Elite Will Not Give Up Power - Dollar Collapse - Revolution - Jacque Fresco

[nathenmorris]

good lord i remember monopoly as a child best damn game ever, but its like when i was in the marine corp oh YOU WANT TO PLAY GAMES lets play hurricane katrina. I love playing games but there comes a point where we grow up mature and put forth effort to make real world changes to make others as well as ourself happy

[Yetibiker11]

Those big ears, those high brows, that fuzzy beard.yeppp he is an Asteroid Monkey!!

[Yetibiker11]

Karl looks like a Star Wars character perhaps an Asteroid Monkey?

[Yetibiker11]

The Venus Project is a great idea for Karl and for those who want this to happen but will it happen? Not now and certainly not in the next millenia. Far too much greed, too many religious powers to fight with one another and worst of all way too many egos to battle with.

Karl mentions that even if they had the money to build such a place in a where ever location it would not work because it would just resort back to one of our current cites. Oh I beg to differ Karl!!

[lrdmrkry]

Why that girl looks so shocked?!!!

[dopeboyhero]

my comments got deleted lmao. SOPA? who knows.

[dopeboyhero]

wtf

[luminumx]

The easiest way and fastest way to take down the power elite is to impose an 100% inheritance tax. The power elite wont be able to pass down their wealth and when they die all there money will return back to the state. Problem solved.

[Flamepwnz]

It's sad, that people like this dont get more attention.

[mipy94]

EVERYTHING CAN BE DONE IN 1 DAY, ONE DAY OF NO BUYING ANYTHING. THE FREKAIN ECONOMY WILL FREAKIN FALL.

[Laoch111]

Jacque Fresco is a great wise man.

[johnyboy6405]

Subs pleeeaase!!!

[darkridr25]

So when does the transition from money to resource based economy even start? Do things HAVE to completely collapse for these ideas to start being implemented? Mind you, I'm not asking for a complete switch over, but rather, I want to see it at least start. Is this really so much to ask?

TVP has been talking for at least 35 years now, and that's all I still hear even now: Talking. Is anything being done beyond that?

[Cows4jessy]

@darkridr25 they created a research facility in venus florida.....

[axe863]

@Cows4jessy Well its a pretty shitty research facility if it hasn't published even 1 peer reviewed research paper in over 30 years.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

STFU with your peer-reviewed bullshit. I've heard enough of your ilk go on about the greatness of the peer-review process, when in fact it is just as corrupt and worthless an institution as anything else in our world.

You know nothing about the peer-review process. Do you know how many Nobel Prize winning, respected scientists have had papers rejected, that actually turned out to be the very papers that got them the Nobel Prize?

You need to learn a lot, before you bark.

[axe863]

@Sidionian Yeah, science and the scientific method are fantastic but when peer reviewed evidence disagrees with your pseudo-scientific beliefs, its nonsense. So you're also a "911 twoofer." Beautiful. If you're a scientist then I'm a porn star.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

Fresco's system is far more sophisticated than your pseudo-scientific clap trap on your channel. It is only deceptively simple to a poorly informed wannabe pseudo-debunker like you. You lack the mental equipment to form the intellectual system from the seemingly simple statements that Fresco (and Joseph) make. You're a far inferior mind to them, but you wish to convince yourself otherwise, which is why you have appointed yourself as the enlightened, sage-like pillar of wisdom.

[axe863]

@Sidionian So because some scientists get rejected from publishing their papers in certain peer reviewed journals for a period of time.... it becomes more acceptable to believe in batshit crazy things. Where is Fresco falsifiable theoretical model of a RBE? There is NO model. Maybe if you understand basic dynamical systems.. you would understand that even if you have a final model but you vary the parameters, you can have completely different types of fluctuations.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

Nice try doofus. I have studied dynamical systems and chaos at university, and your nonsensical brain farts are not going to refute the basics of Fresco's philosophy. And just because you've cherry picked a little philosophy 101 here and there and have been exposed to a bit of the popular account of Popper's philosophy of science, doesn't qualify you to sit on you tube and bark like a clueless little doggy.

[axe863]

@Sidionian You're obviously lying about studying dynamical system and chaos at university. The equation that I stated before {X(t+1)=p[x(t)-x(t)^2]} is a famous NL first order difference equation. Next time don't lie to try to protect your faith==> tell Fresco that science =/= drawing pretty pictures/ making propaganda movies about the ..world of tomorrow.........and actually work together to create a falsifiable model of a RBE and test that theoretical model.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

*Yawn* -- haven't we all seen the likes of you come and go before...? You're a pygmie in a room of giants, too small to be aware of the other, much larger and evolved living structures around you. An ant walking on a basketball, unaware of the ball's three dimensionality.

Thankfully, nobody is paying much attention to your rubbish youtube channel, so operation 'cognitive dissonance' isn't working for you yet again, little dunce.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

You're a jack-of-all trades scraps collector, who understands little, yet thinks that this wee bit of understanding gives you the privilege of 'educating' others.

You've skimmed through a few popular science books and a few philosophy 101 books for good measure, and now you're a self-proclaimed guardian of the status quo, whose self-appointed duty it is, to protect those gullible sheep who have fallen into the 'evil' Fresco trap.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

You're nothing more than a ranting teenager, thinking that a tiny bit of self-reflection and social interaction suddenly outstrips the life experiences of your 'backward' parents.

Is that what you're here to do? Or are you here to somehow request that an accomplished and far more intelligent individual, dignify your existence with a 'falsifiable' (you don't even know the meaning of this concept, you driveling twat) model, so that you can sleep better at night?

[Sidionian]

@axe863

And you're a porn star, are you? And how does that qualify you to critique anything but your 'unfair' wage cuts due to online piracy? In fact, a porn star actually would know more about the bitterness of your monetary religion, than a waffling, wannabe-armchair intellectual on you tube.

You're not the armchair intellectual you desperately wish you were. You have grossly overestimated yourself, and your ability to critique, little fool.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

Knowing your own limitations is far more impressive than professing to know that of others.

But by all means, bark all day long, little doggy, but you're as effective as the dog barking at the moon. You're a non-entity, and nobody is paying any attention to you.

Your brand of hollow rhetoric can be seen through by even the simplest intellect.

Perhaps that's why you've barely even managed to convince yourself, little dunce.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

Remember: you're an idiot with a juvenile OPINION, and all that is above and beyond that, is too sophisticated for you to grasp.

You still fail to understand, that Fresco's simple language and deceptively simple communication techniques also suggests a simplistic, poorly thought-out, non-scientific 'model', that is "batshit crazy."

LOL @ your communication skills.

You never manage to rise above the cliche, do you tiny little doggy?

[Sidionian]

@axe863

But that's to be expected from a self-overestimating jack-of-a-few-trades. Self-overestimators never manage to rise above the common cliche, some of which are:

* Hiding behind seemingly impressive sounding language to mask the emptiness and irrelevance of your 'argument.'

* Misunderstanding all that is connected with scientific enquiry and attempting to use that misunderstanding to criticize those who do understand it.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

* Using social constructs that heavily rely on monetary and reputation standards -- which are strictly NON-scientific -- (such as the modern 'peer-review' process) to convince yourself of demonstrated invalidity.

(You don't even know what a valid or invalid argument is).

As I have stated and demonstrated: You're nothing more than an irrelevant, insignificant cliche. You're a non-entity, and there is nothing further to discuss with you.

[axe863]

@Sidionian "You're a non-entity, and there is nothing further to discuss with you." What's your problem? Btw, extraordinary claims requires extraordinary evidence, not zero evidence. Im sorry if I think its hypocritical for people who believe that a strict adherence to the scientific method is key to proclaim RBE's superiority to capitalism without having falsifiable models of a RBE and capitalism. Im so sorry for being scientifically rational in my approach.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

And in case you wish to be a 'smart-ass' and come back with "why waste time on a non-entity like me?" my response is: Even non-entities like you deserve free education -- so make the most of it and try to learn from your superiors.

But, as the saying goes:

"A Wise man can learn a lot from an idiot, but an idiot never learns anything from the wise man."

Get back to square one and start actually learning, instead of deafening your superiors with your stupidity.

[axe863]

@Sidionian How can someone write so much and yet say so little? I derive great pleasure by being called ignorant by an ignoramus. Ill give you the simplest possible example that will disprove what youve said, X(t+1)=p*X(t)[1-x(t)]. If one varies parameter p, it goes from being asymptotically stable to chaotic. This is not disputable.

[axe863]

@Sidionian "A Wise man can learn a lot from an idiot, but an idiot never learns anything from the wise man." So true ;)

[axe863]

@Sidionian "Even non-entities like you deserve free education -- so make the most of it and try to learn from your superiors." HAHA. For Fresco to be my intellectual superior, you would have to hit me in the head with a hammer a full dozen times.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

"HAHA. For Fresco to be my intellectual superior..."

Okay. It's clear I am dealing with a not-too-bright pre-pubescent ape here (or someone with the intellectual level thereof, or both), who isn't even witty enough to actually do comedy.

Congratulations, doofus -- any moderately successful comedian is more intelligent than you, because you can't even succeed at the proper use of sarcasm and humor.

Short: You're an idiot, and I ask you to cease writing to me anything further.

[axe863]

@Sidionian Did this "non-entity" say something offensive? I proved you wrong with 100 certainty and now you're asking me to stop talking to you because I said one thing that ridiculed your prophet. Have an open mind but not so open that your brain falls out. Goodbye.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

You have proven absolutely nothing, besides the fact that your intellect cannot handle the construction of basic humor.

Queue in the part where you write me an essay on the "unfalsifiability of the subjective veracity of the humor conjecture: Why Sidionian's critique of my humor is pseudo-scientific, unfalsifiable and logically both non-constructible & non-deconstructible; even if a pseudo-linear differential operator with respect to the time axis induces noisy distortions."

[axe863]

@Sidionian You obviously cant be reasoned with so this is for the benefit of others. There are certain classes of systems under which Turing machines are known not to halt==>non-computable. If a system is non-chaotic & structurally regular, a TM can be deduced to halt. If a system is chaotic, a TM can be deduced not to halt. If a system has an internally induced evolutionary structure, a TM will not halt. Fresco knows a RBE is solvable without an optimization model or its parameters.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

I understand what you're trying to say, Axe, but what you are stating is superficial and actually not far from nonsense. A part of me is not sure if you are just trying to amuse yourself by acting stupid, or you actually are stupid (I am not trying to put you down, but I have encountered plenty such folk before).

I do not believe in ad hominem with enquiring minds (who may disagree with me), but I cannot tolerate idiots who are purposely trying to misguide others. 

[Sidionian]

@axe863

So, if you are not such an individual, then let's have a talk sometime (perhaps by email), but not right now.

We are all here to learn and develop, evolve and contribute in whatever way we can. This is my outlook on life. If I see individuals who merely wish to divide, conquer and destroy, then I am intolerant.

I never stated TVP is free from errors. Far from it. And I am not talking about the general structure of TVP.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

I am referring to issues that haven't even been discussed in detail by Jacque, things which he himself would not be fully aware of.

But as stated before, it is already intellectually far superior to all other social systems that are known by economic historians, the details of which need to be mapped out in the future by mathematicians and scientists.

This is one of the many things I will be doing in the future, and perhaps you could assist, instead of trying to rubbish it.

[axe863]

@Sidionian If you actually were a mathematician, you would laugh hysterically at someone who stated, without any proofing, that he can create an optimization model in an environment that is continually in flux due to adaption to internally induced innovations. (If a system has an internally induced evolutionary structure, a TM will not halt.) Even if that weren't the case, one must never accept anything on pure faith. Mathematics and science aren't religions.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

Okay, I will give you the benefit of the doubt here, and assume you actually are NOT trying to be a troll.

I personally have no problems whatsoever with individuals who wish to genuinely think critically, ask questions, not take a single thing on blind faith or devotion, and adhere to the scientific method (please keep in mind that not a single social system, including Captialism, has ever passed such a test or produced a 'falsifiable' model).

[axe863]

@Sidionian Im not a market fundamentalist. I actually specialize in analyzing financial crises. Because I have taken some doctoral level economics/mathematics (Im studying the interdisciplinary field of complexity), I understand the severe limitations of optimization methods and mathematical models in general. Btw, Ill be busy after the 9th

[Sidionian]

@axe863

However, firstly, I will not get into the details with you regarding TVP for the time being, because I actually am quite busy with many things in life, and I generally try to avoid debating trolls on you tube. However, if you turn out not to be a troll, I am more than game to discuss these issues with you. What I will not do, is play ball with a chimp who wishes to throw around fancy buzz words and waste my time with useless quacking.

As I said, not right now, but maybe later.

[axe863]

@Sidionian How about you tone down the insults and talk to me as if I were human being. Why is everyone who disagrees with TVP/TZM assumed to be a troll first? Why do you think the scientific community is almost completely silent about TVP? Is it because there's a global conspiracy or is it because they have absolutely zero scientific evidence for their claims? Its not irrational to require scientific evidence from a group that preaches that science is our only salvation.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

I see you've been doing some barking around in these forums, yes? Are you a scientist? Do you know anything about the peer-review process? No, you do not, that much is obvious. I am a scientist, and I know quite a lot about it. I know how corrupt and close-to-worthless it is. Your kind are the same idiots who flood the 9/11 truth movements with the exact same bullshit sing-a-long mantra: "Where's the peer-reviewed papers?"

If only you knew what you were speaking about, ape.

[darkridr25]

@Cows4jessy Good! I'm glad to hear it. Thanks for the info. :)

[blackpanther6389]

So i have a question to zeitgeistmonroe: Are you not allowed to put up full lectures or what? I would like to sit through a whole lecture because I've never actually seen these videos before and would like to see more.

[michael0001able]

Of course the current system wont collapse lol, but if it does THE VENUS PROJECT :-\

[Play671]

I have always seen as obstinate elite social class. And now I have to say, idiots too.

TVP FOREVER ( TZM too )

[live4pce]

its funny, most of the things he is saying are common sense....yet not.

[Play671]

He is smart! ;)

[PtAltmVansanTarr]

Zeitgeist is awesome

[97pattan]

One way to kick start zeitgeist project is to get the world population to show support with one voice. Use the people power to spear ahead in a positive way without violence and somebody who promise to take up zeitgeist movement could become the next president to be elected and abandon the old system systematically.

[firuinthehouse]

OK check this out:

ALL the unemployed people, or certainly a great part of them, will join any VP opportunity TOMORROW, with their labor, skilled or otherwise. That right there is a completely FREE resource. Provide a system that works (much like a factory would be one) and the people will come.

Why doesn't the VP even attempt anything like that? Over and over I see myself forced to ask - WHY all the begging, when an efficient, capable system wouldn't need to beg ?

[zeitgeistmonroe]

@firuinthehouse 2 years is a relatively short time to expect large scale production for such a radical concept of change. There's no stepping from here to there easily/quickly. Building a model city costs a fortune & require more funds & resources then you realize. We're not Disney. We're a grassroots movement. Call Roxanne or Jacque & ask if you EXPECT more from them... Where's this money for the materials going to come from to "built this factory and they will come" expectation you have?

[97pattan]

@zeitgeistmonroe all this project need is a kick start. But kick start has to come from people who have (material or land) which belongs to the winner group in the capitalism and therefore it is unlikely for them to give up what they already won. its a chicken and egg problem,

[Gyohdon]

@97pattan What if an insider would become part of the winner group?

[97pattan]

@Gyohdon you are right. the present system support the "legal insider". Given that government could print as much money as they want and that government around the world collaborate financial issue. Knowing very well that the system has already collapsed, they could fix the exchange rate meaninglessly without regard to trade balances.

Any announcement about trade etc are meaningless when there is unlimited printing by every government.

[axe863]

@firuinthehouse Why actually apply the scientific method ... when J Fresco says it can work lol

[blackpanther6389]

@axe863 Well the problem is. His ideas haven't been put to practice yet so how can you apply the scientific method to something that hasn't been put to test hmm? He applied the scientific method to the modes of behavior of human beings and to the monetary system and society and he came up with the venus project. Now it's time to emerge with the same method to realize that this system is shit lol, and it doesn't work and it's got to go for the betterment of everyone!! =D

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 Ok...please link me to his peer reviewed model of human behavior and the monetary system. He hasn't applied the scientific method to anything. Hes pseudo-scientific to his core. I would not be ripping on Fresco/TVP movement if they weren't hypocrites. He says that in a RBE the scientific method is king whilst concluding the superiority of RBE with zero peer reviewed papers, zero mathematical models and zero real world application.

[blackpanther6389]

@axe863 I haven't seen any of the stuff you've mentioned; though again, you can't apply this to the real world unless of course he had a test city which he doesn't. I agree to an extent about not having any papers out there. If anyone actually disagrees with anything he says you're free to write a paper about it, or make a youtube video like all of the countless people who make an attempt to debunking what the venus project is capable of, and fail. Where are any of the counter arguments to...

[blackpanther6389]

Where are any of the counter arguments to Jacque and his ideals. He is putting them out there on the web for people to see who needs paper? Another thing he claims is the fact that he has no credentials so he can't get to anybody. 

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 So I have to disprove the existence of a magical unicorn and its true until I provide evidence against it. Hes putting out pretty pictures. If I drew a picture of a wormhole generator, would you believe that I can traverse the universe at faster than the speed of light without any other evidence.

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 Would you have to disprove the existence of my wormhole generator or would I have to prove it? 

[blackpanther6389]

@axe863 Well I'm not out to disprove anything I'm open to all ideas, I'd rather see you prove it. Of course you need money to start any project in this system which is what's required to start the first experimental city and test it's function. I was talking mainly about the way of thinking that comes from Jacque. I don't really know anything about his blueprints except that he says that he'd rather not show as it could become a commercial product which I can understand why he doesn't put it out

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 I dont have to disprove his magical unicorn project but I am going to. If he really understood the human condition and had superior algorithms(and/or if he had a superior model on "capitalistic crisis"), he would earn excess profits (profits in excess of systematic risk) and be the wealthiest organization by the 90's due to ever declining credit constraints. Why is he asking for donations? So he doesnt show you his superior construct and he doesnt use it.

[juqual78]

@axe863 I think because the system that can make his group said profits is the same system that will overuse resources and unnessarily abuse people and the world in which we need to sustain ourselves. It seems the goals of this movement are much more long term than the goals of most people (worrying about just yourself kids, and not say 30 generations down the line). We tend to think very short term and this really needs to change if we seriously plan doing as well as we can in the long run

[axe863]

@juqual78 So instead of demonstrating the superiority of his model(without having to reveal it) and save lives (generating excess wealth) which would severely accelerate the diffusion of TVPS RBE, he choose to allow people to toil with their inefficienct methods to receive the same K amount of money (through interaction with a monetary system) that is necessary to build the first TVP cities. Genius

[axe863]

@juqual78 There is no amount of mental gymnastics that will allow this to make any sense. Better luck, next time.

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 Lol who cares about buildings......anyone can build a building... but no one can overcome "Turning unsolvablity"

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof....... and the fact that TVP promotes a pure scientific approach to everything and have already concluded RBE superiority with ZERO testing .....is completely insane.

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 "Well I'm not out to disprove anything I'm open to all ideas" Ok I have one for you. I have come to this view of the world with the same amount of scientific rigor that TVP utilizes. There are magical scientific invisible mind gremilins in your ear and thats why you have nightmares..and yeah I almost forgot to say science is great scientific method science science science. This is true until you disprove it.

[blackpanther6389]

@axe863 I think I understand what you're saying now. I don't really have anything to say in defense since you obviously have your mind made up. All I'm going to say is that, I'm tired of the monetary system and what it's doing to people because just by, for lack of a better word, "spectating", I can see that money is the root cause for all of the bullshit. I'm ready for change and if someone with much more knowledge than I do has a plan and is willing and wanting to put that plan to test...

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 "I don't really have anything to say in defense since you obviously have your mind made up" ... Im just applying the same scientific method that TVP pretends to support. Science doesnt care about neat ideas.... it cares about ideas that can quantified and survive continual dissection from numerous experts. "I can see that money is the root cause for all of the bullshit." How very unscientific of you..... you say money causes X...with zero falsifiable models to test against.

[blackpanther6389]

I will do what I can to help. You can't do much to help in the money system, just more patchword. So I don't know what it is you want to do in life or whatever but I wish you luck in whatever it is you want to do, not much else I can say when you have me beat right now lol xD.

[axe863]

@blackpanther6389 "You can't do much to help in the money system, just more patchword." Oh ok wheres TVPs peer reviewed research paper on how the monetary system is inherently flawed. ..Oh there is none... what do you mean there's no paper...but if they adhere to the scientific method...they cant say anything conclusive until they have thoroughly tested what they proclaim.

TVP....its pwns, itself.

[Sidionian]

@axe863

I've just viewed your profile. LOL, can we say, professional pseudo-debunking troll?

You're another one of those pathetic pseudo-debunking shills that regularly flood the 9/11 truth communities, with your asinine rubbish. Except, this time, it's the VP. You're what they call "damage control".

You're a floater. A fucking fraud. You drift around, add your dime's worth of dreck to a conversation, and hope that you've confused a few people in the process...

LOL@ you, troll.

[depro9]

This is it, now is our moment. IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN!

[DamnItVideos]

I hope this man never dies...

[DunkleMaterie117]

@DamnItVideos If Jacque Fresco dies, its up to US, to make his ideologie life on. This man is immortal if WE want it. He is really is a hero... and its so sad the fought his whole life with reaching nearly nothing. Can you see how stupid the rest of mankind is.

I already fight in my own way. I dont work for money anymore! I dont work for money! I work for FOOD! :D

[DamnItVideos]

@DunkleMaterie117 what do you do?

[DunkleMaterie117]

@DamnItVideos For Zeitgeistmovement and VenusProject?

- Spread the information, especially " Zeitgeist - Moving Forward "

- Dont work for money. Its possible in Germany. Here are soup-kitchens that provide you with food.

- The soup-kitchens must buy the food as well so help them with naturally seeded and harvested food as well. Like potatoes, tomatos, strawberrys, winegraps and every kind of things.

Even if we are still outnumbered, never give up!

[DamnItVideos]

@DunkleMaterie117 thanks for the info, really appreciate it :)

[Laoch111]

@DamnItVideos The world will be much poorer when Mr Fresco passes away.

Jacque Fresco quote: "I have no notions of a perfect society, I don't know what that means. I know we can do much better than what we've got, I'm no utopian, I'm not a humanist that would like to see everybody living in warmth and harmony: I know that if we don't live that way, we'll kill each other and destroy the Earth."

[DamnItVideos]

@Laoch111 too true mate, too true... :(

[gabrielrs18]

please stop relating venus project and zeitgeist movement to conspiracy theories, those are completely different things

[zeitgeistmonroe]

@gabrielrs18 - I am using certain search engine terms to attract new people to the concepts of TVP & TZM. It is my hope that people will see this as a solution rather than beating a dead horse if they have already lost confidence in the present establishment. I am well informed on what TVP & TZM is and isn't but thanks for your comment nonetheless.

[ProvokedArtists]

@gabrielrs18 They are connected to the farthest extent. If you can not see the connection than you must research what is really happening in the world. This is the answer. Do not state something out of ignorance without seeing both sides.  Knowledge is power, and this is the final destination.

[gabrielrs18]

@ProvokedArtists and it's pretty intelligent to just assume that I dont know both sides and i'm ignorant... TZM and TVP dont recognize politics. Take down the NWO or Illuminatis its not our goal. Never been. Where do you think all this "knowledge" about conspiracies will take you? And I never said that the collapse of the monetary system is a conspiracy theory.

[gabrielrs18]

@ProvokedArtists Peter Joseph himself already asked to the members to dont use his first film to promote the movement, and a lot of members even suggested to change the name of the movement because people usually relates us to these conspiracy lunatics

[ProvokedArtists]

@gabrielrs18 That is what led me to the Venus Project. Conspiracy theories are what opened my mind to an answer. Politics are a part of this system. They are the reason for the creation of the Venus Project. This can not be argued.