The treaty of Tripoli is typically taken out of context. It was simply a dialogue to diffuse a potential conflict with an Islamic state.
Jefferson's enflamatory statements re religion should be taken into context with the revolutionary fervor and anti-Church of England sentiment, but his observations about Christianity being the bloodiest is false.
Canadians have no problem funding Catholic schools, and it works very well, as has been identified by researcher Coleman in 1967.
The separation of church and state only refers to the USA not having a state religion, such as the Church Of England, but has nothing to do with separating religion from government.
Actually the most bloody [faith] that ever existed is Atheism, as communist(dedicated atheist) countries have engaged in more torture and death and conflict than any Christian country ever has.
@bill0756 Atheism is not a faith. Faith is a religious belief, and since atheist don't believe in any religion your statement is invalid. Research the meaning of faith, and you will see that I am not spouting illogical lies such as you. Yes communism is a religion based on the belief in man and worshiping man. It requires atheist thoughts such has not believing in a God, and instead worshiping man, but true Atheism requires believing nothing and worshiping nothing.
To not have faith means to understand everything, and to believe you have perfect perception. As perception changes between individuals, faith is a necessity for anyone.
@bill0756 Research faith. Search every reliable unbiased source. Not Wikipedia. I can tell you right now in the 3 different dictionaries I have that the definition of faith is trust in someone besides yourself. It is also defined as a religious belief. I'm not making crap up in my head.
@bill0756 "the most bloody [faith] that ever existed is Atheism"
Really?
Do you really think an atheist leader could the sole responsible?, in nations with a 95% Christian population, a very powerful and rich church that has control over the minds and will of the people.
Atheism is not comparable to religion, it’s not in competition, it offers nothing, no life philosophy, no values, no dogma.
No one can live atheism as a life philosophy, most atheists where indistinguishable from Christians.
I just recently watched an excellent documentary, " The Hidden Faith of the Founding Fathers", and discovered that the Founding Fathers were all 33rd degree freemasons. They were actually against the true God of the Bible! You will be shocked to discover what the Founding Fathers actually believed in the own words! Please do a search and learn the truth for yourself. Don't follow man...follow the Lord Jesus Christ alone!
As to your point about Illuminati or whatever, I have never subscribed to conspiracy theories. I deal only in fact. Everything I've posted you can research for yourself. If you dispute those points, then by all means prove them wrong. Otherwise, save the opinions for someone else.
As for my people's contributions, I suggest a few things: 1st, read "The Colored Patriots of the American Revolution", which lists some contributions that have been erased from history. 2nd, I suggest you research the biographies of some of our presidents, who kept secret the fact that they had one black parent. You can see clips about them & the 1st president of the U.S. (not Washington) on my channel, who set the precedent for that office. Also research the Warshitaw nation.
My main point, and perhaps the one you're missing the most, is that Progressives, as they are labelled today, consist of the same group of elites that have manipulated this country behind the scenes since it's inception. Research some of the more prominant families and their wealth and you will see what I mean. They simply use the ideology of progressivism to mask their true intentions. As they say, the best slave is the one who willingly enters themselve into bondage.
Many races were enslaved, not just mine. That's why many founders established the 1st anti-slavery groups, such as Franklin and Jefferson. America has forgotten the one thing that should unite us - a lot of our ancestors were brought here against their will. Whether it's race, politics, economic status, where you live, or whatever - Progressives have oppressed others and pitted us against each other. Watch some of the clips on my channel.
The philosophical beginnings of Progressivism began during the Enlightenment when people started to believe that people can actually improve society, that they aren't just subject to the whim of gods or fate. The progressive political movement began in the late 19th century, based on the idea that you can enact social reform through government intervention. I don't think you need to distort their intent to show that it clearly fails in practice (see War on Poverty).
@thegillotine09, that is American Progressivism.. The philosophy is much older than America, and stretches back to the medieval Europe, where the ruler of the kingdom relied upon his regents, nobels, scientific experts, or other members of the court to ascertain what progress meant and what was required, and he ruled accordingly. To claim that the concept of social reform without the aid of god or gods was created by America is a bit arrogant, don't you think?
@thegillotine09, also untrue. America founded religuous freedom, not secularism. Philosophical atheism appeared in Europe and Asia in the 5th and 6th centuries. For example, Buddhism, and Taoism do not center on deity worship. Jainism (which dates back to 3000 BC) introduced the concept that there is no god; that man could in fact become "god" through enlightment and progess - similair to many New Age philosophies followed today. As I said, America is not the origin of these.
Religious freedom IS secularism, or at least the only way to achieve actual religious freedom is through secularism, in that secularism is a belief that religion should not be taken into account in civil matters. Secularism is not atheism. America is the first country to have a secular government.
Prove to me that there is an active conspiracy of "progressives" working behind the scenes to control every aspect of government.
@Nathan54AB, I agree somewhat. Yes, those morals can be gleaned from many sources besides religion, but faith predates philosophy and literature. Everything has grown out of our belief systems. Everything. America was founded by Christians (53 of the 56 founders), the majority of the country was Christian, etc. so we WERE founded as a Christian nation; not on the bible, but on those christian's beliefs. I'll grant you it's grown beyond that if you can respect where it started.
@thegillotine09, not really. Learn how many blacks were involved in our founding (which you no longer learn because of whites, namely white Progressives). While some states clinged to slavery, there were many that didn't. In fact, many states outlawed it. Thousands fought in the revolutionary war, and some of these heroes held elected office at the local level as early as 1796. While it took some forever to see the evil of slavery and racism, there have always been those who could.
@dementeddc Name one black signer of the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence. That's what I mean by a "founder" (I'm sure 56 is the wrong number). The point is that the demographics of the founders is not important, what's important is their ideas, which they expound upon in their writings (and clearly say they want a secular government).
Your definition of Progressivism is off. I'm not a fan of progressivism, especially modern progressivism, but you should at least get it right.
Progressivism and Liberalism is not the same thing. Progressivism is a relic of old Europe, where kings and queens, lords and ladies ruled over everyone else. Whether it's politicians or corporations, the concept that rich elites should control all our lives continues today. These people never wanted to break away from England, have distorted history, and have tried to bring this country down for hundreds of years. They would ensalve us all, regardless of race, and in fact have.
Was it founded on Christianity? Yes and no. America was founded on morals. Principles of right and wrong. The majority at the time were people of faith, so the foundations they laid were largely based on religious teachings. They included morality garnered from atheism, deism, paganism, and other religions, but the major influence WAS christian. Every republic in history has failed due to a lack of morality. Our founders wanted to avoid that by making spirituality our foundation.
@dementeddc The founding fathers based American principles on concepts that happen to coincide with some concepts in the Bible. That does not mean this is a largely Christian-founded nation. You can examine American principles that are said to be Christian and link them with any religion, school of thought, or culture. Christianity does NOT own morals. It does not own principles of right and wrong. These are HUMAN concepts, not religious concepts.
@Nathan54AB, read again what I posted. The founders, as well as majority of people living here at the time were christians, and the framework they laid came from the beliefs they held AS CHRISTIANS. No amount of pandering will change that fact. You may argue those beliefs are more diversified today, but the founders had a singular vision in mind: a republic founded on the moral values they understood at the time (11 different denominations, all of which were CHRISTIAN).
@ContrarySkeptic, Peter Salem fought at Bunker Hill, Prince Estrabrook at Lexington, Prince Whipple crossed the Deleware with Washington, James Armistead was a double agent who spied on the British and fed them false information, Wentworh Cheswell rode in the opposite direction of Paul Revere. Benjamin Banneker, Frederick Douglass, Lemuel Haynes, and hundreds more contributed to this republic. To claim blacks played no part in America's founding is false.
yah, a lot of founding the founding fathers were athiests. but for the most part it is a strong Christian nation. for all though a few powerful men where athiests its the people who built the land from the ground up and fought for freedom who made this country. whether it be the puritans who set the bases of colonial society or the Irish catholic, italian catholic, German protestants who built the skyscrapers. or the baptist african americans who led movements for freedom.
@paulinotou Do you know who most of the people you're talking about are? They're mostly men. Are we a male nation? Most of the people who built the nation were white too. Are we a white nation? No. It doesn't matter who founded the nation or built it- we're a nation, and a nation can't have a religion, a race, or an opinion.
Also to the idiots who keep claiming that Jesus or the founders were Liberals, what the hell are you smoking? They were Libertarians, if anything. Liberals like to make claims about Jesus this, Jesus that. Really, did he not say "if a man shall not work, he shall not eat?" How the hell does that fit into your BS? I suggest you learn what each stands for because you obviously have no clue and sound absurd.
Evangelicals (aka Neo-Cons) joined with conservatives to elect Reagan, but most returned their support to the Democrats after Clinton. If you took the time to research anything about them you'd disover they're very much liberal and left-wing. Take a look at those against Gays, etc. and see how they're registered. Your assertions are false. You probably don't want to hear that, but too bad - that's the way it is.
Got to love the disinformation here. No, America is not a strictly christian nation, however it was most certainly founded on spirituality. 52 of the 55 founders were active members of their churches, which at the time spanned 8 different denominations. Second, this BS about conservatives being religious nutjobs is complete fabrication. Ronald Regan was the only conservative EVER to be president. That term has become so bastardized these days...
Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson....In no instance have . . . the churches been guardians of the liberties of the people." - James Madison....The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity." - John Adams...Lighthouses are more helpful than churches." - Benjamin Franklin
@carnifex714 Why can't you just read the writings in their entirety? To people who have actually read them you look like a complete moron.
You took every one of these quotes out of context. Just read the history for yourself. The American founders were hardcore fundamentalist Christians. Even the ones who questioned the divinity of Jesus still recognized the Jewish Torah as divine scripture.
Why are you going to make me put these quotes in context for you? You're supposed to go look up the rest of the statements surrounding this sentence and you'll notice they aren't as militant as you're making them out to be.
You can't use the American founders words to support the atheist jihad. If we were to give any name to their belief, it would be pantheistic.
To understand what they were thinking you have to understand the point in history. They came out of the protestant reformation.
It's EASILY PROVEN that America is not, and never was, a "Christian nation". Simply click on my name and take 10 minutes to watch my 'Is America a Christian Nation' video.
If you believe you can refute it, please make the attempt.
First let me say I am not saying you video is horrible or anything, though I dissagree with most of it and can defend my beliefs in this area, I just want to point out the missuse of the Bible verses you use. They are taken out of context which changes their meaning. They do not stand against freedom, but rather uphold it. People are most free when governed by a set of laws, or government. Anarchy results in freedom for very few. Basically these verses condem Anarchy. Not freedom.
Instead of using the words as a label, @LoveHisTruth, why doh't you try PRACTICING love of his truth.
As a preacher for the past 45 years, I recognize the scripture used is not "taken out of context" at all. In fact Paul's Letter to the Romans ch. 13 is WORSE when you read the WHOLE context. Google "PaulvsALL" (one word) to see why conservatives love Paul's teaching so much more than the liberal teaching and example of Jesus!
@Rayosun4 Thank you for correcting me sir! I am doing my very best to truely "love His truth" and I hate hypocrisy. The first verse i looked up he used really did (I believe) apply to anarchy. As only a 16 year old girl i realize that my Biblical interpretation is not at its finest. At the moment I am studying God's word and Law. I apoligise if any of my comments were not in the right, I'm doing my best to live by His Word.
"Can the liberties of a nation be sure when we remove their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people, that these liberties are a gift from God?"
You want to know how to tell whether or not we're a Christian nation? Actually read some original documents. Try it. Jefferson and Adams said in their letters to each other that they used the Book of Deuteronomy in the Constitution. And what about the Pilgrims? To deny their own words is to be in denial.
@GodsWildfire You might be right about the Constitution and Deuteronomy, I'm not sure if that's true or not. But don't delude yourself into thinking Jefferson was Christian in the theological sense, because he wasn't. He admittedly loved Jesus' teachings but rejected all of the theology of the virgin birth, miracles and the Resurrection. He even went so far as to cut those references out of his own bible.
@GodsWildfire Well, it's true that Jefferson and Franklin were both still believers in God, just not in the traditional Christian sense. Ditto for Thomas Paine. They were pretty much Deist in their outlook. They believed in the God of Nature, a Supreme Being that set the universe into motion and then let it do it's thing. They were still spiritual men no doubt, but disliked the trappings of organized religion.
@beerbrain420 -- Very true. But they still believed in Biblical principles for this country. And there were many who did actually have a relationship with Christ, including George Washington, Samuel Adams, Benjamin Rush, and George Whitfield.
@GodsWildfire No dispute with you there. I think the Founders really wanted to strike a balance where religion was concerned. As products of a predominantly Christian society, naturally some of their ideas would come from Christian principles, and I agree there's nothing wrong with that. But at the same time, they also wanted to insure that religion did not dominate government either. Allowing total religious freedom without actually endorsing religion, they ensured the best for everyone.
@beerbrain420 -- Well, they wanted everyone to have the right to practice their own religion. But they did not mind praying during the Continental Congress meetings, or prevent something like the Ten Commandments from being put up. We've begin to worry way too much about people disagreeing that we've watered down out country.
@GodsWildfire I'm by no means a hard-line secularist. General references to a Creator like "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance or "In God We Trust" on a coin don't bother me, because anyone can envision "God" in their own way. The Ten Commandments is a bit trickier since it's a direct reference to someone's religion. On a courthouse wall I don't think it's a big deal, but teaching it to kids in public schools might be. It's all a matter of degree, as to where you cross that fine line.
@beerbrain420 -- But some of the Founders did directly reference both the Bible and Christ as important in this country. I do agree fully that nothing should be forced, but I think it is just as big a problem to say that these things are not allowed. The exception to this is when faith becomes dangerous, such as Muslim extremism. That should not be allowed.
@GodsWildfire Oh sure, many of the Founders did openly support religious faith in society, no doubt. I agree they didn't want to stamp out any trace of religion in public society as some might want to see. But they want to make sure that at the same time, government did not become an arm of a religious institution itself. The First Amendment was put there to keep us from going down the same road as the UK and the Church of England being a state-sponsored religion there.
@beerbrain420 -- True that. I think the First was meant to keep the government from enforcing one faith. But I just don't think posting the Ten Commandments is doing that. They're principles that are not bad to live by, no matter what faith one is. I mean, to not murder, steal, etc. should still be taught.
@GodsWildfire For me, merely posting the Ten Commandments somewhere publically like, say, in a courthouse, I think is pretty innocuous (although some of my skeptic friends might disagree with me). In a public school, I would just teach general values that are embodied in the Ten Commandments. Although, I think it would be a problem with teaching "keep the Lord's day holy" in a public school because that is a specific religious instruction better left for the home or church.
As a clergyman who is a Liberal Like Jesus, I resent conservative Christians' efforts fo use the governemnt to promote their religion. They are such failures at persuading people with their preaching that they want government to FORCE their views on the rest of us. If they don't like living in a non-sectarian secular country, why don't they just leave our government alone and move to a Catholic or Protestant country? Actually many of THOSE countries are trying to free themselves, too!
You are so funny,, @GodsWildfire ! You say " when faith becomes dangerous, such as Muslim extremism. That should not be allowed." While you object to being the victim of "Muslim extremism", you see no problem imposing your conservative "Christian extremism" on OTHERS ! LOL LOL LOL
I want someone who believes in the mantra that "we are a Christian Nation" to tell me what this means. In other words--let's suppose we are, and let's suppose the argument is over. What's supposed to happen at that point? What do you see as flowing from that notion? Are Christian churches supposed to be favored? Given tax money? Only Christians can hold office or vote? Legislation must pass Biblical scrutiny? What is supposed to happen as a result of us being a "Christian Nation"?
US liberty is grated first by a creator at birth and only recognized and upheld by the US constitution as a birth-right as such. Why, because if mere men or documents alone granted you liberty only a mere man or document can take it away! This is the distinction from American Liberty & why all men are created equal, evolution surly does not teach this but Christianity does. The basic notion of American liberty & freedom for all is by a God-given birth-right & a non-secular view historically.
@WILLTHEWGMAN Their is nothing in the bible that says all men are created equal. The bible supports slavery, genocide, homocide, infanticide, inscest, etc. Are those the values america are founded on? The killing of a group of people, the killing of babies? NO!!!!!
@PatrioticEagle50 First of all, unless one understands the contex of the events beyond just the literal events you speak of, (like slavery) one will always come to the conclusion the bible is for evil. For example, ever read what kind of slavery God allowed Israel back then, and more importantly, how after seven years, the slaves were to be set free...given plenty of supllies and goods they worked to give you their former master so they can get started on life independently? Nope, you haven't
@PatrioticEagle50 Compare that to the slavery America practiced (and still does through it's trade deals of outsourcing our jobs in globalization in faraway lands)
@Zryuken Videos which require you to read can be quite annoying because at times you cant keep up with the pace they are set.. and pausing the video and rewinding it is a bother..
what a load of rubbish,it started out exposing people worshipping false gods,then turned 360 to attack Christ.i gather this guys plays a lot of chess very black and white and bats for both sides.
I know of noone who is forcing anyone to go to Church. If you don't like Church on TV, turn the channel! How often I hear that because of other garbage we find on TV. However, if you are at McDonalds and I happen to be there, I will still pray over my food along with my family. As long as I don't force you to join with me, I ask you to get over it if that offends you. I have the right to give thanks, you have the right not to.
Look at the Washington monument. He is in the same pose as Baphomet. Which means above or God is the same as below Lucifer. Ill put them on my page in case you would like to compare them.
Whoever created this video is an idiot. The Washington Monument was bulit in dedication to George Washington, hence why it's called the "Washington Monument." It should be noted Jefferson did not have a pastoral degree (unlike most of the founders) so his ramblings here dont amount to anything. The South side of the Supreme Court building depics law givers before Jesus. The North side has all Christians, except Mohamed. That's not Mars in the front and the Treaty is not a founding document.
@MrTrilliondollarman "Ramblings"??? The "ramblings"??? of Thomas Jefferson??? Who is the idiot here? Jefferson practically wrote the words founding our country by himself. The man didn't "ramble". Go get an education ( not from some unacredited christian college) and get your head out of your ass.
No. They are ramblings....plain and simple, and not accurate ones. Jefferson didnt write things "practically" by himself. Not even close to true. The Constitution was written by James Madison, not Jefferson. In addition, each of the Founders completely agreed with the philosopher William Blackstone, who said our rights come from God, not the government.
So who's the idiot with their head up their ass? that would be you.
@MrTrilliondollarman You're quite right about Madison, thank you. Now to adress his opinions. "The civil government ... functions with complete success ... by the total separation of the Church from the State." - James Madison. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprize, every expanded prospect." - James Madison. Care to continue?
We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. Weve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacityto sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God. -James Madison
@MrTrilliondollarman Thank you for saving me the space as this is the next quote I was going to use. Clearly Madison said it because he felt the people to be governed by a non-religious government would need a moral and ethical stance themselves. There is no other explanation.
Actually, there are plenty of other explanations. While we could debate on whether or not Madison wanted say every last US president to be Christian, there is no doubt that he thought the moral and ethical stances of the people would come from religion. Guess what was the prodomiant religion at that time?
@MrTrilliondollarman Of course he thought that "the moral and ethical stances of the people would come from religion" ... It's doubtful that in his time he knew of any other clear source for such a stance. What the "predominant" (sp?) religion was at the time is completely irrelevant. There clearly are and were other sources for a "moral and ethical stance".
And by the way, Madison clearly says "sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments." Last I checked no other faith has rules called the Ten Commandments except Judaism and Christianity.
@MrTrilliondollarman "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..." I really think that's pretty clear, don't you?
"...we have all been encouraged to feel in the guardianship and guidance of that Almighty Being whose power regulates the destiny of nations, whose blessings have been so conspicuously dispensed to this rising Republic, and to whom we are bound to address our devout gratitude for the past, as well as our fervent supplications and best hopes for the future." -James Madison
@MrTrilliondollarman Actually, among others, I went to a very conservative christian school. I needed you to bring up Madison to make my point. Thanks again. BTW, the statue referred to is actually called "war" and was documentably based by Persico, it's creator on the god Mars. Try again.
And what point would that be, that you dont know what the hell you're talking about? Since that's the case, mission accomplished: you have now officially come off as a moron.
Also, I have contacted the curators of that building and they say there is no statue named war or Mars. Care to lose again?
@MrTrilliondollarman Contacted the curators of the capitol rotunda have we? You sir are a liar and a fraud. The titles of the two sculpture are well known, they are "War" and "Peace". Stop wasting my time with nonsense.
ummm....no. I did contact them and while there were two statues by those names at one point, they're not there now. And even if they were still there, does that really take anything away from the notion of America being founded on Christian principles? No. No, it doesnt. Next, you're going to tell me there is no Bible quote on the Liberty Bell.
@MrTrilliondollarman To paraphrase someone I heard "ramble" recently, the liberty bell isn't a founding document. Go waste someone else's time. I'm tired of watching you refute your own arguments.
More like you cant stand that i'm refuting yours. and btw, the liberty bell comment was sarcasm. So not only are you so damn stupid you dont know what you're talking about, you also cant recognize sarcasm.
@MrTrilliondollarman "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" ... Refute that, dipshit.
@MrTrilliondollarman It most certainly does not "shoot down" what I say. It supports it. If the founders had intended to create a "christian nation", they would simply have done so rather than put in place safeguards assuring that the nation's laws were not religious in nature. The states etc. could in theory establish religion except for the supremacy clause, under which the bill of rights would prevail.
Actually it does. The laws of the land in the Constitution had great religious influence. The Founders didnt say America was a Christian nation because Christianity was so prevailent it didnt need to be said. Actually, the Supremacy Clause has never been applied to religious matters.
@MrTrilliondollarman Did you even read the supremacy clause before spouting nonsense? Obviously not. The supremacy clause applies to religious matters directly in it's text. As I've said before, you're a waste of time and now you've proven it.
Obviously I did or I wouldnt have posted what I did. The surpremacy clause doesnt touch on religious matters at all. Like I HAVE said, you're a total moron who doesnt understand much of anything.
@MrTrilliondollarman Although not technically a "founding document" the forteenth amendment would also apply. The individual, (you) are free to practice religion as you wish as long as it doesn't interfere with my right not to. Oh, some advice? Don't try sarcasm again, you suck at it.
@MrTrilliondollarman It also defines citizenship as it applies to the rights of a citizen - "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States" - section1. This would include ... TA DA! religious freedoms as recognized under the first amendment. Not much logic required just read the damned thing.
@MrTrilliondollarman You're right, it's clause three. Unfortunately for you it's still there. "no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."
A for effort but F- minus for interpretation, especially considering elected office holders swear on the Bible to uphold the Constitution--which would make no sense if we elected people who didnt believe in the Bible. Also, the people can informally require that potential officials be Christian, an area clause three cant touch.
@MrTrilliondollarman Officeholders are not required to use the bible in fact Theodore Roosevelt did not and Franklin Pierce affirmed rather than swore. The people cannot require that officials be any such thing because politicians lie almost as often as christians.
More like politicians lie and mislead as often as atheists.....not only can the people require it, they can even flat out demand it. You cant tell them otherwise without infringing on their First Amendment rights.
Grow some brains. If people want to get elected, they have to tout what appeals to the public. Guess what? Believing in God appeals to people; being an atheist does not. Simple as that.
@MrTrilliondollarman Let's quit with the ad-hominem attacks and adress the facts. Just because a politician represents himself as christian doesn't mean he is. Do you really think our current president or Bill Clinton for that matter, are christians?
So you want me to overlook the fact you implied I made no sense? Not going to happen. The point of the matter is the public want their leaders to be religious and as long as they demand that, you have no right to tell them otherwise without stepping on their 1st amendment rights.
@MrTrilliondollarman You want it that way? fine, asshole. Try answering my question. Do you really think All three of our most recent presidents were actually christians or did two of them lie about it to get elected? If they did then your informal test is worth dick. If you think they didn't you're a moron.
Look, moron, none of them lied to get elected. Although one of them had a minister that said questionable things about America, that doesnt change the fact each of the last three belonged to a Christian church of some sort. Either you're too lazy to look stuff up or you get a kick out of being proved wrong.
@MrTrilliondollarman I didn't say they didn't belong to a church, I said they weren't christians and no self respecting christian would claim them as philosophical brethren. Let's get down to reality here. You have no good evidence that this is or was intended to be a "christian nation" and there is plenty of evidence to the contrary, the first amendment being just the most obvious of such evidence. You keep saying you'ved proved me wong when you've done nothing of the kind. Get a brain.
Wrong on everything yet again. The fact is you cant face the reality that anyone who tries to run for office and makes it known they are an atheist will NOT win. Period. You have nothing to show that America was founded on anything other than Christianity, the 1st amendment proves nothing, I have proved you wrong and so will any other informed person.
@MrTrilliondollarman "You have nothing to show that America was founded on anything other than Christianity" I have the first amendment, the basis of the constiution in english common law (not christian btw), and I've cited many other facts. You, like many christians will deny the sunrise if it suits your purposes. Question - What hypothetical evidence would you accept as proof of my hypothesis? I dare you to name it.
First amendment only shows what faiths are allowed, not what the nation was founded on. Constitution was based on Biblical principles and so was English Common law, and you have cited no other facts. You, like many other atheist twits, ignore too much history. I would accept nothing from an arrogant, know-nothing prick like you. If anything, you should and must accept the findings of the book Original Intent. Read it.
@MrTrilliondollarman English common law existed for two hundred years before christianity arrived in England so it can't be based on the bible. You're the one ignoring history, look it up. You've just said all I need to know - " I would accept nothing from an arrogant, know-nothing prick like you." Like all religious zealots, your mind is closed and you just proved it.
@MrTrilliondollarman Wrong, the Magna Carta ended the period of common law rather than began it. There is a clear period of two hundred years where the common law existed and christianity was no part of it. In "Church & State" 7/8/96 Barton admitted that some 12 different quotes he had claimed were "spurious" (which means he made them up) including the Madison quote you used earlier. look it up. The man is a liar and you're insane.
@MrTrilliondollarman BTW, David Barton, the author of "Original Intent" is a self confessed liar who had to publically admit that one of his books was fraud. Why should I believe anything the man says?
@MrTrilliondollarman Interesting isn't it, that the Madison quote you relied on so heavily has now proven to be a fabrication of the author you esteem so highly. You really need to re-examine the company you keep. Belief in god is delusion, plain and simple. That's OK though, lying in defense of god and other delusions has a long and venerable tradition. Keep it up, it just makes the advocacy of reason and atheism easier.
HAAHAHAHAAA!!!! Stupid little boy....no mental professional agrees with you and why should they? Such a notion goes against science, the very science you know little about.
Keep braying like an inane jackass all you want: all the more to disprove and shoot down.
and btw, your notion about the Constitution couldnt be more wrong. the 1st amendment does NOT show America isnt Christian. It only says Congress cannot make a law, but the people and the states can, via the 9th and 10th amendments respectively. Combine that with the fact the Constitution uses the phrase "in the year of our Lord" and no one objected to this phrase.....
And only one faith uses that phrase, all these put together show America is a Christian nation, was founded as a Christian nation, and you ARE WRONG!!!
@MrTrilliondollarman "only one faith uses that phrase" Nearly the whole civilized world used that phrase until the phrase "common era", C. E. became more frequently used. You're an idiot clinging to straws. Your major source has been discredited, your quotes are fakes, your history can be proven incorrect and yet you cling to your conclusions regardless. This is called delusion and I'm done. I've proven my point about you. Have a nice life.
Nope. Jewish nations didnt use it. Islamic nations dont use it. Atheist nations sure as hell dont use it. Only Christian nations use it. You're a braying dumbass who wont shut the hell up. Nothing you say makes any sense, you have been repeatedly discredited, the quotes are airtight, and my history is dead on accurate.
Though you are right on one thing: You are done. Go peddle your bullshit to someone dumb enough to believe you
The photos of the Christ in the Bible are not the real Christ Emmanuel either. I have learned not to like any religion for its slavery like attitudes from leaders.
Read the book of Revelation and the 7 spirits of God. statue of the Christ is in New Orleans Louisiana :O) lol...if you must know,islamic religion provoked the crusades.. all Christians cannot be classified as either hypocrites or fools alone. I have met some that are so much like the Christ. I dont disagree with the enslavement religion teach. Many stories in the Bible have been science proven. does not condemn our forefathers either. Romans 13:1 leads to Gal. 1:10 Foundation not christ like
The problem is that there are people who will denigh the right to practice Faith in America. I believe in the freedom of Religion, not the freedom from Religion. Just because I walk into a Federal building doesn't mean I desrobe my Faith! Not at all!
@DefenderCatholic I have no problem with your right to practice your faith as long as it doesn't interfere with my right NOT to. Would you deny me that right and my right to raise my children free from indoctrination by "your" faith?
So what kind of nation was it before our native american indians were here ? Keep reading ancient history.....and looking at science, archaelogical digs, etc...Russia used to be attached.
Gethaseme cannot spell it properly thought it was named after the garden of GETHESAME (sp?) The garden the christ prayed in all night that he sweat the blood in. Don't recall the author. refresh the page and it will tell you who wrote it and give you the proper spelling.
How is the U.S. close to being a Christian nation? If Christianity was so important, why wasn't it mentioned in the Constitution? I don't know if you've read the most important American document, but, it does say,"no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States." In addition, the first amendment says, "Congress shall make no law RESPECTING AN ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION." The cap words are very important, in my opinion anyway.
The founders of America didn't put either of those in the Constitution.They can swear on a toilet seat if they so chose. It the oath that matters. And the whole "In God we Trust" started shortly after the Constitution was ratified by some religious person, and put on coins in the late 1800s.(If memory serves correctly) So, how is the U.S. close to being a Christian nation? Every bias law that Christians pushed for came after the fact.
Most people are Christians. Here in America people like to call themselves Christians when they really aren't, but why? For social reasons. (And political reasons, for people like Obama).
If Americans lie about their faith for socio-political reasons, how can most ppl be Christians? Assuming you meant Americans with the ,"most ppl are Christians." And if you did, America is not a Christian nation. Why shouldn't America be a neutral nation, having laws and policies that aren't prejudice, bias, discriminative, or invasive of personal choice?
According to the Holy Bible, we are not to celebrate his supposed birthday. Christmas is man made tradition, pagan, etc....no religious nor religion should run a nation. THe possibilities of abusing that religion are to great.
I am going to have freedom from religion. Thumbs up if you're going to have freedom from religion with me.
beesleeper 4 months ago 2
@Justaguy1010
The treaty of Tripoli is typically taken out of context. It was simply a dialogue to diffuse a potential conflict with an Islamic state.
Jefferson's enflamatory statements re religion should be taken into context with the revolutionary fervor and anti-Church of England sentiment, but his observations about Christianity being the bloodiest is false.
Canadians have no problem funding Catholic schools, and it works very well, as has been identified by researcher Coleman in 1967.
bill0756 6 months ago
The separation of church and state only refers to the USA not having a state religion, such as the Church Of England, but has nothing to do with separating religion from government.
bill0756 6 months ago
Actually the most bloody [faith] that ever existed is Atheism, as communist(dedicated atheist) countries have engaged in more torture and death and conflict than any Christian country ever has.
bill0756 6 months ago
@bill0756 Atheism is not a faith. Faith is a religious belief, and since atheist don't believe in any religion your statement is invalid. Research the meaning of faith, and you will see that I am not spouting illogical lies such as you. Yes communism is a religion based on the belief in man and worshiping man. It requires atheist thoughts such has not believing in a God, and instead worshiping man, but true Atheism requires believing nothing and worshiping nothing.
sesshoin1 6 months ago
@sesshoin1
To not have faith means to understand everything, and to believe you have perfect perception. As perception changes between individuals, faith is a necessity for anyone.
bill0756 6 months ago
@bill0756 Research faith. Search every reliable unbiased source. Not Wikipedia. I can tell you right now in the 3 different dictionaries I have that the definition of faith is trust in someone besides yourself. It is also defined as a religious belief. I'm not making crap up in my head.
sesshoin1 6 months ago
@bill0756 "the most bloody [faith] that ever existed is Atheism"
Really?
Do you really think an atheist leader could the sole responsible?, in nations with a 95% Christian population, a very powerful and rich church that has control over the minds and will of the people.
Atheism is not comparable to religion, it’s not in competition, it offers nothing, no life philosophy, no values, no dogma.
No one can live atheism as a life philosophy, most atheists where indistinguishable from Christians.
saintpine 4 months ago
I just recently watched an excellent documentary, " The Hidden Faith of the Founding Fathers", and discovered that the Founding Fathers were all 33rd degree freemasons. They were actually against the true God of the Bible! You will be shocked to discover what the Founding Fathers actually believed in the own words! Please do a search and learn the truth for yourself. Don't follow man...follow the Lord Jesus Christ alone!
shiphrahhopeful 6 months ago
founding fathers were deist which means they believed god made the earth and humanity then stepped back to let humans deal with humans
soap1st 7 months ago
As to your point about Illuminati or whatever, I have never subscribed to conspiracy theories. I deal only in fact. Everything I've posted you can research for yourself. If you dispute those points, then by all means prove them wrong. Otherwise, save the opinions for someone else.
dementeddc 7 months ago
As for my people's contributions, I suggest a few things: 1st, read "The Colored Patriots of the American Revolution", which lists some contributions that have been erased from history. 2nd, I suggest you research the biographies of some of our presidents, who kept secret the fact that they had one black parent. You can see clips about them & the 1st president of the U.S. (not Washington) on my channel, who set the precedent for that office. Also research the Warshitaw nation.
dementeddc 7 months ago
My main point, and perhaps the one you're missing the most, is that Progressives, as they are labelled today, consist of the same group of elites that have manipulated this country behind the scenes since it's inception. Research some of the more prominant families and their wealth and you will see what I mean. They simply use the ideology of progressivism to mask their true intentions. As they say, the best slave is the one who willingly enters themselve into bondage.
dementeddc 7 months ago
Many races were enslaved, not just mine. That's why many founders established the 1st anti-slavery groups, such as Franklin and Jefferson. America has forgotten the one thing that should unite us - a lot of our ancestors were brought here against their will. Whether it's race, politics, economic status, where you live, or whatever - Progressives have oppressed others and pitted us against each other. Watch some of the clips on my channel.
dementeddc 7 months ago
@dementeddc
The philosophical beginnings of Progressivism began during the Enlightenment when people started to believe that people can actually improve society, that they aren't just subject to the whim of gods or fate. The progressive political movement began in the late 19th century, based on the idea that you can enact social reform through government intervention. I don't think you need to distort their intent to show that it clearly fails in practice (see War on Poverty).
thegillotine09 7 months ago
@thegillotine09, that is American Progressivism.. The philosophy is much older than America, and stretches back to the medieval Europe, where the ruler of the kingdom relied upon his regents, nobels, scientific experts, or other members of the court to ascertain what progress meant and what was required, and he ruled accordingly. To claim that the concept of social reform without the aid of god or gods was created by America is a bit arrogant, don't you think?
dementeddc 7 months ago
@dementeddc
Actually I don't think it's a stretch at all considering America is founder of secularism.
You're starting to sound a lot like an Illuminati conspiracy theorist.
thegillotine09 7 months ago
@thegillotine09, also untrue. America founded religuous freedom, not secularism. Philosophical atheism appeared in Europe and Asia in the 5th and 6th centuries. For example, Buddhism, and Taoism do not center on deity worship. Jainism (which dates back to 3000 BC) introduced the concept that there is no god; that man could in fact become "god" through enlightment and progess - similair to many New Age philosophies followed today. As I said, America is not the origin of these.
dementeddc 7 months ago
@dementeddc
Religious freedom IS secularism, or at least the only way to achieve actual religious freedom is through secularism, in that secularism is a belief that religion should not be taken into account in civil matters. Secularism is not atheism. America is the first country to have a secular government.
Prove to me that there is an active conspiracy of "progressives" working behind the scenes to control every aspect of government.
thegillotine09 7 months ago
So we love and include others....That's what being Christian means. Love thy neighbor as thyself!!!!!
allinthethinking 8 months ago
TOTAL SHIT!!!! GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR COUNTRY MUSLIMS GO BACK TO MECCA!!!
mpmcelroy 8 months ago
@Nathan54AB, I agree somewhat. Yes, those morals can be gleaned from many sources besides religion, but faith predates philosophy and literature. Everything has grown out of our belief systems. Everything. America was founded by Christians (53 of the 56 founders), the majority of the country was Christian, etc. so we WERE founded as a Christian nation; not on the bible, but on those christian's beliefs. I'll grant you it's grown beyond that if you can respect where it started.
dementeddc 8 months ago
@dementeddc
56 of the 56 founders were white men. Would you say that America is a white, male nation since beliefs are influenced by culture and gender?
Philosophy predates Christianity ;)
thegillotine09 7 months ago
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dementeddc 7 months ago
@thegillotine09, not really. Learn how many blacks were involved in our founding (which you no longer learn because of whites, namely white Progressives). While some states clinged to slavery, there were many that didn't. In fact, many states outlawed it. Thousands fought in the revolutionary war, and some of these heroes held elected office at the local level as early as 1796. While it took some forever to see the evil of slavery and racism, there have always been those who could.
dementeddc 7 months ago
@dementeddc Name one black signer of the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence. That's what I mean by a "founder" (I'm sure 56 is the wrong number). The point is that the demographics of the founders is not important, what's important is their ideas, which they expound upon in their writings (and clearly say they want a secular government).
Your definition of Progressivism is off. I'm not a fan of progressivism, especially modern progressivism, but you should at least get it right.
thegillotine09 7 months ago
Progressivism and Liberalism is not the same thing. Progressivism is a relic of old Europe, where kings and queens, lords and ladies ruled over everyone else. Whether it's politicians or corporations, the concept that rich elites should control all our lives continues today. These people never wanted to break away from England, have distorted history, and have tried to bring this country down for hundreds of years. They would ensalve us all, regardless of race, and in fact have.
dementeddc 7 months ago
Was it founded on Christianity? Yes and no. America was founded on morals. Principles of right and wrong. The majority at the time were people of faith, so the foundations they laid were largely based on religious teachings. They included morality garnered from atheism, deism, paganism, and other religions, but the major influence WAS christian. Every republic in history has failed due to a lack of morality. Our founders wanted to avoid that by making spirituality our foundation.
dementeddc 9 months ago
@dementeddc The founding fathers based American principles on concepts that happen to coincide with some concepts in the Bible. That does not mean this is a largely Christian-founded nation. You can examine American principles that are said to be Christian and link them with any religion, school of thought, or culture. Christianity does NOT own morals. It does not own principles of right and wrong. These are HUMAN concepts, not religious concepts.
Nathan54AB 8 months ago
@Nathan54AB, read again what I posted. The founders, as well as majority of people living here at the time were christians, and the framework they laid came from the beliefs they held AS CHRISTIANS. No amount of pandering will change that fact. You may argue those beliefs are more diversified today, but the founders had a singular vision in mind: a republic founded on the moral values they understood at the time (11 different denominations, all of which were CHRISTIAN).
dementeddc 8 months ago
@ContrarySkeptic, Peter Salem fought at Bunker Hill, Prince Estrabrook at Lexington, Prince Whipple crossed the Deleware with Washington, James Armistead was a double agent who spied on the British and fed them false information, Wentworh Cheswell rode in the opposite direction of Paul Revere. Benjamin Banneker, Frederick Douglass, Lemuel Haynes, and hundreds more contributed to this republic. To claim blacks played no part in America's founding is false.
dementeddc 9 months ago 2
yah, a lot of founding the founding fathers were athiests. but for the most part it is a strong Christian nation. for all though a few powerful men where athiests its the people who built the land from the ground up and fought for freedom who made this country. whether it be the puritans who set the bases of colonial society or the Irish catholic, italian catholic, German protestants who built the skyscrapers. or the baptist african americans who led movements for freedom.
paulinotou 9 months ago
@paulinotou Do you know who most of the people you're talking about are? They're mostly men. Are we a male nation? Most of the people who built the nation were white too. Are we a white nation? No. It doesn't matter who founded the nation or built it- we're a nation, and a nation can't have a religion, a race, or an opinion.
ContrarySkeptic 9 months ago
Also to the idiots who keep claiming that Jesus or the founders were Liberals, what the hell are you smoking? They were Libertarians, if anything. Liberals like to make claims about Jesus this, Jesus that. Really, did he not say "if a man shall not work, he shall not eat?" How the hell does that fit into your BS? I suggest you learn what each stands for because you obviously have no clue and sound absurd.
dementeddc 10 months ago
@dementeddc You're right- Jesus couldn't be a liberal because liberals don't stand for genocide XD
ContrarySkeptic 9 months ago
Evangelicals (aka Neo-Cons) joined with conservatives to elect Reagan, but most returned their support to the Democrats after Clinton. If you took the time to research anything about them you'd disover they're very much liberal and left-wing. Take a look at those against Gays, etc. and see how they're registered. Your assertions are false. You probably don't want to hear that, but too bad - that's the way it is.
dementeddc 10 months ago
Got to love the disinformation here. No, America is not a strictly christian nation, however it was most certainly founded on spirituality. 52 of the 55 founders were active members of their churches, which at the time spanned 8 different denominations. Second, this BS about conservatives being religious nutjobs is complete fabrication. Ronald Regan was the only conservative EVER to be president. That term has become so bastardized these days...
dementeddc 10 months ago
@dementeddc 55 out of 55 founders were white males, too.
ContrarySkeptic 9 months ago
Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson....In no instance have . . . the churches been guardians of the liberties of the people." - James Madison....The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity." - John Adams...Lighthouses are more helpful than churches." - Benjamin Franklin
carnifex714 10 months ago
@carnifex714 Why can't you just read the writings in their entirety? To people who have actually read them you look like a complete moron.
You took every one of these quotes out of context. Just read the history for yourself. The American founders were hardcore fundamentalist Christians. Even the ones who questioned the divinity of Jesus still recognized the Jewish Torah as divine scripture.
Stop spreading lies. We're all not so ignorant.
knowwaie 10 months ago
@knowwaie Ummm... so how exactly were they out of context?
ContrarySkeptic 9 months ago
@ContrarySkeptic Not everyone is as unsophisticated. Can your entire philosophy and workings of your brain be summed up in one sentence?
Oh that's right, you seem to think every generation before yours was primitive. No one is as smart as you, i'm sure.
knowwaie 9 months ago
@knowwaie No, but if I say I like the color blue then why would you think contradictory of me?
Way to go completely off topic and start generalizing people. Fuck off if you can't answer the question.
ContrarySkeptic 9 months ago
Why are you going to make me put these quotes in context for you? You're supposed to go look up the rest of the statements surrounding this sentence and you'll notice they aren't as militant as you're making them out to be.
You can't use the American founders words to support the atheist jihad. If we were to give any name to their belief, it would be pantheistic.
To understand what they were thinking you have to understand the point in history. They came out of the protestant reformation.
knowwaie 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
It's EASILY PROVEN that America is not, and never was, a "Christian nation". Simply click on my name and take 10 minutes to watch my 'Is America a Christian Nation' video.
If you believe you can refute it, please make the attempt.
sgapplebee 11 months ago
United state of america
United religion of america
United race of america
United opinion of america
Etc...
killerboyfoolz 11 months ago
First let me say I am not saying you video is horrible or anything, though I dissagree with most of it and can defend my beliefs in this area, I just want to point out the missuse of the Bible verses you use. They are taken out of context which changes their meaning. They do not stand against freedom, but rather uphold it. People are most free when governed by a set of laws, or government. Anarchy results in freedom for very few. Basically these verses condem Anarchy. Not freedom.
LoveHisTruth 1 year ago
Instead of using the words as a label, @LoveHisTruth, why doh't you try PRACTICING love of his truth.
As a preacher for the past 45 years, I recognize the scripture used is not "taken out of context" at all. In fact Paul's Letter to the Romans ch. 13 is WORSE when you read the WHOLE context. Google "PaulvsALL" (one word) to see why conservatives love Paul's teaching so much more than the liberal teaching and example of Jesus!
Rev. Ray Dubuque
Rayosun4 1 year ago
@Rayosun4 Thank you for correcting me sir! I am doing my very best to truely "love His truth" and I hate hypocrisy. The first verse i looked up he used really did (I believe) apply to anarchy. As only a 16 year old girl i realize that my Biblical interpretation is not at its finest. At the moment I am studying God's word and Law. I apoligise if any of my comments were not in the right, I'm doing my best to live by His Word.
LoveHisTruth 1 year ago
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"Can the liberties of a nation be sure when we remove their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people, that these liberties are a gift from God?"
~Thomas Jefferson
WILLTHEWGMAN 1 year ago
You want to know how to tell whether or not we're a Christian nation? Actually read some original documents. Try it. Jefferson and Adams said in their letters to each other that they used the Book of Deuteronomy in the Constitution. And what about the Pilgrims? To deny their own words is to be in denial.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire You might be right about the Constitution and Deuteronomy, I'm not sure if that's true or not. But don't delude yourself into thinking Jefferson was Christian in the theological sense, because he wasn't. He admittedly loved Jesus' teachings but rejected all of the theology of the virgin birth, miracles and the Resurrection. He even went so far as to cut those references out of his own bible.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
@beerbrain420 -- I know, he wasn't saved. he and Franklin were considered two of the least spiritual, but even Franklin called for prayer.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
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@GodsWildfire You of all people do you even know what save is?
ManicDepressive101 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire Well, it's true that Jefferson and Franklin were both still believers in God, just not in the traditional Christian sense. Ditto for Thomas Paine. They were pretty much Deist in their outlook. They believed in the God of Nature, a Supreme Being that set the universe into motion and then let it do it's thing. They were still spiritual men no doubt, but disliked the trappings of organized religion.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
@beerbrain420 -- Very true. But they still believed in Biblical principles for this country. And there were many who did actually have a relationship with Christ, including George Washington, Samuel Adams, Benjamin Rush, and George Whitfield.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire No dispute with you there. I think the Founders really wanted to strike a balance where religion was concerned. As products of a predominantly Christian society, naturally some of their ideas would come from Christian principles, and I agree there's nothing wrong with that. But at the same time, they also wanted to insure that religion did not dominate government either. Allowing total religious freedom without actually endorsing religion, they ensured the best for everyone.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
@beerbrain420 -- Well, they wanted everyone to have the right to practice their own religion. But they did not mind praying during the Continental Congress meetings, or prevent something like the Ten Commandments from being put up. We've begin to worry way too much about people disagreeing that we've watered down out country.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
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beerbrain420 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire I'm by no means a hard-line secularist. General references to a Creator like "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance or "In God We Trust" on a coin don't bother me, because anyone can envision "God" in their own way. The Ten Commandments is a bit trickier since it's a direct reference to someone's religion. On a courthouse wall I don't think it's a big deal, but teaching it to kids in public schools might be. It's all a matter of degree, as to where you cross that fine line.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
@beerbrain420 -- But some of the Founders did directly reference both the Bible and Christ as important in this country. I do agree fully that nothing should be forced, but I think it is just as big a problem to say that these things are not allowed. The exception to this is when faith becomes dangerous, such as Muslim extremism. That should not be allowed.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire Oh sure, many of the Founders did openly support religious faith in society, no doubt. I agree they didn't want to stamp out any trace of religion in public society as some might want to see. But they want to make sure that at the same time, government did not become an arm of a religious institution itself. The First Amendment was put there to keep us from going down the same road as the UK and the Church of England being a state-sponsored religion there.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
@beerbrain420 -- True that. I think the First was meant to keep the government from enforcing one faith. But I just don't think posting the Ten Commandments is doing that. They're principles that are not bad to live by, no matter what faith one is. I mean, to not murder, steal, etc. should still be taught.
GodsWildfire 1 year ago
@GodsWildfire For me, merely posting the Ten Commandments somewhere publically like, say, in a courthouse, I think is pretty innocuous (although some of my skeptic friends might disagree with me). In a public school, I would just teach general values that are embodied in the Ten Commandments. Although, I think it would be a problem with teaching "keep the Lord's day holy" in a public school because that is a specific religious instruction better left for the home or church.
beerbrain420 1 year ago
As a clergyman who is a Liberal Like Jesus, I resent conservative Christians' efforts fo use the governemnt to promote their religion. They are such failures at persuading people with their preaching that they want government to FORCE their views on the rest of us. If they don't like living in a non-sectarian secular country, why don't they just leave our government alone and move to a Catholic or Protestant country? Actually many of THOSE countries are trying to free themselves, too!
Rayosun4 1 year ago
@Rayosun4 I wish more clergymen had your reasonable perspective!
beerbrain420 1 year ago
You are so funny,, @GodsWildfire ! You say " when faith becomes dangerous, such as Muslim extremism. That should not be allowed." While you object to being the victim of "Muslim extremism", you see no problem imposing your conservative "Christian extremism" on OTHERS ! LOL LOL LOL
Rayosun4 1 year ago
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I want someone who believes in the mantra that "we are a Christian Nation" to tell me what this means. In other words--let's suppose we are, and let's suppose the argument is over. What's supposed to happen at that point? What do you see as flowing from that notion? Are Christian churches supposed to be favored? Given tax money? Only Christians can hold office or vote? Legislation must pass Biblical scrutiny? What is supposed to happen as a result of us being a "Christian Nation"?
DandAinTac 1 year ago
US liberty is grated first by a creator at birth and only recognized and upheld by the US constitution as a birth-right as such. Why, because if mere men or documents alone granted you liberty only a mere man or document can take it away! This is the distinction from American Liberty & why all men are created equal, evolution surly does not teach this but Christianity does. The basic notion of American liberty & freedom for all is by a God-given birth-right & a non-secular view historically.
WILLTHEWGMAN 1 year ago
@WILLTHEWGMAN Their is nothing in the bible that says all men are created equal. The bible supports slavery, genocide, homocide, infanticide, inscest, etc. Are those the values america are founded on? The killing of a group of people, the killing of babies? NO!!!!!
PatrioticEagle50 1 year ago
@PatrioticEagle50 First of all, unless one understands the contex of the events beyond just the literal events you speak of, (like slavery) one will always come to the conclusion the bible is for evil. For example, ever read what kind of slavery God allowed Israel back then, and more importantly, how after seven years, the slaves were to be set free...given plenty of supllies and goods they worked to give you their former master so they can get started on life independently? Nope, you haven't
Luvcreole 1 year ago
@PatrioticEagle50 Compare that to the slavery America practiced (and still does through it's trade deals of outsourcing our jobs in globalization in faraway lands)
Luvcreole 1 year ago
all that one has to do to prove that US laws do not derive from the ten commandments is compare the first commandment with the first amendment
TheAmazingImbecile 1 year ago
come to the light darkhollow6 easy logic u speak but u know as i belive everyone does what truth really is
epyonzerotoo 1 year ago
This is a cool video and all, I like the content and the presentation, but man you need someone to proofread your work.
Zryuken 1 year ago
@Zryuken Videos which require you to read can be quite annoying because at times you cant keep up with the pace they are set.. and pausing the video and rewinding it is a bother..
GravDiga 1 year ago
@GravDiga Ok, terrific.
Zryuken 1 year ago
"The United States government is not any sense founded on the Christian Religion." -President John Adams, Treaty of Tripoli, 1979
Anyone who tells you that history is on their side, is lying to you.
SnatchTease 1 year ago
what a load of rubbish,it started out exposing people worshipping false gods,then turned 360 to attack Christ.i gather this guys plays a lot of chess very black and white and bats for both sides.
mickwillie1 1 year ago
@mickwillie1 he introduced you to how paganism is steeped into our hstory..then showed how the us is not really xtian.
kmcl11 1 year ago
I know of noone who is forcing anyone to go to Church. If you don't like Church on TV, turn the channel! How often I hear that because of other garbage we find on TV. However, if you are at McDonalds and I happen to be there, I will still pray over my food along with my family. As long as I don't force you to join with me, I ask you to get over it if that offends you. I have the right to give thanks, you have the right not to.
DefenderCatholic 1 year ago
Look at the Washington monument. He is in the same pose as Baphomet. Which means above or God is the same as below Lucifer. Ill put them on my page in case you would like to compare them.
shane4896 1 year ago
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WizardRuru 1 year ago
Unfortunately, hell exists and the days are getting short?
DefenderCatholic 1 year ago
Whoever created this video is an idiot. The Washington Monument was bulit in dedication to George Washington, hence why it's called the "Washington Monument." It should be noted Jefferson did not have a pastoral degree (unlike most of the founders) so his ramblings here dont amount to anything. The South side of the Supreme Court building depics law givers before Jesus. The North side has all Christians, except Mohamed. That's not Mars in the front and the Treaty is not a founding document.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman "Ramblings"??? The "ramblings"??? of Thomas Jefferson??? Who is the idiot here? Jefferson practically wrote the words founding our country by himself. The man didn't "ramble". Go get an education ( not from some unacredited christian college) and get your head out of your ass.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
No. They are ramblings....plain and simple, and not accurate ones. Jefferson didnt write things "practically" by himself. Not even close to true. The Constitution was written by James Madison, not Jefferson. In addition, each of the Founders completely agreed with the philosopher William Blackstone, who said our rights come from God, not the government.
So who's the idiot with their head up their ass? that would be you.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman You're quite right about Madison, thank you. Now to adress his opinions. "The civil government ... functions with complete success ... by the total separation of the Church from the State." - James Madison. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprize, every expanded prospect." - James Madison. Care to continue?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
I certainly do.
We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. Weve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacityto sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God. -James Madison
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Thank you for saving me the space as this is the next quote I was going to use. Clearly Madison said it because he felt the people to be governed by a non-religious government would need a moral and ethical stance themselves. There is no other explanation.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Actually, there are plenty of other explanations. While we could debate on whether or not Madison wanted say every last US president to be Christian, there is no doubt that he thought the moral and ethical stances of the people would come from religion. Guess what was the prodomiant religion at that time?
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Of course he thought that "the moral and ethical stances of the people would come from religion" ... It's doubtful that in his time he knew of any other clear source for such a stance. What the "predominant" (sp?) religion was at the time is completely irrelevant. There clearly are and were other sources for a "moral and ethical stance".
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
That really doesnt take anything away from what he said.
Look at history...there is a direct link between the laws America was founded on and the laws of God found in the Bible.
Also, read The 5000 Year Leap.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
And by the way, Madison clearly says "sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments." Last I checked no other faith has rules called the Ten Commandments except Judaism and Christianity.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..." I really think that's pretty clear, don't you?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Yeah....it means religious people can express their faith all they want and there is NOTHING dipshits like you can do about it.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
"...we have all been encouraged to feel in the guardianship and guidance of that Almighty Being whose power regulates the destiny of nations, whose blessings have been so conspicuously dispensed to this rising Republic, and to whom we are bound to address our devout gratitude for the past, as well as our fervent supplications and best hopes for the future." -James Madison
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
You need to ask for a refund of all the time and money you obviously wasted at that know-nothing liberal school you went to.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Actually, among others, I went to a very conservative christian school. I needed you to bring up Madison to make my point. Thanks again. BTW, the statue referred to is actually called "war" and was documentably based by Persico, it's creator on the god Mars. Try again.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
And what point would that be, that you dont know what the hell you're talking about? Since that's the case, mission accomplished: you have now officially come off as a moron.
Also, I have contacted the curators of that building and they say there is no statue named war or Mars. Care to lose again?
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Contacted the curators of the capitol rotunda have we? You sir are a liar and a fraud. The titles of the two sculpture are well known, they are "War" and "Peace". Stop wasting my time with nonsense.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
ummm....no. I did contact them and while there were two statues by those names at one point, they're not there now. And even if they were still there, does that really take anything away from the notion of America being founded on Christian principles? No. No, it doesnt. Next, you're going to tell me there is no Bible quote on the Liberty Bell.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman To paraphrase someone I heard "ramble" recently, the liberty bell isn't a founding document. Go waste someone else's time. I'm tired of watching you refute your own arguments.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
More like you cant stand that i'm refuting yours. and btw, the liberty bell comment was sarcasm. So not only are you so damn stupid you dont know what you're talking about, you also cant recognize sarcasm.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" ... Refute that, dipshit.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Gladly. It just says "Congress". It doesnt say states, cities, society, counties or families cant establish religion.
It does however say Congress cannot prevent or discourage people from praticing their faith, which shoots what you say down.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman It most certainly does not "shoot down" what I say. It supports it. If the founders had intended to create a "christian nation", they would simply have done so rather than put in place safeguards assuring that the nation's laws were not religious in nature. The states etc. could in theory establish religion except for the supremacy clause, under which the bill of rights would prevail.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Actually it does. The laws of the land in the Constitution had great religious influence. The Founders didnt say America was a Christian nation because Christianity was so prevailent it didnt need to be said. Actually, the Supremacy Clause has never been applied to religious matters.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Did you even read the supremacy clause before spouting nonsense? Obviously not. The supremacy clause applies to religious matters directly in it's text. As I've said before, you're a waste of time and now you've proven it.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Obviously I did or I wouldnt have posted what I did. The surpremacy clause doesnt touch on religious matters at all. Like I HAVE said, you're a total moron who doesnt understand much of anything.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Although not technically a "founding document" the forteenth amendment would also apply. The individual, (you) are free to practice religion as you wish as long as it doesn't interfere with my right not to. Oh, some advice? Don't try sarcasm again, you suck at it.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
More like you suck at logic and i can be as sarcastic as i want to be....
The fourteenth amendment applies to defining a citizen, not said citizen's religious practices.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman It also defines citizenship as it applies to the rights of a citizen - "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States" - section1. This would include ... TA DA! religious freedoms as recognized under the first amendment. Not much logic required just read the damned thing.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
It says no such thing. It applies only to who does and does not count as a citizen. No Ta-da but actually an oops concerning you.
Care to lose this argument again?
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman You're right, it's clause three. Unfortunately for you it's still there. "no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
A for effort but F- minus for interpretation, especially considering elected office holders swear on the Bible to uphold the Constitution--which would make no sense if we elected people who didnt believe in the Bible. Also, the people can informally require that potential officials be Christian, an area clause three cant touch.
So you lose again.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Officeholders are not required to use the bible in fact Theodore Roosevelt did not and Franklin Pierce affirmed rather than swore. The people cannot require that officials be any such thing because politicians lie almost as often as christians.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
HAHAHAHAAA!!!!
More like politicians lie and mislead as often as atheists.....not only can the people require it, they can even flat out demand it. You cant tell them otherwise without infringing on their First Amendment rights.
You lose again.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman What the hell are you talking about? How can the people demand anything of the kind? Make sense.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Grow some brains. If people want to get elected, they have to tout what appeals to the public. Guess what? Believing in God appeals to people; being an atheist does not. Simple as that.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Let's quit with the ad-hominem attacks and adress the facts. Just because a politician represents himself as christian doesn't mean he is. Do you really think our current president or Bill Clinton for that matter, are christians?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
So you want me to overlook the fact you implied I made no sense? Not going to happen. The point of the matter is the public want their leaders to be religious and as long as they demand that, you have no right to tell them otherwise without stepping on their 1st amendment rights.
Now stop being an idiot and grow some brains.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman You want it that way? fine, asshole. Try answering my question. Do you really think All three of our most recent presidents were actually christians or did two of them lie about it to get elected? If they did then your informal test is worth dick. If you think they didn't you're a moron.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Look, moron, none of them lied to get elected. Although one of them had a minister that said questionable things about America, that doesnt change the fact each of the last three belonged to a Christian church of some sort. Either you're too lazy to look stuff up or you get a kick out of being proved wrong.
Which is it?
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman I didn't say they didn't belong to a church, I said they weren't christians and no self respecting christian would claim them as philosophical brethren. Let's get down to reality here. You have no good evidence that this is or was intended to be a "christian nation" and there is plenty of evidence to the contrary, the first amendment being just the most obvious of such evidence. You keep saying you'ved proved me wong when you've done nothing of the kind. Get a brain.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Wrong on everything yet again. The fact is you cant face the reality that anyone who tries to run for office and makes it known they are an atheist will NOT win. Period. You have nothing to show that America was founded on anything other than Christianity, the 1st amendment proves nothing, I have proved you wrong and so will any other informed person.
Grow some sense and grow up.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman "You have nothing to show that America was founded on anything other than Christianity" I have the first amendment, the basis of the constiution in english common law (not christian btw), and I've cited many other facts. You, like many christians will deny the sunrise if it suits your purposes. Question - What hypothetical evidence would you accept as proof of my hypothesis? I dare you to name it.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
First amendment only shows what faiths are allowed, not what the nation was founded on. Constitution was based on Biblical principles and so was English Common law, and you have cited no other facts. You, like many other atheist twits, ignore too much history. I would accept nothing from an arrogant, know-nothing prick like you. If anything, you should and must accept the findings of the book Original Intent. Read it.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman English common law existed for two hundred years before christianity arrived in England so it can't be based on the bible. You're the one ignoring history, look it up. You've just said all I need to know - " I would accept nothing from an arrogant, know-nothing prick like you." Like all religious zealots, your mind is closed and you just proved it.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Wrong. English common law came into existance with the signing of the magna carta. Last I checked, that came after the Bible.
My mind operates the way any mind should---rejecting any nonsense athe-tards like you tout.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Wrong, the Magna Carta ended the period of common law rather than began it. There is a clear period of two hundred years where the common law existed and christianity was no part of it. In "Church & State" 7/8/96 Barton admitted that some 12 different quotes he had claimed were "spurious" (which means he made them up) including the Madison quote you used earlier. look it up. The man is a liar and you're insane.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Wrong again. The Magna Carta began the concept of common law. The man is not a liar---you are a liar. and a dumbass.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman BTW, David Barton, the author of "Original Intent" is a self confessed liar who had to publically admit that one of his books was fraud. Why should I believe anything the man says?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
what did barton lie about? Turns out nothing. None of his books have ever been considered frauds, except by those just as deluded as you.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Ha! I just noticed most of the quotes you used are from that book. LOL, what a moron!
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman Interesting isn't it, that the Madison quote you relied on so heavily has now proven to be a fabrication of the author you esteem so highly. You really need to re-examine the company you keep. Belief in god is delusion, plain and simple. That's OK though, lying in defense of god and other delusions has a long and venerable tradition. Keep it up, it just makes the advocacy of reason and atheism easier.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
HAAHAHAHAAA!!!! Stupid little boy....no mental professional agrees with you and why should they? Such a notion goes against science, the very science you know little about.
Keep braying like an inane jackass all you want: all the more to disprove and shoot down.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
and btw, your notion about the Constitution couldnt be more wrong. the 1st amendment does NOT show America isnt Christian. It only says Congress cannot make a law, but the people and the states can, via the 9th and 10th amendments respectively. Combine that with the fact the Constitution uses the phrase "in the year of our Lord" and no one objected to this phrase.....
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
And only one faith uses that phrase, all these put together show America is a Christian nation, was founded as a Christian nation, and you ARE WRONG!!!
You also fail. You fail a million times over.
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
@MrTrilliondollarman "only one faith uses that phrase" Nearly the whole civilized world used that phrase until the phrase "common era", C. E. became more frequently used. You're an idiot clinging to straws. Your major source has been discredited, your quotes are fakes, your history can be proven incorrect and yet you cling to your conclusions regardless. This is called delusion and I'm done. I've proven my point about you. Have a nice life.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone
Nope. Jewish nations didnt use it. Islamic nations dont use it. Atheist nations sure as hell dont use it. Only Christian nations use it. You're a braying dumbass who wont shut the hell up. Nothing you say makes any sense, you have been repeatedly discredited, the quotes are airtight, and my history is dead on accurate.
Though you are right on one thing: You are done. Go peddle your bullshit to someone dumb enough to believe you
MrTrilliondollarman 1 year ago
The photos of the Christ in the Bible are not the real Christ Emmanuel either. I have learned not to like any religion for its slavery like attitudes from leaders.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
Read the book of Revelation and the 7 spirits of God. statue of the Christ is in New Orleans Louisiana :O) lol...if you must know,islamic religion provoked the crusades.. all Christians cannot be classified as either hypocrites or fools alone. I have met some that are so much like the Christ. I dont disagree with the enslavement religion teach. Many stories in the Bible have been science proven. does not condemn our forefathers either. Romans 13:1 leads to Gal. 1:10 Foundation not christ like
SpringChatty 1 year ago
@SpringChatty "Many stories in the Bible have been science proven" ... like what?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
The problem is that there are people who will denigh the right to practice Faith in America. I believe in the freedom of Religion, not the freedom from Religion. Just because I walk into a Federal building doesn't mean I desrobe my Faith! Not at all!
DefenderCatholic 1 year ago
@DefenderCatholic I have no problem with your right to practice your faith as long as it doesn't interfere with my right NOT to. Would you deny me that right and my right to raise my children free from indoctrination by "your" faith?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
no the USA is an indian nation not a europe one da..
wachnathan 2 years ago
So what kind of nation was it before our native american indians were here ? Keep reading ancient history.....and looking at science, archaelogical digs, etc...Russia used to be attached.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
Does anybody know the name of the song playing in the background???
fadedmachine 2 years ago
Gethaseme cannot spell it properly thought it was named after the garden of GETHESAME (sp?) The garden the christ prayed in all night that he sweat the blood in. Don't recall the author. refresh the page and it will tell you who wrote it and give you the proper spelling.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
The US Constitution is a secular, humanist legal document founded on the principles of the Enlightenment.
FaganRoberts 2 years ago
stop with the music. i had to mute my speakers for this
Xaeravoq 2 years ago
the whole world has pagan roots, but THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA is the ONLY country close to being a Christian nation.
bananabebop 2 years ago
AND freedom of RELIGION.
bananabebop 2 years ago
who gives a shit.... its not
FREETHINK23 2 years ago
How is the U.S. close to being a Christian nation? If Christianity was so important, why wasn't it mentioned in the Constitution? I don't know if you've read the most important American document, but, it does say,"no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States." In addition, the first amendment says, "Congress shall make no law RESPECTING AN ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION." The cap words are very important, in my opinion anyway.
UrDevilsAdvocate 2 years ago
so who got the idea of "In God we Trust" and swearing on the Holy Bible?
bananabebop 2 years ago
The founders of America didn't put either of those in the Constitution.They can swear on a toilet seat if they so chose. It the oath that matters. And the whole "In God we Trust" started shortly after the Constitution was ratified by some religious person, and put on coins in the late 1800s.(If memory serves correctly) So, how is the U.S. close to being a Christian nation? Every bias law that Christians pushed for came after the fact.
UrDevilsAdvocate 2 years ago
Most people are Christians. Here in America people like to call themselves Christians when they really aren't, but why? For social reasons. (And political reasons, for people like Obama).
bananabebop 2 years ago
If Americans lie about their faith for socio-political reasons, how can most ppl be Christians? Assuming you meant Americans with the ,"most ppl are Christians." And if you did, America is not a Christian nation. Why shouldn't America be a neutral nation, having laws and policies that aren't prejudice, bias, discriminative, or invasive of personal choice?
UrDevilsAdvocate 2 years ago
I am not saying that I WANT a Christian country. Who doesn't want freedom?
bananabebop 2 years ago
Yeah it first appeared on the 2 cent coin in 1864.
aintisaword 2 years ago
"It is impossible to govern the world without God and the Bible."
"Do not let any one claim to be a true American if they ever attempt to remove religion from politics."
First President of the United States - George Washington
Cursed be all that learning that is contrary to the cross of Christ. Rev. Jonathan Dickinson, First President of Princeton University
ugha323a 1 year ago
His words then could be translate today into self government through christlike behaviors. Most cannot create miracles though.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
John Adams (The Works of John Adams, ed. C. F. Adams, Boston: Little, Brown Co., 1851, 4:31)
ugha323a 1 year ago
I think he stated that wrong. lol
I hate religion, but it was made for people that can CONTROL AND GOVERN THEMSELVES !
SpringChatty 1 year ago
"How many observe Christ's birthday! How few his precepts!
O! 'tis easier to keep holidays than commandments."
Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanack, 1757
ugha323a 1 year ago
According to the Holy Bible, we are not to celebrate his supposed birthday. Christmas is man made tradition, pagan, etc....no religious nor religion should run a nation. THe possibilities of abusing that religion are to great.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"...no religious nor religion should run a nation. THe possibilities of abusing that religion are to(o) great."
Amen
UrDevilsAdvocate 1 year ago