i live in the bible belt and i wish it was dying here but its not. feel lucky you live in a place where its not everywhere around you. there are probably 50 or 60 in the town i live in. and its a fairly small town. i would love to see them demolished and put the property to better use.
i find that argueing with a woman is often like trying to herd a flock of cats ,they no more respect logic ,reason or semantics than do religious appologists .woman that are shareing your bed are even more likely to run roughshod over any rules of ethical debate or indeed ,of remainung even within its current scope.
plus , they hold a trump card that causes one to with-hold the winning ,double shotted broadside ,for fear of causeing such damage as to make even boarding the prize ,pointless .
I've been following your website for years. I would suggest your benign attitude to the C of E is very typical of people of our age and background. As Kate Fox said in her book 'Watching the English', we call it c of e because church sounds too religious and english too nationalistic.
You obviously don't know much about the Church of England. The religious content of the Church of England is so diluted that it is almost a homoeopathic remedy.
If I lived in America I too would take the threat of Christianity seriously. In Europe a return of the Black Death is more likely than a return of rampant political Christianity.
Excluding famous ones, the authors and the public figures and the scientists... It seems like you nurse a kind of stereotype against average working Americans: They're generally stupid, pig-headed, they cling to their ideas like gun ownership and religion and they can't be reasoned out of them.
To the extent that this picture is accurate, yes. Is there any reason why you think I should like stupid proudly-ignorant loud-mouthed irrational people?
I have many online friends who are American, none of them are famous.
It's not a prejudice when an opinion is formed as a result of plenty of direct experience. You can call it a stereotype if you want but that doesn't make it wrong, unfair or a bad thing. I have a stereotype view of cars too: they have wheels and they are driven by people.
"It's not a prejudice when an opinion is formed as a result of plenty of direct experience. You can call it a stereotype if you want but that doesn't make it wrong, unfair or a bad thing."
I don't expect you to like stupid proud and ignorant people, I mean to say that you irrationally see the bulk of Americans that way. You're pre-judging the group by a stereotype you've constructed based on your experience with a tiny percentage of the individual parts. How is this any different from racism?
I do not assume that all Americans are a particular way. That is what makes it different. I know, from direct experience, that too many Americans are a particular way. I will not apologize for experience!
Feel free to refrain from making any assumptions about a group of people until you have met them all, see how that helps you.
I understand where you're coming from, but people aren't cakes and people aren't cars. People are people, and I think that classifying an individual based on anything other than that individual's behavior gets one into trouble. Both Hitler and Stalin had mustaches, what does that tell you about men with facial hair?
I'm a U.S. citizen myself and I agree that American culture is long overdue for major changes. But what's true of the whole isn't necessarily true of the part.
Don't you see the point about cakes? If you know you like or dislike most cakes when somebody offers you a cake you can make a decision based upon that information. Personally I think most cakes are a bit overrated so if just offered cake I'll decline, if there is an opportunity to find out more I will, because some cakes are well worth it. With people there's very rarely no opportunity to find out more.
Stereotypes are only a problem when direct experience does not replace the stereotype.
Tiny percentage? Are you American, Bishop8000? Because I am and from where I stand it is not at all a tiny percentage but a dangerously large percentage of absolute fools affecting the present and future of our country.
I said that Marin has constructed his stereotype about Americans based on experience with a tiny percentage of them. (How many Americans does he really know?) I know that there are a great number of fools in the United States, but I'm inclined to think that's a problem everywhere, it's just slightly worse here than in Europe.
My experience of Americans is fuller than 99% of humanity's opinions about another people. If I am not allowed to form an opinion very few people would be.
That's exactly what I'm advocating. People need to be treated as individuals regardless of genetic or national associations. Those work no better than flipping a coin. I think you'd find that the individuals within the "another people" you referenced run the gamut from cruel ignorant and intolerant to progressive liberal and enlightened - just like every other people.
Of course people should be treated as individuals. Supermarkets treat their customers as individuals too but this does not stop them employing statisticians to anticipate their behaviour. Please climb off your high horse before you do somebody a mischief.
There is no problem with stereotypes at all. Seriously. The only issues arise when people expect people to match their initial stereotypes and they discount the evidence of the individual and cling to the stereotype of the group. I don't.
If people were rigidly logical like that, then there would be no problem. But as soon as one starts stereotyping, that stereotype inevitably spills over onto the individuals, especially at first. That's just human nature. If you pass someone on the street and you know nothing else about them aside from their national identity, you'll start making judgments about them based on the stereotype you've constructed and that isn't fair or accurate. It's not a high horse, just the facts as I see them.
I refrain from thinking anything at all about people due to national or ethnic identity or age. It's not out of virtue, those are things that simply can't be changed so they can't be accurate tools of judgment. My judgments of an individual are made by the choices of that individual - clothes, body language, etiquette, hygiene, behavior etc.
I used to think that- that it must be a problem everywhere, but the more people I meet from other places, the more I see it isn't. It's just us. You didn't say whether you are American, but I am. I form opinions of people based on what I see them do mostly, and that's how I got such a low opinion of my fellow Americans. No amount of "treating people as individuals" can fix that. Education maybe, but not how I approach them.
You better recruit more members to the Church of England or our worst nightmare may come true and every church's pews will be ripped out to make space for prayer rugs.
i live in the bible belt and i wish it was dying here but its not. feel lucky you live in a place where its not everywhere around you. there are probably 50 or 60 in the town i live in. and its a fairly small town. i would love to see them demolished and put the property to better use.
bryanstrain 5 months ago
i find that argueing with a woman is often like trying to herd a flock of cats ,they no more respect logic ,reason or semantics than do religious appologists .woman that are shareing your bed are even more likely to run roughshod over any rules of ethical debate or indeed ,of remainung even within its current scope.
plus , they hold a trump card that causes one to with-hold the winning ,double shotted broadside ,for fear of causeing such damage as to make even boarding the prize ,pointless .
woodenmajor 9 months ago
I get steamed up about dogma in general,
But I Suspect all of it is the result of language and mentality.
Control the Language, manipulate the mentality...
spick1923 1 year ago
"..twelve step program of humans anonymous."
Brilliant. Actually made my laugh out loud, which I practically never do while alone.
DavidMTRutten 1 year ago
but but gypsies are cool. like one predicted I'd have monetary problems and suddenly I couldn't find my wallet.
ratholin 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I've been following your website for years. I would suggest your benign attitude to the C of E is very typical of people of our age and background. As Kate Fox said in her book 'Watching the English', we call it c of e because church sounds too religious and english too nationalistic.
bluedick321 2 years ago
never thought about the link between the decline of rural workers and the c of e good one.
bluedick321 2 years ago
Religion is not harmless.
Religion hurts women, minorities, homosexuals, scientific advancement, children, history, education, critical thinking, prostitution, nightlife and social cohesion.
kaduisaui 2 years ago
You obviously don't know much about the Church of England. The religious content of the Church of England is so diluted that it is almost a homoeopathic remedy.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
@MartinJWillett You are right, I do not know much about the church of England. Sorry.
What I do know is that religious assholes in America fight over allowing homosexuals civil rights.
Religious assholes in America attack doctors, harass women who need help and destroy health care clinics.
Religious assholes in America insist schools teach creationism as scientific fact. They campaign against science and reasoning.
From where I stand religion is NOT harmless.
kaduisaui 2 years ago
If I lived in America I too would take the threat of Christianity seriously. In Europe a return of the Black Death is more likely than a return of rampant political Christianity.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
You really don't like Americans do you?
bishop8000 2 years ago
I do like many Americans, some of the people I like best are Americans.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
Excluding famous ones, the authors and the public figures and the scientists... It seems like you nurse a kind of stereotype against average working Americans: They're generally stupid, pig-headed, they cling to their ideas like gun ownership and religion and they can't be reasoned out of them.
bishop8000 2 years ago
To the extent that this picture is accurate, yes. Is there any reason why you think I should like stupid proudly-ignorant loud-mouthed irrational people?
I have many online friends who are American, none of them are famous.
It's not a prejudice when an opinion is formed as a result of plenty of direct experience. You can call it a stereotype if you want but that doesn't make it wrong, unfair or a bad thing. I have a stereotype view of cars too: they have wheels and they are driven by people.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
"It's not a prejudice when an opinion is formed as a result of plenty of direct experience. You can call it a stereotype if you want but that doesn't make it wrong, unfair or a bad thing."
I don't expect you to like stupid proud and ignorant people, I mean to say that you irrationally see the bulk of Americans that way. You're pre-judging the group by a stereotype you've constructed based on your experience with a tiny percentage of the individual parts. How is this any different from racism?
bishop8000 2 years ago
I do not assume that all Americans are a particular way. That is what makes it different. I know, from direct experience, that too many Americans are a particular way. I will not apologize for experience!
Feel free to refrain from making any assumptions about a group of people until you have met them all, see how that helps you.
Do you like cakes? Have you tried them all?
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
I understand where you're coming from, but people aren't cakes and people aren't cars. People are people, and I think that classifying an individual based on anything other than that individual's behavior gets one into trouble. Both Hitler and Stalin had mustaches, what does that tell you about men with facial hair?
I'm a U.S. citizen myself and I agree that American culture is long overdue for major changes. But what's true of the whole isn't necessarily true of the part.
bishop8000 2 years ago
Don't you see the point about cakes? If you know you like or dislike most cakes when somebody offers you a cake you can make a decision based upon that information. Personally I think most cakes are a bit overrated so if just offered cake I'll decline, if there is an opportunity to find out more I will, because some cakes are well worth it. With people there's very rarely no opportunity to find out more.
Stereotypes are only a problem when direct experience does not replace the stereotype.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
Tiny percentage? Are you American, Bishop8000? Because I am and from where I stand it is not at all a tiny percentage but a dangerously large percentage of absolute fools affecting the present and future of our country.
dawgsmycopilot 2 years ago
I said that Marin has constructed his stereotype about Americans based on experience with a tiny percentage of them. (How many Americans does he really know?) I know that there are a great number of fools in the United States, but I'm inclined to think that's a problem everywhere, it's just slightly worse here than in Europe.
bishop8000 2 years ago
My experience of Americans is fuller than 99% of humanity's opinions about another people. If I am not allowed to form an opinion very few people would be.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
That's exactly what I'm advocating. People need to be treated as individuals regardless of genetic or national associations. Those work no better than flipping a coin. I think you'd find that the individuals within the "another people" you referenced run the gamut from cruel ignorant and intolerant to progressive liberal and enlightened - just like every other people.
bishop8000 2 years ago
Of course people should be treated as individuals. Supermarkets treat their customers as individuals too but this does not stop them employing statisticians to anticipate their behaviour. Please climb off your high horse before you do somebody a mischief.
There is no problem with stereotypes at all. Seriously. The only issues arise when people expect people to match their initial stereotypes and they discount the evidence of the individual and cling to the stereotype of the group. I don't.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
If people were rigidly logical like that, then there would be no problem. But as soon as one starts stereotyping, that stereotype inevitably spills over onto the individuals, especially at first. That's just human nature. If you pass someone on the street and you know nothing else about them aside from their national identity, you'll start making judgments about them based on the stereotype you've constructed and that isn't fair or accurate. It's not a high horse, just the facts as I see them.
bishop8000 2 years ago
So you refrain from thinking anything at all about people do you? What a paragon of misguided virtue!
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
I refrain from thinking anything at all about people due to national or ethnic identity or age. It's not out of virtue, those are things that simply can't be changed so they can't be accurate tools of judgment. My judgments of an individual are made by the choices of that individual - clothes, body language, etiquette, hygiene, behavior etc.
bishop8000 2 years ago
I used to think that- that it must be a problem everywhere, but the more people I meet from other places, the more I see it isn't. It's just us. You didn't say whether you are American, but I am. I form opinions of people based on what I see them do mostly, and that's how I got such a low opinion of my fellow Americans. No amount of "treating people as individuals" can fix that. Education maybe, but not how I approach them.
dawgsmycopilot 1 year ago
The common term for your wife's aproach to faith is called "apatheism"
fromeroj 2 years ago
You better recruit more members to the Church of England or our worst nightmare may come true and every church's pews will be ripped out to make space for prayer rugs.
Elenkhos 2 years ago 3
Just turn them into pubs that allow smoking and they'll be packed to the rafters.
1140Cecile 2 years ago 7
If I know the English, you mean, including the rafters and bell tower..lol
Elenkhos 2 years ago