I have to agree with you on Arizona during the 70's and 80's being the best of times for the state. If I remember right around 1985 Money Magazine named Prescott #1 to retire, then the boom came all the retirees and Californians moving here putting a drain on our water resources. To me it ruined Prescott, tearing into our open spaces that are now empty malls that have closed due to the economy.
@desertrose355 Prescott is my family hometown, third generation, some family still lives there. I grew up in Phoenix and also lived in Tucson for seven years. When all of my family moved back to Prescott in the early 90s, I couldn't stand the place. It was nothing like I remembered visiting in the 70s and early 80s. I happen to know a lot about water in Arizona and the Prescott AMA in particular, including the Big Chino pipeline. Sigh...
We probably share similar values. Thanks for watching!
@desertrose355 Oh and as for the empty malls...it amazes me that the political and business groups in Prescott totally disregard common sense and the average citizen. Build a new Trader Joes? If they think they have a business case for a successful business then the city council/board of supervisors should offer not breaks but have them work out a deal with one of the empty mall spots.
I'm probably preaching to a member of the choir though. ;~}
I agree...Trader Joes is a joke the business isn't there, the Mall is already struggling, it always has.. The good old boy Politic's haven't changed here always building in the wrong direction. The business incentives alway's burned me up, no care for the local mom and pop stores.
@jrsnyderjr The original walmart Frontier Village mall is the ghosttown mall, the city was upset about not getting the tax revenue, so the incentive there was to get wamart to move to a city tax location.. It's Indian Res land. so no incentive there, and the rumor is the tribe is turning that mall into a casino.. You got to understand I'm not a mall person, I live simple and shop only when I need, I don't need the fashion of the week, or the newest gadget insanity.
@desertrose355 They should have left things at the Frontier Village mall. I understand where you're coming from, I'm a non-complex person and have never been into consumerism. I've been totally out-of-step with most of America for decades on that. I like some tech gadgets, like my laptop, Droid phone and video camera but that's about it. I dress in very basic clothes and am not trendy.
@jrsnyderjr To me Prescott was in it's glory days in the 70's, too much change for me, but I stayed. I enjoy your videos, alot of times we are on the same page. we're headed for bad times, I just hope people are listening and paying attention.
@desertrose355 Thanks...I agree about Prescott in the 70s. Truth is it's inevitable I'll be up there or somewhere in the area within a few years. Phoenix has another whole set of different problems I'm not sure I want to deal with during hard times.
i think the biggest thing that keeps arizona going is the drugs and running illegals. And dont let the state fool you, they have money cuz the get 1 billion dollars a year from all the casinos.
Where I live we have always had boom bust cycles it's the way of the mineral extraction industry. Last year our state government actually had a surplus of money. This year the situation isn't looking so good. One of the problems is government needs to live within its means and the same goes with people. My dad always said the only thing you should go in debt for is to own a home.
Arizona always had an element of boom/bust before it made the complete turn to housing in the early 90s. Copper would go up and down with prices, we used to grow citrus and sometime bad crops, no tourism in summer bcuz too hot, etc but it balanced each other out some.
Lots of us said it was a dumb idea in 90s to put all our eggs in one basket, housing construction, with the claim it would end "boom/bust cycles." It never made sense.
hahaha! prickly pear is a weed around here! people (not me) eat is, the fruit and make jam out of it. Our large cactus tends to be concentrated in areas.
The rapid population growth has done damage to this desert, created social problems, economic trouble and hurt the reputation of this state. I have nothing good to say about it.
Mega corporations are the greediest of them all. If they aren't busy driving people out of work through downsizing to increase profits they're driving their companies into the ground through executive greed and poor management and then want to be bailed out by us the taxpayers.
I don't think your comment is off the wall. Our senator is trying to push a health bill that makes it mandatory that we buy health insurance. Of course one of his biggest campaign fund contributors is the health insurance industry.
oh man and I was afraid when he got elected you guys would get bit...
This is a hotbed against that health care bill and any Congressperson here for it is highly unlikely to get back in office again.
It's amazing to me that during the worst economic period somehow the government thinks it's going to force people to pay for health insurance over food and shelter. It seems like a move to force us to choose a mega corporation plan or a government one and we know where that will take us...
What about the elephant in the living room- illegal immigration? People in California are rabid on the topic- They must leave immediately, no benefits, everyone including kids born here must go back etc. Can your economy take it with them , or without them?
oh I can assure you it's a major topic of conversation. this issue has been going on my entire life but it wasn't until the past 10-15 years it's gotten everyone's attention. it's another huge issue looming for us to figure out how to solve.
Sometimes I think in the professional/managerial classes we forget that when push comes to shove and unemployment reaches 25% or higher in some places (and it's likely going to)...those folks will migrate within the US for that work.
We've already seen that here and local people taking the work, along with a big reduction of illegal immigrant labor. So someone will do the work if it's to be done, just not illegal immigrants I would think.
i have family out there...well had, they have since come back here. our cost of living is so low and all. i see signs of hope for the economy actually.
thanks...I thought of you a couple of times when editing this because I was also reading your tweets...wondering what you'd think.
Your family fits the classic migration pattern here. People move here mostly from the midwest. If things don't work out or there is a downturn they used to move to California and then back here. Now lot's of people are moving back home for good.
There is hope but we're undergoing a top to bottom revaluation. Recovery means every inch of progress is hard work.
The editing just keeps getting more impressive! The war is on. lol
My guess is that very few places escaped this severe economic downturn. We tend to be last here in NH to feel these kinds of things. But we are definitely feeling it now.
I have no idea where new jobs will come from. I just know we
can't keep it going forever with credit based consumption, not without manufacturing jobs.
I think you're right, very few places (or people) will escape this crisis and it's pretty clear now the recovery will be the long hard part.
Beginning to think that this divisiveness of issues has some root in region...lots of people "down south" and "out west" feel the "northeast corridor/great lakes" have been hit relatively mildly in comparison and are insensitive to the rest of country. Look at states/regions and compare attitudes to see what I men.
The jobs thing has really been top of my mind this summer. It affects everyone, employed or not, because it's about income. Where are people going to get income to pay for monthly expenses, their personal debt and pay taxes for the national debt? I'm sure you wonder the same.
As mad as I get some days at "the opposition" I still believe we have more in common than not regarding the problem was. So how do WE get past our mindsets of the solution, get real and start solving stuff in concert?
They love seeing us divided, that means business as usual for those in charge. I bet you and I can agree that large corporations have too much power, and I think we agree that the private sector is also very important. But I would like to see us take some of that power back, downsize them, encourage and aid small businesses to start up.
Absolutely! Democrats and Republicans both need to concede they are unduly influenced by mega corporations.
Conservatives are having to work through recognizing that these corporations are actually anti-free market and tilt the balance as much as the dreaded government intervention does. Corporations have become an insidious silent branch of government. Many conservatives though are concerned about the encroachment of corporations in our government and markets.
I come from a family of small business owners. My cousin and I were the only ones to go the corporate route and the compare/contrast has convinced us it's small business and entrepreneurship for us from now on. Small business got killed here this summer and it's going to be a tough rebuild.
Dave, I think this is going to be hard for more than several years. As artists we have to look to that to overcome our struggles with it, show beauty to others and remember there is truth to adversity creates inspiration.
yeah that's a tough one and so is energy. It really is one foot in front of the other and some days it seems like a slog but ever since I forced my way into doing it a month ago...I'm finding the energy's slowly coming again. Lot of times you just have to grab that brief moment when it gets ya and not put it off but go for it right then. It's hard...
I blame all the over inflated housing prices on the real estate companies and the banks (with all the "creative financing") giving loans to people that couldn't afford them! The banks get bailed out and people get left in the streets! Something very wrong with that picture!!
The economic meltdown is global...and with the war going on and no real change on the horizon, I don't think we've seen the worst of it yet! Guard your health...without it there's no recovery from this crap!
I'm disconcerted because our government gave banks a lot of money to them for this economic crisis to do loan modifications, etc to avoid foreclosures because the industry over-inflated real property. I know a lot of good people who more than qualify for modification and they've been turned down as if it was business-as-usual.
They took the money for that purpose and need to use it for that and cannot give it back because they "changed their mind" because they don't like rules.
Have watched the rapid expansion and sprawl of Phoenix over the last 30 years and ultimately understood there would be some hard times and a price to pay: surely a reality check for other similarly attractive and sprawling sunbelt cities.
I don't think there is anywhere in the world not feeling the impact of the economy.
It seemed like an economic event like this was logical, ever since I can remember, but I think we all thought it was so far out in the future. Here we are...99.9% of the world is affected in one way or another.
I came back to AZ in '76 and expected substantial growth but never the giddy push-the-resources-to-the-limit-way. I've been numb for years to a degree but I still occasionally run across something completely gone, destroyed for another Walgreens, that gets right to me.
I have always been worried about so much of our economy being based on new construction. Not only has it destroyed so much of nature, but it should have been obvious that it couldn't go on forever. One of the many questions, now, is what happens to all of that property that no one wants?
We've always had problems with over construction and after a bust what to do with all the vacant buildings and in between them...this time it's much worse.
People are abandoning those suburban subdivisions and moving back into Phoenix metro core. I see us surrounded by barrios of subprime dilapidated houses blowing big pieces of crap into the city. See Salton Sea developments.
We pushed out into a beautiful delicate desert and there's no getting it back.
Chilling comparison to the old west stand off. And OH is there ever a ton of denial, not just where you are but here on this part of the map too, and not just recently (you and I have already chatted about this).
My main sacrifice with career vs hometown also had to do with salaries. For the same for the same work my counterparts did in LA or Des Moines, our salaries we're probably at least 1/2. No one here would admit that because we were pretending we were "world class" and competing with people who also appeared to have money. A viscous cycle.
My parents were big into optimism, eye-roller stuff for a kid, but I have a much better understanding now that's how they survived the Depression.
As I mentioned to Andy we had a lot of "onshore" customer call center work here that has gone to it's ultimate destination...India. That means 40 hour a week 'steady" jobs with health benefits, retirement, etc are gone and not likely coming back.
The worst of it is small business as you're experiencing. For two years many have been breaking even or getting by but this summer was the end of the road. Summer's usually slower because of heat but this year, everything just stopped.
You know Trish I think you sense as I do that the biggest problem both countries will have that corporations are the major employers and offer the best salaries, benefits, etc. Those jobs are gone or will be going, if not forever, for a very long time. We've both seen what massive unemployment did in the 70s...this may likely could be much worse than that.
The wild card we've been playing is the "bust and boom" cycle since the early 90s with the attempt to minimize and gloss over the bust periods. When it all fell two years ago, our core economic activities just stopped.
We're a city of unemployed realtors, mortgage brokers, construction workers, financial advisors and a lots of call center folks. We were very big into being sort of America's India I think, companies "onshored" stuff here because we work cheap.
I really only know AZ, NM and Southern California but I realize no one is going unaffected by all this. Florida, California, Arizona and Nevada are the epicenter of the housing crisis though...
Here's a shocker for you. In Detroit, the average home price is $18,000.
You can blame the developers and the crooked politicians who changed the laws for them.
Remember they caught Capone on Tax Evasion? If Capone was alive today he would have hidden his money in plain sight by being a developer.
Please rent the 2006 movie (documentary), "COCAINE COWBOYS;" not to mixed up with Andy Warhol's 1979 movie with the same name. I can bring you up to the present day shenanigans after you watch it.
I have to agree with you on Arizona during the 70's and 80's being the best of times for the state. If I remember right around 1985 Money Magazine named Prescott #1 to retire, then the boom came all the retirees and Californians moving here putting a drain on our water resources. To me it ruined Prescott, tearing into our open spaces that are now empty malls that have closed due to the economy.
desertrose355 8 months ago
@desertrose355 Prescott is my family hometown, third generation, some family still lives there. I grew up in Phoenix and also lived in Tucson for seven years. When all of my family moved back to Prescott in the early 90s, I couldn't stand the place. It was nothing like I remembered visiting in the 70s and early 80s. I happen to know a lot about water in Arizona and the Prescott AMA in particular, including the Big Chino pipeline. Sigh...
We probably share similar values. Thanks for watching!
jrsnyderjr 8 months ago
@desertrose355 Oh and as for the empty malls...it amazes me that the political and business groups in Prescott totally disregard common sense and the average citizen. Build a new Trader Joes? If they think they have a business case for a successful business then the city council/board of supervisors should offer not breaks but have them work out a deal with one of the empty mall spots.
I'm probably preaching to a member of the choir though. ;~}
jrsnyderjr 8 months ago
@jrsnyderjr
I agree...Trader Joes is a joke the business isn't there, the Mall is already struggling, it always has.. The good old boy Politic's haven't changed here always building in the wrong direction. The business incentives alway's burned me up, no care for the local mom and pop stores.
desertrose355 8 months ago
@jrsnyderjr The original walmart Frontier Village mall is the ghosttown mall, the city was upset about not getting the tax revenue, so the incentive there was to get wamart to move to a city tax location.. It's Indian Res land. so no incentive there, and the rumor is the tribe is turning that mall into a casino.. You got to understand I'm not a mall person, I live simple and shop only when I need, I don't need the fashion of the week, or the newest gadget insanity.
desertrose355 8 months ago
@desertrose355 They should have left things at the Frontier Village mall. I understand where you're coming from, I'm a non-complex person and have never been into consumerism. I've been totally out-of-step with most of America for decades on that. I like some tech gadgets, like my laptop, Droid phone and video camera but that's about it. I dress in very basic clothes and am not trendy.
jrsnyderjr 8 months ago
@jrsnyderjr To me Prescott was in it's glory days in the 70's, too much change for me, but I stayed. I enjoy your videos, alot of times we are on the same page. we're headed for bad times, I just hope people are listening and paying attention.
desertrose355 8 months ago
@desertrose355 Thanks...I agree about Prescott in the 70s. Truth is it's inevitable I'll be up there or somewhere in the area within a few years. Phoenix has another whole set of different problems I'm not sure I want to deal with during hard times.
jrsnyderjr 8 months ago
i think the biggest thing that keeps arizona going is the drugs and running illegals. And dont let the state fool you, they have money cuz the get 1 billion dollars a year from all the casinos.
wheelori814 1 year ago
Oh yeah! AZ!
Theicool 1 year ago
Yea I wonder if phoenix well ever be the same 2 much bullshit going on in phx. So I just stay blaze
repenphx 2 years ago
Great video and excellent editing!
Where I live we have always had boom bust cycles it's the way of the mineral extraction industry. Last year our state government actually had a surplus of money. This year the situation isn't looking so good. One of the problems is government needs to live within its means and the same goes with people. My dad always said the only thing you should go in debt for is to own a home.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
hey thanks!
Arizona always had an element of boom/bust before it made the complete turn to housing in the early 90s. Copper would go up and down with prices, we used to grow citrus and sometime bad crops, no tourism in summer bcuz too hot, etc but it balanced each other out some.
Lots of us said it was a dumb idea in 90s to put all our eggs in one basket, housing construction, with the claim it would end "boom/bust cycles." It never made sense.
Except for a house, I hate debt.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
oh yeah and this is up where I got the paraglider video I was telling you about. that's next up to edit I think...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
That place looks like a great spot to fly from and just as rocky were I fly.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
It's always better to have a diversified economy.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
I'd rather have stayed a smaller state with 2 million people with a diversified economy instead of a wannabe LA.
The terrain in your vids reminds me a lot of around here.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
We're still under 1 million.
Yeah. But we don't have the big cactus plants ours are small ground hugging type cactus like prickly pear.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
hahaha! prickly pear is a weed around here! people (not me) eat is, the fruit and make jam out of it. Our large cactus tends to be concentrated in areas.
The rapid population growth has done damage to this desert, created social problems, economic trouble and hurt the reputation of this state. I have nothing good to say about it.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Eating cactus doesn't sound to appealing.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
There are so many things wrong with the economy that the list seems endless. The # 1 problem is GREED!
flyhghgy 2 years ago
that and mega corporations...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Mega corporations are the greediest of them all. If they aren't busy driving people out of work through downsizing to increase profits they're driving their companies into the ground through executive greed and poor management and then want to be bailed out by us the taxpayers.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
This is off-the-wall and I couldn't prove it but it's like mega corporations are the arm twisting fourth branch of government now...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
I don't think your comment is off the wall. Our senator is trying to push a health bill that makes it mandatory that we buy health insurance. Of course one of his biggest campaign fund contributors is the health insurance industry.
flyhghgy 2 years ago
oh man and I was afraid when he got elected you guys would get bit...
This is a hotbed against that health care bill and any Congressperson here for it is highly unlikely to get back in office again.
It's amazing to me that during the worst economic period somehow the government thinks it's going to force people to pay for health insurance over food and shelter. It seems like a move to force us to choose a mega corporation plan or a government one and we know where that will take us...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
What about the elephant in the living room- illegal immigration? People in California are rabid on the topic- They must leave immediately, no benefits, everyone including kids born here must go back etc. Can your economy take it with them , or without them?
livelifealwaystoo 2 years ago
oh I can assure you it's a major topic of conversation. this issue has been going on my entire life but it wasn't until the past 10-15 years it's gotten everyone's attention. it's another huge issue looming for us to figure out how to solve.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Where I'm from we depend on them for a lot of labor, and have for years
livelifealwaystoo 2 years ago
Sometimes I think in the professional/managerial classes we forget that when push comes to shove and unemployment reaches 25% or higher in some places (and it's likely going to)...those folks will migrate within the US for that work.
We've already seen that here and local people taking the work, along with a big reduction of illegal immigrant labor. So someone will do the work if it's to be done, just not illegal immigrants I would think.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Very detailed account, jr. Lol at rootin, tootin gunslinger. Your editing AND content are terrific.
livelifealwaystoo 2 years ago
You know what it's like down here as much as a native! LOL
thanks for complimenting both editing and content, that's what I'm striving for. ;~}
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Hi jr!
livelifealwaystoo 2 years ago
Hi lifey!
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
wow excellent vid jr i am impressed!
i have family out there...well had, they have since come back here. our cost of living is so low and all. i see signs of hope for the economy actually.
achampag 2 years ago
thanks...I thought of you a couple of times when editing this because I was also reading your tweets...wondering what you'd think.
Your family fits the classic migration pattern here. People move here mostly from the midwest. If things don't work out or there is a downturn they used to move to California and then back here. Now lot's of people are moving back home for good.
There is hope but we're undergoing a top to bottom revaluation. Recovery means every inch of progress is hard work.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
lol they are def too religious for cali
achampag 2 years ago
lol believe me I understand, you don't have to be religious around here to feel that way about cali!
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
The editing just keeps getting more impressive! The war is on. lol
My guess is that very few places escaped this severe economic downturn. We tend to be last here in NH to feel these kinds of things. But we are definitely feeling it now.
I have no idea where new jobs will come from. I just know we
can't keep it going forever with credit based consumption, not without manufacturing jobs.
Maiyanna 2 years ago
I think you're right, very few places (or people) will escape this crisis and it's pretty clear now the recovery will be the long hard part.
Beginning to think that this divisiveness of issues has some root in region...lots of people "down south" and "out west" feel the "northeast corridor/great lakes" have been hit relatively mildly in comparison and are insensitive to the rest of country. Look at states/regions and compare attitudes to see what I men.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
The jobs thing has really been top of my mind this summer. It affects everyone, employed or not, because it's about income. Where are people going to get income to pay for monthly expenses, their personal debt and pay taxes for the national debt? I'm sure you wonder the same.
As mad as I get some days at "the opposition" I still believe we have more in common than not regarding the problem was. So how do WE get past our mindsets of the solution, get real and start solving stuff in concert?
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
They love seeing us divided, that means business as usual for those in charge. I bet you and I can agree that large corporations have too much power, and I think we agree that the private sector is also very important. But I would like to see us take some of that power back, downsize them, encourage and aid small businesses to start up.
Maiyanna 2 years ago
Absolutely! Democrats and Republicans both need to concede they are unduly influenced by mega corporations.
Conservatives are having to work through recognizing that these corporations are actually anti-free market and tilt the balance as much as the dreaded government intervention does. Corporations have become an insidious silent branch of government. Many conservatives though are concerned about the encroachment of corporations in our government and markets.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
I come from a family of small business owners. My cousin and I were the only ones to go the corporate route and the compare/contrast has convinced us it's small business and entrepreneurship for us from now on. Small business got killed here this summer and it's going to be a tough rebuild.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
an endless sea of foreclosed houses.
years ago you would have been looking at fields of flowers near South Mt.
Oh well.. wouldn't want to live any where else, just a desert rat at heart
NotaTrollTravlin 2 years ago
omg you just made me nostalgic. the japanese orchards and gardens are all gone also...
what on earth is going to become of that sea of houses?
I'm a Desert Rat also!
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
until just a few years ago the "family" house had a farm field as a back yard- but the price of land & house made them sell to developers
I use to party in the desert - 7th & Union hills area LOL
NotaTrollTravlin 2 years ago
your message at the end was the hope
ournationalspace 2 years ago
at this stage if life I have to go towards the light...you get returns in what you invest in.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
It's been hard here as well I must say - a lot of lost jobs.
DaveFromMooseJaw 2 years ago
Dave, I think this is going to be hard for more than several years. As artists we have to look to that to overcome our struggles with it, show beauty to others and remember there is truth to adversity creates inspiration.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Very true - I have seen some nice art coming out around here as of late. And some good poetry as well. Now if I could just get motivated more...
DaveFromMooseJaw 2 years ago
yeah that's a tough one and so is energy. It really is one foot in front of the other and some days it seems like a slog but ever since I forced my way into doing it a month ago...I'm finding the energy's slowly coming again. Lot of times you just have to grab that brief moment when it gets ya and not put it off but go for it right then. It's hard...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
I blame all the over inflated housing prices on the real estate companies and the banks (with all the "creative financing") giving loans to people that couldn't afford them! The banks get bailed out and people get left in the streets! Something very wrong with that picture!!
The economic meltdown is global...and with the war going on and no real change on the horizon, I don't think we've seen the worst of it yet! Guard your health...without it there's no recovery from this crap!
GreatGig1 2 years ago
I'm disconcerted because our government gave banks a lot of money to them for this economic crisis to do loan modifications, etc to avoid foreclosures because the industry over-inflated real property. I know a lot of good people who more than qualify for modification and they've been turned down as if it was business-as-usual.
They took the money for that purpose and need to use it for that and cannot give it back because they "changed their mind" because they don't like rules.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Have watched the rapid expansion and sprawl of Phoenix over the last 30 years and ultimately understood there would be some hard times and a price to pay: surely a reality check for other similarly attractive and sprawling sunbelt cities.
I don't think there is anywhere in the world not feeling the impact of the economy.
LeSaMilano 2 years ago
It seemed like an economic event like this was logical, ever since I can remember, but I think we all thought it was so far out in the future. Here we are...99.9% of the world is affected in one way or another.
I came back to AZ in '76 and expected substantial growth but never the giddy push-the-resources-to-the-limit-way. I've been numb for years to a degree but I still occasionally run across something completely gone, destroyed for another Walgreens, that gets right to me.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
This is so much better than public access
AerocK 2 years ago
I want to see other places and here people's thoughts from all over on all this and I can only talk about where I know to get started.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
I have always been worried about so much of our economy being based on new construction. Not only has it destroyed so much of nature, but it should have been obvious that it couldn't go on forever. One of the many questions, now, is what happens to all of that property that no one wants?
Perroquet51 2 years ago
We've always had problems with over construction and after a bust what to do with all the vacant buildings and in between them...this time it's much worse.
People are abandoning those suburban subdivisions and moving back into Phoenix metro core. I see us surrounded by barrios of subprime dilapidated houses blowing big pieces of crap into the city. See Salton Sea developments.
We pushed out into a beautiful delicate desert and there's no getting it back.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Career vs. Home... I can relate to prioritizing the latter over the former. And, yeah, it's surprising how some folks don't seem to understand that.
4:00 - Gasping aloud at that salary range...!!!
Good grief.
Chilling comparison to the old west stand off. And OH is there ever a ton of denial, not just where you are but here on this part of the map too, and not just recently (you and I have already chatted about this).
Nice positive words at the end here.
Optimism... not an easy task.
OhCurt 2 years ago
My main sacrifice with career vs hometown also had to do with salaries. For the same for the same work my counterparts did in LA or Des Moines, our salaries we're probably at least 1/2. No one here would admit that because we were pretending we were "world class" and competing with people who also appeared to have money. A viscous cycle.
My parents were big into optimism, eye-roller stuff for a kid, but I have a much better understanding now that's how they survived the Depression.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
What kind of businesses have gone down, here our smaller businesses are the ones suffering, hence many empty shops and small commercial premises
It's when the bigger ones follow suit that we will really struggle
twish1999 2 years ago
As I mentioned to Andy we had a lot of "onshore" customer call center work here that has gone to it's ultimate destination...India. That means 40 hour a week 'steady" jobs with health benefits, retirement, etc are gone and not likely coming back.
The worst of it is small business as you're experiencing. For two years many have been breaking even or getting by but this summer was the end of the road. Summer's usually slower because of heat but this year, everything just stopped.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
You know Trish I think you sense as I do that the biggest problem both countries will have that corporations are the major employers and offer the best salaries, benefits, etc. Those jobs are gone or will be going, if not forever, for a very long time. We've both seen what massive unemployment did in the 70s...this may likely could be much worse than that.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Thanks for the economic snapshot.
I always thought that Phoenix was a fast growing town & was holding it's own econmically. What do i know eh?
What sort of jobs have gone. Any industry in particular?
andymooseman 2 years ago
The wild card we've been playing is the "bust and boom" cycle since the early 90s with the attempt to minimize and gloss over the bust periods. When it all fell two years ago, our core economic activities just stopped.
We're a city of unemployed realtors, mortgage brokers, construction workers, financial advisors and a lots of call center folks. We were very big into being sort of America's India I think, companies "onshored" stuff here because we work cheap.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
It's not just your state, it's every state.
We need Obama to stop kowtowing and be the strong leader we elected.
OneoftheImmortals 2 years ago
I really only know AZ, NM and Southern California but I realize no one is going unaffected by all this. Florida, California, Arizona and Nevada are the epicenter of the housing crisis though...
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
Here's a shocker for you. In Detroit, the average home price is $18,000.
You can blame the developers and the crooked politicians who changed the laws for them.
Remember they caught Capone on Tax Evasion? If Capone was alive today he would have hidden his money in plain sight by being a developer.
Please rent the 2006 movie (documentary), "COCAINE COWBOYS;" not to mixed up with Andy Warhol's 1979 movie with the same name. I can bring you up to the present day shenanigans after you watch it.
OneoftheImmortals 2 years ago
Of the states hit the hardest the four I mentioned were real estate...Michigan has major problems because of real estate and the auto industry.
I'm not sure Detroit will ever come back I'm afraid.
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago
It's a very unsettling realization for all of us.
No one really knows where we're going.
robertpina99 2 years ago
and shell shocked from where we've just been,,,
jrsnyderjr 2 years ago