HA HA HA HA! ! ! CIvil rights doesn't include a right be promote perversion Being a faggot is not comparable to being black: the actions you choose to make doesn't determine whether or not someone call you black/white And why is it that homosexuality is the only FILTHY act that people are FORCED to accept? Why not: Arousal from animals Arousal from being vomited on Arousal from being shit on arousal from dead bodies arousal from noxious smells arousal from little kids
@phatso1986 Yes idiot, pedophilia is harmful to CHILDREN. Too bad we don't execute trash like yourself, since you don't seem like you're going to get an education anytime soon.
@phatso1986 Right, because children could even consent to sex? And why are you even bothered by homosexual arousal? Insecurities are YOUR problem. And I don't care which or how many degrees your TRASHY self has received, you're still an idiot, which you seem to be proud of. You have degrees yet you're arguing against homosexuality? And you're telling someone to commit suicide? Yeah, look who's talking about "corrupt and twisted views".
@phatso1986 Yeah yeah, talk about anything but the point of this argument, just so you feel justified. You're a homophobe & homophobia is slowly fading away so go ahead waste your time being a bigoted piece of shit xD
@phatso1986 I'm not going to add more hatred to you because you obviously hate yourself so much that you're proud to be a piece of shit & a bigot & have to hate on innocent people just to let you self hatred out. You're also obviously in denial & too scared to admit it but whatever. And wishing me to die isn't going to do you any good either :)
@phatso1986 Fail, homophobes are the ones who end lives & make life in general a living hell. Gay people help make the world go round! Get over it ^_^
@phatso1986 Nah, do homophobes NOT kill? Cancer is irrelevant to this topic, just like mostly everything else you've said. When are you going to stop failing & just admit how wrong you are?
@phatso1986 13 and 14 year olds are children???? When I was 13, most of us were going through puberty and society considered us YOUNG ADULTS.
That said, adults over 18 who are sexually attracted to teenagers especially the younger teenagers should stay FAR AWAY from them unless they can keep their trouser trouts in their pants.
But if a 13 y.o. wants to have sexual congress with another 13 y.o., fine! I just don't want to see it or hear about it.
Woman at the end: "Freedom of opinion! Freedom of opinion!"
Exactly. And I will use such freedom of opinion to talk about how completely and utterly moronic Ryan Sorba is. Hateful little man. The real question, though, is this: is it hatred for the gays, or self-hatred for his own closeted little ass?
Conservatives fighting. Wow. Social conservatives vs libertarians vs establishment republicans. I had a feeling something like this was gonna happen once this teabagger streak took off.
I like this guy because he unashamedly reveals what today's Republican Party is really all about ... bigotry, intolerance, and homo-phobia. What a pathetic Party. They throw out the word "freedom" all the time, but really only believe in freedom for rich heterosexual white men. What a loser Party. I can't wait to see who they nominate, and will enjoy watching Obama stomp the nominee's narrow-minded Republican ass. What an asshole Party. The Party of Hate and Bigotry.
For once, I can actually say, thank you Media Matters! To all you liverals' dismay, let it be known that this is NOT representative of the liberty movement in this country.
Man this is why I hate conservatives. Prejudiced bigots who have hindered the progress of our nation and our collective conscience. First they were against ending slavery because it infringed on man's right to own property. Then they were against equality of the races because they felt one race was superior to the others. Then they were against women being equals because they felt that their only use was for making babies and cooking the kitchen... Then they hated gays because they hate equality
@DarkMagus1985 What do you make of the 500 conservatives who booed him? Also, opposition to slavery in America largely came from the religious conservatism of Midwestern Evangelicals. America is interesting in that its civil rights, particularly race rights, were born out of religious movements, MLK and Malcolm X among them. At the same time, it is hard to expect the same people to support gay rights. Complex stuff.
@XKG80 Actually I come from a strong abolitionist town in New England. So first and foremost the greatest movement of Abolition came from the Left in this country. The people in the Mid-west territories came from the North East settlers. So your wrong the religious community that most advocated for Abolition were the Quakers, Unitarians, and Congregationalists all of which are known for their Liberal heritage. MLK was from the Leftist/communist movement of the 40s. So get your facts right
@DarkMagus1985 Among all of your distortions, I think the one about the Midwesternerns actually coming from the Northeast is the funniest. Then I could say the Northeasterners were actually from Western Europe and thereby beholden to that culture. And Western Europeans were actually from Southern Europe. And Southern Europeans were actually from the Near East. And Near--Yup, pretty funny.
@XKG80 Actually most migrations began after the Civil War during the Gold Rush & the expansion of our country along with an increase of immigration from Europe coming through mainly Northeast ports such as NY because of the effects of the Civil War. Anyways its not funny its fact they migrated through the Northeast and its funny that you don't realize that the earliest immigrants to the frontier were those of New England and the greater Northeast as the cities became overcrowded they moved west
@DarkMagus1985 The broader point is that if civil rights in America came largely from religious movements, it's not like that gay rights to marriage would come from the same crowd. They're different rights coming from different philosophies although many liberals view them as being similar. There may be hope--while Republican evangelism may have gotten the ball rolling on civil rights some 150 yrs ago, there is a strain in the GOP that is libertarian and more likely to support gay rights.
@XKG80 No the civil rights movement came from several movements the Feminists from Victoria Woodhull & Jane Addams in the 19th century and the Black movements led by Frederick Douglass and WEB Du Bois all which are in the far Left. Look up these individuals study their biographies. Also study the socialist movement, labor movement and progressive movements of the 19th and 20th centuries. Do not include conservatives in the civil rights movement they were fighting for segregation in the South.
@XKG80 Also the Libertarian Movement fought for States Rights which included the states right to deny equal rights to those they deem less than an individual. Know your facts. Barry Goldwater himself was against the civil rights movement because they used the federal government to impose equal rights and end what he felt was a state issue to be decided within the states without incursion from the federal gov. I mean know your history before you state incorrectly your posts.
@XKG80 Libertarians failed in the 60s and they fail now. They fought for segregation and when they could of proven themselves above conservatives they argued for states rights to allow lynchings and segregation in the public space and private business. I don't care how you try to dance around it the facts are they failed. Thank God they did! I would be a 2nd class citizen if they had their way. My family fought in the civil rights movement so I have ample knowledge to argue against your lies!
@DarkMagus1985 You're absolutely insane. The libertarians were not behind the states-right-for-segregation scheme. That was the Democrats, a party of statism since its inception. Goldwater opposed the CRA of '64 for similar reasons Dennis Kucinich opposed the Patriot Act--i.e. a popular law tend to get a bunch of extra crap tacked on to it. But if you oppose the law, you're racist or you're against national security. Some people (YOU) fall for the trap and can't think outside the party's box.
@XKG80 What are you talking about? Libertarians were implicit in denying Civil Rights because they hated the idea of the Federal government forcing states to accept blacks as equals to whites. Its FACT that Barry Goldwater led the charge regardless of motive he was wrong to do so. Arguing otherwise its proof of your own prejudices. Libertarians were not friends of MLK. Have you even read your history?
@DarkMagus1985 "Regardless of motive..." Finally! You admit you're wrong.
Accepting blacks as equals is not what libertarians opposed. I can't believe you cannot see how absurd that is given the main premise of libertarian thinking. But you're a partisan tool, you believe what you're told, and it's all you understand.
I actually don't blame the Democrats. If I were the party of slavery, I'd want to change the story too.
@XKG80 \You don't understand the Southern Strategy. It worked it formed the seeds where Republicans began to hedge their way into the Solid South. It eventually created the framework for Strom Thurmond an avid segregationist and George Wallace infamous gov of Alabama to both become conservatives and even Wallace said, "My only regret is I didn't say States rights now! States rights tomorrow! States right forever!" When referring to his famous quote. Later Thurmond and Wallace became Republicans
@DarkMagus1985 Sorry, but Wallace was never a Republican. Wallace backed Jimmy Carter in 1976, if you recall. That was Wallace's last run at public office. He lost to Carter in the primaries and then backed him after losing. This was when the Dems began to shed their past.
Strong Thurmond changed parties when he RENOUNCED segregation. Get it? Support segregation--Democrat. Renounce segregation--Republican.
@XKG80 Wallace became Republican his son became a Republican the family is still prominent in Alabama as REPUBLICANS. The reasons these guys changed because they didn't want to remain in a party that gave a stronger voice to minorities. Thurmond only renounced his views after they became taboo but many who knew him said that he continued to use racial language when speaking about minorities. DO NOT JUSTIFY COWARDICE OR ACTIONS THAT CAUSED SO MUCH PAIN TO SO MANY PEOPLE!!!
@XKG80 The reasons why the Democrats began to lose the South was when they began to advocate for civil rights. Which even LBJ noted when he signed the civil rights bill, " We have lost the South for a generation..." He was referring to the conservatives who bucked the party because they hated and were livid that they were made to integrate by one of their own. To say by the 70s the South had largely gotten over race is ridiculous. In many states they still have segregated proms.
@DarkMagus1985 I didn't say 70s. Reagan ran for president in 1980 and "segregation" wasn't one of the top 3, 4 or 5 issues on the ballot. It wasn't even debated at the debates. Stop being an idiot.
The larger point I've been making is that civil rights (and I mean to say race-related rights) has religious roots. You say that's BS. Well, look at Prop 8 in California. According to WaPo, 70% of blacks, the most religious group in America, voted against it. That's the point.
@XKG80 His original run was in the 70s. Get your facts right. The gay rights movement was an extension of civil rights movement as was the feminist movement. I highly recommend you read and study the life of Bayard Rustin a personal teacher of MLK. You have to understand the underlying issues of motives and cause and effects. Regardless how you sugarcoat it- THE FACTS ARE LIBERTARIANS & CONS worked to stop and impede civil rights and continue to do so in many states.
@DarkMagus1985 Reagan was not on the prez ballot in 76, and I don't recall any furious debates with Ford about segregation during the primaries. The issue was done. And if you want to get technical, he tried to run in the 60s too. Who cares?
The point is that segregation was not on the ballot in 1980. And you weaken your point by mentioning 76 because it wasn't on the ballot then either. You try to divert the issues because you got proved wrong on every point and even admitted it in one case.
@XKG80 The primaries which he originally ran and lost. Do you even know your history. Reagan ran twice for the Republican ticket and won the 2nd time. Your prejudices are so apparent and our disgusting. Prop 8 was sold by the Mormon Church and tried to antagonize a group of people. I cannot speak for all people who voted for or against it. I wont because that's not the subject at hand. Stick to the facts. We are discussing motives of Wallace, Thurmond, Goldwater and the libertarian inactions
@DarkMagus1985 So why did blacks vote against it 70%? At some point you're going to have to face this.
And don't start crying over Goldwater. He opposed the govt telling private business owners who they could and couldn't do business with. This includes telling blacks they couldn't discriminate against whites. It's not about race. It's about rights.
@XKG80 We are talking about the civil rights movements. We are discussing the rights of any people to hold the views of Dr. King and call out for equality. Its trying to understand the issues. Prop 8 is not the subject at hand. Black people were hammered by the right and especially the Mormon church to vote against gay rights using fear tactics. I can only tell you that many Black people wish they could take it back. See most minorities agree on this issue: Enemy of my enemy is my friend.
@DarkMagus1985 So....black people were so stupid they were confused by the ads? I disagree.
They voted against Prop 8 for religious reasons, which - as I've been arguing the whole time - supersede traditionally left vs. right sentiments.
Same with Hispanics. Same with Muslims. Even Nasser's "secular" revolution in Egypt was extremely anti-gay and anti-abortion. Left and right is important. Religion, more important.
@DarkMagus1985 No, actually my original post was that the race rights movement isn't liked to the gay rights movement because the race right movement was largely religious and the gay rights movement is largely secular. THAT'S IT.
But you wanted to make it about race and lynching and George Wallace somehow. I guess you like bringing up old Democrats.
@XKG80 It was a hybrid effort. It was NOT just religious. Look my family fought for the movement. Many still remember the days of Dr King fondly. Do not tell me what it was or was not. Do not preach to me how you know more than they who were THERE. George Wallace is a factor because he along with the conservative vanguard continue to fight against minority rights. Did you even see, "Prom Night in Mississippi" by Morgan Freeman? Do you know your history?
@DarkMagus1985 No, I don't look at Morgan Freeman movies for my history. This is why you get emotional and cannot think outside of political cliches programmed to you by partisan conglomerates.
@XKG80 No the movie was made by independent sources. Look it up. Read and watch the premise of the movie. How in the South many states still forbid integration and even today in 2011 it still common. Your knowledge of the past is not clear and as informed as mine. You make mistakes and spin around trying to change the subject hoping you can beat me by beating a false argument I didn't make. Clearly you don't even know how to properly debate. Your actually quite funny in your ignorance...
@DarkMagus1985 You can laugh at my funny ignorance as your pore over why Prop 8 was lost due to 70% black vote.
Your "knowledge" is very clear and predictable. It's the political cliche of the day with no original thought. You can think in the context of left vs right and no other ways exist to you. The world is not that simple.
Seriously, by your logic, blacks should have voted 70% IN FAVOR of gay rights. But they didn't. And so it is our job to understand why. My view is, it's religious.
@XKG80 Wow are you flip flopping? Spinning the argument? Look I told you scare tactics were used. Many Black people didn't vote for that or they just voted without being informed. The issue has no merit to the greater argument on minority rights and how all minorities black,brown, yellow, red, white, hell even blue or whatever will attain their liberties through social and political arguments against the establishment's status quo that excludes them.
@DarkMagus1985 Scare tactics? RIDICULOUS!!!! Blacks went through marches, riots, crazy stuff with dogs attacking them and water hoses. And this wasn't even a vote about them!
@XKG80 I was talking about Prop 8. Wow your not very well read. Funny do you even know what your talking about? Prop 8 was sold to blacks by Mormons. When we discovered who were behind the scare tactics the attitude quickly changed. I know its hard being misinformed but try to learn something and pick up a book and maybe go to college pick yourself up a nice history book on the civil rights movement. Like "Why we can't Wait" by MLK or Disposable People by Kevin Bales or "Bombingham" by Grooms
@DarkMagus1985 So black people disavowed their entire civil rights tradition, one that existed for centuries, due fear of stupid Mormon ads for one stupid election?
@XKG80 Wow your spinning more webs than a spider. No Blacks forfeited nothing to Mormons. The people against Prop 8 used deceptive tactics and tried to use ignorance to win their argument. It works and Black people like any people aren't perfect. You don't know what your talking about and you don't cite your sources. Your either very foolish or can't accept your argument is moot as in NOT VALID. So learn a thing or two and go to a library and read up on your history.
@DarkMagus1985 I think this is a case of self hating, honestly. You are making excuses for blacks that don't need excuses. Why don't you just accept that they voted validly with their minds?
No, you say they were too stupid, they were too afraid. Take a breath. Black people have strong opinions on civil rights, but they didn't go for this one. And that's OK, we'll get 'em next time. The question is why? Why did their conscience not bring them to vote for gay rights here?
@XKG80 I think you don't know anything about Black people and trying to make an argument against me. Which of course doesn't work. You don't know your history or my people. You just make claims and don't even defend them. I already explained them to you and you failed to understand it. Go read up who were the main sponsors against prop 8 and u will find out the biggest spenders were the Mormons who targeted Black people and tried to conflate the argument .
@DarkMagus1985 OK, so the Mormons tried to conflate the argument. But do you think black people would be so naive to follow it, especially given their history in civil rights? No! They voted their conscience. The challenge is to make gay rights includable in that conscience.
@XKG80 I told you we know only so much and at the time many Black people like ALL people can be deceived and yes be ignorant on the decisions they make. It does NOT justify their decision it merely answers the why on what they did. Though I will say I can't speak for all Blacks and I wont attempt to. We all come in many stripes and share many ideas. Try to understand to make mistakes is to be human and we all are humans regardless of color.
@XKG80 Yes I know Black people have strong opinions on Civil Rights. I am one of them. I take your attacks as very personal and you keep using Ad Hominem attacks on me and worse on my people. You don't understand the cultures within the Black community and the history behind the Civil Rights Movement. Please read the books I cited and study Black culture and see that many of us our divided on many issues but we as a people grow and learn and change as does your people. Time changes us all
@XKG80 Opinions evolve and devolve ignorance and hatred is the bane to love and reason. Trying to understand history and which side MLK would be on and trying to follow in his footsteps regardless of race and gender we all should march towards his dream. I'm not perfect and I don't claim myself or my people or any people to be so. I believe in the dreams taught to me by my family and I carry them forward towards tomorrow. I want whats best for all Americans and I would hope you would to.
@DarkMagus1985 The point I'm making is not partisan but more cultural. The point I'm making is that old movement of civil rights (i.e. racial rights, born largely out of religion) is not connected to the new movement of gay civil rights.
I'm not saying that's good or bad. It's just something to consider in developing a strategy to get gay rights.
And I don't think it helps gays to try to compare their struggle to the struggle of blacks. It comes off as condescending and distancing.
@XKG80 I told you time and again the civil rights movement grew out of several movements and based on a hard-line leftist view. MLK joined the socialist party when he was young. Bayard Rustin was a leftist. The core of the movement wasn't based on conservative or simply religious ground. Religious words were used with a Leftist ideology that remains strong in Black Churches across America. Its a hybridization of thought that resulted in the movement.
@DarkMagus1985 Same with Hispanics. The leftists think they'll fall right in line, thinking they're all Marxist-friendly. Wrong. They're religious. GOD in any version is more important to people than being left or right. The Middle East has proved this too.
This may not be true of you, but it is true to most people. Until the left & libertarians get that, they'll never win this battle.
@XKG80 You clearly have no knowledge in history or in the knowledge of the past. Ever heard of Che Guevara or Luis Munoz Marin. Do you even know anything about Hispanics before you begin an assault based on idiocy? 98% of Blacks vote Democratic and many hold liberal views. roughly 50-60% of Hispanics increasingly vote Democratic for their rights. 80% of Jews vote Democratic. Why do they? History it speaks to them. They know who discriminates them and who in a perfect world would erase them.
@DarkMagus1985 I'm from Cuba (US immigrant) so I know who Che Guevara is. And I can tell you Cubans are a special case on gay rights. They can be very supportive because Fidel & Che's govt imprisoned and tortured gays for decades, so Cuban exiles have sympathy. But mainland Latin America, it is very taboo outside of the big cities.
But while Mexican-Americans are more "Democrat," they are more greatly opposed to gay rights than Cubans, who are more "Republican." Why? Religion.
@XKG80 Puerto Ricans are very Democratic. Its good you know the history of Cuba but do you know the history of Mexico or Puerto Rico or even that of segregation against Latinos? Do you know who was it that created the embargo to Cuba? Do you realize the reason Castro's regime hasn't fallen is because we haven't used the same approach we did to China in trying to open up trade and in doing so the introduction of capital which would hasten the collapse of said regime.
@DarkMagus1985 Puerto Ricans are v democratic, and they are more for gay rights than - as I said - mainland Latin America where it is more taboo outside of the big cities. In the end, the gay rights movement is going to have to BUILD LINKS with the religious-based civil rights movement of the past instead of destroy the links by bashing Christians and people of faith.
@XKG80 Yes they will make religious friends and create a HYBRID ideology that appeals to both camps. Based on civil rights arguments based on EQUALITY for all. The reasons gays will be accepted among Latinos and Blacks will be because the argument will come from gays who are Black and Latino. You proven my point when you conceded they will build links like I said that MLK did when he created his movement. Its not conservative its Informative arguments that appeal to the masses and will win them
@XKG80 Look your not understanding the argument and you hold that 70% like it was a baby. Look don't use that on me. It does not work. Trust me when I tell you even among Blacks- The issue of gay rights is becoming more and more accepted because its gay Blacks who are making the argument. You forget times change, people change, ignorance like a horrible stink can be washed away in the tub. Trust me the issue is about the greater rights of men not about Prop 8. Use another tactic or be ignorant
@DarkMagus1985 Prop 8 is the relevant referendum for the topic. You say the race movement was "religious leftism." Well, the reason I reject that is Prop 8. Apparently the movement is more "religious" than "leftist."
This is not anything to be ashamed of, and I think it is the gay rights forces that have to reach out to blacks and other people who have a unique history of achieving civil rights.
@XKG80 The movement of the civil rights was led by Progressive Christianity, Reformist Judaism and Liberal Jesuits of the Catholic orders. Which is a brand of reformers who came together through an ideology born not of hate but from LOVE. They all practiced some form of Liberal thought not Conservative ideologies which were against the Civil Rights Movement. Learn your history on the who, what, where and why of the times and you will know the reasons behind my argument.
@DarkMagus1985 So summary: (1) I reject that black people would be so stupid to disavow all their civil rights beliefs and suddenly be confused by ads.
(2) I reject that black people are so meek and fearful, given their history, that they would even be too scared to vote for gay rights in a private voting booth.
(3) The reason they voted against was not fear, not ignorance. It was religious--which is a perfectly valid ground.
@XKG80 Actually the Democrats you speak of later became Republicans because they couldn't stand the idea of being in the same party that betrayed them. They were known as Dixiecrats. Do you know what the Southern Strategy was? It began with Barry Goldwater and Richard Nixon and went on steroids under Ronald Reagan. The strategy targeted white voters and gave them a reason to house their prejudices under the banner of conservatism and libertarian thought. Its not about a box as much as fact!
@DarkMagus1985 Yes, the Southern Strategy is a debunked political theory from the 60s after Goldwater won the South in '64. Unfortunately the theory died the next election when a Democrat won the South. Then in 76, Jimmy Carter won the South again. And the issue of segregation was over by the time Reagan took office. I know the Democrats would like to replay the last 200 years because they were on the losing side of history, but it's over. Keep believing your absurd partisan BS.
@XKG80 When Reagan went to Mississippi a state with such a bloody history he went to a town where four years before 2 young civil rights fighters were killed and spoke to the community. He said to them, "I want to bring your values to Washington and bring about the changes you want." He was speaking to a conservative white audience who acquitted the murderers a few years before. Reagan, Goldwater, Thurmond , and Wallace worked to make the South republican by using the race issue to wedge America
@DarkMagus1985 I cannot believe you think Goldwater and Wallace opposed segregation for the same reason. Just false. They come from completely different philosophies. What can I tell you? One is against all govt intervention. One is against govt invention for the narrow purpose of preventing desegregation. There's a HUGE difference.
Then again, you did earlier admit that their motives were different so maybe you do see it and just choose to ignore it in your analysis.
@XKG80 Trust me as a BLACK guy I am glad that GAYS still fight for their rights. Using the language of Doctor King. The same language used by Cornel West and the same language used by and within my family. Anyone who truly was sincere in true equality will not mind if OTHER minorities use our language. I don't mind Latinos or Jews or anybody using the language of MLK to advance the cause of EQUALITY. I do MIND when the CONSERVATIVES pretend they were on our side when they weren't!!!
@DarkMagus1985 Again, you insist on linking the gay rights movement with the overall civil rights movement. It's just false, and the cause will continue to fail due to willful ignorance of people like you.
Explain Prop 8. Now try again without blurting out "racist" or "nazi." And then you'll come to question why blacks voted against Prop 8. Why did these people, with a great civil rights tradition, vote against? It's because their movement was largely religious.
@XKG80 Its the issue of MOTIVES & IDEOLOGY. IT IS WHAT RESULTED from their ACTIONS. People were being lynched, beaten, raped, and property stolen. Their entire families destroyed and Wallace and Goldwater were both ok with it by not calling it out as wrong. The crime they're at fault was not calling for intervention when an entire group of people were being murdered b/c they weren't the majority. Federal intervention was needed and saved lives. Motives are moot actions speak louder than words.
@XKG80 If you care to learn about segregation in the South I suggest you watch Morgan Freeman's documentary, "Prom Night in Mississippi" Which was made in 2009 and showed Freeman's hometown that was still segregated and largely racist. Its tragic that in so many states its still common for children to be segregated and cannot even dance together. The South isn't over race. Its not Morning in America they sun hasnt even risen to show the light to all the injustices brought by conservatism! =)
@XKG80 MLK's beliefs were a hybrid of Leftist thought and Baptist teachings from the Black church which shares the same ties to many of the Progressive thinking of the 19th/early 20th century which advocated for greater equality and an end to Jim Crow
So why are you surprised that New England abolished slavery and then argued for equal rights were also the first states in our union to end Anti-miscegenation laws, misogyny laws & now allow for gay marriage is also incidentally the liberal states
@DarkMagus1985 You're so partisan, I actually feel sorry for you. All I said was that civil rights in America were tied to religious movements, which is pretty unique given that it's often the opposite in the rest of the world, esp. Latin America & Middle East. But I get it--For you, everything is left vs. right in the traditional American context. I'm afraid reality is more complex than that. Enjoy your box.
@XKG80 Not partisan its fact. First and foremost religious movements are not all conservative. Often dividing between traditional and progressive thinkers. This is why the Protestant movement divided into so many subgroups from the original Calvinists and Lutherans. Its not about Latin America and the Middle East we are talking about MLK and the movements in America. Keep to the subject and try not to deviate into a pathetic tangent. Stick to the facts
@DarkMagus1985 Again, you show how partisan you are. The observation is that America is unique in that its civil rights are tied to religion. THAT'S IT. I know you have to make it about left and right because you are a programmed tool. I don't care about left or right. I'm talking religious vs non-religious.
Yes, we were talking about MLK who was a BAPTIST MINISTER, i.e. RELIGIOUS, and also a civil rights leader, which makes him and America unique compared to much of the world. GET IT, IDIOT?
@XKG80 Yes a Baptist leader with a socialist background. Your argument was that it came from the religious right. My argument was and is that its more than from just a religious background. Your clearly mistaken if you think it was all just religious people who led the movement. Bayard Rustin and many of the great leaders were not leaders of churches. STOP assuming that the Civil Rights Movement was all preachers it wasn't.
So his argument relies on gay being unnatural? I guess he should look at nature a little closer, the animal kingdom has plenty gayness, oh and no the animals aren't just confused either, they have what is called a strong scent, they know what their doing, and they like it, humans are no exception.
@Ironman9100 Martin Luther King's mentor was Bayard Rustin a gay advocate and one of the leaders of the Black Equality movement. Know your history before you insult the dead.... Man your views are disgusting!
"Freedom of opinion" is a bunch of horseshit when that "opinion" is codified in US law in the form of DADT and DOMA. This Ryan Sorba fellow is a closet case just waiting to be outed by the rentboy website. What a reasonable target for the word "asshole."
@jollygood43 The KKK were Democrats, but they were ideologically Conservative and Racist Southern Democrats. Yes, the Dems used to be the Conservative party and the Repubs were Liberal when first founded. Those KKK "democrats" would have been right at home at a Tea Party meeting.
@iolanthela not conservatives or liberals in the modern sense. The Democratic Party always had populist tendencies. And Republicans always were the party of business.
@iolanthela Yeah, I'm not so sure that Ron Paul, the founder of the Tea Party movement, would be so agreeable to that statement, considering that libertarian makes the ability to see through the lens of race impossible because libertarian rejects the idea of the collective unit. Race of course is a collective unit, and because collectivism is rejected by the libertarian Tea Party, therefore it is impossible for Ron Paul's movement and followers to see through the lens of race...But I digress.
@TBlake34 your post made my day! THANKS for that! I was home sick with a cold, and you made me laugh and feel better. It was a very WISE thing to say. I agree that Ryan Sorba looks like a closeted mo. Those are cock sucking lips if I've ever seen them... Hell, I have no shame. I'd do him...!
@sleazybtd Correct. The conservative movement hates gays. I think any gay individual in attendance at that right wing conclave needs to have his head examined. It's like Jews attending a meeting of Nazis. Psychiatric help is definetly needed.
To anyone who is a freedom loving person , realize this, your rights do not extend on other peoples. The GOP can make a life or death decision in 2012 pick the freedom loving candidate (Ron Paul) or some two bit neocon liar flipflopper anti gunner (Mitt Romney). Dr. Ron Paul can cure this countries problems with peace and freedom.
Why do they care what two men or two women do in the privacy of their own home? Who is this f*cking clown? He is probably a closeted gay man himself who is too ashamed to come out. Therefore, he needs to bash the brave gay men that have had the balls to come out (at the same he wishes those balls were in his mouth).
Do you not know that marriage can be done secularly, in front of a judge, preformed in a court of law, rather than in a church in front of a minister?
Did you know that the first amendment is a CLEAR separation of church and state and that you are acting unconstitutionally?
You wanna talk about the laws of God? Do you eat shellfish? Read the damn book it is an EQUAL SIN!!! If you eat at red lobster you might as well just have blown a man!
You're fucking stupid. By ALL accounts Europe is better off than we are. You need to look at some fucking statistics. Let's look at it economically, socially, industrially, educationally, Financially.
Europe has us beat by MILES. Maybe you're stupid in some 1950's delirium in which Europe is recovering from a world war, but that ain't the case now you dumb fuck.
Find me ONE statistic where the US is actually BETTER than Western Europe.
Because if the government doesn't approve of a same-sex marriage then according to records their relationship doesn't exist even though it's as real as the air we breath.
Your analogy has flaws in it... once you accept those flaws you can create a better analogy from something else. You should be able to think of something if you think logically.
They are not "better off with out" all these things. It's why they're wanted so badly.
@gcsecsi, Your ignorance never ceases to amaze me. Can an animal sign a marraige contract? Until it can, marriage between animal and human will NEVER happen.
And, I pray everyday that America becomes like Europe's social democracies. If Jesus answers me, I'll definitely change my opinion from "there is no god" to "MAYBE there is a god..."
You know absolutely nothign about any kind of species. If you can't see the difference between a same sex relationship and bestiality then you're officially retarded because you can't tell the difference between a horse and a human being.
You're arguing the slippery slope again. Somebody gives you a case of a country that has NOBODY asking for marriage with an animal yet here you are continuing with the bullshit argument.
It's two adults who are marrying. Two WILLING adults.
NO, it's all about you and your "imaginary friend," and you wanted to IMPOSE this belief on ME. I won't have it, I tell you... Keep your god OUT of MY government... If you don't like gay marriage, don't marry someone of the same sex. So simple (just like your brain)...
Abortion isn't murder. Never heard of "birthdays?" Why do we celebrate that? That's because that's when LIFE begins... Until you are born, you are a fetus, not a person. But, you knew that right?
Hey, I'd move to Canada way before I'd move to Florida. I HATE hot weather. I lived in the Caribbean for a year, and you can keep it... I can't handle weather like that... That's why your brain is so fried. Too much sun...
How do you have time to get all up in my business? Like my marriage is any of YOUR business in the first place. You don't know what the word "freedom" means. It does NOT mean that we ALL must bow to YOUR version of god. That's NOT freedom. Freedom means if a Unitarian church wants to marry a gay couple it should be their FREEDOM and civil right to do so...
First off, god didn't make anything. Man crreated god in his own image, and I don't like what I see.... And, secondly, animals participate in homosexuality in larger percentages than humans, and it is NECESSARY to preserve the species.
You are totally IGNORANT of history, aren't you? Are you aware that 41 states had some form of ban on interracial marriage, and 70 percent of Americans were AGAINST it (that's more than oppose gay marriage today) when the Supreme Court invalidated all the bans. Interracial marriage became law in all 50 states right on the spot... We predict ths same with gay marriage, and it's all due to Prop 8, which is SWEET to me! All that Mormon money down the drain!
No, I'd MUCH rather stay here and fight for MY rights. So far, I have WON half of the battle, because I'm already legally married in CA, and that's not going away any time soon. Our next step is to eliminate DOMA so that every state will be forced to recognize it, and the Federal government too. That's coming. One step at a time..
Why don't you move to Iran since you like theocracies so much..?
Gay marriage has been legal in Canada for several years now, and guess what? NOBODY FRICKEN CARES any more. They think we're INSANE to fight over something so trivial...
And, why are you so interested in our sex lives anyway? That's what I can never understand. If you want gays to go back in the closet, then ignore us. That's all we want too. We want to LEGAL rights that come with marriage, and then you can forget about it. If I'm in the hospital I want my husband to make my life and death decisions NOT my parents, who live 2500 miles away... And, my husband should inherit my estate when I die too...
And, sorry, but you're again displaying your utter ignorance (bible based). Animals can't agree to marry humans, so beastiaity is forever banned for good reason. Same with young children... We're talking about two HUMANS here, dingbat...
That's funny coming from someone who lives in Miami, which is like the third most GAY city in America... Do you go out to South Beach much? Key West...? And, NO, my husband and I don't particpate in sick behavior. We have a VERY good sex life, just for your info, and most definitely BETTER than YOUR sex life.. I'm SURE of it...
And, Florida will go as the nation goes, if the Supreme Court so deems it. More Americans support gay marriage today than supported interracial when it was banned.
Glad you accepted the fact that abortion is exclusively a heterosexual female phenomenon. Gay men have nothing to do with abortion unless they perform them. You need to OWN that this is a heterosexual issue...
1 Supports the right of EVERY heterosexual woman to have an abortion
2 Supports the right of EACH and EVERY American to have health care, just like the rest of the industrialized world. America is behind THIRD world countries when it comes to health care. And, it's a DISGRACE....
One more thing. Were you born stupid or is it your "lifestyle" choice?
And, I'm already married, so you LOST this debate. Six states (including DC) have gay marriage now, and this is NOT going backwards. You will LOSE this fight eventually. My hope is that Prop 8 will be the ticket for fags in Florida to marry. Can't WAIT!
Nobody cares what you think. Did you ever think of that? I don't like your chosen fake-Christian lifestyle (and that IS a choice) either, but does that mean I have the right to vote on whether you are a Christian? Of course not. Your problem is you have NO brains and NO logic. You're just plain DUMB. It's like arguing with a tree... 70 percent of the public were against interracial marriage when it became legal, so I could care less what the public thinks. That's why we have courts idiot!
this is annoying. they bring up issues like this so we argue with each other instead of going after them for losing lives and treasure in unwinnable wars. and democrats and republicans are stupid enough to fall for it
"I think it is clearly a chosen lifestyle since it is not consdered acceptable behavior by well over halt the the voting public. Personally I don't care what you do, just don.t ask me to accept it or legitimize it!"
You know, people didn't think it was "acceptable behavior" and that WAS the majority back when it came to the idea that being left-handed was considered wrong.
You don't get to say "I don't care" when you're screaming your fucking head off about it.
Suddenly a comment said TO me isn't directed at me? So, either you can't read who you're responding to and calling "the buddy of Listnut" when I was the only other one aside from you guys... or you can't read who you're replying to when you comment.
Correction: There is NO such thing as a "gay lifestyle."
It's like saying "male lifestyle" or "female lifestyle." You are only showing your incredIble IGNORANCE to use such a nonsense term. How's that male lifestyle going for you?
Believe it or not, the TRUE meaning of Conservative means that government should get OUT of our private lives. The Repugs have forgotten this principle. There is an article called:
The Conservative Case for Gay Marriage, by Ted Olson
Well worth reading... But, I agree with you otherwise... The current Repug party has been taken over by nutjobs, and they've lost their way. Tea baggers...LOL!
If you're talking about the "being forced to marry the rapist" bit... it DID happen.
And your God condoned it long ago... he actually had it written that way.
It's still in your holy book, and we're told that EVERYTHING your god says is supposed to be right and holy... yet instead, we get something that anybody can tell you is messed up.
If you believe in "god's plan" or that your days have been planned ahead... you believe that God plans every single miscarriage.
Every miscarriage counts as an abortion by God himself... abortion being a crime in your opinion... this makes God the worst abortionist ever. Because he doesn't even want the woman's consent. He just simply decides when the fetus dies.
You can't cop out with "out of context". When you look at violence in the Quran you attribute that as horrible and disgusting.
You instead throw this away and pretend it's not in the Bible. You bitch about a lack of research, when you should've known these passages existed in the first place.
A "good" entity wouldn't have ordered the deaths of pregnant women.
You don't have any other gods to compare him to in your cult, you HAVE to label him as "good".
So, who effed this guy's mother? That he's so angry at the world? He's a little punk.
magos2k6 8 months ago 3
What a brainless dick head
Ashleyisbaked 8 months ago 4
what a loser. contrary to popular belief, not all conservaive republicans are homophobes. did he go up there expecting to be applauded?
Chernobog2 8 months ago 3
Hey! I like to eat feces! Because me and my filthy feces eating friends do it, we have a RIGHT to include shit in the Food pyramid
Hey, feces has SOME nutrition, that is why babyy elephants eat it.
THat is MUCH MORE that can be said about being a faggot or dyke
phatso1986 9 months ago
the only faggot i see at this event is ryan sorba.
poetwarrior13 9 months ago
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986
1. Homosexuality is not an act.
2. Homosexuality is not a choice.
3. Those other "arousals" you mentioned are harmful, while homosexuality is not.
4. Accept these facts, & if you don't believe me try doing your research.
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
1. pedophlie is not an act
2. pedophilia is not a choise
3. being aroused is harmful? check your facts, faggot
4. accept these facts, if you don't believe me, then there is no hope for you. Too bad we don't execute trash like you, the way the do in Iran
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Yes idiot, pedophilia is harmful to CHILDREN. Too bad we don't execute trash like yourself, since you don't seem like you're going to get an education anytime soon.
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
no faggot
the APA, the same one who "validated" homosexual already disagrees with your claim that having sex with children is damaging to children
RAPE is damaging to children.
but that is irrelevant, i am talking about the AROUSAL
stay on topic, would you homo?
i am a heterosexual man with a master's degree in engineering
to claim that I am trash is more proof of how corrupt and twisted your view of the word is
just do everyone a favor and kill yourself
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Right, because children could even consent to sex? And why are you even bothered by homosexual arousal? Insecurities are YOUR problem. And I don't care which or how many degrees your TRASHY self has received, you're still an idiot, which you seem to be proud of. You have degrees yet you're arguing against homosexuality? And you're telling someone to commit suicide? Yeah, look who's talking about "corrupt and twisted views".
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
"cause children could even consent to sex?"
right, cuz no 13 year old ever had sex with another 13 year old
no country has 14 year old consenting to sex
cuz no child can have sexual arousal
there is no hope for you
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Blah blah more stupidity. You said CHILDREN not teenagers. There's hope for anyone, but apparently you don't want to change.
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
last i checked, someone who was 12, 13, 14, 15 are still considered children
yet, i'm the stupid one
grow up faggot. acecpt that not everyone has to bow down to your gay demands
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Yeah yeah, talk about anything but the point of this argument, just so you feel justified. You're a homophobe & homophobia is slowly fading away so go ahead waste your time being a bigoted piece of shit xD
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
better to be a bigot or a piece of shit
at least shit has a purpose
unlike your filth and perversion
have fun living out your life
with any luck, it won't be for much longer
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 I'm not going to add more hatred to you because you obviously hate yourself so much that you're proud to be a piece of shit & a bigot & have to hate on innocent people just to let you self hatred out. You're also obviously in denial & too scared to admit it but whatever. And wishing me to die isn't going to do you any good either :)
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
shit has nutrition and shtting expels waste
what is homosexuality
have fun knowing that you are worse that shit
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Hah you must be the worst troll ever.
Sebizzar 9 months ago
@Sebizzar
yeah, cuz aperantly shit isnt used for fertilizer
homosexuality stops life
kinda like cancer
phatso1986 9 months ago
@phatso1986 Fail, homophobes are the ones who end lives & make life in general a living hell. Gay people help make the world go round! Get over it ^_^
Sebizzar 8 months ago
@Sebizzar
right, homophobes stop reproduction
its not the homosexuals who do that
i guess in your fucked up mind, having cancer is invigorating, huh?
phatso1986 8 months ago
@phatso1986 Nah, do homophobes NOT kill? Cancer is irrelevant to this topic, just like mostly everything else you've said. When are you going to stop failing & just admit how wrong you are?
Sebizzar 8 months ago
@Sebizzar
right
it's totally irrelevant to talk about a perversion when the video is about another perversion
i guess talking about sherbets that i like would be an irrelevant topic on a italian ice video, huh?
you things really are more worthless than shit
phatso1986 8 months ago
@phatso1986 Everything insult you try to throw at gay people is only a reflection of your self hatred :]
Sebizzar 8 months ago
@phatso1986 I'm not sure where you're going with that.
"homosexuality stops life."
Even if it does, what would that matter? Even if tomorrow the entire human race decided to stop having children... how would that make them wrong?
instereovideos 6 months ago
@phatso1986 13 and 14 year olds are children???? When I was 13, most of us were going through puberty and society considered us YOUNG ADULTS.
That said, adults over 18 who are sexually attracted to teenagers especially the younger teenagers should stay FAR AWAY from them unless they can keep their trouser trouts in their pants.
But if a 13 y.o. wants to have sexual congress with another 13 y.o., fine! I just don't want to see it or hear about it.
EdM021 9 months ago
@EdM021
when i was 12 -13 i had a 8 inch cock
but that is irrelavent just like your prvious post
phatso1986 9 months ago
makes you wonder why this guy is so obsessed with gays.
i wonder how long until he's busted in a cocaine / gay hooker sting?
hellodinojamie 9 months ago
Woman at the end: "Freedom of opinion! Freedom of opinion!"
Exactly. And I will use such freedom of opinion to talk about how completely and utterly moronic Ryan Sorba is. Hateful little man. The real question, though, is this: is it hatred for the gays, or self-hatred for his own closeted little ass?
Islander255 10 months ago
Comment removed
autubeuser 11 months ago
What a dick!
beaner21121 11 months ago
Conservatives fighting. Wow. Social conservatives vs libertarians vs establishment republicans. I had a feeling something like this was gonna happen once this teabagger streak took off.
jons44 11 months ago
I like this guy because he unashamedly reveals what today's Republican Party is really all about ... bigotry, intolerance, and homo-phobia. What a pathetic Party. They throw out the word "freedom" all the time, but really only believe in freedom for rich heterosexual white men. What a loser Party. I can't wait to see who they nominate, and will enjoy watching Obama stomp the nominee's narrow-minded Republican ass. What an asshole Party. The Party of Hate and Bigotry.
TheTruthNow000 11 months ago
@TheTruthNow000 I see a guy who got booed off the stage.
XKG80 11 months ago
For once, I can actually say, thank you Media Matters! To all you liverals' dismay, let it be known that this is NOT representative of the liberty movement in this country.
MattTSteiner 11 months ago
That is some sad shite.
Be nice to see a podium under the chest of someone saying anything good, wouldn't it. What a twat.
Wanderlustus 11 months ago
shit for me, Sorba
davidpar2 11 months ago
His reasoning is articulate but completely and demonstrably false.
papalosopher 1 year ago
Man this is why I hate conservatives. Prejudiced bigots who have hindered the progress of our nation and our collective conscience. First they were against ending slavery because it infringed on man's right to own property. Then they were against equality of the races because they felt one race was superior to the others. Then they were against women being equals because they felt that their only use was for making babies and cooking the kitchen... Then they hated gays because they hate equality
DarkMagus1985 1 year ago 2
@DarkMagus1985 What do you make of the 500 conservatives who booed him? Also, opposition to slavery in America largely came from the religious conservatism of Midwestern Evangelicals. America is interesting in that its civil rights, particularly race rights, were born out of religious movements, MLK and Malcolm X among them. At the same time, it is hard to expect the same people to support gay rights. Complex stuff.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Actually I come from a strong abolitionist town in New England. So first and foremost the greatest movement of Abolition came from the Left in this country. The people in the Mid-west territories came from the North East settlers. So your wrong the religious community that most advocated for Abolition were the Quakers, Unitarians, and Congregationalists all of which are known for their Liberal heritage. MLK was from the Leftist/communist movement of the 40s. So get your facts right
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Among all of your distortions, I think the one about the Midwesternerns actually coming from the Northeast is the funniest. Then I could say the Northeasterners were actually from Western Europe and thereby beholden to that culture. And Western Europeans were actually from Southern Europe. And Southern Europeans were actually from the Near East. And Near--Yup, pretty funny.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Actually most migrations began after the Civil War during the Gold Rush & the expansion of our country along with an increase of immigration from Europe coming through mainly Northeast ports such as NY because of the effects of the Civil War. Anyways its not funny its fact they migrated through the Northeast and its funny that you don't realize that the earliest immigrants to the frontier were those of New England and the greater Northeast as the cities became overcrowded they moved west
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 The broader point is that if civil rights in America came largely from religious movements, it's not like that gay rights to marriage would come from the same crowd. They're different rights coming from different philosophies although many liberals view them as being similar. There may be hope--while Republican evangelism may have gotten the ball rolling on civil rights some 150 yrs ago, there is a strain in the GOP that is libertarian and more likely to support gay rights.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 No the civil rights movement came from several movements the Feminists from Victoria Woodhull & Jane Addams in the 19th century and the Black movements led by Frederick Douglass and WEB Du Bois all which are in the far Left. Look up these individuals study their biographies. Also study the socialist movement, labor movement and progressive movements of the 19th and 20th centuries. Do not include conservatives in the civil rights movement they were fighting for segregation in the South.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 Also the Libertarian Movement fought for States Rights which included the states right to deny equal rights to those they deem less than an individual. Know your facts. Barry Goldwater himself was against the civil rights movement because they used the federal government to impose equal rights and end what he felt was a state issue to be decided within the states without incursion from the federal gov. I mean know your history before you state incorrectly your posts.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 Libertarians failed in the 60s and they fail now. They fought for segregation and when they could of proven themselves above conservatives they argued for states rights to allow lynchings and segregation in the public space and private business. I don't care how you try to dance around it the facts are they failed. Thank God they did! I would be a 2nd class citizen if they had their way. My family fought in the civil rights movement so I have ample knowledge to argue against your lies!
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 You're absolutely insane. The libertarians were not behind the states-right-for-segregation scheme. That was the Democrats, a party of statism since its inception. Goldwater opposed the CRA of '64 for similar reasons Dennis Kucinich opposed the Patriot Act--i.e. a popular law tend to get a bunch of extra crap tacked on to it. But if you oppose the law, you're racist or you're against national security. Some people (YOU) fall for the trap and can't think outside the party's box.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 What are you talking about? Libertarians were implicit in denying Civil Rights because they hated the idea of the Federal government forcing states to accept blacks as equals to whites. Its FACT that Barry Goldwater led the charge regardless of motive he was wrong to do so. Arguing otherwise its proof of your own prejudices. Libertarians were not friends of MLK. Have you even read your history?
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 "Regardless of motive..." Finally! You admit you're wrong.
Accepting blacks as equals is not what libertarians opposed. I can't believe you cannot see how absurd that is given the main premise of libertarian thinking. But you're a partisan tool, you believe what you're told, and it's all you understand.
I actually don't blame the Democrats. If I were the party of slavery, I'd want to change the story too.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 \You don't understand the Southern Strategy. It worked it formed the seeds where Republicans began to hedge their way into the Solid South. It eventually created the framework for Strom Thurmond an avid segregationist and George Wallace infamous gov of Alabama to both become conservatives and even Wallace said, "My only regret is I didn't say States rights now! States rights tomorrow! States right forever!" When referring to his famous quote. Later Thurmond and Wallace became Republicans
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Sorry, but Wallace was never a Republican. Wallace backed Jimmy Carter in 1976, if you recall. That was Wallace's last run at public office. He lost to Carter in the primaries and then backed him after losing. This was when the Dems began to shed their past.
Strong Thurmond changed parties when he RENOUNCED segregation. Get it? Support segregation--Democrat. Renounce segregation--Republican.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Wallace became Republican his son became a Republican the family is still prominent in Alabama as REPUBLICANS. The reasons these guys changed because they didn't want to remain in a party that gave a stronger voice to minorities. Thurmond only renounced his views after they became taboo but many who knew him said that he continued to use racial language when speaking about minorities. DO NOT JUSTIFY COWARDICE OR ACTIONS THAT CAUSED SO MUCH PAIN TO SO MANY PEOPLE!!!
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 The reasons why the Democrats began to lose the South was when they began to advocate for civil rights. Which even LBJ noted when he signed the civil rights bill, " We have lost the South for a generation..." He was referring to the conservatives who bucked the party because they hated and were livid that they were made to integrate by one of their own. To say by the 70s the South had largely gotten over race is ridiculous. In many states they still have segregated proms.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 I didn't say 70s. Reagan ran for president in 1980 and "segregation" wasn't one of the top 3, 4 or 5 issues on the ballot. It wasn't even debated at the debates. Stop being an idiot.
The larger point I've been making is that civil rights (and I mean to say race-related rights) has religious roots. You say that's BS. Well, look at Prop 8 in California. According to WaPo, 70% of blacks, the most religious group in America, voted against it. That's the point.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 His original run was in the 70s. Get your facts right. The gay rights movement was an extension of civil rights movement as was the feminist movement. I highly recommend you read and study the life of Bayard Rustin a personal teacher of MLK. You have to understand the underlying issues of motives and cause and effects. Regardless how you sugarcoat it- THE FACTS ARE LIBERTARIANS & CONS worked to stop and impede civil rights and continue to do so in many states.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Reagan was not on the prez ballot in 76, and I don't recall any furious debates with Ford about segregation during the primaries. The issue was done. And if you want to get technical, he tried to run in the 60s too. Who cares?
The point is that segregation was not on the ballot in 1980. And you weaken your point by mentioning 76 because it wasn't on the ballot then either. You try to divert the issues because you got proved wrong on every point and even admitted it in one case.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 The primaries which he originally ran and lost. Do you even know your history. Reagan ran twice for the Republican ticket and won the 2nd time. Your prejudices are so apparent and our disgusting. Prop 8 was sold by the Mormon Church and tried to antagonize a group of people. I cannot speak for all people who voted for or against it. I wont because that's not the subject at hand. Stick to the facts. We are discussing motives of Wallace, Thurmond, Goldwater and the libertarian inactions
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 So why did blacks vote against it 70%? At some point you're going to have to face this.
And don't start crying over Goldwater. He opposed the govt telling private business owners who they could and couldn't do business with. This includes telling blacks they couldn't discriminate against whites. It's not about race. It's about rights.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 We are talking about the civil rights movements. We are discussing the rights of any people to hold the views of Dr. King and call out for equality. Its trying to understand the issues. Prop 8 is not the subject at hand. Black people were hammered by the right and especially the Mormon church to vote against gay rights using fear tactics. I can only tell you that many Black people wish they could take it back. See most minorities agree on this issue: Enemy of my enemy is my friend.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 So....black people were so stupid they were confused by the ads? I disagree.
They voted against Prop 8 for religious reasons, which - as I've been arguing the whole time - supersede traditionally left vs. right sentiments.
Same with Hispanics. Same with Muslims. Even Nasser's "secular" revolution in Egypt was extremely anti-gay and anti-abortion. Left and right is important. Religion, more important.
And that is what is preventing gay rights in USA.
XKG80 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 No, actually my original post was that the race rights movement isn't liked to the gay rights movement because the race right movement was largely religious and the gay rights movement is largely secular. THAT'S IT.
But you wanted to make it about race and lynching and George Wallace somehow. I guess you like bringing up old Democrats.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 It was a hybrid effort. It was NOT just religious. Look my family fought for the movement. Many still remember the days of Dr King fondly. Do not tell me what it was or was not. Do not preach to me how you know more than they who were THERE. George Wallace is a factor because he along with the conservative vanguard continue to fight against minority rights. Did you even see, "Prom Night in Mississippi" by Morgan Freeman? Do you know your history?
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 No, I don't look at Morgan Freeman movies for my history. This is why you get emotional and cannot think outside of political cliches programmed to you by partisan conglomerates.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 No the movie was made by independent sources. Look it up. Read and watch the premise of the movie. How in the South many states still forbid integration and even today in 2011 it still common. Your knowledge of the past is not clear and as informed as mine. You make mistakes and spin around trying to change the subject hoping you can beat me by beating a false argument I didn't make. Clearly you don't even know how to properly debate. Your actually quite funny in your ignorance...
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 You can laugh at my funny ignorance as your pore over why Prop 8 was lost due to 70% black vote.
Your "knowledge" is very clear and predictable. It's the political cliche of the day with no original thought. You can think in the context of left vs right and no other ways exist to you. The world is not that simple.
Seriously, by your logic, blacks should have voted 70% IN FAVOR of gay rights. But they didn't. And so it is our job to understand why. My view is, it's religious.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Wow are you flip flopping? Spinning the argument? Look I told you scare tactics were used. Many Black people didn't vote for that or they just voted without being informed. The issue has no merit to the greater argument on minority rights and how all minorities black,brown, yellow, red, white, hell even blue or whatever will attain their liberties through social and political arguments against the establishment's status quo that excludes them.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Scare tactics? RIDICULOUS!!!! Blacks went through marches, riots, crazy stuff with dogs attacking them and water hoses. And this wasn't even a vote about them!
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 I was talking about Prop 8. Wow your not very well read. Funny do you even know what your talking about? Prop 8 was sold to blacks by Mormons. When we discovered who were behind the scare tactics the attitude quickly changed. I know its hard being misinformed but try to learn something and pick up a book and maybe go to college pick yourself up a nice history book on the civil rights movement. Like "Why we can't Wait" by MLK or Disposable People by Kevin Bales or "Bombingham" by Grooms
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 So black people disavowed their entire civil rights tradition, one that existed for centuries, due fear of stupid Mormon ads for one stupid election?
Black people afraid of Mormons. Hilarious.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Wow your spinning more webs than a spider. No Blacks forfeited nothing to Mormons. The people against Prop 8 used deceptive tactics and tried to use ignorance to win their argument. It works and Black people like any people aren't perfect. You don't know what your talking about and you don't cite your sources. Your either very foolish or can't accept your argument is moot as in NOT VALID. So learn a thing or two and go to a library and read up on your history.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 I think this is a case of self hating, honestly. You are making excuses for blacks that don't need excuses. Why don't you just accept that they voted validly with their minds?
No, you say they were too stupid, they were too afraid. Take a breath. Black people have strong opinions on civil rights, but they didn't go for this one. And that's OK, we'll get 'em next time. The question is why? Why did their conscience not bring them to vote for gay rights here?
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 I think you don't know anything about Black people and trying to make an argument against me. Which of course doesn't work. You don't know your history or my people. You just make claims and don't even defend them. I already explained them to you and you failed to understand it. Go read up who were the main sponsors against prop 8 and u will find out the biggest spenders were the Mormons who targeted Black people and tried to conflate the argument .
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 OK, so the Mormons tried to conflate the argument. But do you think black people would be so naive to follow it, especially given their history in civil rights? No! They voted their conscience. The challenge is to make gay rights includable in that conscience.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 I told you we know only so much and at the time many Black people like ALL people can be deceived and yes be ignorant on the decisions they make. It does NOT justify their decision it merely answers the why on what they did. Though I will say I can't speak for all Blacks and I wont attempt to. We all come in many stripes and share many ideas. Try to understand to make mistakes is to be human and we all are humans regardless of color.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 Yes I know Black people have strong opinions on Civil Rights. I am one of them. I take your attacks as very personal and you keep using Ad Hominem attacks on me and worse on my people. You don't understand the cultures within the Black community and the history behind the Civil Rights Movement. Please read the books I cited and study Black culture and see that many of us our divided on many issues but we as a people grow and learn and change as does your people. Time changes us all
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 Opinions evolve and devolve ignorance and hatred is the bane to love and reason. Trying to understand history and which side MLK would be on and trying to follow in his footsteps regardless of race and gender we all should march towards his dream. I'm not perfect and I don't claim myself or my people or any people to be so. I believe in the dreams taught to me by my family and I carry them forward towards tomorrow. I want whats best for all Americans and I would hope you would to.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 The point I'm making is not partisan but more cultural. The point I'm making is that old movement of civil rights (i.e. racial rights, born largely out of religion) is not connected to the new movement of gay civil rights.
I'm not saying that's good or bad. It's just something to consider in developing a strategy to get gay rights.
And I don't think it helps gays to try to compare their struggle to the struggle of blacks. It comes off as condescending and distancing.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 I told you time and again the civil rights movement grew out of several movements and based on a hard-line leftist view. MLK joined the socialist party when he was young. Bayard Rustin was a leftist. The core of the movement wasn't based on conservative or simply religious ground. Religious words were used with a Leftist ideology that remains strong in Black Churches across America. Its a hybridization of thought that resulted in the movement.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 I know that when most people think of civil rights, they think of Bayard Rustin. LOL!!!
This is why you lose elections and referendums--By being completely out of touch with the people and with reality.
The point you keep missing is they're religious. That's why they didn't back Prop 8. The longer you ignore it, the longer you will deny gay rights.
XKG80 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Same with Hispanics. The leftists think they'll fall right in line, thinking they're all Marxist-friendly. Wrong. They're religious. GOD in any version is more important to people than being left or right. The Middle East has proved this too.
This may not be true of you, but it is true to most people. Until the left & libertarians get that, they'll never win this battle.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 You clearly have no knowledge in history or in the knowledge of the past. Ever heard of Che Guevara or Luis Munoz Marin. Do you even know anything about Hispanics before you begin an assault based on idiocy? 98% of Blacks vote Democratic and many hold liberal views. roughly 50-60% of Hispanics increasingly vote Democratic for their rights. 80% of Jews vote Democratic. Why do they? History it speaks to them. They know who discriminates them and who in a perfect world would erase them.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 I'm from Cuba (US immigrant) so I know who Che Guevara is. And I can tell you Cubans are a special case on gay rights. They can be very supportive because Fidel & Che's govt imprisoned and tortured gays for decades, so Cuban exiles have sympathy. But mainland Latin America, it is very taboo outside of the big cities.
But while Mexican-Americans are more "Democrat," they are more greatly opposed to gay rights than Cubans, who are more "Republican." Why? Religion.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Puerto Ricans are very Democratic. Its good you know the history of Cuba but do you know the history of Mexico or Puerto Rico or even that of segregation against Latinos? Do you know who was it that created the embargo to Cuba? Do you realize the reason Castro's regime hasn't fallen is because we haven't used the same approach we did to China in trying to open up trade and in doing so the introduction of capital which would hasten the collapse of said regime.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Puerto Ricans are v democratic, and they are more for gay rights than - as I said - mainland Latin America where it is more taboo outside of the big cities. In the end, the gay rights movement is going to have to BUILD LINKS with the religious-based civil rights movement of the past instead of destroy the links by bashing Christians and people of faith.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Yes they will make religious friends and create a HYBRID ideology that appeals to both camps. Based on civil rights arguments based on EQUALITY for all. The reasons gays will be accepted among Latinos and Blacks will be because the argument will come from gays who are Black and Latino. You proven my point when you conceded they will build links like I said that MLK did when he created his movement. Its not conservative its Informative arguments that appeal to the masses and will win them
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 "Will be accepted"? They were not accepted to the tune of 70%, my friend.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Look your not understanding the argument and you hold that 70% like it was a baby. Look don't use that on me. It does not work. Trust me when I tell you even among Blacks- The issue of gay rights is becoming more and more accepted because its gay Blacks who are making the argument. You forget times change, people change, ignorance like a horrible stink can be washed away in the tub. Trust me the issue is about the greater rights of men not about Prop 8. Use another tactic or be ignorant
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Prop 8 is the relevant referendum for the topic. You say the race movement was "religious leftism." Well, the reason I reject that is Prop 8. Apparently the movement is more "religious" than "leftist."
This is not anything to be ashamed of, and I think it is the gay rights forces that have to reach out to blacks and other people who have a unique history of achieving civil rights.
Even the Mormons!
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 The movement of the civil rights was led by Progressive Christianity, Reformist Judaism and Liberal Jesuits of the Catholic orders. Which is a brand of reformers who came together through an ideology born not of hate but from LOVE. They all practiced some form of Liberal thought not Conservative ideologies which were against the Civil Rights Movement. Learn your history on the who, what, where and why of the times and you will know the reasons behind my argument.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 So summary: (1) I reject that black people would be so stupid to disavow all their civil rights beliefs and suddenly be confused by ads.
(2) I reject that black people are so meek and fearful, given their history, that they would even be too scared to vote for gay rights in a private voting booth.
(3) The reason they voted against was not fear, not ignorance. It was religious--which is a perfectly valid ground.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Actually the Democrats you speak of later became Republicans because they couldn't stand the idea of being in the same party that betrayed them. They were known as Dixiecrats. Do you know what the Southern Strategy was? It began with Barry Goldwater and Richard Nixon and went on steroids under Ronald Reagan. The strategy targeted white voters and gave them a reason to house their prejudices under the banner of conservatism and libertarian thought. Its not about a box as much as fact!
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Yes, the Southern Strategy is a debunked political theory from the 60s after Goldwater won the South in '64. Unfortunately the theory died the next election when a Democrat won the South. Then in 76, Jimmy Carter won the South again. And the issue of segregation was over by the time Reagan took office. I know the Democrats would like to replay the last 200 years because they were on the losing side of history, but it's over. Keep believing your absurd partisan BS.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 When Reagan went to Mississippi a state with such a bloody history he went to a town where four years before 2 young civil rights fighters were killed and spoke to the community. He said to them, "I want to bring your values to Washington and bring about the changes you want." He was speaking to a conservative white audience who acquitted the murderers a few years before. Reagan, Goldwater, Thurmond , and Wallace worked to make the South republican by using the race issue to wedge America
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 I cannot believe you think Goldwater and Wallace opposed segregation for the same reason. Just false. They come from completely different philosophies. What can I tell you? One is against all govt intervention. One is against govt invention for the narrow purpose of preventing desegregation. There's a HUGE difference.
Then again, you did earlier admit that their motives were different so maybe you do see it and just choose to ignore it in your analysis.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Trust me as a BLACK guy I am glad that GAYS still fight for their rights. Using the language of Doctor King. The same language used by Cornel West and the same language used by and within my family. Anyone who truly was sincere in true equality will not mind if OTHER minorities use our language. I don't mind Latinos or Jews or anybody using the language of MLK to advance the cause of EQUALITY. I do MIND when the CONSERVATIVES pretend they were on our side when they weren't!!!
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Again, you insist on linking the gay rights movement with the overall civil rights movement. It's just false, and the cause will continue to fail due to willful ignorance of people like you.
Explain Prop 8. Now try again without blurting out "racist" or "nazi." And then you'll come to question why blacks voted against Prop 8. Why did these people, with a great civil rights tradition, vote against? It's because their movement was largely religious.
Keep ignoring it, keep losing.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Its the issue of MOTIVES & IDEOLOGY. IT IS WHAT RESULTED from their ACTIONS. People were being lynched, beaten, raped, and property stolen. Their entire families destroyed and Wallace and Goldwater were both ok with it by not calling it out as wrong. The crime they're at fault was not calling for intervention when an entire group of people were being murdered b/c they weren't the majority. Federal intervention was needed and saved lives. Motives are moot actions speak louder than words.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 If you care to learn about segregation in the South I suggest you watch Morgan Freeman's documentary, "Prom Night in Mississippi" Which was made in 2009 and showed Freeman's hometown that was still segregated and largely racist. Its tragic that in so many states its still common for children to be segregated and cannot even dance together. The South isn't over race. Its not Morning in America they sun hasnt even risen to show the light to all the injustices brought by conservatism! =)
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@XKG80 MLK's beliefs were a hybrid of Leftist thought and Baptist teachings from the Black church which shares the same ties to many of the Progressive thinking of the 19th/early 20th century which advocated for greater equality and an end to Jim Crow
So why are you surprised that New England abolished slavery and then argued for equal rights were also the first states in our union to end Anti-miscegenation laws, misogyny laws & now allow for gay marriage is also incidentally the liberal states
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 You're so partisan, I actually feel sorry for you. All I said was that civil rights in America were tied to religious movements, which is pretty unique given that it's often the opposite in the rest of the world, esp. Latin America & Middle East. But I get it--For you, everything is left vs. right in the traditional American context. I'm afraid reality is more complex than that. Enjoy your box.
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Not partisan its fact. First and foremost religious movements are not all conservative. Often dividing between traditional and progressive thinkers. This is why the Protestant movement divided into so many subgroups from the original Calvinists and Lutherans. Its not about Latin America and the Middle East we are talking about MLK and the movements in America. Keep to the subject and try not to deviate into a pathetic tangent. Stick to the facts
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
@DarkMagus1985 Again, you show how partisan you are. The observation is that America is unique in that its civil rights are tied to religion. THAT'S IT. I know you have to make it about left and right because you are a programmed tool. I don't care about left or right. I'm talking religious vs non-religious.
Yes, we were talking about MLK who was a BAPTIST MINISTER, i.e. RELIGIOUS, and also a civil rights leader, which makes him and America unique compared to much of the world. GET IT, IDIOT?
XKG80 11 months ago
@XKG80 Yes a Baptist leader with a socialist background. Your argument was that it came from the religious right. My argument was and is that its more than from just a religious background. Your clearly mistaken if you think it was all just religious people who led the movement. Bayard Rustin and many of the great leaders were not leaders of churches. STOP assuming that the Civil Rights Movement was all preachers it wasn't.
DarkMagus1985 11 months ago
So his argument relies on gay being unnatural? I guess he should look at nature a little closer, the animal kingdom has plenty gayness, oh and no the animals aren't just confused either, they have what is called a strong scent, they know what their doing, and they like it, humans are no exception.
Khyrid 1 year ago
HERE IS YOUR REAL HOPE AND CHANGE IN 2012
youtube.com/watch?v=kY-maJ0IyuA
BringAmericaBack 1 year ago
wow what rational thoughts from the radical right
nickymaz05 1 year ago
Marting Luther King once said All gays shall be executed and thats what we shall do. Throw them into the ovens like we did to the jews.
Ironman9100 1 year ago
@Ironman9100 Martin Luther King's mentor was Bayard Rustin a gay advocate and one of the leaders of the Black Equality movement. Know your history before you insult the dead.... Man your views are disgusting!
DarkMagus1985 1 year ago
"Freedom of opinion" is a bunch of horseshit when that "opinion" is codified in US law in the form of DADT and DOMA. This Ryan Sorba fellow is a closet case just waiting to be outed by the rentboy website. What a reasonable target for the word "asshole."
JohnnyBB82 1 year ago
All you blacks, hispanics, gays, etc. that sell out to the KKK party get what you get, should've known better.
bigman1225 1 year ago
@bigman1225 you know most members of the KKK were democrats right?
jollygood43 1 year ago
@jollygood43 The KKK were Democrats, but they were ideologically Conservative and Racist Southern Democrats. Yes, the Dems used to be the Conservative party and the Repubs were Liberal when first founded. Those KKK "democrats" would have been right at home at a Tea Party meeting.
iolanthela 1 year ago
@iolanthela not conservatives or liberals in the modern sense. The Democratic Party always had populist tendencies. And Republicans always were the party of business.
xaviqaz 1 year ago
@iolanthela Yeah, I'm not so sure that Ron Paul, the founder of the Tea Party movement, would be so agreeable to that statement, considering that libertarian makes the ability to see through the lens of race impossible because libertarian rejects the idea of the collective unit. Race of course is a collective unit, and because collectivism is rejected by the libertarian Tea Party, therefore it is impossible for Ron Paul's movement and followers to see through the lens of race...But I digress.
MattTSteiner 11 months ago
You gotta admit this guy has the guts to say some really controversial stuff.
tbsla13 1 year ago
How will this gentleman's career end? Male prostitute with meth? Dalliance with suspiciously young boy? Or just good old fashioned bath house romp?
Anyone who is this upset about TEH GAYZ is upset for a very specific reason: self-hatred.
TBlake34 1 year ago 20
@TBlake34 your post made my day! THANKS for that! I was home sick with a cold, and you made me laugh and feel better. It was a very WISE thing to say. I agree that Ryan Sorba looks like a closeted mo. Those are cock sucking lips if I've ever seen them... Hell, I have no shame. I'd do him...!
lisztnut 1 year ago
Wow. So much hate towards people who have done no harm to him.
sleazybtd 1 year ago 3
@sleazybtd Correct. The conservative movement hates gays. I think any gay individual in attendance at that right wing conclave needs to have his head examined. It's like Jews attending a meeting of Nazis. Psychiatric help is definetly needed.
Loejyrrab 9 months ago
Haha, much as i dislike this guys politics i like his energy.
"Oh yeah? Bring it! I love it!"
enderwiggin42 1 year ago
To anyone who is a freedom loving person , realize this, your rights do not extend on other peoples. The GOP can make a life or death decision in 2012 pick the freedom loving candidate (Ron Paul) or some two bit neocon liar flipflopper anti gunner (Mitt Romney). Dr. Ron Paul can cure this countries problems with peace and freedom.
FromyColdeadHands 1 year ago
Why do they care what two men or two women do in the privacy of their own home? Who is this f*cking clown? He is probably a closeted gay man himself who is too ashamed to come out. Therefore, he needs to bash the brave gay men that have had the balls to come out (at the same he wishes those balls were in his mouth).
sonofsam70 1 year ago 2
can't believe there are group people more obsessed with what you do with your dick then yourself.
bigboss025 1 year ago 2
@gcsecsi
Do you not know that marriage can be done secularly, in front of a judge, preformed in a court of law, rather than in a church in front of a minister?
Did you know that the first amendment is a CLEAR separation of church and state and that you are acting unconstitutionally?
You wanna talk about the laws of God? Do you eat shellfish? Read the damn book it is an EQUAL SIN!!! If you eat at red lobster you might as well just have blown a man!
BusinessIDBAI 1 year ago
@gcsecsi
You're fucking stupid. By ALL accounts Europe is better off than we are. You need to look at some fucking statistics. Let's look at it economically, socially, industrially, educationally, Financially.
Europe has us beat by MILES. Maybe you're stupid in some 1950's delirium in which Europe is recovering from a world war, but that ain't the case now you dumb fuck.
Find me ONE statistic where the US is actually BETTER than Western Europe.
BusinessIDBAI 1 year ago 2
Great news about the health care bill, isn't it? One step closer to Socialism, and I'm ELATED!
lisztnut 1 year ago
"Why do you need the government to approve of it"
Because if the government doesn't approve of a same-sex marriage then according to records their relationship doesn't exist even though it's as real as the air we breath.
Your analogy has flaws in it... once you accept those flaws you can create a better analogy from something else. You should be able to think of something if you think logically.
They are not "better off with out" all these things. It's why they're wanted so badly.
sonic8005 1 year ago
@gcsecsi, Your ignorance never ceases to amaze me. Can an animal sign a marraige contract? Until it can, marriage between animal and human will NEVER happen.
And, I pray everyday that America becomes like Europe's social democracies. If Jesus answers me, I'll definitely change my opinion from "there is no god" to "MAYBE there is a god..."
lisztnut 1 year ago 2
You know absolutely nothign about any kind of species. If you can't see the difference between a same sex relationship and bestiality then you're officially retarded because you can't tell the difference between a horse and a human being.
You're arguing the slippery slope again. Somebody gives you a case of a country that has NOBODY asking for marriage with an animal yet here you are continuing with the bullshit argument.
It's two adults who are marrying. Two WILLING adults.
sonic8005 1 year ago
haha, the GOP is so united in cause
nemesis8722 1 year ago
Is that all you can come up with?
Many places in Europe gay marriage is legal. I have yet to find someone who wants to marry their dog.
Maybe it's a wet dream perverted RWers have
bohemianwriter1 1 year ago 6
NO, it's all about you and your "imaginary friend," and you wanted to IMPOSE this belief on ME. I won't have it, I tell you... Keep your god OUT of MY government... If you don't like gay marriage, don't marry someone of the same sex. So simple (just like your brain)...
lisztnut 1 year ago
was this guy just cutting a wrestling promo?
chriskoob 1 year ago
Abortion isn't murder. Never heard of "birthdays?" Why do we celebrate that? That's because that's when LIFE begins... Until you are born, you are a fetus, not a person. But, you knew that right?
lisztnut 1 year ago
Hey, I'd move to Canada way before I'd move to Florida. I HATE hot weather. I lived in the Caribbean for a year, and you can keep it... I can't handle weather like that... That's why your brain is so fried. Too much sun...
lisztnut 1 year ago
More ranting of a frustrated heterosexual... Such a waste of air and space...
lisztnut 1 year ago
How do you have time to get all up in my business? Like my marriage is any of YOUR business in the first place. You don't know what the word "freedom" means. It does NOT mean that we ALL must bow to YOUR version of god. That's NOT freedom. Freedom means if a Unitarian church wants to marry a gay couple it should be their FREEDOM and civil right to do so...
lisztnut 1 year ago
First off, god didn't make anything. Man crreated god in his own image, and I don't like what I see.... And, secondly, animals participate in homosexuality in larger percentages than humans, and it is NECESSARY to preserve the species.
lisztnut 1 year ago
You are totally IGNORANT of history, aren't you? Are you aware that 41 states had some form of ban on interracial marriage, and 70 percent of Americans were AGAINST it (that's more than oppose gay marriage today) when the Supreme Court invalidated all the bans. Interracial marriage became law in all 50 states right on the spot... We predict ths same with gay marriage, and it's all due to Prop 8, which is SWEET to me! All that Mormon money down the drain!
lisztnut 1 year ago
No, I'd MUCH rather stay here and fight for MY rights. So far, I have WON half of the battle, because I'm already legally married in CA, and that's not going away any time soon. Our next step is to eliminate DOMA so that every state will be forced to recognize it, and the Federal government too. That's coming. One step at a time..
Why don't you move to Iran since you like theocracies so much..?
lisztnut 1 year ago
Gay marriage has been legal in Canada for several years now, and guess what? NOBODY FRICKEN CARES any more. They think we're INSANE to fight over something so trivial...
lisztnut 1 year ago 2
And, why are you so interested in our sex lives anyway? That's what I can never understand. If you want gays to go back in the closet, then ignore us. That's all we want too. We want to LEGAL rights that come with marriage, and then you can forget about it. If I'm in the hospital I want my husband to make my life and death decisions NOT my parents, who live 2500 miles away... And, my husband should inherit my estate when I die too...
lisztnut 1 year ago
And, sorry, but you're again displaying your utter ignorance (bible based). Animals can't agree to marry humans, so beastiaity is forever banned for good reason. Same with young children... We're talking about two HUMANS here, dingbat...
lisztnut 1 year ago
That's funny coming from someone who lives in Miami, which is like the third most GAY city in America... Do you go out to South Beach much? Key West...? And, NO, my husband and I don't particpate in sick behavior. We have a VERY good sex life, just for your info, and most definitely BETTER than YOUR sex life.. I'm SURE of it...
And, Florida will go as the nation goes, if the Supreme Court so deems it. More Americans support gay marriage today than supported interracial when it was banned.
lisztnut 1 year ago
Glad you accepted the fact that abortion is exclusively a heterosexual female phenomenon. Gay men have nothing to do with abortion unless they perform them. You need to OWN that this is a heterosexual issue...
lisztnut 1 year ago
@gcsecsi
Look up the "slippery slope" fallacy. Damn, can you give something other than dated bullshit?
Seriously, you can't tell the difference between homosexuality and beastiality. Are you THAT confused?
sonic8005 1 year ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
@gcsecsi
"I am not a scholar, just a believer."??
"There our no other explanations why we live in a perfectly created world"??
"Old Testamnet which has no bearing on what Christ taught"??
"I do know that my God is good God and he works miracles for me on a daily basis."??
"I think it is clearly a chosen lifestyle since it is not consdered acceptable behavior by well over halt the the voting public."??
You should probably reflect upon these statements... and more...
TLydon007 1 year ago
And I don't speak for all fags, but THIS fag:
1 Supports the right of EVERY heterosexual woman to have an abortion
2 Supports the right of EACH and EVERY American to have health care, just like the rest of the industrialized world. America is behind THIRD world countries when it comes to health care. And, it's a DISGRACE....
One more thing. Were you born stupid or is it your "lifestyle" choice?
lisztnut 1 year ago
Just for the record: fags don't have abortions. Only heterosexuals have abortions... STUPID!
lisztnut 1 year ago
And, I'm already married, so you LOST this debate. Six states (including DC) have gay marriage now, and this is NOT going backwards. You will LOSE this fight eventually. My hope is that Prop 8 will be the ticket for fags in Florida to marry. Can't WAIT!
lisztnut 1 year ago
Nobody cares what you think. Did you ever think of that? I don't like your chosen fake-Christian lifestyle (and that IS a choice) either, but does that mean I have the right to vote on whether you are a Christian? Of course not. Your problem is you have NO brains and NO logic. You're just plain DUMB. It's like arguing with a tree... 70 percent of the public were against interracial marriage when it became legal, so I could care less what the public thinks. That's why we have courts idiot!
lisztnut 1 year ago
this is annoying. they bring up issues like this so we argue with each other instead of going after them for losing lives and treasure in unwinnable wars. and democrats and republicans are stupid enough to fall for it
mizzoulibertarian 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@gcsecsi
"I think it is clearly a chosen lifestyle since it is not consdered acceptable behavior by well over halt the the voting public. Personally I don't care what you do, just don.t ask me to accept it or legitimize it!"
You know, people didn't think it was "acceptable behavior" and that WAS the majority back when it came to the idea that being left-handed was considered wrong.
You don't get to say "I don't care" when you're screaming your fucking head off about it.
sonic8005 1 year ago
@gcsecsi
You said it in a comment replying directly to me.
Suddenly a comment said TO me isn't directed at me? So, either you can't read who you're responding to and calling "the buddy of Listnut" when I was the only other one aside from you guys... or you can't read who you're replying to when you comment.
There's no way around it, you STILL fail...
sonic8005 1 year ago
And, people who are TRULY godfearing people do NOT use such terms:
fags, bloodsucking maggots. You are NOT a Christian in ANY sense of the word.... PHONY...
lisztnut 1 year ago
Correction: There is NO such thing as a "gay lifestyle."
It's like saying "male lifestyle" or "female lifestyle." You are only showing your incredIble IGNORANCE to use such a nonsense term. How's that male lifestyle going for you?
lisztnut 1 year ago
That's what those gays get for going to a "Conservative" conference.
What the fuck were they doing there anyway?? Why would they even WANT to be there?? They should know better.
Log Cabin Idiots.
CuteZootSuit 1 year ago
Believe it or not, the TRUE meaning of Conservative means that government should get OUT of our private lives. The Repugs have forgotten this principle. There is an article called:
The Conservative Case for Gay Marriage, by Ted Olson
Well worth reading... But, I agree with you otherwise... The current Repug party has been taken over by nutjobs, and they've lost their way. Tea baggers...LOL!
lisztnut 1 year ago
Oh, and "Repug" is short for Repugnant... Just made that up...
lisztnut 1 year ago
@gcsecsi
He's not my "buddy". You can't tell me my lifestyle or my beliefs are wrong when you're accusing me of being some kind of vampire... that's retarded.
If you don't want peple making fun of you don't leave yourself wide open.
sonic8005 1 year ago
If I were a Christian, I'd be ashamed to belong to the same belief system as you... You're a disgrace to all good Christians.
lisztnut 1 year ago
You are NOT a Christian. You are a phony. REAL Christians don't talk like this:
You said: fag boy... What's wrong with being a fag? That's NO insult:
1 Fags have MORE education than striaghts
2 Fags earn MORE money than straights
3 Fags travel MORE than straights
4 Fags have BETTER sex MORE often than straights It seems to me that BREEDER is more of an insult than fag...
lisztnut 1 year ago
If you're talking about the "being forced to marry the rapist" bit... it DID happen.
And your God condoned it long ago... he actually had it written that way.
It's still in your holy book, and we're told that EVERYTHING your god says is supposed to be right and holy... yet instead, we get something that anybody can tell you is messed up.
sonic8005 1 year ago
Your god kills innocent babies.
If you believe in "god's plan" or that your days have been planned ahead... you believe that God plans every single miscarriage.
Every miscarriage counts as an abortion by God himself... abortion being a crime in your opinion... this makes God the worst abortionist ever. Because he doesn't even want the woman's consent. He just simply decides when the fetus dies.
sonic8005 1 year ago
.... It's not out of context.
You can't cop out with "out of context". When you look at violence in the Quran you attribute that as horrible and disgusting.
You instead throw this away and pretend it's not in the Bible. You bitch about a lack of research, when you should've known these passages existed in the first place.
A "good" entity wouldn't have ordered the deaths of pregnant women.
You don't have any other gods to compare him to in your cult, you HAVE to label him as "good".
sonic8005 1 ye