Sorry but does she think that when people are wrongly convicted of murder it's because the court wasn't trying hard enough and if we had the death penalty then it would try harder inorder to be really sure?
If just one innocent person is put to death for a crime they did not commit, then capital punishment is morally bankrupt. This is why civilised nations don't use it. The idiot woman on the show also has no idea what the term "burden of proof" means.
Dear Christians, If you will ask evidence and proof of big bang and evolution theory from atheists, they will never provide any. But will call you idiot, abuse, delusion, uneducated etc. If any of them would be good atheist, will advise you to read books, search in Internet or educate ourself. But question will always remain same. So I have no doubt that Atheists also believing in some thing blindly which is worse than blindly believing in GOD.
However good forensic science is, the tests and the results themselves are still subject to humal falibillity and interpretation, and are thus CANNOT BE 100% perfect.
If someone could be convicted of a capital crime with ZERO per cent doubt, then I would agree with the Death Penalty.
But as a realist I know that such a level of certainty IS NOT POSSIBLE,
So if you agree with capital punishment using a flawed justive system, then you condone the killing of innocent people
People go on about the wrong person being found guilty and executed but they should realise that in 2007, figures showed that nearly 30 convicted killers released from jail over the past 10 years went on to kill again. We now have better ways to get a correct conviction than ever before with DNA etc so i say bring back Capital Punishment.
@Seanryan2001 banning capital punishment is not synonymous with releasing convicted murderers. Not killing convicted murderers doesn't automatically lead to releasing convicted murderers.
@nickramsay2 Totally respect your concerns on this matter, but please consider the advantages of modern scientific investigation in criminality. More innocent people accused of murder have been let off thanks to D.N.A. evidence and more guilty people convicted. I was just curious to what you think we should do with someone who is guilty of murder irrefutably, with scientific backing? death or life? I'm sorry but I think the government should put people out of there misery I.M.O.
@2212corby It's not modern scientific investigative techniques I have issue with. I take issue with the unreliability of the jury. You can have the best evidence in the world. But if you can't convince the jury. You're dead. Too much of a risk for me. One dead innocent person is one too many.
I'd lock them up forever. With no social interaction. Cost shouldn't be a consideration when balanced against ppls lives. Especially if the process can be wrong in it's judgement.
@2212corby Oh sorry. irrefutably. missed that bit. I'd still lock them up. Execution is just a barbaric practice that a civil society shouldn't engage in. It doesn't solve the problem it isn't a deterrent and the cost if we're wrong, is 2 high. Why solve a wrong with a wrong?
Should we let ppl who have been violently attacked beat their attackers? Or let someone who has been in an RTA drive over the person who caused the accident as punishment?
@nickramsay2 You make a good point, but I can't help the way I feel about this matter, I'm from the "eye for an eye" school, I think people's opinions would change if they were in the shoes of the victim. Death is not a deterrent, I agree, but housing nutjobs like Anders Brievik, for example, is an insult to the 77 familys of his victims. The guy should not have the privilege of breathing.
I wonder how Ian would feel if someone murdered his 2 children? and was living off taxpayers money, warm meals in a heated cell for the rest of their days.
@2212corby I wonder how Ian would feel if the ppl convicted of killing his children were found guilty & killed. And then found innocent on further investigation.
How would you feel if you had been found guilty of murder. Imprisoned & then found innocent and released.
Would YOU like to be executed for something you didn't do?
And if you reply "But I'd never kill someone." You're an idiot.
You don't have to murder someone to be found guilty and executed under capital punishment laws.
@nickramsay2 My argument is based on the proof of conviction, ever heard of D.N.A evidence? Where did I say we should execute the INNOCENT? We have come a long way from the days of alas,Craig Bently.
@2212corby You didn't say that. And I haven't said you did. Read my comment again. And get you head around it properly. Also Google for miscarriages of justice that have ended in the execution of innocent ppl. If you're prepared to be one of them. Then support away.
@2212corby Ian would be mortified if the individual convicted of their murder and executed was subsequently found to be innocent. Not only does it mean that the killer of his children is still at large but the satisfaction and reassurance he would have had on the death of the "innocent" guy would be reflected back on him. That guilt would probably compound the anger he feels at the huge miscarriage of justice.
Justice is not as simple as you paint it out to be.
@corvardus I see your point, but what if someone has been caught with overwhelming evidence that they committed murder of a innocent person. Such as D.N.A. evidence? I wouldn't want anyone executed unless there was STRONG EVIDENCE that they did it!
Where is the Justice for the family's of the murdered person/s?
I've gone all over the board on capital punishment, because I've known both murder victims (and criminals, when I was young and stupid). I now fall squarely against it except in rare occasions where it might actually be the compassionate thing to do. If I had raped and killed many children, I'd want to be put to rest, otherwise I'd be inhuman and not worthy of any kind of social pact. The Texas Model of capital punishment is barbaric.
she keeps saying all we need is complete burden of proof, thing is the judicial system -thought- they had perfect evidence, which they used to condemn these people to death. Its nearly impossible to have perfect evidence, she's an idiot who cannot understand the weight of destroying a human life.
@665tr What if you could simply detain him? If you captured Hitler, detained him for the rest of his life and completely abolished Nazism in Germany and across the globe, would you really feel the need to kill him? Yes, he did do despicable things, and perhaps we should never forgive him for those things, but it doesn't mean we should kill him. By keeping him alive we are showing that we are above the need to simply destroy that which we don't like, especially if it's a living being.
@665tr What Im saying is that killing is wrong ffs don't you get it? If it was wrong Hitler wouldn't have killed,glorifying killing is what perpetrates it surely.Killing solves nothing
i hate seeing this clip because she is so carelessly damaging in the way she avoids rational discussion, yet gets to sit on that side of the panel.
as a rule of thumb if you have to preface an argument with "no disrespect but" your seconds away from disrespecting the person your talking to. she did this by refusing to feel the need to engage ian (which backfired) and instead just spewed her ill thought out views into the discussion.
never give the state the right to take a life as revenge on behalf of a victim. Even moreso now in the corporate fascist system which is now being installed in the west we run the risk of governments who pre-emptively execute people on the premise that the executed may have one day become a threat. oops sounds a bit like the iraq disaster, and concerningly similar the the current rhetoric towards iran. look at how your government treats other countries thats how they would like to treat you.
It has been shown in places where capital punishment is in place that it isn't a deterrent... It just escalates the system of violence and criminals become more hardened and desperate...
Actually I can see her point. People who kill tend to get what, 20 years? If death was at the end of it they'd either A) take more care in killing the people or B) not do it. (Or do it anyway and enjoy being dead.)
She's narrow minded for not seeing the bigger picture like Ian, but her general way of thinking that it would be a deterent is in a way, right.
@xPyroxx Well they have capital punishment in many parts of the USA, and in case you don't know, all crime and stuff has been completely wiped out over there, so clearly it's a super effective deterrent. Derp.
@kinggimped Only in some states. & Americans in those are too thick to realise whats going to happen. I'm pointing out that her idea isnt far off the mark. Its not right. But its got a good point that it would deter people from commiting serious crimes if they know they wont get out in 20 years.
@xPyroxx Do you know how few murders are premeditated? The great majority are spur of the moment actions; events unfold too quickly for someone to stop and consider what punishment they will receive. This is universal among us humans; whether Americans, Brits, Germans, whatever. The death penalty just isn't an effective deterrent.
@Task5003 If I walk outside and stab someone to Death, I'll get 25 years at most. Even if its not premeditated, lets take away the kills that are done on the spot and look at the more extreme kills, more than one. Planned murders. Etc. Detering might not work with them, but it would be better for them not to be out in 20 years.
I don't agree with capital punishment even with full proof - but if 10 million guilty men are executed and 1 innocent, then it isn't acceptable and the whole thing is totally flawed.
Like I said, for me - it isn't acceptable to kill anyone regardless of guilt.
"...on the statute books, for example..." Umm where else might it be?
Priti Patel, flying the flag for fuckwits everywhere. Perhaps it's a minor point to quibble with her turn of phrase but it indicates she simply doesn't understand the issues she's so magnificently failing to discuss.
Its worrying to have an MP of any kind on question time preaching the benefits of capitol punishment as a deterrent to crime who seems to be unaware of the provable findings that it isnt. Not to mention the humanitarian issues.
Stupid private school educated response. If the reason for abolishing capital punishment is that so many cases are judged wrong then it clearly seems that the judicial system is failing. Why ignore the problem by creating a new one? If calculated murder was inforced by hanging then it would deter the person from "calculating the murder of another Human being" and for one who has calusly murdered another human is allowed to walk after spending time in prison then where is the justice i ask!
@falim2007 No it wouldn't, we had capital punishment in the UK for a very long time, even for many crimes other than premeditated murder, it didn't deter, on the contrary the crime rate was far higher most of the time.
If life imprisonment doesn't deter someone, then nothing will (for many life imprisonment is considered worse by people, hence they take their own life). Nor for many murderers is there any real deterrent as a fair number are two sandwiches short of a picnic to put it nicely.
@falim2007 "Stupid private school educated response"
Ian Hislop's ? Well, he did go to a top public school. Of course, Priti Patel went to a state school and shares the opinions of most of the UK's working class.
There's a good American documentary called "After Innocence" which is about people sentenced to death who're found innocent. It's a good watch, no matter your stance, and is relevant to the death penalty debate.
Ultimately this isn't a matter of left and right, I don't think. Some people believe that few should die wrongly, others believe that's totally unacceptable. To box this as a torie-labour, left-right issue is idiotic. It's about whether you have empathy or whether you don't.
Reason I don't like the death penalty, Hitler doesn't deserve it. Too easy.
He should be locked in a prison cell, and every relative of a dead civilian comes in one at a time, three times a day, and kicks him in the balls, for the rest of his life.
@superhamzah85 I know, why do more people not think this? I could be against the death penalty on revenge grounds only. If my loved ones were killed, why would I want the killer to have a quick death.
It would be way more vengeful to let them rot in prison until they're a old man and let them out all confused into a world they will barely recognise with no friends & no family alive that can recognise them... let them see their peers with grandchildren and rich full lives......
"Hangings were a big public festivalin the 1600's. Crowds gathered along the route from Newgate to Tyburn, and around the Tyburn tree itself, often exceeding 100,000. The rich rented upper-storey rooms in houses and pubs to get the best views. Street hawkers and food vendors also lined the route - they knew a good bet when they saw one. A grandstand was even erected at the gallows. Thieves and pickpockets also took advantage of the holiday atmosphere" (pickpocketing was a capital offence)
Two words; Fred West. If we had capital punishment, Fred West, the notorious paedophile, rapist and murderer would be a most likely candidate execution. However, following his arrest, West cheated the justice system by taking his own life, rather than face life imprisionment. Capital punishment would not be a deterent for such people.
@SROCeallaigh That as may be. However, my point still stands that capital punishment would not be a deterant for such people. It may even be a relief for some. Take a person so consumed with guilt or self-loathing that they want to end their own life, but are to cowardly (or possessed of twisted religious conviction) to do so. Execution takes that burden off them (and the relgious nut would recive absolution)
@woodgatejack regarding the life sentence alternative I'll go back to what I originally said that it just is not a punishment in its present state - how can having better food than hospitals, a secure habitat safe from vigilantes and such, and access to TV, internet and whatever be considered punishment?
@woodgatejack If prison time were as harsh and punishing as it should be I would totally support it as the better option, but it just isn't. because of this country's obsession with the human rights of good for nothing scum
...as for her point about the justice system, I agree also, the justice system is a joke, having such harsh punishments would force the re-hash it needs, would force the system to rely only on concrete evidence - DNA, confessions, etc. ...
I don't see how she is stupid...Hislop raises good points, but, though she isn't very good at getting her point across I can see what she is getting at...it is a deterrent, that's just logical, because prisons are pointless in this country - it depends on context...if prisons were closer to dungeons, as they should be, there would be no need for a death penalty...people should stop just comparing it to America all the time, it's a very different world...
@blackmichael75 explain how it's 'irrelevant', it related directly to the issue of whether a) capital punishment is more moral than the system we have now and b) whether it would actually work better than the system we have now...things are generally different in America, and I know our government is corrupt but we have it easy in comparison to Americans...
@SROCeallaigh because the nationality of people and whether or not they have guns does not influence whether capital punishment is a deterrent or not. If it were, there would be less crime in those states and countries which have it. We know that this is not the case.
@blackmichael75 it's a combination of grey areas - it does depend to some extent on the country in question, there are the issues of how easy firearms to access, and there are the issues, - though this is to many just a scapegoat - of ethnic minority areas where there is a higher crime rate (certain parts of London/New York for example)
@blackmichael75 ...Luckily I was raised properly so I have morals, but I know that if I wanted to I could easily go and murder someone in cold blood and not fear the consequences because I know I'd just get about 10-20 years in a comfy safe prison with free food that is better than hospital food apparently...
@SROCeallaigh - The U.S. has the death penalty and a lower crime rate than the UK and yet it has 5 times the number of murders. So not much of a deterrent is it.
@SROCeallaigh Pretty sure it was meant to be 5 times the murder rate rather than 5 times the murders. The real factor is more like 4, regardless the murder rate is still way higher in the States.
@achtung555 I expect so...but I am just trying to say that many things are different in the US, it's a very different country, I think the comparison is quite irrelevant and actually illogical as well...an issue such as this needs to be considered and judged on a case by case basis, by assessing the situations and needs of our country, not by saying 'Americans haven't got it right' or 'look at those horrible Arabs stoning and beheading people'...
@blackmichael75 if we were to adopt capital punishment again, being the huge, sensitive issue it is, Britain would take all measures necessary to make it a strictly regulated system...and, as I was saying, as a result, the legal system as a whole would be improved...
the most annoying thing about priti patel is the way she says something then repeats it, adding *really* for emphasis
i hate that, i really do. it's more annoying even than the lack of substance in her opinions and argument, it really is. i don't know how she managed to get where she is now, i really don't.
@loof000 You may not agree with the first time but let me see if it sounds any better a second later. Like at the opticians: better? or worse? better? or worse...?
@loof000 Yeah it's the classic right wing female argument. Poison wells, emotional appeals, repetition with nodding rinse and repeat. Carol vordman used it to get a whole audience to think it made any logical sense to inform jamie Bullgers parents of Jon Venables latest unrelated crimes...
that asian chick really doesnt know what the term 'burden of proof' means, she repeatedly misused it throughout this video. based on this video alone, i can tell she is a very unintelligent person, what the fuck is she doing on question time?
@SJGibbons1000 That's the problem. Her formal education grades likely would kick ours arse. Formal education doesn't penalize creativity, poor observation etc.... It actually rewards those things as they contribute to higher focus better organization.
@Josh1000digby No difference between me and others in my classification, I meant...BTW where are my other 7 questions, or are you scared of being proved wrong by your own statistics?
Seems to me that its idiotic to say someone is idiotic for supporting capital punishment. The nature of it is never in debate and Ian Hislop and PE, though good in some ways, should not hold themselves up with such self righteousness!
@BiffaTW It is ignorant to support capital punishment, she said that the evidence would have to be completely proven; SHOCKER! Evidence can be fabricated, as happened with the Guildford 4, Birmingham 6 and Maguire 7.
@KungfuCow5 Indeed it can, worse can happen Ill give you a story of young kid from my area who was hung at 19 in 1953. He never committed the crime and what is more everyone knew he did not do so but the Home Secretary at the time wrote a letter that ordered the young man hanged 'as an example'. Continued in another comment...
@KungfuCow5 This is disgusting, in fact worse than disgusting and is the kind of thing that gave capital punishment its notority for abuse. However, if it were to be conducted in proper courts of justice, with the clarity of the law, out of gov. hands, accountable to the people, scrutinised by the media and based on absolutly certain evidence (which many cases invariably are) I believe it would work.
@BiffaTW Are you kidding? Out of government hands? Without the rules and regulations? Subject to people prone to anger and vengeance? How would that work?
@KungfuCow5 He's saying that cuz he's an Amerrykan. You can literally throw in 'get government out' in any argument and get rapturous applause in that land. 2nd only to calling something 'communist'
@KungfuCow5 No I'm not kidding, in a 'civilised society' as you put it, the law should rule, not the government, which is liable to self-interest and is apparently relatively unacccountable once voted in power. People should make a clear distinction between the law and the lawmakers, and remember accountability, all of which are key in this. The government, as my last comments hopefully show, ought to have no right to issue the death penalty above the law, the law should come first.
@BiffaTW The government are accountable to the law and are responsible for implementing it. The death penalty would never worked because there are no circumstances under which it can't be exploited.
If you have the death penalty for any particular crime or crimes, then the guilty party would have motivation to commit any amount of other crimes, including murders, that might help them evade prosecution. THAT is why capital punishment is not only morally wrong, but stupid and counter-productive.
Capital punishment is absurd. Imagine how many more people would go on killing sprees if they were risking being charged with a painless death rather than life in prison.
Texas has one of the highest execution rates in the United States, yet their murder rate has never gone below the top 5 states. It just doesn't work as a deterrent.
Its like the people hating America because they were denied permission to enter owing to a criminal record. All the sleazy gits standing up for murderers on here mostly come from criminal backgrounds and a lot are typing their comments out on a smuggled smartphone in a prison cell. We should be hanging murderers at a rate of one a week in this country. The forensics are so overwhelmingly irrefutable in at least that many cases and so many of these murders are so vicious its like exhibitionism.
'Capital punishment' is not the real issue. It is the state will administer it which is the problem. Giving a power crazied government the right to kill people (after an attempt at due process) is inherantly dangerous.
We're not all knowing- taking this into account, it's pretty obvious that mistakes will be made, and considering the serious nature of capital punishment...We must leave no room for mistakes.
Secondly, capital punishment a deterrant? Have a look at the states in America where capital punishment is implemented. In those very states, the murder rates are still very high.
@TurboDally I wonder how many criminals stop and think "Hmm what will the repercussions be if I kill this person (etc.)?". Many murders are acted out on impulse and if they are premeditated then the criminal doesn't actually expect to get caught.
This woman is an MP?
nickhirst 2 hours ago
I can't believe she is my MP.
TiberJai 18 hours ago
I liked the bit where the idiot was an idiot
danburycollins 20 hours ago
Sorry but does she think that when people are wrongly convicted of murder it's because the court wasn't trying hard enough and if we had the death penalty then it would try harder inorder to be really sure?
SinuousStudios 21 hours ago
If just one innocent person is put to death for a crime they did not commit, then capital punishment is morally bankrupt. This is why civilised nations don't use it. The idiot woman on the show also has no idea what the term "burden of proof" means.
FlowersInHisHair 1 day ago 6
Dear Christians, If you will ask evidence and proof of big bang and evolution theory from atheists, they will never provide any. But will call you idiot, abuse, delusion, uneducated etc. If any of them would be good atheist, will advise you to read books, search in Internet or educate ourself. But question will always remain same. So I have no doubt that Atheists also believing in some thing blindly which is worse than blindly believing in GOD.
samaroo96 1 day ago
However good forensic science is, the tests and the results themselves are still subject to humal falibillity and interpretation, and are thus CANNOT BE 100% perfect.
If someone could be convicted of a capital crime with ZERO per cent doubt, then I would agree with the Death Penalty.
But as a realist I know that such a level of certainty IS NOT POSSIBLE,
So if you agree with capital punishment using a flawed justive system, then you condone the killing of innocent people
AsDeadAsDillinger 1 day ago
People go on about the wrong person being found guilty and executed but they should realise that in 2007, figures showed that nearly 30 convicted killers released from jail over the past 10 years went on to kill again. We now have better ways to get a correct conviction than ever before with DNA etc so i say bring back Capital Punishment.
Seanryan2001 1 day ago
Comment removed
vanillalatteblended 1 day ago
@Seanryan2001 banning capital punishment is not synonymous with releasing convicted murderers. Not killing convicted murderers doesn't automatically lead to releasing convicted murderers.
vanillalatteblended 1 day ago
It can't be a deterrent if people can be falsely accused anyway, as they may have been deterred, innocent and still found guilty.
ghelyar 1 day ago
We should never have capital punishment in the UK. It is too risky that the wrong person is found guilty and executed.
ProtestantsRUs 2 days ago
The danger of executing innocent people is a powerful position but it is NOT an unanswerable argument against the existence of the DP.
Individuals are found guilty of murder which they UNdoubtedly committed
IMO the death penalty should be available.
Hislop is refering to groups of Irishmen who were found guilty and subsequently released.
My GUESS is that the findings of guilt came about because of deceit/distortions encouraged by our adversarial justice system.
divvy1400yam600 2 days ago
@nickramsay2 Totally respect your concerns on this matter, but please consider the advantages of modern scientific investigation in criminality. More innocent people accused of murder have been let off thanks to D.N.A. evidence and more guilty people convicted. I was just curious to what you think we should do with someone who is guilty of murder irrefutably, with scientific backing? death or life? I'm sorry but I think the government should put people out of there misery I.M.O.
2212corby 2 days ago
@2212corby It's not modern scientific investigative techniques I have issue with. I take issue with the unreliability of the jury. You can have the best evidence in the world. But if you can't convince the jury. You're dead. Too much of a risk for me. One dead innocent person is one too many.
I'd lock them up forever. With no social interaction. Cost shouldn't be a consideration when balanced against ppls lives. Especially if the process can be wrong in it's judgement.
nickramsay2 2 days ago
@2212corby Oh sorry. irrefutably. missed that bit. I'd still lock them up. Execution is just a barbaric practice that a civil society shouldn't engage in. It doesn't solve the problem it isn't a deterrent and the cost if we're wrong, is 2 high. Why solve a wrong with a wrong?
Should we let ppl who have been violently attacked beat their attackers? Or let someone who has been in an RTA drive over the person who caused the accident as punishment?
nickramsay2 2 days ago
@nickramsay2 You make a good point, but I can't help the way I feel about this matter, I'm from the "eye for an eye" school, I think people's opinions would change if they were in the shoes of the victim. Death is not a deterrent, I agree, but housing nutjobs like Anders Brievik, for example, is an insult to the 77 familys of his victims. The guy should not have the privilege of breathing.
2212corby 2 days ago
'It's not a deterrent, killing the wrong people'. I love a good reductio ad absurdum.
Spoonface370 2 days ago
the great Hislop..
atheer2002 2 days ago
Of course capital punishment is not a deterrent. If it was crime would of been stopped hundreds of years ago!
TheReegar 2 days ago
I wonder how Ian would feel if someone murdered his 2 children? and was living off taxpayers money, warm meals in a heated cell for the rest of their days.
2212corby 3 days ago
@2212corby I wonder how Ian would feel if the ppl convicted of killing his children were found guilty & killed. And then found innocent on further investigation.
How would you feel if you had been found guilty of murder. Imprisoned & then found innocent and released.
Would YOU like to be executed for something you didn't do?
And if you reply "But I'd never kill someone." You're an idiot.
You don't have to murder someone to be found guilty and executed under capital punishment laws.
nickramsay2 3 days ago
@nickramsay2 My argument is based on the proof of conviction, ever heard of D.N.A evidence? Where did I say we should execute the INNOCENT? We have come a long way from the days of alas,Craig Bently.
2212corby 3 days ago
@2212corby You didn't say that. And I haven't said you did. Read my comment again. And get you head around it properly. Also Google for miscarriages of justice that have ended in the execution of innocent ppl. If you're prepared to be one of them. Then support away.
nickramsay2 2 days ago
@2212corby Ian would be mortified if the individual convicted of their murder and executed was subsequently found to be innocent. Not only does it mean that the killer of his children is still at large but the satisfaction and reassurance he would have had on the death of the "innocent" guy would be reflected back on him. That guilt would probably compound the anger he feels at the huge miscarriage of justice.
Justice is not as simple as you paint it out to be.
corvardus 3 days ago
@corvardus I see your point, but what if someone has been caught with overwhelming evidence that they committed murder of a innocent person. Such as D.N.A. evidence? I wouldn't want anyone executed unless there was STRONG EVIDENCE that they did it!
Where is the Justice for the family's of the murdered person/s?
2212corby 3 days ago
I've gone all over the board on capital punishment, because I've known both murder victims (and criminals, when I was young and stupid). I now fall squarely against it except in rare occasions where it might actually be the compassionate thing to do. If I had raped and killed many children, I'd want to be put to rest, otherwise I'd be inhuman and not worthy of any kind of social pact. The Texas Model of capital punishment is barbaric.
Mangina9000 3 days ago
Capital punishment is not a deterrent. Anyone who claims it is is either ignorant, or a raving right winger who gets a kick out of people dying.
otleybey 3 days ago
she keeps saying all we need is complete burden of proof, thing is the judicial system -thought- they had perfect evidence, which they used to condemn these people to death. Its nearly impossible to have perfect evidence, she's an idiot who cannot understand the weight of destroying a human life.
fearthefurby 3 days ago
Who is that stupid women?
remyworldpeace 4 days ago 3
@remyworldpeace Priti Patel, Tory MP for Witham
nickaxf 1 day ago
Isnt killing wrong?
WorksopGimp 4 days ago
@WorksopGimp so you wouldnt kill someone like hitler?
665tr 3 days ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@665tr What if you could simply detain him? If you captured Hitler, detained him for the rest of his life and completely abolished Nazism in Germany and across the globe, would you really feel the need to kill him? Yes, he did do despicable things, and perhaps we should never forgive him for those things, but it doesn't mean we should kill him. By keeping him alive we are showing that we are above the need to simply destroy that which we don't like, especially if it's a living being.
j0gan673 3 days ago
@665tr What Im saying is that killing is wrong ffs don't you get it? If it was wrong Hitler wouldn't have killed,glorifying killing is what perpetrates it surely.Killing solves nothing
WorksopGimp 3 days ago
I remember this show, this was just one of her terrifying opinions.
KuolemaNox 4 days ago
The sexy brown lady doesn't know what she's talking about.
LecceDiPane 4 days ago 4
She says "you must have absolute burden of proof."
She means absolute certainty, or proof beyond reasonable doubt. Having the burden of proof just means that proof is required from you.
Darkademic 4 days ago 2
i hate seeing this clip because she is so carelessly damaging in the way she avoids rational discussion, yet gets to sit on that side of the panel.
as a rule of thumb if you have to preface an argument with "no disrespect but" your seconds away from disrespecting the person your talking to. she did this by refusing to feel the need to engage ian (which backfired) and instead just spewed her ill thought out views into the discussion.
TheBluePianist 4 days ago 4
Capital Punishment is not a deterrent because the three reasons that people commit murder are
1. Passion, e.g. caching your spouse in bed with someone else, the murder is not thinking of the consequences at the time.
2. Profit, e.g. over drug territory etch. they do it in such a way that they don't think they can get caught.
3. Compulsion, people who are compelled to kill, serial killers or Religious fanaticism etc, feel a need to kill so is can’t be deterred .
Bicthslave 5 days ago 31
@Bicthslave THANK YOU.
Tordah26 4 days ago
@Bicthslave Also as if Drug smugglers and dealers don't already live in constant fear of being executed anyway.
CMcIntosh85 18 hours ago
who is this silly tory cow?
wenger1972 5 days ago
If capital punishment (execution) were a deterrent, there'd be no murders in Texas (or any of the other US states where it is still practised).
EmptyGlass99 5 days ago
@EmptyGlass99 In fact they are the states with the highest murder rates.
Bot23 5 days ago
never give the state the right to take a life as revenge on behalf of a victim. Even moreso now in the corporate fascist system which is now being installed in the west we run the risk of governments who pre-emptively execute people on the premise that the executed may have one day become a threat. oops sounds a bit like the iraq disaster, and concerningly similar the the current rhetoric towards iran. look at how your government treats other countries thats how they would like to treat you.
TheJimzsta 5 days ago
Ian Hislop, take a bow. I've just subbed to Private Eye.
MrR0o 5 days ago
capital punishment does not by nessecity mean execution ....I think we could bring in old time naval punishments ....keel-hauling for example.
temporaldisplacement 5 days ago
@temporaldisplacement that's corporal punishment. Capital punishment is the death penalty.
0llie999 5 days ago
@0llie999 I was certain that capital punishment included torture, whipping, the stockades and execution.
temporaldisplacement 5 days ago
@temporaldisplacement Which almost always resulted in death.
Bot23 5 days ago
It has been shown in places where capital punishment is in place that it isn't a deterrent... It just escalates the system of violence and criminals become more hardened and desperate...
freewilly2fly 5 days ago
As an American I am sad because we don't have television like this when its clear we could really benefit from it.
dubbys 5 days ago
Actually I can see her point. People who kill tend to get what, 20 years? If death was at the end of it they'd either A) take more care in killing the people or B) not do it. (Or do it anyway and enjoy being dead.)
She's narrow minded for not seeing the bigger picture like Ian, but her general way of thinking that it would be a deterent is in a way, right.
xPyroxx 5 days ago
@xPyroxx Well they have capital punishment in many parts of the USA, and in case you don't know, all crime and stuff has been completely wiped out over there, so clearly it's a super effective deterrent. Derp.
kinggimped 5 days ago
@kinggimped Only in some states. & Americans in those are too thick to realise whats going to happen. I'm pointing out that her idea isnt far off the mark. Its not right. But its got a good point that it would deter people from commiting serious crimes if they know they wont get out in 20 years.
xPyroxx 5 days ago
@xPyroxx Do you know how few murders are premeditated? The great majority are spur of the moment actions; events unfold too quickly for someone to stop and consider what punishment they will receive. This is universal among us humans; whether Americans, Brits, Germans, whatever. The death penalty just isn't an effective deterrent.
Task5003 5 days ago
@Task5003 If I walk outside and stab someone to Death, I'll get 25 years at most. Even if its not premeditated, lets take away the kills that are done on the spot and look at the more extreme kills, more than one. Planned murders. Etc. Detering might not work with them, but it would be better for them not to be out in 20 years.
xPyroxx 5 days ago
No idea who that woman is, but she's a complete and utter ****.
Task5003 5 days ago
do porn, darling, not politics.
msg355 5 days ago
@msg355 Good god no.
temporaldisplacement 5 days ago
Capital punishment is unbelievably hypocritical. "We execute people to stop people killing people".
Hmmmm....
tcfizz555 6 days ago
"It is not a deterrent killing the wrong people" - Take that and smoke it, Bitch!
jschanna 6 days ago
What they should do for convicted murderers and rapists is, have a giant gladiator tournament. Obviously they want to kill one and other so let them.
ZigZagRunner 6 days ago
she's a member of Al-Quaeda, right? or is it the K.K.K.???
marcohorowitz8 6 days ago
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marcohorowitz8 6 days ago
I don't agree with capital punishment even with full proof - but if 10 million guilty men are executed and 1 innocent, then it isn't acceptable and the whole thing is totally flawed.
Like I said, for me - it isn't acceptable to kill anyone regardless of guilt.
weirdcitykid 6 days ago
I entirely agree with the lady, do you think she will let me shag her now?
planetrockford 6 days ago
I would have punched my screen if she wasn't so fine.
razzaxxe 1 week ago
She has no grasp on reality, she thinks evidence is perfect and there's no way mistakes could be made even when Ian just highlighted that fact.
When someone says "... does what it says on the tin" and they aren't talking about wood varnish, they are an idiot.
CowLunch 1 week ago 79
@CowLunch Or baked beans. I'd rather like those, inside their tin, to turn out to be baked, and beans. Preferably in tomato sauce, if it so claims.
BlackLiger788 5 days ago
It's like watching a goon try to take down Superman. You just can't understand why they don't know they're not going to win. It's Superman.
gaggle64 1 week ago
Did Harriet Harman used to be a giraffe?
sail1948 1 week ago
Comment removed
1DX2020 1 week ago
She embarrassed herself.
Catandthespoon 1 week ago
This should be called a Hisslap!!!
jnewman888 1 week ago 6
"Complete and utter burden of proof"? Pardon?
"...on the statute books, for example..." Umm where else might it be?
Priti Patel, flying the flag for fuckwits everywhere. Perhaps it's a minor point to quibble with her turn of phrase but it indicates she simply doesn't understand the issues she's so magnificently failing to discuss.
Adv0kaat 1 week ago
Its worrying to have an MP of any kind on question time preaching the benefits of capitol punishment as a deterrent to crime who seems to be unaware of the provable findings that it isnt. Not to mention the humanitarian issues.
cmomofilm 1 week ago
Isn't that one of cameron's brainless totty babes?
sprintersacre1 1 week ago
Whats all this bullshit about liberal versus conservative or left versus right? Some issues are just right versus wrong.
SuperKol91 1 week ago
Stupid private school educated response. If the reason for abolishing capital punishment is that so many cases are judged wrong then it clearly seems that the judicial system is failing. Why ignore the problem by creating a new one? If calculated murder was inforced by hanging then it would deter the person from "calculating the murder of another Human being" and for one who has calusly murdered another human is allowed to walk after spending time in prison then where is the justice i ask!
falim2007 1 week ago
@falim2007 No it wouldn't, we had capital punishment in the UK for a very long time, even for many crimes other than premeditated murder, it didn't deter, on the contrary the crime rate was far higher most of the time.
If life imprisonment doesn't deter someone, then nothing will (for many life imprisonment is considered worse by people, hence they take their own life). Nor for many murderers is there any real deterrent as a fair number are two sandwiches short of a picnic to put it nicely.
somename99 1 week ago
@somename99 Of course it doesn't deter, because the three reason for murder are:
psychological URGE to kill, can't be deterred.
Fit of rage, again it can't be deterred, because you are not thinking clearly
Premeditated murder, which always includes plans to hide who done it. They believe they don't get caught, therefore again not deterring effect.
The only people deterred by capital punishment are also deterred by none capital punishment!
Kashrlyyk 6 days ago
@falim2007 "Stupid private school educated response"
Ian Hislop's ? Well, he did go to a top public school. Of course, Priti Patel went to a state school and shares the opinions of most of the UK's working class.
oarfrost 1 week ago
more like ian jizzlop the little turkey monkey isnt even that funny although i do respect him
and his views on the death of billy ray cyrus
read all about them in ians new auto novella titled
me miley and billy ray a lifetime of memories
Kwornsman87 1 week ago
how can 1 person be so thick ?
NeilTheFerret1 1 week ago
DNA is pretty good so on the multiple rape case I really think the person has taken themselves out of society, there by go ideally to the gallows.
troyboy2819 1 week ago
full proof eh- would that that existed
cardigan3000 1 week ago
Hislop's on the button as usual, the woman's just another muddled idiot.
ysgol3 1 week ago 53
There's a good American documentary called "After Innocence" which is about people sentenced to death who're found innocent. It's a good watch, no matter your stance, and is relevant to the death penalty debate.
Ultimately this isn't a matter of left and right, I don't think. Some people believe that few should die wrongly, others believe that's totally unacceptable. To box this as a torie-labour, left-right issue is idiotic. It's about whether you have empathy or whether you don't.
z0mgrugbyreturns 1 week ago
She's really attractive.
besty222 1 week ago
Reason I don't like the death penalty, Hitler doesn't deserve it. Too easy.
He should be locked in a prison cell, and every relative of a dead civilian comes in one at a time, three times a day, and kicks him in the balls, for the rest of his life.
And he has to eat German food everyday.
superhamzah85 1 week ago
@superhamzah85
But we show him mercy, by giving him German beer, but after 30 years, tell him it was actuallly 20% Holocaust survivor urine.
superhamzah85 1 week ago
@superhamzah85 I know, why do more people not think this? I could be against the death penalty on revenge grounds only. If my loved ones were killed, why would I want the killer to have a quick death.
It would be way more vengeful to let them rot in prison until they're a old man and let them out all confused into a world they will barely recognise with no friends & no family alive that can recognise them... let them see their peers with grandchildren and rich full lives......
CmdrTobs 1 week ago
is this woman an idiot? kinda hot though..
dageezerboi 1 week ago
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pidgin 1 week ago
What about people like Timothy John Evans who where hung and it was later discovered they were innocent once its done you cant take it back
thethirdmansshadow 1 week ago
bring back the capital punishment
kevinkards 1 week ago
@kevinkards No.
khetti2006 1 week ago
Who is the idiot woman by the way?
Tory I guess - lost my vote
I would love to know what Call me Dave says about this,
welshexcile 1 week ago
It hasn't worked in the US, it hasn't made it a deterrent there.
TheStevenWhiting 1 week ago 2
"Hangings were a big public festivalin the 1600's. Crowds gathered along the route from Newgate to Tyburn, and around the Tyburn tree itself, often exceeding 100,000. The rich rented upper-storey rooms in houses and pubs to get the best views. Street hawkers and food vendors also lined the route - they knew a good bet when they saw one. A grandstand was even erected at the gallows. Thieves and pickpockets also took advantage of the holiday atmosphere" (pickpocketing was a capital offence)
chuffyone 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You have to be very wary of a person who actively wants others to be killed
OldManMahoney 1 week ago
Comment removed
dudesuperior 1 week ago
Two words; Fred West. If we had capital punishment, Fred West, the notorious paedophile, rapist and murderer would be a most likely candidate execution. However, following his arrest, West cheated the justice system by taking his own life, rather than face life imprisionment. Capital punishment would not be a deterent for such people.
woodgatejack 1 week ago
@woodgatejack If prisons did their jobs people would not be able to commit suicide when on death row or in custody
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh That as may be. However, my point still stands that capital punishment would not be a deterant for such people. It may even be a relief for some. Take a person so consumed with guilt or self-loathing that they want to end their own life, but are to cowardly (or possessed of twisted religious conviction) to do so. Execution takes that burden off them (and the relgious nut would recive absolution)
woodgatejack 1 week ago
@woodgatejack regarding the life sentence alternative I'll go back to what I originally said that it just is not a punishment in its present state - how can having better food than hospitals, a secure habitat safe from vigilantes and such, and access to TV, internet and whatever be considered punishment?
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh Please be so kind as to answer for me two questions.
1. Have you ever been to prison?
2. What newspaper do you read?
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
@woodgatejack If prison time were as harsh and punishing as it should be I would totally support it as the better option, but it just isn't. because of this country's obsession with the human rights of good for nothing scum
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
if capital punishment were to be reinstated.....we would lose our politicians pretty quickly.
faniboz1 1 week ago
...as for her point about the justice system, I agree also, the justice system is a joke, having such harsh punishments would force the re-hash it needs, would force the system to rely only on concrete evidence - DNA, confessions, etc. ...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
I don't see how she is stupid...Hislop raises good points, but, though she isn't very good at getting her point across I can see what she is getting at...it is a deterrent, that's just logical, because prisons are pointless in this country - it depends on context...if prisons were closer to dungeons, as they should be, there would be no need for a death penalty...people should stop just comparing it to America all the time, it's a very different world...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
If the threat of capital punishment was a deterrent, there wouldn't be all these people on death row in the United States.
blackmichael75 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 they have guns, we don't...also, they're American
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh so? Those two facts are an irrelevance.
blackmichael75 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 explain how it's 'irrelevant', it related directly to the issue of whether a) capital punishment is more moral than the system we have now and b) whether it would actually work better than the system we have now...things are generally different in America, and I know our government is corrupt but we have it easy in comparison to Americans...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh because the nationality of people and whether or not they have guns does not influence whether capital punishment is a deterrent or not. If it were, there would be less crime in those states and countries which have it. We know that this is not the case.
blackmichael75 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 it's a combination of grey areas - it does depend to some extent on the country in question, there are the issues of how easy firearms to access, and there are the issues, - though this is to many just a scapegoat - of ethnic minority areas where there is a higher crime rate (certain parts of London/New York for example)
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 ...Luckily I was raised properly so I have morals, but I know that if I wanted to I could easily go and murder someone in cold blood and not fear the consequences because I know I'd just get about 10-20 years in a comfy safe prison with free food that is better than hospital food apparently...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh - The U.S. has the death penalty and a lower crime rate than the UK and yet it has 5 times the number of murders. So not much of a deterrent is it.
WillShakespeare2007 1 week ago
@WillShakespeare2007 It's also considerably larger than the size of Britain in case you didn't notice...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh - I was obviously talking in percentages dumb ass.
WillShakespeare2007 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh Pretty sure it was meant to be 5 times the murder rate rather than 5 times the murders. The real factor is more like 4, regardless the murder rate is still way higher in the States.
achtung555 1 week ago
@achtung555 I expect so...but I am just trying to say that many things are different in the US, it's a very different country, I think the comparison is quite irrelevant and actually illogical as well...an issue such as this needs to be considered and judged on a case by case basis, by assessing the situations and needs of our country, not by saying 'Americans haven't got it right' or 'look at those horrible Arabs stoning and beheading people'...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 if we were to adopt capital punishment again, being the huge, sensitive issue it is, Britain would take all measures necessary to make it a strictly regulated system...and, as I was saying, as a result, the legal system as a whole would be improved...
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
@SROCeallaigh It was strictly regulated before, but there were still miscarriages or justice and the wrong people were hanged.
blackmichael75 1 week ago
@blackmichael75 but that was before more significant advances in science that can prove beyond doubt that someone is guilty
SROCeallaigh 1 week ago
the most annoying thing about priti patel is the way she says something then repeats it, adding *really* for emphasis
i hate that, i really do. it's more annoying even than the lack of substance in her opinions and argument, it really is. i don't know how she managed to get where she is now, i really don't.
loof000 1 week ago
@loof000 You may not agree with the first time but let me see if it sounds any better a second later. Like at the opticians: better? or worse? better? or worse...?
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
@loof000 Yeah it's the classic right wing female argument. Poison wells, emotional appeals, repetition with nodding rinse and repeat. Carol vordman used it to get a whole audience to think it made any logical sense to inform jamie Bullgers parents of Jon Venables latest unrelated crimes...
CmdrTobs 1 week ago
He nailed it, and i'd nail that chick.
arr5612 2 weeks ago
@Josh1000digby LMFAO Hoisted by your own petard! Annihilated by the great KongofPip! You should close your account and join the circus lol.
MrsFanakapan 2 weeks ago
that asian chick really doesnt know what the term 'burden of proof' means, she repeatedly misused it throughout this video. based on this video alone, i can tell she is a very unintelligent person, what the fuck is she doing on question time?
SJGibbons1000 2 weeks ago
@SJGibbons1000 That's the problem. Her formal education grades likely would kick ours arse. Formal education doesn't penalize creativity, poor observation etc.... It actually rewards those things as they contribute to higher focus better organization.
CmdrTobs 1 week ago
The death penalty is not a deterrent because people always think they'll get away with murder, they never consider the consequences.
Skankndub024 2 weeks ago 26
Is Patel serious? and she's a politician...wow, just wow. Massive shaking my head moment.
chemicalelysium 2 weeks ago
@Josh1000digby No difference between me and others in my classification, I meant...BTW where are my other 7 questions, or are you scared of being proved wrong by your own statistics?
KongofPip 2 weeks ago
Its also WRONG TO KILL. The insane right think that 1 + 1 = 0; IT DOESN'T...
StunnedByStupidity 2 weeks ago
We definitely need a deterrent against being wrongly accused of murder...
gypsyroses198 2 weeks ago
that bitch needs shooting lol
lousaffire 2 weeks ago
Seems to me that its idiotic to say someone is idiotic for supporting capital punishment. The nature of it is never in debate and Ian Hislop and PE, though good in some ways, should not hold themselves up with such self righteousness!
BiffaTW 2 weeks ago
@BiffaTW It is ignorant to support capital punishment, she said that the evidence would have to be completely proven; SHOCKER! Evidence can be fabricated, as happened with the Guildford 4, Birmingham 6 and Maguire 7.
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
@KungfuCow5 Indeed it can, worse can happen Ill give you a story of young kid from my area who was hung at 19 in 1953. He never committed the crime and what is more everyone knew he did not do so but the Home Secretary at the time wrote a letter that ordered the young man hanged 'as an example'. Continued in another comment...
BiffaTW 1 week ago
@BiffaTW And because that can happen it should be clear to any rational member of society that this is not a civilised form of punishment.
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
@KungfuCow5 This is disgusting, in fact worse than disgusting and is the kind of thing that gave capital punishment its notority for abuse. However, if it were to be conducted in proper courts of justice, with the clarity of the law, out of gov. hands, accountable to the people, scrutinised by the media and based on absolutly certain evidence (which many cases invariably are) I believe it would work.
BiffaTW 1 week ago
@BiffaTW Are you kidding? Out of government hands? Without the rules and regulations? Subject to people prone to anger and vengeance? How would that work?
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
@KungfuCow5 He's saying that cuz he's an Amerrykan. You can literally throw in 'get government out' in any argument and get rapturous applause in that land. 2nd only to calling something 'communist'
CmdrTobs 1 week ago
@KungfuCow5 No I'm not kidding, in a 'civilised society' as you put it, the law should rule, not the government, which is liable to self-interest and is apparently relatively unacccountable once voted in power. People should make a clear distinction between the law and the lawmakers, and remember accountability, all of which are key in this. The government, as my last comments hopefully show, ought to have no right to issue the death penalty above the law, the law should come first.
BiffaTW 1 week ago
@BiffaTW The government are accountable to the law and are responsible for implementing it. The death penalty would never worked because there are no circumstances under which it can't be exploited.
KungfuCow5 1 week ago
On another note, how stupid and incoherent is that woman supporting the death penalty?
guitarpedant 2 weeks ago
If you have the death penalty for any particular crime or crimes, then the guilty party would have motivation to commit any amount of other crimes, including murders, that might help them evade prosecution. THAT is why capital punishment is not only morally wrong, but stupid and counter-productive.
guitarpedant 2 weeks ago
ian hisplop
lawes84 2 weeks ago
Good lord, that woman is ridiculous.
mysteryeskimo 2 weeks ago 25
Capital punishment is absurd. Imagine how many more people would go on killing sprees if they were risking being charged with a painless death rather than life in prison.
toolworks 2 weeks ago
the criminal justice system doesn't come in a tin you stupid bitch.
MrCouldbeakiller 2 weeks ago
i think we should parachute Ian Hislop to Washington, he'll sort them out in no time
jakehall331 2 weeks ago
Texas has one of the highest execution rates in the United States, yet their murder rate has never gone below the top 5 states. It just doesn't work as a deterrent.
gbushimprov 2 weeks ago
Ian Hislop, my role-model and unpaid Internet mentor!
luckyyellow70 2 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Its like the people hating America because they were denied permission to enter owing to a criminal record. All the sleazy gits standing up for murderers on here mostly come from criminal backgrounds and a lot are typing their comments out on a smuggled smartphone in a prison cell. We should be hanging murderers at a rate of one a week in this country. The forensics are so overwhelmingly irrefutable in at least that many cases and so many of these murders are so vicious its like exhibitionism.
Whatever104104 2 weeks ago
Let me explain in few words, where there is no doubt about who the murderer is in such circumstatnces the death penalty should be enofrced.
TheSirSneaky 2 weeks ago
what a simpleton
3PointFilms 2 weeks ago
'better ten guilty men go free than one innocent man be hung'!
qetoun 2 weeks ago
'Capital punishment' is not the real issue. It is the state will administer it which is the problem. Giving a power crazied government the right to kill people (after an attempt at due process) is inherantly dangerous.
qetoun 2 weeks ago
We're not all knowing- taking this into account, it's pretty obvious that mistakes will be made, and considering the serious nature of capital punishment...We must leave no room for mistakes.
Secondly, capital punishment a deterrant? Have a look at the states in America where capital punishment is implemented. In those very states, the murder rates are still very high.
TurboDally 2 weeks ago
@TurboDally I wonder how many criminals stop and think "Hmm what will the repercussions be if I kill this person (etc.)?". Many murders are acted out on impulse and if they are premeditated then the criminal doesn't actually expect to get caught.
195ashes 2 weeks ago in playlist Liked videos
I have yet to meet anyone with a brain who supports the death penalty. This lady is absolutely typical of the simple-minded mob mentality...
PaulHussey01 2 weeks ago
I remember this, she is such a twat lol....
dazstar 2 weeks ago