so read your bible and obey it? I'd like to see you try to obey it, have fun trying to adhere to 600 or so laws that are contradictory with each other, the law of your country and even your own moral code, YOU DO NOT STAND A CHANCE!
Mostly, he creates more and more sin, so he really is making us have no chance.... if he is creating it, then we are not the ones doing anything wrong o.O
I think of god like a child. People say, " Why does he make us go through the first process," and don't go far enough to say.... so god makes us have the chance to not believe him, to test our faith.... so maybe he just keeps doing it more and more to test how much faith we can have while making us have so little faith.... That is like a kid playing a game and summoning a bigger army to fight a small army over and over to see how big of an army it takes to kill the small one....
The original video is pure brainwashing. They make you constantly feel guilty and fear punishment. That's exactly how totalitarian regimes work. It explains the complete lack of logic in it. It's purpose is not to convince, but to fool people into joining their church. If God as described there really exists and holds me accountable for those 127 000 sins, then on my death I will just spit in his face and tell him your message to wayofthemaster and company "Fuck off and leave people alone".
That adultery of the heart one ALWAYS has and always will annoy the shit out of me. We're just supposed to what parade around not looking at anything? Not appreciating the beauty of a woman or man? like seriously?
You hit the nail on the head, If god hates sin soooooooo much why did he allow sin plus christians have to ask themself this can god create sin ? If he cant create it then since he would be the source of everything created there would be no sin cause it cant be created from any of his creations .If he can then everything that happened with adam and eve was planned from the beinning like a story book :D
just saw the video in the link and parts of it are wrong the bible writes that no matter how many sins you have commited if you say sorry for all the sins you you have done you will get in heaven
Well bud, you just summed up most of my beef with religion! Great job, and the whole anger/righteous fury bent really showed conviction to your views. Like, and subscribe from me, keep up the good work!
On top of all that bullshit, I should say, the Spanish translation isn't beautiful... They messed up the conditionals -all of them-, the subtitles tend to use something in Spanish is called "omitted subject", but they overuse it, even when it's important to NOT use it for lexical purposes, and they were unable to keep the register... I know translators aren't cheap, but they definitely can afford it, and finding somebody with a proficient use of Spanish cannot be that difficult
@Taiwan1997 My goodness you are an arrogant little shit. Please tell me that you aren't trying to claim Youtube is a Christian site. Even if you are speaking of another site your ignorance is astounding. Threatening anyone because they don't share your beliefs is so repulsive, yet you do it as if you are being righteous. Your morality is so out off whack that I'm surprised you can even the time to comment due to you clearly figuring out how to suck your own dick.
@Taiwan1997 I don't know where you are from but I live in an area known as the bible belt in the US. They knock on our doors weekly spewing their nonsense, they come into our work places telling us we must repent. They even come to our "evil" bars and hooters restaurants telling us that we are evil will burn forever and that we will deserve that fate. Yeah if you like that move to the bible belt and enjoy
The Buddhists don't threaten you with hell but they believe you are going there. So I appreciated the Christians that warned me (for you a threat) than a people who could care less about my eternal soul. That's just me though. Someone's caviar is someone else salty eggs I guess.
@Taiwan1997 The concepts of levels of "hell" in Buddhism are present because they don't believe in an eternal hell that you can never get out of. Their concept of hell is entirely different from yours, and I never said they didn't believe in hell, only that they didn't threaten me with hell fire as Christians do several times a week. I never said that I KNOW Christians are 100% wrong. I don't believe the claims they make, because those claims make no sense and have no evidence.
@Taiwan1997 We don't, how can you know anything with 100% certainty? Maybe your brain is being interfered with by aliens, making you think your life is real, maybe the CIA is doing mind control experiments on you, causing you to hullucinate. Now these ideas are, of cause, possible, but crazy. But you know what? So is a belief that the planet was created by a god 6000 years ago, but, for fun, made it look as if it was 4.6 billion years old, covered it in dinosaur fossils to confuse scientists.
I am surrounded by Buddhists here and they don't bother me at all because I am 100% sure they are wrong so I don't sweat it nor give it the time of day. It seems you have doubts and are worried that there may be something beyond the grave for you and for this reason I can understand your hatred for the gospel. Am I right? Do you doubt your agnostic/atheism at times?
@Taiwan1997 Agnostic atheism is a system of doubt. You're asking me if I doubt my doubt. How do you know your Buddhist friends are 100% wrong? Buddhists don't bother me either because they aren't a deity based religion that tried threatens me with hell fire, or damnation for not believing as they do. They also haven't tried to force scientific information out of schools in favor of their mysticism. I can't say the same for Christianity.
@Taiwan1997 The bible being riddles with plot holes/contradictions and unsubstantiated bullshit claims that people still cling to today evoking feelings of guilt and causing unneeded barriers bothers me just a little.
@GrapplingIgnorance I'm sorry but "Thou shalt not lie" is not one of the commandments! Read Exodus 34 where it's the only place that says the "Ten commandments" or in french "The Ten Words" but it's "Ten" the key word. Or watch the following video: /watch?v=pkCJ8rb8Grw
@boumar19721972 What's your point? I'm addressing the claims of way of the master here. It's them that claim lying once makes you a liar for life. I'm addressing those claims- not the 10 commandments.
@GrapplingIgnorance Ok.Don't bust a vain in your brain, I just pointed out when they started saying "Thou shalt not lie" and so on. Just pointing out that also they don't even know what the ten commandments really are. LOL!
@GrapplingIgnorance The most ironic thing in this banana-men video is that their ‘non-corrupt judge’ would happily forget about every crime if the accused would asked for forgiveness, kissed his ass and praised him in a proper way. It seems that Christian god has huge weakness for brownnosers and apple-polishers. If it is not the behavior of a most corrupt judge imaginable I don't know what is.
Isn't heaven like lying about lying, if by some spectacular feet that you get in, aren't you just as bad not helping the people burning forever. The people who openly support it even agree. Is the true point of Christianity the total loss of one's moral compass?
Wait a second, if the punishment for sins (finite, worldly offenses) are eternal hellfire, why was jesus able to pay for everyone's sins by suffering a finite, worldly punishment instead of eternal hellfire?
The cognitive dissonence of creationists is often pretty amazing.
One individual: commited global genocide, forced people to eat their own children, blessed men for "ripping open the stomachs of pregnant women" of babylon and for dashing their children to pieces before their eyes etc
The other individual: Told a few fibz and accidently commited the thought crime of looking at someone lustily. The former is perfect and wonderful, the latter in need of forgiveness. Never ceases to amaze.
Dont you just love how the narrator guy responds to the nice guy when he says he never cheats, he puts a stripper in front of him and makes him lust just to prove a point!
The whole point of the video you are mocking is to point out that no matter how little we think we've actually sinned, we are still in need of God's own righteousness to make it to Heaven. Sometimes those who think they've sinned the least wind up sinning the most be their refusal to humble themselves before God. GrapplingIgnorance and "Mr. Nice Guy" have much in common.
@eflint1 Your comment does nothing to address the refutations I make in this video. All you have done is assume that I'm a guilty sinful person while completely ignoring the points I address.
@eflint1 Please feel free to explain to me what arguments I straw manned here. I took the points directly from the WayofTheMaster's video and inserted their clips into my video to address their specific arguments. Please tell me where the straw men were built and I will acknowledge them at once.
@eflint1 "It does not matter if it was back in your infacy..." And YOU speak of "logic", Mr Spock? LOGICALLY you should grasp that Ray Comfort is not including babies in the mix. Comfort often quotes the Apostle Paul in Romans who said, By the Law (10 Commandments) comes the KNOWLEDGE of sin". If a baby can't understand this video, then he's not accountable. But YOU are. That's straw argument 1.
@eflint1 Comfort blames children for stealing before their capable of understanding and condemns them to eternal guilt for a sin they commit as a child he says it right in the video. Next?
@eflint1 Hahahahaha.... The video is taken piece by piece and put into my video, but if you want to see it without my commentary and call that "context" then the link is in the description box. It always has been. While you're on the CONTEXT soapbox, I recommend that you search "context" in youtube and watch the first video that comes up. Hahaha...
There are two things I fear: God & I fear for the one who has no fear of God. I am glad I am not going to be you on Judgement Day. I will pray the God will continue to be merciful to you and provide for you so you would repent and turn to Christ you was so kind and loving to die for you a law breaker. Me realizing how bad I was showed me how great God is by dieing for me anyway.
Even if you're a serial killer, reality television star or child molester all you have to do is say "sorry" seconds before dying and - voila! - you're in.
As such, Heaven is full of the most odious creatures whose only virtue is an exemplary sense of timing.
For all of those whining about "thought crimes", remember this. An idea is like a seed. If you water it, it will grow. It will become an obsession, an addiction, and then it will become who you are. Constant thoughts like that can destroy a marriage.
According to theology, god's name is unknowable to humans, our mortal minds can not bear hearing his name. Therefore if I say "God fucking damnit!" I'm not committing a blasphemy. Jesus Christ was not Jesus' true name, it would have been Yeshua (Joshua) and Christ is a title not a name (Like if I went around calling myself Trevor the Holy), so if I say "Jesus Christ on a pike!" that is not blasphemy either. And there you have it! "Blaspheme" your heart out!
Classic religious trick: Make yourself feel like shit for every mistake you've ever done in your life, essentially blackmailing you into joining their faith for rehabilitation or forgiveness. In this sense, good deeds don't mean s**t compared to bad ones. You might as well just sit in your basement reflecting on how utterly worthless you are, eating vegetables.
@MunkyDrag0n I've been to several churches that were like that, and I fled very quickly. :P I've always thought it's ridiculous how much some people try to make you feel condemned and act like it’s a good thing. xP I believe in Jesus, but I believe we're His treasured possession... far from worthless.
@1Rebel4Love And yet he'll still send us all to Hell for not believing in him. I don't know about you, but if Jesus really cared about us, he would have created purgatory immediately before even considering sending people to Hell. We are all fallible. We're all born in different environments. He should know that. It surprises me how so many religious leaders like Jesus sacrifice themselves"due to their love for humanity." I would personally love someone so much more for living than dying.
@MunkyDrag0n I don't really think it's as much Him sending us as much as we were already on our way to Hell; as far as I can tell, Hell/evil is basically just voidness of God/good. Jesus made a way for us to come into God's presence, so that by His blood we would be made righteous and clean and a new creation in Him.
@1Rebel4Love What significance is there in a voidness from God, when it does nothing for remorse? I am okay with being separated from God, because I can't comprehend him. Why join with something I if I can't? I don't know if separation brings me pain or sorrow. I don't know what righteous and clean means. I have seen no examples of it. I can't imagine it. I see only normal, fallible people. If only Jesus would demonstrate it to me in a way I can understand.
@MunkyDrag0n@MunkyDrag0n You talk about, "If only Jesus would demonstrate it to me in a way I can understand." If that's really your desire, perhaps ask Him to show you, and then make up your own mind from there? nothin' to loose
@MunkyDrag0n I really don't know all the answers, honestly. :) I just know that my life really sucked before Jesus found me. I tried "religion"... all it did was tell me how I failed. Jesus, on the other hand, tells me "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." I have no desire for religion - just to know Him. :)
@1Rebel4Love Good for you, but understand that billions of people are perfectly content without your sentiments. You think that because you found fulfillment, your way is the only way? Pretty arrogant if you ask me. I know religion just tells people how they fail, but each also has some doctrine of salvation like your Bible. They all contradict each other. People just pick and choose based on what is most comfortable or convenient. I want to know Him as well, but I can't if He is silent to me.
@MunkyDrag0n If you're content with your life the way it is, then that's great, and I sincerely mean that. :) I'm just sharing my experience. I don't mind if you and others don't agree 'cuz I'm not trying to change anybody's mind or convince them of anything. For me, I just knew something was missing until I found Him. If you're happy, that's fine :)
unless you read the Gnostic version where Jesus used to blind and torcher his friends by making one blind and killing another..in Jesus defense though this was when he was a child so i guess one must reach puberty to become devine
@johndebbra You read that out of the "Gospel of thomas" didn't you? No support to any of it, and even in the parts where Jesus was teaching during His ministry, He "said" some stuff that was way out of line. And then of course the book was written a good 100 years after the other gospels. So no, Jesus was ALWAYS divine.
@TheTrojantroy Actually no i never read Gospel of Thomas..but people like you that assume someone did something without knowing facts is a waist of time to argue with because your type already made up their mind what is what.
What happened in the privacy of our own mind (which, as you pointed out, we have no control of) and 90% of the times actually had no influence on our judgement whatsoever is, and can be considered ample reason to roast us on a barbeque pit for a time longer than we can ever fathom? That's Christian Logic.
The bible talks about taking every thaught into captivity!!... So you have a choice on the matter... you either accept a thaught or you dismiss it.
Go allows thaughts that are inspired from satan to enter anyones mind. But after the thaught enters... we are given a choice. its not sin to think evil thaughts. lust isnt seeing someone naked in your head... Its what you do with that naked person in your head after you thaught about them! Theres a difference! "lust is in the heart"
@Duplooytim I don't, and I never will believe in the existence of God, due to massive lack of evidence, yet I know for one I will never rape anybody, no matter how strong the desire.
As opposed to the Bible, who gave orders that if a man raped a woman, they can pay the father of the woman a 1/4 pounds of silver and marry that woman, and stay with her forever. And that is only if the man was caught raping her (Deuteronomy 22, 28-29)
Dude anything out of the Old testiment... Is not so much needed in christianity... Incase you didnt hear of the new testiment... Old testiment is history, and there is tons of evidence for it... Its not when a man "rapes" a woman but when he "sleeps" with her!... SO WHY LIE! the woman could have consented... Its out of respect that he paid 50 shekels of silver not "1/4 pounds"... to keep her (what version are you reading??) KJV is the first english translation...
@Duplooy According to the New international version it is rape. KJV says lie with her. In NKJV it says seizes and then lies with her (sounds like rape to me, if it was consent, no seizing would be necessary). In the god's word translation it is rape. New living translations just says intercourse but no plans to be married. Good New translation says RAPE.
Sure, some translations are going to just say sex with no intentions of marriage. But clearly others say RAPE.
Well I would go with NKJV and KJV and regardless what you make of it, you should really go back to hebrew and greek when you study scriptures carefully. Which most christians do when they do bible study. But thats old testiment anyway. So Its kinda ofset from christian principles. Like the Jews still follow "an eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" concept. Christians follow Jesus' words "turn the other cheek". So you must understand there is some seperation in old and new!
@Duplooytim While I doubt that that is what happens in a bible studies class, I'll take your word on it.
First, I come from a Jewish household. We do not follow e-e,t-t. Regardless of what the torah says on it. I think that they are 'dumb' for not doing so, since they follow it. But they are no different from Christians on this issue, they cherry-pick amongst the commandments to follow. (my) Jews turn-the-other-cheek too, but they don't have to be told to.
@Duplooytim Some orthodox jews do follow to torah to the T, some don't. Some orthodox Christians attempt to follow the entire bible to the T, others don't. You have your religious wack-nuts in every religion and just plain wack-nuts in every other group.
As for your comment dismissing the OT as, well, old, I direct you to a list of bible quotes that basically state "don't ignore it:" evilbible*com/do_not_ignore_ot.htm
You don't get to just dismiss the OT when Jesus says not to.
But is little Kirk & Ray (religion's Laurel & Hardy) took your advice, they'd have to do actual work to stay rich. That's asking too much of those creatards. Sadly, there is no hell to claim them. I greatly enjoy all your videos.
The thing with the judge is a great example. Maybe next time someone is presented infront of a judge and is asked to swear on the bible, he should say "hey man, forgive me. After all you did make me swear on the bible right? So you believe in god." I wonder how the judge will take it. Isn't it hypocrisy to swear on the bible and then found guilty? For anything as a matter of fact.
According to Ray Comfort, if you steal sweets just once as a kid, then you are forever a thief. Surely that also works in reverse. If you are a habitual thief and steal something everyday except one day then that one day of abstenance makes you a non thief. As usual, fundamentalist "logic" falls at the first hurdle.
@TheTrojantroy In that case I'm choosing to be perfect right now. I'm publically declaring that I CHOSE TO BE PERFECT... hmmm... why hasn't anything changed? That's strange. I guess it turns out that your comment is bullshit.
@GrapplingIgnorance We chose to do imperfect things, making us imperfect. If we sin, then we are sinners. Say your going to your bosses house for dinner. Because you love your job and your boss, you have done this many times. And say that while your there, your boss moves the coffee table and finds something. It's an old stain on his very expensive rug. You confess to the crime, but say that it happened along time ago. By now the stain is almost permanent and nearly impossible to get out...
@TheTrojantroy Should he forgive you, even though it will cost him almost a million dollars? I can tell you know, unless the carpet can be clean without professional help, he won't. In the same way, "A sin is a sin is a sin is a sin." No matter what age, sins shouldn't be tolerated (Lord have mercy, I should know). But repentance offers a way out. Jesus is our way out. Imagine that your bosses son comes out and says "Dad don't be angry, I'll pay for the rug." In the same way, Jesus paid for us
@TheTrojantroy Faith and repentance will save us. We must nail our sins and old life to the cross. Be must be reborn. Confess and believe. But the hard of heart wont understand. They consume themselves with their own pride. They side with God's mortal Enemy. Jesus came for those who know that they are weak, not those who think that they are strong.
@TheTrojantroy This humorously bad strand of comments has inspired me to make a video enacting them. It has been posted as a response to this video. At the end of it, is a link to a video giving what I consider to be a much more accurate analogy for the situation according to Christian Mythology.
@Keitaro2011 Well God loves to create. When it says in Genesis that God "made man in His image", most people assume this means that God looks like a human. But in fact, it meant nothing like that. When God created us, He put certain qualities in us, one of which was a creative quality. And if we humans obsesses over "the arts" and creating, how munch more must the creator of time and space itself be!
@TheTrojantroy God is omnipotent! He CAN "clean" it! Also, Jesus supposedly IS God! That's like saying! "You owe me a lot of money, but I'm going to give myself the money that you owe me!" It's ludicrous.
@TheTrojantroy We are not blaming your god for anything, he couldn't have done anything after all. He doesn't exist... he's like the boogeyman, but made to scare grown up people into mindless servitude to their religious "shepherds". What we choose is what we are, and if you say god gave us the freedom to choose, then he has absolutely no moral right to punish us for our choices. Your god is irrelevant to a reasonable person of today.
@Anonymous247n Oh Atheists, when will you listen to reason? Evidence for God is out there, yet it is ignored. Not that I'm surprised, Jesus predicted all of this. As to your other comment, He's not pushing. He's inviting. If you don't want to go to the oasis, and drink from the waters of Life, then that's your problem. All other roads lead to endless desert.
@TheTrojantroy I don't see any evidence for god, you can't show me or anyone else any evidence for god, jesus predicted many things so now you can pick out what suits your world views, and i don't see god inviting me anywhere. And supposedly that's my problem - well isn't that fair? Typical of your god. Well i refuse to praise an unfair god. Praise must be earned, and simply creating people isn't enough to earn praise.
@Anonymous247n Forgive my anger, but that was the stupidest thing I've ever heard. ""Praise must be earned"? HE DIED FOR YOU! He took our punishment! He has invited into His kingdom. He cared about our salvation so much, that He took it out of our hands! He didn't want us to screw it up, so He made it simple: Follow Him, or follow the world.
@TheTrojantroy I didn't ask anyone to die for me. How can you say someone took our punishment if you (probably) believe we can still land in hell? Clarify this please, if you believe sinners can still burn in hell for all eternity then someone didn't take their punishment! Oh and bytheway, one crucifiction is NOTHING compared to eternal torture in hell. Fairness, is it so much to ask??
@Anonymous247n Let me clarify it this way: The whole rapture/end-of-days/hell thing is like the american civil war. People go to hell because they don't want to be a part of God's plan. Hell is like earth, but with out God (making it MISERABLE). Then around the end of days, the devil will trick the people who want nothing to do with God into rebelling against Him. Then the rebels will be cast into the lake of fire after they lose. I don't know much about the lake of fire, but I would Imagine...
@TheTrojantroy that it is a billion times worse. (Scratch that part about the civil war. I thought I had something good, but I didn't) Anyway, Jesus has called us to follow Him. But people lose their lives by trying to hold on to them. People still end up in Hell by rejecting Jesus. While yes He did take our punishment, unless we put faith in Him we can't be saved. Jesus took the punishment for all of God's children, but are you one of them in the first place?
@TheTrojantroy And as to the crucifixion, It wasn't just physical pain that Jesus felt. He felt unbearable spiritual pain, from all of our sins. And to answer your first question again, before Jesus there was no Way. The door to Heaven was like a mouse hole, VERY few people got into Heaven. Even then, they were former sinners who where forgiven. Jesus is the Gate now, people may only enter through Him.
@TheTrojantroy Well, i just don't imagine that if god were so good, why would the way to him be so difficult? Or better, why would the other way (to hell) be so much more attractive to people? To me, it isn't just "well people are evil", if there's a "war" or a contest between god and devil, why does the devil have such an advantage? And how do we know he loses in the end, IF HE GETS so much more people to his side? That's a thing i don't completely understand, but i'll continue soon...
@Anonymous247n SO i would say that god is perhaps not the ultimate goodness, and the devil maybe not the ultimate evil. What would you say about that? Since god allows testing of people's faith in often cruel ways, he is clearly not all that benevolent. I think we have projected all too many human attributes to god - he wants to be worshipped (for no reason), he gets angry, he destroys his creation in his fury when things don't go the way he planned (which if he's all knowing is impossible)...
@Anonymous247n And perhaps i will never understand Jesus' sacrifice. I admit it, i just don't see it equal to eternal torture in hell. Perhaps it doesn't need to be equal, but i reject hell, because then there can be no heaven either, as people there would feel miserable for their kin suffering in hell eternally. Aah, i just see too many problems, and i hope you understand those are the reasons why i find it difficult to understand all the believers. But i appreciate you taking your time here!
@Anonymous247n Well the thing about Jesus' sacrifice, is that He felt that pain. Jesus felt the pain of Hell. He's been there, done that. And we're supposed to give our life to Him because of it. (about "as people would feel miserable for their kin suffering in hell...") I know this sounds weird, but if you followed Jesus and lived the way He would've and your "kin" didn't: Then was that person ever really your kin?
@Anonymous247n Well, no one wants to hear this, but people ARE evil. People choose the road to hell, by rejecting Jesus. The devil never had an advantage, people are just attracted to sin. In the end, God doesn't lose: the people who fought against Him just have.
If Jesus only felt pain for the duration he was on the cross that's still a lot less than eternity. Also he was resurrected and saved from the pain eventually! Next i asked, WHY are people so evil? If god is the way, why don't more people choose him? That's why i wonder why all this attraction to sin- it must mean either that people are just very badly designed, or the devil is more convincing than god! Anyway i could not bear the thought of other people- good OR evil- suffering eternally.
@TheTrojantroy God created the possibility of us disobeying him. That means, since sin is merely disobedience of God, God created sin.
It always baffles me how theists always try to say that they believe in a creator of supposedly -everything-, except sin, and evil, and suffering babies, etc... Can we say special pleading fallacy? 0.o
So, God (we'll assume Yahweh is the correct choice, of the countless options, for argument's sake) is not omnipotent? There are forces beyond his dominion? I suggest that you brush up on your Christian theology.
@1nomadic Honestly, I can't give you an answer that will make you happy. But this whole situation is like the book of Job: God allows Job to be tested so that his faith will grow. And at the end of the book, Job is still loyal to God, so he is blessed with twice the wealth that he lost. So no, nothing is more powerful than God. But God does allow testing, to benefit a greater plan.
"Honestly, I can't give you an answer that will make you happy."
- Not just me, everyone, including yourself. This incongruence and many others should lead to dissonance, questioning and honest reasoning; not starting with one large presupposition, which you stand atop of and defend with mental gymnastics.
Why not search for the truth and embrace the beautiful nature of humanity itself?
Again, presuppositions. You believe in specific invisible/imaginary sentient beings, which require eternal servitude. All the while rejecting all other invisible/imaginary sentient beings... just because people have told you so. No evidential support, reason or logic in your belief, but yet you post as if you have absolute knowledge...enough to tell others what will/should happen to them. Pure arrogance.
I never cease to be amazed by the minds of the religious.
@TheTrojantroy I did not say that sin is everything that isn't part of God. I said that sin is merely disobedience of God, and that's according to Christianity. As soon as God created free will for human beings (assuming you subscribe to that), he created the sin (again, since sin is disobedience, and free will allows disobedience, then free will allows disobedience, which is sin, thus God created sin). The mythical creator of -everything- cannot not be the creator of anything. Learn your myth.
@lagurash Ok, I took I look back at the story of adam and eve, and then I realized something. Sin wasn't always there. At least it wasn't always recognized. Sin didn't pop up until Adam and Eve tried to play God
@TheTrojantroy When did Adam or Eve try to play God? That's a new claim to me.
And no, sin wasn't always there, as I stated. For the sake of this entire argument, obviously, I'm granting you God as the creator of all. With that, everything -must- stem from him, including evil, disobedience (named sin then theists conflate disobedience and evil with equivocation), all of the maladies and suffering (if he created the Lucifer that's blamed, then God is the cause of it all), etc.
@TheTrojantroy As far as I can tell, that's not biblical. Please tell me where in the Bible the snake is the devil, and then tell me where said snake convinced both Adam and Eve that the fruit would make them as powerful as God. Seeing as how Eve was the one to convince Adam, I know that the devil didn't trick him, biblically speaking (that's how many theists often justify blaming it on the woman). Plus, Gen3:5 says, "...you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” Please, learn your own myth.
@TheTrojantroy Responsibility for a series of actions is one thing, but saying he tricked someone he didn't is another altogether. You don't realize this distinction, or the fact that you don't have a firm grasp on the mythological stories in your touted "holy" book. That's quite sad, so please learn your myth before berating someone for valid criticisms to said myth.
Also, this need to blame women is a sign of weakness among religious men. Get a little more maturity, please...
@TheTrojantroy The Bible and many Christians blame women for the fall...1 Timothy 2:11-14 says, "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner."
Biblical evidence that the Bible/Christianity blames women for the fall...learn your myth, sir.
@lagurash WOW Who told you that theist dont believe God created evil... He didnt create sin, because its not something you create, its a choice...
God created Choice... And there has to be a choice to make.. The choice is good or evil... A person has to choose!!! God created Evil otherwise we wouldnt have a choice between Good!! Then we will not be able to have freewill.. Thus making us just like robots....
@Duplooytim Some theists, not all (and I guess I should've made that clear), believe that God didn't create evil, sin, etc, and that stuff is the work of the devil and us. Funny how God gets credit for our accomplishments, but not our failures.
As the creator of everything, including disobedience, then he created sin. God is responsible for sin, according to the Christian myth. Since -everything- includes the order, the temptation, the tempter, the free will, the gullibility, and the act itself.
No You are mixed up dude... Idk where you get your theology from... FYI... This so called "myth", has more evidence that evolution... (almost every major person in the bible, up to Moses, has been 100% confirmed with historical and archeological evidence!) Even now people say that the ark has been found with 6/8 of its anchor stones... Sodom and gomorrah is a real place and been 100% confirmed to be accurate with the old testiment!!!
@Duplooytim I'm merely repeating the stuff I hear from Christians...so blame them for their "mixed up" theology.
0.o Where is this evidence for Christianity? AnswersinGenesis? Kent Hovind? Will Craig? Ray Comfort? Surprising that all this supposed evidence for your God myth (don't kid yourself, it qualifies as a myth). Really? Moses has been confirmed? Everyone up to him? So, Mark, Matthew, Luke, John, Isaiah, Job, Jesus, and even ark have all been confirmed? That's quite a claim, have evidence?
So, the omnipotent omniscient creator of everything had no option but to create free will? Seems like a limitation to his "all power"...
"Thats why..."
So, he died on the cross because he wants us. The idea of perfection means that he'd be complete, and wouldn't need or desire anything. Or do you not believe your God is perfect? If not, that's fine...
God didn't have to tempt us, or let us be tempted. Omniscient/potent God means illusion of FW.
Also ... God doesnt recieve credit for what we do... He doesnt need us... He "wants" us... Thats why he died on the cross... But he had to give us the choice, and he allows temptation, Unless we ask otherwise!! Because, If he didnt... we'd be robots... Get that into your head!!! Understand the concept.. We are robots without freewill... We are in life tooo choose and thats all there is too it!!
@AceofDiamonds0 Or the freedom to chose God. How can someone show love without a choice. Love without another option is rape. I don't know who you think God is, but He isn't a rapist.
but since god did give us the choice to love and follow him he shouldnt be upset when we use that freewill and dont worship him. if god really did want us to follow him obediently he wouldnt have given us the choice.
plus who would willingly worship a deity that allows tornadoes, starvation, volcanoes, floods, and deadly disease. if god did not create and was in control of these things, he wouldnt be god.
@AceofDiamonds0 Do you remember what happened as a result of the earthquake in Haiti? We became aware of the voodoo and other evil things going on down there. Missionaries began spreading the Gospel down there. Only a few months later, the president of Haiti lead a large group of people in humble, public prayer. Hard times bring out the best in people. God destroys, but He is quick to rebuild.
yes missionaries are wonderful people, basicly saying "here read and believe everything in this book and then we will help you". voodoo is not evil, of course you would think that because it is another way of thinking that takes away believers from christianity. missionaries go after people who are desperate and in need, people only turn to god when they are desperate and in need.
why would you willingly worship a god that causes earthquakes, sorrow, and death?
@AceofDiamonds0 Earthquakes, maybe (honestly I don't know a lot about the God-natural disaster relationship). But sorrow and death, no. In fact He works to save us from those things.
1. if you believe that god is in control of earthquakes and natural disasters, because hes god, you automaticly believe that he brings death and sadness, because natural catastrophes bring death and misery.
2. god doesnt bring sorrow and death? have you read the bible? 10 plagues, noahs flood, sodom and gomorrah, 2 Kings 2:23-25 (bears eating children story).
so read your bible and obey it? I'd like to see you try to obey it, have fun trying to adhere to 600 or so laws that are contradictory with each other, the law of your country and even your own moral code, YOU DO NOT STAND A CHANCE!
doombybbr 2 weeks ago
it is that woman's own fault for flirting with him(if he hit on her it isn't the same thing), but just looking at another woman is ok.
doombybbr 2 weeks ago
Mostly, he creates more and more sin, so he really is making us have no chance.... if he is creating it, then we are not the ones doing anything wrong o.O
dolerbom 1 month ago
I think of god like a child. People say, " Why does he make us go through the first process," and don't go far enough to say.... so god makes us have the chance to not believe him, to test our faith.... so maybe he just keeps doing it more and more to test how much faith we can have while making us have so little faith.... That is like a kid playing a game and summoning a bigger army to fight a small army over and over to see how big of an army it takes to kill the small one....
dolerbom 1 month ago
The original video is pure brainwashing. They make you constantly feel guilty and fear punishment. That's exactly how totalitarian regimes work. It explains the complete lack of logic in it. It's purpose is not to convince, but to fool people into joining their church. If God as described there really exists and holds me accountable for those 127 000 sins, then on my death I will just spit in his face and tell him your message to wayofthemaster and company "Fuck off and leave people alone".
fisyr 1 month ago
That adultery of the heart one ALWAYS has and always will annoy the shit out of me. We're just supposed to what parade around not looking at anything? Not appreciating the beauty of a woman or man? like seriously?
SomedaysDreamersBC 1 month ago
A fair judge wouldn't just forgive the criminals if they worshipped him/her! That got to be one of the worst analogy they could pick!
zxzIzxz 1 month ago
Very well put arguments! Thanks for sharing them.
roccobaroccoSC 1 month ago
You hit the nail on the head, If god hates sin soooooooo much why did he allow sin plus christians have to ask themself this can god create sin ? If he cant create it then since he would be the source of everything created there would be no sin cause it cant be created from any of his creations .If he can then everything that happened with adam and eve was planned from the beinning like a story book :D
a084123 2 months ago
what was that image in the end?
what was it for?
alexchris32 2 months ago
@alexchris32 The image used to be that of my channel icon.
GrapplingIgnorance 2 months ago
just saw the video in the link and parts of it are wrong the bible writes that no matter how many sins you have commited if you say sorry for all the sins you you have done you will get in heaven
Kacper2665 2 months ago
not a huge fan of this channel but I LOVED this one
CapQuacer 2 months ago
@Idontlikwelobster. He shared a tent with Mary Magdallen, and according to one sect of early christians (cathars) he even produced offspring.
JamesThWilliams 3 months ago
Jesus didn't lust for anyone? Damn his dick must be broke.
Idontlikelobster 4 months ago
Well bud, you just summed up most of my beef with religion! Great job, and the whole anger/righteous fury bent really showed conviction to your views. Like, and subscribe from me, keep up the good work!
SecretSm0ke 5 months ago
1: guilty
2: dont think so, but just to be sure, guilty
3: well not married yet, but for the future, guilty
4: aah **dammit, guilty
5: only 127000 times when I'm 70te, But I'm well over that number already
or that rules are a little bit strict, or I'm the worst kind off **hole ever.
Okay, with me the answer is simple, but toward the normal nice people, that video is indeed just rude.
jakiedark 5 months ago
On top of all that bullshit, I should say, the Spanish translation isn't beautiful... They messed up the conditionals -all of them-, the subtitles tend to use something in Spanish is called "omitted subject", but they overuse it, even when it's important to NOT use it for lexical purposes, and they were unable to keep the register... I know translators aren't cheap, but they definitely can afford it, and finding somebody with a proficient use of Spanish cannot be that difficult
Reason4234 5 months ago
Four additional points that cut to the heart of WOTM's bullshit:
1. How is it "justice" to apply infinite torture for stealing a piece of candy or for telling your wife she's not fat? Where is the proportionality?
2. How is it "justice" to punish an innocent person so that criminals can go free?
3. Since Jesus took the punishment for all of us, does that mean that Jesus is burning in hell forever?
4. And finally, Mr. Comfort, where is your evidence that the Buybull is true?
RickySTT 5 months ago
Great video man.
brian4480 5 months ago
Jesus never sinned. He volunteered to die. That is code for suicide, which is......a sin.
AdamBomb669 5 months ago
@AdamBomb669 More specifically, "suicide by cop."
RickySTT 5 months ago
Christians will quit threatening you if you get off of religious sites. Just an idea.
Taiwan1997 6 months ago
@Taiwan1997 My goodness you are an arrogant little shit. Please tell me that you aren't trying to claim Youtube is a Christian site. Even if you are speaking of another site your ignorance is astounding. Threatening anyone because they don't share your beliefs is so repulsive, yet you do it as if you are being righteous. Your morality is so out off whack that I'm surprised you can even the time to comment due to you clearly figuring out how to suck your own dick.
Reip187 6 months ago in playlist More videos from GrapplingIgnorance
@Taiwan1997 I wouldn't have to beat my wife if she just cooked my food and shut the fuck up.......
brian4480 5 months ago
@Taiwan1997 I don't know where you are from but I live in an area known as the bible belt in the US. They knock on our doors weekly spewing their nonsense, they come into our work places telling us we must repent. They even come to our "evil" bars and hooters restaurants telling us that we are evil will burn forever and that we will deserve that fate. Yeah if you like that move to the bible belt and enjoy
DarthChee 5 months ago
The Buddhists don't threaten you with hell but they believe you are going there. So I appreciated the Christians that warned me (for you a threat) than a people who could care less about my eternal soul. That's just me though. Someone's caviar is someone else salty eggs I guess.
Taiwan1997 6 months ago
Actually Buddhists believe and teach 18 levels of hell. How do you know Christians are 100% wrong?
Taiwan1997 6 months ago
@Taiwan1997 The concepts of levels of "hell" in Buddhism are present because they don't believe in an eternal hell that you can never get out of. Their concept of hell is entirely different from yours, and I never said they didn't believe in hell, only that they didn't threaten me with hell fire as Christians do several times a week. I never said that I KNOW Christians are 100% wrong. I don't believe the claims they make, because those claims make no sense and have no evidence.
GrapplingIgnorance 6 months ago 9
@Taiwan1997 We don't, how can you know anything with 100% certainty? Maybe your brain is being interfered with by aliens, making you think your life is real, maybe the CIA is doing mind control experiments on you, causing you to hullucinate. Now these ideas are, of cause, possible, but crazy. But you know what? So is a belief that the planet was created by a god 6000 years ago, but, for fun, made it look as if it was 4.6 billion years old, covered it in dinosaur fossils to confuse scientists.
hydrogenpi16 4 months ago
I am surrounded by Buddhists here and they don't bother me at all because I am 100% sure they are wrong so I don't sweat it nor give it the time of day. It seems you have doubts and are worried that there may be something beyond the grave for you and for this reason I can understand your hatred for the gospel. Am I right? Do you doubt your agnostic/atheism at times?
Taiwan1997 6 months ago
@Taiwan1997 Agnostic atheism is a system of doubt. You're asking me if I doubt my doubt. How do you know your Buddhist friends are 100% wrong? Buddhists don't bother me either because they aren't a deity based religion that tried threatens me with hell fire, or damnation for not believing as they do. They also haven't tried to force scientific information out of schools in favor of their mysticism. I can't say the same for Christianity.
GrapplingIgnorance 6 months ago 9
Why does the gospel bother you so much?
Taiwan1997 6 months ago
@Taiwan1997 The bible being riddles with plot holes/contradictions and unsubstantiated bullshit claims that people still cling to today evoking feelings of guilt and causing unneeded barriers bothers me just a little.
GrapplingIgnorance 6 months ago 3
I like how smashing vendors stalls in a childish fit of rage isn't considered a sin.
JamesThWilliams 6 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance I'm sorry but "Thou shalt not lie" is not one of the commandments! Read Exodus 34 where it's the only place that says the "Ten commandments" or in french "The Ten Words" but it's "Ten" the key word. Or watch the following video: /watch?v=pkCJ8rb8Grw
boumar19721972 6 months ago
@boumar19721972 What's your point? I'm addressing the claims of way of the master here. It's them that claim lying once makes you a liar for life. I'm addressing those claims- not the 10 commandments.
GrapplingIgnorance 6 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance Ok.Don't bust a vain in your brain, I just pointed out when they started saying "Thou shalt not lie" and so on. Just pointing out that also they don't even know what the ten commandments really are. LOL!
boumar19721972 6 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance The most ironic thing in this banana-men video is that their ‘non-corrupt judge’ would happily forget about every crime if the accused would asked for forgiveness, kissed his ass and praised him in a proper way. It seems that Christian god has huge weakness for brownnosers and apple-polishers. If it is not the behavior of a most corrupt judge imaginable I don't know what is.
VincentMeis 6 months ago
"He hates sin!" "Then why did he create it?!" I think that's my favorite part xD
DeathnoteBB 6 months ago
Isn't heaven like lying about lying, if by some spectacular feet that you get in, aren't you just as bad not helping the people burning forever. The people who openly support it even agree. Is the true point of Christianity the total loss of one's moral compass?
5055672439 6 months ago
@5055672439 Possibly
DeathnoteBB 6 months ago
Wait a second, if the punishment for sins (finite, worldly offenses) are eternal hellfire, why was jesus able to pay for everyone's sins by suffering a finite, worldly punishment instead of eternal hellfire?
Z3rostar 6 months ago
Why would god wait to punish me. If iv'e sinned i'd expect to be punished righ away. if i dont, obviously i wouldn't learn from my mistake right?
MetallicAciDD 6 months ago
The cognitive dissonence of creationists is often pretty amazing.
One individual: commited global genocide, forced people to eat their own children, blessed men for "ripping open the stomachs of pregnant women" of babylon and for dashing their children to pieces before their eyes etc
The other individual: Told a few fibz and accidently commited the thought crime of looking at someone lustily. The former is perfect and wonderful, the latter in need of forgiveness. Never ceases to amaze.
GallusSapien 7 months ago
Dont you just love how the narrator guy responds to the nice guy when he says he never cheats, he puts a stripper in front of him and makes him lust just to prove a point!
LB030377 7 months ago in playlist Anti-God
This is very good...I like it ...Jusus loves so much the world..Oh Thanks God You died for me...
K01101993 7 months ago
"my advice is - Fuck off...." lol! priceless!
740992 7 months ago 14
The whole point of the video you are mocking is to point out that no matter how little we think we've actually sinned, we are still in need of God's own righteousness to make it to Heaven. Sometimes those who think they've sinned the least wind up sinning the most be their refusal to humble themselves before God. GrapplingIgnorance and "Mr. Nice Guy" have much in common.
eflint1 8 months ago
@eflint1 Your comment does nothing to address the refutations I make in this video. All you have done is assume that I'm a guilty sinful person while completely ignoring the points I address.
GrapplingIgnorance 8 months ago
This whole critique is nothing but a straw man argument. At least accurately portray what it is you disagree with.
eflint1 8 months ago
@eflint1 Please feel free to explain to me what arguments I straw manned here. I took the points directly from the WayofTheMaster's video and inserted their clips into my video to address their specific arguments. Please tell me where the straw men were built and I will acknowledge them at once.
GrapplingIgnorance 8 months ago
@eflint1 "It does not matter if it was back in your infacy..." And YOU speak of "logic", Mr Spock? LOGICALLY you should grasp that Ray Comfort is not including babies in the mix. Comfort often quotes the Apostle Paul in Romans who said, By the Law (10 Commandments) comes the KNOWLEDGE of sin". If a baby can't understand this video, then he's not accountable. But YOU are. That's straw argument 1.
eflint1 8 months ago
@eflint1 Comfort blames children for stealing before their capable of understanding and condemns them to eternal guilt for a sin they commit as a child he says it right in the video. Next?
GrapplingIgnorance 8 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance Please tell me the name of the video. I'd like to hear the quote in CONTEXT. Do you now what "context" means?
eflint1 8 months ago
@eflint1 Hahahahaha.... The video is taken piece by piece and put into my video, but if you want to see it without my commentary and call that "context" then the link is in the description box. It always has been. While you're on the CONTEXT soapbox, I recommend that you search "context" in youtube and watch the first video that comes up. Hahaha...
GrapplingIgnorance 8 months ago
I would only call someone a liar if they lied to stab someone in the back or to misinform for a malicious intent.
Telling a sarcastic joke is technically lying, but that doesn't make you a liar.
TheRealBobV3 8 months ago
aaw hahah love the video and how you made the previous video sound so stupid. especially the sarcasm after the swearing part lol.
NeverlandAud 8 months ago
There are two things I fear: God & I fear for the one who has no fear of God. I am glad I am not going to be you on Judgement Day. I will pray the God will continue to be merciful to you and provide for you so you would repent and turn to Christ you was so kind and loving to die for you a law breaker. Me realizing how bad I was showed me how great God is by dieing for me anyway.
weRwilsons 8 months ago
Even if you're a serial killer, reality television star or child molester all you have to do is say "sorry" seconds before dying and - voila! - you're in.
As such, Heaven is full of the most odious creatures whose only virtue is an exemplary sense of timing.
JesusSuckedGayPenis 8 months ago
oh how cute, the onewayofthemaster disabled the ratings and comments on his video, you do live up to you name grapplingignorence
62cky4powerthirst 8 months ago
I want to cum toward Jesus after this video
roadkill1001 8 months ago
For all of those whining about "thought crimes", remember this. An idea is like a seed. If you water it, it will grow. It will become an obsession, an addiction, and then it will become who you are. Constant thoughts like that can destroy a marriage.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
According to theology, god's name is unknowable to humans, our mortal minds can not bear hearing his name. Therefore if I say "God fucking damnit!" I'm not committing a blasphemy. Jesus Christ was not Jesus' true name, it would have been Yeshua (Joshua) and Christ is a title not a name (Like if I went around calling myself Trevor the Holy), so if I say "Jesus Christ on a pike!" that is not blasphemy either. And there you have it! "Blaspheme" your heart out!
trevorhmason 8 months ago
butter finger ? xD
tarek12mig 8 months ago
Classic religious trick: Make yourself feel like shit for every mistake you've ever done in your life, essentially blackmailing you into joining their faith for rehabilitation or forgiveness. In this sense, good deeds don't mean s**t compared to bad ones. You might as well just sit in your basement reflecting on how utterly worthless you are, eating vegetables.
MunkyDrag0n 8 months ago 16
@MunkyDrag0n I've been to several churches that were like that, and I fled very quickly. :P I've always thought it's ridiculous how much some people try to make you feel condemned and act like it’s a good thing. xP I believe in Jesus, but I believe we're His treasured possession... far from worthless.
1Rebel4Love 7 months ago
@1Rebel4Love And yet he'll still send us all to Hell for not believing in him. I don't know about you, but if Jesus really cared about us, he would have created purgatory immediately before even considering sending people to Hell. We are all fallible. We're all born in different environments. He should know that. It surprises me how so many religious leaders like Jesus sacrifice themselves"due to their love for humanity." I would personally love someone so much more for living than dying.
MunkyDrag0n 7 months ago
@MunkyDrag0n I don't really think it's as much Him sending us as much as we were already on our way to Hell; as far as I can tell, Hell/evil is basically just voidness of God/good. Jesus made a way for us to come into God's presence, so that by His blood we would be made righteous and clean and a new creation in Him.
1Rebel4Love 6 months ago
@1Rebel4Love What significance is there in a voidness from God, when it does nothing for remorse? I am okay with being separated from God, because I can't comprehend him. Why join with something I if I can't? I don't know if separation brings me pain or sorrow. I don't know what righteous and clean means. I have seen no examples of it. I can't imagine it. I see only normal, fallible people. If only Jesus would demonstrate it to me in a way I can understand.
MunkyDrag0n 6 months ago
@MunkyDrag0n @MunkyDrag0n You talk about, "If only Jesus would demonstrate it to me in a way I can understand." If that's really your desire, perhaps ask Him to show you, and then make up your own mind from there? nothin' to loose
1Rebel4Love 6 months ago
@MunkyDrag0n I really don't know all the answers, honestly. :) I just know that my life really sucked before Jesus found me. I tried "religion"... all it did was tell me how I failed. Jesus, on the other hand, tells me "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." I have no desire for religion - just to know Him. :)
1Rebel4Love 6 months ago
@1Rebel4Love Good for you, but understand that billions of people are perfectly content without your sentiments. You think that because you found fulfillment, your way is the only way? Pretty arrogant if you ask me. I know religion just tells people how they fail, but each also has some doctrine of salvation like your Bible. They all contradict each other. People just pick and choose based on what is most comfortable or convenient. I want to know Him as well, but I can't if He is silent to me.
MunkyDrag0n 6 months ago
@MunkyDrag0n If you're content with your life the way it is, then that's great, and I sincerely mean that. :) I'm just sharing my experience. I don't mind if you and others don't agree 'cuz I'm not trying to change anybody's mind or convince them of anything. For me, I just knew something was missing until I found Him. If you're happy, that's fine :)
1Rebel4Love 6 months ago
@1Rebel4Love Thank you. I am glad you feel that way.
MunkyDrag0n 6 months ago
@MunkyDrag0n Lol got a problem with vegetarians eh?
WAZZA1235 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@MunkyDrag0n Lol got a problem with vegetarians eh?
WAZZA1235 5 months ago
unless you read the Gnostic version where Jesus used to blind and torcher his friends by making one blind and killing another..in Jesus defense though this was when he was a child so i guess one must reach puberty to become devine
johndebbra 8 months ago
@johndebbra You read that out of the "Gospel of thomas" didn't you? No support to any of it, and even in the parts where Jesus was teaching during His ministry, He "said" some stuff that was way out of line. And then of course the book was written a good 100 years after the other gospels. So no, Jesus was ALWAYS divine.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Actually no i never read Gospel of Thomas..but people like you that assume someone did something without knowing facts is a waist of time to argue with because your type already made up their mind what is what.
johndebbra 8 months ago
You bet I'll commit adultery. YEAH bud.
dRevan64 9 months ago
What happened in the privacy of our own mind (which, as you pointed out, we have no control of) and 90% of the times actually had no influence on our judgement whatsoever is, and can be considered ample reason to roast us on a barbeque pit for a time longer than we can ever fathom? That's Christian Logic.
ImAnotherZang 9 months ago
@ImAnotherZang
The bible talks about taking every thaught into captivity!!... So you have a choice on the matter... you either accept a thaught or you dismiss it.
Go allows thaughts that are inspired from satan to enter anyones mind. But after the thaught enters... we are given a choice. its not sin to think evil thaughts. lust isnt seeing someone naked in your head... Its what you do with that naked person in your head after you thaught about them! Theres a difference! "lust is in the heart"
Duplooytim 9 months ago
@Duplooytim I don't, and I never will believe in the existence of God, due to massive lack of evidence, yet I know for one I will never rape anybody, no matter how strong the desire.
As opposed to the Bible, who gave orders that if a man raped a woman, they can pay the father of the woman a 1/4 pounds of silver and marry that woman, and stay with her forever. And that is only if the man was caught raping her (Deuteronomy 22, 28-29)
ImAnotherZang 8 months ago
@ImAnotherZang
Dude anything out of the Old testiment... Is not so much needed in christianity... Incase you didnt hear of the new testiment... Old testiment is history, and there is tons of evidence for it... Its not when a man "rapes" a woman but when he "sleeps" with her!... SO WHY LIE! the woman could have consented... Its out of respect that he paid 50 shekels of silver not "1/4 pounds"... to keep her (what version are you reading??) KJV is the first english translation...
Duplooytim 8 months ago
@Duplooytim alright alright my apologies...
ImAnotherZang 8 months ago
@Duplooy According to the New international version it is rape. KJV says lie with her. In NKJV it says seizes and then lies with her (sounds like rape to me, if it was consent, no seizing would be necessary). In the god's word translation it is rape. New living translations just says intercourse but no plans to be married. Good New translation says RAPE.
Sure, some translations are going to just say sex with no intentions of marriage. But clearly others say RAPE.
Seriously? Good book my ass!
TheCopaceticMan 8 months ago
@Duplooytim But again, it all depends on the version.
TheCopaceticMan 8 months ago
@TheCopaceticMan
Well I would go with NKJV and KJV and regardless what you make of it, you should really go back to hebrew and greek when you study scriptures carefully. Which most christians do when they do bible study. But thats old testiment anyway. So Its kinda ofset from christian principles. Like the Jews still follow "an eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" concept. Christians follow Jesus' words "turn the other cheek". So you must understand there is some seperation in old and new!
Duplooytim 8 months ago
@Duplooytim While I doubt that that is what happens in a bible studies class, I'll take your word on it.
First, I come from a Jewish household. We do not follow e-e,t-t. Regardless of what the torah says on it. I think that they are 'dumb' for not doing so, since they follow it. But they are no different from Christians on this issue, they cherry-pick amongst the commandments to follow. (my) Jews turn-the-other-cheek too, but they don't have to be told to.
TheCopaceticMan 8 months ago
@Duplooytim Some orthodox jews do follow to torah to the T, some don't. Some orthodox Christians attempt to follow the entire bible to the T, others don't. You have your religious wack-nuts in every religion and just plain wack-nuts in every other group.
As for your comment dismissing the OT as, well, old, I direct you to a list of bible quotes that basically state "don't ignore it:" evilbible*com/do_not_ignore_ot.htm
You don't get to just dismiss the OT when Jesus says not to.
TheCopaceticMan 8 months ago
But is little Kirk & Ray (religion's Laurel & Hardy) took your advice, they'd have to do actual work to stay rich. That's asking too much of those creatards. Sadly, there is no hell to claim them. I greatly enjoy all your videos.
mahdatonta 9 months ago
The thing with the judge is a great example. Maybe next time someone is presented infront of a judge and is asked to swear on the bible, he should say "hey man, forgive me. After all you did make me swear on the bible right? So you believe in god." I wonder how the judge will take it. Isn't it hypocrisy to swear on the bible and then found guilty? For anything as a matter of fact.
fablan6 9 months ago
According to Ray Comfort, if you steal sweets just once as a kid, then you are forever a thief. Surely that also works in reverse. If you are a habitual thief and steal something everyday except one day then that one day of abstenance makes you a non thief. As usual, fundamentalist "logic" falls at the first hurdle.
pilgrimpater 9 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
God didn't create sin. We chose to sin, we chose to be imperfect. Your blaming God for problems WE CREATED. Stop fooling yourself.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy In that case I'm choosing to be perfect right now. I'm publically declaring that I CHOSE TO BE PERFECT... hmmm... why hasn't anything changed? That's strange. I guess it turns out that your comment is bullshit.
GrapplingIgnorance 9 months ago 17
@GrapplingIgnorance We chose to do imperfect things, making us imperfect. If we sin, then we are sinners. Say your going to your bosses house for dinner. Because you love your job and your boss, you have done this many times. And say that while your there, your boss moves the coffee table and finds something. It's an old stain on his very expensive rug. You confess to the crime, but say that it happened along time ago. By now the stain is almost permanent and nearly impossible to get out...
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Should he forgive you, even though it will cost him almost a million dollars? I can tell you know, unless the carpet can be clean without professional help, he won't. In the same way, "A sin is a sin is a sin is a sin." No matter what age, sins shouldn't be tolerated (Lord have mercy, I should know). But repentance offers a way out. Jesus is our way out. Imagine that your bosses son comes out and says "Dad don't be angry, I'll pay for the rug." In the same way, Jesus paid for us
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Faith and repentance will save us. We must nail our sins and old life to the cross. Be must be reborn. Confess and believe. But the hard of heart wont understand. They consume themselves with their own pride. They side with God's mortal Enemy. Jesus came for those who know that they are weak, not those who think that they are strong.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy This humorously bad strand of comments has inspired me to make a video enacting them. It has been posted as a response to this video. At the end of it, is a link to a video giving what I consider to be a much more accurate analogy for the situation according to Christian Mythology.
GrapplingIgnorance 9 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance Humorously bad? How so? Don't mock me with out reason and leave.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy What was the point of creating any of us?
Keitaro2011 9 months ago
@Keitaro2011 Well God loves to create. When it says in Genesis that God "made man in His image", most people assume this means that God looks like a human. But in fact, it meant nothing like that. When God created us, He put certain qualities in us, one of which was a creative quality. And if we humans obsesses over "the arts" and creating, how munch more must the creator of time and space itself be!
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy God is omnipotent! He CAN "clean" it! Also, Jesus supposedly IS God! That's like saying! "You owe me a lot of money, but I'm going to give myself the money that you owe me!" It's ludicrous.
Keitaro2011 9 months ago
@Keitaro2011 Yes and no. Jesus is PART of God. So no that analogy wouldn't apply.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@GrapplingIgnorance How ignorant you sad lil Man!
KingofKingsProd 9 months ago
@KingofKingsProd I beg your pardon?
GrapplingIgnorance 9 months ago
@KingofKingsProd Again with the name-calling. Please give a reason.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@KingofKingsProd Oh sorry. I thought you were talking to me.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy We are not blaming your god for anything, he couldn't have done anything after all. He doesn't exist... he's like the boogeyman, but made to scare grown up people into mindless servitude to their religious "shepherds". What we choose is what we are, and if you say god gave us the freedom to choose, then he has absolutely no moral right to punish us for our choices. Your god is irrelevant to a reasonable person of today.
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n Oh Atheists, when will you listen to reason? Evidence for God is out there, yet it is ignored. Not that I'm surprised, Jesus predicted all of this. As to your other comment, He's not pushing. He's inviting. If you don't want to go to the oasis, and drink from the waters of Life, then that's your problem. All other roads lead to endless desert.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy I don't see any evidence for god, you can't show me or anyone else any evidence for god, jesus predicted many things so now you can pick out what suits your world views, and i don't see god inviting me anywhere. And supposedly that's my problem - well isn't that fair? Typical of your god. Well i refuse to praise an unfair god. Praise must be earned, and simply creating people isn't enough to earn praise.
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n Forgive my anger, but that was the stupidest thing I've ever heard. ""Praise must be earned"? HE DIED FOR YOU! He took our punishment! He has invited into His kingdom. He cared about our salvation so much, that He took it out of our hands! He didn't want us to screw it up, so He made it simple: Follow Him, or follow the world.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy I didn't ask anyone to die for me. How can you say someone took our punishment if you (probably) believe we can still land in hell? Clarify this please, if you believe sinners can still burn in hell for all eternity then someone didn't take their punishment! Oh and bytheway, one crucifiction is NOTHING compared to eternal torture in hell. Fairness, is it so much to ask??
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n Let me clarify it this way: The whole rapture/end-of-days/hell thing is like the american civil war. People go to hell because they don't want to be a part of God's plan. Hell is like earth, but with out God (making it MISERABLE). Then around the end of days, the devil will trick the people who want nothing to do with God into rebelling against Him. Then the rebels will be cast into the lake of fire after they lose. I don't know much about the lake of fire, but I would Imagine...
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy that it is a billion times worse. (Scratch that part about the civil war. I thought I had something good, but I didn't) Anyway, Jesus has called us to follow Him. But people lose their lives by trying to hold on to them. People still end up in Hell by rejecting Jesus. While yes He did take our punishment, unless we put faith in Him we can't be saved. Jesus took the punishment for all of God's children, but are you one of them in the first place?
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy And as to the crucifixion, It wasn't just physical pain that Jesus felt. He felt unbearable spiritual pain, from all of our sins. And to answer your first question again, before Jesus there was no Way. The door to Heaven was like a mouse hole, VERY few people got into Heaven. Even then, they were former sinners who where forgiven. Jesus is the Gate now, people may only enter through Him.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Well, i just don't imagine that if god were so good, why would the way to him be so difficult? Or better, why would the other way (to hell) be so much more attractive to people? To me, it isn't just "well people are evil", if there's a "war" or a contest between god and devil, why does the devil have such an advantage? And how do we know he loses in the end, IF HE GETS so much more people to his side? That's a thing i don't completely understand, but i'll continue soon...
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n SO i would say that god is perhaps not the ultimate goodness, and the devil maybe not the ultimate evil. What would you say about that? Since god allows testing of people's faith in often cruel ways, he is clearly not all that benevolent. I think we have projected all too many human attributes to god - he wants to be worshipped (for no reason), he gets angry, he destroys his creation in his fury when things don't go the way he planned (which if he's all knowing is impossible)...
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n And perhaps i will never understand Jesus' sacrifice. I admit it, i just don't see it equal to eternal torture in hell. Perhaps it doesn't need to be equal, but i reject hell, because then there can be no heaven either, as people there would feel miserable for their kin suffering in hell eternally. Aah, i just see too many problems, and i hope you understand those are the reasons why i find it difficult to understand all the believers. But i appreciate you taking your time here!
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n Well the thing about Jesus' sacrifice, is that He felt that pain. Jesus felt the pain of Hell. He's been there, done that. And we're supposed to give our life to Him because of it. (about "as people would feel miserable for their kin suffering in hell...") I know this sounds weird, but if you followed Jesus and lived the way He would've and your "kin" didn't: Then was that person ever really your kin?
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@Anonymous247n Well, no one wants to hear this, but people ARE evil. People choose the road to hell, by rejecting Jesus. The devil never had an advantage, people are just attracted to sin. In the end, God doesn't lose: the people who fought against Him just have.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
If Jesus only felt pain for the duration he was on the cross that's still a lot less than eternity. Also he was resurrected and saved from the pain eventually! Next i asked, WHY are people so evil? If god is the way, why don't more people choose him? That's why i wonder why all this attraction to sin- it must mean either that people are just very badly designed, or the devil is more convincing than god! Anyway i could not bear the thought of other people- good OR evil- suffering eternally.
Anonymous247n 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy God created the possibility of us disobeying him. That means, since sin is merely disobedience of God, God created sin.
It always baffles me how theists always try to say that they believe in a creator of supposedly -everything-, except sin, and evil, and suffering babies, etc... Can we say special pleading fallacy? 0.o
lagurash 9 months ago 3
No, He didn't. Sin was already there. Like you said, sin is everything that isn't part of God. And sin leads to pain.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
So, God (we'll assume Yahweh is the correct choice, of the countless options, for argument's sake) is not omnipotent? There are forces beyond his dominion? I suggest that you brush up on your Christian theology.
1nomadic 9 months ago
@1nomadic Honestly, I can't give you an answer that will make you happy. But this whole situation is like the book of Job: God allows Job to be tested so that his faith will grow. And at the end of the book, Job is still loyal to God, so he is blessed with twice the wealth that he lost. So no, nothing is more powerful than God. But God does allow testing, to benefit a greater plan.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
"Honestly, I can't give you an answer that will make you happy."
- Not just me, everyone, including yourself. This incongruence and many others should lead to dissonance, questioning and honest reasoning; not starting with one large presupposition, which you stand atop of and defend with mental gymnastics.
Why not search for the truth and embrace the beautiful nature of humanity itself?
1nomadic 9 months ago
@1nomadic Don't give so easily my friend. The prince of this world is at work in the hearts and minds of many, don't you give in too.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
Again, presuppositions. You believe in specific invisible/imaginary sentient beings, which require eternal servitude. All the while rejecting all other invisible/imaginary sentient beings... just because people have told you so. No evidential support, reason or logic in your belief, but yet you post as if you have absolute knowledge...enough to tell others what will/should happen to them. Pure arrogance.
I never cease to be amazed by the minds of the religious.
1nomadic 9 months ago
@1nomadic There is logic to it, but clearly you don't want to hear it.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy I did not say that sin is everything that isn't part of God. I said that sin is merely disobedience of God, and that's according to Christianity. As soon as God created free will for human beings (assuming you subscribe to that), he created the sin (again, since sin is disobedience, and free will allows disobedience, then free will allows disobedience, which is sin, thus God created sin). The mythical creator of -everything- cannot not be the creator of anything. Learn your myth.
lagurash 9 months ago 6
@lagurash Again, sin was always there. There was always the option to disobey God.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
Comment removed
lagurash 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Not until free will was applied, in any circumstance, is there the option to disobey your omnipotent God...
Further, if sin always existed, then how is God the creator of everything? Think about it, because that is senseless.
lagurash 9 months ago 2
@lagurash Ok, I took I look back at the story of adam and eve, and then I realized something. Sin wasn't always there. At least it wasn't always recognized. Sin didn't pop up until Adam and Eve tried to play God
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy When did Adam or Eve try to play God? That's a new claim to me.
And no, sin wasn't always there, as I stated. For the sake of this entire argument, obviously, I'm granting you God as the creator of all. With that, everything -must- stem from him, including evil, disobedience (named sin then theists conflate disobedience and evil with equivocation), all of the maladies and suffering (if he created the Lucifer that's blamed, then God is the cause of it all), etc.
lagurash 9 months ago 3
@lagurash The devil tricked them into believing that the fruit would make them as powerful as God.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy As far as I can tell, that's not biblical. Please tell me where in the Bible the snake is the devil, and then tell me where said snake convinced both Adam and Eve that the fruit would make them as powerful as God. Seeing as how Eve was the one to convince Adam, I know that the devil didn't trick him, biblically speaking (that's how many theists often justify blaming it on the woman). Plus, Gen3:5 says, "...you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” Please, learn your own myth.
lagurash 8 months ago
@lagurash But because the snake convinced the woman, the snake still started the domino effect. he deceived know/hoping where it would lead to.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Responsibility for a series of actions is one thing, but saying he tricked someone he didn't is another altogether. You don't realize this distinction, or the fact that you don't have a firm grasp on the mythological stories in your touted "holy" book. That's quite sad, so please learn your myth before berating someone for valid criticisms to said myth.
Also, this need to blame women is a sign of weakness among religious men. Get a little more maturity, please...
lagurash 8 months ago
@lagurash I've never heard anyone blame women for The Fall. And if they have been than I'm sorry. But the devil tempted them both.
TheTrojantroy 8 months ago
@TheTrojantroy The Bible and many Christians blame women for the fall...1 Timothy 2:11-14 says, "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner."
Biblical evidence that the Bible/Christianity blames women for the fall...learn your myth, sir.
lagurash 8 months ago
@lagurash WOW Who told you that theist dont believe God created evil... He didnt create sin, because its not something you create, its a choice...
God created Choice... And there has to be a choice to make.. The choice is good or evil... A person has to choose!!! God created Evil otherwise we wouldnt have a choice between Good!! Then we will not be able to have freewill.. Thus making us just like robots....
God doesnt want to have robots as friends!!!
This video got it all wrong!!
Duplooytim 9 months ago
@Duplooytim Some theists, not all (and I guess I should've made that clear), believe that God didn't create evil, sin, etc, and that stuff is the work of the devil and us. Funny how God gets credit for our accomplishments, but not our failures.
As the creator of everything, including disobedience, then he created sin. God is responsible for sin, according to the Christian myth. Since -everything- includes the order, the temptation, the tempter, the free will, the gullibility, and the act itself.
lagurash 9 months ago
@lagurash
No You are mixed up dude... Idk where you get your theology from... FYI... This so called "myth", has more evidence that evolution... (almost every major person in the bible, up to Moses, has been 100% confirmed with historical and archeological evidence!) Even now people say that the ark has been found with 6/8 of its anchor stones... Sodom and gomorrah is a real place and been 100% confirmed to be accurate with the old testiment!!!
God made free will... He had too..
Duplooytim 9 months ago
@Duplooytim I'm merely repeating the stuff I hear from Christians...so blame them for their "mixed up" theology.
0.o Where is this evidence for Christianity? AnswersinGenesis? Kent Hovind? Will Craig? Ray Comfort? Surprising that all this supposed evidence for your God myth (don't kid yourself, it qualifies as a myth). Really? Moses has been confirmed? Everyone up to him? So, Mark, Matthew, Luke, John, Isaiah, Job, Jesus, and even ark have all been confirmed? That's quite a claim, have evidence?
lagurash 8 months ago
@Duplooytim "God made free will... He had too.. "
So, the omnipotent omniscient creator of everything had no option but to create free will? Seems like a limitation to his "all power"...
"Thats why..."
So, he died on the cross because he wants us. The idea of perfection means that he'd be complete, and wouldn't need or desire anything. Or do you not believe your God is perfect? If not, that's fine...
God didn't have to tempt us, or let us be tempted. Omniscient/potent God means illusion of FW.
lagurash 8 months ago
@lagurash
Also ... God doesnt recieve credit for what we do... He doesnt need us... He "wants" us... Thats why he died on the cross... But he had to give us the choice, and he allows temptation, Unless we ask otherwise!! Because, If he didnt... we'd be robots... Get that into your head!!! Understand the concept.. We are robots without freewill... We are in life tooo choose and thats all there is too it!!
Duplooytim 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
i thought god created everything, even satan. we may choose to sin but it is god who gave us sin and the feedom to choose to sin.
AceofDiamonds0 9 months ago
@AceofDiamonds0 Or the freedom to chose God. How can someone show love without a choice. Love without another option is rape. I don't know who you think God is, but He isn't a rapist.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
but since god did give us the choice to love and follow him he shouldnt be upset when we use that freewill and dont worship him. if god really did want us to follow him obediently he wouldnt have given us the choice.
plus who would willingly worship a deity that allows tornadoes, starvation, volcanoes, floods, and deadly disease. if god did not create and was in control of these things, he wouldnt be god.
AceofDiamonds0 9 months ago
@AceofDiamonds0 Do you remember what happened as a result of the earthquake in Haiti? We became aware of the voodoo and other evil things going on down there. Missionaries began spreading the Gospel down there. Only a few months later, the president of Haiti lead a large group of people in humble, public prayer. Hard times bring out the best in people. God destroys, but He is quick to rebuild.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
yes missionaries are wonderful people, basicly saying "here read and believe everything in this book and then we will help you". voodoo is not evil, of course you would think that because it is another way of thinking that takes away believers from christianity. missionaries go after people who are desperate and in need, people only turn to god when they are desperate and in need.
why would you willingly worship a god that causes earthquakes, sorrow, and death?
AceofDiamonds0 9 months ago
@AceofDiamonds0 Earthquakes, maybe (honestly I don't know a lot about the God-natural disaster relationship). But sorrow and death, no. In fact He works to save us from those things.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy
1. if you believe that god is in control of earthquakes and natural disasters, because hes god, you automaticly believe that he brings death and sadness, because natural catastrophes bring death and misery.
2. god doesnt bring sorrow and death? have you read the bible? 10 plagues, noahs flood, sodom and gomorrah, 2 Kings 2:23-25 (bears eating children story).
AceofDiamonds0 9 months ago
@AceofDiamonds0 Yes God does bring judgement. Sorry I thought you where talking about something else.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
And yes God has a right to be upset, after all He's done for us.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
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@TheTrojantroy
"after all He's done for us."
what like giving us the choice not to follow his word and then killing us when we are not totally obedient?
AceofDiamonds0 9 months ago
@AceofDiamonds0 Are you going to listen or are you going to rant? I;m tired of preaching the Gospel to deaf ears.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago
@TheTrojantroy Well he kinda raped Jesus' mom.
Noone1505123 9 months ago
@Noone1505123 Wow that's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off.
TheTrojantroy 9 months ago