There is no such thing as Objective Evil. Evil is in the instincts of the Subjectivity of the Individual. So is good.
The only kind of "Objective Evil" that I see valid, is observable behaviour that goes against The Harm Principle. And even The Harm Principle only exists in the Subjectivity of some people.
I couldn't listen to the whole video, your issue with the problem of evil is hella easy to resolve. In religion, evil is already defined, "sin", so, if this god thinks it is bad, why does it exist? To a god, in general, this god has great affection, esp. to its creation, and would not create or allow evil.
@Bourtini Just needed to elaborate on a god, in general: evil is a concept, but it describes something that is immoral and/or malevolent. You are confused by the idea of relativity and immoral, yet it is not relative in considering the quality of a benevolent god, which would have the desire of perfecting the lives of its creation and not allow anything that is conflicting with that to exist.
Atheism's big problem is religion...It just feels wrong to us how something so blatantly void of merit could still hold any credibility at all. Really, it's so obvious to atheists what an illogical, self-defeating sham it all is...It's actually depressing, as it makes me think the majority of humanity are mindless, unevolved children.
HAHAHAHAHAHA. This guy believes atheists condone Nazi Germany. Jesus focking christ dude read a book. Get educated. Try to be 'OBJECTIVE' you fucking dolt. You are a disgrace to the human race.
clarifyin an obvious misunderstanding here ,to end with this nonsense goin on about what is evil ,religion created this concept,etc... evil is just a term that we theists DON'T usually use concerning natural disaster but we use it in a sense of a person killin another person.atheists say "natural disasters is accordin 2 u theists is evil so ur so called "God" is evil" breakin the pillars of morals of which my religion stands upon consequently "THERE IS NO GOD" n its stupid to think there is one
Can I ask why you are so obsessed with disproving the beliefs of other men? You seem to spend so much of your precious time on such a worthless argument...
@es696 This is how these people work. They secretly understand how completely insane they sound, but are unwilling to admit they are wrong. So, they go on a huge tirade feverishly trying to prove everyone else wrong by going "CAUSE GOD SAID SO" and standing back with a big moronic grin on their face, confidently assured they have pleased their invisible overlord with this act of sheer stupidity. I see no future for mankind as long as these people are allowed to exist.
No one is saying the examples you say is right or ok! Just stating the definition has nothing to do with that. And even if it was, where were the church during the slavery or the time of the nazis? quite passive I should say...There are nothing called evil...bad or good moral maybe but evil...nope.
"Greetings to everybody, now, in my last video, I showed you how to lure children at playgrounds with nothing more than a lollypop. This time, I'll be tutoring the more intellectual stuff, like actual penetration and covering up your tracks from parents."
Go wash yourself, I can smell your sweaty ballsack through my monitor, you piece of shit :-).
Evil is cultural. we NOW view killing and rape as evil, but in 200 maybe THEY view it as not evil. That does NOT change what we think of it NOW. You do understand that if cultures change, so does what is acceptable? And it does not change history :/ If in 200 years rape is acceptable, does that change what we view as evil now?
The society that you live in shapes your mind, and so shapes your morals.
Evil and good are subjective , it depends on culture and other factors , penis mutilation for religion reason is evil for me , but for jews is a good thing , all is relative .
"since atheist's can't really give a proper consistent response as to what evil is."
Now this is really weak, as I haven't heard one consistent view from the religious either, even though they have the same book(s) they cannot agree. Which isn't weird either because even religious books are not consistent. Nevertheless, I don't need an instruction book to ask for allowance to do good and a lot of what is in the religious books could easily be pointed out to be evil, such as the flooding.
Did you attend physics lessons in your school? You seem to be struggling with understanding what relative means. Nazi are evil in our society, communists were evil in fascist Germany, American imperialists were evil in Soviet Russia, etc. There is no fixed frame of reference in space-time and there is no absolute system of values. And just like physicists learned how to live with their "problem" so did many atheists.
@lanuevagranada Yes, religion, people who are in a group that think they are better than others, I agree that those are bad, but I do believe in God, and I have thought allot about it and all the time it's just more obvious to me that God exists, I believe that people should have the free will that GOD himself gave to us to believe what we choose,
@lanuevagranada and we should not say that someone is stupid for believing something different, we don't have to agree with everyone else, but that is no reason to tell them they are going to hell, God is SO infinite compared to us that we can't comprehend him, and based on this alone there can't be a single person that exists who can claim that they know 100% what God thinks and what he wants. Thanks for reading!
Atheists are probably more moraly honest and honestly good than any religious people there, We are not good because we are especting some bull shit in the other life, we are good because it is born within un being good, you Religious people are good, mostly because you have an interest in that. THERE.
There is no such thing as EVIL. Just like there is no such thing as the DEVIL.
People who enjoy inflicting pain and all so called evil deeds is due in part to nurture(the way you were brought up and things that happen to you in life) and nature (which means you are predisposed to those things by your brain make-up)
Your source of morals are just as subjective as those of atheists. Your holy book was written by men whose morals were subjective. Unless you can prove that your imaginary friend actually exists, your morals are not only subjective but horribly outdated. Besides, it is asinine to think that just because we cannot justify morality in the way a mathematical theorem can be justified all states of being are therefore indistinguishable. That is, being burned alive is just as good or bad as no pain.
So if a society deems something as okay despite it being evil from our perspective, that's a big problem for atheists? What about God deeming something to be okay despite it being evil from our perspective?
@cruiseplatoon Problem with that line of thinking is that other peoples' beliefs will necessarily intersect with your own - therefore you have to worry about others' beliefs lest your own be affected by them.
Evil can simply be defined as an action that denigrates, disrupts or destroys human progress and thus endangers the human race. Nature functions as a “higher authority”. Further natural selection has constantly favoured behaviour that is beneficial for the survival of humans. Since cooperation is the key to human success, evolution has hard-wired us with a disgust towards detrimental behaviour like murder, theft and falsehood.
@lukashoermann Today we can use scientific means to determine beneficial an unfavourable actions.
For instance: Every sane person would agree, that sticking needles into children is evil. If it is a life-saving injection the same act is good.
In every case an accurate definition can be made by studying the effects of an action. It follows that the definition of EVIL changes according to human progress and the relationship with nature.
You really should look up Nazi-germany a bit more before using it in arguments ;) there where soooooooooo not ok by the german population, but they where to scared to rebel because they wud be killed..
I can easily describe evil. Breaking MY morale laws! And while everyone have different morale laws everyone have different descriptions of evil :) And oh yeah, the bible is evil, its pro-murder and mayhem!
ok stop you made 2 in the begining of this points there the first was basicly that cause we might not know an answer to a question means that were evil NO NO NO were willing to admit we dont know and keep looking for a solid answer the second is that just because its the social means that its ok thats not we atheism is about at all. you make a claim there is a god with no evidence that we can see and we reject that consept thats it
Evil is defined by the individual, you don't seem to get that.
If someone thinks to himself "a nice bloody killing-spree would certainly perk up my weekend", then he'd go out, pop a few people off and bathe in their blood, to me (and hopefully anyone who's reading this) that seems evil, but he'd probably think of it as nothing but a bit of fun.
To the Nazi's what they did was okay but to me it's pretty damn fucked up.
Also, this video has absolutely nothing at all to do with atheism.
I feel I should correct some possible misunderstandings from my earlier comments. First off, I am not, I repeat NOT trying to justify the holocaust, or killing in general. I am only giving a plausible explanation for why sometimes humans find killing acceptable and why sometimes we don't. Of course there are many other reasons that people may kill, but it seems safe to assume that (in this example) the entire German civilian population was not clinically mentally ill.
YOU ARE A HOLE. Evil has nothing to do with athiesm. Your trying to be an intellectual to hard my friend and sounding like a complete twat in the process, atheists just have a mind of there own and do not require a god or some religious fruit cake to tell them right from wrong. We dont believe in god because it dosent make sense. evil is just causing someone physical or mental pain for own gain or amusment/pleasure. yopur taking it into past events witch always boil down to my answer.
@SamiZaatari Notice how he avoids the entire statement and chooses to pick out the random comment out of context? This is what they all do. Then they make a video about how they never see a "CONCLUSIVE" answer. Well here it is, in front of your face. You can't avoid it, you've accepted it being there, and now, you have shown everyone what a coward you are. Good day cunt.
@SamiZaatari Evil is a word created by religion to describe the darker side of nature, not just human nature, every human has the potential to do good things, and bad things, this isn't caused by Adam eating an apple thousands of years ago, but instead the experiences you've had in life, for example if a child sees another child of a different skin colour for the first time, some tend to be very abrupt with questions, does this make them racist? no, they just haven't been taught...
@SamiZaatari ... What's acceptable and what isn't, the same goes for many similar matters, so there you go, an easy explanation of what you perceive to be "evil" from a random guy on the internet, yet you claim Atheists have a problem answering it?
@SamiZaatari Sami, EVERYONE is an atheist including yourself. You have to share the planet with other believers in other gods which carries the same believability as yours! So you (and everyone else) IS in fact an athiest to those gods that you think is inferior and invalid compared to the one you believe in. Atheists like myself just believe in one less than you!
@SamiZaatari i agree about him calling you an A hole you know why ? cause your defending a murderer and a child rapist and your talking about slaves yet your prophet had many slaves and you talk about nazis well your prophet was a nazi also if not worse ...until this day hes killing people and hes a jew hater and a racist and the quran is just full of hatred homie >>so please wake up and stop deceiving people
@CraigRidley1 and what you believe makes sense? bible has prophecy down to the tee! have u studied it to say its bogus? like fully study it? probably not cause u dont care. you have to spend thousands of hours to understand and i can tell you know u havent read it to understand it. i can show you many bible prophecies that explain detailed information of past and present century.
@MIGAVELI i can understand that the teachings of jesus christ are a good thing and that the guy did have his heart in the right place and was able to get a large following, i just dont believe he had anything to do with the so called god. for me god is just a ? that know one knows anything about including jesus christ.
@CraigRidley1 Today it is a social norm to have a police state and pass bills contradicting the constitution of a just and speedy trial. It is a social norm to do have binge drinking causing death to young adults. It is social norm to have sex outside of marriage causing STD to spread rampantly. It is a social norm to have slave wages and lend money on interest which most people find it difficult to meet their expenses and put food on their table.
You are only partly correct when you say that killing Jews and other minorities became the social "norm" in Nazi Germany. It was the norm in the sense that the leaders of the Nazi party wanted to make it normal, but there are some basic evolutionary aspects that make this more complicated than it appears. Competition for resources would have made it acceptable to kill rivals, and thus boost your own chances of survival. However, killing other members of your own species (continued)
@Chamiletchisonai inherently reduces the available gene pool; kill enough humans, and pretty soon humans will go extinct. The decision of whether or not to kill individuls or small groups is based on a) can we afford to lose their genetic material and b) will I/my tribe benefit from the lack of competition. TheRipcity22 was basically right in saying that the root of killing is a "tribe mentality" that urges us to eliminate competitors for resources and potential mates.
Defining evil is straightforward. It's the opposite of good. Define what good is, and you're done. Good is only meaningful in terms of that which achieves a goal. If good didn't accomplish anything, how could it be good? I choose my highest goal as my own life. On a fundamental level, you have to choose to value either life or death, and I choose life. Therefore, that which is inimical to my life is evil, and what promotes it is good.
@ShellsOnTheFloor So to give an example, killing is evil because it's impossible to say my life has value while someone else's doesn't. You can't justify that, it makes no sense. So killing someone implicitly asserts that human life is worthless, and that goes against my standard of valuing my own life.
To say that evil is evil because God says so is just ridiculous. There's not even evidence that he exists, and even if he did, which God are you gonna follow? :P
I'm begining to think that Sami talks intently with his webcam because it's the only thing he can find that shuts up long enough to let him finish his word vomit without laughing or debunking his childish arguments.
I can only lol at this guy. His agruments are filled with so many logical holes and loops that he never makes a point and just simply jabbers around the real point.
Sir you are an idiot. The "Problem of Evil" is a straw man fallacy. Evil is an issue created by religion not a real thing, Satan is evil, God created satan, ergo God created Evil. Atheists do not define evil because there is nothing to define.
Even people quoting the same scriptures come up with contradictory values. You have to remember that the slaveholders won all of the Bible-quoting contests (using the Jewish Bible as well as the New Testament). Also we also don't now stone unruly children or do any number of barbaric practices as the Bible prescribes. The Bible didn't itself change, but people's interpretation of it did. How else would someone get their morality if not from this bizarre revelation?
You're lost, you'll never be able to see the true beauty in the world because your view is so clouded by infantile myths, I feel sorry for you. You're like a child who lacks curiosity, you'll never learn anything and your existence will be nothing but a detriment to humanity.
The fact that I'm the smartest, most attractive and most creative man who's ever lived also brings me great joy,, It's also based on nothing other than my wanting it to be true , just like you being a Muslim.
You should start being curious, after all, you're the adult who believes in laughably stupid fairy tales.
@TheRipcity22 the only thing laughable was ur comment beating ur chest harder than king kong.
so u think Pharoah was a fairy tale? the splitting of the moon was a fairy tale? pregnancy and conception a fairy tale? the water cycle is a fairy tale? the creation of the universe is a fairy tale? living and dying is a fairy tale?
oops, look who im asking, someone that thinks he is the worlds best LOL.
Well, in this case. If in future social norm would be killing- it wouldn't be evil to them. But it is and would be evil from our perspective. Its simple: Views change... Thats all.
I base my morality on how I want to be treated. In my opinion, an act towards another is "moral" if it encourages reciprocal behaviour that benefits me/makes me feel good somehow, and "immoral" if it encourages reciprocal behaviour that disadvantages me or leaves me in a worse position.
For the record, not all Atheists have a position on the "does god exist" question. Agnostic Atheists, for example, do not hold a position, for neither yes nor no can be proven.
There's no such thing as evil, or good. They are just labels we put on actions that we like or dislike, and it's relative to our genetic instincts and environment. Problem solved.
Genocide is always bad, as there is no perceivable good coming from it, and the ultimate bad on the other hand. Eradication in general only is good when the value of the eradicated is miniscule compared to the number the eradicated would kill. Smallpox, for instance. As my earlier post said, good and bad are objective in terms of aspects. But the whole is somewhat subjective, though many things (like killing without any increase in life to balance it) are obviously objectively bad.
Evil is willful bad. When you want bad, and you do bad because of that, it's evil. Badness is something that causes lower quality or quantity of life, and is totally objective. Goodness is something that causes higher quality or quantity of life, and is totally objective. When you balance how much goodness vs how much badness there is (balance is subjective) tells you if it's good or bad. Raping hurts someone way more than it makes someone else happy, as genocide kills more than it saves.
After we divide ourselves into "tribes" we then set off to dehumanize those who aren't in the tribe. Germany dehumanized Jews, even during the height of the War Germans were still lawful when interacting with each other because they were in the tribe. So the problem is back in your court Sami. Once we realize that all of humanity is in the "tribe" we'll see no more war. That won't happen while adults believe in childish fairy tales and kill each other over it, Time to grow up Sami.
Sami , like most theists, can't seem to wrap his mind around the fact that there are no absolutes. Stealing is wrong 99% of the time. Murder is wrong 99% of the time etc,While Germany deemed Jew hatred kosher in the 30-40's it did not make it less "evil". Humanity as a whole determines this, that's why these are "crimes against humanity". It should be pointed out that tribalism, the type which theism inevitably leads to, is to blame for nearly every atrocity mankind has ever inflicted on itself.
Don't make a video about 1 idiot's definition of evil. Evil is simply: Screwing someone over intentionally when there is an option to not screw them over. Period. Personal gain, spite, doesn't matter. Revenge (vengeance) is an exception. The act of revenge must be less than or equal to the recipients wrongdoing in order to not be evil. Sodomy is not evil. Rape is. Murder is evil. Eye for an eye is not.
Here's a simple shot at explaining who needs to be taken off the face of the earth. Rapists, Murders (cold blooded), and those who take from society and cause destruction of peace, destruction of the prosperity of others, and create imbalance in the planets resources. There. Simple and effective. All of those kinds of people can be gotten rid of and it would help our planet drastically. The cons of getting rid of those people are strictly super-ethical, which super-ethics transcend even logic.
morals change along with our environments yes, but those changes have to be either relative to survival (or indifferent such as rituals) so something like murder and rape will be counter effective to survival that is why it would be unlikely to be accepted unless in war. However older religions (older that 1000 years) are an outdated moral system that do not fit in our society and are in fact immoral. its amazing to how many things natural selection applies
I had to pause at NAZZI xD .... wow... they always talk about Poor old Hitler. ~sigh~ They never talk about the constant kiling from the romans to enforce thier religion... anyway (PLAY). Yaaawn next video.... I've seen enough moral stuff.
His logic is flawed simply because it's directed at atheists and not the Human race in general. The idea of good and evil is an abstract opinion and varies by definition. Racism in the U.S. is usually perpetrated by extreme Christians who disregard the teachings of their faith, another example would be extremest Muslims who believe in conversion or death. Maybe theists should take care of their own before they tout their moral superiority first.
Evil is whatever makes a god upset. For example, not worshipping or tickling the fancy of the gods Yahweh and Allah is very evil- so evil that it's worth torturing you for eternity for that alone. Evil doers may come across good and bad experiences in their life time like good people, but in the end they will pay- which means those being oppressed needn't fight back as the gods will sort them out!
Even if god were like Stalin, disobeying god's command to kill non-believers=EVIL!
What is evil is a 50+ year old man marring a 6 six year old girl (Ashia) and having sex with her at 9 years of age. Muhammad was a paedophile, end of story full stop.
Funny how southern United States racism, and rape, is used as an example of an immoral act according to society. How evil does the Bible explain such acts are? Oh, wait...
evil cannot be defined. evile is not defined by society, it just is. this leads to the conclusion that all your arguments are invalid. and this includes the athesit you were responding to. athesist have different stances becuase we do not follow an institution and alot of atheists are afraid to say the truth wich is there is no evil and all percetion is only that.
Evil is an abstract concept and you're just playing semantics trying to sidestep the real question that was posed. If you really do not understand it, then perhaps it could be rephrased in this manner: why are there so many things in the universe that are detrimental to human beings? Why is there pain, suffering, fear, trauma? These things undeniably exist and since they do then either god allows them to exist, he cannot remove them, or very simply god himself doesn't exist.
Alvin Plantinga's free will defense argument is the answer to the Evil argument. Google it or look it up in wikipedia, as it explains the argument very well.
im very intreseted in ur argument, but the only issue i have is that u increase the sprectrum of "society". u metion nazi's and try to argue that while their society said it was okay to kill jews, it is still evil. wrong. it is evil according to UR standards of society. so the nazis killing jews is not evil.... to nazi germans living during that period.its no diffrent than a radical islamist, notice the radical, blowing themselves up and believe then will go to heaven.
b) anything someone does to benefit themselves at the cost of others.
These are very similar, but basically morals can be determined through logic alone.
To get morals from some kind of Moral Giver (aka god) brings the exact problem you touch on in this video - just because god supports slavery, murder and overall treats one nation better than all others doesn't mean its a good thing to do.
I doubt any atheist with a brain understands that evil is defined by laws and collective norms. No matter what an isolated society accepts as correct, it has nothing to do with evil. If in the US south it was socially acceptable to lynch blacks, it makes no difference as to whether it was good or evil.
Here's evil: the god of the Old Testament sending plagues to Egypt because he was a racist. The god of the OT demanding Abraham to kill his son. The god of the OT basically being a psychopath.
Use whatever definition of evil you want since evil is simply the assessment that something is undesirable, morally or otherwise.
If God were so perfect, he certainly would know the flaws he gave us and how we'd act beforehand before damning us to eternal torture, and he'd know how cruel nature is. He has no excuse aside from nonexistence or ineptitude.
The logical contradictions remain. Theists just like to blithely ignore them.
Furthermore, don't even pull the bullshit "God works in mysterious ways" line. Saying this is pretty much an admission of ignorance and that the theist is no more enlightened than anybody else.
Which is to say that they need to shut up and stop trying to make their assinine moral pronouncements.
You answered the question yourself, "you atheists have a problem giving a consistent answer to what is evil".
Evil is subjective, fact. Would I consider drawing a cartoon of a man named Mohammed evil? Absolutely not. You, a Muslim (?), on the other hand may consider it an evil worth killing for. An act I would consider evil.
All humans are born with inbuilt moral boundaries, the rest are learnt based upon the society in which we live. This is a fact. I trust you know what a meme is?
I see subjective evil as evil according to a person, not a society, and I wouldn't generalise all atheists as not all atheists share identical ideas about everything, just saying you do say "you" as if your point is addressing any atheist who may be watching.
i still see no problem with it.... what the Nazis did was ok to them but when a society is forced to submit their ideologues go into hiracuial struction i.e. America won the war therefore they had to back off then the standard of morality was upheld by the concenciss of the moral standard on which to judge right and wrong..
This is a very long-winded video, but it fails because all people recognise that certain acts and events are undesirable. Even if one accepts moral relativism, which not everyone does, evil is a workable label for these undesirable acts and events. The existence of these acts and events is the problem for a good god, no matter what we use to define that evil, or that different people do have different lists. Worse, that different people can have different definitions of evil is a problem.
This is a very long-winded way to present the 'no objective morality' argument.
Believers in a God believe in an absolute morality given by that god... so, the inconsistency is between the 'evil' in the world created by and overseen by that god - and that god's own definition of evil.
As an athiest I don't belive in evil as a concept. No one does 'evil' it is always justified to themself.
Even if its I hate them and so must hurt them. Or my rise to power is important enough to lie to the people. They don't have souls so we are allowed to trade them as slaves. I hurt so I will make others hurt.
Not nice but justifiable to some people (don't forget insanity)
Its why the best villians in fiction have belivable motives. Evil for the sake of evil doesn't exist in reality.
I find it odd in these debates where people go "stalin was bad therefore athiests are wrong." and its countered by "pedofile prests and the crusades". Because the existance of God is either true for everyone or no one.
Consiquently we come to God allows evil to exist. Problematic for religious people.
Or evolution sometimes throws up a wrongen. Not a problem for athiests as their belief system is based on what is. "good" as we arbitrally define it normally helps the group but it is a trend.
No, evil is not the problem of atheism. Evil is the problem of a god that is supposedly good, but fails to or outright refuses to stop it. If God is inherently good, why did he make us so that we would fall short of his standards no matter what we did? Why did he make some people evil? Because if God created everything, then he created evil as well, and that would make him an evil being.
Evil is subjective. Persecution and murder were accepted in the society of Nazi Germany, yes. However, people looking back condemn this view of evil, which is our subjective view of it. They had their view, and we have ours, it's constantly changing. No one is saying murder is ok just because a society says it is, we're just saying that is what they defined it as, whether they were right or wrong is entirely up to the person looking at it. They were 'technically evil' by our view point.
Hi sami. I was wondering about your thought on two things:
1) firstly we could reformulate the problem of evil using a non-moral term e.g. suffering (Problem of gratuitous suffering). I mean many atheistic philosophers of religion do just that.
2) another way to bypass this problem is that we could use your standard of evil and say that existence of evil (as u define it) contradicts with god (as u define his nature) so here problem of evil would show that your belief is self contradictory.
Poorly presented worn out overly refuted argumentation. Is there any point in this long marathon of fallacious philosophical argumentation that you still feel holds water?
Evil is that which intentionally causes unecessary harm to humans. what is harm? harm is that's which we NATURALLY don't want as humans (regardless of culture) like hunger, thurst, pain, violence, fear, insecurity, axiety ,not having access to resources, or not beeing able to procreate, or to access knowledge...etc these are empirically deductable facts about humans nothing subjective about them.
@iParadox1989 actually many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources. :)
@SamiZaatari So you disagree with your statement about many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources? Those were your words right?
@SamiZaatari So you disagree with your statement that many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources. These are your words right? This comes from the source statement stating that Society would never deem murder as acceptable because that would be counterproductive to it's stabilization.
But those societies didn't work. And that is why their ideas on what was socially accepted didn't work. They 'burned out' as it were. Hence your talking bollocks again!
@iParadox1989 The point that he made was not whether or not society would ever deem murder as acceptable, bur rather, he said "if" which is a hypothetical form, "IF society deemed murder ok, by atheists' standards, it would not be wrong. So, stop trying to avoid the answer and rebuttal to your atheistic beliefs.
@songwriter4artists No, it would not be ok by atheists. Atheists, if you aren't aware, are people as well. We have interest in sustaining society just like anyone else.
Also, there is no such thing as "atheistic beliefS". Being an atheist only requires one thing and one thing ONLY - not believing in god.
Andmight I add -- Theists like you readily condone eternal punishment (worse then murder) for a finite crime. So who's really hateful here?
@webhutspain Again, an undeveloped fetus in not a healthy human. If what you are saying did happen, that's great. But that does not mean that the fetus was a healthy human when it was born (even though it became one due to advances in medicine). The implication of your argument is that everything that has even a potential to be a human, even sperm, should be treated equally.
@iParadox1989 Why does my argument imply that I would treat sperm equally. That is an assumption you make, and a wrong one at that. Should we kill people who are on dialysis machines, because they are not healthy humans? At what point should a human decide that another human is not worthy of life? A baby has it's own blood which does not mix with that of it's mother, it lives off the placenta - metaphorically the mother is merely the incubator or the dialysis machine that keeps someone alive.
perhaps the best definition of evil, is something you find so repugnant you not only get angry thinking about it, but fearful of it at the same time
of course, that means my arachnophobia kind of makes me biased, but I said the best definition, not a good one, perhaps "least bad" is a better term for it
as I said though, I find the term fairly useless, I reserve it for fantasy games and so on because they run off that kind of thing, the DnD alignment system for instance
even then I don't use the term evil really, it just doesn't seem like a useful term to me
I really mean it, it's always confused me why people insist on using the term, I've never bothered to
sorry if it's hard to explain, but there you go, I see things as desirable and undesirable personally, and come from a functionality/utility/completely "true or untrue" approach
it gets me in trouble a lot, so I know I'm not the norm, but there you go, to me, my "religion" is "truth" whatever it may be
@noobler9 hmmm, using the term truth, and saying I worship it, or make a religion out of it might be the wrong thing to do... but as far as I can tell, my basic idea is that the truth is the truth and I want to know it as best as possible, and run through what various claims are and try to match it up with my experiences as best as possible, AND figuring out what works best with my overall views as developed thus far some things are stupid, useless, destructive
personally, I find the term evil, is primarily rooted in black and white thinking, and world view models that are flawed and oversimplistic so my definition of evil is the big black knight with fiery glowing eyes and a nasty shrieking voice and stuff that's scary, oh and he has ugly weapons instead of bright gleaming swords
yea, it's campy, but I kind of don't have a use for the term except for that, and to try to denounce someone/group/action REALLY heavily as unpleasant, "to everyone"
YOU DO KNOW THAT HITLER KILLED IN THE NAME OF YOUR CHRISTIAN GOD? RIGHT?
S4ukk0 1 week ago
Earthquakes suck. For everyone. If god created the earth as it is, he is a dick.
TaoTeChing00 2 weeks ago
Might is Right, and Might Makes Right. Even your God, in the Bible, shows that.
PangoliaDogg15 3 weeks ago
There is no such thing as Objective Evil. Evil is in the instincts of the Subjectivity of the Individual. So is good.
The only kind of "Objective Evil" that I see valid, is observable behaviour that goes against The Harm Principle. And even The Harm Principle only exists in the Subjectivity of some people.
PangoliaDogg15 3 weeks ago
I couldn't listen to the whole video, your issue with the problem of evil is hella easy to resolve. In religion, evil is already defined, "sin", so, if this god thinks it is bad, why does it exist? To a god, in general, this god has great affection, esp. to its creation, and would not create or allow evil.
Bourtini 1 month ago
@Bourtini Just needed to elaborate on a god, in general: evil is a concept, but it describes something that is immoral and/or malevolent. You are confused by the idea of relativity and immoral, yet it is not relative in considering the quality of a benevolent god, which would have the desire of perfecting the lives of its creation and not allow anything that is conflicting with that to exist.
Bourtini 1 month ago
Atheism's big problem is religion...It just feels wrong to us how something so blatantly void of merit could still hold any credibility at all. Really, it's so obvious to atheists what an illogical, self-defeating sham it all is...It's actually depressing, as it makes me think the majority of humanity are mindless, unevolved children.
rogan71 1 month ago 2
HAHAHAHAHAHA. This guy believes atheists condone Nazi Germany. Jesus focking christ dude read a book. Get educated. Try to be 'OBJECTIVE' you fucking dolt. You are a disgrace to the human race.
wuharold00 1 month ago
clarifyin an obvious misunderstanding here ,to end with this nonsense goin on about what is evil ,religion created this concept,etc... evil is just a term that we theists DON'T usually use concerning natural disaster but we use it in a sense of a person killin another person.atheists say "natural disasters is accordin 2 u theists is evil so ur so called "God" is evil" breakin the pillars of morals of which my religion stands upon consequently "THERE IS NO GOD" n its stupid to think there is one
HIMAZZZ1991 1 month ago
Go blow something up you Jew.
neomysterio 1 month ago
Can I ask why you are so obsessed with disproving the beliefs of other men? You seem to spend so much of your precious time on such a worthless argument...
es696 2 months ago
@es696 This is how these people work. They secretly understand how completely insane they sound, but are unwilling to admit they are wrong. So, they go on a huge tirade feverishly trying to prove everyone else wrong by going "CAUSE GOD SAID SO" and standing back with a big moronic grin on their face, confidently assured they have pleased their invisible overlord with this act of sheer stupidity. I see no future for mankind as long as these people are allowed to exist.
tlucentefl 1 month ago
Evil is a word which is commonly used to describe actions or people which cause harm to others.
RationalConclusion 2 months ago
@RationalConclusion That's far too broad a definition. Do you consider a man who defends his family with force from armed criminals to be "evil"?
tlucentefl 1 month ago
@tlucentefl Of course not. I would have thought that went without saying.
RationalConclusion 1 month ago
No one is saying the examples you say is right or ok! Just stating the definition has nothing to do with that. And even if it was, where were the church during the slavery or the time of the nazis? quite passive I should say...There are nothing called evil...bad or good moral maybe but evil...nope.
QRS666 2 months ago
What about cutting off a orphans hands because he stole some food out off hunger.
That's okay as your society deems it acceptable.
MrSofasurf 2 months ago
17 minute response??? Damn... wasting 30 seconds (or less) to type this here already seems like a total waste of time.
666ragnarok666 2 months ago
"Greetings to everybody, now, in my last video, I showed you how to lure children at playgrounds with nothing more than a lollypop. This time, I'll be tutoring the more intellectual stuff, like actual penetration and covering up your tracks from parents."
Go wash yourself, I can smell your sweaty ballsack through my monitor, you piece of shit :-).
trapfman 2 months ago
You need a lesson in reasoning.
Evil is cultural. we NOW view killing and rape as evil, but in 200 maybe THEY view it as not evil. That does NOT change what we think of it NOW. You do understand that if cultures change, so does what is acceptable? And it does not change history :/ If in 200 years rape is acceptable, does that change what we view as evil now?
The society that you live in shapes your mind, and so shapes your morals.
SIC66SIC66 2 months ago
Evil and good are subjective , it depends on culture and other factors , penis mutilation for religion reason is evil for me , but for jews is a good thing , all is relative .
EdyMar77 2 months ago
"since atheist's can't really give a proper consistent response as to what evil is."
Now this is really weak, as I haven't heard one consistent view from the religious either, even though they have the same book(s) they cannot agree. Which isn't weird either because even religious books are not consistent. Nevertheless, I don't need an instruction book to ask for allowance to do good and a lot of what is in the religious books could easily be pointed out to be evil, such as the flooding.
Hirnlego999 2 months ago
Did you attend physics lessons in your school? You seem to be struggling with understanding what relative means. Nazi are evil in our society, communists were evil in fascist Germany, American imperialists were evil in Soviet Russia, etc. There is no fixed frame of reference in space-time and there is no absolute system of values. And just like physicists learned how to live with their "problem" so did many atheists.
27182818284590452354 2 months ago
Wake up! my brainwashed-bearded friend, religion holds nothing good for our world.
lanuevagranada 3 months ago 9
@lanuevagranada Yes, religion, people who are in a group that think they are better than others, I agree that those are bad, but I do believe in God, and I have thought allot about it and all the time it's just more obvious to me that God exists, I believe that people should have the free will that GOD himself gave to us to believe what we choose,
neoman121 2 months ago
@lanuevagranada and we should not say that someone is stupid for believing something different, we don't have to agree with everyone else, but that is no reason to tell them they are going to hell, God is SO infinite compared to us that we can't comprehend him, and based on this alone there can't be a single person that exists who can claim that they know 100% what God thinks and what he wants. Thanks for reading!
neoman121 2 months ago
Atheists are probably more moraly honest and honestly good than any religious people there, We are not good because we are especting some bull shit in the other life, we are good because it is born within un being good, you Religious people are good, mostly because you have an interest in that. THERE.
lanuevagranada 3 months ago
@lanuevagranada
There's no 'probably' about it. Stats bear it out. Atheists commit fewer crimes.
AndyR2009 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Oh yeah I almost forgot - there is also no such thing as SIN. (that's a Christian fabrication)
wonbyamile 3 months ago
There is no such thing as EVIL. Just like there is no such thing as the DEVIL.
People who enjoy inflicting pain and all so called evil deeds is due in part to nurture(the way you were brought up and things that happen to you in life) and nature (which means you are predisposed to those things by your brain make-up)
wonbyamile 3 months ago
Your source of morals are just as subjective as those of atheists. Your holy book was written by men whose morals were subjective. Unless you can prove that your imaginary friend actually exists, your morals are not only subjective but horribly outdated. Besides, it is asinine to think that just because we cannot justify morality in the way a mathematical theorem can be justified all states of being are therefore indistinguishable. That is, being burned alive is just as good or bad as no pain.
dXoverdteqprogress 4 months ago
So if a society deems something as okay despite it being evil from our perspective, that's a big problem for atheists? What about God deeming something to be okay despite it being evil from our perspective?
phocjame 4 months ago
The real problem is that is an issue for people...Worry about your own life asshole ..Leave people alone in there beliefs or non-beliefs
cruiseplatoon 5 months ago
@cruiseplatoon Problem with that line of thinking is that other peoples' beliefs will necessarily intersect with your own - therefore you have to worry about others' beliefs lest your own be affected by them.
phocjame 4 months ago
you are a jew evil does not concern us, ave israel
Pesterjester 3 months ago
Religions BIG Problem, Stupidity
tilemacro 5 months ago
Evil can simply be defined as an action that denigrates, disrupts or destroys human progress and thus endangers the human race. Nature functions as a “higher authority”. Further natural selection has constantly favoured behaviour that is beneficial for the survival of humans. Since cooperation is the key to human success, evolution has hard-wired us with a disgust towards detrimental behaviour like murder, theft and falsehood.
lukashoermann 5 months ago
@lukashoermann Today we can use scientific means to determine beneficial an unfavourable actions.
For instance: Every sane person would agree, that sticking needles into children is evil. If it is a life-saving injection the same act is good.
In every case an accurate definition can be made by studying the effects of an action. It follows that the definition of EVIL changes according to human progress and the relationship with nature.
lukashoermann 5 months ago
Your intellect shames the human race
hypock1 5 months ago
you look rabbi if u wear black hat and black overcoat and hold taurat :)
saaramalik 5 months ago
You really should look up Nazi-germany a bit more before using it in arguments ;) there where soooooooooo not ok by the german population, but they where to scared to rebel because they wud be killed..
DagmanNG 5 months ago
I can easily describe evil. Breaking MY morale laws! And while everyone have different morale laws everyone have different descriptions of evil :) And oh yeah, the bible is evil, its pro-murder and mayhem!
DagmanNG 5 months ago
Look in the dictionary. Evil, for the meaning look up God
LLOYD19851012 6 months ago
ok stop you made 2 in the begining of this points there the first was basicly that cause we might not know an answer to a question means that were evil NO NO NO were willing to admit we dont know and keep looking for a solid answer the second is that just because its the social means that its ok thats not we atheism is about at all. you make a claim there is a god with no evidence that we can see and we reject that consept thats it
Xlivesforever 6 months ago
Evil in the form of pubes on your face?
yodellikeyoumeanit09 6 months ago
@yodellikeyoumeanit09
his beard isn't even that messy...
skatetennis123 6 months ago
Evil is a word we use to distance ourselves from actions we find so deplorable we have to make the person/persons seem less human than ourselves.
It's an abstraction like many other terms.
auritone 6 months ago
Evil is defined by the individual, you don't seem to get that.
If someone thinks to himself "a nice bloody killing-spree would certainly perk up my weekend", then he'd go out, pop a few people off and bathe in their blood, to me (and hopefully anyone who's reading this) that seems evil, but he'd probably think of it as nothing but a bit of fun.
To the Nazi's what they did was okay but to me it's pretty damn fucked up.
Also, this video has absolutely nothing at all to do with atheism.
JonBj2 6 months ago
@SinkaSurto ;)
SamiZaatari 6 months ago
@SinkaSurto i'm a hole?
SamiZaatari 6 months ago
I feel I should correct some possible misunderstandings from my earlier comments. First off, I am not, I repeat NOT trying to justify the holocaust, or killing in general. I am only giving a plausible explanation for why sometimes humans find killing acceptable and why sometimes we don't. Of course there are many other reasons that people may kill, but it seems safe to assume that (in this example) the entire German civilian population was not clinically mentally ill.
Chamiletchisonai 7 months ago
YOU ARE A HOLE. Evil has nothing to do with athiesm. Your trying to be an intellectual to hard my friend and sounding like a complete twat in the process, atheists just have a mind of there own and do not require a god or some religious fruit cake to tell them right from wrong. We dont believe in god because it dosent make sense. evil is just causing someone physical or mental pain for own gain or amusment/pleasure. yopur taking it into past events witch always boil down to my answer.
CraigRidley1 7 months ago 23
This has been flagged as spam show
@CraigRidley1 watch thiswww.youtube.com/watch?v=zDHJ4ztnldQ
CraigRidley1 7 months ago
@CraigRidley1 i'm a hole?
SamiZaatari 7 months ago
@SamiZaatari sorry was just pissed because im an evil atheiest, my bad.
CraigRidley1 6 months ago
@SamiZaatari Notice how he avoids the entire statement and chooses to pick out the random comment out of context? This is what they all do. Then they make a video about how they never see a "CONCLUSIVE" answer. Well here it is, in front of your face. You can't avoid it, you've accepted it being there, and now, you have shown everyone what a coward you are. Good day cunt.
i6o4 5 months ago
@SamiZaatari Yes
max2right 5 months ago
@SamiZaatari Evil is a word created by religion to describe the darker side of nature, not just human nature, every human has the potential to do good things, and bad things, this isn't caused by Adam eating an apple thousands of years ago, but instead the experiences you've had in life, for example if a child sees another child of a different skin colour for the first time, some tend to be very abrupt with questions, does this make them racist? no, they just haven't been taught...
Torcaski 2 months ago
@SamiZaatari ... What's acceptable and what isn't, the same goes for many similar matters, so there you go, an easy explanation of what you perceive to be "evil" from a random guy on the internet, yet you claim Atheists have a problem answering it?
Torcaski 2 months ago
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@SamiZaatari Sami, EVERYONE is an atheist including yourself. You have to share the planet with other believers in other gods which carries the same believability as yours! So you (and everyone else) IS in fact an athiest to those gods that you think is inferior and invalid compared to the one you believe in. Atheists like myself just believe in one less than you!
talover403 2 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@SamiZaatari i agree about him calling you an A hole you know why ? cause your defending a murderer and a child rapist and your talking about slaves yet your prophet had many slaves and you talk about nazis well your prophet was a nazi also if not worse ...until this day hes killing people and hes a jew hater and a racist and the quran is just full of hatred homie >>so please wake up and stop deceiving people
HizboAllat2 2 days ago
@CraigRidley1 and what you believe makes sense? bible has prophecy down to the tee! have u studied it to say its bogus? like fully study it? probably not cause u dont care. you have to spend thousands of hours to understand and i can tell you know u havent read it to understand it. i can show you many bible prophecies that explain detailed information of past and present century.
MIGAVELI 6 months ago
@MIGAVELI i can understand that the teachings of jesus christ are a good thing and that the guy did have his heart in the right place and was able to get a large following, i just dont believe he had anything to do with the so called god. for me god is just a ? that know one knows anything about including jesus christ.
CraigRidley1 6 months ago
@CraigRidley1 Today it is a social norm to have a police state and pass bills contradicting the constitution of a just and speedy trial. It is a social norm to do have binge drinking causing death to young adults. It is social norm to have sex outside of marriage causing STD to spread rampantly. It is a social norm to have slave wages and lend money on interest which most people find it difficult to meet their expenses and put food on their table.
going2sleep 2 months ago
You are only partly correct when you say that killing Jews and other minorities became the social "norm" in Nazi Germany. It was the norm in the sense that the leaders of the Nazi party wanted to make it normal, but there are some basic evolutionary aspects that make this more complicated than it appears. Competition for resources would have made it acceptable to kill rivals, and thus boost your own chances of survival. However, killing other members of your own species (continued)
Chamiletchisonai 7 months ago
@Chamiletchisonai inherently reduces the available gene pool; kill enough humans, and pretty soon humans will go extinct. The decision of whether or not to kill individuls or small groups is based on a) can we afford to lose their genetic material and b) will I/my tribe benefit from the lack of competition. TheRipcity22 was basically right in saying that the root of killing is a "tribe mentality" that urges us to eliminate competitors for resources and potential mates.
Chamiletchisonai 7 months ago
Defining evil is straightforward. It's the opposite of good. Define what good is, and you're done. Good is only meaningful in terms of that which achieves a goal. If good didn't accomplish anything, how could it be good? I choose my highest goal as my own life. On a fundamental level, you have to choose to value either life or death, and I choose life. Therefore, that which is inimical to my life is evil, and what promotes it is good.
ShellsOnTheFloor 7 months ago
@ShellsOnTheFloor So to give an example, killing is evil because it's impossible to say my life has value while someone else's doesn't. You can't justify that, it makes no sense. So killing someone implicitly asserts that human life is worthless, and that goes against my standard of valuing my own life.
To say that evil is evil because God says so is just ridiculous. There's not even evidence that he exists, and even if he did, which God are you gonna follow? :P
ShellsOnTheFloor 7 months ago
Sociopathic charlatan!!!
RaynorGo 7 months ago
I'm begining to think that Sami talks intently with his webcam because it's the only thing he can find that shuts up long enough to let him finish his word vomit without laughing or debunking his childish arguments.
MrTheglovner 7 months ago
I can only lol at this guy. His agruments are filled with so many logical holes and loops that he never makes a point and just simply jabbers around the real point.
Lucasson112 7 months ago
Sir you are an idiot. The "Problem of Evil" is a straw man fallacy. Evil is an issue created by religion not a real thing, Satan is evil, God created satan, ergo God created Evil. Atheists do not define evil because there is nothing to define.
MrArokOleary 7 months ago
Even people quoting the same scriptures come up with contradictory values. You have to remember that the slaveholders won all of the Bible-quoting contests (using the Jewish Bible as well as the New Testament). Also we also don't now stone unruly children or do any number of barbaric practices as the Bible prescribes. The Bible didn't itself change, but people's interpretation of it did. How else would someone get their morality if not from this bizarre revelation?
txvoltaire 8 months ago
atheism is nothing but nonsense.
they r a lost bunch.
they r totally lost, directionless.
nafism6969 8 months ago
@nafism6969
I'm at home, not lost at all.
You're lost, you'll never be able to see the true beauty in the world because your view is so clouded by infantile myths, I feel sorry for you. You're like a child who lacks curiosity, you'll never learn anything and your existence will be nothing but a detriment to humanity.
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
@TheRipcity22 oh please, if u only new the joy I have from being a muslim, u would fight me for it with ur swords and guns.
now go be curious and learn how to balance a budget somewhere else.
nafism6969 7 months ago
Comment removed
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
@nafism6969
The fact that I'm the smartest, most attractive and most creative man who's ever lived also brings me great joy,, It's also based on nothing other than my wanting it to be true , just like you being a Muslim.
You should start being curious, after all, you're the adult who believes in laughably stupid fairy tales.
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
@TheRipcity22 the only thing laughable was ur comment beating ur chest harder than king kong.
so u think Pharoah was a fairy tale? the splitting of the moon was a fairy tale? pregnancy and conception a fairy tale? the water cycle is a fairy tale? the creation of the universe is a fairy tale? living and dying is a fairy tale?
oops, look who im asking, someone that thinks he is the worlds best LOL.
pls.
nafism6969 7 months ago
@nafism6969
If you're too stupid to understand my comments, there's no point debating you.
My point was that the desire for something to be true has no effect on whether or not it is true.
Pharaohs existed, what exactly are you asking?
the splitting of the moon ? haha! really?
Water cycle?
You're a bumbling idiot, no point wasting tine on you.,
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
@TheRipcity22 im not after a debate. iv got better things to do. but if im a bumbling idiot, u should jump on the opportunity to humiliate me.
nafism6969 7 months ago
@nafism6969
You humiliate yourself. Splitting the moon? There really is no point responding to someone who is dumb enough to believe that.
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
@TheRipcity22 whatever. u cant responsond anyway cause u have ur head in ur ass and all u can c is shit.
nafism6969 7 months ago
@nafism6969
Brilliant retort!
I was sure wrong about you.
TheRipcity22 7 months ago
Well, in this case. If in future social norm would be killing- it wouldn't be evil to them. But it is and would be evil from our perspective. Its simple: Views change... Thats all.
Drago19930713 8 months ago
But of course, good and evil are very subjective terms.
unlyckystrike 8 months ago
So how does it feel trying to be the muslim-edition of Pat Condell? Must be pretty funny or what? lol :)
unlyckystrike 8 months ago
marrying a 6 years old child is ok
killing innocent homosexuals is ok
killing people who give up Islam faith is ok
so on and so forth
this is what Islam is
we don't need religions, we need law
tussude 8 months ago
I base my morality on how I want to be treated. In my opinion, an act towards another is "moral" if it encourages reciprocal behaviour that benefits me/makes me feel good somehow, and "immoral" if it encourages reciprocal behaviour that disadvantages me or leaves me in a worse position.
For the record, not all Atheists have a position on the "does god exist" question. Agnostic Atheists, for example, do not hold a position, for neither yes nor no can be proven.
adspadoublea 8 months ago
"An it harm non, do what thou wilt."
seeqer66 8 months ago
An action is "evil" if it increases the amount of suffering in the world or decreases the amount of happiness in the world.
-A Friendly Atheist-
evzt3 8 months ago
There's no such thing as evil, or good. They are just labels we put on actions that we like or dislike, and it's relative to our genetic instincts and environment. Problem solved.
Ledwix 8 months ago
Genocide is always bad, as there is no perceivable good coming from it, and the ultimate bad on the other hand. Eradication in general only is good when the value of the eradicated is miniscule compared to the number the eradicated would kill. Smallpox, for instance. As my earlier post said, good and bad are objective in terms of aspects. But the whole is somewhat subjective, though many things (like killing without any increase in life to balance it) are obviously objectively bad.
Enginmaster 9 months ago
Evil is willful bad. When you want bad, and you do bad because of that, it's evil. Badness is something that causes lower quality or quantity of life, and is totally objective. Goodness is something that causes higher quality or quantity of life, and is totally objective. When you balance how much goodness vs how much badness there is (balance is subjective) tells you if it's good or bad. Raping hurts someone way more than it makes someone else happy, as genocide kills more than it saves.
Enginmaster 9 months ago
There is no evil - only opinion.
judgewest2000 9 months ago
After we divide ourselves into "tribes" we then set off to dehumanize those who aren't in the tribe. Germany dehumanized Jews, even during the height of the War Germans were still lawful when interacting with each other because they were in the tribe. So the problem is back in your court Sami. Once we realize that all of humanity is in the "tribe" we'll see no more war. That won't happen while adults believe in childish fairy tales and kill each other over it, Time to grow up Sami.
TheRipcity22 9 months ago 27
Sami , like most theists, can't seem to wrap his mind around the fact that there are no absolutes. Stealing is wrong 99% of the time. Murder is wrong 99% of the time etc,While Germany deemed Jew hatred kosher in the 30-40's it did not make it less "evil". Humanity as a whole determines this, that's why these are "crimes against humanity". It should be pointed out that tribalism, the type which theism inevitably leads to, is to blame for nearly every atrocity mankind has ever inflicted on itself.
TheRipcity22 9 months ago
Don't make a video about 1 idiot's definition of evil. Evil is simply: Screwing someone over intentionally when there is an option to not screw them over. Period. Personal gain, spite, doesn't matter. Revenge (vengeance) is an exception. The act of revenge must be less than or equal to the recipients wrongdoing in order to not be evil. Sodomy is not evil. Rape is. Murder is evil. Eye for an eye is not.
fundles420 9 months ago
Here's a simple shot at explaining who needs to be taken off the face of the earth. Rapists, Murders (cold blooded), and those who take from society and cause destruction of peace, destruction of the prosperity of others, and create imbalance in the planets resources. There. Simple and effective. All of those kinds of people can be gotten rid of and it would help our planet drastically. The cons of getting rid of those people are strictly super-ethical, which super-ethics transcend even logic.
MasteroChieftan 9 months ago
morals change along with our environments yes, but those changes have to be either relative to survival (or indifferent such as rituals) so something like murder and rape will be counter effective to survival that is why it would be unlikely to be accepted unless in war. However older religions (older that 1000 years) are an outdated moral system that do not fit in our society and are in fact immoral. its amazing to how many things natural selection applies
Netruic 10 months ago
I had to pause at NAZZI xD .... wow... they always talk about Poor old Hitler. ~sigh~ They never talk about the constant kiling from the romans to enforce thier religion... anyway (PLAY). Yaaawn next video.... I've seen enough moral stuff.
Charlymaumushi 11 months ago
Moral and ethics existed LONG before religion stole these ideas and tried to pretend they OWNED these ideas.
Try again Sami.
YOU FAIL
MrTruthAddict 11 months ago
Evil is any act that puts personal gain/desire above the good of the society.
macgeek2004 11 months ago
His logic is flawed simply because it's directed at atheists and not the Human race in general. The idea of good and evil is an abstract opinion and varies by definition. Racism in the U.S. is usually perpetrated by extreme Christians who disregard the teachings of their faith, another example would be extremest Muslims who believe in conversion or death. Maybe theists should take care of their own before they tout their moral superiority first.
secretagentchrisr 11 months ago
Evil is whatever makes a god upset. For example, not worshipping or tickling the fancy of the gods Yahweh and Allah is very evil- so evil that it's worth torturing you for eternity for that alone. Evil doers may come across good and bad experiences in their life time like good people, but in the end they will pay- which means those being oppressed needn't fight back as the gods will sort them out!
Even if god were like Stalin, disobeying god's command to kill non-believers=EVIL!
therock27374 1 year ago
What is evil is a 50+ year old man marring a 6 six year old girl (Ashia) and having sex with her at 9 years of age. Muhammad was a paedophile, end of story full stop.
krissyeh 1 year ago
Funny how southern United States racism, and rape, is used as an example of an immoral act according to society. How evil does the Bible explain such acts are? Oh, wait...
kingmystyk 1 year ago
evil cannot be defined. evile is not defined by society, it just is. this leads to the conclusion that all your arguments are invalid. and this includes the athesit you were responding to. athesist have different stances becuase we do not follow an institution and alot of atheists are afraid to say the truth wich is there is no evil and all percetion is only that.
MrNinjaSpartan 1 year ago
So evil is subjective?
What a suprise...
IiiERT 1 year ago
evil is just self pleasure/selfishness, usually at the expense of others
You can see that in the 7 deadly sins
thefancysticks 1 year ago
brother sami, i think i understand the morality of atheists, read something about utilitarianism i hope it will help you
salam
MrPathanStyle 1 year ago
Evil is an abstract concept and you're just playing semantics trying to sidestep the real question that was posed. If you really do not understand it, then perhaps it could be rephrased in this manner: why are there so many things in the universe that are detrimental to human beings? Why is there pain, suffering, fear, trauma? These things undeniably exist and since they do then either god allows them to exist, he cannot remove them, or very simply god himself doesn't exist.
carlsberg24 1 year ago
I congratulate you Sami for your efforts.
I would like to share with you a great website that discusses Atheism, the problem of Evil, God etc
here it is: logical proof . net
Pinkcowdesigns 1 year ago
Alvin Plantinga's free will defense argument is the answer to the Evil argument. Google it or look it up in wikipedia, as it explains the argument very well.
TheShmakser 1 year ago
does this guy look crazy,i bet hes a christian...
puncho33 1 year ago
im very intreseted in ur argument, but the only issue i have is that u increase the sprectrum of "society". u metion nazi's and try to argue that while their society said it was okay to kill jews, it is still evil. wrong. it is evil according to UR standards of society. so the nazis killing jews is not evil.... to nazi germans living during that period.its no diffrent than a radical islamist, notice the radical, blowing themselves up and believe then will go to heaven.
mgs4227 1 year ago
Evil is anything that:
a) brings an overall detriment to society
b) anything someone does to benefit themselves at the cost of others.
These are very similar, but basically morals can be determined through logic alone.
To get morals from some kind of Moral Giver (aka god) brings the exact problem you touch on in this video - just because god supports slavery, murder and overall treats one nation better than all others doesn't mean its a good thing to do.
Plausiblesarge 1 year ago
@SamiZaatari
Great Job Brother Keep it Up!!
:)
akib89 1 year ago
I doubt any atheist with a brain understands that evil is defined by laws and collective norms. No matter what an isolated society accepts as correct, it has nothing to do with evil. If in the US south it was socially acceptable to lynch blacks, it makes no difference as to whether it was good or evil.
Here's evil: the god of the Old Testament sending plagues to Egypt because he was a racist. The god of the OT demanding Abraham to kill his son. The god of the OT basically being a psychopath.
1971ojoalparche1971 1 year ago
Use whatever definition of evil you want since evil is simply the assessment that something is undesirable, morally or otherwise.
If God were so perfect, he certainly would know the flaws he gave us and how we'd act beforehand before damning us to eternal torture, and he'd know how cruel nature is. He has no excuse aside from nonexistence or ineptitude.
The logical contradictions remain. Theists just like to blithely ignore them.
dhx84 1 year ago
@dhx84
Furthermore, don't even pull the bullshit "God works in mysterious ways" line. Saying this is pretty much an admission of ignorance and that the theist is no more enlightened than anybody else.
Which is to say that they need to shut up and stop trying to make their assinine moral pronouncements.
dhx84 1 year ago
actually you stupid fucker your Quran deems slavery and genocide okay too in its context which is non believers and most all women.
ShlongOChrist 1 year ago
You answered the question yourself, "you atheists have a problem giving a consistent answer to what is evil".
Evil is subjective, fact. Would I consider drawing a cartoon of a man named Mohammed evil? Absolutely not. You, a Muslim (?), on the other hand may consider it an evil worth killing for. An act I would consider evil.
All humans are born with inbuilt moral boundaries, the rest are learnt based upon the society in which we live. This is a fact. I trust you know what a meme is?
venomfanex 1 year ago
I see subjective evil as evil according to a person, not a society, and I wouldn't generalise all atheists as not all atheists share identical ideas about everything, just saying you do say "you" as if your point is addressing any atheist who may be watching.
MrTwentington 1 year ago
i still see no problem with it.... what the Nazis did was ok to them but when a society is forced to submit their ideologues go into hiracuial struction i.e. America won the war therefore they had to back off then the standard of morality was upheld by the concenciss of the moral standard on which to judge right and wrong..
WilkoPhilip 1 year ago
This is a very long-winded video, but it fails because all people recognise that certain acts and events are undesirable. Even if one accepts moral relativism, which not everyone does, evil is a workable label for these undesirable acts and events. The existence of these acts and events is the problem for a good god, no matter what we use to define that evil, or that different people do have different lists. Worse, that different people can have different definitions of evil is a problem.
archapmangcmg 1 year ago 11
This is a very long-winded way to present the 'no objective morality' argument.
Believers in a God believe in an absolute morality given by that god... so, the inconsistency is between the 'evil' in the world created by and overseen by that god - and that god's own definition of evil.
No need for any atheist to define anything...
SAHBfan 1 year ago
whoa, in Nazi Germany that was not the social norm at all.
governator45 1 year ago
You're missing the point, by a very large margin.
lordwindowlicker 1 year ago
"Good" and "Bad" seems to be relative to necessities, whether or not the necessities are imagined or otherwise.
funkyplayer4212 1 year ago
As an athiest I don't belive in evil as a concept. No one does 'evil' it is always justified to themself.
Even if its I hate them and so must hurt them. Or my rise to power is important enough to lie to the people. They don't have souls so we are allowed to trade them as slaves. I hurt so I will make others hurt.
Not nice but justifiable to some people (don't forget insanity)
Its why the best villians in fiction have belivable motives. Evil for the sake of evil doesn't exist in reality.
Nexius8 1 year ago
I find it odd in these debates where people go "stalin was bad therefore athiests are wrong." and its countered by "pedofile prests and the crusades". Because the existance of God is either true for everyone or no one.
Consiquently we come to God allows evil to exist. Problematic for religious people.
Or evolution sometimes throws up a wrongen. Not a problem for athiests as their belief system is based on what is. "good" as we arbitrally define it normally helps the group but it is a trend.
Nexius8 1 year ago
No, evil is not the problem of atheism. Evil is the problem of a god that is supposedly good, but fails to or outright refuses to stop it. If God is inherently good, why did he make us so that we would fall short of his standards no matter what we did? Why did he make some people evil? Because if God created everything, then he created evil as well, and that would make him an evil being.
bagpipeplayer 1 year ago
Evil is subjective. Persecution and murder were accepted in the society of Nazi Germany, yes. However, people looking back condemn this view of evil, which is our subjective view of it. They had their view, and we have ours, it's constantly changing. No one is saying murder is ok just because a society says it is, we're just saying that is what they defined it as, whether they were right or wrong is entirely up to the person looking at it. They were 'technically evil' by our view point.
Desert2323 1 year ago
Hi sami. I was wondering about your thought on two things:
1) firstly we could reformulate the problem of evil using a non-moral term e.g. suffering (Problem of gratuitous suffering). I mean many atheistic philosophers of religion do just that.
2) another way to bypass this problem is that we could use your standard of evil and say that existence of evil (as u define it) contradicts with god (as u define his nature) so here problem of evil would show that your belief is self contradictory.
monsta123x 1 year ago
Poorly presented worn out overly refuted argumentation. Is there any point in this long marathon of fallacious philosophical argumentation that you still feel holds water?
FreeThinkingCrusader 1 year ago
Evil is that which intentionally causes unecessary harm to humans. what is harm? harm is that's which we NATURALLY don't want as humans (regardless of culture) like hunger, thurst, pain, violence, fear, insecurity, axiety ,not having access to resources, or not beeing able to procreate, or to access knowledge...etc these are empirically deductable facts about humans nothing subjective about them.
Ijustasking 1 year ago
Society would never deem murder as acceptable because that would be counterproductive to it's stabilization.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
@iParadox1989 actually many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources. :)
SamiZaatari 1 year ago
@SamiZaatari A few don't make a society.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
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@SamiZaatari A few don't make a society.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@SamiZaatari A few don't make a society.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
@SamiZaatari and you are ok with that Sami? Do you agree with it? Which ones need to be removed in your opinion?
talover30 1 year ago
@talover30 no one needs to be removed.
SamiZaatari 1 year ago
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@SamiZaatari So you disagree with your statement about many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources? Those were your words right?
talover30 1 year ago
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@SamiZaatari So you disagree with your statement that many people have said we need to remove most of the earths population, because it is destabilising the planet and it's resources. These are your words right? This comes from the source statement stating that Society would never deem murder as acceptable because that would be counterproductive to it's stabilization.
talover30 1 year ago
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@SamiZaatari Since you are a Muslim you should know that the Quran disagrees with you.
Stevoukos 11 months ago
@SamiZaatari
people remove them selves, we all die. the key is population control, through education ideally, more likely through regulation.
if poverty is solved, education levels will rise at same time, its natural.
that could fix itself, but it wont, because of greed.
V0nAnglesmith 8 months ago
@SamiZaatari then what is your point?
SolTetto 7 months ago
But those societies didn't work. And that is why their ideas on what was socially accepted didn't work. They 'burned out' as it were. Hence your talking bollocks again!
SolTetto 7 months ago
@SamiZaatari You mean like god will do on doomsday? I get it!
Imhornydadcomeinside 1 year ago
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@SamiZaatari If you are one of these people you are mentally retarded.
4FunPlayin 7 months ago
@iParadox1989 The point that he made was not whether or not society would ever deem murder as acceptable, bur rather, he said "if" which is a hypothetical form, "IF society deemed murder ok, by atheists' standards, it would not be wrong. So, stop trying to avoid the answer and rebuttal to your atheistic beliefs.
songwriter4artists 1 year ago
@songwriter4artists No, it would not be ok by atheists. Atheists, if you aren't aware, are people as well. We have interest in sustaining society just like anyone else.
Also, there is no such thing as "atheistic beliefS". Being an atheist only requires one thing and one thing ONLY - not believing in god.
Andmight I add -- Theists like you readily condone eternal punishment (worse then murder) for a finite crime. So who's really hateful here?
iParadox1989 1 year ago
@iParadox1989 Society today kills millions of healthy humans in the form of abortion. Society deems this ok.
webhutspain 1 year ago
@webhutspain An undeveloped fetus is not a healthy human.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
@iParadox1989 Tell that to people who are born 5 months into a pregnancy and live a healthy life.
webhutspain 1 year ago
@webhutspain Again, an undeveloped fetus in not a healthy human. If what you are saying did happen, that's great. But that does not mean that the fetus was a healthy human when it was born (even though it became one due to advances in medicine). The implication of your argument is that everything that has even a potential to be a human, even sperm, should be treated equally.
iParadox1989 1 year ago
@iParadox1989 Why does my argument imply that I would treat sperm equally. That is an assumption you make, and a wrong one at that. Should we kill people who are on dialysis machines, because they are not healthy humans? At what point should a human decide that another human is not worthy of life? A baby has it's own blood which does not mix with that of it's mother, it lives off the placenta - metaphorically the mother is merely the incubator or the dialysis machine that keeps someone alive.
webhutspain 1 year ago
God dammit! Evil does not exist as anything more than a perception. It's like what you feel watching a movie, you might like it, I might hate it.
Evil is not a thing.
whitetrashoutlaw 1 year ago
perhaps the best definition of evil, is something you find so repugnant you not only get angry thinking about it, but fearful of it at the same time
of course, that means my arachnophobia kind of makes me biased, but I said the best definition, not a good one, perhaps "least bad" is a better term for it
as I said though, I find the term fairly useless, I reserve it for fantasy games and so on because they run off that kind of thing, the DnD alignment system for instance
noobler9 1 year ago
even then I don't use the term evil really, it just doesn't seem like a useful term to me
I really mean it, it's always confused me why people insist on using the term, I've never bothered to
sorry if it's hard to explain, but there you go, I see things as desirable and undesirable personally, and come from a functionality/utility/completely "true or untrue" approach
it gets me in trouble a lot, so I know I'm not the norm, but there you go, to me, my "religion" is "truth" whatever it may be
noobler9 1 year ago
@noobler9 hmmm, using the term truth, and saying I worship it, or make a religion out of it might be the wrong thing to do... but as far as I can tell, my basic idea is that the truth is the truth and I want to know it as best as possible, and run through what various claims are and try to match it up with my experiences as best as possible, AND figuring out what works best with my overall views as developed thus far some things are stupid, useless, destructive
to me, that is "evil"
noobler9 1 year ago
personally, I find the term evil, is primarily rooted in black and white thinking, and world view models that are flawed and oversimplistic so my definition of evil is the big black knight with fiery glowing eyes and a nasty shrieking voice and stuff that's scary, oh and he has ugly weapons instead of bright gleaming swords
yea, it's campy, but I kind of don't have a use for the term except for that, and to try to denounce someone/group/action REALLY heavily as unpleasant, "to everyone"
noobler9 1 year ago