People who argue only about the effectiveness of the martial arts styles in defeating an opponent are ignoring what martial arts is meant to be and what it's meant to accomplish. The benefits of martial arts is to improve one's self mastery and judgement, and to provide a physical framework in which it is safe to spar and learn about the body's movement and weaknesses.
As seeing only the combat can rob oneself of half the lesson so may seeing what is not effective as something that is.. Therefore we must seek to find truth within ourselves and also truth of what is real and effective in combat.
The grab on :43 sec. you asked about is sankyo. it can be a pressure point, but is mostly used to lead and move your partners mind through extending ki and having them agree to follow u. If the attacker fights and struggles then they inflict this pressure point apon themselves..
The arm grab as you asked is sankyo. It can be a pressure point but is mostly used to lead and extend ki though your attacker to move his mind and agree to follow. If they struggle then they are inflicting the pressure point on themselves. It is at :43 second on the video
The arm grab as you asked is sankyo. It can be a pressure point but is mostly used to lead and extend ki though your attacker to move his mind and agree to follow. If they struggle then they are inflicting the pressure point on themselves.
When a technique that I'm not familiar with is applied to me quickly often my natural resistance works against me. When I get this reaction out of others (albeit in the dojo) I see the techniques in a different light.
I would say against full resistance they do not work. When quick and unexpected it can be easy to break even a strong joint.
Any technique worth a damn will work under resistance.. Now that doesn't mean that any technique must work all the time, you need to adapt in the moment..and use the right move.. However, if the move is of any real use there shouldn't be any special cooperation needed. Use examples that are known to work, like a Rear Naked Choke or an Armbar.. If the technique can't be used like those examples are (under the right positional and timing conditions) then we need to re-evaluate.
An armbar is certainly more effective and less risky than most wrist locks and yet some MMA fighters are great at resisting long enough to find a way out. Also it's often inappropriate to lie on the ground just to apply a technique. Chokes are amazing unless you're a police officer and fear litigation.
We need a lot of options in case our opponent moves in a way we don't expect or finds a way to resist. I'm not going to pinch anybody, mind! That was a bit silly.
Any direct irimi or atemi-waza, off the top of my head.. Kaiten nage looks somewhat like Tony Blauer's startle flinch response, and might give a clue to how we might look at the origins of aikido's techniques or its applications.
Also remember that aikido strives the 'harmony of force'.. If the attacker moves in such a way technique x is unlogical to apply, then of course it wouldn't work.. Would you do an armbar on someone who's kicking you?
@risdon34 "The arm grab at :43... What did he do, pressure point or simply breaking balance? I can't quite see."
I haven't learned this technique, but he appears to be pinching the brachial artery. I can say from experience (not dojo related) that it hurts quite a bit and I can easily imagine its effectiveness at encouraging cooperation. A major plus is that it doesn't matter how big their arms are, there's always a space between the bicep and tricep big enough to fit some fingers :-)
@cassidy99ful thats foolish, many differing views that are different but there are ways that are superior. Look at the way a teenage boy trains over that of an NBA star there is one that is superior, but guess what coaches still train the boys in ways that aren't the best.
According to one prominent teacher, contact must be established in order? to apply some Aiki.. As we know in CMA this is called bridging.
If we think of applying Aiki by reacting off alive energy (feel) as in ChiSao then IMO the ability to apply may be more practical. Feeling vs seeing, the former is much faster and allows for alive adaptation, IOW harmonizing with him to dissolve his attack. ChiSao or a similar kind of drill could well be used to assist in training Aikido.
So, uh, why are we poo pooing anyones style? I mean, they are all good for different things. I'm not going to say what I do because I'm pretty sure someone will say something to this affect, "Dude, I can beat that any day, your style sucks!"
I commend anyone who says something like this for their stupidity in the arts.
Well we should be mindful of respect for all styles.. Still some styles may well be better suited to certain things.. Aikido was after all the created to be as non violent as possible following the founders respect for the sanctity of life.. Aikijujitsu less so...
IMO we can learn something from most styles assuming we have access to good instruction which is hard to come by.
Aikido..or I should say, aikido-style techniques (aiki-waza) aren't as effective as Aikido makes them out to be. A good aikijujutsu style on the other hand...much more realistic.
Ironic OR moronic? LISTS OF TECHNIQUES Tachiwaza - mae (standing, attacks from the front) Tachiwaza - ushiro (standing, attacks from the rear) Suwariwaza (tori and uke sitting) Hanmi handachiwaza (tori sitting, uke standing) Tantodori (defense against knife) Tachidori (defense against sword) Jodori (defense against staff) Kaeshiwaza (counter techniques) Henkawaza (changed techniques) Kogeki (attacks in aikido)
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"In reality, Aikido has no forms, no set patterns. It is like an invisible wave of energy. However such a phenomenon is too difficult for human beings to grasp, so we use provisional forms to explain it and put it into practice." Morihei Ueshiba.
You've described the various provisional forms but in reality there are no techniques, no forms.
The problem with pretending to be smarter than you actually are, is that you insult your own TRUE intelligence (which you obviously have) as well as the people you are trying to impress with a written knowledge of Morihei Ueshiba's TRANSLATED words.
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No you're just dim. I stated there are no techniques, you disagreed, I quoted O-Sensei. WingChum then thought he'd be smart but failed utterly because he's posted a vid presumably from his own art that has half the Aikido syllabus up to 4th kyu in it. Because he used the word techniques I did also. Then you thought I was contradicting myself when in fact I was just being lazy. Iqwaxzi then failed to realise that what's written in the book is also passed on verbally in the dojo.
you are right. no one ever used it. it´s all an illusion that has perpretrated for MANY DECADES, and everyone that has every tried to use aikido in a combat has failed... NOT!!!!
So you do not do the one, two, three defence rather one, four, two, five etc dependant on where you are and the attacker. Just watch the opening sequence of the Segal film Nico for this demonstration. One person attacks him and he puts him in front of the next. And remember Aikido did evolve from the Daito-Ryu Samurai arts. They were well honed at fighting on battlefields so it does work in multi attacks.
The training in those arts teaches this. Aikido when multiple attacked you move in to a position where you a) put the the first person you deal with in front of or into the next attacker. B) you use the attackers attack to move past them to deal with the person to the side or behind. In other words you constantly force the multiple attackers to step over around each other.
I notice on a few aikido vids on YT people stating if you got attacked by many people and you did Aikido you would lose (or to that effect). Actually any martial art style can lose but Aikido is the best I know. I will explain. In Karate, gung Fu, etc you defend on principle the first attacker, then second, third etc. Fighting each then moving on to the next.
its techniques are effective but i don t like its philosophy a martial art mutsnt t be violent but it can t be an art of peace to be martial martial means combattive not art of peace as aikido
Aikido does not mean art of peace. It means Way of Harmony. Keep in mind that a hurricane and the tornado are in harmony with nature. I would not call either of these things peaceful.
Aikido is conflict resolution in harmony with the laws of nature.
The founder of Aikido Morihei Ueshiba Didn't intend for Aikido to be used for fighting but for peace. He was originally a Swordsman & practitioner of several old Jujutsu Ryu. IMHO, Aikido died with him as he could really make the techniques work due to his vast knowledge of Jujutsu and his fighting experience. Problem with Aikido now is that Practitioners think they can do what O-Sensei could do but without fighting for real against resisting opponents...Not!! there is no magic in fighting!
in Aikido you use what your oponent attacks you with, so no matter how passive you are, when the attacks come you work with what is given to you. Aikido is a martial ART, it's not intended to do harm, so if you are passive while there is no attack directed at you, you are doing what you are supposed to be doing.
Jukido is correct. I trained aikido intesnely for a long time. My instructor even said it is a study of movement with some martial applications. Now he would roll with greco and karate guys and win. But he ended up using more taijitsu then aikido. And he was the most natural athlete I have ever met. But he was honest in his description of aikido.
abtikamot. please be honest with yourself, enough Aikido ideology. Show me a video of an Aiki defeated a BJJ or a Greco. Think about the the development of Aikido as Jukido very honestly outlined. Clearly an art can be ineffective for purposes - example sport BJJ is not as good against mulitple attackers. What you said is complete nonsense, if it were true, than there is no reason to learn an art if the art has not affect on effectiveness, only the practitioner.
Sorry but I can not show you any video, BJJ or a Greco is are meant for sports....but if you can imagine the situation...full pack with bandolier and you just run for say 5 miles in a mountainous terrain and then you a met 3 machete welding persons who wants to kill you. Try your BJJ or Greco. .
ok show me Aikido guy defeating a person trained in Eskrima. I would rather know taijitsu, butjitsu, or daito ryu. In fact, if you are in San Diego, I will come to your dojo and hit you with my bokken.
Anyways, is this the situation you expect to encounter? if so then you probably should get a gun and learn how to use it as well as your martial art. Or at least get a kitana and study iaido.
I was trained in stick fighting too, and we dont call it escrima....we call it baston or commonly known as arnis de mano.. for info I was from the town that was one of the originator of arnis de mano, and pangamot etc.and I am very sorry I can not invite you to my dojo, I dont have one and I still live in my old town. and yes I do encountered such threats.
Let me be clear, I trained aikido intensely for almost five years. And some techniques are good. But I never ran into to more unsubstantiated egos in any other setting... no respect for other arts or viewpoint and an inability to discuss concerns of meeting a boxer or bjj in the streets, or someone who will fake, won't follow, or is trained in knife fighting. They cared less about these practical safety concerns and more about there self-righteous superiority and were very defensive.
Then you will know that some aikido evolve into some kind of cultural arts. But if you look closely a lot of the techniques are very practical and it is the martial aspect of aikido.
It sounds very different to my experience. We talked about these things all the time. Any time a new student came along from a different style we would ask them to demonstrate as much as they could so we could better understand defence against their previous style. Many of the other students I trained with were security staff ('bouncers') from night clubs. The used Aikido techniques against armed (knives) and unarmed (drunk/drugged) patrons who really wanted to hurt them. Aikido seemed to work.
YOU people remind me of people who like to argue just to argue. After you read OSense's books then try and talk to someone who is a Akidoist. OSense traveled all over Japan and fought/trained with everyone he came across. Aikido ios NOT about who is best but a way of living. Other "arts" are about killing and hurting some one Aikido is about living in harmony with the universe. You guys pull men down Aikido lifts man up.
Interesting how you preach non-combativeness while you are so defensive about other's comments. You seem to be doing as much arguing as anyone here. Everyone is entitled to their perspective and IF you were truly at peace as you profess, you would be busy with constructive activities rather than telling others they are wrong because their philosophy is not in alignment with your own.
Perhaps you should remove the board from your own eye before attempting to remove the splinter from another's.
I think it is interesting that so many people who watch this have NO idea what it's all about. Why do you want to hurt and kill one another? I don't know where the name ART came from since it is all about killing. You hate mongers need to read his books. Aikido began over OSense refusing to fight his close friend. My friend, a champion karate instructor, is 40 and has physicial problems. OSense is 80 and still going strong ALL day.
If you are serious about Aikido you should learn to meditate and budism. Too many people bastardized Aikido and use SOME tech without realizing the other. I discovered I could sit on the bottom of a pool for about 5 min. I also have a resting heart rate of 24 bpm. If you read his book he will tell you Aikido is based on LOVE. understand when you play football with a young cousin and he charges you and you step aside and he goes flying. Thats Aikido!
NO, i did not know that..and im wondering how You do..I have studied Ueshiba O'senseis life for some time now, and i have never heard of his practice in this method...perhaps you could direct me where you found this out
I really like that they show the non-aikido version first. I found that to be pretty neat.
A lot of aikido techniques look fake; I can understand speculation. After studying aikido for a few years, however, I'm able to understand what and how Tohei-sensei can subdue three people at once. It still seems crazy to me, of course, I'm nowhere near his level, but I can attest to the veracity of these techniques.
This is actually one of the strongest, most tactical martial arts today. And unlike the "sports" that they allow in MMA, this is a "martial art." Judo is a sport. Kendo is a sport. Boxing is a sport. Aikido, Shinkendo, Hapkido... these are not sports. Sports are effective to a point. Martial arts are effective to a point further.
Try being less of an idiot before you talk to people.
Haha! Wow. There is a reason that aikido isn't allowed in competitions and it's not because it's bogus.
And you can enter MMA fights without knowing martial arts, so bringing that up was kind of lame.
Aikido is a very complex martial art that is actually very, very effective when the techniques are executed properly. Why don't you go ask someone who knows aikido to show you something?
Personaly My advice is not to ask them to show u anything LOL. Chances are they won't hurt you. But they move and deflect so fast you keep wondering if they took your eyes out or your hands off. And you keep thinking he might hit your eyes next time.. (This guy was finely tuned)
I was like a stuned mullet I have never come across anything like that Man ever.
Aikido is better known as shit because it should not be something shared with dick heads. Thats if you have 10 years first of all.
Muy bueno el video. Pero tengo una duda que sucede cuando el sensei es sujetado por detras? Y luego que es lo que le hace sobre el antebrazo? Lo pellizca?
Interesting that you clowns believe Martial Arts means you hurt someone. Why do you want to hurt someone? You are one sick puppy! BS? One of the times I used Aikido was some monkey like you who was a black belt in karate wanted to fight me and I refused and started to walk away he tried to sucker punch me. I or I should say HE broke his wrist. Another time some clown broke his arm while I had my hands in my pocket. We don't enter contests because Thats not what Aikido is about fool!
Amen. The silliness of UFC/MMA is that it basically destroys martial arts by turning it into two idiots running after each other throwing punches till they are bloodied and dumb founded. That's not martial arts, it is called backyard hick boxing.
littleemoboy001...mma uses muay thai jiu jitsu and judo TECHNIQUE. idk how to stress the word technique anymore, to the extent that jiu jitsu and muay thai practitioners can watch the fights and genuinely enjoy watching their techniques be executed properly in a real fight.
the fights that suck are the ones where its like wrestling/boxing fighters.
but that doesnt mean that there arnt real dedicated martial artists fighting mma
Great comment. I had similar experiences. I didn't break anyone's arm, but a clown sent himself flying across the room.
I've been attacked on the street before, and the guy never has time to dance around and throw jabs, because I could just keep walking away. That's why there were always punches flying at me, aimed to connect and harm
A fight requires two aggressors. When you stop becoming one, the other is drawn out of balance, and into your (and Universe's) game.
I must disagree. What you say is true if the agressor is less skilled, but if the agressor is more skilled, it becomes a predator/prey relationship. Too much of a defensive approach allows your opponent to set the pace of the encounter. In that case, you aren't in control at all.
Just because the other guy is the aggressor, doesn't mean that I should be "waiting" for something to happen.
It does, however, dictate a certain arrangement of circumstances that plays well with Aikido approach.
Aikido is often labeled as defensive art while it is pro-active. You start to move when they start to move - you don't wait. In Yoshinkan Aikido it is common to initiate/provoke attack even before the aggressor does.
I must say that does make more sense to me. Thank you for clarifying. But, even if Aikido isn't a defensive art, I know alot of people who treat it that way. One of my sparring partners has the "defensive" attitude, saying aikido is his primary style. He was very frustrating to spar with for a long time. After I learned his angles of circular retreating, though, I was able to back him up to a wall. Then he was kind of helpless. All the best to you in the future.
An Aikidoka, well trained should be able to control an opponent with short bursts of temporary pain. The use of pain is opposed to causing real damage.
Obviously against some opponents you will need to cause more pain to defend yourself from them.
Pain is still a better option than really damaging a person in many fights. For instance what if you were defending yourself from a loved one and you didn't want to cause lasting damage.
Aikido reveals to you that fine line and how to end a fight
On higher levels though, many Aikido pain-compliance techniques (nikkyo, sankyo, kote gaeshi) can be accomplished without causing actual pain.
Pain is a good fallback, but really the core of the techniques lies in establishing connection with attacker's center, taking over their center and throwing them.
I feel that the slight and temporary pain caused by novices practicing Aikido is a good way to describe to the hard technique fanboys that Aikido has presence and power. When I first started I found that pain caused me to focus. That focus then opened my mind to control and fluidity which is what little I may know of ki.
That transformation sounds like what you described. Good, healthy pain forged my mind and it may be what takes some to understand basics of aikido.
If you run into someone who was born deaf how do you tell him what music is. If they are born blind how do you tell him whjat you see and et al. The gift of smell is one of our most sensitive yet we are sledom aware of it. If you can't measure something that doesn't exist YET how do we know if it works or not. How come I have a resting heart beat of 24 BPM. How come I can sit on the bottom of a pool for 5 min or sit outside naked in 60 below zero weather? Try it (Aikido)you'll like it.
Some time ago I witnessed an "unbendable arm" demo at a martial arts exposition. This guy with arms outstretched had 2 students on each arm apparently unable to move him or his arms as much as they "tried". I requested to try as this smacked of pure deception. Except I asked to hang from his wrist with my feet off the ground. If 2 students couldn't move a single arm he should be able to hold my 190 LB body weight with no problem. Well, he declined my offer which is what I expected.
In terms of the unbendable arm, I dont think it has anything to do with strength and holding anybodies weight. Its about using weight underside, relaxation and extending energy outwards to create an arm that wont bend rather than using muscles to try and do the same thing. I think sweetsweaty is missing the point.
And this is the ultimate achievement in Aikido, to perform Aikido without using excess muscular strength which is why KI is emphasised so the practitioner has some concept to use in order to achieve effortless power. Most martial arts except for the internal ones rely on speed and strength for their techniques because its all about winning. Aikido encourages people to learn and discover the power of effortlessness which takes many many years to uncover.
An arm is a lever with hinges All levers bend, that is their nature. It is ONLY the contraction of tendons and muscles that control arm movement. To suggest that some (undefined, non-mechanicall) force is at work to keep an arm from bending is a violation of mathematically proven Newtonian mechanics.
So is the reality of the human spirit living after death, thats a violation of mathematically proven science also. But science cannot prove its not real. There are somethings in nature that require us to take a leap of faith, for many people this is very hard to do. Im not saying Ki exists because I dont know anything about it, but I do know that science is not the be all and end all of our understanding of the universe.
Science is not meant to be the be all, end all. It is simply a reliable method for understanding the physical universe. What we ultimately conclude is subject to human error and frailty but it's the methodology we use to discover truths that
Sorry, my comment got cut off. To be fair to your point, yes I think scientific method should be open to different avenues of exploration. And following that... claims for new discoveries in energy (like ki) should be looked into. But we also need some method to validation the claim because as we all know the world is full of crazy and ridiculous claims. Subjecting claims which appear to violate physical laws to observable, repeatable testing is not an unreasonable approach.
Then perhaps somebody should make a scientific study of ki and find out what it actually is. Sure, there are people out there making unsubstantiated claims on this and that but then for an entire culture to embrace the concept of ki, there must be something in it.
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A lot of bullshit in there. Ki projection for instance, A complete crock, fraud, teacher elitism and arrogance. Damn it, you can see the uke throwing himself, he recoils and jumps away as though he has been thrown by Tohei's ki. Watch it in slow motion. I gave aikido the benefit of my doubt but the more I aikido clips I watch, the more I see fraud, phoniness and BS. The fakery is SO transparent.
looks like u dont understand the concept of ki. ki is something u ALWAYS use. what u saw is him using pressure points on the guy n the guy getting away from him. he didnt force him in a direction but the guy choses to pull away cuz it fuccin hurts.
I aggree with you sweetyfootmasterguy. I want to believe in this shit because it looks cool. I've read the books people told me to read and had people put me in arm locks but I wasnt resisting. The idea that the average person can learn some aikido and deftly defeat a knife weilding attacker is ridiculous. Maybe a good sized bouncer or a cop could use acouple locks here and there.
IT IS SO OBVIOUS YOU HAVE NEVER TRAINED IN A REAL AIKIDO SCHOOL.maybe you "tested" a few moves with abuddy or something. But I have trained in BJJ, Kenpo, Kajukenbo, And Aikido. there is NO Faking. You mistake training principles for the art. I mean i have for now 17 years training and will practice AIkido until i am old and grey, cant do that with MMA.
No matter what you say ki projection IS pure BS. And they always refuse to prove it under controlled objective testing. It's always with a student and always a demo. I make no claims for myself but I know faked movements when I see them. You can see the guy jumping, you can see him recoiling his legs before jumping. It is so obvious. For once, just once, let's see a clip of a real resisting trained fighter in an actual match with aikido man. I would wager money on the outcome.
because if it was in a real match it would look similar to jujutsu. not bjj but jjj. japanese jj has all of this in it, the difference is aikido focuses on the aiki aspect alone and takes a far more pacifistic and esoteric approach to training. also it has been used in combat by the early practitioners. true its not used in mma cage fighting now days. aikido is a far more self defense system then fighting system. the element of surprise compared to exchanging blows knowings whats coming at you.
Sorry but that's just wishful thinking. Whether aikido is effectiveor not has NOT been demonstratively proven at least not in any video I've seen. But the real issue I have problem with is ki projection. Do you really believe this Tohei guy barely touches his student and he just flies away? Can't you see that the uke recoils and jumps away? It's so obvious. Give this, what am I supposed to think of aikido?
I am not sure where you got the idea that they were jumping back because of a ki projection. i think they were flying backwards because it hurt like hell!
Like when teacher winds the students forearm like a wristwatch then does his magic tap and student goes flying. Am I expected to believe that? Like his magic ki force can make anything come true. THAT is dreamland.
It looks like teacher was winding up his music box. But to be specific, the student didn't just pull his arm away which would be expected, his whole body leaped away. This is done to dramatize the art and it is NOT uncommon that uke's do cooperate in order to make teacher and the demo look good. Reality is very different thing and I have never, (no not once) seen a clip of real contest between a skilled aikidoka and a resisting skilled fighter of another discipline.
mainly because aikido see no purpose in doings such things. its taught to cops for its arresting techniques, but you are right there are no real videos of aikido fight, mainly because its not a fighting art its a self defense art. big difference. meanings the person doesnt expect a person to counter. fighting arts expect a person to square off in a ring and fight. aikido merely surprise and restrains. its the aiki of jujutsu basically, just more spiritual
Ya and its not as super powered as they claim, but thats any martial art. the people practicing always think its better then it really is be that bjj, boxing, karate, or aikido.
Not all styles of Aikido focus on Ki-development as an external force. But Ki is simply the energy within us all. We ALL have it. In Aikido you must just learn to recognize it when its thrown at you, such as a PUNCH. You learn to use the energy that the attacker has presented you with against them. Is that really so hard to understand?
Ki is a non-scientific concept that is founded in ancient mysticism. All energy has identity & can be measured. Ki has NEVER been proven to exist in any objective test. The best way to test for ki is have a "ki master" lift heavy weights. With the assistance of ki they ought to be able lift far more weight than someone of comparable size. The simple answer is they cannot and have NEVER been able to demonstrate this simple task of increased strength through ki.
Sweaty feet- You should not comment with such confidence in matters that you have no real experience. It is quite obvious that you have not trained Aikido for any length of time or you would not say such ignorant things. As for your reference to scientific measurement of ki, there are a multitude of peer reviewed studies of non-local energy and bio-energy fields. Furthermore, science is constantly proving itself wrong. Go back 50 years and much of what we "knew" has been proven wrong. Feel!
Sir, with respect I DO know something about the laws of physics, enough to know that "ki demos" violate every one of them. By measurement I am not talking about measuring ki energy fields. I am referring to the physical feats of strength claimed as a result of ki. Now THAT can easily be measured. Throw some weights on these guys, just about 100 Kilos will do. Let us see if their ki works with weights as well as it does with their students. Trouble is they refuse such a test... why?
And BTW I make no judgement on what you study or have studied. I respect what you do. I especially have respect for BJJ since it has at least proven itself in actual combative matches and is truly effective. I respect many of the martial arts.
It is these crazy aikido demo clips with ki projection and other silly stunts that I question. And I'm certainly not alone in this opinion.
did i mention i teach aikido? non of my student "fall" for me, Ukemi is an art that save your own joints, I promise you that it is like electricity, harmless in the walls, put it in an unsafe arena and yes it can kill you. to some people, nascar seams fake because the drivers don't constantly wreck each other... peace.
for anyone who was wondering, that is what tohei refered to as 'ki pinching' if you notice he pinches his uke's thighs. Very difficult to learn how to do it
I have been doing aikido for 3 years, and although it is very hard to do a technique on a trained aikidoka who is resisting, I have found out that aikido works very well on attackers who have an "evil intent." In any case, aikido is a great tool to use.
Do you have any Aikido videos of someone using it vs other styles???? I mean, style vs the same style is one thing, who would do against something like MT or JJ??
the closest your gonna get to seeing Aikido against realistic attackers is an old Steven Segeal movie. I trained in karate and aikido, and I'll tell you straight, it takes 5+years for Aikido to be worth a damn against a trained striker of only a couple years.
How you want grab a twister? This is no sport! This is real budo, material art you know. Pratice 10 years and more, maybe you will understand something.The Aikido.clip represent also the training together to learn something and to grow up together, not to destroy. How you want train with hurt trainingpartners. In real fight....
I want to see aikido used in a real attack... not someone just walking up and letting someone grab them. If they just let you grab them without trying to avoid it or fight back, what good is it? In a real situation you need to defend yourself, not dance around with him.
the whole point of the art is not to attack!!! its a art of defense there is no offense. you will not see this used to attack because it will not work as a attack. second its used through out the world on police forces to restrain people with out breaking them up. the Japaneses police force learns Aikido as well as judo. this is something just used by some crack pots down the street its actually used in real life by real people as part of their job.
So you are saying someone walks up to mug you with a knife is not an attack? I understand that the guy in the middle is defending and using aikido... The people he's throwing around should be doing REAL attacks. Not running to his left or right letting themselves get flipped around. It's not very realistic defending against someone who wants you to succeed with throwing them in the first place.
this a demo clip. even bjj and judo in their demo are going to look good. if you look like crap in your vids do you really want to study it? second, if you are good at a art you make it look effortless when you do the technique. its hard to get a person to attack you blindly knowing they could get hurt very very badly by fighting the technique like the guy on the street is. its a demo not real life. training can never truly be reality.
training might not be the actual reality but by adding elements such as real weapons, hard attacks, real-life situations(grabs, chokes etc.) it will be that close...
also for people who do not want to maim the attacker, holds and grabs that do not allow the attacker to take a swing and keep the defender in control are better than punches and kicks.
steven seagal is burnt out? he`s just an actor¿? well i will be very gradful if a sensei like him ACCEPTS to teach me the harmony of aikido....excellent demostration of ki power by the way.
you cannot do fully aikido techniques without ki energy means comes from spiritual one's individual body to blast off the enemies away you see it sudden fall the uke with some impossibilities, it means it is art of magic that who does perform such ki powers that can suddenly harm their own body in the future...
you cannot do fully aikido techniques without ki energy means comes from spiritual one's individual body, it means it is art of magic that can suddenly harm their body in the future...
People who argue only about the effectiveness of the martial arts styles in defeating an opponent are ignoring what martial arts is meant to be and what it's meant to accomplish. The benefits of martial arts is to improve one's self mastery and judgement, and to provide a physical framework in which it is safe to spar and learn about the body's movement and weaknesses.
andwhatfire 5 months ago
@andwhatfire
As seeing only the combat can rob oneself of half the lesson so may seeing what is not effective as something that is.. Therefore we must seek to find truth within ourselves and also truth of what is real and effective in combat.
trondyne 5 months ago
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andwhatfire 5 months ago
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andwhatfire 5 months ago
RIP Koichi Tohei Sensei.
glimmerman108 8 months ago
amazing!
taseljoff 1 year ago
The grab on :43 sec. you asked about is sankyo. it can be a pressure point, but is mostly used to lead and move your partners mind through extending ki and having them agree to follow u. If the attacker fights and struggles then they inflict this pressure point apon themselves..
seanyboy1978 1 year ago
The arm grab as you asked is sankyo. It can be a pressure point but is mostly used to lead and extend ki though your attacker to move his mind and agree to follow. If they struggle then they are inflicting the pressure point on themselves. It is at :43 second on the video
seanyboy1978 1 year ago
The arm grab as you asked is sankyo. It can be a pressure point but is mostly used to lead and extend ki though your attacker to move his mind and agree to follow. If they struggle then they are inflicting the pressure point on themselves.
seanyboy1978 1 year ago
The arm grab at :43... What did he do, pressure point or simply breaking balance? I can't quite see.
risdon34 1 year ago
@risdon34
Looks like a combination of both. Can a practitioner pull it (and other things) off on a live resisting opponent?? That is the question.
trondyne 1 year ago
@trondyne
When a technique that I'm not familiar with is applied to me quickly often my natural resistance works against me. When I get this reaction out of others (albeit in the dojo) I see the techniques in a different light.
I would say against full resistance they do not work. When quick and unexpected it can be easy to break even a strong joint.
risdon34 1 year ago
@risdon34
Any technique worth a damn will work under resistance.. Now that doesn't mean that any technique must work all the time, you need to adapt in the moment..and use the right move.. However, if the move is of any real use there shouldn't be any special cooperation needed. Use examples that are known to work, like a Rear Naked Choke or an Armbar.. If the technique can't be used like those examples are (under the right positional and timing conditions) then we need to re-evaluate.
trondyne 1 year ago
@trondyne
An armbar is certainly more effective and less risky than most wrist locks and yet some MMA fighters are great at resisting long enough to find a way out. Also it's often inappropriate to lie on the ground just to apply a technique. Chokes are amazing unless you're a police officer and fear litigation.
We need a lot of options in case our opponent moves in a way we don't expect or finds a way to resist. I'm not going to pinch anybody, mind! That was a bit silly.
risdon34 1 year ago
@trondyne
Any direct irimi or atemi-waza, off the top of my head.. Kaiten nage looks somewhat like Tony Blauer's startle flinch response, and might give a clue to how we might look at the origins of aikido's techniques or its applications.
Also remember that aikido strives the 'harmony of force'.. If the attacker moves in such a way technique x is unlogical to apply, then of course it wouldn't work.. Would you do an armbar on someone who's kicking you?
cryodragoon 1 year ago
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@risdon34 "The arm grab at :43... What did he do, pressure point or simply breaking balance? I can't quite see."
I haven't learned this technique, but he appears to be pinching the brachial artery. I can say from experience (not dojo related) that it hurts quite a bit and I can easily imagine its effectiveness at encouraging cooperation. A major plus is that it doesn't matter how big their arms are, there's always a space between the bicep and tricep big enough to fit some fingers :-)
blackmetalwhiteguy 1 month ago
What's the difference with O-Sensei's aikido?
emanresu81 2 years ago
if one style was superior to all the others it would have dominated them and there would be only one way of fighting.
cassidy99ful 2 years ago
Arguably it has or is.
Styles and methods were regional however with training moving in a particular direction in different regions and cultures.
Most don't really train hard core and fight so results are often theoretical.
I would also say that Aiki is not fighting per se..
trondyne 2 years ago
@cassidy99ful thats foolish, many differing views that are different but there are ways that are superior. Look at the way a teenage boy trains over that of an NBA star there is one that is superior, but guess what coaches still train the boys in ways that aren't the best.
tojiro12 1 year ago
A thought.
According to one prominent teacher, contact must be established in order? to apply some Aiki.. As we know in CMA this is called bridging.
If we think of applying Aiki by reacting off alive energy (feel) as in ChiSao then IMO the ability to apply may be more practical. Feeling vs seeing, the former is much faster and allows for alive adaptation, IOW harmonizing with him to dissolve his attack. ChiSao or a similar kind of drill could well be used to assist in training Aikido.
trondyne 2 years ago
So, uh, why are we poo pooing anyones style? I mean, they are all good for different things. I'm not going to say what I do because I'm pretty sure someone will say something to this affect, "Dude, I can beat that any day, your style sucks!"
I commend anyone who says something like this for their stupidity in the arts.
Stuiiiii 2 years ago
Well we should be mindful of respect for all styles.. Still some styles may well be better suited to certain things.. Aikido was after all the created to be as non violent as possible following the founders respect for the sanctity of life.. Aikijujitsu less so...
IMO we can learn something from most styles assuming we have access to good instruction which is hard to come by.
trondyne 2 years ago
Aikido..or I should say, aikido-style techniques (aiki-waza) aren't as effective as Aikido makes them out to be. A good aikijujutsu style on the other hand...much more realistic.
BuckMuscles 2 years ago 4
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There are no techniques in Aikido.
ketsan 2 years ago
Did you mean to state there are no STRIKES in aikido, or were you being "ironic"?
DippShits 2 years ago 12
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No, there are no techniques in Aikido.
ketsan 2 years ago
DippShits 2 years ago 12
This comment has received too many negative votes show
"In reality, Aikido has no forms, no set patterns. It is like an invisible wave of energy. However such a phenomenon is too difficult for human beings to grasp, so we use provisional forms to explain it and put it into practice." Morihei Ueshiba.
You've described the various provisional forms but in reality there are no techniques, no forms.
NEXT RETARD PLEASE
ketsan 2 years ago
Gentlemen please!
This is all semantics.
Can we all agree on the following clarification: "There are no EFFECTIVE techniques in Aikido." (against a resisting opponent)
WingChum 2 years ago 8
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Uh huh. There's three of our ineffective techniques in your video in the first two minutes. Well done for slating your own art.
ketsan 2 years ago
Now you are claiming there ARE techniques in Aikido as you can see them in a Wing Chun Kung Fu video???
DippShits 2 years ago 12
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Provisional forms.
ketsan 2 years ago
The problem with pretending to be smarter than you actually are, is that you insult your own TRUE intelligence (which you obviously have) as well as the people you are trying to impress with a written knowledge of Morihei Ueshiba's TRANSLATED words.
iqwaxzi 2 years ago 12
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Yeah but I have okuden too which teach the exact same thing.
ketsan 2 years ago
Yeah but, no but...
...I am caught up in a nonsensical debate with a bloody kid!
DippShits 2 years ago 12
This comment has received too many negative votes show
No you're just dim. I stated there are no techniques, you disagreed, I quoted O-Sensei. WingChum then thought he'd be smart but failed utterly because he's posted a vid presumably from his own art that has half the Aikido syllabus up to 4th kyu in it. Because he used the word techniques I did also. Then you thought I was contradicting myself when in fact I was just being lazy. Iqwaxzi then failed to realise that what's written in the book is also passed on verbally in the dojo.
ketsan 2 years ago
Go to a lesson at a respectable association (probably not kiAikido) try and resist and see what happens.
If the technique is put on correctly it will work..
Seems quite silly for a wing chunner to make a comment like that when your style has as much validity and very simmilar theories.
stingrae789 2 years ago
@stingrae789
Were you following the thread?
I was one of several youtubers making fun of a kid named ketsan who knows everything...
...and nothing, both at the same time because he is a Zen Master, apparently.
I have genuine respect for AiKiDo and its practitioners , as long as they have a sense of humour ;)
WingChum 2 years ago 10
you are right. no one ever used it. it´s all an illusion that has perpretrated for MANY DECADES, and everyone that has every tried to use aikido in a combat has failed... NOT!!!!
camilo862 2 years ago
@camilo862
Your reply makes no sense...
...have you been following the thread?
We were making fun of ketsan, NOT disrespecting Aikido.
WingChum 2 years ago
Go ahead, laugh. I'm right and there's no way for you to demonstrate otherwise because you don't have the training..
ketsan 2 years ago
Is this serious? No effective techniques?
Take a look at what Gary Lam is doing these days.. His Chun is looking more and more like Aikido...
trondyne 2 years ago
3RD TIME!
Were you following the thread?
I was one of several youtubers making fun of a kid named ketsan who knows everything...
...and nothing, both at the same time because he is a Zen Master, apparently.
I have genuine respect for AiKiDo and its practitioners , as long as they have a sense of humour ;)
WingChum 2 years ago
Uesheba said 90% of self defense in Aiki is Atemi...
trondyne 2 years ago
So you do not do the one, two, three defence rather one, four, two, five etc dependant on where you are and the attacker. Just watch the opening sequence of the Segal film Nico for this demonstration. One person attacks him and he puts him in front of the next. And remember Aikido did evolve from the Daito-Ryu Samurai arts. They were well honed at fighting on battlefields so it does work in multi attacks.
Justavaragejoe 2 years ago 2
The training in those arts teaches this. Aikido when multiple attacked you move in to a position where you a) put the the first person you deal with in front of or into the next attacker. B) you use the attackers attack to move past them to deal with the person to the side or behind. In other words you constantly force the multiple attackers to step over around each other.
Justavaragejoe 2 years ago 2
I notice on a few aikido vids on YT people stating if you got attacked by many people and you did Aikido you would lose (or to that effect). Actually any martial art style can lose but Aikido is the best I know. I will explain. In Karate, gung Fu, etc you defend on principle the first attacker, then second, third etc. Fighting each then moving on to the next.
Justavaragejoe 2 years ago 2
0:23
"I love you man!"
"yeah... love me over there."
XD
RyuuKyuzo 2 years ago 2
My grandpa used to grab my arm like that (0:43).
swellsrise 2 years ago 3
Kudos for showing a video that doesn't contain junk music.
Toophless1 2 years ago 7
If a bully or a group of bullies want to fight with you ,you can t be agree with this philosophy because you must damage your enemies
browin44 2 years ago
In a street aggression against 4 bullies for example if you applicate these principles they massacre you expecially if they are armed
browin44 2 years ago
you shouldnt damage your enemy
browin44 2 years ago
Aikido philosophy does NOT forbid you to damage an enemy. It simply says it is not necessary.
Deke101 2 years ago 7
Actually O-Sensei said "Aikido is the martial art where we try not to kill people."
ketsan 2 years ago 3
yes but according to aikido philosophy
browin44 2 years ago
yes but it should be a martial art..............
browin44 2 years ago
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Aikido IS a martial art.
Deke101 2 years ago
its techniques are effective but i don t like its philosophy a martial art mutsnt t be violent but it can t be an art of peace to be martial martial means combattive not art of peace as aikido
browin44 2 years ago
Aikido does not mean art of peace. It means Way of Harmony. Keep in mind that a hurricane and the tornado are in harmony with nature. I would not call either of these things peaceful.
Aikido is conflict resolution in harmony with the laws of nature.
Deke101 2 years ago
to defend yourself you have not to be violent but you need to be martial aikido is too pacifist it looks like gandhi or Gesù
browin44 2 years ago
remember though that Gandhi did free India....
Chessmate25 2 years ago
aikido could be ineffective as selfdefence not because of its techniques but because of its too pacifist philosophy
browin44 2 years ago
Aikido philosophy is NOT pacifist, it is assertive. Picture a parent controlling one's child.
Deke101 2 years ago
""In Yoshinkan Aikido, it is common to initiate/provoke attack even before the aggressor does. ""
I whole-heartedly agree, Shihonage!
NakedMovieStar 2 years ago
The founder of Aikido Morihei Ueshiba Didn't intend for Aikido to be used for fighting but for peace. He was originally a Swordsman & practitioner of several old Jujutsu Ryu. IMHO, Aikido died with him as he could really make the techniques work due to his vast knowledge of Jujutsu and his fighting experience. Problem with Aikido now is that Practitioners think they can do what O-Sensei could do but without fighting for real against resisting opponents...Not!! there is no magic in fighting!
jukido987 2 years ago
in Aikido you use what your oponent attacks you with, so no matter how passive you are, when the attacks come you work with what is given to you. Aikido is a martial ART, it's not intended to do harm, so if you are passive while there is no attack directed at you, you are doing what you are supposed to be doing.
morbidni3 2 years ago
Oooo Kay
jukido987 2 years ago
Jukido is correct. I trained aikido intesnely for a long time. My instructor even said it is a study of movement with some martial applications. Now he would roll with greco and karate guys and win. But he ended up using more taijitsu then aikido. And he was the most natural athlete I have ever met. But he was honest in his description of aikido.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
Effectivity of the art depends on the person executing the technique. If your sensei can not make it work, he is the problem and not the art.
abtikamot 2 years ago
abtikamot. please be honest with yourself, enough Aikido ideology. Show me a video of an Aiki defeated a BJJ or a Greco. Think about the the development of Aikido as Jukido very honestly outlined. Clearly an art can be ineffective for purposes - example sport BJJ is not as good against mulitple attackers. What you said is complete nonsense, if it were true, than there is no reason to learn an art if the art has not affect on effectiveness, only the practitioner.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
Sorry but I can not show you any video, BJJ or a Greco is are meant for sports....but if you can imagine the situation...full pack with bandolier and you just run for say 5 miles in a mountainous terrain and then you a met 3 machete welding persons who wants to kill you. Try your BJJ or Greco. .
abtikamot 2 years ago
ok show me Aikido guy defeating a person trained in Eskrima. I would rather know taijitsu, butjitsu, or daito ryu. In fact, if you are in San Diego, I will come to your dojo and hit you with my bokken.
Anyways, is this the situation you expect to encounter? if so then you probably should get a gun and learn how to use it as well as your martial art. Or at least get a kitana and study iaido.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
I was trained in stick fighting too, and we dont call it escrima....we call it baston or commonly known as arnis de mano.. for info I was from the town that was one of the originator of arnis de mano, and pangamot etc.and I am very sorry I can not invite you to my dojo, I dont have one and I still live in my old town. and yes I do encountered such threats.
abtikamot 2 years ago
Let me be clear, I trained aikido intensely for almost five years. And some techniques are good. But I never ran into to more unsubstantiated egos in any other setting... no respect for other arts or viewpoint and an inability to discuss concerns of meeting a boxer or bjj in the streets, or someone who will fake, won't follow, or is trained in knife fighting. They cared less about these practical safety concerns and more about there self-righteous superiority and were very defensive.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
Then you will know that some aikido evolve into some kind of cultural arts. But if you look closely a lot of the techniques are very practical and it is the martial aspect of aikido.
abtikamot 2 years ago
That is something I agree with %100.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
I am sorry you were in a really lousy dojo. One of the basic tennets of Aikido is humility and control of one's small ego.
I remember the sign on the wall in my first dojo read "Please leave your shoes and your ego here at this doorway."
Deke101 2 years ago
It sounds very different to my experience. We talked about these things all the time. Any time a new student came along from a different style we would ask them to demonstrate as much as they could so we could better understand defence against their previous style. Many of the other students I trained with were security staff ('bouncers') from night clubs. The used Aikido techniques against armed (knives) and unarmed (drunk/drugged) patrons who really wanted to hurt them. Aikido seemed to work.
N17C1 2 years ago
if your dojo is in San Diego, I will come and you can prove me wrong.
WHenryGuitar 2 years ago
YOU people remind me of people who like to argue just to argue. After you read OSense's books then try and talk to someone who is a Akidoist. OSense traveled all over Japan and fought/trained with everyone he came across. Aikido ios NOT about who is best but a way of living. Other "arts" are about killing and hurting some one Aikido is about living in harmony with the universe. You guys pull men down Aikido lifts man up.
Dallouez 2 years ago 10
You put it very well my friend.That is all true to what you said.Greetings
fotisaiki 2 years ago
Interesting how you preach non-combativeness while you are so defensive about other's comments. You seem to be doing as much arguing as anyone here. Everyone is entitled to their perspective and IF you were truly at peace as you profess, you would be busy with constructive activities rather than telling others they are wrong because their philosophy is not in alignment with your own.
Perhaps you should remove the board from your own eye before attempting to remove the splinter from another's.
YanseDaHouzi 2 years ago
I think it is interesting that so many people who watch this have NO idea what it's all about. Why do you want to hurt and kill one another? I don't know where the name ART came from since it is all about killing. You hate mongers need to read his books. Aikido began over OSense refusing to fight his close friend. My friend, a champion karate instructor, is 40 and has physicial problems. OSense is 80 and still going strong ALL day.
Dallouez 2 years ago
If you are serious about Aikido you should learn to meditate and budism. Too many people bastardized Aikido and use SOME tech without realizing the other. I discovered I could sit on the bottom of a pool for about 5 min. I also have a resting heart rate of 24 bpm. If you read his book he will tell you Aikido is based on LOVE. understand when you play football with a young cousin and he charges you and you step aside and he goes flying. Thats Aikido!
Dallouez 2 years ago
@Dallouez
I partially agree with that,but I wouldn't change my faith for nothing,even If I was 100 % sure That God I believe in doesn't exist....
GoblinBerserker 2 years ago
DID u know the creater of akido learned from the kuki family which is one of our ryu in ninjutsu (bujinkan budo taijutsu) kukishin ryu?
maceioninjutsu 2 years ago
NO, i did not know that..and im wondering how You do..I have studied Ueshiba O'senseis life for some time now, and i have never heard of his practice in this method...perhaps you could direct me where you found this out
DmakAttack 2 years ago
Aikido Ellis Video Channel
Kenshiro Abbe - Tadashi Abe- Masahilo Nakazono - M Noro - TK Chiba and much more
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Aikitrad 2 years ago
I really like that they show the non-aikido version first. I found that to be pretty neat.
A lot of aikido techniques look fake; I can understand speculation. After studying aikido for a few years, however, I'm able to understand what and how Tohei-sensei can subdue three people at once. It still seems crazy to me, of course, I'm nowhere near his level, but I can attest to the veracity of these techniques.
yoruketseki 3 years ago
I said "speculation" but I meant "skepticism." -,-
yoruketseki 3 years ago
This is actually one of the strongest, most tactical martial arts today. And unlike the "sports" that they allow in MMA, this is a "martial art." Judo is a sport. Kendo is a sport. Boxing is a sport. Aikido, Shinkendo, Hapkido... these are not sports. Sports are effective to a point. Martial arts are effective to a point further.
Try being less of an idiot before you talk to people.
yoruketseki 3 years ago
Haha! Wow. There is a reason that aikido isn't allowed in competitions and it's not because it's bogus.
And you can enter MMA fights without knowing martial arts, so bringing that up was kind of lame.
Aikido is a very complex martial art that is actually very, very effective when the techniques are executed properly. Why don't you go ask someone who knows aikido to show you something?
yoruketseki 3 years ago
Personaly My advice is not to ask them to show u anything LOL. Chances are they won't hurt you. But they move and deflect so fast you keep wondering if they took your eyes out or your hands off. And you keep thinking he might hit your eyes next time.. (This guy was finely tuned)
I was like a stuned mullet I have never come across anything like that Man ever.
Aikido is better known as shit because it should not be something shared with dick heads. Thats if you have 10 years first of all.
microsoftbighard 3 years ago
Muy bueno el video. Pero tengo una duda que sucede cuando el sensei es sujetado por detras? Y luego que es lo que le hace sobre el antebrazo? Lo pellizca?
maoxfranki 3 years ago
Interesting that you clowns believe Martial Arts means you hurt someone. Why do you want to hurt someone? You are one sick puppy! BS? One of the times I used Aikido was some monkey like you who was a black belt in karate wanted to fight me and I refused and started to walk away he tried to sucker punch me. I or I should say HE broke his wrist. Another time some clown broke his arm while I had my hands in my pocket. We don't enter contests because Thats not what Aikido is about fool!
Dallouez 3 years ago 4
Amen. The silliness of UFC/MMA is that it basically destroys martial arts by turning it into two idiots running after each other throwing punches till they are bloodied and dumb founded. That's not martial arts, it is called backyard hick boxing.
LittleEmoBoy001 3 years ago 8
littleemoboy001...mma uses muay thai jiu jitsu and judo TECHNIQUE. idk how to stress the word technique anymore, to the extent that jiu jitsu and muay thai practitioners can watch the fights and genuinely enjoy watching their techniques be executed properly in a real fight.
the fights that suck are the ones where its like wrestling/boxing fighters.
but that doesnt mean that there arnt real dedicated martial artists fighting mma
weloveyoudimebag 3 years ago
Great comment. I had similar experiences. I didn't break anyone's arm, but a clown sent himself flying across the room.
I've been attacked on the street before, and the guy never has time to dance around and throw jabs, because I could just keep walking away. That's why there were always punches flying at me, aimed to connect and harm
A fight requires two aggressors. When you stop becoming one, the other is drawn out of balance, and into your (and Universe's) game.
The Universe usually wins.
shihonage 2 years ago 5
pretty kewel comment kid...and deep
G0dspelronin 2 years ago
Thanks, kiddo
shihonage 2 years ago
I must disagree. What you say is true if the agressor is less skilled, but if the agressor is more skilled, it becomes a predator/prey relationship. Too much of a defensive approach allows your opponent to set the pace of the encounter. In that case, you aren't in control at all.
auronguy 2 years ago
Don't mistake what I said for faux-pacifism.
Just because the other guy is the aggressor, doesn't mean that I should be "waiting" for something to happen.
It does, however, dictate a certain arrangement of circumstances that plays well with Aikido approach.
Aikido is often labeled as defensive art while it is pro-active. You start to move when they start to move - you don't wait. In Yoshinkan Aikido it is common to initiate/provoke attack even before the aggressor does.
shihonage 2 years ago
I must say that does make more sense to me. Thank you for clarifying. But, even if Aikido isn't a defensive art, I know alot of people who treat it that way. One of my sparring partners has the "defensive" attitude, saying aikido is his primary style. He was very frustrating to spar with for a long time. After I learned his angles of circular retreating, though, I was able to back him up to a wall. Then he was kind of helpless. All the best to you in the future.
auronguy 2 years ago
Aikido is as much about evasion as it is about entry (irimi), direct and indirect. Most of all, he has to be able to close openings with strikes.
O Sensei himself said things like "here, in real life situation, smash attacker's face full force".
There's a movement of Aiki-hippies however who prefer to pretend Aikido can work purely with a defensive mindset.
Ending a conflict harmoniously, Aikido-way, should feel light to defender, but severe to attacker, and make them afraid for their life.
shihonage 2 years ago
An Aikidoka, well trained should be able to control an opponent with short bursts of temporary pain. The use of pain is opposed to causing real damage.
Obviously against some opponents you will need to cause more pain to defend yourself from them.
Pain is still a better option than really damaging a person in many fights. For instance what if you were defending yourself from a loved one and you didn't want to cause lasting damage.
Aikido reveals to you that fine line and how to end a fight
beansnrice321 2 years ago
On higher levels though, many Aikido pain-compliance techniques (nikkyo, sankyo, kote gaeshi) can be accomplished without causing actual pain.
Pain is a good fallback, but really the core of the techniques lies in establishing connection with attacker's center, taking over their center and throwing them.
shihonage 2 years ago
I feel that the slight and temporary pain caused by novices practicing Aikido is a good way to describe to the hard technique fanboys that Aikido has presence and power. When I first started I found that pain caused me to focus. That focus then opened my mind to control and fluidity which is what little I may know of ki.
That transformation sounds like what you described. Good, healthy pain forged my mind and it may be what takes some to understand basics of aikido.
beansnrice321 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
absolutely ridiculous
eafkuor 3 years ago
If you run into someone who was born deaf how do you tell him what music is. If they are born blind how do you tell him whjat you see and et al. The gift of smell is one of our most sensitive yet we are sledom aware of it. If you can't measure something that doesn't exist YET how do we know if it works or not. How come I have a resting heart beat of 24 BPM. How come I can sit on the bottom of a pool for 5 min or sit outside naked in 60 below zero weather? Try it (Aikido)you'll like it.
Dallouez 3 years ago
Some time ago I witnessed an "unbendable arm" demo at a martial arts exposition. This guy with arms outstretched had 2 students on each arm apparently unable to move him or his arms as much as they "tried". I requested to try as this smacked of pure deception. Except I asked to hang from his wrist with my feet off the ground. If 2 students couldn't move a single arm he should be able to hold my 190 LB body weight with no problem. Well, he declined my offer which is what I expected.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
In terms of the unbendable arm, I dont think it has anything to do with strength and holding anybodies weight. Its about using weight underside, relaxation and extending energy outwards to create an arm that wont bend rather than using muscles to try and do the same thing. I think sweetsweaty is missing the point.
Aikimans 3 years ago
And this is the ultimate achievement in Aikido, to perform Aikido without using excess muscular strength which is why KI is emphasised so the practitioner has some concept to use in order to achieve effortless power. Most martial arts except for the internal ones rely on speed and strength for their techniques because its all about winning. Aikido encourages people to learn and discover the power of effortlessness which takes many many years to uncover.
Aikimans 3 years ago
An arm is a lever with hinges All levers bend, that is their nature. It is ONLY the contraction of tendons and muscles that control arm movement. To suggest that some (undefined, non-mechanicall) force is at work to keep an arm from bending is a violation of mathematically proven Newtonian mechanics.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
So is the reality of the human spirit living after death, thats a violation of mathematically proven science also. But science cannot prove its not real. There are somethings in nature that require us to take a leap of faith, for many people this is very hard to do. Im not saying Ki exists because I dont know anything about it, but I do know that science is not the be all and end all of our understanding of the universe.
Aikimans 3 years ago
Science is not meant to be the be all, end all. It is simply a reliable method for understanding the physical universe. What we ultimately conclude is subject to human error and frailty but it's the methodology we use to discover truths that
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
Sorry, my comment got cut off. To be fair to your point, yes I think scientific method should be open to different avenues of exploration. And following that... claims for new discoveries in energy (like ki) should be looked into. But we also need some method to validation the claim because as we all know the world is full of crazy and ridiculous claims. Subjecting claims which appear to violate physical laws to observable, repeatable testing is not an unreasonable approach.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
Then perhaps somebody should make a scientific study of ki and find out what it actually is. Sure, there are people out there making unsubstantiated claims on this and that but then for an entire culture to embrace the concept of ki, there must be something in it.
Aikimans 3 years ago
explaining most of the things with scientific "spectacles" i sfine. some things are not to be explained. otherwise magic is lost.
manicap1 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
A lot of bullshit in there. Ki projection for instance, A complete crock, fraud, teacher elitism and arrogance. Damn it, you can see the uke throwing himself, he recoils and jumps away as though he has been thrown by Tohei's ki. Watch it in slow motion. I gave aikido the benefit of my doubt but the more I aikido clips I watch, the more I see fraud, phoniness and BS. The fakery is SO transparent.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
looks like u dont understand the concept of ki. ki is something u ALWAYS use. what u saw is him using pressure points on the guy n the guy getting away from him. he didnt force him in a direction but the guy choses to pull away cuz it fuccin hurts.
ABoy877 3 years ago
anyway onez u experience it on your own by somebody who is half ur size u'll believe it 2
ABoy877 3 years ago
I agree..... let an aikido blackbelt grab you up...then tell me it's a crock
Dovemagician 3 years ago
I aggree with you sweetyfootmasterguy. I want to believe in this shit because it looks cool. I've read the books people told me to read and had people put me in arm locks but I wasnt resisting. The idea that the average person can learn some aikido and deftly defeat a knife weilding attacker is ridiculous. Maybe a good sized bouncer or a cop could use acouple locks here and there.
Lymmar 3 years ago
IT IS SO OBVIOUS YOU HAVE NEVER TRAINED IN A REAL AIKIDO SCHOOL.maybe you "tested" a few moves with abuddy or something. But I have trained in BJJ, Kenpo, Kajukenbo, And Aikido. there is NO Faking. You mistake training principles for the art. I mean i have for now 17 years training and will practice AIkido until i am old and grey, cant do that with MMA.
williamross77 3 years ago 2
No matter what you say ki projection IS pure BS. And they always refuse to prove it under controlled objective testing. It's always with a student and always a demo. I make no claims for myself but I know faked movements when I see them. You can see the guy jumping, you can see him recoiling his legs before jumping. It is so obvious. For once, just once, let's see a clip of a real resisting trained fighter in an actual match with aikido man. I would wager money on the outcome.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
because if it was in a real match it would look similar to jujutsu. not bjj but jjj. japanese jj has all of this in it, the difference is aikido focuses on the aiki aspect alone and takes a far more pacifistic and esoteric approach to training. also it has been used in combat by the early practitioners. true its not used in mma cage fighting now days. aikido is a far more self defense system then fighting system. the element of surprise compared to exchanging blows knowings whats coming at you.
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
Sorry but that's just wishful thinking. Whether aikido is effectiveor not has NOT been demonstratively proven at least not in any video I've seen. But the real issue I have problem with is ki projection. Do you really believe this Tohei guy barely touches his student and he just flies away? Can't you see that the uke recoils and jumps away? It's so obvious. Give this, what am I supposed to think of aikido?
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
I am not sure where you got the idea that they were jumping back because of a ki projection. i think they were flying backwards because it hurt like hell!
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
Like when teacher winds the students forearm like a wristwatch then does his magic tap and student goes flying. Am I expected to believe that? Like his magic ki force can make anything come true. THAT is dreamland.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
once agian thats not ki projection, thats pain. it wasnt a tap, it was a pinch on a nerve ending. nothing magical about that. it hurts like hell.
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
It looks like teacher was winding up his music box. But to be specific, the student didn't just pull his arm away which would be expected, his whole body leaped away. This is done to dramatize the art and it is NOT uncommon that uke's do cooperate in order to make teacher and the demo look good. Reality is very different thing and I have never, (no not once) seen a clip of real contest between a skilled aikidoka and a resisting skilled fighter of another discipline.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
mainly because aikido see no purpose in doings such things. its taught to cops for its arresting techniques, but you are right there are no real videos of aikido fight, mainly because its not a fighting art its a self defense art. big difference. meanings the person doesnt expect a person to counter. fighting arts expect a person to square off in a ring and fight. aikido merely surprise and restrains. its the aiki of jujutsu basically, just more spiritual
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
Okay, but I still think aikido is tall on claims but short on proof.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
Ya and its not as super powered as they claim, but thats any martial art. the people practicing always think its better then it really is be that bjj, boxing, karate, or aikido.
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
Not all styles of Aikido focus on Ki-development as an external force. But Ki is simply the energy within us all. We ALL have it. In Aikido you must just learn to recognize it when its thrown at you, such as a PUNCH. You learn to use the energy that the attacker has presented you with against them. Is that really so hard to understand?
captainmo55 3 years ago
Ki is a non-scientific concept that is founded in ancient mysticism. All energy has identity & can be measured. Ki has NEVER been proven to exist in any objective test. The best way to test for ki is have a "ki master" lift heavy weights. With the assistance of ki they ought to be able lift far more weight than someone of comparable size. The simple answer is they cannot and have NEVER been able to demonstrate this simple task of increased strength through ki.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
Real "ki" is just good posture and good postural muscles and the ability to use them in a co-ordinated manner.
ketsan 3 years ago
"Ki" is good posture and good postural muscles.
ketsan 3 years ago
Sweaty feet- You should not comment with such confidence in matters that you have no real experience. It is quite obvious that you have not trained Aikido for any length of time or you would not say such ignorant things. As for your reference to scientific measurement of ki, there are a multitude of peer reviewed studies of non-local energy and bio-energy fields. Furthermore, science is constantly proving itself wrong. Go back 50 years and much of what we "knew" has been proven wrong. Feel!
personalrevolution 3 years ago
Sir, with respect I DO know something about the laws of physics, enough to know that "ki demos" violate every one of them. By measurement I am not talking about measuring ki energy fields. I am referring to the physical feats of strength claimed as a result of ki. Now THAT can easily be measured. Throw some weights on these guys, just about 100 Kilos will do. Let us see if their ki works with weights as well as it does with their students. Trouble is they refuse such a test... why?
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
"ki" is a physical thing, a "manifestation" of the nervous system. when you "feel" the ki, you feel your nervous system...
bekesi13 3 years ago
And BTW I make no judgement on what you study or have studied. I respect what you do. I especially have respect for BJJ since it has at least proven itself in actual combative matches and is truly effective. I respect many of the martial arts.
It is these crazy aikido demo clips with ki projection and other silly stunts that I question. And I'm certainly not alone in this opinion.
sweetsweatyfeet 3 years ago
did i mention i teach aikido? non of my student "fall" for me, Ukemi is an art that save your own joints, I promise you that it is like electricity, harmless in the walls, put it in an unsafe arena and yes it can kill you. to some people, nascar seams fake because the drivers don't constantly wreck each other... peace.
williamross77 3 years ago
0:20 it LOOKED as if he super farted and the guy flew away LOL
Anyway, aikido.. Beautiful art of control.
SyProductions 3 years ago
for anyone who was wondering, that is what tohei refered to as 'ki pinching' if you notice he pinches his uke's thighs. Very difficult to learn how to do it
samstreet101 3 years ago
I have been doing aikido for 3 years, and although it is very hard to do a technique on a trained aikidoka who is resisting, I have found out that aikido works very well on attackers who have an "evil intent." In any case, aikido is a great tool to use.
peaceatrebor 3 years ago
Do you have any Aikido videos of someone using it vs other styles???? I mean, style vs the same style is one thing, who would do against something like MT or JJ??
MinotauroNog 3 years ago
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GBNowProduction 3 years ago
i want to know how to do that!!!!
clarice5000 3 years ago
ey at :20 what the heck is that?
Eayne 3 years ago 4
Hahahahaha!
PicoELoro 3 years ago
Cool video. You gotta love these old school guys.
senseimacaluso 3 years ago
very good
elmensagero31 3 years ago
the closest your gonna get to seeing Aikido against realistic attackers is an old Steven Segeal movie. I trained in karate and aikido, and I'll tell you straight, it takes 5+years for Aikido to be worth a damn against a trained striker of only a couple years.
VictorRattle 3 years ago
sdf
fourbasel 3 years ago
Hi ClashBoredom,
How you want grab a twister? This is no sport! This is real budo, material art you know. Pratice 10 years and more, maybe you will understand something.The Aikido.clip represent also the training together to learn something and to grow up together, not to destroy. How you want train with hurt trainingpartners. In real fight....
pace Akira Akoshua
fourbasel 3 years ago
I want to see aikido used in a real attack... not someone just walking up and letting someone grab them. If they just let you grab them without trying to avoid it or fight back, what good is it? In a real situation you need to defend yourself, not dance around with him.
ClashBoredom 3 years ago
the whole point of the art is not to attack!!! its a art of defense there is no offense. you will not see this used to attack because it will not work as a attack. second its used through out the world on police forces to restrain people with out breaking them up. the Japaneses police force learns Aikido as well as judo. this is something just used by some crack pots down the street its actually used in real life by real people as part of their job.
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
So you are saying someone walks up to mug you with a knife is not an attack? I understand that the guy in the middle is defending and using aikido... The people he's throwing around should be doing REAL attacks. Not running to his left or right letting themselves get flipped around. It's not very realistic defending against someone who wants you to succeed with throwing them in the first place.
ClashBoredom 3 years ago
this a demo clip. even bjj and judo in their demo are going to look good. if you look like crap in your vids do you really want to study it? second, if you are good at a art you make it look effortless when you do the technique. its hard to get a person to attack you blindly knowing they could get hurt very very badly by fighting the technique like the guy on the street is. its a demo not real life. training can never truly be reality.
wayoftheforesthand 3 years ago
training might not be the actual reality but by adding elements such as real weapons, hard attacks, real-life situations(grabs, chokes etc.) it will be that close...
stephen182006 3 years ago
also for people who do not want to maim the attacker, holds and grabs that do not allow the attacker to take a swing and keep the defender in control are better than punches and kicks.
sublimenija 3 years ago
je autentico aikido para el! ...
hadronica 3 years ago
very good
pmaojo 3 years ago
steven seagal is burnt out? he`s just an actor¿? well i will be very gradful if a sensei like him ACCEPTS to teach me the harmony of aikido....excellent demostration of ki power by the way.
04nemesis 3 years ago
you cannot do fully aikido techniques without ki energy means comes from spiritual one's individual body to blast off the enemies away you see it sudden fall the uke with some impossibilities, it means it is art of magic that who does perform such ki powers that can suddenly harm their own body in the future...
moz165 3 years ago
you cannot do fully aikido techniques without ki energy means comes from spiritual one's individual body, it means it is art of magic that can suddenly harm their body in the future...
moz165 3 years ago
steven seagal is burnt out now, hes just a fucking actor fuckin fag msa1985 is a douch.
steven used to be good.....
demonhuntr92 3 years ago
someone asked about masters.
here we have a 'master-beater'.
say it out loud!
steviepotter 3 years ago
Are you crazy. M.A. practicioners of those kind of techniques only become better with age.
shinobicl 3 years ago