The absolute truth is the interdependence of life, the entanglement of all and everything in the language of quantum physics. Capitalism is the historic process of PRIVATE PROPERTY RELATIONSHIP OF ALIENATION,EXPLOITATION AND SUFFERING OF HUMANITY in a modality of commodity production with the sole motive of profit in a WORLD MARKET MECHANISM of ARTIFICIAL SCARCITY,, DISTORTION AND DESTRUCTION. The critical majority shall emerge and create the awrenes and the awakening.
i think friedman is badly misunderstood. As any economist he was against monopolies and oligopolies, and he was for freedom. Like any doctrine, friedman's has been distorted, possibly by people who never bothered to read what he wrote or listen to what he said.
However, he did hang out with the worst politicians, so he deserves a bit of blame...
World capitalism is organised legalised robbery of the energy of immense humanity in a monetary web of control,exploitation and deception.Capitalism no mater what model of government is the template of domination of death over life. We need to get rid of this pathological destructive system for a world of cooperation for our coomon needs and well being in harmony within and without.
Peter Joseph courageously embodies the humanistic / scientific enlightenment of the 21 st century. He has grasped the very inner structrual contradictions of the CAPITALIST/MONETARY system and his revolutionary call for a WORLD OF COOPERATION FOR OUR COMMON NEEDS AND WELL BEING should be the CONSTITUTION OF NEW HUMANI CIVIILISATION. My deepest respect to my brother P.Joseph. in Zetgeist for Venus Project, Time to make history democratically,consciously and globally
@arzoyan And what do you and Peter have in store for people like me, people who don't want to "cooperate" and participate in your "revolutionary" vision? What will you do when you cannot implement this vision democratically? I'm guessing I won't like the answer...
@cf40409 A majority democratic movement of no leaders no followers to share the Earth in cooperation for our common needs and well being. Hope one day you will join us and if not hope all the best in a tyrannical MARKET SYSTEM OF ARTIFICIA SCARCITY and manipulation.
@arzoyan Am I correct in understanding your intentions to leave me out of this final solution? If so, then I have no quarrel with you, just a difference of opinion. I am interested to hear you say that this "movement" has "no leaders no followers." Does not your strident defense of this movement make you a "follower"? What about scarcity is artificial? We live in a world with finite resources, do we not? Scarcity will be a defining feature of any system, be it "tyrannical" or otherwise.
@cf40409 Its a principled stance for for a majority democratic movment for change. You should make a distinction between Artificial scarcity as a market mechanism of manipulation for the material interest of elite OWNERS/RULERS. and a Universe that Time is limited and so the resources on Earth . We have the means for plenty in harmony, CAPITALISM IS ORGANISED SUFFERING.
@arzoyan I want change too, but not the kind of change you are talking about. In a free market, the price of a good/service is a direct reflection of the demand and supply of a particular good/service. This is called the market price. In a competitive free market system, it is in the material interests of the "owners" to set a competitive price, if they want to stay in business. Thus, the interests of the "owners" and of the consumers are both served by this system.
@arzoyan My response may sound evasive, so I will continue. There appears to be a contradiction between the principle of freedom of choice and of equality and "harmony"; it may be impossible to have it both ways. Do we want to live in a society in which people are free to choose to indulge in the fruits of their labor however they see fit, or should the goal of society be to restrict freedom of choice in the hopes of bringing about a more equitable share of the fruits of our collective labor ?
@cf40409 Employment system of the wage slavery of the working class is to perpetuate the class rule of the elite. Work as evolving ,creative interaction of our common humanity for our common needs and well being shall transform the narrow and artificial distinctions that helps to maintain the illusions of choice and freedom.
@arzoyan Well, as you know, this is not a new idea. It used to be a revolutionary idea, and it sounds alright if you don't think about its history. People found out very quickly what happens when you give up economic freedom, that is, freedom to choose how to spend one's earned money: the loss of political freedom. While you appear to have good intentions, its the other people I'm worried about; human greed and self-interest will prevent this communitarian system from being desirable.
So this would apply to how the New Deal was pushed in after the 1929 crash? And how Obama pushed through the bailouts and Obamacare after the housing crash?
Do you understand the difference between firemen rushing in to save a family who's house is on fire and opportunists rushing in to take advantage of them?
She's talking about crony capitalism, not free markets. Don't get Friedman involved in this. Military industrial complex being enhanced by Iraq occupation? Go right ahead
america never had a form of 'free' market economy as described by friedman...so the whole argument attacking friedman's principles falls flat without holding any water!
@psspeed this is not the argument presented, the argument goes like this. Friedman sets freemarket as a goal but in practicality it has only come about by setting in motion a shock doctrine. Plus it cannot be called freemarket since the implemented policies (statutory laws) are bastardly claiming freedom for their paternity ie. extorsion, duress
@epsilon8998 'true scottsman' is a vague term used to defend 'scottsman'. I am not just throwing in 'true capitalism' in my argument. I am saying objectively that america doesn't have the free market system where government is devoid of any role in regulation, creation, or manipulation of businesses/economy. If a bank is going bankrupt, you let it go. You don't use tax payers money to bail it out. the word 'free market' is a term of certitude, unlike true scottsman.
@psspeed Please give some empirical examples of an actual existing "free market system" that is "devoid of any [government] role in regulation" and also define what it means to have regulation. How is government regulation different from corporate regulation?
@epsilon8998 very specific example i could think of is "performance based contracting in highway construction and maintenance". these new forms of contract which, unlike the traditional method based contracting, doesn't dictate what material should go into the construction or what equipments to be used, or what thickness the road should be... the contractor is free to do whatever he wants....he can bring in his own innovative techniques to optimise his profits....
@psspeed How is that an example of a free market? I was talking about an entire country that fits that description, not specific policies on road management. And what's to say that the contractor won't cut back on his costs by using less asphalt to pave over the new road and fix potholes and use visual trickery to make it look like he did, thus increasing his profits, but also increasing the danger to drivers. Isn't that a form of "dictating" to drivers that their risks have to increase?
@epsilon8998 contd..(1)...the only restriction is tht the ultimate product cannot have any potholes, undulations etc. which would make the road users(consumers) lose their valuable time, damage their vehicles etc.Fine will be inflicted proportional to the loss to the consumers.This type of govt. intervention to protect consumer rights is even advocated by Friedman.This method is gaining widespread acceptance for its effectiveness and swiftness in the output and has been adopted by many DOTs.....
@psspeed And this is not really a free market anyway: it's just a policy adjustment. It still exists in the context of a system of government funded road management and construction, and a government funded (fully or partially) education system, and a government managed bureaucracy that regulates driving standards, as well as a government operated police system to enforce the rules. How is this the "free market" at all?...
@epsilon8998@epsilon8998 contd..(2).. Contrast this with the traditional govt. regulated construction industry which has stringent clauses like past turnover of the company, equipments owned etc, which prevent new players from entering the field, favouring the big shots. Of course, ‘free market’ is a goal which we should strive to achieve instead of slaying towards socialism hindering the progress of mankind.
@psspeed ... You still have not said what the difference is between corporate and government regulation. What is the difference other than arbitrary property rights?
@epsilon8998 example 2: since the airline deregulation act of 1978, due to open competition, by 1999, the airfares fell by 25% ; airline operators doubled from 43 to 90.
@psspeed Yeah, maybe that, but it's come at the cost of reducting the wages of airline workers and pilots to record lows, and destroying the power of unions during the Regan years.
@psspeed No. airline fares have gone up and now we are seeing the elimination of many of the customer service perks (frequent flier mileage, baggage discounts etc.). More operators? Tell that to Eastern Airlines or Laker Airlines, both victims of the price wars. Friedman was a scummy little con artist whose father fucked up running a textile factory in Rahway, NJ back in the twenties when the US was king in textile manufacturing and New Jersey speciffically was a leader in this field.
america never had a form of government as described by hitler...so the whole argument attacking hitler's principles falls flat without holding any water!
@psspeed The closest we had ever been to a totally free market was in the early stages of the Republic. By the mid 1800's through the first decades of the industrial revolution America was a mess. Slave labor, child labor, monopolies price fixing and the like. I think you should learn a little American history instead of regurgitating the corporate propaganda you subject yourself to.
I actually like some of what Friedman says. But, this chick speaks absolute truth about the true motive of the Iraq invasion. It's too easy. The IMF had no power in Irag and Iran. Now what is the US aim? The invasion of Iran. It's basically the way global bankers will run the world.
no logo changed my life, because I realized I didn't have to shave my head and live in the woods. I could make small changes in how and where I purchased food and clothes by buying locally, and even boycott things on a local level. The book is very exciting.
Naomi Klein is lying about what Friedman believed. He believed that FREEDOM should drive every aspect of life. The little film they show with pictures of Nixon, Bush etc. are designed to imply that Friedman approved the policies of Nixon and Bush, etc. What garbage.
Agreed. Actually, Nixon seems more Keynesian. Moreover, terms like "free trade", or even "Capitalism" shouldn't be used interchangeably with corporatism IMO, because it ignors what the problem is.
I mean, I try to give Klein credit but she comes across as another Michael Moore at times
I know T. Roosevelt very well and the circumstances he was up against. I don't believe in any donations by corporations, lobbyist or special interest groups. I also think political campaining should be limited to a certain amount of time before the election. There is no reason for campainging to begin a year or more before the actual election.
Its better to upturn cars and destroy property than to organize? I think that the reason why Europe has had an emigrant (muslim) problem is because of the policy of "beneficient neglect" practiced after World War II in so many European host nations. So, the issue of "improper" assimilation policy had a lot to do with the perception of disenfranchisement, from one generation of immigrant group to the next. In America, assimilation seems to have worked quite well, but Ms. Klein would say no.
Does this bitch think that disasters havent been used by the left to take advantage of people? of course it has.. and Friedman's ideas are "radical" at all, they are based on the idea that no one is better at deciding what you need than you.. and also that it is immoral to force someone to do something (pay taxes).. She is crazy and plain incorrect
she's incorrect in that she says, we can do good by taking other people's money and spending it on other people.. she judges government and wealth redistribution strategies based on their intent and not their outcome.. so many programs like social security, medicare, and minimum wage are put in place with the idea of improving the lives of the lower and middle class, but these programs often do the exact opposite.. we need to judge programs based on results, not goals
@lobsterman91 Well if they're failures, you've yet to demonstrate how. Nor is it to correct she doesn't measure outcome., only intent. The burden of proof is on the Right that attack her book anyway. They can't if she quotes what's on the public record, including articles in the press or speeches.
Competition in a political economy of a Market system of artificial scarcity that perpetuate the conditions of the wage slavery of immense humanity for the abstract process of Capital accumulation and concentration is INSANE,NEGATIVE,DESTRUCTIVE,DEHUMANISING,DEVALUING,DISTORTING OF ALL LIVING VIBRATION. By sharing the Earth in cooperation for our common needs and well being we shall transcend and bring about a new paradigm of Oness negating the destructive legacy of CLASS,MONEY,STATE
unless all of these ideas make it into mainstream beliefs then the majority of people will remain blissfully unaware. change lies with the majority of people but most dont care about how they are governed as long as they are fine. and so our hope for a better world wains...
a corporate charter is primarily based on "maximizing profits while externalizing costs"..........
............considering that this charter is not subservent to the human condition, community well being or responsible use of resources...........then this mandate has now passed a threashold within developed societies that is sociopathic in its consequences the World and its inhabitants........
the New Deal the greatest restriction on capitalism in 20th century America and presumably beloved by Ms. Klein that was imposed in a time of crisis. Many of the crises of the 20th century resulted from anti-capitalistic policies, rather than from capitalism: China was falling apart because of the murderous and tyrannical policies of Chairman Mao, which then led to bottom-up demands for capitalistic reforms; New Zealand and Chile abandoned socialistic policies for freer markets .
@examinfo Agree. We should write a book "Shock Doctrine: The Rise of Disaster Socialism." Government intervention on the free market after economic crisis only prolongs and deepens problems! The New Deal was bad! People should research the Depression of 1920 which was more severe than than the year 1929 (Great Depression), yet only lasted a little over a year! Why? No government intervention!
@cabgt You are suffering from cerebral myopia and disney fairytale of roller coaster in your perceptions of facts. State has always been an instrument of force in the hand of the ruling elite in its insatiable drive for control and dominance, ask yourself why USA has over 130 millitary bases and millitary presence in 77 countries,? TO MANAGE THE WORLD RESOUCES FOR ITS RULING ELITE.
@arzoyan Capitalism and free-market does not encourage war, but peace. Socialism kills and destroys society. History shows this. It is not debatable. Does America have freemarket capitalism? No, just growing government and welfare as did the Roman Empire - both which free-market capitalists (people who believe in freedom) are against. Move to Venezuela or Cuba if there it is so much better
@cabgt Listen to Eisenhower's warning about the military industrial compled. No wars they don't make money. As for socialism, do you mean
Soviet style? That would of course bad. Democratic Socialism? Sweden hasn't been in a war for a couple hundred years. I don't see Norway or the Netherlands rattling sabers ant anyone.......and please do not say Hitler was a socialist. The National Socialist were socialist in name only, one of his first acts was to purge the party of true socialist.
No, Hitler was a socialist. If you read Karl Popper's "The open society and its enemies" (the volume on Karl Marx's social economic project), this will be made abundantly clear. Since the end of World War I, most of Europe has only known one form of socialism or other. The entitlement-welfarism that informs so much of European socialism has come up against considerable challenge, practically and theoretically. What must it be like to see a cradle to grave system as no longer sustainable?
@whiff1962 Hitler most certainly was not a socialist. Go read an actual history of the Nazi era. The best is the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. The industrialist and big business people loved Hitler b/c of his anti labor policies. The first people sent of to those early concentration camps were suspected communists and trade union leaders. He hated communism. The National Socialist were socialist in name only, those who too the 'socialist' part to seriously were purged from the party.
@xexixk I would beg to differ with you. The NASDP could not have had the successes it did unless it was at least pallitable by the "average" German. The only difference I would note between Communism and Naziism (Fascism), is in the "exportability" of Communism, and the decidedly nationalist flavor of the latter. Other than that, both were cut from the same socio-historical cloth. Read Karl Popper for a deeper analysis, and you might come to re-evaluate.
@whiff1962 Communism rejects the idea of private ownership, Facsism doesn't - read Mussolini's definition of facsism. Socialism had nothing to do with those who supported Hitler. They supported him because of his ferverent nationalism and promises to restore German glory and avenge the humiliations of the first World War.
@xexixk You are mixing your apples and oranges with this argument. My contention is that socialism is the common parent; the siblings being communism and socialism. By any other name, both Naziism and Communism shared a common intellectual history, and whether one "allowed" private ownership, while the other didn't, is but one contrast among many commonalities.
@whiff1962 Also, communism, at least on paper, stresses that all people are equals. An idea which is rejected by fascism. Any claim that tyranny is only capable of coming from the far reaches of one side of the political spectrum is false.
Communism on paper, to set the record straight, says nothing of this morally loaded assertion of equality, as you seem to assert. Remember, Communism is an economic system, and as such, concerns itself with human behavior. Communism never asserted any "equality", after all, what credence would "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" have, if equality were the intended end? Even the staunchest Communist would differ with your assessment. What of individual striving?
@whiff1962 I'm not speaking of works of communist theorey so much as the laws of formally communist countries. In the Soviet Union, legally, everyone was equal, but in practice of course they were not - old ethnic divisions and so forth still persisted. And 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs' does indeed ascert a sense of equality among all - that one person shall not do with out while another person does with too much.
@xexixk Yes, equality before the law, and compulsory voting. I do see the handy work in present-day America, with the liberal-left and its radical, "progressive" utopian engineering. I see it in my own former career in the mental health field, with its decidely collectivist trends, as in the community based mental health services. I got out when I realized that I was altering the individual to alter the social. I suppose universal mental health screening is good for the "public" good, right?
@whiff1962 Remember, utopian promises - depending upon what one considers to be utopia - can come from the left or the right. I see nothing decidely leftist going on these days. Wall Street bail outs aren't leftist. A government still under the thumb of corporate and special interests isn't leftist. There's really no difference between the two parties, they are just different sides of the same coin.
Wall Street bail outs are fascistic, right? Just like Naomi says. Or is that "corporatist"? I suppose the term corporate socialism means nothing to you; it obviously does for the Obama administration; its textbook socialism, call it what you may. As for the two parties being one, I do have to agree with you on that. That is why I am for maximizing individual freedom, and no initiating of violence by the state against the individual, with the intent of diminishing said freedoms! And your state?
@whiff1962 Moreover, for your information, Corporations enjoy many of the same rights under U.S. federal and state laws, as those of the individual. So, looks like that might be something to wrap your head around.
@whiff1962 I'm aware of the status of corporations and I never said I liked it or agree with it. In fact I hate it. That is where the real power lies in this country. DC takes it's marching orders from corporate interests b/c of campaign contributions, etc. It's nothing more than legalized bribary.
@whiff1962 Yes, thats what I said about campaign contributions and corporate control and both parties being the same. I'd never say it was just one of them. They are both the same. You don't seem to get that I'm beating up on both parties here. As for the BP exec, in some other countries their CEO would have been arrested and I wouldn't mind that at all.
@whiff1962 I said both parties were the same in truth, which you seemed to agree with. You are the one who brought up the subject of mental health issues. I don't think any contradictions lie with me, sorry.
@xexixk Who do you think gave the permission to drill some 1000 wells off of the Gulf? You are at least aware of the sheer number of wells, coastly in the U.S? The state, as you would say, has been hoodwinked, and if necessary, wined and dined into sleeping with big business? How might it strike if I assert that it is likewise the very presence of state bureaucracy that both facilitates and exacerbates these "BP" momements? However, you do seem steadfast in the illusion of a "beneficient" state.
So how does make the corporate and state relationship equitable again? Should the state own ALL the means of production? What of individual economic self-determination; what of the very nature of American democracy, in this radical, revolutionary vision? But of what, exactly? What is then your alternative? What practical measures would you implement? What of our society's instutitions, as the basis of our free and open society? Do you actually think that the individual can decide for himself?
@whiff1962 No I don't believe that the government should own all means of production. I do, however, agree with what Teddy Roosevelt said, "Let individuals contribute as they desire; but let us prohibit in effective fashion all corporations from making contributions for any political purpose, directly or indirectly."
@xexixk What about lobby groups? U.S. govt. and lobbyism are inextricably bound, but who is to draw the line on the latter? Moreover, if you knew your history, you would know that T. Roosevelt was up against a much different set of circumstances than today. If the U.S. had a president similiar to him, we'd be living in a statist society. Just look at the bureaucracies that sprang up under his watch.
"CEO would have been arrested and I wouldn't mind that at all." I think we know where your empathies lie. As for your knocking both parties, you seem to be contradicting your earlier assertion that both parties are really one. So, which is it? Yeah, I have talked to a lot of decidedly statist types as yourself, but not as anti-democratic.
@whiff1962 Teddy Roosevelt also advocated holding the officers of corporations personally responsible. I'm most certainly not anti-democratic. I haven't even said what I think the role of the state is or should be so your attempts to divine my beliefs have failed. What is difficult to understand about their being no real differences between the two parties? Power - getting and keeping it - is the primary objective of both parties, not actually doing anything.
@whiff1962 Both parties have their offical platforms, but that is just for show, their real objective is power. All of the fighting between this is just a spectacle for our amusment. It's all for show.
@whiff1962 I didn't say wall street bailouts are a good thing. I'm fully away of what corporate socialism or corporate welfare is but that is not the same thing as the political/ecomonic theory of socialsim as state ownership of the means of production and distribution. Remember, the right in the country in the past have provided their share of corporate welfare too. I'm not saying I agree with it, just pointing it out.
@whiff1962 I don't believe in compulsory mental health 'screening' unless someone is actually having real mental health issues. Some of these so called emotional disorders are nothing more than made up 'diseases.' Don't forget who helps to promote them and encourage people to seek 'help': big pharma industries b/c they make a fortune off of selling anti depressants and other psychiatric meds. They would have everyone of us on prozac if they could to increase their profits.
@xexixk I didn't mention "compulsory"; that would have not been an adequate trap. No, not compulsory, but universal, and heavily promoted by a network of cooperting agencies, all tied to one thing. The liberal psychiatric enterprise is run by equally liberal, do-gooder, types. The entire paradigm that now animates psychiatry, namely, the pharmacalogic myth of mental illness, is no less the brainchild of your beloved liberal, "progressive" mental hygienists, going back some fifty years.
@whiff1962 I never said I loved anything or anyone and if you look back at my comment you will see that I said many of those 'diseases' are fake. Now, there are real mental diseases. I've real ones - sschizophrenia, etc. But ADD, etc. I reject, the pharm industry makes a killing by selling rittalin for supposed ADD kids and it's wrong.
@whiff1962 Good lord guy, I've never even said where my personal politics lie. Have you just missed all of the criticisms I just gave of contemporary psychology and the pharm industry creating fake 'diseases'?
@xexixk You can reject them all you want, that doesn't stop the liberal, do-gooders wanting to find the treatments for the very myth they promulgate: that of mental illness. The social, economic and political ramifications (never mind the ethical and moral) of funding all that concerns itself with the treatment for ALL "afflicted" with mental illness, is staggering. What kind of culture do you think your ideological brethren seek to effect with this altering of the individual? At what cost?
@whiff1962 Fact: Go too far to the left you end up with tyranny...go too far to the right you end up with tyranny....Stalin, Mao, etc. came from the far left, .... Hitler, Mussolini, Franco etc. came from the far right
Naomi Klein should die a horrible death for lying to people. It is not capitalism and free markets that cause poverty and economic problems. Its the fact that since the depression we have been imposing keynesian economics to our economy in this country (US). Look at the results! The economy is much too complicated to educate amateur commentators on youtube in a few comments. People should do more research before they buy anything this stupid bitch says.
@MrXZodiacInfinitY I agree with you... Research on both sides,, Investigate with open mind... The countries with most economic freedom is the wealtiest.. China privatized their economy in 1978,, search "China growth" on google and look at the graph,, People are so much more free in China today, than they were before privatization...
Why does it matter that she is cute? Do people say that when Noam Chomsky starts talking or any other political activist? Who cares what she looks like isn't her message enough? My god!
@MarilynFilth She is not cute.. She is a bimbo. There is a difference. I live in the same city as her, I've seen her give speeches multiple times, read her "No Logo" book. Garbage. She is a cheap shot, riding the commie wave, bitching about obvious problems without offering any constructive solutions, and making top dollars on it. She is profiting from the overzealous commies the same way as anti-abortion groups profit from photos dead fetus.
@akayami77 Bullshit. She's both cute and intelligent and should have won the Nobel Prize that was given to the repulsive, neo fascist little prick Milton "Scumbag" Friedman. The Chicago school of nazism, economic terror, government subversion, union busting and low paid labor have had their way with their ideas. The result? Declining wages, jobs outsourcing, excessive tax cuts for the wealthy. JFK, RFK and MLK caught the bullets that should have gotten Friedman, Ayn Rand and Leo Strauss.
Naomi Klein is a dumb bimbo selling the usual shallow left propaganda... Milton Friedman has always said that Capitalism does not guarantee Liberty, yet, Liberty cannot exists without Capitalism. In other words, if you want a free society, Capitalism is a required ingredient of it. There are other ingrediens but Capitalism is one of them. I do not get it why she gets so much attention. Her stuff is so shallow, it's ridiculous. She is a good speaker, but really lacks depth. It's a trend I guess..
@akayami77 Liberty exists in Germany, Sweeden and France. Also UK which has a more socialist ideology.
Only an American can think that an ideology where the top 1% of the world making more money off the backs of the blue colour people is a good system of Government.
You know how long Capitalism has been around compared to fair legitimate trade? Just because you do not live in a Capitalist Country does not mean it can not prosper. You are the dumb bimbo.
@MarilynFilth Well, I was born in continental Europe and I've spend most of my life tasting fruits of that "liberty". Americans are actually far less "laissez-faire" capitalist than they're said to be. US gov. while slightly better than most European gov. is still a far cry from a small, lightweight government that Milton Friedman was always advocating. Nowadays, we're facing an always growing gov. and always shrinking middle class... Do you see the correlation ?
@akayami77 Yours is an example of an incredibly lazy and shallow argument which doesn't even bother to engage with what it means to be a free society. Friedman's belief in the abolition of all trade barriers has been discredited even to his disciples (save perhaps for some armchair populists) To sum up anything that questions neoliberal values as "shallow left propaganda" is a sad reflection on yourself and you do yourself a further disservice with ignorant phrases such as "dumb bimbo"
@onesy1 Friedman polices have not been implemented because no gov. has balls to do unpopular, yet necessary changes. It's very easy for politicians to cater to narrow groups for support in exchange for socially unfair policies. Sadly, politicians from both sides have been whoring their positions for support, instead of doing the long term necessary for their country. Sometimes, doing the best, is not doing anything, especially regarding the economy.
@akayami77 Your argument (an argument made by Schmitt and appropriated by Hayek) is essentially one which reduces government to a technocratic issue, the efficacy of which can best be measured by its resemblance to market transactions in the private sector. Your assault on 'narrow groups' (insert 'special interests' i.e. class and 'old elites') amounts to the same attacks on democracy made in Weimar Germany. No doubt you are an advocate of Pinochet?
@onesy1 Narrow groups such as Unions, Trade associations, Corporations etc. that extract regulations that allow them to abuse the rest of society... Free market puts natural rules that prevent narrow groups from abusing others. Regulations distort natural rules, and allow some groups to tilt the table in their advantage. Natural economical competition is replaced by political competition where money is exchanged for regulations.
@akayami77@akayami77 "Free market" doesn't prevent narrow groups from abusing others. With nobody to uphold labour laws, who's to stop people from driving down wages indefinitely? Laws restrict 'natural rules' by outlawing the right to kill. Natural is not a justification for anything. In the absence of government, all legislation would be determined by the extremely narrow interests of those with money to back it up. How would this be a change for the better?
@onesy1 BTW, it's hard to be more profound in 500 characters. She gave a 50min interview, and 2 books, and still said nothing. Just constant bitching...
Capitalism is the wage slavery of immense humanity in a politically corrupt,manipulated MARKET SYSTEM OF ARTIFICIAL SCARCITY ,a tyrannical,destructive system to perpetuate poverty and exploitation in the interest of the ruling class. Capitalism from its mercantile plundering and enslavement of African natives to its Millitaristic rise of European Powers to World wars and Financial serfdom of the world has been a DISASTEROUS imposition .
@arzoyan where did you grow up? capitilism had alotted men the incentive to drive society and culture in a way unprecendented by any other economic philosophy of our time or in histories record..what drives the biologists, chemists and slew of other industry professionals to develop life saving pharmacueticals, treatments and technologies that have saved more human lives than can be estimated?what has driven food producers to increase there output of consummables..
@arzoyan or inspired the innovation of the layman to develop devices and means..ie.computer..car..airplane that ultimately changes the world as we know it ? the scary thing is you already know the answer but devoid of any rational insight you will arbitrarily spew your socialist view points.. a view point that has been proven time and time again through the ages to fail and end in misery for all who participate, the wake itself which extends that devastation to the innocent..
@shockw You are not making any senseible arguement, I am suggesting a democratic majority conscious change for a world of cooperation where our needs and well being are not snared by minority for their insatiable drive for accumulation and concentration of power and wealth.
@arzoyan Oh, I see, tyranny of the majority...and those who never got over his narcissistic hang over. I very much doubt that any "majority" willingly gives up its individual and collective wealth to the work shy and lazy.
@whiff1962 You are recycling the ideological lies,distortions and lies of your owners, your mind is colonised for commercial use, your little ego lost in disney myth making and wall street servitude.
@arzoyan I think that I fair a lot better in the imperfection of Capitalism, than in your crackpot, socialist(?) Utopia. As for the "recycling" bit, I say, what of your plastering videos with your "cut and paste" drivel? You make such bold, sweeping assertions, on what you consider to be the "good" society, however, history has proven your ilk wrong, time and again. I suggest you go back to living under your rock.
@arzoyan My "owners"? And who are your keepers, in your "stateless" and "moneyless" society? Why do you even bother to respond to this video, given your decidely anarchistic bent? Klein is a socialist-statist, so I find your posts on this video to be non sequitor and out of place. Now go spend your state dole, and leave the economy to the rest of us.
@whiff1962 "socialist-statist" is a contradiction in term, your distorted self is the energetic reality of world capitalism, destructive,exploitative,dehumanising,devaluing all and everything. go and consume your little ego.
@arzoyan Socialist-statist is NOT a contradiction, nor is redundant. Naomi Klein labors under the same misapprehension that the one can make an appeal to the "better nature" of the state, to serve the greater good. In essence, Klein believes that "popular" appeal to the more beneficient aspects of the state are the means of addressing all manner of injustice and inequality. I say that such an appeal is both Socialist and Statist, hence, the use of the recognized term "Socialist-statism."
@whiff1962 Socialism has always meant A WORLD HUMANITY SHARING THE EARTH IN COOPERATION, a moneyless,classless,stateless communities taking care of our needs,wellbeing and creative energies in harmony within and without, the enemies of humanity have distorted, are distorting the democratic revolutionary ideas for the material interest of the ruling class, Naomi is just one little girl in the horrific wonderland of world capitalism, confused and lost.
@arzoyan Where do you think such innovation, creativity and material gain come to be fostered in the first place? Look at all the great innovators and producers, and you will find that it was the free-market, with the consumer as captain of the ship, that brought the world its unprecedented wealth. Its funny how you call out others for their greed, when, in fact, your own personal greed figures no less importantly. You do strike me as a middle-aged, socially and economically disaffected, idiot.
@arzoyan Under your "egalitarianism", I would be compelled to give up my private property, and, in a real sense my freedoms. Yes, your so-called "sharing" society would bode well for the likes of the economically disaffected and cynical, but I don't see how any notion of "democracy" would figure in your radical transformations. Secular evangelicalism a scientific-socialist claptrap.
@whiff1962 In a world that is so nourishing, we are conditioned to fear for our little possession, its the fear of having versus the freedom of being.
@arzoyan Like my "having" a good education and good intellect; and you, of "being" uneducated and dim-witted? Is this the ostensible dichotomy of which you speak? Try reading p. 235 of Ludwig Von Mises fourth edition of "Human action". There is no full flower of (communistic) "freedom" that will do away with the realm of necessity. As for the rest of your hamstrung "thinking", I say, humbug to your metaphysical claptrap.
@whiff1962 You are shadow bxing with your distorted self, CAPITALISM IS THE HISTORIC EVOLUTION OF THE TYRANNY OF PRIVATE PROPERTY RELATIONSHIP OF ALIENATION,EXPLOITATION AND SUFFERING OF HUMANITY IN A MODALITY OF MONETARY SERFDOM. STOP PARROTING YOUR OWNERS.
Were do you expressly set forth your "programmatic" plan of social and economic justice? You are glib, certainly as pertains to your vapid arguments about "exploitation", etc. I very much doubt that you make for a sound and logical argument, merely by waxing "revolutionary" in your diction. Your responses, on a variety of YT videos, are truly undecipherable. I really don't think that you know what you are saying; Just the same indescriminate spraying of your pseudo-intellectual ejaculate.
@arzoyan Please, get your facts straight before you make silly comments. Mercantilism is not capitalism. Capitalism is not enslavement. Capitalism promotes freedom and free markets (human will and mutual benefit). It is when governments get involved in free markets that they screw things up. Thank capitalism for the improvements in living standards of billions around the world from what would've otherwise been subsistence standards of living. Educate yourself.
@arzoyan Don't forget the western powers in Asia! Yes, this is the typical leftist cant, of looking back to history, and assuming that it continues to repeat itself. But lefties aren't being doctrinal and rigid in their thinking. And certainly not hemmed in by historicism...yeah, right.
Yes, Naomi Klein is the most beautiful woman in the world. But the interviewer needs to stop grunting and muttering while his interviewee speaks. Doesn't he know he's mic'ed?
@Ihatemyusernamemore Absolutely. I know it digresses from her points, but she is really cute. And the fact that she knows what she's talking about I think makes her more attractive.
But anyway, great interview. Good questions and Naomi makes such a compelling interpretation of neoclassical economics and neoconservative power. It sucks though that her book has been hailed by conspiracy theorists, when in fact her book is not at all a conspiracy theory but critique on our culture.
@Sivels You wrote "this sounds like a conspiracy theory." Klein addresses this beginning 36:45. You repeat what all her right wing critics have said. Unable to refute any of the data she presents in the book, her critics attempt to discredit her work by saying it's conspiracy theory. Klein isn't a conspiracy theorist. What she lays out in the book is a program enacted by a group of people (political conservatives) with a specific set of interests (profits). It's not conspiracy, it's history.
bukoman: It is good that you want to stay in chile.....but please tell the 100mil latinos in the USA that Latinos should live in Latino Nations....burkoman:maybe you should move to Hogo land.....sounds like it´s the country for you...
And Peterter I agree with ptofview, you talk talk but you don't even know what she actually does with her money....
She probably does her part, but the thing that is needed is to change the way gvts operate to stop this, because if we really wanted to we could. But of course that is not the aim or even desired, profit and good business is much more important than peoples lives, which is pathetic.
I find it funny for those complaining that she 'contributes to capitalism' by selling her books. Well first off, if you read the book, she talks about 'disaster capitalism', not just capitalism in general, more capitalism pushed to the extreme, abuses, etc.... So I really don't get why some people say that, it's just stupid. I mean if people like this didn't write these kinds of books we would be much worse off.
Another Socialist....blah blah blah!
TheNova1960 1 month ago
Naomi Klein is what smart people call a "moron"
HandyMan101 5 months ago
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The absolute truth is the interdependence of life, the entanglement of all and everything in the language of quantum physics. Capitalism is the historic process of PRIVATE PROPERTY RELATIONSHIP OF ALIENATION,EXPLOITATION AND SUFFERING OF HUMANITY in a modality of commodity production with the sole motive of profit in a WORLD MARKET MECHANISM of ARTIFICIAL SCARCITY,, DISTORTION AND DESTRUCTION. The critical majority shall emerge and create the awrenes and the awakening.
arzoyan 6 months ago
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This Lady changed my life. Now, I hope to Change yours:
wwwDOTf4wpeaceDOTde
A F4 World Peace Cultural-Change Proponent, the result.
AntiChrista4WPeace 7 months ago
i think friedman is badly misunderstood. As any economist he was against monopolies and oligopolies, and he was for freedom. Like any doctrine, friedman's has been distorted, possibly by people who never bothered to read what he wrote or listen to what he said.
However, he did hang out with the worst politicians, so he deserves a bit of blame...
terrywoodinc 7 months ago
Ron Paul 2012
End the Fed
End the Wars
RunLiberty 8 months ago
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World capitalism is organised legalised robbery of the energy of immense humanity in a monetary web of control,exploitation and deception.Capitalism no mater what model of government is the template of domination of death over life. We need to get rid of this pathological destructive system for a world of cooperation for our coomon needs and well being in harmony within and without.
arzoyan 9 months ago 2
Peter Joseph courageously embodies the humanistic / scientific enlightenment of the 21 st century. He has grasped the very inner structrual contradictions of the CAPITALIST/MONETARY system and his revolutionary call for a WORLD OF COOPERATION FOR OUR COMMON NEEDS AND WELL BEING should be the CONSTITUTION OF NEW HUMANI CIVIILISATION. My deepest respect to my brother P.Joseph. in Zetgeist for Venus Project, Time to make history democratically,consciously and globally
arzoyan 9 months ago 7
@arzoyan And what do you and Peter have in store for people like me, people who don't want to "cooperate" and participate in your "revolutionary" vision? What will you do when you cannot implement this vision democratically? I'm guessing I won't like the answer...
cf40409 3 months ago
@cf40409 A majority democratic movement of no leaders no followers to share the Earth in cooperation for our common needs and well being. Hope one day you will join us and if not hope all the best in a tyrannical MARKET SYSTEM OF ARTIFICIA SCARCITY and manipulation.
arzoyan 3 months ago
@arzoyan Am I correct in understanding your intentions to leave me out of this final solution? If so, then I have no quarrel with you, just a difference of opinion. I am interested to hear you say that this "movement" has "no leaders no followers." Does not your strident defense of this movement make you a "follower"? What about scarcity is artificial? We live in a world with finite resources, do we not? Scarcity will be a defining feature of any system, be it "tyrannical" or otherwise.
cf40409 3 months ago
@cf40409 Its a principled stance for for a majority democratic movment for change. You should make a distinction between Artificial scarcity as a market mechanism of manipulation for the material interest of elite OWNERS/RULERS. and a Universe that Time is limited and so the resources on Earth . We have the means for plenty in harmony, CAPITALISM IS ORGANISED SUFFERING.
arzoyan 3 months ago
@arzoyan I want change too, but not the kind of change you are talking about. In a free market, the price of a good/service is a direct reflection of the demand and supply of a particular good/service. This is called the market price. In a competitive free market system, it is in the material interests of the "owners" to set a competitive price, if they want to stay in business. Thus, the interests of the "owners" and of the consumers are both served by this system.
cf40409 3 months ago
@arzoyan My response may sound evasive, so I will continue. There appears to be a contradiction between the principle of freedom of choice and of equality and "harmony"; it may be impossible to have it both ways. Do we want to live in a society in which people are free to choose to indulge in the fruits of their labor however they see fit, or should the goal of society be to restrict freedom of choice in the hopes of bringing about a more equitable share of the fruits of our collective labor ?
cf40409 3 months ago
@cf40409 Employment system of the wage slavery of the working class is to perpetuate the class rule of the elite. Work as evolving ,creative interaction of our common humanity for our common needs and well being shall transform the narrow and artificial distinctions that helps to maintain the illusions of choice and freedom.
arzoyan 3 months ago
@arzoyan Well, as you know, this is not a new idea. It used to be a revolutionary idea, and it sounds alright if you don't think about its history. People found out very quickly what happens when you give up economic freedom, that is, freedom to choose how to spend one's earned money: the loss of political freedom. While you appear to have good intentions, its the other people I'm worried about; human greed and self-interest will prevent this communitarian system from being desirable.
cf40409 3 months ago
So this would apply to how the New Deal was pushed in after the 1929 crash? And how Obama pushed through the bailouts and Obamacare after the housing crash?
niffink 9 months ago
@niffink
Do you understand the difference between firemen rushing in to save a family who's house is on fire and opportunists rushing in to take advantage of them?
swordsintopens 8 months ago
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Noami Rocks:
wwwf4wpeaceDOTde
F...4 World peace by Cultural-Change, by Anti-Christa-Aisha-klein aka sun
Peace All
Inshallah
namAste
f4wpeace 10 months ago
My brain also gets shocked when it get so much bullshit at the time...
DaDemoguy 10 months ago
She's talking about crony capitalism, not free markets. Don't get Friedman involved in this. Military industrial complex being enhanced by Iraq occupation? Go right ahead
Trimbler00 11 months ago
his comennts.. :/
TheHulahophop 11 months ago
I habitually go out of my way to litter. Recreational littering! Seriously! :D
CelticKraut 1 year ago
america never had a form of 'free' market economy as described by friedman...so the whole argument attacking friedman's principles falls flat without holding any water!
psspeed 1 year ago 9
@psspeed this is not the argument presented, the argument goes like this. Friedman sets freemarket as a goal but in practicality it has only come about by setting in motion a shock doctrine. Plus it cannot be called freemarket since the implemented policies (statutory laws) are bastardly claiming freedom for their paternity ie. extorsion, duress
lvildos 1 year ago
@psspeed Yeah right, there are no TRUE Scottsmen, right?
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@epsilon8998 'true scottsman' is a vague term used to defend 'scottsman'. I am not just throwing in 'true capitalism' in my argument. I am saying objectively that america doesn't have the free market system where government is devoid of any role in regulation, creation, or manipulation of businesses/economy. If a bank is going bankrupt, you let it go. You don't use tax payers money to bail it out. the word 'free market' is a term of certitude, unlike true scottsman.
psspeed 1 year ago
@psspeed Please give some empirical examples of an actual existing "free market system" that is "devoid of any [government] role in regulation" and also define what it means to have regulation. How is government regulation different from corporate regulation?
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@epsilon8998 very specific example i could think of is "performance based contracting in highway construction and maintenance". these new forms of contract which, unlike the traditional method based contracting, doesn't dictate what material should go into the construction or what equipments to be used, or what thickness the road should be... the contractor is free to do whatever he wants....he can bring in his own innovative techniques to optimise his profits....
psspeed 1 year ago
@psspeed How is that an example of a free market? I was talking about an entire country that fits that description, not specific policies on road management. And what's to say that the contractor won't cut back on his costs by using less asphalt to pave over the new road and fix potholes and use visual trickery to make it look like he did, thus increasing his profits, but also increasing the danger to drivers. Isn't that a form of "dictating" to drivers that their risks have to increase?
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@epsilon8998 contd..(1)...the only restriction is tht the ultimate product cannot have any potholes, undulations etc. which would make the road users(consumers) lose their valuable time, damage their vehicles etc.Fine will be inflicted proportional to the loss to the consumers.This type of govt. intervention to protect consumer rights is even advocated by Friedman.This method is gaining widespread acceptance for its effectiveness and swiftness in the output and has been adopted by many DOTs.....
psspeed 1 year ago
@psspeed And this is not really a free market anyway: it's just a policy adjustment. It still exists in the context of a system of government funded road management and construction, and a government funded (fully or partially) education system, and a government managed bureaucracy that regulates driving standards, as well as a government operated police system to enforce the rules. How is this the "free market" at all?...
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@epsilon8998 @epsilon8998 contd..(2).. Contrast this with the traditional govt. regulated construction industry which has stringent clauses like past turnover of the company, equipments owned etc, which prevent new players from entering the field, favouring the big shots. Of course, ‘free market’ is a goal which we should strive to achieve instead of slaying towards socialism hindering the progress of mankind.
psspeed 1 year ago
@psspeed ... You still have not said what the difference is between corporate and government regulation. What is the difference other than arbitrary property rights?
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@epsilon8998 example 2: since the airline deregulation act of 1978, due to open competition, by 1999, the airfares fell by 25% ; airline operators doubled from 43 to 90.
psspeed 1 year ago
@psspeed Yeah, maybe that, but it's come at the cost of reducting the wages of airline workers and pilots to record lows, and destroying the power of unions during the Regan years.
epsilon8998 1 year ago
@psspeed No. airline fares have gone up and now we are seeing the elimination of many of the customer service perks (frequent flier mileage, baggage discounts etc.). More operators? Tell that to Eastern Airlines or Laker Airlines, both victims of the price wars. Friedman was a scummy little con artist whose father fucked up running a textile factory in Rahway, NJ back in the twenties when the US was king in textile manufacturing and New Jersey speciffically was a leader in this field.
ChrisDutch 1 year ago
@ChrisDutch First you say the airline fares have gone up, then you mention "price wars" which by definition means the price is going down...
Trimbler00 11 months ago
@psspeed
You are totally wrong...without mitigation of any merit.
LAlba9 1 year ago
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america never had a form of government as described by hitler...so the whole argument attacking hitler's principles falls flat without holding any water!
swordsintopens 8 months ago
*@psspeed
swordsintopens 8 months ago
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*@psspeed
swordsintopens 8 months ago
wow, they really screwed this code up here at youtube. A forum should be really easy to use. Even amatures make them work well.
swordsintopens 8 months ago
@psspeed The closest we had ever been to a totally free market was in the early stages of the Republic. By the mid 1800's through the first decades of the industrial revolution America was a mess. Slave labor, child labor, monopolies price fixing and the like. I think you should learn a little American history instead of regurgitating the corporate propaganda you subject yourself to.
joejoe652 2 months ago
I actually like some of what Friedman says. But, this chick speaks absolute truth about the true motive of the Iraq invasion. It's too easy. The IMF had no power in Irag and Iran. Now what is the US aim? The invasion of Iran. It's basically the way global bankers will run the world.
manmanguy 1 year ago
no logo changed my life, because I realized I didn't have to shave my head and live in the woods. I could make small changes in how and where I purchased food and clothes by buying locally, and even boycott things on a local level. The book is very exciting.
septip123 1 year ago
Everything should be Voluntary, the OPPOSITE of Socialism.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
It works! I'm shocked at how stupid Naomi Klein is!!
somor98 1 year ago
naomi klein is an imbecile
eugdog106 1 year ago
Naomi Klein is lying about what Friedman believed. He believed that FREEDOM should drive every aspect of life. The little film they show with pictures of Nixon, Bush etc. are designed to imply that Friedman approved the policies of Nixon and Bush, etc. What garbage.
jscottupton 1 year ago
@jscottupton
Agreed. Actually, Nixon seems more Keynesian. Moreover, terms like "free trade", or even "Capitalism" shouldn't be used interchangeably with corporatism IMO, because it ignors what the problem is.
I mean, I try to give Klein credit but she comes across as another Michael Moore at times
SUpersaiyajinjerkbag 1 year ago
I know T. Roosevelt very well and the circumstances he was up against. I don't believe in any donations by corporations, lobbyist or special interest groups. I also think political campaining should be limited to a certain amount of time before the election. There is no reason for campainging to begin a year or more before the actual election.
xexixk 1 year ago
Its better to upturn cars and destroy property than to organize? I think that the reason why Europe has had an emigrant (muslim) problem is because of the policy of "beneficient neglect" practiced after World War II in so many European host nations. So, the issue of "improper" assimilation policy had a lot to do with the perception of disenfranchisement, from one generation of immigrant group to the next. In America, assimilation seems to have worked quite well, but Ms. Klein would say no.
whiff1962 1 year ago
Does this bitch think that disasters havent been used by the left to take advantage of people? of course it has.. and Friedman's ideas are "radical" at all, they are based on the idea that no one is better at deciding what you need than you.. and also that it is immoral to force someone to do something (pay taxes).. She is crazy and plain incorrect
lobsterman91 1 year ago
@lobsterman91 Incorrect about what, though?
Redcarpet01 1 year ago
@Redcarpet01
she's incorrect in that she says, we can do good by taking other people's money and spending it on other people.. she judges government and wealth redistribution strategies based on their intent and not their outcome.. so many programs like social security, medicare, and minimum wage are put in place with the idea of improving the lives of the lower and middle class, but these programs often do the exact opposite.. we need to judge programs based on results, not goals
lobsterman91 1 year ago
@lobsterman91 Well if they're failures, you've yet to demonstrate how. Nor is it to correct she doesn't measure outcome., only intent. The burden of proof is on the Right that attack her book anyway. They can't if she quotes what's on the public record, including articles in the press or speeches.
Redcarpet01 1 year ago
FOLLOW ME COMRADE!!!! TO THE EMPTY FOOD STORE!!!!
rachelgolem 1 year ago
how much money have you made from your books and how much property have you bought ?
alilapointe1 1 year ago
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Competition in a political economy of a Market system of artificial scarcity that perpetuate the conditions of the wage slavery of immense humanity for the abstract process of Capital accumulation and concentration is INSANE,NEGATIVE,DESTRUCTIVE,DEHUMANISING,DEVALUING,DISTORTING OF ALL LIVING VIBRATION. By sharing the Earth in cooperation for our common needs and well being we shall transcend and bring about a new paradigm of Oness negating the destructive legacy of CLASS,MONEY,STATE
arzoyan 1 year ago
She is not an economist, and it shows.
arbide2 1 year ago
unless all of these ideas make it into mainstream beliefs then the majority of people will remain blissfully unaware. change lies with the majority of people but most dont care about how they are governed as long as they are fine. and so our hope for a better world wains...
watsabrafor 1 year ago
a corporate charter is primarily based on "maximizing profits while externalizing costs"..........
............considering that this charter is not subservent to the human condition, community well being or responsible use of resources...........then this mandate has now passed a threashold within developed societies that is sociopathic in its consequences the World and its inhabitants........
jacopman 1 year ago
"Free market" is impossible because
1. how do you keep the people on top from controlling everyone without regulating them?
2. how do you make sure everyone at the bottom is fed and clothed?
ANSWER
1. FREELY Share ALL resources and knowledge worldwide, NO more money/property
2. Use LATEST technology to create an ABUNDANCE of all our needs, NO more scarcity, waste or theft
3. Automate/localize ALL production and distribution, NO more wage/debt slavery
v=YxPPnCW6sMo
v=yPmHaTirnCc
dontblockmedk 1 year ago
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Foreign Meddling is Good! watch?v=0HrJYI1QHa8
JohananRaatz 1 year ago
did she even read a single book friedman wrote? she is the one abusing shock doctrine, she is one whole lying dike! IMHO
coturnix19 1 year ago
i would disagree with some of her points of veiw and interpretation of certain facts and events
minerasasd 1 year ago
this was before obama right?
JeroenUyttendaele 1 year ago
the New Deal the greatest restriction on capitalism in 20th century America and presumably beloved by Ms. Klein that was imposed in a time of crisis. Many of the crises of the 20th century resulted from anti-capitalistic policies, rather than from capitalism: China was falling apart because of the murderous and tyrannical policies of Chairman Mao, which then led to bottom-up demands for capitalistic reforms; New Zealand and Chile abandoned socialistic policies for freer markets .
examinfo 1 year ago
@examinfo Agree. We should write a book "Shock Doctrine: The Rise of Disaster Socialism." Government intervention on the free market after economic crisis only prolongs and deepens problems! The New Deal was bad! People should research the Depression of 1920 which was more severe than than the year 1929 (Great Depression), yet only lasted a little over a year! Why? No government intervention!
cabgt 1 year ago
@cabgt You are suffering from cerebral myopia and disney fairytale of roller coaster in your perceptions of facts. State has always been an instrument of force in the hand of the ruling elite in its insatiable drive for control and dominance, ask yourself why USA has over 130 millitary bases and millitary presence in 77 countries,? TO MANAGE THE WORLD RESOUCES FOR ITS RULING ELITE.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan Capitalism and free-market does not encourage war, but peace. Socialism kills and destroys society. History shows this. It is not debatable. Does America have freemarket capitalism? No, just growing government and welfare as did the Roman Empire - both which free-market capitalists (people who believe in freedom) are against. Move to Venezuela or Cuba if there it is so much better
cabgt 1 year ago
@cabgt Listen to Eisenhower's warning about the military industrial compled. No wars they don't make money. As for socialism, do you mean
Soviet style? That would of course bad. Democratic Socialism? Sweden hasn't been in a war for a couple hundred years. I don't see Norway or the Netherlands rattling sabers ant anyone.......and please do not say Hitler was a socialist. The National Socialist were socialist in name only, one of his first acts was to purge the party of true socialist.
xexixk 1 year ago
No, Hitler was a socialist. If you read Karl Popper's "The open society and its enemies" (the volume on Karl Marx's social economic project), this will be made abundantly clear. Since the end of World War I, most of Europe has only known one form of socialism or other. The entitlement-welfarism that informs so much of European socialism has come up against considerable challenge, practically and theoretically. What must it be like to see a cradle to grave system as no longer sustainable?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Hitler most certainly was not a socialist. Go read an actual history of the Nazi era. The best is the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. The industrialist and big business people loved Hitler b/c of his anti labor policies. The first people sent of to those early concentration camps were suspected communists and trade union leaders. He hated communism. The National Socialist were socialist in name only, those who too the 'socialist' part to seriously were purged from the party.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk I would beg to differ with you. The NASDP could not have had the successes it did unless it was at least pallitable by the "average" German. The only difference I would note between Communism and Naziism (Fascism), is in the "exportability" of Communism, and the decidedly nationalist flavor of the latter. Other than that, both were cut from the same socio-historical cloth. Read Karl Popper for a deeper analysis, and you might come to re-evaluate.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Communism rejects the idea of private ownership, Facsism doesn't - read Mussolini's definition of facsism. Socialism had nothing to do with those who supported Hitler. They supported him because of his ferverent nationalism and promises to restore German glory and avenge the humiliations of the first World War.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk You are mixing your apples and oranges with this argument. My contention is that socialism is the common parent; the siblings being communism and socialism. By any other name, both Naziism and Communism shared a common intellectual history, and whether one "allowed" private ownership, while the other didn't, is but one contrast among many commonalities.
whiff1962 1 year ago
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whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Also, communism, at least on paper, stresses that all people are equals. An idea which is rejected by fascism. Any claim that tyranny is only capable of coming from the far reaches of one side of the political spectrum is false.
xexixk 1 year ago
Communism on paper, to set the record straight, says nothing of this morally loaded assertion of equality, as you seem to assert. Remember, Communism is an economic system, and as such, concerns itself with human behavior. Communism never asserted any "equality", after all, what credence would "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" have, if equality were the intended end? Even the staunchest Communist would differ with your assessment. What of individual striving?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I'm not speaking of works of communist theorey so much as the laws of formally communist countries. In the Soviet Union, legally, everyone was equal, but in practice of course they were not - old ethnic divisions and so forth still persisted. And 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs' does indeed ascert a sense of equality among all - that one person shall not do with out while another person does with too much.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk Yes, equality before the law, and compulsory voting. I do see the handy work in present-day America, with the liberal-left and its radical, "progressive" utopian engineering. I see it in my own former career in the mental health field, with its decidely collectivist trends, as in the community based mental health services. I got out when I realized that I was altering the individual to alter the social. I suppose universal mental health screening is good for the "public" good, right?
whiff1962 1 year ago
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xexixk 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Remember, utopian promises - depending upon what one considers to be utopia - can come from the left or the right. I see nothing decidely leftist going on these days. Wall Street bail outs aren't leftist. A government still under the thumb of corporate and special interests isn't leftist. There's really no difference between the two parties, they are just different sides of the same coin.
xexixk 1 year ago
Wall Street bail outs are fascistic, right? Just like Naomi says. Or is that "corporatist"? I suppose the term corporate socialism means nothing to you; it obviously does for the Obama administration; its textbook socialism, call it what you may. As for the two parties being one, I do have to agree with you on that. That is why I am for maximizing individual freedom, and no initiating of violence by the state against the individual, with the intent of diminishing said freedoms! And your state?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Moreover, for your information, Corporations enjoy many of the same rights under U.S. federal and state laws, as those of the individual. So, looks like that might be something to wrap your head around.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I'm aware of the status of corporations and I never said I liked it or agree with it. In fact I hate it. That is where the real power lies in this country. DC takes it's marching orders from corporate interests b/c of campaign contributions, etc. It's nothing more than legalized bribary.
xexixk 1 year ago
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whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Yes, thats what I said about campaign contributions and corporate control and both parties being the same. I'd never say it was just one of them. They are both the same. You don't seem to get that I'm beating up on both parties here. As for the BP exec, in some other countries their CEO would have been arrested and I wouldn't mind that at all.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk But you said that both parties are really one. Which is it? You contradict yourself over...what are we debating anyway?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I said both parties were the same in truth, which you seemed to agree with. You are the one who brought up the subject of mental health issues. I don't think any contradictions lie with me, sorry.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk Who do you think gave the permission to drill some 1000 wells off of the Gulf? You are at least aware of the sheer number of wells, coastly in the U.S? The state, as you would say, has been hoodwinked, and if necessary, wined and dined into sleeping with big business? How might it strike if I assert that it is likewise the very presence of state bureaucracy that both facilitates and exacerbates these "BP" momements? However, you do seem steadfast in the illusion of a "beneficient" state.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Corporations and the government are happy to scratch each other's backs and do each other's bidding so long as the money flows.
xexixk 1 year ago
So how does make the corporate and state relationship equitable again? Should the state own ALL the means of production? What of individual economic self-determination; what of the very nature of American democracy, in this radical, revolutionary vision? But of what, exactly? What is then your alternative? What practical measures would you implement? What of our society's instutitions, as the basis of our free and open society? Do you actually think that the individual can decide for himself?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 No I don't believe that the government should own all means of production. I do, however, agree with what Teddy Roosevelt said, "Let individuals contribute as they desire; but let us prohibit in effective fashion all corporations from making contributions for any political purpose, directly or indirectly."
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk What about lobby groups? U.S. govt. and lobbyism are inextricably bound, but who is to draw the line on the latter? Moreover, if you knew your history, you would know that T. Roosevelt was up against a much different set of circumstances than today. If the U.S. had a president similiar to him, we'd be living in a statist society. Just look at the bureaucracies that sprang up under his watch.
whiff1962 1 year ago
"CEO would have been arrested and I wouldn't mind that at all." I think we know where your empathies lie. As for your knocking both parties, you seem to be contradicting your earlier assertion that both parties are really one. So, which is it? Yeah, I have talked to a lot of decidedly statist types as yourself, but not as anti-democratic.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Teddy Roosevelt also advocated holding the officers of corporations personally responsible. I'm most certainly not anti-democratic. I haven't even said what I think the role of the state is or should be so your attempts to divine my beliefs have failed. What is difficult to understand about their being no real differences between the two parties? Power - getting and keeping it - is the primary objective of both parties, not actually doing anything.
xexixk 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Both parties have their offical platforms, but that is just for show, their real objective is power. All of the fighting between this is just a spectacle for our amusment. It's all for show.
xexixk 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I didn't say wall street bailouts are a good thing. I'm fully away of what corporate socialism or corporate welfare is but that is not the same thing as the political/ecomonic theory of socialsim as state ownership of the means of production and distribution. Remember, the right in the country in the past have provided their share of corporate welfare too. I'm not saying I agree with it, just pointing it out.
xexixk 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I don't believe in compulsory mental health 'screening' unless someone is actually having real mental health issues. Some of these so called emotional disorders are nothing more than made up 'diseases.' Don't forget who helps to promote them and encourage people to seek 'help': big pharma industries b/c they make a fortune off of selling anti depressants and other psychiatric meds. They would have everyone of us on prozac if they could to increase their profits.
xexixk 1 year ago
@xexixk I didn't mention "compulsory"; that would have not been an adequate trap. No, not compulsory, but universal, and heavily promoted by a network of cooperting agencies, all tied to one thing. The liberal psychiatric enterprise is run by equally liberal, do-gooder, types. The entire paradigm that now animates psychiatry, namely, the pharmacalogic myth of mental illness, is no less the brainchild of your beloved liberal, "progressive" mental hygienists, going back some fifty years.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I never said I loved anything or anyone and if you look back at my comment you will see that I said many of those 'diseases' are fake. Now, there are real mental diseases. I've real ones - sschizophrenia, etc. But ADD, etc. I reject, the pharm industry makes a killing by selling rittalin for supposed ADD kids and it's wrong.
xexixk 1 year ago
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whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Good lord guy, I've never even said where my personal politics lie. Have you just missed all of the criticisms I just gave of contemporary psychology and the pharm industry creating fake 'diseases'?
xexixk 1 year ago
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@xexixk You can reject them all you want, that doesn't stop the liberal, do-gooders wanting to find the treatments for the very myth they promulgate: that of mental illness. The social, economic and political ramifications (never mind the ethical and moral) of funding all that concerns itself with the treatment for ALL "afflicted" with mental illness, is staggering. What kind of culture do you think your ideological brethren seek to effect with this altering of the individual? At what cost?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@xexixk You are schizophrenic? Really? So are you on state dole? I suppose you are then a captive audience with statism then?
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 I never said I was schizophrenic. I gave that as an example of a mental illness that was real as opposed to a created fake one.
xexixk 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Fact: Go too far to the left you end up with tyranny...go too far to the right you end up with tyranny....Stalin, Mao, etc. came from the far left, .... Hitler, Mussolini, Franco etc. came from the far right
xexixk 1 year ago
Naomi Klein should die a horrible death for lying to people. It is not capitalism and free markets that cause poverty and economic problems. Its the fact that since the depression we have been imposing keynesian economics to our economy in this country (US). Look at the results! The economy is much too complicated to educate amateur commentators on youtube in a few comments. People should do more research before they buy anything this stupid bitch says.
MrXZodiacInfinitY 1 year ago
@MrXZodiacInfinitY I agree with you... Research on both sides,, Investigate with open mind... The countries with most economic freedom is the wealtiest.. China privatized their economy in 1978,, search "China growth" on google and look at the graph,, People are so much more free in China today, than they were before privatization...
bjarnet3 1 year ago
youtube Johan Norberg vs. Naomi Klein and The Shock Doctrine
whitesox889 1 year ago
Why does it matter that she is cute? Do people say that when Noam Chomsky starts talking or any other political activist? Who cares what she looks like isn't her message enough? My god!
MarilynFilth 1 year ago
@MarilynFilth She is not cute.. She is a bimbo. There is a difference. I live in the same city as her, I've seen her give speeches multiple times, read her "No Logo" book. Garbage. She is a cheap shot, riding the commie wave, bitching about obvious problems without offering any constructive solutions, and making top dollars on it. She is profiting from the overzealous commies the same way as anti-abortion groups profit from photos dead fetus.
akayami77 1 year ago
@akayami77 Bullshit. She's both cute and intelligent and should have won the Nobel Prize that was given to the repulsive, neo fascist little prick Milton "Scumbag" Friedman. The Chicago school of nazism, economic terror, government subversion, union busting and low paid labor have had their way with their ideas. The result? Declining wages, jobs outsourcing, excessive tax cuts for the wealthy. JFK, RFK and MLK caught the bullets that should have gotten Friedman, Ayn Rand and Leo Strauss.
ChrisDutch 1 year ago
stupid Bitch...
pssiddharth 1 year ago
Naomi Klein is a dumb bimbo selling the usual shallow left propaganda... Milton Friedman has always said that Capitalism does not guarantee Liberty, yet, Liberty cannot exists without Capitalism. In other words, if you want a free society, Capitalism is a required ingredient of it. There are other ingrediens but Capitalism is one of them. I do not get it why she gets so much attention. Her stuff is so shallow, it's ridiculous. She is a good speaker, but really lacks depth. It's a trend I guess..
akayami77 1 year ago
@akayami77 Liberty exists in Germany, Sweeden and France. Also UK which has a more socialist ideology.
Only an American can think that an ideology where the top 1% of the world making more money off the backs of the blue colour people is a good system of Government.
You know how long Capitalism has been around compared to fair legitimate trade? Just because you do not live in a Capitalist Country does not mean it can not prosper. You are the dumb bimbo.
MarilynFilth 1 year ago
@MarilynFilth Well, I was born in continental Europe and I've spend most of my life tasting fruits of that "liberty". Americans are actually far less "laissez-faire" capitalist than they're said to be. US gov. while slightly better than most European gov. is still a far cry from a small, lightweight government that Milton Friedman was always advocating. Nowadays, we're facing an always growing gov. and always shrinking middle class... Do you see the correlation ?
akayami77 1 year ago
@akayami77 Yours is an example of an incredibly lazy and shallow argument which doesn't even bother to engage with what it means to be a free society. Friedman's belief in the abolition of all trade barriers has been discredited even to his disciples (save perhaps for some armchair populists) To sum up anything that questions neoliberal values as "shallow left propaganda" is a sad reflection on yourself and you do yourself a further disservice with ignorant phrases such as "dumb bimbo"
onesy1 1 year ago
@onesy1 Friedman polices have not been implemented because no gov. has balls to do unpopular, yet necessary changes. It's very easy for politicians to cater to narrow groups for support in exchange for socially unfair policies. Sadly, politicians from both sides have been whoring their positions for support, instead of doing the long term necessary for their country. Sometimes, doing the best, is not doing anything, especially regarding the economy.
akayami77 1 year ago
@akayami77 Your argument (an argument made by Schmitt and appropriated by Hayek) is essentially one which reduces government to a technocratic issue, the efficacy of which can best be measured by its resemblance to market transactions in the private sector. Your assault on 'narrow groups' (insert 'special interests' i.e. class and 'old elites') amounts to the same attacks on democracy made in Weimar Germany. No doubt you are an advocate of Pinochet?
onesy1 1 year ago
@onesy1 Narrow groups such as Unions, Trade associations, Corporations etc. that extract regulations that allow them to abuse the rest of society... Free market puts natural rules that prevent narrow groups from abusing others. Regulations distort natural rules, and allow some groups to tilt the table in their advantage. Natural economical competition is replaced by political competition where money is exchanged for regulations.
akayami77 1 year ago
@akayami77 @akayami77 "Free market" doesn't prevent narrow groups from abusing others. With nobody to uphold labour laws, who's to stop people from driving down wages indefinitely? Laws restrict 'natural rules' by outlawing the right to kill. Natural is not a justification for anything. In the absence of government, all legislation would be determined by the extremely narrow interests of those with money to back it up. How would this be a change for the better?
onesy1 1 year ago
@onesy1 BTW, it's hard to be more profound in 500 characters. She gave a 50min interview, and 2 books, and still said nothing. Just constant bitching...
akayami77 1 year ago
Capitalism is the wage slavery of immense humanity in a politically corrupt,manipulated MARKET SYSTEM OF ARTIFICIAL SCARCITY ,a tyrannical,destructive system to perpetuate poverty and exploitation in the interest of the ruling class. Capitalism from its mercantile plundering and enslavement of African natives to its Millitaristic rise of European Powers to World wars and Financial serfdom of the world has been a DISASTEROUS imposition .
arzoyan 1 year ago 51
@arzoyan where did you grow up? capitilism had alotted men the incentive to drive society and culture in a way unprecendented by any other economic philosophy of our time or in histories record..what drives the biologists, chemists and slew of other industry professionals to develop life saving pharmacueticals, treatments and technologies that have saved more human lives than can be estimated?what has driven food producers to increase there output of consummables..
shockwaveization 1 year ago
@arzoyan or inspired the innovation of the layman to develop devices and means..ie.computer..car..airplane that ultimately changes the world as we know it ? the scary thing is you already know the answer but devoid of any rational insight you will arbitrarily spew your socialist view points.. a view point that has been proven time and time again through the ages to fail and end in misery for all who participate, the wake itself which extends that devastation to the innocent..
shockwaveization 1 year ago
@shockw You are not making any senseible arguement, I am suggesting a democratic majority conscious change for a world of cooperation where our needs and well being are not snared by minority for their insatiable drive for accumulation and concentration of power and wealth.
arzoyan 1 year ago 18
@arzoyan Oh, I see, tyranny of the majority...and those who never got over his narcissistic hang over. I very much doubt that any "majority" willingly gives up its individual and collective wealth to the work shy and lazy.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 You are recycling the ideological lies,distortions and lies of your owners, your mind is colonised for commercial use, your little ego lost in disney myth making and wall street servitude.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan I think that I fair a lot better in the imperfection of Capitalism, than in your crackpot, socialist(?) Utopia. As for the "recycling" bit, I say, what of your plastering videos with your "cut and paste" drivel? You make such bold, sweeping assertions, on what you consider to be the "good" society, however, history has proven your ilk wrong, time and again. I suggest you go back to living under your rock.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@arzoyan My "owners"? And who are your keepers, in your "stateless" and "moneyless" society? Why do you even bother to respond to this video, given your decidely anarchistic bent? Klein is a socialist-statist, so I find your posts on this video to be non sequitor and out of place. Now go spend your state dole, and leave the economy to the rest of us.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 "socialist-statist" is a contradiction in term, your distorted self is the energetic reality of world capitalism, destructive,exploitative,dehumanising,devaluing all and everything. go and consume your little ego.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan Socialist-statist is NOT a contradiction, nor is redundant. Naomi Klein labors under the same misapprehension that the one can make an appeal to the "better nature" of the state, to serve the greater good. In essence, Klein believes that "popular" appeal to the more beneficient aspects of the state are the means of addressing all manner of injustice and inequality. I say that such an appeal is both Socialist and Statist, hence, the use of the recognized term "Socialist-statism."
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 Socialism has always meant A WORLD HUMANITY SHARING THE EARTH IN COOPERATION, a moneyless,classless,stateless communities taking care of our needs,wellbeing and creative energies in harmony within and without, the enemies of humanity have distorted, are distorting the democratic revolutionary ideas for the material interest of the ruling class, Naomi is just one little girl in the horrific wonderland of world capitalism, confused and lost.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan Where do you think such innovation, creativity and material gain come to be fostered in the first place? Look at all the great innovators and producers, and you will find that it was the free-market, with the consumer as captain of the ship, that brought the world its unprecedented wealth. Its funny how you call out others for their greed, when, in fact, your own personal greed figures no less importantly. You do strike me as a middle-aged, socially and economically disaffected, idiot.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 As I said, your mind is colonised for commercial use, you are in the box for long haul.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan Well, then, free me! LOL
whiff1962 1 year ago
@arzoyan Under your "egalitarianism", I would be compelled to give up my private property, and, in a real sense my freedoms. Yes, your so-called "sharing" society would bode well for the likes of the economically disaffected and cynical, but I don't see how any notion of "democracy" would figure in your radical transformations. Secular evangelicalism a scientific-socialist claptrap.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 In a world that is so nourishing, we are conditioned to fear for our little possession, its the fear of having versus the freedom of being.
arzoyan 1 year ago
@arzoyan Like my "having" a good education and good intellect; and you, of "being" uneducated and dim-witted? Is this the ostensible dichotomy of which you speak? Try reading p. 235 of Ludwig Von Mises fourth edition of "Human action". There is no full flower of (communistic) "freedom" that will do away with the realm of necessity. As for the rest of your hamstrung "thinking", I say, humbug to your metaphysical claptrap.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@whiff1962 You are shadow bxing with your distorted self, CAPITALISM IS THE HISTORIC EVOLUTION OF THE TYRANNY OF PRIVATE PROPERTY RELATIONSHIP OF ALIENATION,EXPLOITATION AND SUFFERING OF HUMANITY IN A MODALITY OF MONETARY SERFDOM. STOP PARROTING YOUR OWNERS.
arzoyan 1 year ago
Were do you expressly set forth your "programmatic" plan of social and economic justice? You are glib, certainly as pertains to your vapid arguments about "exploitation", etc. I very much doubt that you make for a sound and logical argument, merely by waxing "revolutionary" in your diction. Your responses, on a variety of YT videos, are truly undecipherable. I really don't think that you know what you are saying; Just the same indescriminate spraying of your pseudo-intellectual ejaculate.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@arzoyan Please, get your facts straight before you make silly comments. Mercantilism is not capitalism. Capitalism is not enslavement. Capitalism promotes freedom and free markets (human will and mutual benefit). It is when governments get involved in free markets that they screw things up. Thank capitalism for the improvements in living standards of billions around the world from what would've otherwise been subsistence standards of living. Educate yourself.
cabgt 1 year ago
@arzoyan Don't forget the western powers in Asia! Yes, this is the typical leftist cant, of looking back to history, and assuming that it continues to repeat itself. But lefties aren't being doctrinal and rigid in their thinking. And certainly not hemmed in by historicism...yeah, right.
whiff1962 1 year ago
@arzoyan I see you are cutting and pasting again.
whiff1962 1 year ago
She wrote a very chomsky esque book. It's sources are beyond reproach. She's really coming along.
neo communist...lol...gimmie a break.
doublestrokeroll 1 year ago
Yes, Naomi Klein is the most beautiful woman in the world. But the interviewer needs to stop grunting and muttering while his interviewee speaks. Doesn't he know he's mic'ed?
czwall 1 year ago
Naomi klein is soooooooooooo hawt and smart to thats a turn on
I would totally go out with her
Ihatemyusernamemore 1 year ago
@Ihatemyusernamemore Absolutely. I know it digresses from her points, but she is really cute. And the fact that she knows what she's talking about I think makes her more attractive.
But anyway, great interview. Good questions and Naomi makes such a compelling interpretation of neoclassical economics and neoconservative power. It sucks though that her book has been hailed by conspiracy theorists, when in fact her book is not at all a conspiracy theory but critique on our culture.
slytown 1 year ago
It seems any idea that that can't be comprehended by the small minded is deemed a " conspiracy theory " .. Follow the money ! ..
MiraginXXX 1 year ago
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The left loves Naomi Klein, but she completely clueless, this sounds like a conspiracy theory.
Sivels 2 years ago
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@Sivels You wrote "this sounds like a conspiracy theory." Klein addresses this beginning 36:45. You repeat what all her right wing critics have said. Unable to refute any of the data she presents in the book, her critics attempt to discredit her work by saying it's conspiracy theory. Klein isn't a conspiracy theorist. What she lays out in the book is a program enacted by a group of people (political conservatives) with a specific set of interests (profits). It's not conspiracy, it's history.
bapyou 1 year ago
bukoman: It is good that you want to stay in chile.....but please tell the 100mil latinos in the USA that Latinos should live in Latino Nations....burkoman:maybe you should move to Hogo land.....sounds like it´s the country for you...
pepsiwatersugar 2 years ago
....where would the latinos move to then?
pepsiwatersugar 2 years ago
....burkoman....are you a neo communist....
pepsiwatersugar 2 years ago
....naomi is super to pinpoint the problems with modern capitalism....but her solutions are very left wing...maybe neo communist...
pepsiwatersugar 2 years ago
What a liar, I truly hope no one puts too much credence in what this statist says
MrHigginsPM 2 years ago
And Peterter I agree with ptofview, you talk talk but you don't even know what she actually does with her money....
She probably does her part, but the thing that is needed is to change the way gvts operate to stop this, because if we really wanted to we could. But of course that is not the aim or even desired, profit and good business is much more important than peoples lives, which is pathetic.
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago
@peterpetersnbg and others
I find it funny for those complaining that she 'contributes to capitalism' by selling her books. Well first off, if you read the book, she talks about 'disaster capitalism', not just capitalism in general, more capitalism pushed to the extreme, abuses, etc.... So I really don't get why some people say that, it's just stupid. I mean if people like this didn't write these kinds of books we would be much worse off.
xdeliriumx1 2 years ago