 years ago
haha hitler did'nt let the british simply go. he knew that chruchill was not chamberlain and that he would not sign peace with great britain easily.
and bombing beaches full of english soldiers is not the best way to let them return home...
the reason why the BEF escaped is because the french hold the panzer attacks during several days.
only french divisions defended dunkirk's defense perimeter. not a single british division (except the RAF over the channel).
Perversus666 2 years ago
absolute rubbish - you should read a little more about it and learn about the many british units that had to stay behind in the rearguard.
THthefirst 2 years ago
no one knows, why hitler gave the order to stop! Some people say that it is because he wanted a truce with great britain after he took control above central europe, others say it is because he thought that the "luftwaffe" would be able to destroy the whole british army. The Wehrmacht had to stop so they couldn't crush the British and France troops left. But one thing is clear, their morale was low. The "Stuka" bombardement and superiority of the germans was depressing
SbenTreal 2 years ago
yes and no. It's true the French fought on for four days under General Molinié, thereby keeping seven German divisions from the assault on Dunkirk, but some of the british units came back and fought back. It is also true on the ground it was the French who held the line while the last remaining British were evacuated. Despite concentrated artillery fire and Luftwaffe strafing and bombs, the French stood their ground.
66mra 2 years ago
Thats not completely accurate, and remember the reason why British forces had to retreat was due to the failure of the French forces to hold their line, caused a 50mile break in the allied line.
williamwills 2 years ago
@Perversus666 My father was in the rearguard at Dunkirk, and got out on the last day, as far as I am aware he wasn't French. Unless Hackney was a French colony.
jackHNv 1 year ago
@Perversus666
You wanna explain what the 40,000 troops of the BEF were doing that didn't make it back?
Poorly educated fool!
Malo64 1 year ago
Germany is the Best!
Elberiver11 2 years ago
if Germany was the best they wouldn't have lost two wars in a row
ccclllsport 2 years ago
Dont be Silly. It was 4 World powers against one European country. Amazing, that the Germans kept it for such a long time.
Elberiver11 2 years ago
true it is amazing that they kept going for so long espacilly agais the british who had everything to fight for.Surey hittler knew he could never win the war,considering that britian promised that it would bring 54 other counties agaist Germany(the common wealth)as well as fighting America,France and russia,he must have knew he couldn'
ttake on them all
ccclllsport 2 years ago
this film makes the navy look like idiots. they use little boats to take the people off the beach to the distroyers. and they new they would get bombed. and killing british troops while there retreting isnt going easy on us at all.
TDogg186 2 years ago
A panzer attack on guys with just rifles would have been a bloodbath. The British Army would have been slaughtered and atleast 75% if the Brits would have been killed. You should be greatful Herr Hitler didn't want to destroy his Aryan cousins, but only get them on his side.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
i have to disagree i think the germans just didnt want to loose more men so thay bomb them instead.
TDogg186 2 years ago
What did I just say ? Hitler states he wanted a German British alliance in Mei Kampf. Why would he kill the people he wants for allies ?
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
went easy on the british... thats a new 1
K1NG1T 2 years ago 2
Why would Hitler want to Kill or humiliate fellow British Aryans ?
FinalWar1444 2 years ago 3
GERMAN WEHRMACHT! BEST ARMY!!!
cristiandan06 2 years ago 2
Beaucoup de ces documents anglais sont postérieurs à 1940, on y voit des pistolets-mitrailleurs Sten alors qu'ils n'en avaient pas encore.
fm192429 2 years ago
what's With the cow in the last part? o0
emmax123456789 3 years ago
Wow....5/5!!!
ODZADZE 3 years ago
There we go: massive myth No 1. Hitler wanted to go easy on the British because he wanted to bestow 'peace with honour'. It's rubbish.
It was a strategic error on the part of a German High Command nervous about its heavy losses to the British in the north. All documentary evidence points to this fact.
The 'soft war' nonsense was a rationalisation dreamed-up decades ago by ill-informed historians unable to grasp the concept of Hitler's strategic confusion and guesswork.
And thank God for it!
ludocrat 3 years ago 3
yes it was a strategic mistake. but hitler made this decision in expectation of peace among two white whatever racial featured nations. i would not go as far to expect him to have an alliance with britan, but he was (lets say) hoping that the british would accept his noble act.
his generals would not agree with the führer. if it had been for them, the british forces would have been destroyed. thats what we hear from our vets.
doctordamage123 2 years ago 2
You might be right.
(We must remember, though, that the 'Pause' was as inexplicable to the British as it was to German commanders in the field. The British government regarded it as 'happy HItler hubris'. I guess I was taking that view too.)
You're right, of course: there must have been some political motive, however misguided, for the stop command. Rommel himself was frustrated by what he saw as - militarily - a ridiculous order to give up total victory.
I stand corrected on the point :)
ludocrat 2 years ago
fine ;-)
doctordamage123 2 years ago
Hello.
I have to ask for a favor, and get involved to back me up.
It seems to me that a new point of view is neccssary.
Can you please opine agian on what you've stated previously on Dunkirk?
Thanks
the82spartans 2 years ago
even in common diaries like Hans von Luck and Sigfried Knapp say Hitler gave the order to stop. You don't seem well read or intelligent at this point. Just ignorant.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Yes, your idle Hitler ordered the Panzers to stop.... and for what reason?
To give a big fat prize to big fat Goring! lol
Just for shits and giggles, I'll look for diaries... but that is not going to prove Hitler stopped to 'spare' the BEF. That is just a pipe dream for Hitler apologists.
Ignorance is bliss. It seems at least I've read one book that you have not.
Since you have so many pleasantries for me, let me in turn comment on your character.
You are a racist.
the82spartans 2 years ago
if the diaries and document and this video don't prove it, what will prove it to your little brain ?
so what if I'm a "racist". race is a scientific reality. The founding fathers were also racists.
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
Well said, well spoken FW1444.
Are you a racist Scientist, by chance?
Maybe a descendent of Founding Fathers...?
Kidding.
Which is truth?
V1 & V2 project designed as vengeance weapon or a publicity stunt for dur Fuher?
Kidding.
Thank you for the amusement.
the82spartans 2 years ago
v1 and v2 were ineffective vengance weapons made for revenge of allied bombing raids. and I am related to the founding fathers., FYI
FinalWar1444 2 years ago
nice
yzon33 3 years ago